Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:29 AM - Re: First Flight (skyring)
2. 02:44 AM - Re: Re: AD's question for airworthy cert (Floyd Johnson)
3. 03:06 AM - Re: AD's question for airworthy cert (84KF)
4. 03:28 AM - Bleeding brakes (QSS)
5. 03:42 AM - Re: Bleeding brakes (D. Fisher)
6. 04:06 AM - Re: Re: AD's question for airworthy cert (Clem Nichols)
7. 05:11 AM - Re: Re: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum (fox5flyer)
8. 06:04 AM - E-Mail or Website? Off Topic (Noel Loveys)
9. 06:19 AM - Re: Bleeding brakes (Cudnohufsky's)
10. 06:49 AM - Re: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum (Cudnohufsky's)
11. 07:57 AM - Bleeding brakes (Floyd Johnson)
12. 08:05 AM - Re: AD's question for airworthy cert (akflyer)
13. 08:25 AM - Re: Off topic Garbled e-mail from 84KF (me) (Rexinator)
14. 08:28 AM - Re: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum (Noel Loveys)
15. 08:29 AM - Re: 912ULS heavy duty starter ? (alnanarthur)
16. 09:36 AM - Re: AD's question for airworthy cert (84KF)
17. 09:42 AM - Re: AD's question for airworthy cert (84KF)
18. 09:43 AM - Re: Weight & Balance issues (kenneth schooley)
19. 10:16 AM - Re: Off topic Garbled e-mail from 84KF (me) (Michael Gibbs)
20. 10:51 AM - 912ULS sprag clutch problems ? (alnanarthur)
21. 11:02 AM - Cooling Question (Cudnohufsky's)
22. 12:04 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (Lowell Fitt)
23. 12:30 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (D. Fisher)
24. 12:32 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (D. Fisher)
25. 12:48 PM - airframe gross wtg (DEAN TINAGLIA)
26. 02:03 PM - Resin WAS: wingtip crack (Michel Verheughe)
27. 02:11 PM - Re: 912ULS sprag clutch problems ? (Clint Bazzill)
28. 02:41 PM - New Product Stops Rotax Kickbacks on Starting (Mark Burton)
29. 02:52 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (Lowell Fitt)
30. 03:03 PM - Re: Resin WAS: wingtip crack (Lowell Fitt)
31. 03:40 PM - Re: Cooling Question (Michael Logan)
32. 04:01 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (Noel Loveys)
33. 04:08 PM - Source code in posts - Off topic (Noel Loveys)
34. 04:36 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (dwight purdy)
35. 04:53 PM - Re: Weight & Balance issues (Roger McConnell)
36. 05:12 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (Noel Loveys)
37. 05:17 PM - Re: Source code in posts - Off topic (Don Smythe)
38. 06:10 PM - Re: Resin WAS: wingtip crack (Noel Loveys)
39. 06:24 PM - Re: Resin WAS: wingtip crack (Noel Loveys)
40. 06:45 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (Don Smythe)
41. 06:55 PM - Re: Source code in posts - Off topic (john perry)
42. 07:00 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (john perry)
43. 07:05 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (84KF)
44. 07:07 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (john perry)
45. 07:43 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (Noel Loveys)
46. 07:51 PM - Re: Source code in posts - Off topic (akflyer)
47. 09:14 PM - Re: Bleeding brakes (84KF)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: First Flight |
David, congratulations. That makes two S5 912ULS to fly this week. Ours flew here
in Austria on Wednesday. It will be interesting to compare some figures. I
will post when the test flying is a little more advanced. We are still having
some niggling engine problems but hope to get it sorted soon. Kerry
Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101179#101179
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: AD's question for airworthy cert |
Clem,
Just for varification, only the builder with a repairmans certificate
issued for his plane can work on it and he cannot work on
any other airplanes. A certified FAA A&E is the only other person who is
authorized to work on experimental or certified aircraft. Floyd
> [Original Message]
> From: Clem Nichols <cnichols@scrtc.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Date: 3/16/2007 9:57:17 PM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: AD's question for airworthy cert
>
>
> Re: ELSA repairman's certificate
>
> All you need to get the repairman's certificate (which enables you to do
the
> annual inspection on your own ELSA plane) is to successfully complete the
16
> hour course. The 2 or 3 week course enables you to inspect and work on
your
> SLSA plane. As I understand it, anyone, certificate or not, can work on
any
> experimental plane.
>
> Clem Nichols
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "dcsfoto" <david@kelm.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 6:56 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: AD's question for airworthy cert
>
>
> >
> > First the AD Biweekly changes every two weeks. Yes ADs do not apply to
our
> > type aircraft but the FAA wants that block filled in on the Form 8130-6.
> > will look like "2007-06"
> > S-SLA must be built from a kit, that the mfg has built and certified at
> > least one aircraft.
> > E-LSA is called the "wild west" it is what the "fat" ultralights that
are
> > not 51%
> > built are using.
> > S-SLA have 2" LIGHT SPORT placards.
> > E-LSA has 2" EXPERIMENTAL placards that is the easy way to tell
diferance.
> > Go E-LSA if you did not build the and want to get a repairmans
> > certificate
> > all you need to do is go to a short ( 2 or 3 weeks ) school and get a
> > E-LSA repairmans cert.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101128#101128
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: AD's question for airworthy cert |
"A certified FAA A&E is the only other person who is
authorized to work on experimental or certified aircraft"
Anybody else want to address this? [Wink]
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101186#101186
Message 4
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Hi guys, can someone tell me what the best was is to bleed matco brakes.
For some reason I have two different types. The pilot side has the 2 x
MC-1 and the starboard side has 2 x MC-3.
Regards
Graeme
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
Graeme, I have not done dual system like that but if it plumbed lilke
this
http://matco.elixirlabs.com/users/matco/images/mastercylinder21a.jpg
I would do it as a single systems below.
http://matco.elixirlabs.com/users/matco/images/PRESS_BLEED.jpg
Looks like the reserviors are on the left side .
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: QSS
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 6:25 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
Hi guys, can someone tell me what the best was is to bleed matco
brakes. For some reason I have two different types. The pilot side has
the 2 x MC-1 and the starboard side has 2 x MC-3.
Regards
Graeme
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: AD's question for airworthy cert |
Floyd:
I don't know if it applies to all experimental airplanes or just to
experimental light sport aircraft, but I was taught in the 16 hour LS1
repairman course I attended that an ELSA "can be maintained by anybody".
The annual condition inspection must be done by an A&P or the owner as a
light-sport repairman with an "inspection" rating. I can work on and do the
annual inspection on my own ELSA, but not on someone elses. Nor can I do
the initial inspection in order to obtain an airworthiness certificate. I
don't have the time right now to try and look it up in the fed regs, but
will try later this weekend.
Clem
----- Original Message -----
From: "Floyd Johnson" <kitfox69@earthlink.net>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 4:43 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: AD's question for airworthy cert
> <kitfox69@earthlink.net>
>
> Clem,
>
> Just for varification, only the builder with a repairmans certificate
> issued for his plane can work on it and he cannot work on
> any other airplanes. A certified FAA A&E is the only other person who is
> authorized to work on experimental or certified aircraft. Floyd
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Clem Nichols <cnichols@scrtc.com>
>> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>> Date: 3/16/2007 9:57:17 PM
>> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: AD's question for airworthy cert
>>
>>
>> Re: ELSA repairman's certificate
>>
>> All you need to get the repairman's certificate (which enables you to do
> the
>> annual inspection on your own ELSA plane) is to successfully complete the
> 16
>> hour course. The 2 or 3 week course enables you to inspect and work on
> your
>> SLSA plane. As I understand it, anyone, certificate or not, can work on
> any
>> experimental plane.
>>
>> Clem Nichols
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "dcsfoto" <david@kelm.com>
>> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 6:56 PM
>> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: AD's question for airworthy cert
>>
>>
>> >
>> > First the AD Biweekly changes every two weeks. Yes ADs do not apply to
> our
>> > type aircraft but the FAA wants that block filled in on the Form
>> > 8130-6.
>> > will look like "2007-06"
>> > S-SLA must be built from a kit, that the mfg has built and certified at
>> > least one aircraft.
>> > E-LSA is called the "wild west" it is what the "fat" ultralights that
> are
>> > not 51%
>> > built are using.
>> > S-SLA have 2" LIGHT SPORT placards.
>> > E-LSA has 2" EXPERIMENTAL placards that is the easy way to tell
> diferance.
>> > Go E-LSA if you did not build the and want to get a repairmans
>> > certificate
>> > all you need to do is go to a short ( 2 or 3 weeks ) school and get a
>> > E-LSA repairmans cert.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Read this topic online here:
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101128#101128
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum |
Emails like this coming from new guys makes me roll my eyes, especially
early in the morning before I finish my cup of coffee. "actual Kitfox List
web site"? "the List site is only way to go"?
First off Steve, I appreciate your input. You seem like a fairly well
informed guy, but Jim is right. You are having a configuration problem with
your mailer, or perhaps it's the method you use to copy/paste. It isn't the
other 500 people here, but you're making it their problem. Your emails are
the only ones coming as Jim Crowder described. You've been told about it
before, but apparently ignored it.
Second, if there is an "actual Kitfox List web site" it would be
Sportflight.com. Matronics is a mail server.
And third, your opinion about "the List site viewing is only way to go" is
noted, but what you don't seem to understand is that this list has been
around for close to 20 years, gone through several mail list servers, and
still has many of us old timers hanging on, as well as some charter members
who kind of like the email version of the list. When we changed to Matt
Dralle's Matronics server about two years ago there was no forum at that
time, but was added about a year or so ago as an option. What is happening
is that many new members are taking the forum option because they aren't
aware of the email option and we're getting a mix of forum and email,
probably in the neighborhood of 20/80. One of the big problems with the
forum version is that for the 80 percent of us using the email version is
that we often don't know what the forum contributor is talking about because
he/she usually doesn't quote any part of the message they're responding to.
Not a huge problem, but definitely an annoyance.
Please check your configuration settings and set them to plain text so that
we don't have to sift through all the html codes. A lot of us would
appreciate it.
Deke Morisse
List Janitor/Manager/Administrator/whatever...
> Sorry... I do realize that my post may show up somewhat "corrupted" when
read through misc. e-mail clients. All I can say is when viewed using the
actual Kitfox List web site
http://forums.matronics.com/viewforum.php?f=8&sid=83b6acbe5602af72d6c023eab4688518
> all will be right and legible.
> I sometimes compose using Microsoft works, then cut and paste to the List
Message Body window, and this might be a cause of corrupted e-mail. It does
not affect the List site viewing.
>
> I post right to the site, and forget that others receive through e-mail.
While I regret the e-mail corruption, it is not my intention to send e-mail
to every viewerreader. IMHO, the List site is the only way to go.
> Thanks for the input.
> Steve
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101168#101168
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | E-Mail or Website? Off Topic |
I figured I would start this off. Do not Archive... Put that in before I
forget.
I use the e-mail to read most of the posts. My E-Mail client is Microsoft
Outlook. It allows me to down load all the headers from the server(s) and
decide what I want to download and what I want to delete from the server.
As a result if I get any SPAM or files I consider too large for my slow dial
up connection, the only one I can blame is myself. Some times large E-mails
sit for days on the server before I down load them.
I do use the web site for doing searches on specific topics.
Noel
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
Graeme,
Do not know if it is the best but it worked very well for me. I used a
12 volt fuel pump, hooked it to a gal jug with brake fluid in it and the
other end to the bleeder on the brake. I also had the top plug of the
brake fluid reservoir replaced with a hose barb and hose that went back
to the gal jug. I would bump the fuel pump on and off while I worked the
brake until there were no more air bubbles in the line. (Leaving the
fuel pump I was using "on" all the time would pop the line off the brake
bleader, a smaller pressure pump would have been better but it was what
I had). Then do the same on the other side. My Matcos would weep at the
seals and I would have to re-bleed them every couple months or they
would get squishy.
Lloyd
----- Original Message -----
From: QSS
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 4:25 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
Hi guys, can someone tell me what the best was is to bleed matco
brakes. For some reason I have two different types. The pilot side has
the 2 x MC-1 and the starboard side has 2 x MC-3.
Regards
Graeme
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum |
All,
I bought a Model 5 that was ground looped and needed to be repaired. In
doing so I removed everything from the frame to repair, only place I found
rust / corrosion was on the cross members under the floor boards, the area
had been stuffed with insulation and was retaining moisture. Might be worth
removing the floor boards during annual inspections for those that have
never pulled them.
My 2 cents worth.
Lloyd
* Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 1 Thes. 5:21 *
----- Original Message -----
From: "n85ae" <n85ae@yahoo.com>
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 10:04 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum
>
> Just to stir up the corrosion pot again.
>
> For what it's worth. I screwed some bare aluminum pieces (6061) to
> the back fence about 6 years ago as a sanity check when building my
> plane.
>
> Through sun and dark, acid rain, sleet, hail, you name it. There's no
> sign of any corrosion whatsoever ... I live in Chicago, so we do have
> bad weather.
>
> The only corrosion on my Kitfox has been a tiny bit on the landing gear
> plates, and the engine mount where some powder coat got chipped off.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101021#101021
>
>
>
Message 11
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|
A trick I learned, while I was on the Maintinance Committee for my Flying club,
was to run a piece of clear plastic oxygen hose from the bleeder at the brake,
and back to the filler on the resiuvoir (sp). Just pump the brake pedal and
the air will exit the end of the hose, while the fluid returns to the tank. Simple
and works like a charm. Oh, and don't use the hose for your oxygen after
bleeding your brakes. He! He!.
Floyd Johnson
kitfox69@earthlink.net
EarthLink Revolves Around You.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: AD's question for airworthy cert |
[quote="kitfox69(at)earthlink.net"]Clem,
Just for varification, only the builder with a repairmans certificate
issued for his plane can work on it and he cannot work on
any other airplanes. A certified FAA A&E is the only other person who is
authorized to work on experimental or certified aircraft. Floyd
Not quite right...Anyone including your 5 year old kid could work on an expiremental
plane.. However, only the person holding the repairmans certificate (original
builder) or any A&P can sign off on the condition inspection.
--------
Leni
Avid C W/582
1260 full lotus
.......DO NOT ARCHIVE.....
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101220#101220
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Off topic Garbled e-mail from 84KF (me) |
I don't think it has been mentioned that the main problem is the
"quotation marks" and some other special charadcters when pasted from an
HTML source. If you only read messages on the forum you may not
understand the complaint. They are not being displayed correctly and
they look like this: . It's distracting when you try to read the
quoted text.
Example:
In experimental certificate, the word
experimental indicates that there is no known standard for
the design or production of the aircraft.
I think it's worth noting that the forum is much slower for some dialup
users and some of us don't have the option of high speed (unless we go
$atellite). I live in a rural area and dialup never gets faster than
maybe 28Kbps. It's just the nature of the phone service out in the
boonies until fiber optics replaces all copper wires. Additionally plain
text email naturally eliminates virus problems and you can choose to
reject attachments. Attachments can really slow down your email
downloads with rural service. That can be a significant consideration.
My point is; dialup and the simplicity/security of the standard email
list is preferable and even necessary to some of us. The option of the
forum improves the experience for those who want the bells and whistles,
but we all want the text to be clear as intended.
Rexinator
Colorado
BTW, I recently upgraded to DSL with a personal wireless network so I'm
able to enjoy the forum also. I just know how bad it can be and I still
prefer to get my kitfox messages as email.
do not archive
84KF wrote:
>
>I'm sorry that some e-mail clients do not reproduce some postings in the original
format as written. If there is a problem with reading postings using e-mail
as an elected source, (signed up for it..) then go right to the source...
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewforum.php?f=8&sid=83b6acbe5602af72d6c023eab4688518
>The ability to accent and highlight statements is provided here, but when these
benefits are used, it does mess up e-mails.
>
>I will (again) try to remember that not all use the 'site', but I see using the
'site' as the best source..., as originally intended..
>
>Steve
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Corrosion Protecting Aluminum |
Sounds like the previous owner wanted to fly a house.
You said the area was, "stuffed". I expect that means it was fibre glass
batt insulation. That would be the problem with retaining moisture, no air
could circulate with the batts there.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Cudnohufsky's
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 12:19 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum
>
>
> <7suds@chartermi.net>
>
> All,
> I bought a Model 5 that was ground looped and needed to be
> repaired. In
> doing so I removed everything from the frame to repair, only
> place I found
> rust / corrosion was on the cross members under the floor
> boards, the area
> had been stuffed with insulation and was retaining moisture.
> Might be worth
> removing the floor boards during annual inspections for those
> that have
> never pulled them.
> My 2 cents worth.
> Lloyd
> * Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 1 Thes. 5:21 *
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "n85ae" <n85ae@yahoo.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 10:04 AM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum
>
>
> >
> > Just to stir up the corrosion pot again.
> >
> > For what it's worth. I screwed some bare aluminum pieces (6061) to
> > the back fence about 6 years ago as a sanity check when building my
> > plane.
> >
> > Through sun and dark, acid rain, sleet, hail, you name it.
> There's no
> > sign of any corrosion whatsoever ... I live in Chicago, so
> we do have
> > bad weather.
> >
> > The only corrosion on my Kitfox has been a tiny bit on the
> landing gear
> > plates, and the engine mount where some powder coat got chipped off.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101021#101021
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: 912ULS heavy duty starter ? |
Clint, Randy and all,
Thanks for your reply. I have been using Clint's starting procedure
with success for some time but slowly
over some months it has been getting harder and harder to start.
When cranking with ignition switches on, it seems to fire once and
then the prop abruptly stops and unless
I release the starter, it continues cranking and then repeats this
several times. Then the carbs start to
overflow due to the shaking and the engine appears to be flooded.
I'm concerned that I may have a worn or defective sprag clutch. If
that is the case I'll have to pull the
engine and have it repaired ( big $$$ ). Then, I might as well go
for the heavy duty starter.
Maybe John Mcbean can modify my engine mount, or maybe a Series 7
engine mount might fit.
On Mar 16, 2007, at 12:28 PM, Randy Daughenbaugh wrote:
> <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
>
> Allan,
> I had to modify (Actually Skystar did it for me!) my motor mount in
> order to
> use the heavy duty starter. I suspect that you will need the
> modification.
>
> In the absence of other problems, I think you should consider Clint's
> advice.
>
> Randy Series 5/7 912S
>
> .
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> alnanarthur
> Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 9:38 AM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: 912ULS heavy duty starter ?
>
> <alnanarthur@sbcglobal.net>
>
> List,
>
> I have a Kitfox 5 with an early 912ULS engine which does not have the
> heavy duty starter.
>
> Can anyone tell me the dimensions of the heavy duty starter.
>
> I have only about 1/2 in. clearance between the back of my present
> starter and one of the
> engine mount tubes.
>
>
> Allan Arthur
> Kitfox 5, N40AA
> Rotax 912ULS, Warpdrive 3 blade
> Byron Airport, CA (C83) Hanger C8
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: AD's question for airworthy cert |
Gentlemen,
Answers to who may perform maintenance and required inspections involving
ELSA, SLSA, and Amateur-built is found on page 44779 of the Final Rule. Get it
from AOPA website. I would post it here, but don't want to ruffle feathers.
Maintenance....Preventive Maintenance ... 2 different terms.
To find the items included under 'preventive maintenance' go to FAR 43, appendix
A.
For more 'preventive maintenance' info on SLSA, go to FAR 43.3g,
The 'new guy' (ya, right.)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101229#101229
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: AD's question for airworthy cert |
BTW....."Anyone including your 5 year old kid could work on an expiremental plane..
However, only the person holding the repairmans certificate (original builder)
or any A&P can sign off on the condition inspection."
100%correct
Steve
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101230#101230
Message 18
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| Subject: | Weight & Balance issues |
Hi John,
Wts. as follows...R. Main 322
L. Main 310
Nose 170
Kitfox Vixen 912, GSC three blade
If you have any more questions please let me know...............Ken
>From: <josandt@verizon.net>
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kitfox-List: Weight & Balance issues
>Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2007 20:07:20 -0500 (CDT)
>
>
>Is anyone out there with a tri-gear willing to share the recorded weights
>of their three wheels? Two main gear weights and the nosegear weight. Your
>assistance in sharing these weights would help me assess the viability of
>my current "rough" setup. I just need a frame of reference for GENERAL
>weight adjustment. Not planning on using the info for final weight and
>balance issues! Would certainly appeciate anyone's help. I also think this
>would be very useful info for anyone building a trigear. Does anyone have
>this kind of info on file? If so, please indicate which model/series you
>own. It would be helpful to me because I have major weight/balance issues
>caused by addition of Corvair engine/BRS chute/special manifold mods/etc.
>John Sandt
>
>Series 7 Sport / Corvair / BRS / Tri-gear / under construction
>
>
_________________________________________________________________
Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon.
http://games.msn.com/en/flexicon/default.htm?icid=flexicon_hmemailtaglinemarch07
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Off topic Garbled e-mail from 84KF (me) |
Steve sez:
>I will (again) try to remember that not all use the 'site', but I
>see using the 'site' as the best source..., as originally intended..
Your historical sense is off considerably. This had been an e-mail
list for a decade before the web-based features that Matronics offers
came on-line. As Jim Crowder mentioned, many subscribers do take
advantage of the web site features but others find them considerably
less convenient than plain old e-mail and seldom use them.
There have been discussions in the past over postings that are too
much trouble to read and many members have come up with a simple and
effective solution--delete them without reading them. Presumably,
the point of posting a message is to communicate your ideas to a
large group of people, so it makes sense to be as inclusive as
possible when doing so, doesn't it? Using plain text when posting is
a simple way to accomplish that objective.
Mike
Message 20
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| Subject: | 912ULS sprag clutch problems ? |
List,
Has any Rotax 912 series engine users had sprag clutch problems?
I am having starting problems and am beginning to suspect the sprag
clutch.
I would appreciate any insight on this problem.
I expect that the 912ULS would stress this part more than the 80
hp 912.
I had early problems shaking off the carbs on start-up and shut-down
with this
engine until I added side springs to each carb and had the the
gearbox modified
to add the 30 deg. slipper clutch.
I got one of the first 912ULS engines from Skystar. I hope that I'm
not breaking new ground with this problem.
Allan Arthur
Kitfox 5, N40AA
Rotax 912ULS, Warpdrive 3 blade
Byron Airport, CA (C83) Hanger C8
Message 21
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| Subject: | Cooling Question |
All,
I am in the process of repiaring my damaged 5 and am reinstalling the
cooling system for the engine. Previous owner was using a heater core under
the instrument panel with a small fan for cabin heat. It was plumbed in
parrallel into the system with a shutoff valve ahead of the heater core,
that plumbing was plugged off when I recieved it so I conclude he was having
problems with it flowing and disconnected it from the system. The in / out
on the heater core is slightly smaller than the rest of the system and also
has a restrictor plug in one end and I suspect that was his problem, if he
opend the valve to the heater core it would not flow very well because the
fluid would take the path of least resistance across the parallel route. My
thought was to remove the restrictor plug, again plumb in parallel but put
the shut off in the parallel bypass instead of the heater core thus forcing
the coolant through the heater core, but since the heater core is smaller
dia connections I would have to limit the shut oof so I would not be able to
completley close off the bypass. That's my thinking, has anyone tried this
and had success or failure? Anyone out there running a heater core for cabin
heat? Any thoughts on how to best hook up the system?
Lloyd
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
Graeme, the way it was recommended to me as I was building is to use a
lever type pump oil can, fill it with the brake fluid and using a short
length of plastic tubing connect it to the bleed fittings on the caliper and
pump away. Monitor the reservoirs.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "QSS" <msm@byterocky.net>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 2:25 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
Hi guys, can someone tell me what the best was is to bleed matco brakes. For
some reason I have two different types. The pilot side has the 2 x MC-1 and
the starboard side has 2 x MC-3.
Regards
Graeme
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
Lowell,
Yup same here and if his setup is the same as the pic I sent earlier then
that explains why they are different from left to right. The one side would
have the reservoir in it and the other it just flows through as you pump the
fluid through.
One should add that MIL SPEC fluid only should be used.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 3:03 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
>
> Graeme, the way it was recommended to me as I was building is to use a
> lever type pump oil can, fill it with the brake fluid and using a short
> length of plastic tubing connect it to the bleed fittings on the caliper
> and pump away. Monitor the reservoirs.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "QSS" <msm@byterocky.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 2:25 AM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
>
>
> Hi guys, can someone tell me what the best was is to bleed matco brakes.
> For some reason I have two different types. The pilot side has the 2 x
> MC-1 and the starboard side has 2 x MC-3.
> Regards
> Graeme
>
>
>
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
Floyd, That might work on a application with the bleeders pointed up
but with the bleeder at the bottom of caliper I think you woudl find it
hard to get all the air out.
Air in system equals a spongy pedal.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Floyd Johnson
To: Kitfox-List
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 10:57 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
A trick I learned, while I was on the Maintinance Committee for my
Flying club, was to run a piece of clear plastic oxygen hose from the
bleeder at the brake, and back to the filler on the resiuvoir (sp). Just
pump the brake pedal and the air will exit the end of the hose, while
the fluid returns to the tank. Simple and works like a charm. Oh, and
don't use the hose for your oxygen after bleeding your brakes. He! He!.
Floyd Johnson
kitfox69@earthlink.net
EarthLink Revolves Around You.
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | airframe gross wtg |
Question ..Was the Classic 4 (2003) airframe a basic 1400 or 1550 GW
WTG, three items had to be installed , to qualify as I recall, wood
gusset on both sides of seat in tube frame and metal cover over carry
thru rear over head tube connecting wing spar (rear)attachment.....any
thoughts, ....want the 1320 G W for sport license, and now is 1200 GW
Message 26
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| Subject: | Resin WAS: wingtip crack |
On Mar 16, 2007, at 9:51 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> Boat construction as you said uses a lot more resin.
It may be so, Noel, but do you have some figures? The way I understand
it is that GRP (Glassfiber Reinforced Plastic) construction where the
resin used is polyester, requires 70% of glassfiber and 30% of
polyester. Less resin and the glassfiber won't be enough impregnated.
More resin and it won't help strength more than an extra coat of
topcoat would.
Those are not my figures but those from engineers working for reputable
certification societies such as Lloyds of London.
Admittedly many "home-building" yachtsmen will use more resin than
necessary, but that could also happen with a home-building airman,
couldn't it?
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
Message 27
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| Subject: | 912ULS sprag clutch problems ? |
Allan,
Contact me off line, will give you some free good advise about 912ULS
engines. Had mine since 2000. Clint (650) 712-1802
From: alnanarthur <alnanarthur@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: 912ULS sprag clutch problems ?
List,
Has any Rotax 912 series engine users had sprag clutch problems?
I am having starting problems and am beginning to suspect the sprag
clutch.
I would appreciate any insight on this problem.
I expect that the 912ULS would stress this part more than the 80 hp 912.
I had early problems shaking off the carbs on start-up and shut-down with
this
engine until I added side springs to each carb and had the the gearbox
modified
to add the 30 deg. slipper clutch.
I got one of the first 912ULS engines from Skystar. I hope that I'm
not breaking new ground with this problem.
Allan Arthur
Kitfox 5, N40AA
Rotax 912ULS, Warpdrive 3 blade
Byron Airport, CA (C83) Hanger C8
_________________________________________________________________
Mortgage refinance is hot 1) Rates near 30-yr lows 2) Good credit get
intro-rate 4.625%*
https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h2a5f&s=4056&p=5117&disc=y&vers=743
Message 28
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| Subject: | New Product Stops Rotax Kickbacks on Starting |
Folks,
Those of you having problems starting Rotax 4 strokes may be interested in a new
product that is being marketed by Conair Sports in the UK. Their "Soft Start"
module stops the engine kicking back when starting. Saves wear on sprag clutches.
I don't think there are details on the website yet but you can email them
at the following address for info:
service@conairsports.co.uk
I hope this is helpful,
Mark
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101268#101268
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
Dave, I don't understand the logic here. If the bleeders are on the
bottom, attach the tube, crack the bleeder then pump. All the air will be
expelled. Explain where the residual air will be found.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "D. Fisher" <d@cfisher.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
Floyd, That might work on a application with the bleeders pointed up but
with the bleeder at the bottom of caliper I think you woudl find it hard to
get all the air out.
Air in system equals a spongy pedal.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Floyd Johnson
To: Kitfox-List
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 10:57 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
A trick I learned, while I was on the Maintinance Committee for my Flying
club, was to run a piece of clear plastic oxygen hose from the bleeder at
the brake, and back to the filler on the resiuvoir (sp). Just pump the brake
pedal and the air will exit the end of the hose, while the fluid returns to
the tank. Simple and works like a charm. Oh, and don't use the hose for your
oxygen after bleeding your brakes. He! He!.
Floyd Johnson
kitfox69@earthlink.net
EarthLink Revolves Around You.
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: Resin WAS: wingtip crack |
Michel,
When we closed the elevator on the Lancair IV, the Hysol penetrated the
carbon fiber skins through the dreaded pinholes. After curing it looked and
felt like fine sandpaper. These skins were obviously vacuum bagged and
designed to be very light. Granted this was an Epoxy lay-up, but when we
were instructed in the manual to use the bid lay-ups, the recommended method
was to put the several layers of cloth, 2 bid, 3 bid, etc. on a sheet of
polythelene - 3 mil, saturate with resin, sandwich with another sheet of
polyethylene, and roll or squeegee as much of the resin out of the glass as
possible. This was for weight reduction. Then if there was any sign of
wetness on the surface to blot that up with paper towls.
I doubt any of this would hold gasoline or water for that matter. A very
complex procedure in preparing the fuel bays before closing eliminated fuel
leakage - for most.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michel Verheughe" <michel@online.no>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 1:00 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Resin WAS: wingtip crack
>
> On Mar 16, 2007, at 9:51 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
>> Boat construction as you said uses a lot more resin.
>
> It may be so, Noel, but do you have some figures? The way I understand it
> is that GRP (Glassfiber Reinforced Plastic) construction where the resin
> used is polyester, requires 70% of glassfiber and 30% of polyester. Less
> resin and the glassfiber won't be enough impregnated. More resin and it
> won't help strength more than an extra coat of topcoat would.
>
> Those are not my figures but those from engineers working for reputable
> certification societies such as Lloyds of London.
>
> Admittedly many "home-building" yachtsmen will use more resin than
> necessary, but that could also happen with a home-building airman,
> couldn't it?
>
> Cheers,
> Michel
>
> do not archive
>
>
>
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Cooling Question |
Try plumbing in a thermostat. Use one from a 2002 series BMW and the year is around
1975. Racepages.com has them for about $35.
G4000-39718 Wahler BMW 2002 is the part number.
If you use the bypass, which is the outlet that comes off at roughly a 45 degree
angle, neck it down to your heater hose size, run this to your heater valve,
heater and then to nipple on the water pump. This will give you good warm water
flow through the heater.
--------
Mike Logan
Fredericksburg, VA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101280#101280
Message 32
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|
I start, surprisingly, by draining my brake system down enough to be
sure
there will be no bubbles in the brake lines or master cylinder. Then I
use
a $1.95 pumper style oil can with a bit of clear tubing pushed on over
the
end and put the other end on the bleeding nipple. I use the small pump
in
the oil can to drive fluid into the wheel cylinder and back through the
system. Takes around a can full (~3 oz.) of fluid to fill the brake
system.
You know when it is done by closing the bleeder and having a good solid
brake. Just incase I put too much fluid in the system I wrap the base
of
master cylinder/ reservoir with a rag. Three times out of four I don't
need
it. Using a barb nipple in the top of the reservoir to create a closed
loop
as far as I can see will cause a bit more mess but never the less is
interesting.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
Cudnohufsky's
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
Graeme,
Do not know if it is the best but it worked very well for me. I used a
12
volt fuel pump, hooked it to a gal jug with brake fluid in it and the
other
end to the bleeder on the brake. I also had the top plug of the brake
fluid
reservoir replaced with a hose barb and hose that went back to the gal
jug.
I would bump the fuel pump on and off while I worked the brake until
there
were no more air bubbles in the line. (Leaving the fuel pump I was using
"on" all the time would pop the line off the brake bleader, a smaller
pressure pump would have been better but it was what I had). Then do the
same on the other side. My Matcos would weep at the seals and I would
have
to re-bleed them every couple months or they would get squishy.
Lloyd
----- Original Message -----
From: QSS <mailto:msm@byterocky.net>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 4:25 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
Hi guys, can someone tell me what the best was is to bleed matco brakes.
For
some reason I have two different types. The pilot side has the 2 x MC-1
and
the starboard side has 2 x MC-3.
Regards
Graeme
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matron
href
"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
Message 33
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| Subject: | Source code in posts - Off topic |
Just wondering if there is actually any one out there who will admit to
having a big problem with reading the little bit of code that is in some of
the posts? If I had a big problem with it I wouldn't let on.
Noel
Before I forget do not archive
BTW I also changed the subject Etc.Etc.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of fox5flyer
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 10:40 AM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum
>
>
> <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>
>
> Emails like this coming from new guys makes me roll my eyes,
> especially
> early in the morning before I finish my cup of coffee.
> "actual Kitfox List
> web site"? "the List site is only way to go"?
> First off Steve, I appreciate your input. You seem like a fairly well
> informed guy, but Jim is right. You are having a
> configuration problem with
> your mailer, or perhaps it's the method you use to
> copy/paste. It isn't the
> other 500 people here, but you're making it their problem.
> Your emails are
> the only ones coming as Jim Crowder described. You've been
> told about it
> before, but apparently ignored it.
> Second, if there is an "actual Kitfox List web site" it would be
> Sportflight.com. Matronics is a mail server.
> And third, your opinion about "the List site viewing is only
> way to go" is
> noted, but what you don't seem to understand is that this
> list has been
> around for close to 20 years, gone through several mail list
> servers, and
> still has many of us old timers hanging on, as well as some
> charter members
> who kind of like the email version of the list. When we
> changed to Matt
> Dralle's Matronics server about two years ago there was no
> forum at that
> time, but was added about a year or so ago as an option.
> What is happening
> is that many new members are taking the forum option because
> they aren't
> aware of the email option and we're getting a mix of forum and email,
> probably in the neighborhood of 20/80. One of the big
> problems with the
> forum version is that for the 80 percent of us using the
> email version is
> that we often don't know what the forum contributor is
> talking about because
> he/she usually doesn't quote any part of the message they're
> responding to.
> Not a huge problem, but definitely an annoyance.
> Please check your configuration settings and set them to
> plain text so that
> we don't have to sift through all the html codes. A lot of us would
> appreciate it.
> Deke Morisse
> List Janitor/Manager/Administrator/whatever...
>
>
> > Sorry... I do realize that my post may show up somewhat
> "corrupted" when
> read through misc. e-mail clients. All I can say is when
> viewed using the
> actual Kitfox List web site
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewforum.php?f=8&sid=83b6acbe5602
> af72d6c023eab4688518
> > all will be right and legible.
> > I sometimes compose using Microsoft works, then cut and
> paste to the List
> Message Body window, and this might be a cause of corrupted
> e-mail. It does
> not affect the List site viewing.
> >
> > I post right to the site, and forget that others receive
> through e-mail.
> While I regret the e-mail corruption, it is not my intention
> to send e-mail
> to every viewerreader. IMHO, the List site is the only way to go.
> > Thanks for the input.
> > Steve
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101168#101168
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
That sounds great!
Dwight Purdy model ll
At 10:57 AM 3/17/2007 -0400, you wrote:
>A trick I learned, while I was on the Maintinance Committee for my Flying
>club, was to run a piece of clear plastic oxygen hose from the bleeder at
>the brake, and back to the filler on the resiuvoir (sp). Just pump the
>brake pedal and the air will exit the end of the hose, while the fluid
>returns to the tank. Simple and works like a charm. Oh, and don't use the
>hose for your oxygen after bleeding your brakes. He! He!.
>
>
>Floyd Johnson
><mailto:kitfox69@earthlink.net>kitfox69@earthlink.net
>EarthLink Revolves Around You.
>
>
><http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
>
>
>12:33 PM
2:33 PM
Message 35
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| Subject: | Weight & Balance issues |
John,
My Series 7 with Rotax 912uls and GSC 3 blade prop weighed in at,
295-left main, 300.80-right main and 203.20 on the nose wheel all
measurements are in pounds.
Regards
Roger Mac
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
josandt@verizon.net
Sent: Friday, March 16, 2007 8:07 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Weight & Balance issues
Is anyone out there with a tri-gear willing to share the recorded weights of
their three wheels? Two main gear weights and the nosegear weight. Your
assistance in sharing these weights would help me assess the viability of my
current "rough" setup. I just need a frame of reference for GENERAL weight
adjustment. Not planning on using the info for final weight and balance
issues! Would certainly appeciate anyone's help. I also think this would be
very useful info for anyone building a trigear. Does anyone have this kind
of info on file? If so, please indicate which model/series you own. It would
be helpful to me because I have major weight/balance issues caused by
addition of Corvair engine/BRS chute/special manifold mods/etc. John Sandt
Series 7 Sport / Corvair / BRS / Tri-gear / under construction
Message 36
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Just keep away from the Skydrol ;-)
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of D. Fisher
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 5:00 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
>
>
>
> Lowell,
> Yup same here and if his setup is the same as the pic I sent
> earlier then
> that explains why they are different from left to right. The
> one side would
> have the reservoir in it and the other it just flows through
> as you pump the
> fluid through.
>
> One should add that MIL SPEC fluid only should be used.
>
> Dave
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 3:03 PM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
>
>
> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
> >
> > Graeme, the way it was recommended to me as I was building
> is to use a
> > lever type pump oil can, fill it with the brake fluid and
> using a short
> > length of plastic tubing connect it to the bleed fittings
> on the caliper
> > and pump away. Monitor the reservoirs.
> >
> > Lowell
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "QSS" <msm@byterocky.net>
> > To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 2:25 AM
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
> >
> >
> > Hi guys, can someone tell me what the best was is to bleed
> matco brakes.
> > For some reason I have two different types. The pilot side
> has the 2 x
> > MC-1 and the starboard side has 2 x MC-3.
> > Regards
> > Graeme
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Source code in posts - Off topic |
I have a problem with it and don't mind admitting it. I also have a problem
with you submitting post after post aft post on every subject matter that
hits the list. Look at what you just posted, it says nothing, provided no
useful information and is about to drive me away. This Kitfox email list
has gone to crap. As I've said before, it has turned into a cheap CHAT
channel. Why can't you and a few others just report fact and leave the CHAT
crap on the side. As you can tell, I'm Pissed and the Admin folks need to
start pulling the plug on some members.
Don Smythe
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 7:05 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Source code in posts - Off topic
>
> Just wondering if there is actually any one out there who will admit to
> having a big problem with reading the little bit of code that is in some
> of
> the posts? If I had a big problem with it I wouldn't let on.
>
> Noel
> Before I forget do not archive
> BTW I also changed the subject Etc.Etc.
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of fox5flyer
>> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 10:40 AM
>> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum
>>
>>
>> <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>
>>
>> Emails like this coming from new guys makes me roll my eyes,
>> especially
>> early in the morning before I finish my cup of coffee.
>> "actual Kitfox List
>> web site"? "the List site is only way to go"?
>> First off Steve, I appreciate your input. You seem like a fairly well
>> informed guy, but Jim is right. You are having a
>> configuration problem with
>> your mailer, or perhaps it's the method you use to
>> copy/paste. It isn't the
>> other 500 people here, but you're making it their problem.
>> Your emails are
>> the only ones coming as Jim Crowder described. You've been
>> told about it
>> before, but apparently ignored it.
>> Second, if there is an "actual Kitfox List web site" it would be
>> Sportflight.com. Matronics is a mail server.
>> And third, your opinion about "the List site viewing is only
>> way to go" is
>> noted, but what you don't seem to understand is that this
>> list has been
>> around for close to 20 years, gone through several mail list
>> servers, and
>> still has many of us old timers hanging on, as well as some
>> charter members
>> who kind of like the email version of the list. When we
>> changed to Matt
>> Dralle's Matronics server about two years ago there was no
>> forum at that
>> time, but was added about a year or so ago as an option.
>> What is happening
>> is that many new members are taking the forum option because
>> they aren't
>> aware of the email option and we're getting a mix of forum and email,
>> probably in the neighborhood of 20/80. One of the big
>> problems with the
>> forum version is that for the 80 percent of us using the
>> email version is
>> that we often don't know what the forum contributor is
>> talking about because
>> he/she usually doesn't quote any part of the message they're
>> responding to.
>> Not a huge problem, but definitely an annoyance.
>> Please check your configuration settings and set them to
>> plain text so that
>> we don't have to sift through all the html codes. A lot of us would
>> appreciate it.
>> Deke Morisse
>> List Janitor/Manager/Administrator/whatever...
>>
>>
>> > Sorry... I do realize that my post may show up somewhat
>> "corrupted" when
>> read through misc. e-mail clients. All I can say is when
>> viewed using the
>> actual Kitfox List web site
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewforum.php?f=8&sid=83b6acbe5602
>> af72d6c023eab4688518
>> > all will be right and legible.
>> > I sometimes compose using Microsoft works, then cut and
>> paste to the List
>> Message Body window, and this might be a cause of corrupted
>> e-mail. It does
>> not affect the List site viewing.
>> >
>> > I post right to the site, and forget that others receive
>> through e-mail.
>> While I regret the e-mail corruption, it is not my intention
>> to send e-mail
>> to every viewerreader. IMHO, the List site is the only way to go.
>> > Thanks for the input.
>> > Steve
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Read this topic online here:
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101168#101168
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 38
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| Subject: | Resin WAS: wingtip crack |
Admittedly many "home-building" yachtsmen will use more resin than
necessary, but that could also happen with a home-building airman, couldn't
it?
Unfortunately yes.
But in processes where the hull is sprayed up as opposed to layed up and
autoclaved a lot more resin is used. This makes the hull more impermeable
to water and of course heavier which is not a problem.
I guess what the insurance industry is getting at is insuring great
strength at minimum weight. This great strength may be needed like the step
for the mast and the structure to hold the keel. That is where the 70/30 or
pre preg comes into play. As a rank outsider to yachting, let alone world
class yachting, I expect that is why the ten meter boats cost tens of
millions of dollars.... And that's not counting the engineering that goes
into them.
The other part of the 70/30 mix (by mass) is also true... With a slight drop
in resin saturation it is easy to end up with serious voids in the final
product that can cause even greater structural weakness. For this reason
most parts made with this accuracy are also tested with ultrasonic equipment
and sometimes even industrial X-Ray to verify the validity of the part.
Even the clamshell cowls on the 777 have a good coat of gel coat on the
exterior to protect them from water permeation and possible delamination.
In fact it has become a bit of a concern, as a very small crack in the
surface of the cowl, as may be occur by careless loading with a lift truck
is a lot more serious than the same bump on a similar aluminium cowl.
The one thing I have noticed missing from this thread is the use of Kevlar
and what the difference between glass, graphite ( carbon) and Kevlar. It
strikes me for a lot of aviation purposes Kevlar would be the superior
composite fabric.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Michel Verheughe
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 6:31 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Resin WAS: wingtip crack
>
>
>
> On Mar 16, 2007, at 9:51 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> > Boat construction as you said uses a lot more resin.
>
> It may be so, Noel, but do you have some figures? The way I
> understand
> it is that GRP (Glassfiber Reinforced Plastic) construction where the
> resin used is polyester, requires 70% of glassfiber and 30% of
> polyester. Less resin and the glassfiber won't be enough impregnated.
> More resin and it won't help strength more than an extra coat of
> topcoat would.
>
> Those are not my figures but those from engineers working for
> reputable
> certification societies such as Lloyds of London.
>
> Admittedly many "home-building" yachtsmen will use more resin than
> necessary, but that could also happen with a home-building airman,
> couldn't it?
>
> Cheers,
> Michel
>
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 39
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| Subject: | Resin WAS: wingtip crack |
We used to consider that the same as making our own pre-preg. After
squeezing the excess resin out of the cloth we could roll it up, still in
its plastic sandwich and put in the refrigerator to slow down the curing.
This was useful if you had to do several layers of different
materials...e.g. carbon and Kevlar even aluminium foil (embedded antennas).
That system makes a good strong part but one that is also permeable by
water... and I guess gas. What I found really interesting is when you
vacuum bag this stuff you will be surprised by how much excess resin will be
pressed out by the bagging.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Lowell Fitt
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 7:30 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Resin WAS: wingtip crack
>
>
> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
> Michel,
>
> When we closed the elevator on the Lancair IV, the Hysol
> penetrated the
> carbon fiber skins through the dreaded pinholes. After
> curing it looked and
> felt like fine sandpaper. These skins were obviously vacuum
> bagged and
> designed to be very light. Granted this was an Epoxy lay-up,
> but when we
> were instructed in the manual to use the bid lay-ups, the
> recommended method
> was to put the several layers of cloth, 2 bid, 3 bid, etc. on
> a sheet of
> polythelene - 3 mil, saturate with resin, sandwich with
> another sheet of
> polyethylene, and roll or squeegee as much of the resin out
> of the glass as
> possible. This was for weight reduction. Then if there was
> any sign of
> wetness on the surface to blot that up with paper towls.
>
> I doubt any of this would hold gasoline or water for that
> matter. A very
> complex procedure in preparing the fuel bays before closing
> eliminated fuel
> leakage - for most.
>
> Lowell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Michel Verheughe" <michel@online.no>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 1:00 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Resin WAS: wingtip crack
>
>
> <michel@online.no>
> >
> > On Mar 16, 2007, at 9:51 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> >> Boat construction as you said uses a lot more resin.
> >
> > It may be so, Noel, but do you have some figures? The way I
> understand it
> > is that GRP (Glassfiber Reinforced Plastic) construction
> where the resin
> > used is polyester, requires 70% of glassfiber and 30% of
> polyester. Less
> > resin and the glassfiber won't be enough impregnated. More
> resin and it
> > won't help strength more than an extra coat of topcoat would.
> >
> > Those are not my figures but those from engineers working
> for reputable
> > certification societies such as Lloyds of London.
> >
> > Admittedly many "home-building" yachtsmen will use more resin than
> > necessary, but that could also happen with a home-building airman,
> > couldn't it?
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Michel
> >
> > do not archive
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
I have no idea what the "SKYDROL' comment means. The subject is, Bleeding
Brakes. please try to stay on tract. This is not a Chat Room.
Don Smythe
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 8:10 PM
> Just keep away from the Skydrol ;-)
>
> Noel
Message 41
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| Subject: | Re: Source code in posts - Off topic |
Im am putting myself on the hatchet block. Where in the heck is everyones
HUMOR . Is life so damn shitty for some of you to not realize that a little
humor goes a long way . and if you do not really like what others have to
say then use the darn delete button . I do believe this country is founded
on letting people say what we want even if we agree to disagree. and letting
the other party know what we think about there opinions . THIS IS CALLED
FREEDOM OF SPEECH.
I do not believe anyone should be banned or whupped up on to bad including
Steve<the controversy continues about E/SLA weight limits lol . or ME heck
I complain about alot of things . Or even DAVE the Crazy Canadian who makes
us laugh with his Vid's . Come on guys lighten up and enjoy life . Cant we
all agree to disagree and heck lets all drink to this one . If the moderator
or someone else want's to ban me from postin to this list then so be it .
Just remember that any info pertinent or not is valuable to someone . And
one day you may be looking for that info .
So take a chill drink a few brews and relax get laid or something to loosen
up and get over it .
I love the list and the info provided but damn the humor is lacking and with
all the crap we have to deal with in our society where else can some of us
guys go that fly Avids and Kitfoxes or who cares what else kind of machine ,
and enjoy it and be able to laugh at our mistakes and to learn at the same
time .
Nuff said Here I hope I'm still on here tomorrow
John Perry
Kitfox 2 N718PD
ARCHIVE THIS
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 7:15 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Source code in posts - Off topic
>
> I have a problem with it and don't mind admitting it. I also have a
> problem with you submitting post after post aft post on every subject
> matter that hits the list. Look at what you just posted, it says nothing,
> provided no useful information and is about to drive me away. This
> Kitfox email list has gone to crap. As I've said before, it has turned
> into a cheap CHAT channel. Why can't you and a few others just report
> fact and leave the CHAT crap on the side. As you can tell, I'm Pissed and
> the Admin folks need to start pulling the plug on some members.
>
> Don Smythe
>
Message 42
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
Did u bother to do a internet search on SKYDROL
YES THIS IS A CHAT ROOM AND I FOR ONE APPRECIATE NOEL'S POSTS.
KEEP EM COMIN NOEL
JOHN PERRY PISSED AT THE NON HUMOROUS ONES
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 8:45 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
>
> I have no idea what the "SKYDROL' comment means. The subject is, Bleeding
> Brakes. please try to stay on tract. This is not a Chat Room.
>
> Don Smythe
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 8:10 PM
>> Just keep away from the Skydrol ;-)
>>
>> Noel
>
>
>
Message 43
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
" have no idea what the "SKYDROL' comment means."
Hey...I thought it was good humor.
It makes a good car wax... go try it. (just kidding group, just kidding)
Steve
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101319#101319
Message 44
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
YEAH i am replying again For your INFORMATON SKYDROL is a aviation Hydraulic
fluid .
Dont hammer on NOEL for you not knowing what something is why dont you ask
next time . and gee you might be informed and learn something new in your
life .
It is staying on track because you do not want to put it in your brakes cuzz
it will ruin all the seals .
Me again
JOHN PERRY STILL PISSED AT The NON HUMOROUS ONES
----- Original Message -----
From: "Don Smythe" <dosmythe@cox.net>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 8:45 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
>
> I have no idea what the "SKYDROL' comment means. The subject is, Bleeding
> Brakes. please try to stay on tract. This is not a Chat Room.
>
> Don Smythe
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 8:10 PM
>> Just keep away from the Skydrol ;-)
>>
>> Noel
>
>
>
Message 45
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|
Just read the post I replied to.
Dave had mentioned to use a brake fluid with a mil spec. Skydrol is also a
hydraulic (brake) fluid. The problem is it will eat all the seals in your
brake system. Then it will attack any plastics or rubber it comes in
contact with, with few exceptions. The usable Mil specs MIL H- 5606, MIL
H-83282, or MIL H-46170 (I looked up the numbers to be sure) are not in any
way compatible with the synthetic Phosphate-ester base Skydrol/Hyjet which
may be left around a hangar.
If you need further explanation contact me off list. I'll be happy to
accommodate you.
BTW. That comment was on track....as was my description of the method I've
been using for bleeding brakes for some time now.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
> Don Smythe
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 11:15 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bleeding brakes
>
>
>
> I have no idea what the "SKYDROL' comment means. The subject
> is, Bleeding
> Brakes. please try to stay on tract. This is not a Chat Room.
>
> Don Smythe
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 8:10 PM
> > Just keep away from the Skydrol ;-)
> >
> > Noel
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 46
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| Subject: | Re: Source code in posts - Off topic |
does anyone else want to start a forum, where we can talk about these killer planes
and enjoy ourselves? I know the old buggers here provide alot of great info,
and some were the founding fathers.. but holy crap.. the last time I saw
so many old people get pissed over nothing was at a damn BINGO hall...
I like to enjoy life, and I dont mind admitting it!
let me know if anyone want to have fun and still trade info and I will start a
new forum
--------
Leni
Avid C W/582
1260 full lotus
.......DO NOT ARCHIVE.....
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101330#101330
Message 47
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| Subject: | Re: Bleeding brakes |
If I remember right from A&P school days, Skydrol is used in high-attitude aircraft,
and very high pressure hydraulic systems. Like nitrogen, it will not contain
or absorb moisture,...which would freeze at altitude. As said before, very
corrosive, and highly toxic to skin. It's no joke among the air-carrier mechanics.
very bad stuff. But it works.
Anyway...
steve
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101337#101337
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