Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:07 AM - Re: Kitfox Pilot/Builder Age?? (you can lie if you want ;-) (John Anderson)
2. 01:18 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (Michel Verheughe)
3. 01:20 AM - Re: Font sizes (Michael Gibbs)
4. 01:20 AM - Re: Age (Michael Gibbs)
5. 01:21 AM - Re: Tri gear vs tailwheel for short take-off, was: Is a taildragger dangerous (John Anderson)
6. 01:21 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (Michael Gibbs)
7. 03:56 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (John Oakley)
8. 04:01 AM - Mail delivery - Lowell FYI (Dave)
9. 04:21 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (Dave)
10. 04:24 AM - Re: Idaho BackCcountry Trip (Ben Baltrusaitis)
11. 04:54 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (John Oakley)
12. 05:03 AM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerous (W Duke)
13. 05:13 AM - Belly / float mount reinforcement (Richard Rabbers)
14. 05:57 AM - Re: Re: Kitfox Pilot/Builder Age?? (you can lie if you want ;-) (Lynn Matteson)
15. 06:00 AM - Re: Font sizes (Lynn Matteson)
16. 06:06 AM - Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement (Dave)
17. 06:45 AM - Re: Re: Michigan Kitfox (COZIK,KEVIN)
18. 07:30 AM - Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement (Fox5flyer)
19. 07:35 AM - Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement (Richard Rabbers)
20. 07:39 AM - Re: Kitfox in Thailand? (John Galt)
21. 07:43 AM - Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement (Richard Rabbers)
22. 07:57 AM - Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement (Dave)
23. 08:04 AM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (Noel Loveys)
24. 08:07 AM - Re: Re: Font sizes (Noel Loveys)
25. 08:13 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (Noel Loveys)
26. 08:16 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (Noel Loveys)
27. 08:30 AM - Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement (Noel Loveys)
28. 08:33 AM - Re: Kitfox in Thailand? (Noel Loveys)
29. 08:39 AM - Re: Kitfox in Thailand? (mscotter@comcast.net)
30. 08:50 AM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (Clifford Begnaud)
31. 09:04 AM - Re: Re: Michigan Kitfox (Lynn Matteson)
32. 09:07 AM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (Dave)
33. 09:16 AM - Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement (Richard Rabbers)
34. 10:04 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (kitfoxmike)
35. 10:04 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (Dick D'Archangel)
36. 10:15 AM - tail wheel (John Oakley)
37. 10:25 AM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (Dave)
38. 10:37 AM - John Galt (Fox5flyer)
39. 11:07 AM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (kitfoxmike)
40. 11:22 AM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (kirkhull)
41. 11:50 AM - Insurance (George Wells@adelphia.net)
42. 12:20 PM - Re: Insurance (Scott Patterson)
43. 12:32 PM - Re: Insurance (Rexster)
44. 12:38 PM - FLOAT PLANE GROUP: "Easy-Lift" Amphibious Floats (Barry)
45. 12:46 PM - Re: Insurance (Glenn Horne)
46. 12:51 PM - Re: FLOAT PLANE GROUP: "Easy-Lift" Amphibious Floats (Dave)
47. 12:52 PM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (Michel Verheughe)
48. 12:54 PM - Re: Insurance (Rexster)
49. 01:11 PM - Re: Insurance (eccles)
50. 01:45 PM - Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? (Richard Rabbers)
51. 03:14 PM - Re: John Galt (John Galt)
52. 03:19 PM - Re: Insurance (Jimmie Blackwell)
53. 03:21 PM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (Roger McConnell)
54. 03:22 PM - Re: Ignition switch question (Cudnohufsky's)
55. 03:25 PM - Re: Kitfox in Thailand? (John Galt)
56. 03:26 PM - Re: Insurance (Gary Olson)
57. 03:27 PM - Re: Kitfox in Thailand? (John Galt)
58. 03:31 PM - Re: FLOAT PLANE GROUP: CZECH FLOATS (WBL)
59. 04:08 PM - Re: Insurance (Don Smythe)
60. 04:11 PM - Re: Re: John Galt (Don Smythe)
61. 04:17 PM - Re: Kitfox in Thailand? (skyflyte@comcast.net)
62. 04:22 PM - Re: Ignition switch question (clemwehner)
63. 04:31 PM - Member Terminated (Don Pearsall)
64. 04:36 PM - Re: John Galt (Marwynne Kuhn)
65. 04:46 PM - Re: Member Terminated (John Galt)
66. 05:07 PM - Re: Kitfox in Thailand? (Noel Loveys)
67. 05:22 PM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (Noel Loveys)
68. 05:24 PM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (Noel Loveys)
69. 05:26 PM - Re: Insurance (Gary Olson)
70. 05:45 PM - Re: Re: Member Terminated (Noel Loveys)
71. 06:02 PM - The Thailand connection (GONER752@aol.com)
72. 06:15 PM - Re: Ignition switch question (Fox5flyer)
73. 06:18 PM - literary references (Marco Menezes)
74. 06:19 PM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (john perry)
75. 06:24 PM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (john perry)
76. 06:58 PM - Re: Insurance (kirkhull)
77. 07:03 PM - Re: Kitfox Pilot/Builder Age?? (you can lie if you want ;-) (Floran Higgins)
78. 07:06 PM - Re: FLOAT PLANE GROUP: CZECH FLOATS (Malcolmbru@aol.com)
79. 07:13 PM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous (kirkhull)
80. 07:44 PM - Re: Re: Member Terminated (Jose M. Toro)
81. 07:57 PM - Re: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous ()
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox Pilot/Builder Age?? (you can lie if you want ;-) |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson" <janderson412@hotmail.com>
58 for me, flew my first tail dragger at 20 and never ground looped yet.
Yes, know what you mean about taking for ever to do that 40 hrs, first flew
my S5 March and only done 17hrs..but then it is winter here.....
From: "Margaret Hastedt" <hastedt@iodp.tamu.edu>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox Pilot/Builder Age?? (you can lie if you
want ;-)
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Margaret Hastedt"
<hastedt@iodp.tamu.edu>
I'm a 43 yr. old woman and have built a Classic IV. But it ain't the years,
it's the mileage!
A little over half the 40 hours flown off now. Feels like it's taking
forever...
-Margaret H.
College Station, TX
>>>gerns25@netscape.net 08/21/06 7:23 PM >>>
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "darinh" <gerns25@netscape.net>
I am currently building a Series 7 and started wondering if there are any
other builders located near Salt Lake City, Utah. Then I started wondering
what the general demographic of our group looked like (age wise). I figured
this would be a fun topic and I may get to now some of you better by putting
it out there.
I will start with myself...I am 30 and have owned a Model III and am
currently building a Series 7 (almost finished with the Fuse).
If there are any of you that are located near Salt Lake City, Utah let me
know, I wouldn't mind some moral support/encouragement while building.
Darin
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56191#56191
_________________________________________________________________
Need more speed? Get Xtra Broadband @
http://jetstream.xtra.co.nz/chm/0,,202853-1000,00.html
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? |
> From: RichWill [rwill1@adelphia.net]
> Tail-draggers are NOT inherently dangerous... Pilots are !!!
Yes, Rich, I still have to hear about a taildragger doing a ground loop in the
hangar! :-)
I understand that any pilot can get in a ground loop, if not paying attention,
as Mr Denneys did. I am trying to figure out if the advantages of the taildragger
is not outweighted by it's danger, and to do that, I need to figure out if,
flying a taildragger as safe as I can, is good enough or if it is just a matter
of time to meet the inevitable extra cost in repairs that a taildragger represents.
Motorbikes are also considered to be more dangerous than cars, yet, some bikers
have been driving all their life without a single accident.
If we leave the distracted pilot on the side and consider now exclusively the problem
of the crosswind and the weathervaning (that I wrongly called first windvaning,
but that is rather called, weathercocking, I think), how much does it
represent a danger for structural damages?
Because I don't want to try in in real-life, the only experience I have is with
a flight simulator but I can't trust a computer to tell me the real thing, hence
my enquiry.
In a crosswind from across the runway, in a simulator, a Kitfox with weathercock,
once going slow enough to have the rudder not responding, into the wind, not
any further.
It has been said on this forum that the moment of rotation will spin the plane
past the wind direction. By how much?
Of course, if the plane turns 90 degrees, into the wind, the initial moment of
inertia will tend to still push the plane in the direction of the runway, hence
now a side force that can tip the plane on one wing tip. But I just can't reproduce
that in the simulator because if the speed is slow enough to have a non-responding
rudder, it is slow enough to turn 90 degrees without having a strong
side force.
So, my question is: Has anyone experienced, or heard of, a taildragger that has
had a wind in the ground because of a crosswind, and solely a crosswind, without
the distraction of the pilot being involved?
Because if the answer is yes, then I'll ask about how putting a tiny wheel in the
drooping winglets of my model 3? I know, it will make all the other pilots
in the hangar laught but ... who cares? Not me!
Cheers,
Michel
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 3
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Noel sez:
>If GM made cars like Apple makes Macs they would be three times faster....
>But could only travel on 10% of the roads.
More like 110% of the roads, now. The Intel-based Macs can run Mac
OS X and Windows XP. The best of both worlds in a stylish package.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 4
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Tony sez:
>if anyone knows of kitfox for sale, please let me know.
Murle Williams has some want ads on his web site:
<http://MurleWilliamsAviation.com>. Click the "Wanted/For Sale" link
at the top of the page.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 5
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| Subject: | Tri gear vs tailwheel for short take-off, was: Is a |
taildragger dangerous
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson" <janderson412@hotmail.com>
From: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Tri gear vs tailwheel for short take-off, was: Is a
taildragger dangerous
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud"
<shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
ken wrote:
"I think I read on this list some time ago ( a year or more) that the nose
wheel Kitfox can take off and land a little shorter than the tailwheel
version"
-------------------
Beg to differ here, on touch down, with a tail dragger you can apply better
braking by holding the stick back and putting more weight on the mains, on
a trainer wheel config, when the brakes are applied weight comes off the
mains and onto the nose wheel and the mains will skid.
----------
a trigear plane has less
drag initially in the takeoff roll, thus allowing it to accelerate faster.
------------
Very little drag at loww speed very little effect.
-------------------------------------------------
Ken,
I believe this to be true. John McBean is likely the best authority on this
subject.
While I have not actually tested a tri-gear vs. tailwheel kitfox (partly
because it's difficult to find two similarly configured) I do have some
empirical evidence to support the idea that a trigear can take-off and land
shorter...
Recently, I switched tires from 600x6 to 850X6. The taller tires allow the
wing to sit at a higher angle when on the ground in the 3 pt position. This
higher angle allows my plane to take-off 75' shorter than before. (5100'
elevation airport) Test were done on two subsequent days in identical
conditions.
I have commented about this wing angle issue before. The sitting position of
the plane puts the wing at an angle that is well below the angle at which
the wing will stall on landing. Because of this, a TRUE 3 pt, full stall
landing in a kitfox (models 4 and higher are the ones I refer to here) will
cause the tailwheel to touch down first. (by a significant amount in the
kitfoxes I have flown) This angle also lengthens the take off roll. With
wing sitting at this low angle, the plane must accelerate to a higher speed
before liftoff than if the wing were at a higher angle.
Now I realize that some people will comment that their kitfox can stall and
land in 3 pt position without the tailwheel touching first (or at least not
by a significant amount) But I would counter that by suggesting that your CG
may be such that you don't have the elevator authority to really stall it
hard, especially in ground effect.
Following this logic, a tri-gear plane could rotate so that the wing is at
the optimum angle for short take-offs and landings, thus outperforming a
similar tailwheel airplane. In addition to this, a trigear plane has less
drag initially in the takeoff roll, thus allowing it to accelerate faster.
Despite this, I would never switch to a tri gear airplane because many of
the off-airport places that I land would leave a tri gear fox with it's nose
buried in the ground.
There is a nice article on STOL aircraft design on the Zenair web site:
http://www.zenithair.com/stolch801/design/design.html
Best Regards,
Cliff
S5, Erie, CO
I think I read on this list some time ago ( a year or more) that the nose
wheel Kitfox can take off and land a little shorter than the tailwheel
version because of the ability to get a little more rotation and thus a
greater angle of attack. Does anyone else remember that discussion? I made
the tailwheel decision and purchased the parts before I heard about this.
That being said I am staying with the tailwheel - logic aside. I have
tailwheel experience, I like the looks, and I like being in the fraternity
of the few pilots who fly tailwheel airplanes.
Ken Jones
_________________________________________________________________
Shop til you drop at XtraMSN Shopping http://shopping.xtramsn.co.nz/home/
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Ken sez:
>I think I read...the nose wheel Kitfox can take off and land a
>little shorter than the tailwheel version because of the ability to
>get a little more rotation and thus a greater angle of attack.
The difference in rotation angle is probably slight. The tail could
only go down a few inches further without the tail wheel which is
probably only a few degrees. On the other hand, with the wing at a
neutral pitch angle, there is probably less aerodynamic drag for the
nose wheel version during the ground roll. How does the rolling
friction of a nose wheel compare to any given tail wheel? Who knows?
On landing, the nose wheel pilot can pretty much stomp on the brakes
as hard as he likes without fear of a prop strike, while the tail
wheel pilot may lift the tail with heavy braking.
Theoretical discussions aside, on a hot day my nose-wheeled,
912S-powered Model IV-1200 Speedster could get off the ground in 120
feet with me and a full load of fuel on-board at a 1500' field
elevation.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 7
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| Subject: | Is a taildragger dangerous? |
Noel,
No problem here. My wife ran off with a guy that had a bigger engine. I will
be buying a new set of amphibs this year and join the group with tales of
wilderness experiences, fun at the dock or just those Sunday flight to the
beach.
Who many guys or gals are on floats and how many types of floats are out
there now a days? I would love to put a list together. Mine were the
aerocet, humm, where is Sam Goodal and does he still have the equipment to
build them ?
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 6:29 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
You should have asked him to be specific on the kinds of accidents and
specifically injuries incurred by float planes. Are we talking gear down
landing in water on amphibs? Possibly the same amphib float gear up on the
runway? How about denting a float on a submerged rock? or falling off a
float while trying to dock?
There seem to be more dangers only because floats give you the opportunity
to go more places. Try them sometime you'll love 'em!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Oakley
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 12:56 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
When I bought my fox in 92 I made the mistake of taking my wife into the
insurance guys office, he explained to her that a tail dragger was four
times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear and the amphip
float equipped fox like yours is 5 times more likely to have a mishap than
the tail dragger.. she looked at him with big eyes and said " our float
plane is 20 times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear 182 ?
" he nodded and hummm,.. Like Walter Mitty , we never did fly the floats.
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Baltrusaitis
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 8:46 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
I was disappointed when I read "How to Fly a Kitfox" by Edward Downs on page
13:
"In general, a less skilled tri-gear pilot has about the same statistical
safety record as a skilled taildragger pilot."
I thought I could be better than that.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Mail delivery - Lowell FYI |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
Lowell -- you did mention mail and I sent this one at about 10 AM on
Wednesday the 23 Aug.
I rec'd it here at 2:56 AM on Aug 24.
I have no other mail problems so I would venture to guess that Matronics
mail servers might be the issue.
Dave
PS I am sending this at 7 AM Aug 24, 2006
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:06 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Idaho BackCcountry Trip
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
>
> Lowell,
>
> Great story.
>
> I have rec;d it twice now FYI
> Once in text and second time with a .doc attachment.
>
> Dave
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 8:42 AM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Idaho BackCcountry Trip
>
>
>> Well, this is the forth time I have tried to send this out. The first
>> two
>> times, I got no rejection notice, but FYI, I suppose Matronics has a max
>> file size. Mine checked out at 11kb before sending. I did get a
>> rejection
>> notice the third time and apparently Matronics doesn't like Word Perfect
>> and
>> rejected it for that reason. I am now sending with only doc and txt
>> attachment versions. I was just trying to be helpful with the file
>> types.
>>
>> Lowell
>>
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? |
MessageI have aerocets 1100 amphibs.
They work well on my IV but I would add that they are a bit
underfloated but fully operational as they are. Aerocets are not
currently being made but the molds are out there somewhere.
I will add that Dan Denney insisted on all SS parts on the floats which
makes them the most corrosive resistance possible for salt water. I
operate in fresh water only and have re-made parts of the landing gear
with 4130 as it's strength is far superior to the SS used on the
Aerocets. Operating off pavement and water the SS fares well but with
grass operation the gear's life decreases immensely.
I would suggest that if you are looking for floats that you should talk
to Paul Seehafer as he very involved with floats and he runs the
seaplane base in Oshkosh.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: John Oakley
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 7:03 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
Noel,
No problem here. My wife ran off with a guy that had a bigger engine.
I will be buying a new set of amphibs this year and join the group with
tales of wilderness experiences, fun at the dock or just those Sunday
flight to the beach.
Who many guys or gals are on floats and how many types of floats are
out there now a days? I would love to put a list together. Mine were the
aerocet, humm, where is Sam Goodal and does he still have the equipment
to build them ?
John Oakley
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 6:29 PM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
You should have asked him to be specific on the kinds of accidents and
specifically injuries incurred by float planes. Are we talking gear
down landing in water on amphibs? Possibly the same amphib float gear up
on the runway? How about denting a float on a submerged rock? or
falling off a float while trying to dock?
There seem to be more dangers only because floats give you the
opportunity to go more places. Try them sometime you'll love 'em!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Oakley
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 12:56 PM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
When I bought my fox in 92 I made the mistake of taking my wife into
the insurance guys office, he explained to her that a tail dragger was
four times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear and the
amphip float equipped fox like yours is 5 times more likely to have a
mishap than the tail dragger.. she looked at him with big eyes and said
" our float plane is 20 times more likely to have a mishap than the
tricycle gear 182 ? " he nodded and hummm,.. Like Walter Mitty , we
never did fly the floats.
John Oakley
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
---
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Baltrusaitis
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 8:46 AM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
I was disappointed when I read "How to Fly a Kitfox" by Edward Downs
on page 13:
"In general, a less skilled tri-gear pilot has about the same
statistical safety record as a skilled taildragger pilot."
I thought I could be better than that.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Idaho BackCcountry Trip |
I like the .doc version because I didn't have time to read it and just
saved it to MS Word for later.
Ben
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: 08/23/2006 10:06 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Idaho BackCcountry Trip
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
Lowell,
Great story.
I have rec;d it twice now FYI
Once in text and second time with a .doc attachment.
Dave
Message 11
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| Subject: | Is a taildragger dangerous? |
Aerocet are beautiful, and I sold them to Dan Denney four or five years
ago, thanks for the note. I will look around.
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 5:21 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
I have aerocets 1100 amphibs.
They work well on my IV but I would add that they are a bit underfloated
but fully operational as they are. Aerocets are not currently being made but
the molds are out there somewhere.
I will add that Dan Denney insisted on all SS parts on the floats which
makes them the most corrosive resistance possible for salt water. I operate
in fresh water only and have re-made parts of the landing gear with 4130 as
it's strength is far superior to the SS used on the Aerocets. Operating off
pavement and water the SS fares well but with grass operation the gear's
life decreases immensely.
I would suggest that if you are looking for floats that you should talk to
Paul Seehafer as he very involved with floats and he runs the seaplane base
in Oshkosh.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: John Oakley <mailto:john@leptron.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 7:03 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
Noel,
No problem here. My wife ran off with a guy that had a bigger engine. I will
be buying a new set of amphibs this year and join the group with tales of
wilderness experiences, fun at the dock or just those Sunday flight to the
beach.
Who many guys or gals are on floats and how many types of floats are out
there now a days? I would love to put a list together. Mine were the
aerocet, humm, where is Sam Goodal and does he still have the equipment to
build them ?
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 6:29 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
You should have asked him to be specific on the kinds of accidents and
specifically injuries incurred by float planes. Are we talking gear down
landing in water on amphibs? Possibly the same amphib float gear up on the
runway? How about denting a float on a submerged rock? or falling off a
float while trying to dock?
There seem to be more dangers only because floats give you the opportunity
to go more places. Try them sometime you'll love 'em!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Oakley
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 12:56 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
When I bought my fox in 92 I made the mistake of taking my wife into the
insurance guys office, he explained to her that a tail dragger was four
times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear and the amphip
float equipped fox like yours is 5 times more likely to have a mishap than
the tail dragger.. she looked at him with big eyes and said " our float
plane is 20 times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear 182 ?
" he nodded and hummm,.. Like Walter Mitty , we never did fly the floats.
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Baltrusaitis
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 8:46 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
I was disappointed when I read "How to Fly a Kitfox" by Edward Downs on page
13:
"In general, a less skilled tri-gear pilot has about the same statistical
safety record as a skilled taildragger pilot."
I thought I could be better than that.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerous |
I believe it was John McBean that told me several years ago that the nose wheel
had a shorter take off because the wing is at a lower AOA and offers less drag.
Therefore faster acceleration and earlier rotation.
Maxwell S6/TW/IO240
Kenneth and Alice Jones <kmamjones@comcast.net> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kenneth and Alice Jones"
I think I read on this list some time ago ( a year or more) that the nose
wheel Kitfox can take off and land a little shorter than the tailwheel
version because of the ability to get a little more rotation and thus a
greater angle of attack. Does anyone else remember that discussion? I made
the tailwheel decision and purchased the parts before I heard about this.
That being said I am staying with the tailwheel - logic aside. I have
tailwheel experience, I like the looks, and I like being in the fraternity
of the few pilots who fly tailwheel airplanes.
Ken Jones
Original Message -----
From: "Michael Gibbs"
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 4:02 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerous
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs
>
> Michel sez:
>
>>...Ground loop from bad landing in good weather condition. Is it a real
>>danger when you have several hundred landings on a plane you know well?
>>Will I, one day, loose control without apparent reason?
>
> There is a famous story about Dan Denney giving a demonstration flight in
> a Kitfox to a magazine reporter and ground-looping the airplane on
> landing. I'm sure Denney had thousands of hours in 'foxes at that time.
>
> Distraction is something that can sneak up on the most experienced of
> pilots.
>
> Mike G.
> N728KF
>
>
>
---------------------------------
All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Belly / float mount reinforcement |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
I recently received some info from a model 3 pilot flying Full Lotus floats.
He relayed " One item that was needed for floats on the models 1 through 3 is a
brace across the bottom that I purchased from Skstar. "
I'd not heard of this before.
Does anyone have any knowledge or feel a need for reinforcement like this?
- see photo attached.
Thanks
--------
Richard in SW Michigan
Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56936#56936
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/belly_gear_reinforcement_824.jpg
Message 14
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|
| Subject: | Re: Kitfox Pilot/Builder Age?? (you can lie if you want |
;-)
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Hey Kevin, I was just talking with Kitfox owner Jack (?) at Mason
Airport (TEW) yesterday, and your name came up. Sounds like you are
taking your 'fox to his hangar soon. I flew in there yesterday to go
visit Beacon Aviation.
Lynn
do not archive
On Wednesday, August 23, 2006, at 07:22 PM, Kevin Cozik wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Kevin Cozik"
> <Kcozik@cablespeed.com>
>
> 38 years old.
> Kevin
> S6 in mid Michigan
Message 15
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|
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
But on those 10% of the roads, there would be no "orange cones"....: )
Lynn
do not archive
On Wednesday, August 23, 2006, at 08:39 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
>
> If GM made cars like Apple makes Macs they would be three times
> faster....
>
> But could only travel on 10% of the roads.
>
> Noel
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
>> Lynn Matteson
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 5:40 PM
>> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Font sizes
>>
>>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>>
>> That didn't work for me Rex and Dave...but then I buck the tide by
>> using a Mac. I can go to font size and increase the size of the
>> offending post, but then what would I have to complain about? : )
>> Strangely enough, if I were to reply to one of these hard-to-read,
>> 10-point posts, my mail system automatically increases the
>> font size to
>> that which I have set for my system, which is 12-point...so even my
>> mail system recognizes that 10-point is too small.
>>
>> Lynn
>>
>> On Wednesday, August 23, 2006, at 07:16 AM, Rexster wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Dave.
>>>
>>> It works!
>>>
>>>
>>> Rex in Michigan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --"Dave"<dave@cfisher.com>wrote:
>>> -->Kitfox-Listmessagepostedby:"Dave"<dave@cfisher.com>
>>>
>>> Lynn,
>>>
>>> IuseoutlookexpressformailandtoadjustfontsizeI
>> justholddown
>>> CTRL
>>> buttonandrollthemousewheelonmessageanditchangessize.
>>> OralternatewouldbeclickonView==>Textsize==>
>> selectfontsi
>>> ze
>>> youlike
>>>
>>> Dave
>>>
>>>
>>> -----OriginalMessage-----
>>> From:"LynnMatteson"<lynnmatt@jps.net>
>>> To:<kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>>> Sent:Tuesday,August22,200610:22PM
>>> Subject:Kitfox-List:Fontsizes
>>>
>>>
>>>> -->Kitfox-Listmessagepostedby:LynnMatteson
>> <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>>>>
>>>> Heyguysandgals,howaboutgivingthisoldmanabreak
>> andnotuse
>>> those
>>>> stinkin'little10sizeletteringthathavebeencropping
>> upherelat
>>> ely.
>>>> Forsomereason,alotofmailhasbeencominginusing
>> thattiny,ha
>>> rdto
>>>> readsize.Itdoesn'tcostanymoretousea12,and
>> thesetiredeyes
>>>
>>>> wouldappreciateit.:)
>>>> Andit'snotjustmyreader,ormycomputer,assome
>> messagescontain
>>> size
>>>> 10,12,andeven14whenquotingotherposters.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Lynn
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
Richard,
no photo attached ?
I have a brand new set of Full lotus at my shop now being installed on a
beaver .
Let me know if you need pics.
I do have the aerocet install info as well.
dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 8:13 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Belly / float mount reinforcement
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
>
> I recently received some info from a model 3 pilot flying Full Lotus
> floats.
>
> He relayed " One item that was needed for floats on the models 1 through 3
> is a brace across the bottom that I purchased from Skstar. "
>
> I'd not heard of this before.
> Does anyone have any knowledge or feel a need for reinforcement like this?
> - see photo attached.
>
> Thanks
>
> --------
> Richard in SW Michigan
> Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56936#56936
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/belly_gear_reinforcement_824.jpg
>
>
>
Message 17
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|
| Subject: | Re: Michigan Kitfox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "COZIK,KEVIN" <kcozik@cablespeed.com>
Hi Lynn
I just missed you yesterday. The guys at Beacon are
great. Les, the owner, is a friend of mine.
My plane will be in my hangar sunday morning so stop by
when you get a chance.
Kevin
Message 18
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|
| Subject: | Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <morid@northland.lib.mi.us>
It appears that Skystar engineering felt this area needed some extra
strength.
Deke
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
>
> I recently received some info from a model 3 pilot flying Full Lotus
floats.
>
> He relayed " One item that was needed for floats on the models 1 through 3
is a brace across the bottom that I purchased from Skstar. "
>
> I'd not heard of this before.
> Does anyone have any knowledge or feel a need for reinforcement like this?
> - see photo attached.
>
> Thanks
>
> --------
> Richard in SW Michigan
> Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)
Message 19
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|
| Subject: | Belly / float mount reinforcement |
Dave relayed that my photo attachment (sent via web view) did not come through.
I'll dupicate my question here and try the attachment via Email.
I recently received some info from a model 3 pilot flying Full Lotus floats.
He relayed " One item that was needed for floats on the models 1 through 3 is
a brace across the bottom that I purchased from Skstar. "
I'd not heard of this before.
Does anyone have any knowledge or feel a need for einforcement like this?
- see photo attached.
Thanks!
Richard - Model 1, 618, Full Lotus floats - Benton Harbor MI.
Richard
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox in Thailand? |
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
> Not even warm!
>
>
> Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
> *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
>
> Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers market
> out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K
> range?
>
>
> On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
> > Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your
> > original comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make
> > that blind rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
> >
> > Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
> >
> > You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL
> > Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
> > money..... Big MONEY!
> >
> > Noel
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > *Sent:* Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
> > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> >
> > Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is
> > even that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not
> > reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking about. I
> > was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing his
> > kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a one
> > way ticket to Thailand.
> >
> >
> >
> > On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
> >
> > > John Galt,
> >
> > Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on
> > this list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex
> > trade and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only
> > termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless
> > you're here for the intended purpose.
> >
> > Rex in Michigan
> >
> > -- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
> > *From:* John Galt <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
> >
> > I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will not
> > cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the price,
> > not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they may
> > be.
> >
> > RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
> > I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear
> > next. Fly alone young man.
> >
> > Don Smythe
> >
> > *
> > tronics.comics.com
> > *
> >
> > **
> >
> > http://wiki.matronics.com
> >
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp://wiki.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
> *
>
>
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
> no photo attached ?
Dave,
The photo shows up in the forum link http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56936#56936 where I generated my question. I also received the attachement when I received my posting via Email. I'll try again via Email to the list.
> I have a brand new set of Full lotus at my shop now being installed on a beaver
. Let me know if you need pics.
Yes....I'd love to see photos of your installations or parts/mounts.
It seem fairly basic and I know my needs are not unlike others - low weight + required
strength. My model 1 low gross lives no room for excess.
Thanks!
--------
Richard in SW Michigan
Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56978#56978
Message 22
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|
| Subject: | Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement |
Richard,
I have not seen this brace before but I would certainly make one up if
it called for.
Looks like a decent stiffner.
Now that is on front float gear attachment fittings. So Why would they
not have one on the rear attach fittings as ther is more load there plus
the added wing struts attach there as well.
I know some of the earlier Kitfoxes that is was a weak spot ,
expecially on hard landings.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Rabbers
To: Kitfox List
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 10:34 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Belly / float mount reinforcement
Dave relayed that my photo attachment (sent via web view) did not come
through.
I'll dupicate my question here and try the attachment via Email.
I recently received some info from a model 3 pilot flying Full Lotus
floats.
He relayed " One item that was needed for floats on the models 1
through 3 is a brace across the bottom that I purchased from Skstar. "
I'd not heard of this before.
Does anyone have any knowledge or feel a need for einforcement like
this?
- see photo attached.
Thanks!
Richard - Model 1, 618, Full Lotus floats - Benton Harbor MI.
Richard
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
The brakes on my model III-A won't even hold the plane at full throttle.. I
doubt they could cause a nose over even with full application. One of these
days I'll get to try out the wheels.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Michael Gibbs
> Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 5:51 AM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a
> taildragger dangerous
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs
> <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
>
> Ken sez:
>
> >I think I read...the nose wheel Kitfox can take off and land a
> >little shorter than the tailwheel version because of the ability to
> >get a little more rotation and thus a greater angle of attack.
>
> The difference in rotation angle is probably slight. The tail could
> only go down a few inches further without the tail wheel which is
> probably only a few degrees. On the other hand, with the wing at a
> neutral pitch angle, there is probably less aerodynamic drag for the
> nose wheel version during the ground roll. How does the rolling
> friction of a nose wheel compare to any given tail wheel? Who knows?
>
> On landing, the nose wheel pilot can pretty much stomp on the brakes
> as hard as he likes without fear of a prop strike, while the tail
> wheel pilot may lift the tail with heavy braking.
>
> Theoretical discussions aside, on a hot day my nose-wheeled,
> 912S-powered Model IV-1200 Speedster could get off the ground in 120
> feet with me and a full load of fuel on-board at a 1500' field
> elevation.
>
> Mike G.
> N728KF
>
>
>
>
>
Message 24
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|
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
As soon as they put DSL in here I'm having one!
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Michael Gibbs
> Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 5:51 AM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Font sizes
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs
> <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
>
> Noel sez:
>
> >If GM made cars like Apple makes Macs they would be three
> times faster....
> >But could only travel on 10% of the roads.
>
> More like 110% of the roads, now. The Intel-based Macs can run Mac
> OS X and Windows XP. The best of both worlds in a stylish package.
>
> Mike G.
> N728KF
>
>
>
>
>
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Is a taildragger dangerous? |
John:
If I can find a set of Aerocet 1100 amphibs I'll sell you my straights.
I
live on the beach so I use the 'Fox for sight seeing, fishing and the
love
of flying.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Oakley
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 8:33 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
Noel,
No problem here. My wife ran off with a guy that had a bigger engine. I
will
be buying a new set of amphibs this year and join the group with tales
of
wilderness experiences, fun at the dock or just those Sunday flight to
the
beach.
Who many guys or gals are on floats and how many types of floats are out
there now a days? I would love to put a list together. Mine were the
aerocet, humm, where is Sam Goodal and does he still have the equipment
to
build them ?
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 6:29 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
You should have asked him to be specific on the kinds of accidents and
specifically injuries incurred by float planes. Are we talking gear
down
landing in water on amphibs? Possibly the same amphib float gear up on
the
runway? How about denting a float on a submerged rock? or falling off
a
float while trying to dock?
There seem to be more dangers only because floats give you the
opportunity
to go more places. Try them sometime you'll love 'em!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Oakley
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 12:56 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
When I bought my fox in 92 I made the mistake of taking my wife into the
insurance guys office, he explained to her that a tail dragger was four
times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear and the amphip
float equipped fox like yours is 5 times more likely to have a mishap
than
the tail dragger.. she looked at him with big eyes and said " our float
plane is 20 times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear
182 ?
" he nodded and hummm,.. Like Walter Mitty , we never did fly the
floats.
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Baltrusaitis
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 8:46 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
I was disappointed when I read "How to Fly a Kitfox" by Edward Downs on
page
13:
"In general, a less skilled tri-gear pilot has about the same
statistical
safety record as a skilled taildragger pilot."
I thought I could be better than that.
Message 26
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| Subject: | Is a taildragger dangerous? |
Thanks Dave. That's a good idea. I still don't relish the thought of
dunking my 4130 frame into the briny North Atlantic my frame isn't
powder
coated and you can never be sure you got all the salt out.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
I have aerocets 1100 amphibs.
They work well on my IV but I would add that they are a bit
underfloated
but fully operational as they are. Aerocets are not currently being made
but
the molds are out there somewhere.
I will add that Dan Denney insisted on all SS parts on the floats which
makes them the most corrosive resistance possible for salt water. I
operate
in fresh water only and have re-made parts of the landing gear with 4130
as
it's strength is far superior to the SS used on the Aerocets. Operating
off
pavement and water the SS fares well but with grass operation the gear's
life decreases immensely.
I would suggest that if you are looking for floats that you should talk
to
Paul Seehafer as he very involved with floats and he runs the seaplane
base
in Oshkosh.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: John Oakley <mailto:john@leptron.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 7:03 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
Noel,
No problem here. My wife ran off with a guy that had a bigger engine. I
will
be buying a new set of amphibs this year and join the group with tales
of
wilderness experiences, fun at the dock or just those Sunday flight to
the
beach.
Who many guys or gals are on floats and how many types of floats are out
there now a days? I would love to put a list together. Mine were the
aerocet, humm, where is Sam Goodal and does he still have the equipment
to
build them ?
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 6:29 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
You should have asked him to be specific on the kinds of accidents and
specifically injuries incurred by float planes. Are we talking gear
down
landing in water on amphibs? Possibly the same amphib float gear up on
the
runway? How about denting a float on a submerged rock? or falling off
a
float while trying to dock?
There seem to be more dangers only because floats give you the
opportunity
to go more places. Try them sometime you'll love 'em!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Oakley
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 12:56 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
When I bought my fox in 92 I made the mistake of taking my wife into the
insurance guys office, he explained to her that a tail dragger was four
times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear and the amphip
float equipped fox like yours is 5 times more likely to have a mishap
than
the tail dragger.. she looked at him with big eyes and said " our float
plane is 20 times more likely to have a mishap than the tricycle gear
182 ?
" he nodded and hummm,.. Like Walter Mitty , we never did fly the
floats.
John Oakley
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Ben
Baltrusaitis
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 8:46 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Is a taildragger dangerous?
I was disappointed when I read "How to Fly a Kitfox" by Edward Downs on
page
13:
"In general, a less skilled tri-gear pilot has about the same
statistical
safety record as a skilled taildragger pilot."
I thought I could be better than that.
Message 27
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| Subject: | Belly / float mount reinforcement |
I have that brace on my plane. as well as a strake under the vertical
stabilizer. You can hit pretty hard if there is a decent wave at all
so
the brace seems ok to me.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard
Rabbers
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:05 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Belly / float mount reinforcement
Dave relayed that my photo attachment (sent via web view) did not come
through.
I'll dupicate my question here and try the attachment via Email.
I recently received some info from a model 3 pilot flying Full Lotus
floats.
He relayed " One item that was needed for floats on the models 1 through
3
is a brace across the bottom that I purchased from Skstar. "
I'd not heard of this before.
Does anyone have any knowledge or feel a need for einforcement like
this?
- see photo attached.
Thanks!
Richard - Model 1, 618, Full Lotus floats - Benton Harbor MI.
Richard
Message 28
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| Subject: | Kitfox in Thailand? |
You got that right! :-)
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:09 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Not even warm!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
market
out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K
range?
On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca
<mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca> >
wrote:
Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your original
comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make that
blind
rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL
Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
money..... Big MONEY!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is
even
that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not
reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking
about. I
was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing
his
kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a
one
way ticket to Thailand.
On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com <mailto:runwayrex@juno.com> >
wrote:
John Galt,
Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on
this
list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex
trade
and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only
termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum
unless
you're here for the intended purpose.
Rex in Michigan
-- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
From: John Galt <mailto:johngalt.0@gmail.com>
I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will not
cool
my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the price, not
some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they may
be.
RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear
next.
Fly alone young man.
Don Smythe
tronics.com <http://tronics.com/>
ics.com <http://ics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 29
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|
| Subject: | Re: Kitfox in Thailand? |
He probably will, but not to you. :-0
You still have yet to answer the question that was posed to you. What connection
do kitfoxs, or their builders, have to do with the child sex trade? And why
the comment by youing trying to tie the two together?
I think I smell a troll. What do we need to do to get this one booted?
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "John Galt" <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Not even warm!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers market out there,
let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K range?
On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your original comment
in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make that blind rage, the
words "child sex trade", would invoke!
Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL Aerocet floats
and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring money..... Big MONEY!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is even that
frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not reading the
thread, you would have figured out what I was talking about. I was objecting
to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing his kitfox too low".
If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
John Galt,
Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on this list
seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex trade and/or
religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only termoil you have
going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless you're here for
the intended purpose.
Rex in Michigan
-- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
From: John Galt
I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will not cool my
interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the price, not some over
zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they may be.
RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear next. Fly
alone young man.
Don Smythe
tronics.com
ics.com
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
<html><body>
<DIV>He probably will, but not to you. :-0</DIV>
<DIV>You still have yet to answer the question that was posed to you. What
connection do kitfoxs, or their builders, have to do with the child sex trade?
And why the comment by youing trying to tie the two together?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I think I smell a troll. What do we need to do to get this one booted?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px
solid">-------------- Original message -------------- <BR>From: "John Galt"
<johngalt.0@gmail.com> <BR>Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.<BR><BR>
<DIV><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 8/24/06, <B class=gmail_sendername>Noel Loveys</B> <<A href="mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca">noelloveys@yahoo.ca</A>> wrote:</SPAN>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT size=4>Not even warm!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<P align=left><SPAN lang=en-us><FONT size=4>Noel</FONT></SPAN></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000
2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma size=2></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=q>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com" target=_blank>owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com </A>[mailto:<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com" target=_blank>owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com</A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>John Galt<BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_10d3ecf78f4cfd4a_2><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM<BR><B>To:</B> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com" target=_blank>kitfox-list@matronics.com</A><BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?<BR><BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_10d3ecf78f4cfd4a_4>
<DIV>Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers market
out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K range?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR> </DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_10d3ecf78f4cfd4a_6><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 8/23/06, <B class=gmail_sendername>Noel Loveys</B> <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca" target=_blank> noelloveys@yahoo.ca</A>> wrote:</SPAN> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_10d3ecf78f4cfd4a_8>
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT size=4>Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure
out</FONT></SPAN><SPAN><FONT size=4> your original comment in relation
pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make that blind rage, the words
"child sex trade", would invoke! </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT size=4>Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.</FONT> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT size=4>You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight
three blade UL Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em.....
Bring money..... Big MONEY!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<P align=left><SPAN lang=en-us><FONT size=4>Noel</FONT></SPAN></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000
2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma size=2></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com" target=_blank>owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com </A>[mailto:<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com" target=_blank>owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com</A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>John Galt<BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM<BR><B>To:</B> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com" target=_blank>kitfox-list@matronics.com </A><BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><B>Subject:</B> Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?<BR><BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV>Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is even
that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not
reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking about.
I was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing
his kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a one
way ticket to Thailand. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><BR> </DIV></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_10d3ecf78f4cfd4a_10>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 8/23/06, <B class=gmail_sendername>Rexster</B> <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:runwayrex@juno.com" target=_blank>runwayrex@juno.com </A>> wrote: </SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid"></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV>
<P>John Galt,</P>
<P> Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on this
list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex trade
and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only termoil
you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless you're
here for the intended purpose. </P>
<P>Rex in Michigan<BR><BR>-- "Don Smythe" <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:dosmythe@cox.net" target=_blank>dosmythe@cox.net</A>> wrote:<BR></P></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV><B>From:</B> <A title=johngalt.0@gmail.com onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:johngalt.0@gmail.com" target=_blank>John Galt</A> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT:
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation,
so it will not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market
sets the price, not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned
they may be. </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial>RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS
EVANGELIST...</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial>I don't think I'll
respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear next. Fly alone
young man.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial>Don Smythe</FONT></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://tronics.com/" target=_blank>tronics.com</A>
<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://ics.com/" target=_blank>ics.com</A>
</FONT></B></PRE></DIV></A></DIV>
<DIV><PRE></PRE></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000
size=2>
</FONT></B></PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=q>
<DIV><SPAN><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2>
</FONT></B></PRE></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV> </DIV><BR><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
</FONT></B></PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=q><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List</A></A>
http://forums.matronics.com</A></A>
http://wiki.matronics.com</A></A>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution</A></A>
</FONT></B></PRE></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier"
color=#000000 size=2>
</B></FONT></PRE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
Mike wrote:
"The difference in rotation angle is probably slight. The tail could
only go down a few inches further without the tail wheel which is
probably only a few degrees."
Mike,
The difference is that the maingear on the Tri is farther aft, this has the
effect of raising the front end of the plane farther when the tail is all
the way down. This allows the wing to sit at a higher angle of incidence
compared to the tailwheel plane.
As far as braking, who cares if the Tri gear plane can brake harder than the
TW plane, you could only do it on an improved runway and there isn't much
need to do so there. They are all long enough to require no braking at all.
The real issue is which plane can brake harder and stop quicker on rough off
airport landings. TW wins hands down.
John Anderson's comment about low speed drag on the take off roll is right
on, the difference is likely minimal.
Best regards,
Cliff
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Michigan Kitfox |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
I'll be at Beacon on Mon. the 28th, around 8am, to have my xpndr
certified for VFR.
Lynn
do not archive
On Thursday, August 24, 2006, at 09:46 AM, COZIK,KEVIN wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "COZIK,KEVIN"
> <kcozik@cablespeed.com>
>
> Hi Lynn
> I just missed you yesterday. The guys at Beacon are great. Les, the
> owner, is a friend of mine.
>
> My plane will be in my hangar sunday morning so stop by when you get a
> chance.
>
> Kevin
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
I am sure that Mike knows all about rough field landings in a tri gear from
what I have read.
120 foot TO in a speedster is impressive, my long winged IV will only do
about 200 foot TO on hot day with no wind at 1000 asl. and weighs under
600 lbs.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Clifford Begnaud" <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
dangerous
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clifford Begnaud"
> <shoeless@barefootpilot.com>
>
> Mike wrote:
> "The difference in rotation angle is probably slight. The tail could
> only go down a few inches further without the tail wheel which is
> probably only a few degrees."
>
> Mike,
> The difference is that the maingear on the Tri is farther aft, this has
> the
> effect of raising the front end of the plane farther when the tail is all
> the way down. This allows the wing to sit at a higher angle of incidence
> compared to the tailwheel plane.
>
> As far as braking, who cares if the Tri gear plane can brake harder than
> the
> TW plane, you could only do it on an improved runway and there isn't much
> need to do so there. They are all long enough to require no braking at
> all.
> The real issue is which plane can brake harder and stop quicker on rough
> off
> airport landings. TW wins hands down.
>
> John Anderson's comment about low speed drag on the take off roll is right
> on, the difference is likely minimal.
> Best regards,
> Cliff
>
>
>
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Belly / float mount reinforcement |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
> Noel sez: I have that brace on my plane
I'm glad to hear about this support at this point 'prior to mounting'.
> Deke sez: It appears that Skystar engineering felt this area needed some extra
strength.
Yep, I guess so.
> Dave sez: So Why would they not have one on the rear attach fittings as there
is more load there plus the added wing struts attach there as well.
I'm curious also.
I welcome other input or experience.
Thanks!
--------
Richard in SW Michigan
Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57013#57013
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
I think we need to have a poll as to how many of us actually land in a rough off
field. I don't. Currently 100% is ashphalt. Off field, or the boonees landing
is very risky and I concider most to be extrem flying. Am I the only one
that takes safety seriously and determines yes or no to a landing site. Sure
some of us are thinking, what if the engine quites. I say, that's not a normal.
My definition of extrem is daredevil.
--------
kitfoxmike
kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
rv7 wingkit
reserved 287RV
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57025#57025
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? |
This thread has so many replies that I felt I should offer my experience
as an example.
Prior to flying my Classic 4 (w/914 ul) I had about 120 hours Total
Filght Duration (mostly in 152's but included 7 hrs in a J3 for
tailwheel endorsement). 33 of these hours were PIC time. I also had 3
hrs dual time in a 912 powered Classic 4.
Since then I have flown 6061D over 100 hours and made over 200 landings
(20% wheel, 80% 3-point) all on pavement. A few of the landings have
been hard because I didn't judge the distance from the ground correctly,
and I done some bounding, but once the airplane stopped flying I have
had no problems controlling it on the ground. I have avoided crosswind
takoff and landing when possible, but have managed OK when I had to land
crosswind.
This is not to say I won't ground loop of have some control problems in
the future, only that a fairly inexperienced pilot can safely fly a
tail wheel airplane under routine conditions.
I want to emphasize that I am no "top gun". My piloting skills are
average at best. The only asset I have, and this is questionable, is
close to 1,000 hours is kayaks steered with rudder peddles. So I've had
a lot of practice steering with my feet.
Dick D'Archangel
Classic 4 912 ul
Ben Baltrusaitis wrote:
> I was disappointed when I read "How to Fly a Kitfox" by Edward Downs
> on page 13:
>
> "In general, a less skilled tri-gear pilot has about the same
> statistical safety record as a skilled taildragger pilot."
>
> I thought I could be better than that.
>
>
Message 36
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For those that asked, the matcomfg.com tail wheel I installed on my fox, is
a WHLT-8 PNEU. It still shows up as 217.72 dollars from them. It showed up
in 2 days.
John Oakley
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
I fly off grass 98% on wheels when no snow
I fly off 98 % skis when there is no snow and sometimes on just grass with
skis.( straight skis only )
I fly off water and asphault and grass strips when on amphibs
I have practiced forced approaches since I started flying over 25 years ago
and have had 4 forced landings.
- one engine failure - homebuilt
-one carb came loose and engine failed homebuilt
-one lost power on TO in 172 and deadstick back to airport
- one prop failure ( blade departed) and landed in field with engine just
barely attached.
all the above -- no damage to landing gear or anything other that the last
prop failure where the windshield blew out and firewall got partially torn
away from engine shaking around.
moral of story is practice certainly helps in realtime.
same story for spins -- if you cannot demostrate and be proficient then just
a course in "awareness " does not necessarily cut it. How many get killed
from stall/spin accidents yearly but only instructors need to train for them
?
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 1:03 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
dangerous
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
>
> I think we need to have a poll as to how many of us actually land in a
> rough off field. I don't. Currently 100% is ashphalt. Off field, or the
> boonees landing is very risky and I concider most to be extrem flying. Am
> I the only one that takes safety seriously and determines yes or no to a
> landing site. Sure some of us are thinking, what if the engine quites. I
> say, that's not a normal.
>
> My definition of extrem is daredevil.
>
> --------
> kitfoxmike
> kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
> http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
> rv7 wingkit
> reserved 287RV
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57025#57025
>
>
>
Message 38
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Mr. Galt, with all due respect, it would appear to me that it is you who
has the attitude and you've demonstrated it since your first post to
this list. We pride ourselves on this List for having member harmony
and we intend to keep it that way even if it means to occasionally do a
little weeding. You obviously feel the need to have the last word when
what you should be doing is providing useful and constructive input for
others to benefit from. If you have no useful or constructive input
then perhaps just lurk with us and when you have a meaningful question
that is Kitfox related, don't hesitate to ask it. If you are not able
to do this we have a solution.
Sincerely,
Deke Morisse and
Don Pearsall
List Administrators
----- Original Message -----
From: John Galt
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 10:39 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Not even warm!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
market out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in
the $14K range?
On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your
original comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire,
make that blind rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade
UL Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
money..... Big MONEY!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy
or is even that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you
were not reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was
talking about. I was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not
me) for "pricing his kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is
them. Or perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
John Galt,
Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody
on this list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers
with sex trade and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue
isn't the only termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off
of this forum unless you're here for the intended purpose.
Rex in Michigan
-- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
From: John Galt
I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it
will not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets
the price, not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well
intentioned they may be.
RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what
I'll hear next. Fly alone young man.
Don Smythe
tronics.com
ics.com
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
Now don't anybody get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with landing off field.
It's when you take it to the next level and land where no airplane should land
type of thing. I remember when I snomobiled and the people I went with gradually
got into extrem I mean extrem sleading. I think the billy goats would shake
from some of the crap these guys did. I mean, going up mountain sides almost
straight up, and then go back the way they came in but not just easing it
back down, I mean running wide open and jumping over the edge, these guys also
caused avalanches and they rode the fricken avalanches. This is when I quit
snomobiling.
I want flying to be fun, I fly 200 hrs a year, and try and do different things
to make it fun. But to land into one way strips and land on sand bars and into
a strip that even my truck wouldn't be able to handle. Well, do I need to say
any more.
I would like to know how many people really do this kind of flying on this list.
--------
kitfoxmike
kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
rv7 wingkit
reserved 287RV
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57039#57039
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kirkhull" <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
a-men
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RichWill
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 7:02 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerous?
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "RichWill" <rwill1@adelphia.net>
Tail-draggers are NOT inherently dangerous... Pilots are !!!
--------
Semper Fi
15 ITT
G2 HqCo HqBn
1st MarDiv
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=56801#56801
Message 41
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Does any one have a good source for Liability insurance on a Model 5
Thanks
Message 42
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott Patterson <scott@lifeseeker.com>
I just signed up with Avemco. 800-638-8440.
$1,000,000 liability for $572/year. Model IV.
Scott Patterson
Message 43
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Falcon Insurance has been good for me for the past seven years. Well, th
ey've taken my money and fortunately, I haven't needed any of it back. T
heir prices have been lower than the other guys I checked with though an
d they have an outdoor booth at Oshkosh where you can renew each year. I
like the fact that they show at "Kosh. That's my input, for what it's w
orth.
Rex in Michigan
-- "George Wells@adelphia.net" <georgewells@adelphia.net> wrote:
Does any one have a good source for Liability insurance on a Model 5Than
========================
========================
========================
========================
========================
========================
========================
========================
=================
<html><P>Falcon Insurance has been good for me for the past seven years.
Well, they've taken my money and fortunately, I haven't needed any of i
t back. Their prices have been lower than the other guys I checked with
though and they have an outdoor booth at Oshkosh where you can renew eac
h year. I like the fact that they show at "Kosh. That's my input, for wh
at it's worth.</P>
<P>Rex in Michigan</P>
<P> </P>
<P> <BR><BR>-- "George Wells@adelphia.net" <geor
gewells@adelphia.net> wrote:<BR></P>
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.2900.2963" name=GENERATOR>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Does any one have a good source for Lia
bility insurance on a Model 5</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Thanks</FONT></DIV><PRE><B><FONT face=
"courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
========================
===========
">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List</A>
========================
===========
tronics.com</A>
========================
===========
ics.com</A>
========================
===========
www.matronics.com/contribution</A>
========================
===========
</B></FONT></PRE>
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 44
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| Subject: | FLOAT PLANE GROUP: "Easy-Lift" Amphibious Floats |
Paul S. (Great Article ) , Paul L. , Gary A. , Dave , Noel L. , Richard R.,
& All
STILL SEARCHING
A friend is installing "Easy-Lift" 1050 Amphib Floats on a Model III.
The Canadian Co went into business around 1992 and out of business
before the entire kit was Shipped.
We are looking for Rigging Info for the Fox in hopes of not having to
work through all the design trial and error.
Thanks
Barry
Message 45
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Just bought some for my Model II.
$524.00 for 1 year. AUA Greensboro N.C.
Glenn Horne Suffolk, Va 582
----- Original Message -----
From: George Wells@adelphia.net
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 2:49 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Insurance
Does any one have a good source for Liability insurance on a Model 5
Thanks
Message 46
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| Subject: | Re: FLOAT PLANE GROUP: "Easy-Lift" Amphibious Floats |
BlankMaybe this guy can help ?
Dave
1650 BILMAR EASY LIFT FLOATS . $8,500 . AVAILABLE FOR SALE . Bilmar
Easylift 1650 floats in exc cond. Christavia rigging. Floats loacted in
Hearst Ontaria . Contact Adam J. Scheck - located Whitehorse, YT Canada
. Telephone: 867-334-2393 . Posted July 10, 2006 . Show all Ads posted
by this Advertiser . Recommend This Ad to a Friend . Send a Message
----- Original Message -----
From: Barry
To: Kitfox List
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 3:37 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: FLOAT PLANE GROUP: "Easy-Lift" Amphibious Floats
Paul S. (Great Article ) , Paul L. , Gary A. , Dave , Noel L. ,
Richard R., & All
STILL SEARCHING
A friend is installing "Easy-Lift" 1050 Amphib Floats on a Model III.
The Canadian Co went into business around 1992 and out of business
before the entire kit was Shipped.
We are looking for Rigging Info for the Fox in hopes of not having to
work through all the design trial and error.
Thanks
Barry
Message 47
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
On Aug 24, 2006, at 7:03 PM, Dick D'Archangel wrote:
> The only asset I have, and this is questionable, is close to 1,000
> hours is kayaks steered with rudder peddles.
This is very interesting, Dick, and I would say: Yes, your kayak
experience probably helps you to steer a Kitfox taildragger.
I have often wonder if my lifetime sailing experience had any profit to
my newly aviation one. And I think that, yes, on several aspects.
First, there is the weather and navigation, common to both sea- and
sky-farers. Then there is the actual handling of a vehicle that doesn't
necessarily goes in the direction the nose is pointing at.
Last but not least, there is the element, air of water, that makes
steering something soft, compared to a ground vehicle.
Say, I would steer my sailboat in heavy seas, trying to make the
narrow entrance of a harbour, in a strong abeam current. I would crab,
to estimate my actual track on the ground, preventing the seas to make
me yaw by pulling the tiller before the next wave lifts my stern and
make me weather-helming. Right after, I'd push hard the tiller, this
time to prevent a yaw in the other direction.
The same feeling of "steering in something soft" is what I experience
when "dancing on the pedals" to keep my Kitfox straight in a landing.
Does this make sense to you?
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
Message 48
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With Falcon, I'm paying $969 for liability plus $30,000 value of full co
verage. I had checked with Avemco and they were much higher. Why not cal
l both and compare for what you'd like.
Rex in Michigan
-- Scott Patterson <scott@lifeseeker.com> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Scott Patterson <scott@lifeseeker.com
>
I just signed up with Avemco. 800-638-8440.
$1,000,000 liability for $572/year. Model IV.
Scott Patterson
========================
===========
========================
===========
========================
===========
========================
===========
========================
===========
<html><P>With Falcon, I'm paying $969 for liability plus $30,000 va
lue of full coverage. I had checked with Avemco and they were much highe
r. Why not call both and compare for what you'd like.</P>
<P>Rex in Michigan <BR><BR>-- Scott Patterson <sc
ott@lifeseeker.com> wrote:<BR>--> Kitfox-List messa
ge posted by: Scott Patterson <scott@lifesee
ker.com><BR><BR>I just signed up with Avemco
. 800-638-8440.<BR><BR>$1,000,000 liability for $572
========================
========================
- The Kitfox-List Email Foru
ist utilities such as the Subscriptions pa
========================
========================
sp; - NEW MATRONICS WEB 
========================
========================
- NEW MATRONICS 
========================
========================
sp; - List Contribution Web S
nbsp; &
nbsp; -Matt&n
========================
========================
==<BR></P>
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 49
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Avemco insures the Kitfox
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of George
Wells@adelphia.net
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 1:50 PM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Kitfox-List: Insurance
Does any one have a good source for Liability insurance on a Model 5
Thanks
Message 50
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerous? |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Richard Rabbers" <rira1950@yahoo.com>
Michael & Dick,
I agree that experience in many things can be applied to flying.
I'd say even dancing (as someone has hinted at) can be applied to rudder control.
A common flying concern - density altitude - became a significant factor as
a sailboat moves from the tropics to the cold northern climate...
The strength of the cold wind and resulting power of a sail is much greater than
a warm tropical breeze.
Deck adjustable (ha!) ...... sail, needs to be shortened (reefed) at a much lower
windspeed in cold air (semi-soft) than in warm (soft) air.
As you say, navigation, movement across the planet, radio skills, all apply.
Do not archive
--------
Richard in SW Michigan
Model 1 / 618 - full-lotus floats (restoration)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57072#57072
Message 51
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Dear list moderator:
Hitler also prided himself on harmony and purity of race. He achived that by
killing all those that questioned or disagreed with him.
Just so we are clear before you pull the switch, my contentions/claims are
as follows:
1. A list member reported he recieved hate mail for "pricing his kitfox too
low". I was being supportive of his right to price his plane any darn way he
wishes too. This has drawn a large amount of hate mail to me, both on the
list as well as privately.
2. That owners of kitfoxes should be held to the same norms as the rest of
society. Kitfox ownership is not a get out of jail free card.
That much being said, I decline to drink the purple koolaid. If you and the
collective list membership want to continue to live the dream, so be it. I
won't. You have your solution and that is terminating anyone who thinks
differently then the collective.
Best regards,
-John
On 8/24/06, Fox5flyer <morid@northland.lib.mi.us> wrote:
>
> Mr. Galt, with all due respect, it would appear to me that it is you who
> has the attitude and you've demonstrated it since your first post to this
> list. We pride ourselves on this List for having member harmony and we
> intend to keep it that way even if it means to occasionally do a little
> weeding. You obviously feel the need to have the last word when what you
> should be doing is providing useful and constructive input for others to
> benefit from. If you have no useful or constructive input then perhaps just
> lurk with us and when you have a meaningful question that is Kitfox related,
> don't hesitate to ask it. If you are not able to do this we have a
> solution.
> Sincerely,
> Deke Morisse and
> Don Pearsall
> List Administrators
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>
> *From:* John Galt <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
> *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 10:39 AM
> *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
>
>
> Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
>
> On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> >
> > Not even warm!
> >
> >
> >
> > Noel
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> > <owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com+>[mailto:
> > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
> > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> >
> > Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
> > market out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the
> > $14K range?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> >
> > > Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your
> > > original comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make
> > > that blind rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
> > >
> > > Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
> > >
> > > You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL
> > > Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
> > > money..... Big MONEY!
> > >
> > > Noel
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > > *Sent:* Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
> > > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> > >
> > > Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or
> > > is even that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were
> > > not reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking
> > > about. I was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for
> > > "pricing his kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or
> > > perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
> > >
> > > > John Galt,
> > >
> > > Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on
> > > this list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex
> > > trade and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only
> > > termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless
> > > you're here for the intended purpose.
> > >
> > > Rex in Michigan
> > >
> > > -- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
> > > *From:* John Galt <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
> > >
> > > I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will
> > > not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the
> > > price, not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they
> > > may be.
> > >
> > > RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
> > > I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear
> > > next. Fly alone young man.
> > >
> > > Don Smythe
> > >
> > > *
> > > tronics.comics.com
> > > *
> > >
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> >
> > *
> >
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp://wiki.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
> > *
> >
> >
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 52
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I checked Avemco today. Compared to Falcon, Avemco is a little cheaper for liability,
but almost 3 times as high for hull coverage.
eccles <eccles@Chartermi.net> wrote: Avemco insures the Kitfox
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of George Wells@adelphia.net
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 1:50 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Insurance
Does any one have a good source for Liability insurance on a Model 5
Thanks
Message 53
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Roger McConnell" <rdmac@swbell.net>
Mike,
Count me as one that lands 100% on asphalt or better still concrete.
Sense I'm still flying the 40 hours off my plane; I haven't had or made the
push to try grass yet. I have landed on grass and enjoyed it very much, just
not in the Kitfox. I will some day but sense I'm a "lazy" pilot:) I haven't
gotten around to it yet. By the way you might consider me, too safety
conscious.
Roger Mac
S7/912s (trigear)
DO NOT ARCHIVE
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxmike
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:04 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
dangerous
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
I think we need to have a poll as to how many of us actually land in a rough
off field. I don't. Currently 100% is ashphalt. Off field, or the boonees
landing is very risky and I concider most to be extrem flying. Am I the
only one that takes safety seriously and determines yes or no to a landing
site. Sure some of us are thinking, what if the engine quites. I say,
that's not a normal.
My definition of extrem is daredevil.
--------
kitfoxmike
kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
rv7 wingkit
reserved 287RV
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57025#57025
Message 54
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| Subject: | Re: Ignition switch question |
MessageGuys,
I have not followed this thread completely but if you are looking for
alternatives to panel wiring take a look at the Hot Box by Kuntzleman
Electronics, Inc.
http://www.kestrobes.com/The_HOT_BOX_brochure.html
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave G.
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 8:11 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Ignition switch question
True enough. The high current side of starter solenoid will remain
live and on the far side of the firewall. None of the other systems will
require as much amperage.
----- Original Message -----
From: Noel Loveys
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 9:39 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Ignition switch question
A simple solution is to use a heavy 60-80A switch in the
panel.....but..... then you have to bring high current through the fire
wall.
Message 55
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox in Thailand? |
Mesier Rexster:
Well, judging by the amount of personal attacks I have recieved, including
your e-mail below, it doesn't seem like a friendly place... certainly not if
you disagree with anyone or question the collective.
Still, I bet you do feel better after getting that off your chest, so we
might as well share that with everyone. Ahhhhh.... much better, aye?
On 8/24/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com> wrote:
>
> John,
>
> You're an interesting fellow. I'm curious about what your history is.
> Try to understand that I'm not getting on your case, but trying to
> understand you. It seems that all you want to do on the forum is argue and
> fight with people on what for the rest of us, is a friendly chat place. I'm
> sure that this lack of people skills transfers into the rest of your life
> and you probably have very few friends, if any. That's sad for someone to go
> through life like that. I'm surprised from the many people on the forum that
> are appalled by your comments that you continue to be nasty with almost all
> of your emails to the forum.
>
> Out of curiosity, there's a fellow from my high school graduating class
> who has completely alienated himself from the rest of the class with a
> similar attitude. Everybody shakes their heads in amazement at how nasty he
> is and why he chooses that lifestyle. It's sad to see him so miserable.
> There's no way to ask him as he's even less approachable than you are (I
> think). We feel badly for him and the lifestyle he chooses as I actually
> liked him during high school. We're all trying to figure out what makes him
> like that. The rest of us have had so much fun getting together and enjoying
> emails with each other over the years. Why would he choose to constantly be
> digging up things to argue about? You seem a bit more talkative so maybe you
> can give me some insight. Life is too short to be like that.
>
> One more question. I've noticed that both of you guys like to use long
> words that don't seem to come up in most people's conversations. I don't
> save any of the forum emails if they're not pertaining to Kitfoxes so I
> don't have examples to give you. The only one I remember (zealots)isn't that
> uncommon but you do tend to use pretty big and uncommon terms. The fellow
> from my high school class does the same thing. Any ideas here?
>
> I doubt that at this stage in your life that we'd be able to help you be
> a happier person, but my guess would be that if you talked to people on the
> forum with in a friendlier manner that you'd be more welcome. Keep in mind
> that I'm not trying to make you feel bad, I would just like to understand
> what makes you seem to enjoy haggling with people. Life can be so much more
> fun if you make friends instead.
>
> Please note that I'm sending this to you personally and not the entire
> Kitfox forum. Let's keep the personal stuff off of there. Good luck to you
> and I hope things get better for you.
>
> Rex in Michigan
>
> ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
> Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
>
> On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> >
> > Not even warm!
> >
> >
> >
> > Noel
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
> > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> >
> > Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
> > market out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the
> > $14K range?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> >
> > > Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your
> > > original comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make
> > > that blind rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
> > >
> > > Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
> > >
> > > You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL
> > > Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
> > > money..... Big MONEY!
> > >
> > > Noel
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > > *Sent:* Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
> > > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> > >
> > > Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or
> > > is even that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were
> > > not reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking
> > > about. I was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for
> > > "pricing his kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or
> > > perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
> > >
> > > > John Galt,
> > >
> > > Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on
> > > this list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex
> > > trade and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only
> > > termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless
> > > you're here for the intended purpose.
> > >
> > > Rex in Michigan
> > >
> > > -- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
> > > *From:* John Galt <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
> > >
> > > I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will
> > > not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the
> > > price, not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they
> > > may be.
> > >
> > > RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
> > > I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear
> > > next. Fly alone young man.
> > >
> > > Don Smythe
> > >
> > > *
> > > tronics.comics.com
> > > *
> > >
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> >
> > *
> >
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp://wiki.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
> > *
> >
> >
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 56
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George,
I just bound coverage on my S7 with Falcon. Avemco was $3400 for the same coverage.
I can't tell you why but they weren't even in the ballpark. Here is part
of my contract. I insured the plane for $30,000 value (I think that is a bit
under valued, but we won't go into that subject as it seems to be a hot potato!).
I have 0 time in a kitfox.
Hull Value Hull Coverage Hull Deductible Liability Medical
Breach of Warranty Loss Payee
$30,000 Full Flight $100 $500K/$100K $3,000
_____
PREMIUM
Liability = $499
Medical = $12
Hull = $985
Total Premium = $1,496
PILOT REQUIREMENTS
Pilot Name Dual Hours Required Solo Hours Required
GARY T OLSON 1 2
eccles <eccles@Chartermi.net> wrote:
Avemco insures the Kitfox
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of George Wells@adelphia.net
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 1:50 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Insurance
Does any one have a good source for Liability insurance on a Model 5
Thanks
---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail.
Message 57
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox in Thailand? |
Is this a question or a directive? See my response to your owner for the
question(s), and be sure to vote me off Kitfox island if your not happy with
the truth.
On 8/24/06, mscotter@comcast.net <mscotter@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> He probably will, but not to you. :-0
> You still have yet to answer the question that was posed to you. What
> connection do kitfoxs, or their builders, have to do with the child sex
> trade? And why the comment by youing trying to tie the two together?
>
> I think I smell a troll. What do we need to do to get this one booted?
>
>
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: "John Galt" <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
> Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
>
> On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
> > Not even warm!
> >
> >
> >
> > Noel
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
> > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> >
> >
> >
> > Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
> > market out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the
> > $14K range?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your
> > > original comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make
> > > that blind rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
> > >
> > > Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
> > >
> > > You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL
> > > Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
> > > money..... Big MONEY!
> > >
> > > Noel
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > > *Sent:* Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
> > > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or
> > > is even that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were
> > > not reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking
> > > about. I was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for
> > > "pricing his kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or
> > > perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
> > >
> > > > John Galt,
> > >
> > > Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on
> > > this list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex
> > > trade and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only
> > > termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless
> > > you're here for the intended purpose.
> > >
> > > Rex in Michigan
> > >
> > > -- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
> > > *From:* John Galt <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
> > >
> > > I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will
> > > not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the
> > > price, not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they
> > > may be.
> > >
> > > RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
> > > I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear
> > > next. Fly alone young man.
> > >
> > > Don Smythe
> > >
> > > *
> > > tronics.comics.com
> > > *
> > >
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> >
> > *
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
> > http://forums.matronics.com http://wiki.matronics.com
> > *
> >
> >
> >
>
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 58
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| Subject: | Re: FLOAT PLANE GROUP: CZECH FLOATS |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: WBL <aeromer@ix.netcom.com>
Does anyone in the FLOAT PLANE GROUP the have experience with Czech floats? I
inquired at Oshkosh without connecting with a KF owner who knew about these rugged
aluminum floats. The Czech brochure shows an N numbered KF on anphibs.
Pete
-----Original Message-----
>From: Barry <barryhuston@adelphia.net>
>Sent: Aug 24, 2006 12:37 PM
>To: Kitfox List <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>Subject: Kitfox-List: FLOAT PLANE GROUP: Czech Floats
Message 59
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Gary,
I have always had Falcon. Like you I probably underinsured a bit.
I have $20K hull with the standard $1mil liability. My total premiums
are about $1100. per year. When I got mine, they accepted 5 hours
"RIDING" in a kitfox and not being PIC. I even went back to them and
explained that I had NO training and NO PIC time in a Kitfox. They
said, the 5 hours I had looked good enough for them. I was a bit
surprised. However, since then I've heard that many pilots are getting
stuck with more requirements than they required of me. I didn't quite
understand what they wanted from you in order to insure?
Don Smythe
----- Original Message -----
From: Gary Olson
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
contract. I insured the plane for $30,000 value (I think that is a bit
under valued, but we won't go into that subject as it seems to be a hot
potato!). I have 0 time in a kitfox.
Message 60
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|
1. A list member reported he recieved hate mail for "pricing his kitfox
too low". I was being supportive of his
I wasn't going to say anymore on this matter but, the hate mail comment
was mine. If you had noticed, I put (NOT REALLY) behind the hate
comment. It was meant to be a light comment and the not really should
have explained that.
Don Smythe
Message 61
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox in Thailand? |
Pleeeease get him off the list, he is not a Kitfox builder/owner/pilot. I'm tired
of these little minded outbursts.
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "John Galt" <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
Is this a question or a directive? See my response to your owner for the question(s),
and be sure to vote me off Kitfox island if your not happy with the truth.
On 8/24/06, mscotter@comcast.net <mscotter@comcast.net> wrote:
He probably will, but not to you. :-0
You still have yet to answer the question that was posed to you. What connection
do kitfoxs, or their builders, have to do with the child sex trade? And why
the comment by youing trying to tie the two together?
I think I smell a troll. What do we need to do to get this one booted?
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "John Galt" <johngalt.0@gmail.com >
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Not even warm!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers market out there,
let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K range?
On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca > wrote:
Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your original comment
in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make that blind rage, the
words "child sex trade", would invoke!
Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL Aerocet floats
and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring money..... Big MONEY!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is even that
frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not reading the
thread, you would have figured out what I was talking about. I was objecting
to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing his kitfox too low".
If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
John Galt,
Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on this list
seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex trade and/or
religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only termoil you have
going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless you're here for
the intended purpose.
Rex in Michigan
-- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
From: John Galt
I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will not cool my
interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the price, not some over
zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they may be.
RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear next. Fly
alone young man.
Don Smythe
tronics.com
ics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
<html><body>
<DIV>Pleeeease get him off the list, he is not a Kitfox builder/owner/pilot.
I'm tired of these little minded outbursts.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px
solid">-------------- Original message -------------- <BR>From: "John Galt"
<johngalt.0@gmail.com> <BR>Is this a question or a directive? See my response
to your owner for the question(s), and be sure to vote me off Kitfox island
if your not happy with the truth.<BR><BR>
<DIV><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 8/24/06, <B class=gmail_sendername><A href="mailto:mscotter@comcast.net">mscotter@comcast.net</A></B> <<A href="mailto:mscotter@comcast.net">mscotter@comcast.net</A>> wrote:</SPAN>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>He probably will, but not to you. :-0</DIV>
<DIV>You still have yet to answer the question that was posed to you. What
connection do kitfoxs, or their builders, have to do with the child sex trade?
And why the comment by youing trying to tie the two together?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I think I smell a troll. What do we need to do to get this one booted?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px
solid"></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=q>-------------- Original message -------------- <BR>From: "John Galt" <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:johngalt.0@gmail.com" target=_blank>johngalt.0@gmail.com </A>> <BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_10d40e31805104cc_2>Guess you'll be quick to sell it with
that attitude.<BR><BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_10d40e31805104cc_4><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 8/24/06, <B class=gmail_sendername>Noel Loveys</B> <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca" target=_blank> noelloveys@yahoo.ca</A>> wrote:</SPAN> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=e id=q_10d40e31805104cc_6>
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT size=4>Not even warm!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<P align=left><SPAN lang=en-us><FONT size=4>Noel</FONT></SPAN></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000
2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma size=2></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com" target=_blank>owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com </A>[mailto:<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com" target=_blank>owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com</A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>John Galt<BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM<BR><B>To:</B> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com" target=_blank>kitfox-list@matronics.com</A><BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?<BR><BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV>Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers market
out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K range?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR> </DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 8/23/06, <B class=gmail_sendername>Noel Loveys</B> <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca" target=_blank> noelloveys@yahoo.ca </A>> wrote:</SPAN> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT size=4>Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure
out</FONT></SPAN><SPAN><FONT size=4> your original comment in relation
pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make that blind rage, the words
"child sex trade", would invoke! </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT size=4>Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.</FONT> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><FONT size=4>You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight
three blade UL Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em.....
Bring money..... Big MONEY!</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<P align=left><SPAN lang=en-us><FONT size=4>Noel</FONT></SPAN></P>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000
2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma size=2></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com" target=_blank>owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com </A>[mailto:<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com" target=_blank>owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com</A>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>John Galt<BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM<BR><B>To:</B> <A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:kitfox-list@matronics.com" target=_blank>kitfox-list@matronics.com </A><BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><B>Subject:</B> Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?<BR><BR></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV>Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is even
that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not
reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking about.
I was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing
his kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a one
way ticket to Thailand. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><BR> </DIV></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 8/23/06, <B class=gmail_sendername>Rexster</B> <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:runwayrex@juno.com" target=_blank>runwayrex@juno.com </A>> wrote: </SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid"></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV>
<P>John Galt,</P>
<P> Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on this
list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex trade
and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only termoil
you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless you're
here for the intended purpose. </P>
<P>Rex in Michigan<BR><BR>-- "Don Smythe" <<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:dosmythe@cox.net" target=_blank>dosmythe@cox.net</A>> wrote:<BR></P></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV><B>From:</B> <A title=johngalt.0@gmail.com onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="mailto:johngalt.0@gmail.com" target=_blank>John Galt</A> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT:
5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation,
so it will not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market
sets the price, not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned
they may be. </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial>RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS
EVANGELIST...</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial>I don't think I'll
respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear next. Fly alone
young man.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2><FONT face=Arial>Don Smythe</FONT></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://tronics.com/" target=_blank>tronics.com</A>
<A onclick="return top.js.OpenExtLink(window,event,this)" href="http://ics.com/" target=_blank>ics.com</A>
</FONT></B></PRE></DIV></DIV>
<DIV><PRE></PRE></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000
size=2>
</FONT></B></PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN>
<DIV><SPAN><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2>
</FONT></B></PRE></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV> </DIV><BR><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
</FONT></B></PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV><SPAN><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" size=2>
</FONT></B></PRE></SPAN></DIV>http://www.matronics.com/contribution</A> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><PRE></PRE></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><PRE><B><FONT
face="courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
</FONT></B></PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=q><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List</A></A>
http://forums.matronics.com</A></A>
http://wiki.matronics.com</A></A>
http://www.matronics.com/contribution</A></A>
</FONT></B></PRE></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV></DIV><BR><PRE><B><FONT face="courier new,courier" color=#000000 size=2>
</B></FONT></PRE>
<BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
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Message 62
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| Subject: | Ignition switch question |
Does anyone in our group have experience with the Hot Box in a kitfox?
Any negatives? Does it limit wiring alternatives that might be needed in
a kitfox?
I'm thinking about one just to simplify the wiring job.
Clem
Lawton, OK
KF IV-912
-----Original Message-----
Guys,
I have not followed this thread completely but if you are looking for
alternatives to panel wiring take a look at the Hot Box by Kuntzleman
Electronics, Inc.
http://www.kestrobes.com/The_HOT_BOX_brochure.html
Message 63
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| Subject: | Member Terminated |
Mr.. Galt,
You have been given many chances to be supportive and to contribute
positively to the Kitfox forum. We have over 400 members who can manage to
do that with no controversy. You have chosen not to do so. Instead you
answer every post with some complaint about a member, and post bizarre
messages such as about child sex in Thailand.
The last straw is this post where you publicly posted a member's private
message to you. That was a breach of confidentiality that we cannot
tolerate.
Sorry it did not work out for you, but you are gone. Do not try to
re-subscribe.
Don Pearsall
List Administrator
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 3:25 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox in Thailand?
Mesier Rexster:
Well, judging by the amount of personal attacks I have recieved, including
your e-mail below, it doesn't seem like a friendly place... certainly not if
you disagree with anyone or question the collective.
Still, I bet you do feel better after getting that off your chest, so we
might as well share that with everyone. Ahhhhh.... much better, aye?
On 8/24/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com> wrote:
John,
You're an interesting fellow. I'm curious about what your history is. Try
to understand that I'm not getting on your case, but trying to understand
you. It seems that all you want to do on the forum is argue and fight with
people on what for the rest of us, is a friendly chat place. I'm sure that
this lack of people skills transfers into the rest of your life and you
probably have very few friends, if any. That's sad for someone to go through
life like that. I'm surprised from the many people on the forum that are
appalled by your comments that you continue to be nasty with almost all of
your emails to the forum.
Out of curiosity, there's a fellow from my high school graduating class
who has completely alienated himself from the rest of the class with a
similar attitude. Everybody shakes their heads in amazement at how nasty he
is and why he chooses that lifestyle. It's sad to see him so miserable.
There's no way to ask him as he's even less approachable than you are (I
think). We feel badly for him and the lifestyle he chooses as I actually
liked him during high school. We're all trying to figure out what makes him
like that. The rest of us have had so much fun getting together and enjoying
emails with each other over the years. Why would he choose to constantly be
digging up things to argue about? You seem a bit more talkative so maybe you
can give me some insight. Life is too short to be like that.
One more question. I've noticed that both of you guys like to use long
words that don't seem to come up in most people's conversations. I don't
save any of the forum emails if they're not pertaining to Kitfoxes so I
don't have examples to give you. The only one I remember (zealots)isn't that
uncommon but you do tend to use pretty big and uncommon terms. The fellow
from my high school class does the same thing. Any ideas here?
I doubt that at this stage in your life that we'd be able to help you be a
happier person, but my guess would be that if you talked to people on the
forum with in a friendlier manner that you'd be more welcome. Keep in mind
that I'm not trying to make you feel bad, I would just like to understand
what makes you seem to enjoy haggling with people. Life can be so much more
fun if you make friends instead.
Please note that I'm sending this to you personally and not the entire
Kitfox forum. Let's keep the personal stuff off of there. Good luck to you
and I hope things get better for you.
Rex in Michigan
---------- Forwarded Message ----------
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca > wrote:
Not even warm!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers market
out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K
range?
On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca <mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
> wrote:
Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your original
comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make that blind
rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL
Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
money..... Big MONEY!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is even
that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not
reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking about. I
was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing his
kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a one
way ticket to Thailand.
On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com <mailto:runwayrex@juno.com> >
wrote:
John Galt,
Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on this
list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex trade
and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only
termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless
you're here for the intended purpose.
Rex in Michigan
-- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
From: John Galt <mailto:johngalt.0@gmail.com>
I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will not cool
my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the price, not
some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they may be.
RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear next.
Fly alone young man.
Don Smythe
tronics.com <http://tronics.com/>
ics.com <http://ics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 64
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Disapear John... be a gentleman,
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 3:14 PM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: John Galt
Dear list moderator:
Hitler also prided himself on harmony and purity of race. He achived that
by killing all those that questioned or disagreed with him.
Just so we are clear before you pull the switch, my contentions/claims are
as follows:
1. A list member reported he recieved hate mail for "pricing his kitfox
too low". I was being supportive of his right to price his plane any darn
way he wishes too. This has drawn a large amount of hate mail to me, both on
the list as well as privately.
2. That owners of kitfoxes should be held to the same norms as the rest of
society. Kitfox ownership is not a get out of jail free card.
That much being said, I decline to drink the purple koolaid. If you and
the collective list membership want to continue to live the dream, so be it.
I won't. You have your solution and that is terminating anyone who thinks
differently then the collective.
Best regards,
-John
On 8/24/06, Fox5flyer <morid@northland.lib.mi.us> wrote:
Mr. Galt, with all due respect, it would appear to me that it is you who
has the attitude and you've demonstrated it since your first post to this
list. We pride ourselves on this List for having member harmony and we
intend to keep it that way even if it means to occasionally do a little
weeding. You obviously feel the need to have the last word when what you
should be doing is providing useful and constructive input for others to
benefit from. If you have no useful or constructive input then perhaps just
lurk with us and when you have a meaningful question that is Kitfox related,
don't hesitate to ask it. If you are not able to do this we have a
solution.
Sincerely,
Deke Morisse and
Don Pearsall
List Administrators
----- Original Message -----
From: John Galt
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 10:39 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca > wrote:
Not even warm!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
market out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the
$14K range?
On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca > wrote:
Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your
original comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make
that blind rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade
UL Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
money..... Big MONEY!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy
or is even that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you
were not reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking
about. I was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for
"pricing his kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or
perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
John Galt,
Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody
on this list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with
sex trade and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the
only termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum
unless you're here for the intended purpose.
Rex in Michigan
-- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
From: John Galt
I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it
will not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the
price, not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they
may be.
RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what
I'll hear next. Fly alone young man.
Don Smythe
tronics.com
ics.com
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 65
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| Subject: | Re: Member Terminated |
Talk about a hypocrite! All the accusations you make against me, yet it is
your members who are full of hate. Shall I repost the other members message
who wished me to die because I owned a piper cherokee?
Mr. Pearsall, you are truly a sick and closed minded individial who supports
the hate of your membership towards anyone who would question the kitfox
purple koolaid.
And take your head out of your ass. It is people like yourself and some of
your list that condone the abuse of children during their sex vacations in
Thailand that sicken me. I will not keep your dirty little secret that your
list members hold.
And not resubscribe to the list? The beauty of the internet is that you can
change your e-mail address. I will now make it my mission to let all know
what a sick bunch of preverts invest this kitfox list. You truly should be
ashamed of yourself.
On 8/24/06, Don Pearsall <donpearsall@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Mr.. Galt,
> You have been given many chances to be supportive and to contribute
> positively to the Kitfox forum. We have over 400 members who can manage to
> do that with no controversy. You have chosen not to do so. Instead you
> answer every post with some complaint about a member, and post bizarre
> messages such as about child sex in Thailand.
>
> The last straw is this post where you publicly posted a member's private
> message to you. That was a breach of confidentiality that we cannot
> tolerate.
>
> Sorry it did not work out for you, but you are gone. Do not try to
> re-subscribe.
>
> Don Pearsall
> List Administrator
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 3:25 PM
> *To:* Rexster
> *Subject:* Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox in Thailand?
>
>
> Mesier Rexster:
>
> Well, judging by the amount of personal attacks I have recieved, including
> your e-mail below, it doesn't seem like a friendly place... certainly not if
> you disagree with anyone or question the collective.
>
> Still, I bet you do feel better after getting that off your chest, so we
> might as well share that with everyone. Ahhhhh.... much better, aye?
>
>
> On 8/24/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com> wrote:
> >
> > John,
> >
> > You're an interesting fellow. I'm curious about what your history is.
> > Try to understand that I'm not getting on your case, but trying to
> > understand you. It seems that all you want to do on the forum is argue and
> > fight with people on what for the rest of us, is a friendly chat place. I'm
> > sure that this lack of people skills transfers into the rest of your life
> > and you probably have very few friends, if any. That's sad for someone to go
> > through life like that. I'm surprised from the many people on the forum that
> > are appalled by your comments that you continue to be nasty with almost all
> > of your emails to the forum.
> >
> > Out of curiosity, there's a fellow from my high school graduating
> > class who has completely alienated himself from the rest of the class with
a
> > similar attitude. Everybody shakes their heads in amazement at how nasty he
> > is and why he chooses that lifestyle. It's sad to see him so miserable.
> > There's no way to ask him as he's even less approachable than you are (I
> > think). We feel badly for him and the lifestyle he chooses as I actually
> > liked him during high school. We're all trying to figure out what makes him
> > like that. The rest of us have had so much fun getting together and enjoying
> > emails with each other over the years. Why would he choose to constantly be
> > digging up things to argue about? You seem a bit more talkative so maybe you
> > can give me some insight. Life is too short to be like that.
> >
> > One more question. I've noticed that both of you guys like to use long
> > words that don't seem to come up in most people's conversations. I don't
> > save any of the forum emails if they're not pertaining to Kitfoxes so I
> > don't have examples to give you. The only one I remember (zealots)isn't that
> > uncommon but you do tend to use pretty big and uncommon terms. The fellow
> > from my high school class does the same thing. Any ideas here?
> >
> > I doubt that at this stage in your life that we'd be able to help you
> > be a happier person, but my guess would be that if you talked to people on
> > the forum with in a friendlier manner that you'd be more welcome. Keep in
> > mind that I'm not trying to make you feel bad, I would just like to
> > understand what makes you seem to enjoy haggling with people. Life can be so
> > much more fun if you make friends instead.
> >
> > Please note that I'm sending this to you personally and not the entire
> > Kitfox forum. Let's keep the personal stuff off of there. Good luck to you
> > and I hope things get better for you.
> >
> > Rex in Michigan
> >
> > ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
> > Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
> >
> > On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca > wrote:
> > >
> > > Not even warm!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Noel
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > > *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
> > > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> > >
> > > Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
> > > market out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the
> > > $14K range?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your
> > > > original comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make
> > > > that blind rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
> > > >
> > > > Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
> > > >
> > > > You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade
> > > > UL Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
> > > > money..... Big MONEY!
> > > >
> > > > Noel
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > > > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf Of *John Galt
> > > > *Sent:* Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
> > > > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
> > > >
> > > > Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or
> > > > is even that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were
> > > > not reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking
> > > > about. I was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for
> > > > "pricing his kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or
> > > > perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > John Galt,
> > > >
> > > > Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on
> > > > this list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with
sex
> > > > trade and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the
only
> > > > termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum unless
> > > > you're here for the intended purpose.
> > > >
> > > > Rex in Michigan
> > > >
> > > > -- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
> > > > *From:* John Galt <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
> > > >
> > > > I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will
> > > > not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the
> > > > price, not some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned
they
> > > > may be.
> > > >
> > > > RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
> > > > I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll
> > > > hear next. Fly alone young man.
> > > >
> > > > Don Smythe
> > > >
> > > > *
> > > > tronics.comics.com
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > >
> > *
> > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp://wiki.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
> > *
> >
> >
> *
>
> *
>
>
Message 66
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| Subject: | Kitfox in Thailand? |
I'm not interested in selling my 'Fox. But as the man says everything
is
for sale it's just a matter of the price.
My attitude is it will take a big pile of money to give me a better
plane
for my purposes than the little Fox.
Cheers!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
mscotter@comcast.net
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 1:09 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
He probably will, but not to you. :-0
You still have yet to answer the question that was posed to you. What
connection do kitfoxs, or their builders, have to do with the child sex
trade? And why the comment by youing trying to tie the two together?
I think I smell a troll. What do we need to do to get this one booted?
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "John Galt" <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
Not even warm!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
market
out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K
range?
On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < <mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
wrote:
Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your original
comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make that
blind
rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL
Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
money..... Big MONEY!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is
even
that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not
reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking
about. I
was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing
his
kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a
one
way ticket to Thailand.
On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com <mailto:runwayrex@juno.com> >
wrote:
John Galt,
Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on
this
list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex
trade
and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only
termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum
unless
you're here for the intended purpose.
Rex in Michigan
-- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
From: John Galt <mailto:johngalt.0@gmail.com>
I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will not
cool
my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the price, not
some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they may
be.
RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear
next.
Fly alone young man.
Don Smythe
tronics.com <http://tronics.com/>
ics.com <http://ics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 67
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|
| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
With a prop lost you have to be one of the luckiest guys around. I'm
curious as to the type of plane and prop that was.... I'm not looking for
brand names just general info.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave
> Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 2:55 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a
> taildragger dangerous
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
>
> I fly off grass 98% on wheels when no snow
> I fly off 98 % skis when there is no snow and sometimes on
> just grass with
> skis.( straight skis only )
> I fly off water and asphault and grass strips when on amphibs
> I have practiced forced approaches since I started flying
> over 25 years ago
> and have had 4 forced landings.
> - one engine failure - homebuilt
> -one carb came loose and engine failed homebuilt
> -one lost power on TO in 172 and deadstick back to airport
> - one prop failure ( blade departed) and landed in field
> with engine just
> barely attached.
>
> all the above -- no damage to landing gear or anything other
> that the last
> prop failure where the windshield blew out and firewall got
> partially torn
> away from engine shaking around.
>
> moral of story is practice certainly helps in realtime.
>
> same story for spins -- if you cannot demostrate and be
> proficient then just
> a course in "awareness " does not necessarily cut it. How
> many get killed
> from stall/spin accidents yearly but only instructors need to
> train for them
> ?
>
>
> Dave
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 1:03 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
> dangerous
>
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike"
> <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
> >
> > I think we need to have a poll as to how many of us
> actually land in a
> > rough off field. I don't. Currently 100% is ashphalt.
> Off field, or the
> > boonees landing is very risky and I concider most to be
> extrem flying. Am
> > I the only one that takes safety seriously and determines
> yes or no to a
> > landing site. Sure some of us are thinking, what if the
> engine quites. I
> > say, that's not a normal.
> >
> > My definition of extrem is daredevil.
> >
> > --------
> > kitfoxmike
> > kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
> > http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
> > rv7 wingkit
> > reserved 287RV
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57025#57025
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 68
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
I like floats. Now I'm out of the SPAM CAN I trained on I haven't turned a
wheel.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> kitfoxmike
> Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 3:37 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a
> taildragger dangerous
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
>
> Now don't anybody get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with
> landing off field. It's when you take it to the next level
> and land where no airplane should land type of thing. I
> remember when I snomobiled and the people I went with
> gradually got into extrem I mean extrem sleading. I think
> the billy goats would shake from some of the crap these guys
> did. I mean, going up mountain sides almost straight up, and
> then go back the way they came in but not just easing it back
> down, I mean running wide open and jumping over the edge,
> these guys also caused avalanches and they rode the fricken
> avalanches. This is when I quit snomobiling.
>
> I want flying to be fun, I fly 200 hrs a year, and try and do
> different things to make it fun. But to land into one way
> strips and land on sand bars and into a strip that even my
> truck wouldn't be able to handle. Well, do I need to say any more.
>
> I would like to know how many people really do this kind of
> flying on this list.
>
> --------
> kitfoxmike
> kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
> http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
> rv7 wingkit
> reserved 287RV
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57039#57039
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 69
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|
Don,
It would appear to me that I am on my own for the first couple of hours. Your
right, it doesn't make much sense to me either.
Don Smythe <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
Gary,
I have always had Falcon. Like you I probably underinsured a bit. I have
$20K hull with the standard $1mil liability. My total premiums are about $1100.
per year. When I got mine, they accepted 5 hours "RIDING" in a kitfox and
not being PIC. I even went back to them and explained that I had NO training
and NO PIC time in a Kitfox. They said, the 5 hours I had looked good enough
for them. I was a bit surprised. However, since then I've heard that many
pilots are getting stuck with more requirements than they required of me. I didn't
quite understand what they wanted from you in order to insure?
Don Smythe
----- Original Message -----
From: Gary Olson
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
contract. I insured the plane for $30,000 value (I think that is a bit under
valued, but we won't go into that subject as it seems to be a hot potato!). I
have 0 time in a kitfox.
---------------------------------
Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out.
Message 70
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| Subject: | Re: Member Terminated |
Wow ! And I thought I could blow things out of proportion!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 9:16 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Member Terminated
Talk about a hypocrite! All the accusations you make against me, yet it
is
your members who are full of hate. Shall I repost the other members
message
who wished me to die because I owned a piper cherokee?
Mr. Pearsall, you are truly a sick and closed minded individial who
supports
the hate of your membership towards anyone who would question the kitfox
purple koolaid.
And take your head out of your ass. It is people like yourself and some
of
your list that condone the abuse of children during their sex vacations
in
Thailand that sicken me. I will not keep your dirty little secret that
your
list members hold.
And not resubscribe to the list? The beauty of the internet is that you
can
change your e-mail address. I will now make it my mission to let all
know
what a sick bunch of preverts invest this kitfox list. You truly should
be
ashamed of yourself.
On 8/24/06, Don Pearsall <donpearsall@comcast.net> wrote:
Mr.. Galt,
You have been given many chances to be supportive and to contribute
positively to the Kitfox forum. We have over 400 members who can manage
to
do that with no controversy. You have chosen not to do so. Instead you
answer every post with some complaint about a member, and post bizarre
messages such as about child sex in Thailand.
The last straw is this post where you publicly posted a member's private
message to you. That was a breach of confidentiality that we cannot
tolerate.
Sorry it did not work out for you, but you are gone. Do not try to
re-subscribe.
Don Pearsall
List Administrator
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 3:25 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox in Thailand?
Mesier Rexster:
Well, judging by the amount of personal attacks I have recieved,
including
your e-mail below, it doesn't seem like a friendly place... certainly
not if
you disagree with anyone or question the collective.
Still, I bet you do feel better after getting that off your chest, so we
might as well share that with everyone. Ahhhhh.... much better, aye?
On 8/24/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com> wrote:
John,
You're an interesting fellow. I'm curious about what your history is.
Try
to understand that I'm not getting on your case, but trying to
understand
you. It seems that all you want to do on the forum is argue and fight
with
people on what for the rest of us, is a friendly chat place. I'm sure
that
this lack of people skills transfers into the rest of your life and you
probably have very few friends, if any. That's sad for someone to go
through
life like that. I'm surprised from the many people on the forum that are
appalled by your comments that you continue to be nasty with almost all
of
your emails to the forum.
Out of curiosity, there's a fellow from my high school graduating
class
who has completely alienated himself from the rest of the class with a
similar attitude. Everybody shakes their heads in amazement at how nasty
he
is and why he chooses that lifestyle. It's sad to see him so miserable.
There's no way to ask him as he's even less approachable than you are (I
think). We feel badly for him and the lifestyle he chooses as I actually
liked him during high school. We're all trying to figure out what makes
him
like that. The rest of us have had so much fun getting together and
enjoying
emails with each other over the years. Why would he choose to constantly
be
digging up things to argue about? You seem a bit more talkative so maybe
you
can give me some insight. Life is too short to be like that.
One more question. I've noticed that both of you guys like to use long
words that don't seem to come up in most people's conversations. I don't
save any of the forum emails if they're not pertaining to Kitfoxes so I
don't have examples to give you. The only one I remember (zealots)isn't
that
uncommon but you do tend to use pretty big and uncommon terms. The
fellow
from my high school class does the same thing. Any ideas here?
I doubt that at this stage in your life that we'd be able to help you
be a
happier person, but my guess would be that if you talked to people on
the
forum with in a friendlier manner that you'd be more welcome. Keep in
mind
that I'm not trying to make you feel bad, I would just like to
understand
what makes you seem to enjoy haggling with people. Life can be so much
more
fun if you make friends instead.
Please note that I'm sending this to you personally and not the entire
Kitfox forum. Let's keep the personal stuff off of there. Good luck to
you
and I hope things get better for you.
Rex in Michigan
---------- Forwarded Message ----------
Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that attitude.
On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca > wrote:
Not even warm!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Yeap, the other poster did not like my comment that it is a buyers
market
out there, let alone for experimentals. Big money? You mean in the $14K
range?
On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca
<mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
> wrote:
Consider that some people, I'm one, who didn't figure out your original
comment in relation pricing a plane. Consider also the ire, make that
blind
rage, the words "child sex trade", would invoke!
Maybe it's time to close the book on this one.
You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo in flight three blade UL
Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels if you want 'em..... Bring
money..... Big MONEY!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
<mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Galt
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in Thailand?
Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I look for Kitfoxes to buy or is
even
that frowned upon by the list crumogeons on here? Too bad you were not
reading the thread, you would have figured out what I was talking
about. I
was objecting to the list zealots attacking a man (not me) for "pricing
his
kitfox too low". If anyone needs counseling, it is them. Or perhaps a
one
way ticket to Thailand.
On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com <mailto:runwayrex@juno.com> >
wrote:
John Galt,
Have you checked into some good counseling in your area? Nobody on
this
list seems to have a clue how you have connected Kifox flyers with sex
trade
and/or religious zealots. I would guess that this issue isn't the only
termoil you have going on in your head. Please stay off of this forum
unless
you're here for the intended purpose.
Rex in Michigan
-- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
From: John Galt <mailto:johngalt.0@gmail.com>
I realize these religious zealots exist in any vocation, so it will not
cool
my interest in kitfoxes. My sole point is the market sets the price, not
some over zealous evangelist, no matter how well intentioned they may
be.
RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS EVANGELIST...
I don't think I'll respond anymore to this. No telling what I'll hear
next.
Fly alone young man.
Don Smythe
tronics.com <http://tronics.com/>
ics.com <http://ics.com/>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://wiki.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 71
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| Subject: | The Thailand connection |
Holey polyfiber, Batman.Are you kidding me? The past few days I have skipped
the Thai posts as I know little to nothing about it. Then tonight I read the
post header "john galt"and the related previous posts.wow.Does this guy
seriously equate doing any sort of business in Thailand with supporting child
sex
slavery? I feel bad for the original poster inquiring about kitfoxes in
Thailand. I would definitely be pissed if it were me. As for John Galt;if you
were looking for an opportunity to contribute something, you definitely have the
wrong list. I hope the list admin. takes swift and appropriate action. I'm an
avid thread reader and seldom have anything to say, (mostly because you guys
know a helluva lot more about my 'fox than me: )
but I felt moved to say something.Thats my 2 cents. There, I feel better.
Thanks.
Greg G.
mod II 582
Do not archive
Message 72
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| Subject: | Re: Ignition switch question |
MessageThe only thing I can think of is that it being a solid state
unit, if you lose the box you lose whatever it's controlling.
Deke
----- Original Message -----
From: clemwehner
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 7:22 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Ignition switch question
Does anyone in our group have experience with the Hot Box in a kitfox?
Any negatives? Does it limit wiring alternatives that might be needed in
a kitfox?
I'm thinking about one just to simplify the wiring job.
Clem
Lawton, OK
KF IV-912
-----Original Message-----
Guys,
I have not followed this thread completely but if you are looking
for alternatives to panel wiring take a look at the Hot Box by
Kuntzleman Electronics, Inc.
http://www.kestrobes.com/The_HOT_BOX_brochure.html
Message 73
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| Subject: | literary references |
List:
John Galt is the protagonist in Ayn Rand's novel "Atlas Shrugged." In the novel
Rand describes a declining world where the true virtues of men- rationality,
productivity, and pride- are denounced as impractical evils. Once overflowing
with living energy, New York Citys streets are now grey and dismal. John Galt,
the man who has uncompromisingly preserved his virtues, sees the state of mankind
and refuses to accept it. He will not wait hopelessly for the fulfillment
of empty promises of a better future preached by the mystics and the humanists;
he will not stand by and watch a mindless collective destroy the men he respects.
John Galt acts. Unlike the biblical Creator, he does not actively wipe
out the human race; instead, he cleanses the world by removing its prime movers,
knowing that the corrupt, those who live as parasites off of the productive
man, will not survive without their hosts.
P.S. The above is from an essay by a college student, that took 1st place in
a contest sponsored by the Ayn Rand Institute. I thought the name was familiar
but I read the book 30 years ago and couldn't quite place it. Interesting, eh?
do not archive
Marco Menezes
Model 2 582 N99KX
---------------------------------
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail.
Message 74
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "john perry" <eskflyer@lvcisp.com>
If I see a creek bed or river bar or field strip big enough to get in and
out then i try it . That is what these planes are for short field and fun .
when you start talking safety try driving down the freeway and see how safe
you are . use good judgement and if you are secure in your abilities to get
into and out of short rough fields then by all meens DONT TRY IT . But if
you want to experience what the plane can really do then try it , you will
love it .
John flying safe flying low flying slow .
Kitfox 2 N718PD
582
gsc/ivo inflight
soon to be on floats
----- Original Message -----
From: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:03 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
dangerous
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
>
> I think we need to have a poll as to how many of us actually land in a
> rough off field. I don't. Currently 100% is ashphalt. Off field, or the
> boonees landing is very risky and I concider most to be extrem flying. Am
> I the only one that takes safety seriously and determines yes or no to a
> landing site. Sure some of us are thinking, what if the engine quites. I
> say, that's not a normal.
>
> My definition of extrem is daredevil.
>
> --------
> kitfoxmike
> kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
> http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
> rv7 wingkit
> reserved 287RV
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57025#57025
>
>
>
Message 75
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "john perry" <eskflyer@lvcisp.com>
Its called flying in ALASKA if you want to go anywhere there and fish and
hunt and have fun for the weekend . Yes there are so called civilized
airstrips but to land on the beach or river bar and fish for several hours
and enjoy the sights AHHHHHHHHHH that is the life i miss most now that i am
in so called civilized America .
John
Kitfox 2
N718PD
----- Original Message -----
From: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 1:07 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
dangerous
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
>
> Now don't anybody get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with landing off
> field. It's when you take it to the next level and land where no airplane
> should land type of thing. I remember when I snomobiled and the people I
> went with gradually got into extrem I mean extrem sleading. I think the
> billy goats would shake from some of the crap these guys did. I mean,
> going up mountain sides almost straight up, and then go back the way they
> came in but not just easing it back down, I mean running wide open and
> jumping over the edge, these guys also caused avalanches and they rode the
> fricken avalanches. This is when I quit snomobiling.
>
> I want flying to be fun, I fly 200 hrs a year, and try and do different
> things to make it fun. But to land into one way strips and land on sand
> bars and into a strip that even my truck wouldn't be able to handle. Well,
> do I need to say any more.
>
> I would like to know how many people really do this kind of flying on this
> list.
>
> --------
> kitfoxmike
> kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
> http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
> rv7 wingkit
> reserved 287RV
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57039#57039
>
>
>
Message 76
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I just got ins from the EAA ( I believe they use Falcon ) for my Classic VI
about 2 months ago. My test pilot had 1200 pic and 600 tail wheel. They
required 0 time in type for him. I have 250 pic (legal , flying with my dad
for 2 million hours doesn't count ) with 6 tail wheel. They required me
to have 10 with an instructor in type and 10 solo in type. However I did
have coverage while I did these ( instructor time first ). The only bad
thing is that they would not cover my Stepfather and co-builder for sport
pilot training.
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Gary Olson
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 7:26 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Insurance
Don,
It would appear to me that I am on my own for the first couple of hours.
Your right, it doesn't make much sense to me either.
Don Smythe <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
Gary,
I have always had Falcon. Like you I probably underinsured a bit. I
have $20K hull with the standard $1mil liability. My total premiums are
about $1100. per year. When I got mine, they accepted 5 hours "RIDING" in a
kitfox and not being PIC. I even went back to them and explained that I had
NO training and NO PIC time in a Kitfox. They said, the 5 hours I had
looked good enough for them. I was a bit surprised. However, since then
I've heard that many pilots are getting stuck with more requirements than
they required of me. I didn't quite understand what they wanted from you in
order to insure?
Don Smythe
----- Original Message -----
From: Gary Olson <mailto:ofd725@yahoo.com>
contract. I insured the plane for $30,000 value (I think that is a bit under
valued, but we won't go into that subject as it seems to be a hot potato!).
I have
_____
Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it
<http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=42974/*http:/www.yahoo.com/preview> out.
Message 77
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox Pilot/Builder Age?? (you can lie if you want |
;-)
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Floran Higgins" <cliffh@outdrs.net>
I am 73, Be 74 in Nov.
Floran H.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lyle Persels" <lpers@mchsi.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 6:51 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox Pilot/Builder Age?? (you can lie if you
want ;-)
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lyle Persels <lpers@mchsi.com>
>
> I'm 73, soon to be 74. I think I have the record so far. Any of you
> younger dudes want to trade with me?
>
> Lyle
>
> On 08 22, 06, at 7:15 AM, Algate wrote:
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Algate" <algate@attglobal.net>
>>
>> Gary Algate
>> 50yrs
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 78
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| Subject: | Re: FLOAT PLANE GROUP: CZECH FLOATS |
the check floats are the old zenair beefed up they where available as a kit
at one time I am building a set now Murphy in Canada still makes a set as a
kit about $6,000
mal modil 2 582
Message 79
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kirkhull" <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
I have not landed the fox on grass yet but will as soon as the 40 are done.
Short strips are no place for test flights but I don't thank that a grass
strip is unsafe and would almost argue the other way. I'm pretty sure that
everyone on the list would consider me safety consensus as I am a former
Safety analyst for a major airline, And now in the insurance world
--Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger McConnell
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 5:21 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
dangerous
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Roger McConnell" <rdmac@swbell.net>
Mike,
Count me as one that lands 100% on asphalt or better still concrete.
Sense I'm still flying the 40 hours off my plane; I haven't had or made the
push to try grass yet. I have landed on grass and enjoyed it very much, just
not in the Kitfox. I will some day but sense I'm a "lazy" pilot:) I haven't
gotten around to it yet. By the way you might consider me, too safety
conscious.
Roger Mac
S7/912s (trigear)
DO NOT ARCHIVE
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxmike
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:04 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
dangerous
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" <kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
I think we need to have a poll as to how many of us actually land in a rough
off field. I don't. Currently 100% is ashphalt. Off field, or the boonees
landing is very risky and I concider most to be extrem flying. Am I the
only one that takes safety seriously and determines yes or no to a landing
site. Sure some of us are thinking, what if the engine quites. I say,
that's not a normal.
My definition of extrem is daredevil.
--------
kitfoxmike
kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
rv7 wingkit
reserved 287RV
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=57025#57025
Message 80
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| Subject: | Re: Member Terminated |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jose M. Toro" <jose_m_toro@yahoo.com>
Don:
Thanks for your decision!!! If this person is really
a pilot, and his flying judgements are similar to his
postings, then the sky is not anymore as safe as it
used to be. Any relation with the 911 pilots???
Jose
--- John Galt <johngalt.0@gmail.com> wrote:
> Talk about a hypocrite! All the accusations you make
> against me, yet it is
> your members who are full of hate. Shall I repost
> the other members message
> who wished me to die because I owned a piper
> cherokee?
>
> Mr. Pearsall, you are truly a sick and closed minded
> individial who supports
> the hate of your membership towards anyone who would
> question the kitfox
> purple koolaid.
>
> And take your head out of your ass. It is people
> like yourself and some of
> your list that condone the abuse of children during
> their sex vacations in
> Thailand that sicken me. I will not keep your dirty
> little secret that your
> list members hold.
>
> And not resubscribe to the list? The beauty of the
> internet is that you can
> change your e-mail address. I will now make it my
> mission to let all know
> what a sick bunch of preverts invest this kitfox
> list. You truly should be
> ashamed of yourself.
>
>
>
> On 8/24/06, Don Pearsall <donpearsall@comcast.net>
> wrote:
> >
> > Mr.. Galt,
> > You have been given many chances to be supportive
> and to contribute
> > positively to the Kitfox forum. We have over 400
> members who can manage to
> > do that with no controversy. You have chosen not
> to do so. Instead you
> > answer every post with some complaint about a
> member, and post bizarre
> > messages such as about child sex in Thailand.
> >
> > The last straw is this post where you publicly
> posted a member's private
> > message to you. That was a breach of
> confidentiality that we cannot
> > tolerate.
> >
> > Sorry it did not work out for you, but you are
> gone. Do not try to
> > re-subscribe.
> >
> > Don Pearsall
> > List Administrator
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:
> > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On Behalf
> Of *John Galt
> > *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 3:25 PM
> > *To:* Rexster
> > *Subject:* Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox in Thailand?
> >
> >
> > Mesier Rexster:
> >
> > Well, judging by the amount of personal attacks I
> have recieved, including
> > your e-mail below, it doesn't seem like a friendly
> place... certainly not if
> > you disagree with anyone or question the
> collective.
> >
> > Still, I bet you do feel better after getting that
> off your chest, so we
> > might as well share that with everyone. Ahhhhh....
> much better, aye?
> >
> >
> > On 8/24/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > John,
> > >
> > > You're an interesting fellow. I'm curious
> about what your history is.
> > > Try to understand that I'm not getting on your
> case, but trying to
> > > understand you. It seems that all you want to do
> on the forum is argue and
> > > fight with people on what for the rest of us, is
> a friendly chat place. I'm
> > > sure that this lack of people skills transfers
> into the rest of your life
> > > and you probably have very few friends, if any.
> That's sad for someone to go
> > > through life like that. I'm surprised from the
> many people on the forum that
> > > are appalled by your comments that you continue
> to be nasty with almost all
> > > of your emails to the forum.
> > >
> > > Out of curiosity, there's a fellow from my
> high school graduating
> > > class who has completely alienated himself from
> the rest of the class with a
> > > similar attitude. Everybody shakes their heads
> in amazement at how nasty he
> > > is and why he chooses that lifestyle. It's sad
> to see him so miserable.
> > > There's no way to ask him as he's even less
> approachable than you are (I
> > > think). We feel badly for him and the lifestyle
> he chooses as I actually
> > > liked him during high school. We're all trying
> to figure out what makes him
> > > like that. The rest of us have had so much fun
> getting together and enjoying
> > > emails with each other over the years. Why would
> he choose to constantly be
> > > digging up things to argue about? You seem a bit
> more talkative so maybe you
> > > can give me some insight. Life is too short to
> be like that.
> > >
> > > One more question. I've noticed that both of
> you guys like to use long
> > > words that don't seem to come up in most
> people's conversations. I don't
> > > save any of the forum emails if they're not
> pertaining to Kitfoxes so I
> > > don't have examples to give you. The only one I
> remember (zealots)isn't that
> > > uncommon but you do tend to use pretty big and
> uncommon terms. The fellow
> > > from my high school class does the same thing.
> Any ideas here?
> > >
> > > I doubt that at this stage in your life that
> we'd be able to help you
> > > be a happier person, but my guess would be that
> if you talked to people on
> > > the forum with in a friendlier manner that you'd
> be more welcome. Keep in
> > > mind that I'm not trying to make you feel bad, I
> would just like to
> > > understand what makes you seem to enjoy haggling
> with people. Life can be so
> > > much more fun if you make friends instead.
> > >
> > > Please note that I'm sending this to you
> personally and not the entire
> > > Kitfox forum. Let's keep the personal stuff off
> of there. Good luck to you
> > > and I hope things get better for you.
> > >
> > > Rex in Michigan
> > >
> > > ---------- Forwarded Message ----------
> > > Guess you'll be quick to sell it with that
> attitude.
> > >
> > > On 8/24/06, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca >
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Not even warm!
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Noel
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > *From:* owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:
> > > > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On
> Behalf Of *John Galt
> > > > *Sent:* Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:35 AM
> > > > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in
> Thailand?
> > > >
> > > > Yeap, the other poster did not like my
> comment that it is a buyers
> > > > market out there, let alone for experimentals.
> Big money? You mean in the
> > > > $14K range?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 8/23/06, Noel Loveys < noelloveys@yahoo.ca
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Consider that some people, I'm one, who
> didn't figure out your
> > > > > original comment in relation pricing a
> plane. Consider also the ire, make
> > > > > that blind rage, the words "child sex
> trade", would invoke!
> > > > >
> > > > > Maybe it's time to close the book on this
> one.
> > > > >
> > > > > You can buy my model III-A 582"B" box w/ Ivo
> in flight three blade
> > > > > UL Aerocet floats and straight skis wheels
> if you want 'em..... Bring
> > > > > money..... Big MONEY!
> > > > >
> > > > > Noel
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > *From:*
> owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:
> > > > > owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] *On
> Behalf Of *John Galt
> > > > > *Sent:* Wednesday, August 23, 2006 10:16 PM
> > > > > *To:* kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > > > > *Subject:* Re: Kitfox-List: Kitfox in
> Thailand?
> > > > >
> > > > > Gosh Rex, is it permissable to you if I
> look for Kitfoxes to buy or
> > > > > is even that frowned upon by the list
> crumogeons on here? Too bad you were
> > > > > not reading the thread, you would have
> figured out what I was talking
> > > > > about. I was objecting to the list zealots
> attacking a man (not me) for
> > > > > "pricing his kitfox too low". If anyone
> needs counseling, it is them. Or
> > > > > perhaps a one way ticket to Thailand.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 8/23/06, Rexster <runwayrex@juno.com >
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > John Galt,
> > > > >
> > > > > Have you checked into some good counseling
> in your area? Nobody on
> > > > > this list seems to have a clue how you have
> connected Kifox flyers with sex
> > > > > trade and/or religious zealots. I would
> guess that this issue isn't the only
> > > > > termoil you have going on in your head.
> Please stay off of this forum unless
> > > > > you're here for the intended purpose.
> > > > >
> > > > > Rex in Michigan
> > > > >
> > > > > -- "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net> wrote:
> > > > > *From:* John Galt <johngalt.0@gmail.com>
> > > > >
> > > > > I realize these religious zealots exist in
> any vocation, so it will
> > > > > not cool my interest in kitfoxes. My sole
> point is the market sets the
> > > > > price, not some over zealous evangelist, no
> matter how well intentioned they
> > > > > may be.
> > > > >
> > > > > RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS...........ZEALOUS
> EVANGELIST...
> > > > > I don't think I'll respond anymore to this.
> No telling what I'll
> > > > > hear next. Fly alone young man.
> > > > >
> > > > > Don Smythe
> > > > >
> > > > > *
> > > > > tronics.comics.com
> > > > > *
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > *
> > > > >
> > > > > *
> > > > >
> > > > > *
> > > >
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > > *
> > > >
> > > >
> > > *
> > >
>
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-Listhttp://forums.matronics.comhttp://wiki.matronics.comhttp://www.matronics.com/contribution
> > > *
> > >
> > >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> >
>
__________________________________________________
Message 81
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| Subject: | Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger dangerous |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
I flew the last 16 hours of the 40 off flying from my home strip. By then I felt
confident in the engine and felt safer on my grass strip than
landing on pavement.
As far as poll of grass landings versus pavement, since I got the plane home I
land on grass more than 90% of the time. Even lots of my
destinations are grass.
Randy
On Thu, 24 Aug 2006 21:13 , kirkhull <kirkhull@sbcglobal.net> sent:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kirkhull" kirkhull@sbcglobal.net>
>
>I have not landed the fox on grass yet but will as soon as the 40 are done.
>Short strips are no place for test flights but I don't thank that a grass
>strip is unsafe and would almost argue the other way. I'm pretty sure that
>everyone on the list would consider me safety consensus as I am a former
>Safety analyst for a major airline, And now in the insurance world
>
>
>--Original Message-----
>From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>[owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com','','','')">owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]
On Behalf Of Roger McConnell
>Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 5:21 PM
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
>dangerous
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Roger McConnell" rdmac@swbell.net>
>
>Mike,
> Count me as one that lands 100% on asphalt or better still concrete.
>Sense I'm still flying the 40 hours off my plane; I haven't had or made the
>push to try grass yet. I have landed on grass and enjoyed it very much, just
>not in the Kitfox. I will some day but sense I'm a "lazy" pilot:) I haven't
>gotten around to it yet. By the way you might consider me, too safety
>conscious.
>
> Roger Mac
> S7/912s (trigear)
>DO NOT ARCHIVE
>-----Original Message-----
>From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>[owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com','','','')">owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]
On Behalf Of kitfoxmike
>Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2006 12:04 PM
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Is a taildragger dangerousIs a taildragger
>dangerous
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "kitfoxmike" kitfoxmike@yahoo.com>
>
>I think we need to have a poll as to how many of us actually land in a rough
>off field. I don't. Currently 100% is ashphalt. Off field, or the boonees
>landing is very risky and I concider most to be extrem flying. Am I the
>only one that takes safety seriously and determines yes or no to a landing
>site. Sure some of us are thinking, what if the engine quites. I say,
>that's not a normal.
>
>My definition of extrem is daredevil.
>
>--------
>kitfoxmike
>kitfox4 1200 912ul speedster
>http://www.frappr.com/kitfoxmike
>rv7 wingkit
>reserved 287RV
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php\?p=57025#57025
>
>
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