Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:35 AM - Survival at sea. - South America to Oskosh (Jose M. Toro)
2. 03:35 AM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (JeffFowler@aol.com)
3. 04:15 AM - Accidents - was Kitfox crash (Larry Martin)
4. 04:17 AM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (Ceashman@aol.com)
5. 04:43 AM - Re: Re: Kitfox Crash (Barry West)
6. 04:58 AM - Re: Re: Michigan Kitfoxers (Sid Hausding)
7. 06:19 AM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Bradley M Webb)
8. 06:25 AM - Re: Re: Kitfox Crash (Bradley M Webb)
9. 06:28 AM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (Randy Daughenbaugh)
10. 06:35 AM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (Bradley M Webb)
11. 09:12 AM - Re: (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety - Michel (Andrew Matthaey)
12. 09:35 AM - Re: (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety - Michel (Michael Logan)
13. 11:04 AM - Re: Slips and all the rest. (Michael Gibbs)
14. 11:04 AM - Re: Kitfox Crash (Michael Gibbs)
15. 11:24 AM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (kurt schrader)
16. 11:43 AM - Re: (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety - Michel (Andrew Matthaey)
17. 11:46 AM - By any other name (Joel Mapes)
18. 12:51 PM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (John Anderson)
19. 01:12 PM - Re: By any other name (kirk hull)
20. 01:52 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Clint Bazzill)
21. 02:46 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (AMuller589@aol.com)
22. 02:50 PM - Tailwheel Checkout (AMuller589@aol.com)
23. 03:25 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Randy Daughenbaugh)
24. 04:20 PM - Re: Re: Flaps. (debrun26@juno.com)
25. 04:48 PM - Battery Box (Cudnohufsky's)
26. 04:48 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Dan Billingsley)
27. 05:03 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Clint Bazzill)
28. 05:33 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (AMuller589@aol.com)
29. 05:33 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (AMuller589@AOL.COM)
30. 05:33 PM - Re: Battery Box (Mark R Miller)
31. 05:37 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Lowell Fitt)
32. 05:43 PM - Re: Re: Michigan Kitfoxers (morid@northland.lib.mi.us)
33. 05:52 PM - Re: Re: Flaps. (kurt schrader)
34. 05:54 PM - Re: Re: Flaps. (AMuller589@aol.com)
35. 06:01 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (AMuller589@aol.com)
36. 06:12 PM - Re: Re: Kitfox Crash (kurt schrader)
37. 06:19 PM - Re: series V C.G and weight limits (AMuller589@aol.com)
38. 06:19 PM - Re: Re: Michigan Kitfoxers (Cudnohufsky's)
39. 06:27 PM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (kurt schrader)
40. 06:45 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Clint Bazzill)
41. 06:46 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Clint Bazzill)
42. 07:11 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Clint Bazzill)
43. 07:15 PM - Re: Slips and all the rest. (kitfoxmike)
44. 08:22 PM - Re: Re: Slips and all the rest. (Jay Carter)
45. 08:29 PM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (John Anderson)
46. 09:25 PM - Re: Kitfox Crash (2thesky)
47. 11:03 PM - Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle (Andy Fultz)
48. 11:26 PM - Re: Battery Box (Michel Verheughe)
49. 11:36 PM - Re: Battery Box (Michel Verheughe)
50. 11:37 PM - NOTE: Attached file size (Michel Verheughe)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Survival at sea. - South America to Oskosh |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jose M. Toro" <jose_m_toro@yahoo.com>
That was my friend Marcelo Matocq from Argentina, and
this happenned in 1998. On his trip, he stayed two
nights at my home in Puerto Rico before continuing his
trip to USA via Dominican Republic, Cuba, Key West.
He told me that, at some point of his trip, he heard a
loud explosion. After some analysis he realized that
it was one of the condoms that exploded due to the sun
heat. Many more exploded later. In addition to the
condoms, he had another flotation device attached on
the bottom of the plane. It was made from a truck
tire's tube, and was intended to be inflated by means
of an extinguisher. I wonder if those flotation
devices would really work, but am glad he didn't have
the opportunity to test them during his trip.
Jose
>
> --- Malcolmbru@aol.com wrote:
>
> > when a Flight star flew from south America across
> > the Ocean to sun fun the
> > pilot put over 300 inflated condoms in the wings
>
> > DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
> __________________________________________________
>
>
>
>
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
>
>
> Admin.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
__________________________________________________
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle |
In a message dated 8/5/2006 4:28:35 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
kmamjones@comcast.net writes:
Cut Schrader's comment about a motorcycle grip throttle caught my attention.
I'm building an S7 taildragger. I have a bad left leg from polio as a
child - not enough strength for left rudder. I used to fly an RV-4. Sold it
to build the Kitfox - no need for speed anymore. I had left rudder and left
brake hand controls on the RV-4. On landings I cut the power to idle when
the field was made. I needed the left hand for rudder (particularly on
crosswinds) and right for the stick. I never did wheel landings - a bit
too cautious I guess. I don't know much about motorcycles. Could a
motorcycle grip throttle be installed on the S7 stick, but still have a
regular throttle for others would might fly the plane? I'm using a Rotax
912S, which, of course, has two carbs. Sure, I could probably fly the S7
like the RV-4, but I would much rather have use of the throttle on the
landing and roll-out - more options, you know. I hadn't thought about the
motorcycle grip before. Is it even feasible to run two throttle cables to
two carbs? How could the motorcycle throttle be locked to maintain cruise
RPM? Any ideas would be appreciated. If this sounds a little dumb, have some
compassion - I'm a good accountant - not an engineer.
Ken Jones
Hello Ken and list,
How you would rig the cables is unclear to me, but, my 1985 H-D FLT has
a throttle that has a thumb screw that holds the throttle by tension at what
ever setting you leave it at. It's a common feature on most bikes above 400
cc today. the diameter of your stick is needed to make a decision on what type
to use if you try it though.
Till Next Time,
Jeff Fowler
Message 3
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| Subject: | Accidents - was Kitfox crash |
Best to avoid USAir.....
Then he
volunteered that his company - US Air, to his knowledge, loses about 3
pilots a year to general aviation accidents.
Now if this is a valid number and given US Air's published pilot
population
of 3228, they lose just under one pilot per thousand per year. I guess
the
way I read this, assuming my new friend's numbers are somewhat accurate,
it
can be concluded that there is a problem here.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle |
All this talk about a motorcycle throttle has me worried!
If John Denver were here he would say "keep things standard" "I can't live
with controls and switches and valves being anywhere but correct and in the
right place". That's what he would say.
What would happen with a twist throttle (motorcycle style) at the end of your
stick when moving the stick around, yanking it back for take off, pushing it
forward for level flight and what about those quick lefts and rights at
landing (little breezes).
I can imagine, if I had another control on my stick, I would be adjusting the
RPM the same time as I make flight control inputs.
But then again, I am thinking of installing a foot controlled throttle. Do
you think it should be to the right of the rudder peddles or in between?
(Kidding!!)
With all the discussions on the topic, safety?
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox Crash |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Barry West" <barry@pgtc.com>
I believe that if you build the plane you can name it anything you want to.
Barry West
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 9:45 PM
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Pearsall"
> <donpearsall@comcast.net>
>
> I have to agree with Lowell. The name of the plane remains, even if the
> company is out of business. I once owned a DeSoto Powermaster. Since then
> Chrysler took over the line, but if you see one on the street, it is still
> called a DeSoto.
>
> So I think it is still a Skystar Vixen.
>
> Don Pearsall
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
> Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 7:24 PM
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
> Hey Rexter,
>
> Are you saying the kit I ordered from Dan Denney and that was delivered by
> Skystar has had a name change? I think since Skystar delivered the kit,
> I'll still call it a Skystar Kitfox Model IV.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Lowell
>
> Do Not Archive
> ----- Original Message -----
> Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 5:57 PM
>
>
> ..............One small thing. It's not a Skystar Kitfox anymore. Skystar
> (Skyscam) is bankrupt and left many Kitfox pilots/owners in debt. It's
> just
> called a Kitfox now.
>
> -- "eccles" <eccles@Chartermi.net> wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "eccles" <eccles@chartermi.net>
>
> well if I remember my flight training correctly, they say if you have an
> emergency on take off to fly straight ahead and Never try to turn back
> especially when you don't have any altitude or in this case any airspeed
> either .and it sounds like he had neither. it still wont bring him back
> but
> it is something for the rest of us to try and remember. I myself have
> never
> been in this situation except in training and I hope that i never will be
> but just the same, You need to be very aware of what you can and cannot
> do,
> I feel that the skystar Kitfox is a very safe aircraft if flown with
> respect, just my two cents
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
> Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 5:52 PM
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
> Marco's post reminds me of a post I recently sent to the Lancair list.
> There has been a long thread having to with aircraft accident stastics.
> Something about how to measure them - flight hour or passenger miles. The
> argument involved whether general aviation is more or less safe and by how
> much, than the scheduled air carriers and if so why. Lots of talk about
> concern for passengers keeping ones mind on business etc. skill level,
> training and, of course, a lot of posturing, pontificating and axe
> grinding.
>
> Anyway my comment had to do with my airman physical that I took Tuesday
> and
> a conversation I had with another pilot there for the same reason - but
> his
> was a Class I while mine was the class III. I found we lived in
> neighboring
> towns and I asked him if he had an airplane. He said no and went further
> to
> say that he would not fly in a general aviation airplane. Then he
> volunteered that his company - US Air, to his knowledge, loses about 3
> pilots a year to general aviation accidents.
>
> Now if this is a valid number and given US Air's published pilot
> population
> of 3228, they lose just under one pilot per thousand per year. I guess
> the
> way I read this, assuming my new friend's numbers are somewhat accurate,
> it
> can be concluded that there is a problem here.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 12:40 PM
>
>
>> Latest report suggests pilot (an airline retiree) lost power on climb-out
>> and tried to turn 180 degrees to the runway he'd just left.
> .
>
>
> ===================================
>
> ===================================
>
> ===================================
> ===================================
>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Michigan Kitfoxers |
Unless he fired himself, he is the airport manager...........was here in Alpena
too, came to a lot of our EAA activities and meetings but we could never get
him to take flying lessons. He retired from the Air Force too.
Nice guy, will help your chapter a lot.........
Sid
------------------
Richard Rabbers <rira1950@yahoo.com> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers"
> Say hi to Lee Sherwitz out at the airport ...... and have fun at your Military
flyin this weekend! ......Get that one of yours up and flying and come north
to visit.
Hello Sid,
- What does Lee do at BEH?
- A couple flights today... I'll be working on a project on the north (airport)
side of my place this weekend. I expect some good sights.
- Many projects underway... sure looking forward to getting in the air.
Richard
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=52490#52490
"Why can't we all just get along?"
---------------------------------
Next-gen email? Have it all with the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bradley M Webb" <bmwebb@cox.net>
Classic cross-control stall maneuver. This demonstration is in every flight
training syllabus, and I had to perform it when doing my CFI practical. I
teach every student how not to get into that situation.
Very good demo video, as a Cessna doesn't do them real well, owing to the
positive stability of the design.
Bradley
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxmike
Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 1:31 PM
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
Interesting enough, this same type of thread is on the vansairforce site.
This was posted and is very interesting to watch.
http://www.apstraining.com/clips/skidded_turn_high.wmv
--------
kitfoxmike
kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
rv7 wingkit
reserved 287RV
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=52321#52321
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox Crash |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bradley M Webb" <bmwebb@cox.net>
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
jdisher@intergate.com
Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 2:59 PM
> Don't worry about the fox at that point, she belongs to the
> insurance company. It's time to sya.
Very correct.
And that's the hard point. In a stressful situation that gives time to think
about it, most pilots worry about saving the airframe. They believe they
won't die, not yet anyway, and they start thinking about how much money this
is going to cost.
It's really hard to overcome that feeling, which is another reason older
students are so much harder to teach. A young student will do anything you
tell them to do, because they lack the years of experience in life, and they
don't have a lot to compare the danger to. An older student only half
believes what you tell them, 'cuz they figure they've survived this long,
it'll be just another close call, like all the others.
Bradley
Message 9
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| Subject: | Motorcycle grip Throttle |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
Ken,
I think this could be done. It would take some research, but there are lots
of different kinds of hardware out there.
A lot of bikes (especially dirt bikes) have two cables - one to pull the
throttle open and one to pull it shut. It seems to me that this could be
interfaced with the standard throttle control for the 912S. But it may be
better to just have a custom cable made to go directly to the carbs. There
are a number of places that will do this.
There are twist throttle controls where the cable comes out parallel to the
bar (stick?) and there are twist throttle controls where the cable comes out
90 degrees to the bar/stick. I kinda like the 90 degree approach for
mounting on the stick. These cables are designed to handle lots of movement
because the handle bars move to steer the motorcycle. Attention would be
needed in selecting the routing of the cables to avoid interference with
legs, frame, etc.
Another approach is the ATV thumb throttle. I don't know that these have a
position lock as someone else pointed out is available on a lot of bikes.
You could make the stick a couple of inches longer and mount this thumb
throttle above the hand grip to be well positioned for the thumb. You might
even be able to hook up a cruise control to handle cruise flight.
Interesting problem. Lots of options. Good luck and I would like a report
of your progress.
Randy 912S series 5/7
.
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kenneth and
Alice Jones
Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 11:35 PM
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kenneth and Alice Jones"
<kmamjones@comcast.net>
Cut Schrader's comment about a motorcycle grip throttle caught my attention.
I'm building an S7 taildragger. I have a bad left leg from polio as a
child - not enough strength for left rudder. I used to fly an RV-4. Sold it
to build the Kitfox - no need for speed anymore. I had left rudder and left
brake hand controls on the RV-4. On landings I cut the power to idle when
the field was made. I needed the left hand for rudder (particularly on
crosswinds) and right for the stick. I never did wheel landings - a bit
too cautious I guess. I don't know much about motorcycles. Could a
motorcycle grip throttle be installed on the S7 stick, but still have a
regular throttle for others would might fly the plane? I'm using a Rotax
912S, which, of course, has two carbs. Sure, I could probably fly the S7
like the RV-4, but I would much rather have use of the throttle on the
landing and roll-out - more options, you know. I hadn't thought about the
motorcycle grip before. Is it even feasible to run two throttle cables to
two carbs? How could the motorcycle throttle be locked to maintain cruise
RPM? Any ideas would be appreciated. If this sounds a little dumb, have some
compassion - I'm a good accountant - not an engineer.
Ken Jones
Message 10
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| Subject: | Motorcycle grip Throttle |
There is a lever actuated friction lock, called "cruise control", for bike
throttles that help hold the twist grip for you when cruising down the
highway. I think there are several makes, but try JC Whitney, or any local
motorcycle shop. You can adjust them for tension, so you can still move the
throttle if you have to. Has a little lever to engage and disengage it.
One thing to think about is a trigger throttle, like that on early ATVs and
most watercraft. One or two finger trigger style at the stick grip might get
you what you want. Not sure how you'd "lock" it, but you might be able to
figure something out.
Bradley
_____
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
JeffFowler@aol.com
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 6:32 AM
In a message dated 8/5/2006 4:28:35 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
kmamjones@comcast.net writes:
Cut Schrader's comment about a motorcycle grip throttle caught my attention.
I'm building an S7 taildragger. I have a bad left leg from polio as a
child - not enough strength for left rudder. I used to fly an RV-4. Sold it
to build the Kitfox - no need for speed anymore. I had left rudder and left
brake hand controls on the RV-4. On landings I cut the power to idle when
the field was made. I needed the left hand for rudder (particularly on
crosswinds) and right for the stick. I never did wheel landings - a bit
too cautious I guess. I don't know much about motorcycles. Could a
motorcycle grip throttle be installed on the S7 stick, but still have a
regular throttle for others would might fly the plane? I'm using a Rotax
912S, which, of course, has two carbs. Sure, I could probably fly the S7
like the RV-4, but I would much rather have use of the throttle on the
landing and roll-out - more options, you know. I hadn't thought about the
motorcycle grip before. Is it even feasible to run two throttle cables to
two carbs? How could the motorcycle throttle be locked to maintain cruise
RPM? Any ideas would be appreciated. If this sounds a little dumb, have some
compassion - I'm a good accountant - not an engineer.
Ken Jones
Hello Ken and list,
How you would rig the cables is unclear to me, but, my 1985 H-D FLT has
a throttle that has a thumb screw that holds the throttle by tension at what
ever setting you leave it at. It's a common feature on most bikes above 400
cc today. the diameter of your stick is needed to make a decision on what
type to use if you try it though.
Till Next Time,
Jeff Fowler
Message 11
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| Subject: | (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety - Michel |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" <spaghettiohead@hotmail.com>
That is the major reason I'll be moving to Jacksonville, FL next week w/o my
'Fox - too many damn hurricanes and I don't need the added stress of those
logistics LoL.
Andrew
do not archive
>From: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kitfox-List: (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety - Michel
>Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 08:56:36 +0200
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
>
>On Aug 4, 2006, at 9:43 PM, Jose M. Toro wrote:
>>Right now, Puerto Rico is in the hurricane season, so most of the light
>>planes are stored in a garage.
>
>Yes, I know. Time to immigrate to Norway, hombre! :-)
>I have a friend in West Palm Beach who is retired and when the hurricane
>season is at its worse, he gets in his mobile home, called Mother Earth,
>and moves north.
>
>Cheers,
>Michel
>
>do not archive
>
>
>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
>http://wiki.matronics.com
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Message 12
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| Subject: | (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety - Michel |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Michael Logan" <michael.logan@cox.net>
Awful warm with beautiful flying weather in Jacksonville Andrew. You are
really going to miss the Kitfox.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andrew Matthaey
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 12:06 PM
Michel
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey"
<spaghettiohead@hotmail.com>
That is the major reason I'll be moving to Jacksonville, FL next week w/o my
'Fox - too many damn hurricanes and I don't need the added stress of those
logistics LoL.
Andrew
do not archive
>From: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kitfox-List: (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety - Michel
>Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 08:56:36 +0200
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
>
>On Aug 4, 2006, at 9:43 PM, Jose M. Toro wrote:
>>Right now, Puerto Rico is in the hurricane season, so most of the light
>>planes are stored in a garage.
>
>Yes, I know. Time to immigrate to Norway, hombre! :-)
>I have a friend in West Palm Beach who is retired and when the hurricane
>season is at its worse, he gets in his mobile home, called Mother Earth,
>and moves north.
>
>Cheers,
>Michel
>
>do not archive
>
>
>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
>http://wiki.matronics.com
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Message 13
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|
| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Clint sez:
>And again I will say it would almost be impossible to spin out of a slip.
You can say it all you want, Clint, but it can be done and I've done
it. Deliberately, in my case, but as with any stall/spin scenario,
it can be done inadvertently as well.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox Crash |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Lowell writes:
>...given US Air's published pilot population of 3228, they lose just
>under one pilot per thousand per year. I guess the way I read this,
>assuming my new friend's numbers are somewhat accurate, it can be
>concluded that there is a problem here.
I wouldn't lose any sleep over it Lowell. The numbers you heard
provide far too little information to draw any conclusions from. It
could simply mean that when you drive the heavy iron for a living you
forget how to fly a real airplane.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Actually what I was suggesting is the standard for
helos, but not on the stick you are thinking of. It
is on the other stick called the "collective" beside
the seat, which controls lift and power, not
direction.
Our flap handle could be used the same way, to a
degree. But it must be noted that the helo's throttle
works backwards from a motorcycle and that can be
dangerous, if you mix the two.
The benefit of this arrangement on a plane is that you
can much more precisely control lift with flaps and
with more rapid responce than by changing pitch. But
for it to work well, you need to constantly have your
hand on the flap lever and that is why you put the
throttle there. Also it would need instant pitch trim
to match the flap pitch inputs to keep the angle of
attack you select with the stick, or you will have the
nose ducking and pitching with every flap change.
Done well, you could hold a constant pitch attitude
and AOA on final, but vary the flaps with every gust
and downdraft to precisely keep your glideslope
without pitch changes. No ballooning or floating
either. It really is much more precise and quicker
control than we are used to in airplanes.
Kurt S.
--- Ceashman@aol.com wrote:
> All this talk about a motorcycle throttle has me
> worried!
>
> If John Denver were here he would say "keep things
> standard" "I can't live
> with controls and switches and valves being anywhere
> but correct and in the
> right place". That's what he would say.
> What would happen with a twist throttle (motorcycle
> style) at the end of your
> stick when moving the stick around, yanking it back
> for take off, pushing it
> forward for level flight and what about those quick
> lefts and rights at
> landing (little breezes).
>
> I can imagine, if I had another control on my stick,
> I would be adjusting the
> RPM the same time as I make flight control inputs.
>
> But then again, I am thinking of installing a foot
> controlled throttle. Do
> you think it should be to the right of the rudder
> peddles or in between?
> (Kidding!!)
>
> With all the discussions on the topic, safety?
__________________________________________________
Message 16
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| Subject: | (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety - Michel |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey" <spaghettiohead@hotmail.com>
I've done about 100 hrs flying all over te state of Florida in a Duchess
over the last couple of months - certainly much better flying than I had
ever imagined Florida could ever offer (albeit, just as hot as I thought
LoL)...I'll be instructing down in Jax for only a couple months max,
however...then I'll be back w/my 'Fox :-)
By the way, if there are any Kitfoxer's in the Northern Florida area in need
of some instruction time, I'd be more than happy to help out!
Andrew
KF3
>From: "Michael Logan" <michael.logan@cox.net>
>To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety -
>Michel
>Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 12:34:23 -0400
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Michael Logan" <michael.logan@cox.net>
>
>Awful warm with beautiful flying weather in Jacksonville Andrew. You are
>really going to miss the Kitfox.
>
>Mike
>
>-----Original Message-----
>[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Andrew
>Matthaey
>Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 12:06 PM
>Michel
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andrew Matthaey"
><spaghettiohead@hotmail.com>
>
>That is the major reason I'll be moving to Jacksonville, FL next week w/o
>my
>
>'Fox - too many damn hurricanes and I don't need the added stress of those
>logistics LoL.
>
>Andrew
>
>do not archive
>
>
> >From: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
> >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> >Subject: Kitfox-List: (off-topic) Hurricanes WAS Passenger safety -
>Michel
> >Date: Sat, 5 Aug 2006 08:56:36 +0200
> >
> >--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
> >
> >On Aug 4, 2006, at 9:43 PM, Jose M. Toro wrote:
> >>Right now, Puerto Rico is in the hurricane season, so most of the light
> >>planes are stored in a garage.
> >
> >Yes, I know. Time to immigrate to Norway, hombre! :-)
> >I have a friend in West Palm Beach who is retired and when the hurricane
> >season is at its worse, he gets in his mobile home, called Mother Earth,
> >and moves north.
> >
> >Cheers,
> >Michel
> >
> >do not archive
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
> >http://wiki.matronics.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Message 17
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| Subject: | By any other name |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Joel Mapes" <foxfloatflyer@hotmail.com>
When Boeing purchased McDonnel Douglas the MD-80 became the Boeing MD-80
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/md-80-90/index.html
Denney, Downs, Skystar or McBean it's still a Kitfox.
Joel
Model 5 912 1st engine run July 22!
_________________________________________________________________
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle |
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found ---
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resend the email using Plain Text formatting.
HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section
in their client's default configuration. If you're using
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Message 19
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| Subject: | By any other name |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kirk hull" <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
they were still McDonnel Douglas airplanes supported by Boeing
then they became the Boeing 717 when the new planes came out ( new engines
and gear )
The data plate will never change
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Joel Mapes
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 1:46 PM
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Joel Mapes" <foxfloatflyer@hotmail.com>
When Boeing purchased McDonnel Douglas the MD-80 became the Boeing MD-80
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/md-80-90/index.html
Denney, Downs, Skystar or McBean it's still a Kitfox.
Joel
Model 5 912 1st engine run July 22!
_________________________________________________________________
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found ---
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resend the email using Plain Text formatting.
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Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
REGARDINGSKIDS AND SLIPS, especially: Tell me exactly how you spin an
airplane from a slip. Clint
This is how it is done according to FAA-H-8083-3 "AIRPLANE FLYING HANDBOOK"
page 5-11:
quote: A spin is when the airplane's wing exceeds the angle of attack
(stall) with a side slip or yaw acting on the airplane at, or beyond the actual
stall. During this uncoordinated maneuver, a pilot may not be aware that a
critical angle of attack has been exceeded until the airplane yaws out of control
toward the lowering wing. If stall recovery is not initiated immediately,
the airplane may enter a spin.
If this stall occurs while the airplane is in a slipping or skidding
turn, this can result in a spin entry and rotation in the direction that the
rudder is being applied, regardless of which wingtip is raised. end quote.
The difference between a skid and a slip is shown on page 4-5 of this same
book. It shows a slip as a maneuver with one wing low and the ball on the
opposite side of the T & B from the low wing whereas a slip occurs with the ball
on the same side as the low wing or the wings level. i.e left wing down ball
left is slip wings level ball right is slip, left wing down ball right is a
skid.
To answer the original question you can spin any time you have a hard over
rudder AND A STALL. Skids and slips are safe and are demonstration required
maneuvers AS LONG AS THERE IS NO STALL. (HIGH SPEED OR LOW SPEED)(UNACCELERATED
OR ACCELERATED).
Message 22
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| Subject: | Tailwheel Checkout |
A lot of questions arise on this website concerning basic flying knowledge.
Most of these can be resolved by the subject article in AMERICA'S FLYWAYS
article at the following website _www.americasflyways.com_
(http://www.americasflyways.com) . Good reading even for CFI's and examiners.
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
I agree that you can enter a spin anytime you stall in uncoordinated flight.
And both skids and slips are uncoordinated maneuvers.
Can you clarify your info from page 4-5? I think you have a typo with skid
and slip.
I am going to have to try some slips and skids and watch the ball.
Randy
.
_____
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
AMuller589@aol.com
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 3:44 PM
REGARDINGSKIDS AND SLIPS, especially: Tell me exactly how you spin an
airplane from a slip. Clint
This is how it is done according to FAA-H-8083-3 "AIRPLANE FLYING HANDBOOK"
page 5-11:
quote: A spin is when the airplane's wing exceeds the angle of attack
(stall) with a side slip or yaw acting on the airplane at, or beyond the
actual stall. During this uncoordinated maneuver, a pilot may not be aware
that a critical angle of attack has been exceeded until the airplane yaws
out of control toward the lowering wing. If stall recovery is not initiated
immediately, the airplane may enter a spin.
If this stall occurs while the airplane is in a slipping or skidding
turn, this can result in a spin entry and rotation in the direction that the
rudder is being applied, regardless of which wingtip is raised. end quote.
The difference between a skid and a slip is shown on page 4-5 of this same
book. It shows a slip as a maneuver with one wing low and the ball on the
opposite side of the T & B from the low wing whereas a slip occurs with the
ball on the same side as the low wing or the wings level. i.e left wing down
ball left is slip wings level ball right is slip, left wing down ball right
is a skid.
To answer the original question you can spin any time you have a hard over
rudder AND A STALL. Skids and slips are safe and are demonstration required
maneuvers AS LONG AS THERE IS NO STALL. (HIGH SPEED OR LOW
SPEED)(UNACCELERATED OR ACCELERATED).
Message 24
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|
Hi All, I'm looking at buying a KF5 and would like to know what the u
sual empty weight is with a NSI 100hp engine. The plane has it's tail #
but no cetified weight. Also, is the gross wt 1550 lbs? I've only see
n a model 4 and would like to know if the baggage area is larger in the
KF5. Also how do I find out what the CG range is? Thanks much, Lay
ne
________________________________________________________________________
Try Juno Platinum for Free! Then, only $9.95/month!
<html>Hi All, I'm looking at buying a KF5 and would li
ke to know what the usual empty weight is with a NSI 100hp engine.
The plane has it's tail # but no cetified weight. Also, is the gr
oss wt 1550 lbs? I've only seen a model 4 and would like to know i
f the baggage area is larger in the KF5. Also how do I find out wh
at the CG range is? Thanks much, Layne&nbs
p;</html>
<font face="Times-New-Roman" size="2"><br><br>______________________
__________________________________________________<br>
Try Juno Platinum for Free! Then, only $9.95/month!<br>
Visit <a href="http://www.juno.com/value">http://www.juno.com/value</a
> to sign up today!<br></font>
Message 25
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Cudnohufsky's" <7suds@chartermi.net>
List,
Installing an Odessey PC680 in my fox forward of the firewall, can I simply
construct a tray to hold it or does it need to be a full box?
Lloyd
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
One thing I would add...As I was demonstrating a forward slip to an instructor
he asked that I keep the indicated speed up higher than I would normally have
it on final. I'm sure this is common knowledge to some, but his answer made complete
sence so I think it's worth mentioning...As a forward or side slip is initiated
it will of course affect the ram air entering the pitot tube (the air
is now entering at an angle). This is especially so when the wing with the pitot
tube is aft and air flow is being blocked or disrupted by the fuselage. Now
imagine how things might look if the P Tube decided to suck a bug during flight.
This probably isn't a problem to a veteran that knows his/her plane...but
it may be critical info for a low time pilot to understand.
Dan
Randy Daughenbaugh <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com> wrote:
I agree that you can enter a spin anytime you stall in uncoordinated
flight. And both skids and slips are uncoordinated maneuvers.
Can you clarify your info from page 4-5? I think you have a typo with skid and
slip.
I am going to have to try some slips and skids and watch the ball.
Randy
.
---------------------------------
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of AMuller589@aol.com
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 3:44 PM
REGARDINGSKIDS AND SLIPS, especially: Tell me exactly how you spin an airplane
from a slip. Clint
This is how it is done according to FAA-H-8083-3 "AIRPLANE FLYING HANDBOOK"
page 5-11:
quote: A spin is when the airplane's wing exceeds the angle of attack (stall)
with a side slip or yaw acting on the airplane at, or beyond the actual stall.
During this uncoordinated maneuver, a pilot may not be aware that a critical
angle of attack has been exceeded until the airplane yaws out of control toward
the lowering wing. If stall recovery is not initiated immediately, the airplane
may enter a spin.
If this stall occurs while the airplane is in a slipping or skidding turn,
this can result in a spin entry and rotation in the direction that the rudder
is being applied, regardless of which wingtip is raised. end quote.
The difference between a skid and a slip is shown on page 4-5 of this same
book. It shows a slip as a maneuver with one wing low and the ball on the opposite
side of the T & B from the low wing whereas a slip occurs with the ball
on the same side as the low wing or the wings level. i.e left wing down ball left
is slip wings level ball right is slip, left wing down ball right is a skid.
To answer the original question you can spin any time you have a hard over
rudder AND A STALL. Skids and slips are safe and are demonstration required maneuvers
AS LONG AS THERE IS NO STALL. (HIGH SPEED OR LOW SPEED)(UNACCELERATED
OR ACCELERATED).
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found ---
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Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
I attached the picture describing what I tried to say.
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
any kind of slip is safe. Any kind of skid is safe. BUT NONE ARE SAFE IN A
STALL AT LOW ALTITUDE.
Message 30
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Mark R Miller" <markrmiller@cableone.net>
Short answer is a tray with straps of sufficient strength is all that is
required.
Mark Miller
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 5:50 PM
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Cudnohufsky's" <7suds@chartermi.net>
>
> List,
> Installing an Odessey PC680 in my fox forward of the firewall, can I
> simply construct a tray to hold it or does it need to be a full box?
> Lloyd
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
> http://wiki.matronics.com
>
>
>
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
I think I need a little help here.
When I slip to landing, I usually give full right rudder and drop the left
wing to control heading, using elevator to control airspeed. If I
transition from my typical slip to a skidding turn, I will have to have to
go from full right rudder, through neutral rudder to an uncoodinated left
rudder (assuming flying left traffic). I would think this would be a real
rarity if not unheard of with any pilot with more than a few hours. My
guess is that when Clint described his turns to final, slipping all the way
down, he is using a left slip in left traffic and would use a right slip in
right traffic - just a guess.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 11:25 AM
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
>
> first off, I'm not upset, just concerned and I don't want to read anymore
> about accidents. Now, if a person is in a slip and gets messed up in
> there thinking, they can go into a skid. Now, I've read some post were
> people are slipping and going in a side slip, now in my opinion a side
> slip is ok, but not to be mistaken for doing a base to final, or any other
> turn, it's just for alignment when off slightly on your final with the
> runway. The skid can accure if doing a slip on base to final, expecially
> if you are turning one direction over the other depends which side you are
> slipping. My advice, take out the slip when making any kind of turn and
> make sure you have proper down elevator. Last note: this thread says slips
> and all the rest. Skids are one of the rest.
>
> --------
> kitfoxmike
> kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
> http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
> rv7 wingkit
> reserved 287RV
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=52346#52346
>
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Michigan Kitfoxers |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: morid@northland.lib.mi.us
Thanks Richard.
Hey folks. I can't do much with the Michigan Kitfoxes right now as I'm away
from home and on somebody else's computer. I'm just doing a quick scan right
now and weeding out an enormous amount of spam. I'll be home Monday and get
caught up with all the messages and see where we sit on this.
Thanks to all who have contributed and asked to be a part of it. Like I said,
I
don't know where this will go, but this is a start.
Deke
Quoting Richard Rabbers <rira1950@yahoo.com>:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
>
>
> > Michigan Kitfoxers
>
>
> Seems like a good 'location / type' contact list could benefit all on (our)
> Matronics list. The existing member list includes many voids and is not very
> well suited for sorting. Perhaps someday the structure could be improved.
> (not to minimize the great work that they do)
>
> It seems to me that those involved on this list might all welcome the chance
> to make contact with others no matter where they may find themselves. (when
> traveling, on lay-overs...etc) It might be tuff to avoid keeping a list that
> included contact info/email addresses from being captured by 'the outside'
> creating junk mail or other?
>
> Meantime I'm glad to be part of this new effort and assume good will come.
>
> Richard Rabbers
> 627 W Main Street
> Benton Harbor, MI 49022
> (269) 925-1901
> rira1950@yahoo.com
> Kitfox Model 1 - s/n 168
> (purchased from 2nd owner - slowly being restored)
> Rotax 618, Powerfin prop
> Full Lotus floats
>
> - I'm enjoying this list very much. It's great to be able to become familar
> with Kitfox prior to flight...
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=52307#52307
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------
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Message 33
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Is it already signed off and flying? Or not certified
yet and so no certified weight?
Most should weigh 870-950 empty. Gear type and
add-ons make the biggest difference.
If I remember correctly, the early -5's were 1400
gross? 1550 gross is standard for the later -5's, but
you can set your own gross as a builder.
My FAA inspector recommended I set my gross above
anything I would ever use. Then license and insure it
to that so you are never at risk for going over and
losing your license or insurance coverage. Politics!
Fly under the real gross and if you go a few pounds
over, it is not a violation. (Bad that we should fear
violations more than performance)
Yes the baggage area is larger for -5's and beyond.
Weight limit dictated by CG with 150 lbs tops.
The CG is in the builder's manual. Don't have mine
here, or I could pass it on.
Kurt S. S-5/NSI turbo
Only 437 e-mails to catch up on since I went on
vacation..... :-(
--- "debrun26@juno.com" <debrun26@juno.com> wrote:
> Hi All, I'm looking at buying a KF5 and would
> like to know what the usual empty weight is with a
> NSI 100hp engine. The plane has it's tail # but no
> cetified weight. Also, is the gross wt 1550 lbs?
> I've only seen a model 4 and would like to know if
> the baggage area is larger in the KF5. Also how do
> I find out what the CG range is? Thanks much,
> Layne
__________________________________________________
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Attached is a factory weight and balance cleaned up of extraneous comments
regarding other than un-swept wing, non-series V etc data. The series V comes
in forward swept one degree or non swept wing. THE MAX GROSS WEIGHT
RECOMMENDED IS 1550 LBS BUT YOU CAN CERTIFICATE ANY MAX WEIGHT YOU DESIRE. The
FAA
inspectors don't care or check factory recommended data.The floor and bag are
very large but you can also make the baggage compartment any shape you want
and many people put in a long thin-wall pvc tube for skis and fishing poles.
Its up to you to keep the c.g. in limits.
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
During landings you should never use skids or slips except on final for
landings in a cross wind or need to lose altitude/airspeed. NEVER IN TURNS that
is just asking for it.
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox Crash |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Got an AOA already. Trying to keep all my accidents
non-fatal and all my handicaps mental. ;-) Working
so far.....
Kurt S.
--- 6440 Auto Parts <sales@6440autoparts.com> wrote:
If that is the only fatalities involved
> then it would be prudent
> to install an angle of attack and that problem
> should go away.
>
> Randy
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> Sent: Friday, August 04, 2006 1:29 PM
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader
> > <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
> >
> > Before I decided to build my Fox I got the
> accident
> > summary on kitFox's from the EAA and went thru
> about
> > 300 reports. In all of that there were only 4
> deaths
> > in 2 of the 300 accidents. Both were from steep
> > takeoff stalls. I gathered that the kitFox was a
> very
> > survival plane, if one just doesn't try to show
> off on
> > takeoff and is prepared for engine failure.
> >
> > Kurt S. S-5/NSI turbo
__________________________________________________
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| Subject: | Re: series V C.G and weight limits |
I tried to attach a Attach a copy of a factory weight and balance cleaned up
of extraneous comments regarding other than un-swept wing, non-series V etc
data. The series V comes in forward swept one degree or non swept wing. THE
MAX GROSS WEIGHT RECOMMENDED IS 1550 LBS BUT YOU CAN CERTIFICATE ANY MAX
WEIGHT YOU DESIRE. The FAA inspectors recommend you use whatever you think your
estimated max useful weight will be so you don't exceed it in use for insurance
and accident purposes..The floor and bag are very large but you can also
make the baggage compartment any shape you want and many people put in a long
thin-wall pvc tube for skis and fishing poles. Its up to you to keep the c.g.
in limits. The factory says the MGW is 1550 lbs , Mean Aerodynamic Center 51.1
in, forward cgl imit 9.96 in, rearward cg limit 14.75 in. The cg limits are
absolute and must be complied there is no discretion here, only in the max
gross weight should you use other than factory limits and I don't recommend
that.
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Michigan Kitfoxers |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Cudnohufsky's" <7suds@chartermi.net>
Deke,
Count me in, Lloyd in the U.P.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 7:41 PM
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: morid@northland.lib.mi.us
>
> Thanks Richard.
> Hey folks. I can't do much with the Michigan Kitfoxes right now as I'm
> away
> from home and on somebody else's computer. I'm just doing a quick scan
> right
> now and weeding out an enormous amount of spam. I'll be home Monday and
> get
> caught up with all the messages and see where we sit on this.
> Thanks to all who have contributed and asked to be a part of it. Like I
> said, I
> don't know where this will go, but this is a start.
>
> Deke
>
>
> Quoting Richard Rabbers <rira1950@yahoo.com>:
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
>>
>>
>> > Michigan Kitfoxers
>>
>>
>> Seems like a good 'location / type' contact list could benefit all on
>> (our)
>> Matronics list. The existing member list includes many voids and is not
>> very
>> well suited for sorting. Perhaps someday the structure could be improved.
>> (not to minimize the great work that they do)
>>
>> It seems to me that those involved on this list might all welcome the
>> chance
>> to make contact with others no matter where they may find themselves.
>> (when
>> traveling, on lay-overs...etc) It might be tuff to avoid keeping a list
>> that
>> included contact info/email addresses from being captured by 'the
>> outside'
>> creating junk mail or other?
>>
>> Meantime I'm glad to be part of this new effort and assume good will
>> come.
>>
>> Richard Rabbers
>> 627 W Main Street
>> Benton Harbor, MI 49022
>> (269) 925-1901
>> rira1950@yahoo.com
>> Kitfox Model 1 - s/n 168
>> (purchased from 2nd owner - slowly being restored)
>> Rotax 618, Powerfin prop
>> Full Lotus floats
>>
>> - I'm enjoying this list very much. It's great to be able to become
>> familar
>> with Kitfox prior to flight...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=52307#52307
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program.
>
>
>
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
Hi Ken,
I've seen a few adaptations in the past for
disabilities. Most were invented by the individual,
but I bet the EAA has a few ideas available for you.
I once met a man driving a BMW motorcycle with a hook
on his left arm. All the controls were moved to the
right side. Clutch, break, throttle, signals....
Would it work for you to put a strap over the right
peddle so that you could push and pull it? You would
need a cable interconnect to make it work the other
side when you pull. Torgier once drew up such an
arrangement for us a while back. He is a wiz for
finding info too.
Maybe widen the top of the peddle so that you could
put a break on either side of the peddle arm. Toe
push left, right or both brakes by moving your foot?
If you don't like the motorcycle throttle, how about a
big "L" shapped bar or second stick extending from or
below the panel? Push and pull for throttle, swing
laterally like your stick, but for rudder? Fly with
both hands?
Lots of ideas available.... No reason not to fly.
Kurt S.
--- Kenneth and Alice Jones <kmamjones@comcast.net>
wrote:
> Cut Schrader's comment about a motorcycle grip
> throttle caught my attention.
> I'm building an S7 taildragger. I have a bad left
> leg from polio as a
> child - not enough strength for left rudder. I used
> to fly an RV-4. Sold it
> to build the Kitfox - no need for speed anymore. I
> had left rudder and left
> brake hand controls on the RV-4. On landings I cut
> the power to idle when
> the field was made. I needed the left hand for
> rudder (particularly on
> crosswinds) and right for the stick. I never did
> wheel landings - a bit
> too cautious I guess. I don't know much about
> motorcycles. Could a
> motorcycle grip throttle be installed on the S7
> stick, but still have a
> regular throttle for others would might fly the
> plane? I'm using a Rotax
> 912S, which, of course, has two carbs. Sure, I could
> probably fly the S7
> like the RV-4, but I would much rather have use of
> the throttle on the
> landing and roll-out - more options, you know. I
> hadn't thought about the
> motorcycle grip before. Is it even feasible to run
> two throttle cables to
> two carbs? How could the motorcycle throttle be
> locked to maintain cruise
> RPM? Any ideas would be appreciated. If this sounds
> a little dumb, have some
> compassion - I'm a good accountant - not an
> engineer.
>
> Ken Jones
__________________________________________________
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found ---
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resend the email using Plain Text formatting.
HOTMAIL is notorious for only including an HTML section
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
This is how I veiw a slip. You use right rudder and left stick, example, now this
is important, plus forward stick. Also, you use a slip to LOOSE altitude.
Once you loose the altitude you take OUT the slip. The way I see it, you can
only stall IF you go aft stick. Thus you are not in a slip anymore you are
in uncoordinated flight, you WILL stall and go right into a spin.
--------
kitfoxmike
kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
rv7 wingkit
reserved 287RV
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=52681#52681
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| Subject: | Re: Slips and all the rest. |
Forty minutes to download the two messages with attachments. This will
not work for me. I will have to leave the list if this continues. I
know, it's my problem. If the list is going to operate this way, ok. I
just cannot be included.
Jay C.
----- Original Message -----
From: AMuller589@aol.com
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 7:28 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Slips and all the rest.
I attached the picture describing what I tried to say.
Message 45
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| Subject: | Re: Motorcycle grip Throttle |
--- MIME Errors - No Plain-Text Section Found ---
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resend the email using Plain Text formatting.
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HOTMAIL, please see your email application's settings
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox Crash |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "2thesky" <biggerspurs@hotmail.com>
MichaelGibbs(at)cox.net wrote:
> I wouldn't lose any sleep over it Lowell. The numbers you heard provide far
too little information to draw any conclusions from. It could simply mean that
when you drive the heavy iron for a living you forget how to fly a real airplane.
You know, I have a cousin that has 20 some odd years at a major airline. Here
is his story relating to flying "real airplanes." Years back, he owned a Cessna
210. He said it was hell being the only professional pilot who owned a plane
in the family. He was automatically elected the family air taxi. Also, he
lived in a large city and the plane was kept at an airport with Class B airspace.
He said going flying was too much like going to work. He lost interest
in flying it and sold it. Fast forward 12 years. He had moved to a very small
town, the kids had moved out, and less than 2 miles away there was a grass
runway where the locals did touch and goes all day in cubs, 150's, and Champs.
Living close enough to see and hear that all day eventually got to him. The
GA bug bit again. A friend of his had a Grumman Tiger that was in excellent
shape and was for sale cheap. He hitched a ride in a nieghbor's 182 to pick
the plane up and fly it home. When he got there, the seller had him sit in the
left seat while he "checked out" my cousin as he sat in the right seat, in
the hangar with the door open by pointing to instruments and going over V-speeds.
He flew it home. He parked the plane and immediately called an instructor.
He said that had he kept flying the plane, he would have screwed up. He said
it was odd to come home from flying a 727 for a living and then get in the
Tiger with an instructor half his age who had never flown anything larger than
a Seneca to learn to fly all over again. He says that too many airline pilots
do not fly their GA aircraft enough and then are lulled into being over confident
because they are pilots for a living. THe difference is, according to
him, that there is a difference between a flight deck with two other crew members,
advanced computerized navigational systems, auto pilots, etc. and flying
a Tiger, Cessna, or a two seat taildragger. He says had he let his ego let him
keep flying the plane after he bought it without getting a proper checkout or
addition!
al instr
uction after not flying GA for over a decade, he would have died in it. He also
says that sometimes he has to make himself find the time to fly the little airplane
to keep his skills sharp. I just wonder if those 3 pilots that that airline
are losing a year, if that is an accurate number, could be victims of flying
an airplane they are not savvy on because after all, they fly for a living?
Just a thought, and do not archive.
--------
Every takeoff is optional, but every landing is mandatory!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=52689#52689
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| Subject: | Motorcycle grip Throttle |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Andy Fultz" <fultz@trip.net>
Ken,
What about a throttle set up similar to that on a 4-wheeler with an
adjustable friction control? Just another thought. There's no doubt in my
mind that something, that will work for you, can be had. You might just
well need that throttle when you have both hands busy with other chores.
Andy F.
-----Original Message-----
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Kenneth and
Alice Jones
Sent: Saturday, August 05, 2006 12:35 AM
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kenneth and Alice Jones"
<kmamjones@comcast.net>
Cut Schrader's comment about a motorcycle grip throttle caught my attention.
I'm building an S7 taildragger. I have a bad left leg from polio as a
child - not enough strength for left rudder. I used to fly an RV-4. Sold it
to build the Kitfox - no need for speed anymore. I had left rudder and left
brake hand controls on the RV-4. On landings I cut the power to idle when
the field was made. I needed the left hand for rudder (particularly on
crosswinds) and right for the stick. I never did wheel landings - a bit
too cautious I guess. I don't know much about motorcycles. Could a
motorcycle grip throttle be installed on the S7 stick, but still have a
regular throttle for others would might fly the plane? I'm using a Rotax
912S, which, of course, has two carbs. Sure, I could probably fly the S7
like the RV-4, but I would much rather have use of the throttle on the
landing and roll-out - more options, you know. I hadn't thought about the
motorcycle grip before. Is it even feasible to run two throttle cables to
two carbs? How could the motorcycle throttle be locked to maintain cruise
RPM? Any ideas would be appreciated. If this sounds a little dumb, have some
compassion - I'm a good accountant - not an engineer.
Ken Jones
Message 48
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
On Aug 6, 2006, at 2:33 AM, Mark R Miller wrote:
> Short answer is a tray with straps of sufficient strength is all that
> is required.
I agree with Mark, Lloyd. The Odessey PC680 (also my battery) is sealed
and can be positioned any way, even upside down. I have had mine for
nearly two years, not on the firewall but right behind the seat, to
shift a bit the CG when I installed a Jabiru engine.
Cheers,
Michel
Message 49
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
On Aug 6, 2006, at 2:33 AM, Mark R Miller wrote:
> Short answer is a tray with straps of sufficient strength is all that
> is required.
I agree with Mark, Lloyd. The Odessey PC680 (also my battery) is sealed
and can be positioned any way, even upside down. I have had mine for
nearly two years, not on the firewall but right behind the seat, to
shift a bit the CG when I installed a Jabiru engine.
Cheers,
Michel
Message 50
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| Subject: | NOTE: Attached file size |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
On Aug 6, 2006, at 5:21 AM, Jay Carter wrote:
> Forty minutes to download the two messages with attachments.
Yes. While I have DSL and it goes pretty quick, on behalf of the "poor"
modem users, I would like to ask everyone to check the size of any
attachment to the list. If it is more than say, 200 Kb, please consider
finding ways to reduce it or, even better, try to put it on a server
and publish only the link of it.
If you need help to reduce graphic files, you are welcomed to first
write to me privately and I will help you.
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
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