Today's Message Index:
----------------------
0. 03:37 AM - Warp Drive mounting (Dave G.)
2. 04:01 AM - Re: Re: maximum width dimention (EWadsworth@aol.com)
3. 04:31 AM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (dave)
4. 05:24 AM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (Ceashman@aol.com)
5. 06:00 AM - Re: Engine Heater (Tom Jones)
6. 07:12 AM - Re: Re: Engine Heater (Fox5flyer)
7. 07:39 AM - Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (84KF)
8. 07:55 AM - Re: Engine Heater (Stan Bearup)
9. 08:33 AM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (john perry)
10. 08:40 AM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (Fox5flyer)
11. 08:45 AM - Re: Re: Engine Heater (Lowell Fitt)
12. 08:46 AM - Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (84KF)
13. 09:12 AM - Re: Re: Ethanol (Noel Loveys)
14. 09:29 AM - Re: Engine Heater (Lynn Matteson)
15. 09:29 AM - (Clint Bazzill)
16. 09:42 AM - revisit alodine subject (Dave G.)
17. 09:43 AM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (Lynn Matteson)
18. 09:52 AM - Alcolhol a must read (SAIB) (Clint Bazzill)
19. 10:03 AM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (dave)
20. 10:18 AM - ALCOHOL and Aircraft A MUST READ (Clint Bazzill)
21. 10:58 AM - Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page (Michael Gibbs)
22. 11:00 AM - Re: revisit alodine subject (James Shumaker)
23. 11:12 AM - Re: Engine Heater (Lowell Fitt)
24. 12:13 PM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (Lowell Fitt)
25. 12:29 PM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (John Anderson)
26. 12:32 PM - If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . (Ben-PA)
27. 12:39 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (John Anderson)
28. 12:44 PM - [O.T.]Hams are also model builders. WAS: radio problem (Michel Verheughe)
29. 01:03 PM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (Jimmie Blackwell)
30. 01:04 PM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (Dave G.)
31. 01:26 PM - Re: Reshrinking fabric (Dave and Diane)
32. 01:42 PM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (Don Smythe)
33. 02:07 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (Dave G.)
34. 02:21 PM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (Dave G.)
35. 02:22 PM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (Dave G.)
36. 02:26 PM - Re: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! (Dan Billingsley)
37. 02:31 PM - Re: radio problem (GypsyBeeInnkeepers)
38. 02:42 PM - Re: If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . (Guy Buchanan)
39. 02:42 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (Guy Buchanan)
40. 02:42 PM - Re: Still Learning (Guy Buchanan)
41. 02:42 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (John Anderson)
42. 02:44 PM - Re: John Anderson / EAA Sport Aviation Completions (Jim Crowder)
43. 02:47 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (Guy Buchanan)
44. 03:00 PM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (dave)
45. 03:01 PM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (dave)
46. 03:18 PM - Re: If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . (84KF)
47. 03:25 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (Jerry Liles)
48. 03:30 PM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (Don Smythe)
49. 03:37 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (Dave and Diane)
50. 03:40 PM - Re: Engine Heater (Fox5flyer)
51. 03:42 PM - Re: Re: Engine Heater (Fox5flyer)
52. 03:45 PM - Re: Reshrinking fabric (ron schick)
53. 03:57 PM - Re: Engine Heater (Fox5flyer)
54. 04:02 PM - Re: John Anderson / EAA Sport Aviation Completions (John Anderson)
55. 04:49 PM - Re: Engine Heater (Stan Bearup)
56. 04:57 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (Dave G.)
57. 05:00 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (Dave G.)
58. 05:17 PM - Re: Engine Heater (Fox5flyer)
59. 05:40 PM - Re: Reshrinking fabric (Tom Jones)
60. 06:26 PM - Re: Warp Drive mounting (Lowell Fitt)
61. 07:08 PM - Re: Re: If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . (Guy Buchanan)
62. 07:09 PM - Re: revisit alodine subject (Jim Crowder)
63. 07:58 PM - Re: If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . (84KF)
64. 09:00 PM - Re: Re: Reshrinking fabric (ron schick)
65. 09:15 PM - Re: radio problem (kurt schrader)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Warp Drive mounting |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
> >
> > Dave.
> >
> > The mounting plate goes on outside of hub.
> >
There have been a couple of replies stating this and I'm confused. I have a
spinner mounting plate that is about 1/8" thick and 7" diameter. It was
originally used with a GSC prop that now hangs in the basement. The spinner
attaches with 9 machine screws around it's base. I must mount this between
the Warp HPL hub and the mounting flange. After the hub I have the choice of
using just washers under the heads of the 8mm bolts or another flange like
plate (which has suddenly gone AWOL). Any locknuts or other fastening helper
must go in the space between the C-box and the mounting flange. My immediate
though is to use cross-drilled bolts with washers under the heads and
nothing behind the flange, wire secured. However I am a complete neophyte in
aviation matters and I am willing to be educated.
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: maximum width dimention |
Hi Ron, It is 7'10" when folded.
Ed
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Warp Drive mounting |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
Dave ,
I mount the HPL hub right on to the gearbox hub.
If I had a spinner --it would go HUB - spinner backing plate - HPL
hub - 1/8 inch plate - then 8mm bolts with washers under the head . Your
Hub should be threaded for the 8mm bolts.
You can use a nyloc an nut on back side of hub to secure them or metal
lock nuts if you have.
I would not use safety wire until you have tweaked your prop to where you
want it .
Also no need for locktite either but some will still use it. If you feel
like lockwire just drill the heads and install it . But when you install
your spinner you might want to use locktight on screws.
Hope this helps you and I would call Warp to verify all this rambling
:)
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 6:36 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
>
>> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
>> >
>> > Dave.
>> >
>> > The mounting plate goes on outside of hub.
>> >
>
> There have been a couple of replies stating this and I'm confused. I have
> a spinner mounting plate that is about 1/8" thick and 7" diameter. It was
> originally used with a GSC prop that now hangs in the basement. The
> spinner attaches with 9 machine screws around it's base. I must mount this
> between the Warp HPL hub and the mounting flange. After the hub I have the
> choice of using just washers under the heads of the 8mm bolts or another
> flange like plate (which has suddenly gone AWOL). Any locknuts or other
> fastening helper must go in the space between the C-box and the mounting
> flange. My immediate though is to use cross-drilled bolts with washers
> under the heads and nothing behind the flange, wire secured. However I am
> a complete neophyte in aviation matters and I am willing to be educated.
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave"
Kind of sick of this of this topic. (thank you-thank you Dave!!!)
Bottom line----
If you not happy with LSA then go for it .
If not --well stay N numbered
All I see is LSA is a way to guys who lost aviation medical to fly with a
limit of 1320 lbs on wheels. But i stand to be corrected.
early message posted by me:
Question from Steve/ Can anyone tell me where to find the FAR that says as a
PVT Pilot I CANNOT fly my Kitfox V under the new Sport Pilot rules.
Hi Steve.
This is a heavy question, why don't you ask someone from the EAA. you would
probably get the close to perfect answer.
It seem that if you ask 5 pilots what the rule is you get 6 different
answers...
You are asking pilots and not someone close to the rule making!
Today's posting
If someone from the EAA office is listening in, please contact Steve and
explain the real Sport Pilot Rule.
Does someone from the list know who the gent is at EAA, that we can identify
him and put him in contact with Steve.
I think this would be far more beneficial than going around the list for
weeks on end.
Steve.
Don't' interoperate my posting incorrectly (don't get me wrong).
A very good question, but am not learning much. Getting many interpretations,
but alas' slowly getting confused and bewildered!
I think you could contact EAA, Sport Pilot/Light-Sport Aircraft Hotline
877/FLY1232 (www.SportPilot.org or SportPilot@EAA.org )
Why not try these people for their best interpretation of the rules. I
understand the EAA assisted with the making of them, so they should know best.
Again, best of luck with your search for the truth.
Eric. Classic IV, Atlanta.
Do Not Archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
Deke, I have been thinking that one of those "Tent Heaters" would work as an engine preheater. You an see an example at http://www.outdoorsportz.com/OGTHOOOO1001.html
If you "Do the Google" you will find many examples"
Tom Jones
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72366#72366
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@i-star.com>
Thanks Tom. I like the option. Keep the ideas coming folks!
Deke
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 8:59 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Engine Heater
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
>
> Deke, I have been thinking that one of those "Tent Heaters" would work as
an engine preheater. You an see an example at
http://www.outdoorsportz.com/OGTHOOOO1001.html
> If you "Do the Google" you will find many examples"
>
> Tom Jones
> Ellensburg, WA
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72366#72366
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
Here is a simple solution . Do not click on the subject, or follow my posts: Can
you interpret what Im saying? Dont like whats on TV? Turn it off.
If someone from the EAA office is listening in, please contact Steve and explain
the real Sport Pilot Rule.
If you are so sure of YOUR convictions we would like to read them. Please tell
us why, and provide complete references to back up your statements. This
post subject has been in reference to misinformation that is clarified completely
in the:
Federal Register
Certification of Aircraft and Airman for the Operation of Light-Sport aircraft;
Final Rule. Dated July 27, 2004
A very good question, but am not learning much.
but am not learning much.? Ahh its the old Ill just blame the teacher for my
kids lack of education reasoning
Getting many interpretations, but alas' slowly getting confused and bewildered!
This is not my fault. I am not giving many interpretations. You just rely
on many interpretation as being accurate. How can there be more than one?
Why not try these people for their best interpretation of the rules
There is NO interpretation necessary, Just the ability to read and add.
While were here.
Kitfoxaircraft has spoken..
http://kitfoxaircraft.com/FAQ.htm#2
What is the gross weight of a Kitfox?
The current Kitfox has been structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross weight at +6g
and -3g Load Limit. With an empty weight of 750 lbs, it can easily be operated
within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross with a 570 lb or better useful load. Not
concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross weight limit and have an 800
lb useful load.
It just said:
a) structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross weight (design weight) .
b) can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross
c) Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross weight limit
How can they sell a 1550 lb plane for light sport privileges??
Because it can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross with
a 570 lb or better useful load
NOT certified, not certificated, operated, as is, With an empty weight of 750
lbs (or less).
Got a private pilot cert? Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross
weight limit and have an 800 lb useful load.
Can you hear me now?
steve
--------
Steve: Former Fi-156 'Storch' driver (...talk about folding wings!!!)
New owner, not builder- Kitfox V / 912UL / Warp Dr 3 blade. Thanks to the late
great Ray Mudge, Brighton Mi.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72384#72384
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
Deke,
Having lived in Alaska for 25 years and having the same needs and
requirements that you mention below for preheating aircraft engines, I
can guarantee that the best engine pre-heater you can get, hands down is
the Red Dragon. You can purchase them from Chief Aircraft and Aircraft
Spruce, or search locally for them as well.
The Red Dragon is fueled from a portable propane bottle, and uses a 12
volt car battery to run the electric operated fan.When used with a
cowling blanket/cover to retain the heat inside the cowling, your engine
will be heated in 30 minutes, or less, depending on the outside air
temp. At -20 F, 30 minutes would do the trick every time up in the
Fairbanks area. Along with the heater unit itself, you will want the 6'
ducting hose that attaches to the end of the heater and is placed up
under the cowling to direct the heat to the engine. I have pasted a
couple of links below for you to check out. Good luck.
Stan
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/reddragpreheater.php
http://www.chiefaircraft.com/cgi-bin/air/hazel.cgi?client=13204987&acti
on=serve&item=/Aircraft/Accessories/EnginePreheater.html
----- Original Message -----
From: Fox5flyer
To: Kitfox List
Sent: Saturday, November 04, 2006 5:34 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Engine Heater
I'm looking for ideas for an engine heater. Following are the things
it needs to satisfy for my situation.
- First, no electric is available so it must be self sustaining,
but battery power is fine.
- Must be able to heat engine up to at least 75 degrees in a
reasonable time.
- Must be safe with no threat of the open flame torching anything
or shrinking fabric. This doesn't mean it can't have an open flame. It
just needs to be safe.
- Plans built is fine so long as components are readily available.
- Factory built is fine too if someone has a setup to sell.
- Must be portable.
If anybody has any meaningful suggestions they can contribute I'd much
appreciate it.
If offering to sell me something, please take that off list. Photos
are welcome.
Thanks a bunch,
Deke
S5 in a cold hangar
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "john perry" <eskflyer@lvcisp.com>
STEVE
this is getting as stupid as the [ POT SCRUBBERS] . If you want to try and
make someone believe you then just call your local FISDO or the FAA in OK
CITY. and argue .
IF you dont do that then I guess you are scared of the real answer .
Tired of the drivel and pot scrubbing
John Perry
Kitfox 2 N718PD
TD/ Straight floats
Hot PInk IVO
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 9:38 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end!
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
>
> Here is a simple solution . Do not click on the subject, or follow my
> posts: Can you ?ointerpret? what I?Tm saying? Don?Tt like what?Ts on
> TV? Turn it off.
>
> ?oIf someone from the EAA office is listening in, please contact Steve
> and explain the real Sport Pilot Rule.?
> If you are so sure of YOUR convictions we would like to read them.
> Please tell us why, and provide complete references to back up your
> statements. This post subject has been in reference to misinformation
> that is clarified completely in the:
>
> Federal Register
> Certification of Aircraft and Airman for the Operation of Light-Sport
> aircraft; Final Rule. Dated July 27, 2004
>
> A very good question, but am not learning much.
>
> ?obut am not learning much?o.? Ahh? it?Ts the old ?oI?Tll just
> blame the teacher for my kids lack of education? reasoning
>
> Getting many interpretations, but alas' slowly getting confused and
> bewildered!
> This is not my fault. I am not giving ?omany? interpretations?.
> You just rely on many interpretation? as being accurate. How can there
> be more than one?
>
>
> Why not try these people for their best interpretation of the rules
>
> There is NO interpretation necessary, Just the ability to read and
> add.
>
> While we?Tre here?.
> Kitfoxaircraft has spoken?..
> http://kitfoxaircraft.com/FAQ.htm#2
>
> What is the gross weight of a Kitfox?
> ?oThe current Kitfox has been structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross
> weight at +6g and -3g Load Limit. With an empty weight of 750 lbs, it can
> easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross with a 570 lb or
> better useful load. Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross
> weight limit and have an 800 lb useful load.?
>
> It just said:
> a) structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross weight? (design weight) .
> b) can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross
> c) Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross weight limit
>
> How can they sell a 1550 lb plane for light sport privileges??
> Because ?oit can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb
> gross with a 570 lb or better useful load?
>
> NOT certified, not certificated, ?operated, as is, ?oWith an empty
> weight of 750 lbs? (or less).
> Got a private pilot cert? ?oNot concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550
> lb gross weight limit and have an 800 lb useful load.?
>
> Can you hear me now?
> steve
>
> --------
> Steve: Former Fi-156 'Storch' driver (...talk about folding wings!!!)
> New owner, not builder- Kitfox V / 912UL / Warp Dr 3 blade. Thanks to the
> late great Ray Mudge, Brighton Mi.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72384#72384
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@i-star.com>
Steve, no need to get upset over this. You need to understand that what you
are telling us is contrary to what we've been lead to believe from the
git-go and it's difficult for all of us to take this as gospel without some
confirmation from the source of the rule. I suggested EAA because they are
definitely on our side and they were also very instrumental in formulating
the rule. Like I said previously, I feel what you posted has merit.
However, I personally would like to see something from those "on high" that
reinforces your interpretation.
I personally have been very interested in this thread because I've learned a
lot more about Sport Pilot than I would have otherwise. I think it is
something that will affect us all at one time or another whether SP, PP,
Com, or ATP.
Sincerely,
Deke Morisse
----- Original Message -----
From: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 10:38 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end!
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
>
> Here is a simple solution . Do not click on the subject, or follow my
posts: Can you ?ointerpret? what I?Tm saying? Don?Tt like what?Ts on
TV? Turn it off.
>
> ?oIf someone from the EAA office is listening in, please contact Steve
and explain the real Sport Pilot Rule.?
> If you are so sure of YOUR convictions we would like to read them.
Please tell us why, and provide complete references to back up your
statements. This post subject has been in reference to misinformation that
is clarified completely in the:
>
> Federal Register
> Certification of Aircraft and Airman for the Operation of Light-Sport
aircraft; Final Rule. Dated July 27, 2004
>
> A very good question, but am not learning much.
>
> ?obut am not learning much?o.? Ahh? it?Ts the old ?oI?Tll just
blame the teacher for my kids lack of education? reasoning
>
> Getting many interpretations, but alas' slowly getting confused and
bewildered!
> This is not my fault. I am not giving ?omany? interpretations?.
You just rely on many interpretation? as being accurate. How can there be
more than one?
>
>
> Why not try these people for their best interpretation of the rules
>
> There is NO interpretation necessary, Just the ability to read and
add.
>
> While we?Tre here?.
> Kitfoxaircraft has spoken?..
> http://kitfoxaircraft.com/FAQ.htm#2
>
> What is the gross weight of a Kitfox?
> ?oThe current Kitfox has been structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross
weight at +6g and -3g Load Limit. With an empty weight of 750 lbs, it can
easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross with a 570 lb or
better useful load. Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross
weight limit and have an 800 lb useful load.?
>
> It just said:
> a) structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross weight? (design weight) .
> b) can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross
> c) Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross weight limit
>
> How can they sell a 1550 lb plane for light sport privileges??
> Because ?oit can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb
gross with a 570 lb or better useful load?
>
> NOT certified, not certificated, ?operated, as is, ?oWith an empty
weight of 750 lbs? (or less).
> Got a private pilot cert? ?oNot concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550
lb gross weight limit and have an 800 lb useful load.?
>
> Can you hear me now?
> steve
>
> --------
> Steve: Former Fi-156 'Storch' driver (...talk about folding wings!!!)
> New owner, not builder- Kitfox V / 912UL / Warp Dr 3 blade. Thanks to the
late great Ray Mudge, Brighton Mi.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72384#72384
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Hey Deke, That's it.
Lowell
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 5:59 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Engine Heater
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
>
> Deke, I have been thinking that one of those "Tent Heaters" would work as
> an engine preheater. You an see an example at
> http://www.outdoorsportz.com/OGTHOOOO1001.html
> If you "Do the Google" you will find many examples"
>
> Tom Jones
> Ellensburg, WA
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72366#72366
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
"IF you dont do that then I guess you are scared of the real answer "
Kitfoxaircraft has spoken..
http://kitfoxaircraft.com/FAQ.htm#2
What is the gross weight of a Kitfox?
The current Kitfox has been structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross weight at +6g
and -3g Load Limit. With an empty weight of 750 lbs, it can easily be operated
within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross with a 570 lb or better useful load. Not
concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross weight limit and have an 800
lb useful load.
It just said:
a) structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross weight (design weight) .
b) can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross
c) Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross weight limit
How can they sell a 1550 lb plane for light sport privileges?? Because it can
easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross with a 570 lb or better
useful load
NOT certified, not certificated, operated, as is, With an empty weight of 750
lbs (or less).
Got a private pilot cert? Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross
weight limit and have an 800 lb useful load.
Can you hear me now?
steve
Ya, I guess Kitfoxaircraft has their head up their &%# too eh?
steve
--------
Steve: Former Fi-156 'Storch' driver (...talk about folding wings!!!)
New owner, not builder- Kitfox V / 912UL / Warp Dr 3 blade. Thanks to the late
great Ray Mudge, Brighton Mi.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72398#72398
Message 13
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Lead and mtbe are both octane number enhancers. The difference is MTBE
isn't corrosive like Ethanol, doesn't form a solution with water, doesn't
vapour loc like Ethanol and won't make a meal out of your composite tanks.
There is the fact that the newer gas station tanks are made of composite
using vinyl fillers. These fillers are supposed to be invulnerable to
Ethanol. I prefer to visit that particular subject again in say fifteen
years. In the mean time if you made your own tanks and made them using
vinyl fillers then that is one less thing you have to worry about when
boozing up the plane. The rest of us with composite tanks should try to
avoid booze ( in the glass and in the tank) while flying.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of jareds
> Sent: Saturday, November 04, 2006 9:06 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Ethanol
>
>
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: jareds <jareds@verizon.net>
>
> Don,
>
> I thought the MBTE acted as a lubricant after lead was removed from
> gasoline.
> Now that i moved from DC to South Dakota there is an ethynol plant on
> every corner. The TV commercial where the dude rolls up to a
> corn field
> to fill up is almost a reality here. I really have to go out
> of my way
> to find fuel because our bulk deliverer only can delivery ethy based
> fuel. So this is a pretty interesting thread. Hope we get some more
> experts to weigh in!
> Thanks,
>
> Jared
>
> Don Smythe wrote:
>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net>
> >
> > I don't know anything about gasoline or mbte/ethanol but
> thought the
> > questions was worth beating around a little. So, you can possible
> > remove the ethanol but would have to replace it with something else
> > like mbte??? Correct?? What does mbte or ethanol do to gasoline to
> > make it good/safe for engines? I guess an engine would not operate
> > correctly with the mbte/ethanol removed.
> >
> > Don Smythe
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob" <dswaim1119@comcast.net>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Sent: Friday, November 03, 2006 8:35 AM
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Ethanol
> >
> >
> >> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Bob" <dswaim1119@comcast.net>
> >>
> >> The problem is that the ethanol is there with it's own job - to
> >> replace the MTBE. Theoretically, you could do what you
> propose, IF
> >> you can determine how precisely much ethanol you are
> taking out, make
> >> sure you got all the water back out, have the replacement on hand,
> >> determine the equivalent amount of replacement, and then mix the
> >> replacement uniformly through your fuel.
> >>
> >> Bob
> >>
> >> --------
> >> Remember that internet advice may only be worth what you pay.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Read this topic online here:
> >>
> >> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=71966#71966
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
I know you said no electric is available, but I'll offer this in case
you decide to wire your hangar, or if anybody else is so inclined:
I use a ceramic disc heater sitting on a short step stool, aimed at the
air discharge area under the rear of the cowl. I have a small (12" x
18") sheet of stainless steel, about .020", that I use to keep the heat
away from the fiberglass cowl. This aims the heat up under the engine,
warms the oil pan, the oil cooler, and eventually the whole engine. I
set it for 4:30 am, and by the time the sun is up...6:30 or so these
days...the engine oil is just about my takeoff temp...140F. The heads
are nearly the same temp, and by the time I taxi to the far end, it's
ready to fly. This works well on my Jabiru, but you Rotax (and your
Subaru, Deke) guys have a different configuration.
Lynn
On Saturday, November 4, 2006, at 07:34 PM, Fox5flyer wrote:
> I'm looking for ideas for an engine heater. Following are the things
> it needs to satisfy for my situation.
>
> - First, no electric is available so it must be self sustaining,
> but battery power is fine.
>
> -Must be able to heat engine up to at least 75 degrees in a
> reasonable time.
>
> - Must be safe with no threat of the open flame torching anything
> or shrinking fabric. This doesn't mean it can't have an open flame.
> It just needs to be safe.
>
> - Plans built is fine so long as components are readily available.
>
> - Factory built is fine too if someone has a setup to sell.
>
> -Must be portable.
>
> If anybody has any meaningful suggestionsthey can contribute I'd much
> appreciate it.
> If offering to sell me something, please take that off list. Photos
> are welcome.
>
> Thanks a bunch,
> Deke
> S5 in a cold hangar
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clint Bazzill" <clint_bazzill@hotmail.com>
Test
_________________________________________________________________
Use your PC to make calls at very low rates
https://voiceoam.pcs.v2s.live.com/partnerredirect.aspx
Message 16
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| Subject: | revisit alodine subject |
We did cover this a while back but I have a problem. I bought an acid
prep and an alodine chromate conversion chemical a few weeks back and I
was delayed and just got around to starting this today. I warmed up the
garage and the aluminum and then poured out a sample of each chemical to
test the process on a piece of the aluminum material. The acid prep
certainly worked and was quite active in cleaning the material. The
actual alodine was completely ineffective however, nothing happened at
all. I waited ten minutes and nothing.
Is there any posibility that the process is more complex than apply and
wait? I was a little apprehensive when I purchased the product as the
seal was broken and the solution has stained the plastic bottle, I just
wish to know how quick and active alodine usually is before I confront
the NAPA people.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Sorry you are bothered by posts that don't reflect your current
interests, John. But sometimes a thread sparks some interest in someone
that wouldn't have otherwise been alerted to it. I started the PS
(won't say the whole words) thread because I had a need to know. By the
time it was over (if it is), I was getting sick of it too. But thanks
to several on this group, I now have a successful...I think...heater in
my plane. That's the way this group is supposed to work. I for one, am
sick of reading about setting props, and this current "beat the FAA
rule" weight issue. I CAN be sick of it, because I have a fixed-pitch
prop, and I'm willing to fly my plane at the weight it was intended, so
these topics don't interest me, but I can "change channels" as was
suggested....or not turn the TV on.
Lynn
On Sunday, November 5, 2006, at 11:31 AM, john perry wrote:
> this is getting as stupid as the [ POT SCRUBBERS] .Tired of the drivel
> and pot scrubbing
>
> John Perry
Message 18
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| Subject: | Alcolhol a must read (SAIB) |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clint Bazzill" <clint_bazzill@hotmail.com>
This should clear up a lot of things, or get them mixed up even more.
http://www.faa.gov.aircraft/safety/alerts/saib/media/CE-07-06.pdf
Clint
_________________________________________________________________
Stay in touch with old friends and meet new ones with Windows Live Spaces
http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwsp0070000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://spaces.live.com/spacesapi.aspx?wx_action=create&wx_url=/friends.aspx&mkt=en-us
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
hey Pot scrubbers was a great topic and a good test for some .
I have 2 more installs this week and both owners are as happy as a pig in
the mud.
I only used SS pads so far but I do have copper ones but have not tried
yet.
Dave
BTW I have not hooked up my scat lines of muffler yet to cabin as I am
only running heat from my scoop of the back of radiator so far for heat but
the coldest i been out is about 25F in the last week of flying and that was
near 10 hours. Not frozen yet.
----- Original Message -----
From: "john perry" <eskflyer@lvcisp.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please
end!
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "john perry" <eskflyer@lvcisp.com>
STEVE
this is getting as stupid as the [ POT SCRUBBERS] . If you want to try and
make someone believe you then just call your local FISDO or the FAA in OK
CITY. and argue .
IF you dont do that then I guess you are scared of the real answer .
Tired of the drivel and pot scrubbing
John Perry
Kitfox 2 N718PD
TD/ Straight floats
Hot PInk IVO
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 9:38 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end!
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
>
> Here is a simple solution . Do not click on the subject, or follow my
> posts: Can you ?ointerpret? what I?Tm saying? Don?Tt like what?Ts on
> TV? Turn it off.
>
> ?oIf someone from the EAA office is listening in, please contact Steve
> and explain the real Sport Pilot Rule.?
> If you are so sure of YOUR convictions we would like to read them.
> Please tell us why, and provide complete references to back up your
> statements. This post subject has been in reference to misinformation
> that is clarified completely in the:
>
> Federal Register
> Certification of Aircraft and Airman for the Operation of Light-Sport
> aircraft; Final Rule. Dated July 27, 2004
>
> A very good question, but am not learning much.
>
> ?obut am not learning much?o.? Ahh? it?Ts the old ?oI?Tll just
> blame the teacher for my kids lack of education? reasoning
>
> Getting many interpretations, but alas' slowly getting confused and
> bewildered!
> This is not my fault. I am not giving ?omany? interpretations?.
> You just rely on many interpretation? as being accurate. How can there
> be more than one?
>
>
> Why not try these people for their best interpretation of the rules
>
> There is NO interpretation necessary, Just the ability to read and
> add.
>
> While we?Tre here?.
> Kitfoxaircraft has spoken?..
> http://kitfoxaircraft.com/FAQ.htm#2
>
> What is the gross weight of a Kitfox?
> ?oThe current Kitfox has been structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross
> weight at +6g and -3g Load Limit. With an empty weight of 750 lbs, it can
> easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross with a 570 lb or
> better useful load. Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross
> weight limit and have an 800 lb useful load.?
>
> It just said:
> a) structurally tested at 1550 lbs gross weight? (design weight) .
> b) can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb gross
> c) Not concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550 lb gross weight limit
>
> How can they sell a 1550 lb plane for light sport privileges??
> Because ?oit can easily be operated within the LSA limit of 1320 lb
> gross with a 570 lb or better useful load?
>
> NOT certified, not certificated, ?operated, as is, ?oWith an empty
> weight of 750 lbs? (or less).
> Got a private pilot cert? ?oNot concerned about LSA? Use the full 1550
> lb gross weight limit and have an 800 lb useful load.?
>
> Can you hear me now?
> steve
>
> --------
> Steve: Former Fi-156 'Storch' driver (...talk about folding wings!!!)
> New owner, not builder- Kitfox V / 912UL / Warp Dr 3 blade. Thanks to the
> late great Ray Mudge, Brighton Mi.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72384#72384
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | ALCOHOL and Aircraft A MUST READ |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Clint Bazzill" <clint_bazzill@hotmail.com>
The Last link I sent didn't work, don't know why but check this out.
http://www.faa.gov/aircraft/safety/alerts/saib/media/CE-07-06.pdf
Clint
_________________________________________________________________
Add a Yahoo! contact to Windows Live Messenger for a chance to win a free
trip!
http://www.imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/yahoo/default.aspx?locale=en-us&hmtagline
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michael Gibbs <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
I had sed:
>This is not the definition of "maximum takeoff
>weight." You have taken this section completely
>out of context.
To which Steve replied:
>In what way? PLEASE explain.
I already did in my original reply. I'm not
going to play 20 question with you--try Noel for
that, he loves it.
I had sed:
>Maximum takeoff weight is a fixed value applied
>by the manufacturer (the "amateur" in the case
>of amateur-built aircraft) and does not change
>from one flight to another, regardless of the
>aircraft's loading.
To which Steve replied:
>VERY VERY WRONG, Show you reference to that
>profound declaration! You just now, made up your
>own difinition based on personal opinion. Can't
>do that.
OK, let's start with the word "maximum." I think
#2 is particularly appropriate to this
discussion. From Merriam-Webster Dictionary
<http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/maximum>:
>Main Entry: maximum
>Function: noun
>Inflected Form(s): plural maxima /-s&-m& /; or maximums /-s(&-)m&mz/
>Etymology: Latin, neuter of maximus biggest -- more at MAXIM
>1 a : the greatest quantity or value attainable
>or attained b : the period of highest, greatest,
>or utmost development
>2 : an upper limit allowed (as by a legal
>authority) or allowable (as by the circumstances
>of a particular case)
>3 : the largest of a set of numbers;
>specifically : the largest value assumed by a
>real-valued continuous function defined on a
>closed interval
>- maximum adjective
By definition, a "maximum" is not TODAYs weight,
it is the MOST EVER. There is "takeoff weight",
the actual value for today's flight and a
"maximum takeoff weight", the most it can ever
be. The LSA rules refer to the "maximum takeoff
weight" not the actual takeoff weight.
I had sed:
>"The FAA agreed that some people would try to do
>that and added this poorly-worded text to their
>narrative. "
To which Steve replied:
>Why is it poorly-worded? I'ts beautiful.
It's poorly worded because it is ambiguous. You
have taken it's meaning as a definition of the
term "maximum takeoff weight" and I have taken it
as narrative. Clearly it is not clear enough.
Steve followed with:
>Please don't break a progressive thread by using
>my "subject title" to start a reply in a new
>post. Reply to the original post using the
>"reply button at the bottom of the original
>post. It will maintain the continuity of the
>discussion.
I'm sorry you are not happy with the message
header handling of my e-mail client, but I do not
use the web interface to read the list and don't
plan to start. You needn't worry though, I have
made my point on this subject and you are free to
disagree. I'm sure I'm not the only one getting
tired of this pointless discussion.
Besides, there is nothing "progressive" about
this on-going attempt to convince people who know
better that you can fly any airplane ever built
as an LSA simply by playing games with your
takeoff weight. If you are confident of that,
just go do it! Try not to get caught, though.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
I noticed that some of the aluminum will yellow and take a coating easily a
nd other alloys will not seem to take the alodine or will require sanding s
hortly before treatment. Don't remember the specific alloys but you might
want to try scrubbing a sample with scotch brite pad or sand paper and then
retreating before assuming that the alodine is bad.=0A=0AJim Shumaker=0A
=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Dave G. <occo
m@ns.sympatico.ca>=0ATo: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Sunday, November
5, 2006 9:41:15 AM=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: revisit alodine subject=0A=0A
=0AWe did cover this a while back but I have a problem. I bought an acid pr
ep and an alodine chromate conversion chemical a few weeks back and I was d
elayed and just got around to starting this today. I warmed up the garage a
nd the aluminum and then poured out a sample of each chemical to test the p
rocess on a piece of the aluminum material. The acid prep certainly worked
and was quite active in cleaning the material. The actual alodine was compl
etely ineffective however, nothing happened at all. I waited ten minutes an
d nothing. =0A =0AIs there any posibility that the process is more complex
than apply and wait? I was a little apprehensive when I purchased the produ
ct as the seal was broken and the solution has stained the plastic bottle,
I just wish to know how quick and active alodine usually is before I confro
=============
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Deke, I remember reading of an Alaska pilot using a length or stove pipe
fed into the cowl with one of the old fashioned gas fueled "blow torches" at
the bottom. They would start if up early and return to their cabin for
breakfast and oil heating - see below. I suppose a propane torch might
serve as a modern replacement of the blow torch or even a small multifuel
camp stove might be best as it could use the aircraft fuel in a pinch. If a
fixture was made to center the flame of the propane torch or camp stove, a
length of flexible aluminum dryer hose could be used as well. this
conceivably would help move the flame further from the airplane. One other
thing they did in extreme conditions is drain the oil, heat it in a pan on
the stove and return it to the engine hot. These were must fly commercial
guys.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@i-star.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 04, 2006 4:34 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Engine Heater
I'm looking for ideas for an engine heater. Following are the things it
needs to satisfy for my situation.
- First, no electric is available so it must be self sustaining, but
battery power is fine.
- Must be able to heat engine up to at least 75 degrees in a reasonable
time.
- Must be safe with no threat of the open flame torching anything or
shrinking fabric. This doesn't mean it can't have an open flame. It just
needs to be safe.
- Plans built is fine so long as components are readily available.
- Factory built is fine too if someone has a setup to sell.
- Must be portable.
If anybody has any meaningful suggestions they can contribute I'd much
appreciate it.
If offering to sell me something, please take that off list. Photos are
welcome.
Thanks a bunch,
Deke
S5 in a cold hangar
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
I don't think John is bothered by posts not necessarily in his interest.
The forum is for all our benefit. I read every post even though I don't
have a Subaru, Jabiru or a 582.
What to me, at least,becomes tiresome is posts from some who have no
personal experience in the area of the question and are still quite willing
to give their best guess. This requires some real sorting out and is for
practical purposes extremely burdensom to those that may be asking from a
new to Kitrfox perspective.
Many questions are from people who need real information, sort of like
"facts" - the recent spinner question as an example. The original poster
asked a reasonable question. I didn't respond because my set-up is not the
same as his and didn't want to confuse the issue. That thinking didn't
concern others and one post essentially giving the final answer ended with a
confession that he didn't even have a spinner.
Were I new to Kitfox, I wouldn't find all the various "opinions" helpful. I
would want real info from real people with real experience with MY Issue.
Regarding the pot scrubbers - yes it was beaten to death. Likely every
possible variation of the idea was posted, yet the most widely accepted
reason for the potscrubber in the heat muff, mentioned early on was not
discussed at all, i.e. slowing the air passage through the muff, and whether
more than one would be better than just one.
And regarding LSA. No amount of argument will change anyones mind. We have
our trusted sources for our information, most of them deeply involved in
it's formulation, not just someone who just possibly bought the wrong
airplane and is trying to develop a consensus. Let's all just live with it
and hopefully go on to something else.
One more thing. I am getting the distinct impression that the more vocal
guys on the list now are not builders, but at least second owners of their
Kitfox. Am I wrong in this, I hope so.
I remember the Kitfox list as a source of real help when I was early into
Kitfox. Lately it seems to have become more of a chat room where lots of
posts are just made to fill in an otherwise boring day. The truth really is
out there. Lots of information on Google and other good sources, but then
the facts stop the chat so lets ignore the facts and just chat - lots more
fun for some, I guess.
Maybe I am just getting old or maybe even getting a life, but, I'm sure
getting tired of it all.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 9:43 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please
end!
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> Sorry you are bothered by posts that don't reflect your current interests,
> John. But sometimes a thread sparks some interest in someone that wouldn't
> have otherwise been alerted to it. I started the PS (won't say the whole
> words) thread because I had a need to know. By the time it was over (if it
> is), I was getting sick of it too. But thanks to several on this group, I
> now have a successful...I think...heater in my plane. That's the way this
> group is supposed to work. I for one, am sick of reading about setting
> props, and this current "beat the FAA rule" weight issue. I CAN be sick
> of it, because I have a fixed-pitch prop, and I'm willing to fly my plane
> at the weight it was intended, so these topics don't interest me, but I
> can "change channels" as was suggested....or not turn the TV on.
>
> Lynn
> On Sunday, November 5, 2006, at 11:31 AM, john perry wrote:
>> this is getting as stupid as the [ POT SCRUBBERS] .Tired of the drivel
>> and pot scrubbing
>>
>> John Perry
>
>
>
Message 25
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| Subject: | Warp Drive mounting |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson" <janderson412@hotmail.com>
Not sure that I follow exactly what you have but the prop hub must go onto
the prop flange. Then the spinner mounting plate. As mentioned in my last, I
have a re-enforcing ring flange on the outer face of the spinner mounting
plate.
From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
> >
> > Dave.
> >
> > The mounting plate goes on outside of hub.
> >
There have been a couple of replies stating this and I'm confused. I have a
spinner mounting plate that is about 1/8" thick and 7" diameter. It was
originally used with a GSC prop that now hangs in the basement. The spinner
attaches with 9 machine screws around it's base. I must mount this between
the Warp HPL hub and the mounting flange. After the hub I have the choice of
using just washers under the heads of the 8mm bolts or another flange like
plate (which has suddenly gone AWOL). Any locknuts or other fastening helper
must go in the space between the C-box and the mounting flange. My immediate
though is to use cross-drilled bolts with washers under the heads and
nothing behind the flange, wire secured. However I am a complete neophyte in
aviation matters and I am willing to be educated.
_________________________________________________________________
Discover fun and games at @ http://xtramsn.co.nz/kids
Message 26
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| Subject: | If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Ben-PA" <ben@gmpexpress.net>
. . .then can I fly without a high-performance endorsement:
In a retractable gear plane if I don't retract the gear?
Or fly with more than 200 horsepower if I don't use full throttle?
Or fly with a constant speed propellor if I don't change the pitch?
Ben
--------
Sign up on the Kitfox Frappr Map:
http://www.frappr.com/kitfox
You can see where fellow Kitfoxers live and pictures of their planes. Be sure to
post some pictures of you, your plane, or share the scenery of the Kitfox world.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72437#72437
Message 27
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| Subject: | revisit alodine subject |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson" <janderson412@hotmail.com>
Aluminum alloy has a slight oily coat on it after process. Before alodining
you must scotbright with water until the water runs off clean and doesn't
pool. After this, wash the alum and dry, degrease then treat. It will go
staw colour within minutes. Just light straw is sufficent.
From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Kitfox-List: revisit alodine subject
We did cover this a while back but I have a problem. I bought an acid prep
and an alodine chromate conversion chemical a few weeks back and I was
delayed and just got around to starting this today. I warmed up the garage
and the aluminum and then poured out a sample of each chemical to test the
process on a piece of the aluminum material. The acid prep certainly worked
and was quite active in cleaning the material. The actual alodine was
completely ineffective however, nothing happened at all. I waited ten
minutes and nothing.
Is there any posibility that the process is more complex than apply and
wait? I was a little apprehensive when I purchased the product as the seal
was broken and the solution has stained the plastic bottle, I just wish to
know how quick and active alodine usually is before I confront the NAPA
people.
_________________________________________________________________
Looking for love? Check out XtraMSN Personals
http://xtramsn.match.com/match/mt.cfm?pg=channel&tcid 0731
Message 28
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| Subject: | [O.T.]Hams are also model builders. WAS: radio problem |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
On Nov 5, 2006, at 6:41 AM, kurt schrader wrote:
> If I remember correctly, NASA borrowed slow scan from
> the Ham guys, who invented it. NASA stayed with it
> until the digital age for all their space pics. But
> slow scan, like KitFox's and our "improvements", are
> home brew. Many new ideas also come from model
> builders.
> We are the leaders, not the followers. :-)
Your comments illustrate very well what I said a while ago, Kurt: the
experimental aviation business is pretty much like the radio amateur
business. They are both "amateurs," from the latin: Amare, which means,
to love. While we are not professionals, we do it with great love and
passion.
A ham is constantly experimenting and the reason I have slowed down
that activity is that, after contacting a ham from New Zealand ...
there wasn't anything any more remote on this planet to test, the
"Kiwiland" being at my antipode.
Did you know that, at the beginning of the last century, only low and
medium frequencies were used by broadcasters? The high frequency range
was left for the hams to play with. Until, one day, hams managed to
make intercontinental contacts on this "left over" frequency. It was
then very quickly taken back by professional broadcasters, the military
... well, everyone.
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Jimmie Blackwell" <JimmieBlackwell@austin.rr.com>
I agree with most of what Lowell is saying.
This list has been most helpful to me when I was building a Kitfox and when
I was rebuilding my current Kitfox. It does seem that some of the
questions, especially by newcomers, that need to be answered go largely
unanswered and over shadowed by the arguing back and forth on subjects that
get beat to death several times over. I do not plead innocent, but will try
hard to stick to the real issues and purpsoe of this list.
Hopefully, everyone will revisit the real purpose of this list. To me that
is to help each other as much as possible whether we are an original builder
or a second owner of a Kitfox. I know that many of you have helped me and
even though I am currently just a second owner I believe that some of my
knowledge has helped others. I will continue trying to do so.
Jimmie
Kitfox Speedster, Second Owner
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 2:12 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please
end!
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
> I don't think John is bothered by posts not necessarily in his interest.
> The forum is for all our benefit. I read every post even though I don't
> have a Subaru, Jabiru or a 582.
>
> What to me, at least,becomes tiresome is posts from some who have no
> personal experience in the area of the question and are still quite
> willing to give their best guess. This requires some real sorting out and
> is for practical purposes extremely burdensom to those that may be asking
> from a new to Kitrfox perspective.
>
> Many questions are from people who need real information, sort of like
> "facts" - the recent spinner question as an example. The original poster
> asked a reasonable question. I didn't respond because my set-up is not
> the same as his and didn't want to confuse the issue. That thinking
> didn't concern others and one post essentially giving the final answer
> ended with a confession that he didn't even have a spinner.
>
> Were I new to Kitfox, I wouldn't find all the various "opinions" helpful.
> I would want real info from real people with real experience with MY
> Issue.
>
> Regarding the pot scrubbers - yes it was beaten to death. Likely every
> possible variation of the idea was posted, yet the most widely accepted
> reason for the potscrubber in the heat muff, mentioned early on was not
> discussed at all, i.e. slowing the air passage through the muff, and
> whether more than one would be better than just one.
>
> And regarding LSA. No amount of argument will change anyones mind. We
> have our trusted sources for our information, most of them deeply involved
> in it's formulation, not just someone who just possibly bought the wrong
> airplane and is trying to develop a consensus. Let's all just live with
> it and hopefully go on to something else.
>
> One more thing. I am getting the distinct impression that the more vocal
> guys on the list now are not builders, but at least second owners of their
> Kitfox. Am I wrong in this, I hope so.
>
> I remember the Kitfox list as a source of real help when I was early into
> Kitfox. Lately it seems to have become more of a chat room where lots of
> posts are just made to fill in an otherwise boring day. The truth really
> is out there. Lots of information on Google and other good sources, but
> then the facts stop the chat so lets ignore the facts and just chat - lots
> more fun for some, I guess.
>
> Maybe I am just getting old or maybe even getting a life, but, I'm sure
> getting tired of it all.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 9:43 AM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page.
> Please end!
>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>>
>> Sorry you are bothered by posts that don't reflect your current
>> interests, John. But sometimes a thread sparks some interest in someone
>> that wouldn't have otherwise been alerted to it. I started the PS (won't
>> say the whole words) thread because I had a need to know. By the time it
>> was over (if it is), I was getting sick of it too. But thanks to several
>> on this group, I now have a successful...I think...heater in my plane.
>> That's the way this group is supposed to work. I for one, am sick of
>> reading about setting props, and this current "beat the FAA rule" weight
>> issue. I CAN be sick of it, because I have a fixed-pitch prop, and I'm
>> willing to fly my plane at the weight it was intended, so these topics
>> don't interest me, but I can "change channels" as was suggested....or not
>> turn the TV on.
>>
>> Lynn
>> On Sunday, November 5, 2006, at 11:31 AM, john perry wrote:
>>> this is getting as stupid as the [ POT SCRUBBERS] .Tired of the drivel
>>> and pot scrubbing
>>>
>>> John Perry
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 4:12 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please
end!
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
> I don't think John is bothered by posts not necessarily in his interest.
> The forum is for all our benefit. I read every post even though I don't
> have a Subaru, Jabiru or a 582.
>
> What to me, at least,becomes tiresome is posts from some who have no
> personal experience in the area of the question and are still quite
> willing
I scan all the messages and quickly delete the ones that are just arguing. I
learned stuff on the potscrubber thread that may be of use when I re-engine
and many other posts are of value to me. I am not an original builder (wish
I was) I am a re-rebuilder of a twice damaged plane. I need all the help I
can get as neither of the two very talented builders that preceeded me are
easily available and there is only one other 'fox local to me here in
Halifax.
No thread to trivial, I can delete a hundred posts in just a few minutes.
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Reshrinking fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Dave and Diane <ddsyverson@comcast.net>
Ron,
Don't be tempted to try something that isn't provided for by the manufacturer
of the fabric covering system.
I don't know what fabric covering system, or what kind of paint is on your
aircraft - razorback? ceconite? Cotton? Polyfiber? /polytone? aerothane?- the
only thing you can be sure works is what the OEM Mfgr says.
I cannot speak to any of the other systems; my experience is only with
Polyfiber products. On poly fiber products you never use a heat gun; you only
use a calibrated iron at the correct temperature because you absolutely
cannot control the tempearature at the fabric with a heat gun.
The repair procedures for polyfiber products DO NOT include trying to reshrink
the fabric with paint and the undercoats on the fabric.
What you need to do is repair or replace the fabric, by the exact procedure
recommended by the fabric system manufacturer. You will not be happy and may
not be safe if you deviate from the manufacturers recommendations.
One of the cheapest reference books I ever purchased for my project was the
poly fiber manual. One of the best things I ever did when I was unhappy with
a portion of the fabric job was to rip it off, throw it away and start from
new - just like the manual says - in the long run you will be a lot happier
with the result, and you will never have any nagging questions about your
safety because of the repair.
Sincerely,
Dave S.
St Paul, MN
M-7 nosedragger
On Saturday 04 November 2006 6:50 pm, ron schick wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
>
> I need to do some fabric work , and other things, and was wondering if I
> can use a heat gun to reshrink the painted fabric. I want to unglue then
> reglue as much as possible. Ya not my best landing. Ron NB Ore
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Warp Drive mounting |
Dave,
I have probably the same situation as you. My spinner/plate cabe off a
GSC and I'm using it on the Warp. See attached picture of how mine is
mounted. Nine #10 screws go through the spinner and into the plate.
Don Smythe
> From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
> There have been a couple of replies stating this and I'm confused. I have
> a spinner mounting plate that is about 1/8" thick and 7" diameter. It was
> originally used with a GSC prop that now hangs in the basement. The
> spinner attaches with 9 machine screws around it's base. I must mount this
> between the Warp HPL hub and the mounting flange. After the hub I have the
> choice of using just washers under the heads of the 8mm bolts or another
> flange like plate (which has suddenly gone AWOL). Any locknuts or other
> fastening helper must go in the space between the C-box and the mounting
> flange. My immediate though is to use cross-drilled bolts with washers
> under the heads and nothing behind the flange, wire secured. However I am
> a complete neophyte in aviation matters and I am willing to be educated.
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Anderson" <janderson412@hotmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 4:39 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: revisit alodine subject
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson"
> <janderson412@hotmail.com>
>
> Aluminum alloy has a slight oily coat on it after process. Before
> alodining you must scotbright with water until the water runs off clean
> and doesn't pool. After this, wash the alum and dry, degrease then treat.
> It will go staw colour within minutes. Just light straw is sufficient.
I think I'm past any factory coating but will try again and see. It wouldn't
be a great use to me if it requires a great deal of sanding to use as it's
the inside of the two new spars and I've dragged scotchbrite through there
as much as I ever will already. I may end up following the other
recommendation I've received and slosh epoxy primer through the spar.
Message 34
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| Subject: | Warp Drive mounting |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
I've attached an slightly exploded view of the spinner and hub. (ignore
the title, software picked it) As you can see locknuts would be a little
inconvenient behind the plate. I've sent it to Warpdrive props also for
comment.
> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson"
<janderson412@hotmail.com>
>Not sure that I follow exactly what you have but the prop hub must go
onto
>the prop flange. Then the spinner mounting plate. As mentioned in my
last, I
>have a re-enforcing ring flange on the outer face of the spinner
mounting
>plate.
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Warp Drive mounting |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
Thanks Don, that is exactly what I need.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 5:41 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
> Dave,
> I have probably the same situation as you. My spinner/plate cabe off a
> GSC and I'm using it on the Warp. See attached picture of how mine is
> mounted. Nine #10 screws go through the spinner and into the plate.
>
> Don Smythe
>> From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
>
>> There have been a couple of replies stating this and I'm confused. I have
>> a spinner mounting plate that is about 1/8" thick and 7" diameter. It was
>> originally used with a GSC prop that now hangs in the basement. The
>> spinner attaches with 9 machine screws around it's base. I must mount
>> this
>> between the Warp HPL hub and the mounting flange. After the hub I have
>> the
>> choice of using just washers under the heads of the 8mm bolts or another
>> flange like plate (which has suddenly gone AWOL). Any locknuts or other
>> fastening helper must go in the space between the C-box and the mounting
>> flange. My immediate though is to use cross-drilled bolts with washers
>> under the heads and nothing behind the flange, wire secured. However I am
>> a complete neophyte in aviation matters and I am willing to be educated.
>
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please end! |
Thank you Lowell,
...well said! Too many people out there trying to be the Shell Answer Man...commenting
because they love to hear (see) themselves think.
Dan
Lowell Fitt <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt"
I don't think John is bothered by posts not necessarily in his interest.
The forum is for all our benefit. I read every post even though I don't
have a Subaru, Jabiru or a 582.
What to me, at least,becomes tiresome is posts from some who have no
personal experience in the area of the question and are still quite willing
to give their best guess. This requires some real sorting out and is for
practical purposes extremely burdensom to those that may be asking from a
new to Kitrfox perspective.
Many questions are from people who need real information, sort of like
"facts" - the recent spinner question as an example. The original poster
asked a reasonable question. I didn't respond because my set-up is not the
same as his and didn't want to confuse the issue. That thinking didn't
concern others and one post essentially giving the final answer ended with a
confession that he didn't even have a spinner.
Were I new to Kitfox, I wouldn't find all the various "opinions" helpful. I
would want real info from real people with real experience with MY Issue.
Regarding the pot scrubbers - yes it was beaten to death. Likely every
possible variation of the idea was posted, yet the most widely accepted
reason for the potscrubber in the heat muff, mentioned early on was not
discussed at all, i.e. slowing the air passage through the muff, and whether
more than one would be better than just one.
And regarding LSA. No amount of argument will change anyones mind. We have
our trusted sources for our information, most of them deeply involved in
it's formulation, not just someone who just possibly bought the wrong
airplane and is trying to develop a consensus. Let's all just live with it
and hopefully go on to something else.
One more thing. I am getting the distinct impression that the more vocal
guys on the list now are not builders, but at least second owners of their
Kitfox. Am I wrong in this, I hope so.
I remember the Kitfox list as a source of real help when I was early into
Kitfox. Lately it seems to have become more of a chat room where lots of
posts are just made to fill in an otherwise boring day. The truth really is
out there. Lots of information on Google and other good sources, but then
the facts stop the chat so lets ignore the facts and just chat - lots more
fun for some, I guess.
Maybe I am just getting old or maybe even getting a life, but, I'm sure
getting tired of it all.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lynn Matteson"
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 9:43 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: "maximum takeoff weight" Page by page. Please
end!
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson
>
> Sorry you are bothered by posts that don't reflect your current interests,
> John. But sometimes a thread sparks some interest in someone that wouldn't
> have otherwise been alerted to it. I started the PS (won't say the whole
> words) thread because I had a need to know. By the time it was over (if it
> is), I was getting sick of it too. But thanks to several on this group, I
> now have a successful...I think...heater in my plane. That's the way this
> group is supposed to work. I for one, am sick of reading about setting
> props, and this current "beat the FAA rule" weight issue. I CAN be sick
> of it, because I have a fixed-pitch prop, and I'm willing to fly my plane
> at the weight it was intended, so these topics don't interest me, but I
> can "change channels" as was suggested....or not turn the TV on.
>
> Lynn
> On Sunday, November 5, 2006, at 11:31 AM, john perry wrote:
>> this is getting as stupid as the [ POT SCRUBBERS] .Tired of the drivel
>> and pot scrubbing
>>
>> John Perry
>
>
>
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: radio problem |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: GypsyBeeInnkeepers <hefferans@gmail.com>
Yes and don't forget many of the engineers are also Hams so they
probably just transferred their hobby ideas into their work.
Hey, do you think there's a market for micro air cargo carriers? I can
see it now, Kitfoxes flying little packages to remote customers. :-)
Rex
Colorado
kurt schrader wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: kurt schrader <smokey_bear_40220@yahoo.com>
>
>--- Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no> wrote:
>
>
>
>>Slow-scan TV? Few people know all the weird things
>>hams are doing, like
>>moon bouncing and meteor scatters ... :-)
>>
>>
>
>If I remember correctly, NASA borrowed slow scan from
>the Ham guys, who invented it. NASA stayed with it
>until the digital age for all their space pics. But
>slow scan, like KitFox's and our "improvements", are
>home brew. Many new ideas also come from model
>builders.
>
>We are the leaders, not the followers. :-)
>
>Kurt S.
>
>Do not archive
>
>
Message 38
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|
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.1.2
| Subject: | Re: If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
At 12:32 PM 11/5/2006, you wrote:
>. . .then can I fly without a high-performance endorsement:
>In a retractable gear plane if I don't retract the gear?
>Or fly with more than 200 horsepower if I don't use full throttle?
>Or fly with a constant speed propellor if I don't change the pitch?
>Ben
Ben. Thanks for the laugh. It made my day.
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Do not archive
Message 39
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X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6.2.1.2
| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
At 09:41 AM 11/5/2006, you wrote:
>The actual alodine was completely ineffective however, nothing happened at
>all. I waited ten minutes and nothing.
Dave,
What do you mean by this? Was there no color change whatsoever?
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
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| Subject: | Re: Still Learning |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
At 05:49 PM 11/3/2006, you wrote:
>If your engine rpms with the clutch drop below 2400 the clutch is
>disengaged and you have the equivalent of an engine out. No need to
>actually shut it down.
I guess I just wanted to confirm that was true once so I wouldn't be
surprised in the eventuality.
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson" <janderson412@hotmail.com>
A good tight wod of s/bright through the spar shoud do the job. That's what
I did as I REALLY didn't want the risk of corrosion in that area. I then
added a coat of two pac primer too.
From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: revisit alodine subject
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
----- Original Message ----- From: "John Anderson"
<janderson412@hotmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 4:39 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: revisit alodine subject
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson"
><janderson412@hotmail.com>
>
>Aluminum alloy has a slight oily coat on it after process. Before alodining
>you must scotbright with water until the water runs off clean and doesn't
>pool. After this, wash the alum and dry, degrease then treat. It will go
>staw colour within minutes. Just light straw is sufficient.
I think I'm past any factory coating but will try again and see. It wouldn't
be a great use to me if it requires a great deal of sanding to use as it's
the inside of the two new spars and I've dragged scotchbrite through there
as much as I ever will already. I may end up following the other
recommendation I've received and slosh epoxy primer through the spar.
_________________________________________________________________
Shop til you drop at XtraMSN Shopping http://shopping.xtramsn.co.nz/home/
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| Subject: | John Anderson / EAA Sport Aviation Completions |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Crowder <jimlc@att.net>
John,
I can't read the tail number, but it is yellow with blue trim. The
owner is John Anderson of New Zealand, EAA 0547637. I'd say it's your plane.
Jim Crowder
At 12:54 AM 11/5/2006, you wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson" <janderson412@hotmail.com>
>
>Is it me Jim? ZK-RJA?? Hadn't heard. Takes us a while to get it out
>here in NZ. Rgds, John
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
At 02:07 PM 11/5/2006, you wrote:
>I think I'm past any factory coating but will try again and see. It wouldn't
>be a great use to me if it requires a great deal of sanding to use as it's
>the inside of the two new spars and I've dragged scotchbrite through there
>as much as I ever will already. I may end up following the other
>recommendation I've received and slosh epoxy primer through the spar.
The process you used requires no sanding of bare aluminum. The
acid prep works on any clean aluminum surface leaving it ready for
immediate alodine application. You said the acid prep was energetic so the
surface must have been clean enough. I'm wondering now whether the tubes
are anodized. Did your tubes show the manufacturer's marks on the outside,
indicating specification, type, and temper? Or are they a bright, uniform
silver color?
Finally, has anyone tried acid-prep on a known anodized surface to
see if it looks "active"? Have you then tried alodine on it? What happened?
Given no answer I will henceforth go to my garage and attempt the
experiment myself and report the results.
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Message 44
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| Subject: | Re: Warp Drive mounting |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180
Dave , That looks right. Just use the round crushplate on the
outside of the warp hub then put you bolts through that. I have a E
box and it is tight to get locknuts on but i have them on an no safety
wire. But you can use safety wire if you like. I would not put on
spinner till you all done playing with prop etc. I don't have a spin on
the WARP but I might get one for looks, I doubt you would gain much
with it but who knows, the Kitfox has a huge hole up front and most
likely alot more thant required.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Dave G.
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 5:21 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
I've attached an slightly exploded view of the spinner and hub.
(ignore the title, software picked it) As you can see locknuts would be
a little inconvenient behind the plate. I've sent it to Warpdrive props
also for comment.
> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson"
<janderson412@hotmail.com>
>Not sure that I follow exactly what you have but the prop hub must go
onto
>the prop flange. Then the spinner mounting plate. As mentioned in my
last, I
>have a re-enforcing ring flange on the outer face of the spinner
mounting
>plate.
Message 45
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| Subject: | Re: Warp Drive mounting |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
I should mention that I have the Aluminum hub - 2 parts front and rear
and no the kind with hte plates.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 4:41 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
> Dave,
> I have probably the same situation as you. My spinner/plate cabe off a
> GSC and I'm using it on the Warp. See attached picture of how mine is
> mounted. Nine #10 screws go through the spinner and into the plate.
>
> Don Smythe
>> From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
>
>> There have been a couple of replies stating this and I'm confused. I have
>> a spinner mounting plate that is about 1/8" thick and 7" diameter. It was
>> originally used with a GSC prop that now hangs in the basement. The
>> spinner attaches with 9 machine screws around it's base. I must mount
>> this
>> between the Warp HPL hub and the mounting flange. After the hub I have
>> the
>> choice of using just washers under the heads of the 8mm bolts or another
>> flange like plate (which has suddenly gone AWOL). Any locknuts or other
>> fastening helper must go in the space between the C-box and the mounting
>> flange. My immediate though is to use cross-drilled bolts with washers
>> under the heads and nothing behind the flange, wire secured. However I am
>> a complete neophyte in aviation matters and I am willing to be educated.
>
Message 46
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| Subject: | Re: If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
then can I fly without a high-performance endorsement:
Yes, you may.
61.31 Type rating requirements, additional training, and authorization requirements.
(e) Additional training required for operating complex airplanes. (1) Except as
provided in paragraph (e)(2) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command
of a complex airplane (an airplane that has a retractable landing gear,
flaps, and a controllable pitch propeller; or, in the case of a seaplane, flaps
and a controllable pitch propeller), unless the person has--
(i) Received and logged ground and flight training from an authorized instructor
in a complex airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that
is representative of a complex airplane, and has been found proficient in the
operation and systems of the airplane; and
(ii) Received a one-time endorsement in the pilot's logbook from an authorized
instructor who certifies the person is proficient to operate a complex airplane.
(2) The training and endorsement required by paragraph (e)(1) of this section is
not required if the person has logged flight time as pilot in command of a complex
airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative
of a complex airplane prior to August 4, 1997.
(f) Additional training required for operating high-performance airplanes. (1)
Except as provided in paragraph (f)(2) of this section, no person may act as pilot
in command of a high-performance airplane (an airplane with an engine of
more than 200 horsepower), unless the person has--
(i) Received and logged ground and flight training from an authorized instructor
in a high-performance airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training
device that is representative of a high-performance airplane, and has been found
proficient in the operation and systems of the airplane; and
(ii) Received a one-time endorsement in the pilot's logbook from an authorized
instructor who certifies the person is proficient to operate a high-performance
airplane.
(2) The training and endorsement required by paragraph (f)(1) of this section is
not required if the person has logged flight time as pilot in command of a high-performance
airplane, or in a flight simulator or flight training device that
is representative of a high-performance airplane prior to August 4, 1997.
(k) Exceptions.
.
(2) The rating limitations of this section do not apply to--
(iii) The holder of a pilot certificate when operating an aircraft under the authority
of an experimental or provisional aircraft type certificate;
(v) The holder of a recreational pilot certificate operating under the provisions
of Sec. 61.101(h).
The requirement for an endorsement is NOT required when operation an Experimental
AW aircraft
Your question is completely out of context and is presented in an trolling manner.
The answerer is correct, .....but not what you have been told, so you wont be
convinced of this either.
Steve
--------
Steve: Former Fi-156 'Storch' driver (...talk about folding wings!!!)
New owner, not builder- Kitfox V / 912UL / Warp Dr 3 blade. Thanks to the late
great Ray Mudge, Brighton Mi.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72466#72466
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jerry Liles <wliles@bayou.com>
Some types of "Alodine" do not result in the gold color change. The
metal remains silver colored. Check the 'destructions" that came with
your conversion coating and make certian.
Jerry Liles
Guy Buchanan wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
>
> At 02:07 PM 11/5/2006, you wrote:
>
>> I think I'm past any factory coating but will try again and see. It
>> wouldn't
>> be a great use to me if it requires a great deal of sanding to use as
>> it's
>> the inside of the two new spars and I've dragged scotchbrite through
>> there
>> as much as I ever will already. I may end up following the other
>> recommendation I've received and slosh epoxy primer through the spar.
>
>
> The process you used requires no sanding of bare aluminum. The
> acid prep works on any clean aluminum surface leaving it ready for
> immediate alodine application. You said the acid prep was energetic so
> the surface must have been clean enough. I'm wondering now whether the
> tubes are anodized. Did your tubes show the manufacturer's marks on
> the outside, indicating specification, type, and temper? Or are they a
> bright, uniform silver color?
> Finally, has anyone tried acid-prep on a known anodized
> surface to see if it looks "active"? Have you then tried alodine on
> it? What happened? Given no answer I will henceforth go to my garage
> and attempt the experiment myself and report the results.
>
>
> Guy Buchanan
> K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
>
Message 48
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| Subject: | Re: Warp Drive mounting |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net>
My drawing might have the spinner plate reversed. That is, the flange goes
toward the rear. Not sure without looking. When I installed the GSC
spinner, I had to do a little bit of trimming on the spinner to fit over the
Warp prop.
Don Smythe
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 5:22 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
>
> Thanks Don, that is exactly what I need.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 5:41 PM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
>
>
>> Dave,
>> I have probably the same situation as you. My spinner/plate cabe off
>> a
>> GSC and I'm using it on the Warp. See attached picture of how mine is
>> mounted. Nine #10 screws go through the spinner and into the plate.
>>
>> Don Smythe
>>> From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
>>
>>> There have been a couple of replies stating this and I'm confused. I
>>> have
>>> a spinner mounting plate that is about 1/8" thick and 7" diameter. It
>>> was
>>> originally used with a GSC prop that now hangs in the basement. The
>>> spinner attaches with 9 machine screws around it's base. I must mount
>>> this
>>> between the Warp HPL hub and the mounting flange. After the hub I have
>>> the
>>> choice of using just washers under the heads of the 8mm bolts or another
>>> flange like plate (which has suddenly gone AWOL). Any locknuts or other
>>> fastening helper must go in the space between the C-box and the mounting
>>> flange. My immediate though is to use cross-drilled bolts with washers
>>> under the heads and nothing behind the flange, wire secured. However I
>>> am
>>> a complete neophyte in aviation matters and I am willing to be educated.
>>
>
>
>
Message 49
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Dave and Diane <ddsyverson@comcast.net>
On the issue of the Alodine doing nothing after acid treating. I can't say
that I have tried every Alodine solution out there; however I have found that
at least two different brands behave differently, appearance wise.
1) The traditional stuff which leaves the straw color so a person can see that
something has occurred.
2) The stuff that DOESN'T leave a straw color - in this case, it really looks
like nothing has happened, but I have been told by the manufacturer that is
exactly what one sees - nothing, but that the conversion coating has
occurred.
As others have said - if your acid treatment was obviously active (effervesced
during ythe acid treatment) then it is pretty clear that the aluminum is
clean and that the alodine should "take".
I'd ask the people who sold it to see what they say. I know that it is
sometimes pretty hard to get a knowledgeable answers from counter help at
some stores - possibly ask for a data sheet or a web address where a person
can ask the company reps directly.
In any case, epoxy sloshing after whatever treatment is still a very good
idea.
Good Luck.
DO NOT Archive
Dave S
St Paul, MN
On Sunday 05 November 2006 4:46 pm, Guy Buchanan wrote:
Message 50
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437
Thanks Stan. That Red Dragon unit is probably the best on the planet.
Actually I'm looking for something a bit more portable so that I can
stow it in the baggage compartment for cross country trips. My Soob is
a great engine, but can be a bit temperamental below 35f ambient without
some heat. The Zodi tent heater looks like it just might be what I
need. Still looking at options though so all suggestions will be
appreciated.
Deke
----- Original Message -----
From: Stan Bearup
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 10:54 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Engine Heater
Deke,
Having lived in Alaska for 25 years and having the same needs and
requirements that you mention below for preheating aircraft engines, I
can guarantee that the best engine pre-heater you can get, hands down is
the Red Dragon. You can purchase them from Chief Aircraft and Aircraft
Spruce, or search locally for them as well.
The Red Dragon is fueled from a portable propane bottle, and uses a 12
volt car battery to run the electric operated fan.When used with a
cowling blanket/cover to retain the heat inside the cowling, your engine
will be heated in 30 minutes, or less, depending on the outside air
temp. At -20 F, 30 minutes would do the trick every time up in the
Fairbanks area. Along with the heater unit itself, you will want the 6'
ducting hose that attaches to the end of the heater and is placed up
under the cowling to direct the heat to the engine. I have pasted a
couple of links below for you to check out. Good luck.
Stan
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/eppages/reddragpreheater.php
http://www.chiefaircraft.com/cgi-bin/air/hazel.cgi?client=13204987&acti
on=serve&item=/Aircraft/Accessories/EnginePreheater.html
----- Original Message -----
From: Fox5flyer
To: Kitfox List
Sent: Saturday, November 04, 2006 5:34 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Engine Heater
I'm looking for ideas for an engine heater. Following are the
things it needs to satisfy for my situation.
- First, no electric is available so it must be self sustaining,
but battery power is fine.
- Must be able to heat engine up to at least 75 degrees in a
reasonable time.
- Must be safe with no threat of the open flame torching
anything or shrinking fabric. This doesn't mean it can't have an open
flame. It just needs to be safe.
- Plans built is fine so long as components are readily
available.
- Factory built is fine too if someone has a setup to sell.
- Must be portable.
If anybody has any meaningful suggestions they can contribute I'd
much appreciate it.
If offering to sell me something, please take that off list. Photos
are welcome.
Thanks a bunch,
Deke
S5 in a cold hangar
Message 51
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@i-star.com>
Thanks Tom. That looks like a nice unit. I might just go in that
direction, but still considering options.
Deke
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 8:59 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Engine Heater
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
>
> Deke, I have been thinking that one of those "Tent Heaters" would work as
an engine preheater. You an see an example at
http://www.outdoorsportz.com/OGTHOOOO1001.html
> If you "Do the Google" you will find many examples"
>
> Tom Jones
> Ellensburg, WA
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72366#72366
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Reshrinking fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick" <roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
Thanks I have the Poly-fibre manual and it states that it can be repaired.
If it can be washed clean, patched, shrunk and repainted how is that
differant than just additional shrinking. If the paint goes south I'll wash
it off and squirt it again. I shrunk the tapes into form when I covered it
polybrush and all. My thought of the heat gun was to not trash the paint.
As far as reattatching the fabric, how is that differant from the origional
attachment if washed clean with MEK? Already soaked and removed some seams
today. I can either cut of and glue new fabric to fabric, or just reatatch
to the fuse. Crap not another maximum takeoff weight! Well lots of work
before recoveing. Thanks Ron NB Ore
>From: Dave and Diane <ddsyverson@comcast.net>
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Reshrinking fabric
>Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2006 15:41:12 -0600
>
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Dave and Diane <ddsyverson@comcast.net>
>
>Ron,
>
>Don't be tempted to try something that isn't provided for by the
>manufacturer
>of the fabric covering system.
>
>I don't know what fabric covering system, or what kind of paint is on your
>aircraft - razorback? ceconite? Cotton? Polyfiber? /polytone? aerothane?-
>the
>only thing you can be sure works is what the OEM Mfgr says.
>
>I cannot speak to any of the other systems; my experience is only with
>Polyfiber products. On poly fiber products you never use a heat gun; you
>only
>use a calibrated iron at the correct temperature because you absolutely
>cannot control the tempearature at the fabric with a heat gun.
>
>The repair procedures for polyfiber products DO NOT include trying to
>reshrink
>the fabric with paint and the undercoats on the fabric.
>
>What you need to do is repair or replace the fabric, by the exact procedure
>recommended by the fabric system manufacturer. You will not be happy and
>may
>not be safe if you deviate from the manufacturers recommendations.
>
>One of the cheapest reference books I ever purchased for my project was the
>poly fiber manual. One of the best things I ever did when I was unhappy
>with
>a portion of the fabric job was to rip it off, throw it away and start from
>new - just like the manual says - in the long run you will be a lot happier
>with the result, and you will never have any nagging questions about your
>safety because of the repair.
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Dave S.
>St Paul, MN
>M-7 nosedragger
>
>On Saturday 04 November 2006 6:50 pm, ron schick wrote:
> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "ron schick"
><roncarolnikko@hotmail.com>
> >
> > I need to do some fabric work , and other things, and was wondering if I
> > can use a heat gun to reshrink the painted fabric. I want to unglue
>then
> > reglue as much as possible. Ya not my best landing. Ron NB Ore
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Add a Yahoo! contact to Windows Live Messenger for a chance to win a free
trip!
Message 53
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@i-star.com>
Thanks Lowell. That sounds very similar to the setup that I already tried.
What bothered me was the open flame going up through the pipe and I was too
paranoid to leave it alone for even a few minutes. Also, it was difficult
to control the amount of heat going up the pipe and I caused a small amount
of damage to my belly fabric under the radiator, so I decided that I didn't
like the setup and would look for something more effective and safer.
Draining the oil wouldn't work very well on mine because like the 912 my
Soob has a remote oil sump. The hot oil wouldn't really heat the engine to
ease starting. Still considering options.
Deke
Ps: still waiting for a good day to install the low-fuel sender. Too many
visitors are keeping me too busy with other things. I did manage to see Bob
Dylan in concert the other night at the Palace...
>
> Deke, I remember reading of an Alaska pilot using a length or stove pipe
> fed into the cowl with one of the old fashioned gas fueled "blow torches"
at
> the bottom. They would start if up early and return to their cabin for
> breakfast and oil heating - see below. I suppose a propane torch might
> serve as a modern replacement of the blow torch or even a small multifuel
> camp stove might be best as it could use the aircraft fuel in a pinch. If
a
> fixture was made to center the flame of the propane torch or camp stove, a
> length of flexible aluminum dryer hose could be used as well. this
> conceivably would help move the flame further from the airplane. One
other
> thing they did in extreme conditions is drain the oil, heat it in a pan on
> the stove and return it to the engine hot. These were must fly commercial
> guys.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@i-star.com>
> To: "Kitfox List" <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, November 04, 2006 4:34 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Engine Heater
>
>
> I'm looking for ideas for an engine heater. Following are the things it
> needs to satisfy for my situation.
>
> - First, no electric is available so it must be self sustaining, but
> battery power is fine.
>
> - Must be able to heat engine up to at least 75 degrees in a
reasonable
> time.
>
> - Must be safe with no threat of the open flame torching anything or
> shrinking fabric. This doesn't mean it can't have an open flame. It just
> needs to be safe.
>
> - Plans built is fine so long as components are readily available.
>
> - Factory built is fine too if someone has a setup to sell.
>
> - Must be portable.
>
> If anybody has any meaningful suggestions they can contribute I'd much
> appreciate it.
> If offering to sell me something, please take that off list. Photos are
> welcome.
>
> Thanks a bunch,
> Deke
> S5 in a cold hangar
>
>
Message 54
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| Subject: | John Anderson / EAA Sport Aviation Completions |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson" <janderson412@hotmail.com>
Yep that's it alright Jim. I'll be looking forward to receiving the Nov
issue. Many thanks and trust your back to full fitness.
Regards, John.
From: Jim Crowder <jimlc@att.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: John Anderson / EAA Sport Aviation Completions
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Jim Crowder <jimlc@att.net>
John,
I can't read the tail number, but it is yellow with blue trim. The owner is
John Anderson of New Zealand, EAA 0547637. I'd say it's your plane.
Jim Crowder
At 12:54 AM 11/5/2006, you wrote:
>--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "John Anderson"
><janderson412@hotmail.com>
>
>Is it me Jim? ZK-RJA?? Hadn't heard. Takes us a while to get it out here in
>NZ. Rgds, John
_________________________________________________________________
Become a fitness fanatic @ http://xtramsn.co.nz/health
Message 55
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
Deke,
Check out the small catalytic heater on the link below. This looks like
it would work well for pre-heating, and appears that it would be simple
to adapt a tube to that would feed up beneath the cowling.
Stan
http://www.coleman.com/coleman/colemancom/detail.asp?product_id=5036-85
0&categoryid=3000
Message 56
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
----- Original Message -----
From: "Guy Buchanan" <bnn@nethere.com>
> Dave,
> What do you mean by this? Was there no color change whatsoever?
>
Yup, that's exactly what I found. The spars are the regular 6061-T6 tubes
and the inserts sold by sportplane/kitfox but I have not got to trying them
yet. I was trying the process out on the portion of the insert that got cut
out in forming the "fishmouth". A second attempt this evening after
scrubbing heavily with scotchbrite and warm alodine solution left only a
very slight blue line where the sample broke the surface, nothing else.
Message 57
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
- Some types of "Alodine" do not result in the gold color change. The
> metal remains silver colored. Check the 'destructions" that came with
> your conversion coating and make certian.
>
> Jerry Liles
>
The label clearly indicates that the treated material will be coloured with
a gold hue. I think the NAPA folks got some 'splainin to do.
Message 58
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| Subject: | Re: Engine Heater |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437
Thanks Stan.
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Stan Bearup
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 7:48 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Engine Heater
Deke,
Check out the small catalytic heater on the link below. This looks
like it would work well for pre-heating, and appears that it would be
simple to adapt a tube to that would feed up beneath the cowling.
Stan
http://www.coleman.com/coleman/colemancom/detail.asp?product_id=5036-85
0&categoryid=3000
Message 59
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| Subject: | Re: Reshrinking fabric |
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
Ron,
I had a "Not my best takeoff incident" a few years ago. I had to rebuild the left
wing and replace the bungi truss on my Classic 4. The job ended up being
a lot easier than I first thought it would be.
You do not reshrink the original fabric. You remove fabric you need to do the
airframe repairs. Remove paint, poly spray, and poly brush on only the area of
the old fabric that you poly tack the new fabric to. You shrink only the new
fabric which pulls the old fabric tight also. I'm working from memory of six
years ago on this so may not be exact. I just followed the polyfiber manual
section on repairs.
I cut and removed a section of fabric from about one foot behind the bungi truss
to one foot in front of it from bottom door sill under the belly to the other
bottom door sill.
The only fabric experience I had at the time was covering the plane when I built
it. When I was done with the repair no one could find where it was.
If you used poly tone the paint removal is easy. If it's Aerothane, then it's
a little different, but I think the manual has it covered.
This may sound strange but while making the repairs I found that I really enjoy
the building process.
Tom Jones
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72495#72495
Message 60
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| Subject: | Re: Warp Drive mounting |
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
I think it depends on the spinner. It seems not all are mounted the same.
My Warp spinner mounting plate, at least I think it was from Warp as it came
with the prop from Skystar, is mounted last (forward of the prop hub) as
the flange for the actual spinner mounting is tapered aft with cutouts for
the prop blades.
The squash plate, I think, is primarily used for the wood props. My set-up
came with one, but the bolts shipped were too short for installation of the
plate. I decided that the plate was something for the Misc Kitfox Box if
using the Warp prop.
The former is as it is, the latter is an opinion.
----- Original Message -----
From: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 4:00 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
>
> Dave says
> > If I had a spinner --it would go HUB - spinner backing plate -
> > HPL
> hub - 1/8 inch plate - then 8mm bolts with washers under the head ....
> Hope this helps you and I would call Warp to verify all this rambling.
> Dave
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 6:36 AM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Warp Drive mounting
>
>
>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Dave G." <occom@ns.sympatico.ca>
>>
>>> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "dave" <dave@cfisher.com>
>>> >
>>> > Dave.
>>> >
>>> > The mounting plate goes on outside of hub.
>>> >
>>
>> There have been a couple of replies stating this and I'm confused. I have
>> a spinner mounting plate that is about 1/8" thick and 7" diameter. It was
>> originally used with a GSC prop that now hangs in the basement. The
>> spinner attaches with 9 machine screws around it's base. I must mount
>> this between the Warp HPL hub and the mounting flange. After the hub I
>> have the choice of using just washers under the heads of the 8mm bolts or
>> another flange like plate (which has suddenly gone AWOL). Any locknuts or
>> other fastening helper must go in the space between the C-box and the
>> mounting flange. My immediate though is to use cross-drilled bolts with
>> washers under the heads and nothing behind the flange, wire secured.
>> However I am a complete neophyte in aviation matters and I am willing to
>> be educated.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 61
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| Subject: | Re: If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . |
At 03:18 PM 11/5/2006, you wrote:
>then can I fly without a high-performance endorsement:
>
>Yes, you may.
>
>61.31 Type rating requirements, additional training, and authorization
>requirements.
Wow. That's a loophole you can drive a truck through! No requirements for
complex, HP, pressurized, type specific, or tailwheel endorsements if it's
an experimental. Who would have thunk it. Not even type ratings. I can go
buy a 737, modify it, certify it experimental, and go fly it anywhere I
want with PP rating with no endorsements or training whatsoever! Amazing!
Guy Buchanan
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Do not archive
Message 62
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| Subject: | Re: revisit alodine subject |
What I found when I did the same thing several years ago was that if
I acid washed only, as inside the spars, that I tended to only get a
small color change. If I was able to rub the aluminum with the
Scotch pads, I would get a stronger color change. And if I first
treated with out being able to give the completely rub with the
Scotch pad, a later rubbing with the pad still failed to produce the
strong color change. I was told at the time that the amount of
treatment first given was sufficient to protect the metal from
further treatment, and that I should then consider the metal as
treated even though I had not gotten the golden or dark brown result
I got in other cases.
Jim Crowder
At 05:57 PM 11/5/2006, you wrote:
>>Dave,
>> What do you mean by this? Was there no color change whatsoever?
>
>Yup, that's exactly what I found. The spars are the regular 6061-T6
>tubes and the inserts sold by sportplane/kitfox but I have not got
>to trying them yet. I was trying the process out on the portion of
>the insert that got cut out in forming the "fishmouth". A second
>attempt this evening after scrubbing heavily with scotchbrite and
>warm alodine solution left only a very slight blue line where the
>sample broke the surface, nothing else.
Message 63
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| Subject: | Re: If Steve is right about LSA rules. . . |
Nice try, wouldnt work.
If that is your reason for applying for an experimental AW cert, you would not
be issued one. And you must state your reason during application.
21.191 Experimental certificates.
Experimental certificates are issued for the following purposes:
(a) Research and development. aircraft.
(b) Showing compliance with regulations.
(c) Crew training. .
(d) Exhibition.
(e) Air racing.
(f) Market surveys.
g) Operating amateur-built aircraft.
Dont think its amateur-built,
Dont see just cruzing around there.
There are no loop-holes, and I didnt say there were.
Like the ARMY recruitment commercial on TV. Its the FAA.
steve
--------
Steve: Former Fi-156 'Storch' driver (...talk about folding wings!!!)
New owner, not builder- Kitfox V / 912UL / Warp Dr 3 blade. Thanks to the late
great Ray Mudge, Brighton Mi.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72517#72517
Message 64
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| Subject: | Re: Reshrinking fabric |
Thanks Tom yes I am enjoying the repair as it is simple compared to the
build. Also the MEK makes the proccess more fun, at the expense of brain
cells. I will need to replace some fabric below the pilot door, but hope to
limit my area. Ron NB Ore
do not archive
>From: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Reshrinking fabric
>Date: Sun, 5 Nov 2006 17:40:37 -0800
>
>
>Ron,
>I had a "Not my best takeoff incident" a few years ago. I had to rebuild
>the left wing and replace the bungi truss on my Classic 4. The job ended
>up being a lot easier than I first thought it would be.
>
>You do not reshrink the original fabric. You remove fabric you need to do
>the airframe repairs. Remove paint, poly spray, and poly brush on only the
>area of the old fabric that you poly tack the new fabric to. You shrink
>only the new fabric which pulls the old fabric tight also. I'm working
>from memory of six years ago on this so may not be exact. I just followed
>the polyfiber manual section on repairs.
>
>I cut and removed a section of fabric from about one foot behind the bungi
>truss to one foot in front of it from bottom door sill under the belly to
>the other bottom door sill.
>
>The only fabric experience I had at the time was covering the plane when I
>built it. When I was done with the repair no one could find where it was.
>
>If you used poly tone the paint removal is easy. If it's Aerothane, then
>it's a little different, but I think the manual has it covered.
>
>This may sound strange but while making the repairs I found that I really
>enjoy the building process.
>
>Tom Jones
>Ellensburg, WA
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=72495#72495
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
All-in-one security and maintenance for your PC. Get a free 90-day trial!
Message 65
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| Subject: | Re: radio problem |
Cross fertilization is one of the main benefits of
this list. That is how I ended up with a boat compass
and starter switch on my Fox. The boat compass
adjusted out the bad magnetism of the panel area, and
the boat starter switch has a "push to prime" function
making that a one hand operation. Learned it
here.....
I grew up with a 2 meter home made antenna on the roof
(as well as a few other bands) of a home made house.
My father taught me to "git-er-done".
>From this list I learned things that made my Fox
better and safer. I truely believe people here have
saved lives thru prevention of costly mistakes and
honest sharing of lessons learned.
We are dreamers and sometimes get off track, but it
all seems to educate us for the better. Like Lowell,
I try to read everything and I learn. I may not have
the same engine, raido, etc, but a good idea often
comes from different sources.
We just need to keep it civil and real.
Starting with this subject "radio problem", a number
of well, and sometimes self educated people will toss
around ideas and get to the right answer eventually.
But lets try not to confuse the answer.
I remember Don S. and his surging engine problem
costing him a bunch in time, money and frustration.
If we could have been there and seen it happen just
once, many of us would have known it was the clutch
right off and saved Don a bunch. For most people this
list does make the save. Don S. is one of the hero's
in our favor, even if we didn't get it correct right
off for him, he has been there for us.
As with hangar talk, sometimes I have to walk away,
but I am right back here almost every day to learn...
-------------------------------------------------
Working for UPS, I used to fly Louisville, Omaha,
Cedar rapids, Louisville flights. A Cessna 4xx would
race us to Cedar Rapids every night with half a dozen
boxes for us to haul out. Sometimes it would get down
to only 2 boxes. Eventually the 4xx was canceled, but
it showed that there was still business for the little
planes too.
UPS started as West Coast boys on bikes. Now it hauls
6% of the US GNP. Certainly "Flying FoxCars" isn't
beyond reality. :-)
Kurt S. S-5 (my other plane)
Do not archive
--- GypsyBeeInnkeepers <hefferans@gmail.com> wrote:
> Yes and don't forget many of the engineers are also
> Hams so they
> probably just transferred their hobby ideas into
> their work.
> Hey, do you think there's a market for micro air
> cargo carriers? I can
> see it now, Kitfoxes flying little packages to
> remote customers. :-)
> Rex
> Colorado
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