Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:38 AM - Re: flase ribs (Michael Gibbs)
2. 12:38 AM - Re: Droop tips -Crusie speeds mods. (Michael Gibbs)
3. 01:04 AM - Re: Re: Droop tips -Crusie speeds mods. (QSS)
4. 04:19 AM - Re: Bing Carb Flooding (michael paton)
5. 06:23 AM - Re: Re: Please read this sort of OT (flier)
6. 06:26 AM - Re: Please read this sort of OT (flier)
7. 07:21 AM - Re: flase ribs (Bob)
8. 08:17 AM - Re: Droop tips -Crusie speeds mods. (kitfoxmike)
9. 10:08 AM - Re: flase ribs (Michel Verheughe)
10. 12:18 PM - Re: Rotax For Sale (Noel Loveys)
11. 06:57 PM - Re: Mielage: Fuel consumption based on gallons per hour (Randy Daughenbaugh)
12. 07:32 PM - Re: Bing Carb Flooding (Cudnohufsky's)
13. 07:32 PM - Fuel consumption based on gallons per hour (fox5flyer)
14. 08:04 PM - Re: Source code in posts - Off topic (Larry/Cathy Boone)
15. 08:19 PM - Re: Source code in posts - Off topic (Kitfoxv@comcast.net)
16. 08:48 PM - Re: Re: Please read this sort of OT (Kitfoxv@comcast.net)
17. 09:55 PM - Re: Source code in posts - Off topic (Larry/Cathy Boone)
18. 10:26 PM - Re: Source code in posts - Off topic (Kitfoxv@comcast.net)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Noel sez:
>You said @ 0 deg there would be no lift nor induced drag I'm not too
>sure how you define induced drag. One of the problems with a mass
>moving through a fluid ( air ) is there is always drag induced by
>the movement.
Clem is quite right. Induced drag is the drag that comes from the
production of lift. You are referring to parasite drag, Noel. No
lift = no induced drag.
>The other observation I would like to make is that many planes e.g.
>the CH701 actually have "upside down" airfoils on the tail to
>actually push the tail down and apply load to the wings.
With very few exceptions, all aircraft with conventional tails (those
without canards) have downward lifting tails. Having the center of
mass forward of the center of lift is what provides stability in the
pitch axis.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Droop tips -Crusie speeds mods. |
kitfoxmike sez:
>...by that time the fox is moving very slow and after touch I hit
>the brakes lightly and stop it, very short. forget the flaps.
My Model IV-1200 Speedster could touch down considerably slower with
full flaps than without. It also got off the ground much quicker
with 1/2 flaps on takeoff--as little as 120 feet one time. You are
missing out on half the performance your plane is capable of.
Mike G.
N728KF
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Droop tips -Crusie speeds mods. |
I agree Mike, I have been experimenting with flaps for a while now and I
realise the group has divided thoughts about their effectiveness but I am
confident the short field performance with flaps is better than without. A
while back I was landing in 15 knots of cross wind with 20 degrees of flap
with no noticeable aileron control loss. The big deficit as I see it is that
if you do get some drift on the flair, dont dump your flaps to gain more
aileron authority or your going to end up with a bent plane. Just use power
and go around. I use with and with out depending on conditions and feel I
know my plane better for it. Just my 2 bobs worth.
Regards
Graeme ----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Gibbs" <MichaelGibbs@cox.net>
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 5:37 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Droop tips -Crusie speeds mods.
>
> kitfoxmike sez:
>
>>...by that time the fox is moving very slow and after touch I hit the
>>brakes lightly and stop it, very short. forget the flaps.
>
> My Model IV-1200 Speedster could touch down considerably slower with full
> flaps than without. It also got off the ground much quicker with 1/2
> flaps on takeoff--as little as 120 feet one time. You are missing out on
> half the performance your plane is capable of.
>
> Mike G.
> N728KF
>
>
> --
> 19/03/2007 11:49 AM
>
>
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Bing Carb Flooding |
thanks for this info , have been having the same prob , will try jets=0A9J-
FOX=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: fox5flyer <fox5flyer@idealwifi
.net>=0ATo: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 3:13:
31 AM=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bing Carb Flooding=0A=0A--> Kitfox-List m
essage posted by: "fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>=0A=0AI don't know i
f this has anything to do with the problem or the fix, but=0Aback when I ha
d my Model II with gray head 582 I had a big problem (from the=0Agit-go) wi
th the engine running very rough at idle, but as the rpms went up=0Athe eng
ine would smooth out, but not until it got over 3k. At 2k idle it=0Awould
shake so badly that the floats would overfill the bowls and fuel would=0Apo
ur out the vents. Obviously, this overfilling of the bowls just=0Aexacerba
ted the problem so it was difficult to see what the actual problem=0Awas, e
specially since the float levels were set to factory settings. I=0Afooled
around with it for awhile changing needles, balance, etc., and while=0Aa f
riend was over we were discussing what to do because everything was brand
=0Anew and we felt that there was probably nothing actually wrong with the
=0Acarbs. As we talked about it one of us said something about the idle je
ts=0Amaybe being too rich as the carbs may have been assembled for a differ
ent=0Aaltitude. I thought it was worth a try so I ordered from Spruce a se
t of=0Aidle jets the next size leaner and voila! Smoothed right out! End
of=0Aproblem. Of course, I had to make the usual twice a year change to th
e=0Amains to compensate for the wild temp swings here in Michigan, but actu
ally=0Anever had any fuel related problems again for 400 hours.=0AHope this
might help a little bit.=0ADeke=0A=0A----- Original Message ----- =0AFrom:
"W & R Beck" <trevorkebb@earthlink.net>=0ATo: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
=0ASent: Monday, March 19, 2007 6:27 PM=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bing Ca
orkebb@earthlink.net>=0A>=0A> Folks:=0A>=0A> I will be interested to hear w
hat others say about this as I have had the=0A> same intermittent problem w
ith my 350 hour greyhead, and on the rear carb=0A> only. Wierd. LEAF advise
d me to check the fuel levels -1/2"- in the=0Abowls,=0A> and the plunger
that the floats work against to shut off fuel; its viton=0Atip=0A> should b
e clear of debris and not worn. My was clean and not worn and=0Afloat=0A> l
evels are good, but I found the rear float in the rear carb binding in=0Ath
e=0A> down position. If you pushed it down with fuel in the bowl it would n
ot=0A> float back up. So I changed the rear float in each carb for the new
style=0A> that has beveled corners. Now there is no possibility that either
float=0Awill=0A> bind in either carb. But I still don't know if that was t
he problem. I=0A> suspect not. The annual will be finished on the plane soo
n and we'll have=0Ato=0A> see how it goes then.=0A>=0A> Robert=0A>=0A>=0A>
> Hi ! Guys,=0A> > I have a Bluehead 582 about 150 hours old
so I would not=0A> > expect worn parts and they certainly look ok. Howeve
r every now and=0Athen=0A> > the back carby floods. When it does I get roug
h running down low. If the=0A> > motor is not running then I get some dribb
ling out of those two little=0A> > holes=0A> > in the vent loop. It only do
es it several weeks apart. If I pull the=0Abowl=0A> > I=0A> > can't find an
ything either in the bowl or needle and seat. It's a worry=0A> > because i
t drips on the muffler. In flight I just give it full throttle=0A> > and
=0A> > back off again and it's fine. On the ground if I pull the bowl off I
=0Afind=0A> > nothing and all is fine when I put it back. Being intermitten
t like that=0A> > it=0A> > makes it very hard to find. It's always only the
back bowl and=0A> > theoretically=0A> > nothing can get to the needle and
seat anyway. I have a filter and a=0A> > gascolator. Any common problems
like this or any ideas would be=0A> > appreciated. Thanks in advance, Rex.
===================0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A=0A=0A=0A =0A___________________________________________________________
_________________________=0ANow that's room service! Choose from over 150,
000 hotels=0Ain 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.=0Aht
tp://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Please read this sort of OT |
What I'm trying to figure out is why anyone would
want to listen to another conversation of yours about
that rule.
Let it go!
DO NOT ARCHIVE
--- Original Message ---
From: "84KF" <stevebenesh@comcast.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Please read this sort of OT
<stevebenesh@comcast.net>
>
>If anyone is interested, Avidflyer and I will
be "discussing" (cough...cough...) the "Federal
Register / Vol. 69, No. 143 / Tuesday, July 27,
2004 / Rules and Regulations", also known as
the "Final Rule"
> He has agreed to actually read the document, when
time permits, and present his opinions. What is
encouraging is that the man was honest enough to
admit that at this time he has NOT read it... as I
suspect many of the group here has not either.
> That's good enough for me as it shows that he is
a free thinker, and not reliant on others to make
decisions for him. Some of us live our lives based on
our own thinking and judgement. Some, incapable of
that, just sit back.., accept the words of others at
factual, and when asked to prove those words, merely
retort "well..., that's what I was told." or as here,
tend to quote the very commercial publication who's
statements are being contested. Hello?
>Stay abreast of this in the following days at
http://www.avidfoxflyers.com/
>And... please offer any input or questions you care
to.
>Sugested reading beforehand is "Federal Register /
Vol. 69, No. 143 / Tuesday, July 27, 2004 / Rules and
Regulations" available for download, .pdf format,
from the AOPA site:
>
http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/regulatory/regsport.html
>Look for it in the "Related Documents" at the bottom
of the page.
>
>steve
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?
p=101801#101801
>
>
>_-
=====================================================
=====
browse
Subscriptions page,
FAQ,
List
>_-
=====================================================
=====
Web Forums!
>_-
=====================================================
=====
>
>
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Please read this sort of OT |
Don't worry guys. You'all have fun over there.
--- Original Message ---
From: "avidflyer" <depronalaska@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Please read this sort of OT
<depronalaska@yahoo.com>
>
>Some of you are under the impression that I want to
rip this list apart and take a bunch of members with
me... NOTHING could be farther from the truth..
>My intention is to stay a member of this list and
learn as much as possible... The "other" site is a
place we can go to chat, flame, and carry on without
pissing off anyone.
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?
p=101784#101784
>
>
>_-
=====================================================
=====
browse
Subscriptions page,
FAQ,
List
>_-
=====================================================
=====
Web Forums!
>_-
=====================================================
=====
>
>
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Looks like it's mostly covered, just an engineer's input/side-track on airfoil
moments. To create lift, the wing airfoil tries to pitch it's nose downward (actually,
the CL lifts the trailing edge) which engineers express as coefficient
of moment (Cm). The tail is initially designed to offset that Cm and the download
is typically roughly (note the combination of 2 weasel words) 10% of the
wing lift. This is a drag that we pay for in fuel burn and it can be offset
by using the cg in lieu of some tail downforce, or by adding a canard (which has
it's own drag). That's why cruise speed and fuel burn typically do a bit better
at aft cg. We control the pitch of the plane by controlling how much or
little the tail offsets the CM. What we know as the ends of the cg range are
just within the number of pounds of force that the elevator can make. As we all
know, bad things can happen when we exceed those limits of cg and elevator
authority. While we are on this side-track, wreckage of airplanes that lose part
of the horizontal tail (like early Bonanzas) are easy to spot. As soon as
the tail starts to fail and not generate downforce, the nose snaps down and the
wings break in a downward direction, rather than up.
Back to the original question about adding ribs, though. Airflow hates flat surfaces,
especially if they can vibrate slightly. It creates all sorts of drag
to run air along a flat slab. This is the not-so-secret of fish, birds, cars,
hulls, etc. The early Kitfoxes and Avids flew fine without the ribs and they
were lighter, but adding ribs in the later airplanes provided a curvature for
the air to follow. The pressure of the leading edge of this slight airfoil shape
will become positive and the aft portion will be negative, so there isn't
the draggy turbulence created by vibrating the flat surface, either. The net
effect is that a slightly curved surface should reduce drag at cruise and delay
boundary layer separation at the stalling point of that surface.
Whether the speed differences at cuise and stall are enough for you to do the work
is subjective and up to you.
Bob
Aero Eng (but work aircraft systems), A&P
--------
Remember that internet advice may only be worth what you pay.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101880#101880
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Droop tips -Crusie speeds mods. |
tough group
--------
kitfoxmike
model IV, 1200
speedster
912ul
Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101895#101895
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
A bit off-topic!
On Mar 19, 2007, at 10:30 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> You said @ 0 deg there would be no lift nor induced drag <SNIP>
Delayed by living in different time zones, you already go a very good
answer from Clem, Noel, and the excellent explanation from Bob, which I
enjoyed reading.
> BTW what sim are you using where you can use NACA foils???
It is called X-Plane that you can find at www.x-plane.com. It runs on
PC, Mac and Linux. You can download a free demo that will let you fly
for six minutes with a joystick. After that, only the AP will work.
As the X in the name indicates, it is more a flight simulator for
experimenting than Microsoft Flight Simulator. It comes with the tools
to make you own aircraft and I would even say, any craft because I even
modelled landsailers with it. After all, a sail is nothing more than a
not-so-good wing profile.
The simulator is based on what is called the blade theory, where all
elements are divided in a number of objects with eventual lift, drag
and moment; the latter being what Bob talks about.
Of course, there are limitations. Airfoils data are tested in wind
tunnels and go up to 20 degrees angle of incidence. That's because
nearly all will stall beyond that. It means that when flying in a
normal attitude envelope, the simulation is quite good. But beyond
that, as e.g. in a spin; it may not be realistic at all. But then, no
simulator will because such an attitude would request the use of CFD
(Computational Fluid Dynamic) where each "parcel" of air is simulated
and an individual object. That kind of simulation cannot happen on home
computers at real-time speed, unfortunately.
But I have learnt a lot with X-Plane and I still enjoy changing small
parameters and see how it affects the behaviour. My Kitfox is, of
course, modelled as well as I could (with 3D cockpit) and is available
at x-plane.org, the place where one distribute aircraft and scenery.
Cheers,
Michel
do not archive
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Which PSRU? B,C or E
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Jerry
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 12:07 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Rotax For Sale
I have a Rotax 583 fwf engine, mount, exhaust, psru, prop and all related
hardware for sale. It was removed to install 2200 Jabiru. Would like to
sell to someone in need of an engine. Price negotiable, best offer, plus
shipping. It is in Lewiston, Idaho.
Thanks Jerry
Do not archive
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Mielage: Fuel consumption based on gallons per hour |
I will throw out one data point for a series 5 with series 7 firewall
forward and 912S.
>From Rapid City, South Dakota to just past the other side of South Dakota -
Sioux Center Iowa. 390 miles, 430 miles on I-90, about 4.3 hours on clock,
one stop, 13 gal premium car gas 30 miles per gallon.
I now have a better prop and am quite a bit faster and burning more like 3.3
gal/hr.
Randy
.
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of L Klingmuller
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2007 2:10 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Mielage: Fuel consumption based on gallons per hour
The subject of fuel consumtion has so many variables: speed, engine,
altitude, airplane, weight, inclusion/exclusions, averages, etc, etc
Now here is a chanllange for those who have been flying some longer
x-country flights and have computed AVERAGE trip milages.
What is your average MILAGE e. g. st miles/gal or n miles/gal??
Here some recent data for an RV-6A based on total gl used for the total GPS
milage flown from Denver / Tucson / southern Calf/ Albuquerque/Denver
(includes one hour of sight seeing and all taxiing etc)
Total GPS milage: 2000 nml
Total fuel: 102 gl
Average milage: 22.5 gl/st ml
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Bing Carb Flooding |
Deke,
Interesting, had a similar problem with the 503DCDI in my 4, but on the top
end. Idle was great but on the way back from Oshkosh one year (very hot0
developed a miss and decided to land at a little grass strip in Wisconsin,
tried changing plugs but still had the miss and was not comfortable leaving
the ground, finally tried pulling the air filters and that allowed the
engine to lean out enough to clear up. When I got home I ordered different
mains and would have to change main jets for really hot weather.
Lloyd
* Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. 1 Thes. 5:21 *
----- Original Message -----
From: "fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2007 8:13 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bing Carb Flooding
>
> I don't know if this has anything to do with the problem or the fix, but
> back when I had my Model II with gray head 582 I had a big problem (from
> the
> git-go) with the engine running very rough at idle, but as the rpms went
> up
> the engine would smooth out, but not until it got over 3k. At 2k idle it
> would shake so badly that the floats would overfill the bowls and fuel
> would
> pour out the vents. Obviously, this overfilling of the bowls just
> exacerbated the problem so it was difficult to see what the actual problem
> was, especially since the float levels were set to factory settings. I
> fooled around with it for awhile changing needles, balance, etc., and
> while
> a friend was over we were discussing what to do because everything was
> brand
> new and we felt that there was probably nothing actually wrong with the
> carbs. As we talked about it one of us said something about the idle jets
> maybe being too rich as the carbs may have been assembled for a different
> altitude. I thought it was worth a try so I ordered from Spruce a set of
> idle jets the next size leaner and voila! Smoothed right out! End of
> problem. Of course, I had to make the usual twice a year change to the
> mains to compensate for the wild temp swings here in Michigan, but
> actually
> never had any fuel related problems again for 400 hours.
> Hope this might help a little bit.
> Deke
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "W & R Beck" <trevorkebb@earthlink.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2007 6:27 PM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Bing Carb Flooding
>
>
>> <trevorkebb@earthlink.net>
>>
>> Folks:
>>
>> I will be interested to hear what others say about this as I have had the
>> same intermittent problem with my 350 hour greyhead, and on the rear carb
>> only. Wierd. LEAF advised me to check the fuel levels -1/2"- in the
> bowls,
>> and the plunger that the floats work against to shut off fuel; its viton
> tip
>> should be clear of debris and not worn. My was clean and not worn and
> float
>> levels are good, but I found the rear float in the rear carb binding in
> the
>> down position. If you pushed it down with fuel in the bowl it would not
>> float back up. So I changed the rear float in each carb for the new style
>> that has beveled corners. Now there is no possibility that either float
> will
>> bind in either carb. But I still don't know if that was the problem. I
>> suspect not. The annual will be finished on the plane soon and we'll have
> to
>> see how it goes then.
>>
>> Robert
>>
>>
>> > Hi ! Guys,
>> > I have a Bluehead 582 about 150 hours old so I would not
>> > expect worn parts and they certainly look ok. However every now and
> then
>> > the back carby floods. When it does I get rough running down low. If
>> > the
>> > motor is not running then I get some dribbling out of those two little
>> > holes
>> > in the vent loop. It only does it several weeks apart. If I pull the
> bowl
>> > I
>> > can't find anything either in the bowl or needle and seat. It's a
>> > worry
>> > because it drips on the muffler. In flight I just give it full
>> > throttle
>> > and
>> > back off again and it's fine. On the ground if I pull the bowl off I
> find
>> > nothing and all is fine when I put it back. Being intermittent like
>> > that
>> > it
>> > makes it very hard to find. It's always only the back bowl and
>> > theoretically
>> > nothing can get to the needle and seat anyway. I have a filter and a
>> > gascolator. Any common problems like this or any ideas would be
>> > appreciated. Thanks in advance, Rex.
>> > rexjan@bigpond.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Fuel consumption based on gallons per hour |
That's some great fuel economy Randy. What sort of average cruise
speeds were you getting for the trip?
Deke
----- Original Message -----
From: Randy Daughenbaugh
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 8:58 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Mielage: Fuel consumption based on gallons
per hour
I will throw out one data point for a series 5 with series 7 firewall
forward and 912S.
From Rapid City, South Dakota to just past the other side of South
Dakota - Sioux Center Iowa. 390 miles, 430 miles on I-90, about 4.3
hours on clock, one stop, 13 gal premium car gas 30 miles per gallon.
I now have a better prop and am quite a bit faster and burning more
like 3.3 gal/hr.
Randy
.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of L
Klingmuller
Sent: Monday, March 19, 2007 2:10 PM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Kitfox-List: Mielage: Fuel consumption based on gallons per
hour
The subject of fuel consumtion has so many variables: speed, engine,
altitude, airplane, weight, inclusion/exclusions, averages, etc, etc
Now here is a chanllange for those who have been flying some longer
x-country flights and have computed AVERAGE trip milages.
What is your average MILAGE e. g. st miles/gal or n miles/gal??
Here some recent data for an RV-6A based on total gl used for the
total GPS milage flown from Denver / Tucson / southern Calf/
Albuquerque/Denver (includes one hour of sight seeing and all taxiing
etc)
Total GPS milage: 2000 nml
Total fuel: 102 gl
Average milage: 22.5 gl/st ml
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Source code in posts - Off topic |
BIG PROBLEMO? No, but it takes a lot of concentration (time) to figure out
exactly what you are trying to say. After reading the "give and take" on
some of the issues, "exactly" is a big deal and time is a precious comodity
for some of us.
You might want to consider the concept of "first impressions" in the quality
of communications. If something of importance is being said, how it is said
can be just as important to the receiver of the message relating to its
perceived value and its source. The natural tendency of a human being is to
think "if it looks like garbage, it probably is garbage." There is an old
saying in the computer industry, "garbage in-garbage out." There is another
saying in aircraft maintenance, "if it looks good (i.e. welds, machined
parts, etc.), it probably is good." The opposite is true also. If I apply
the above to communications about technical issues through the email, then
if the message looks like garbage it could very well be garbage and/or the
source of it is a producer of garbage. So why should I waste my time trying
to read it? If it is considered important enough by the sender to
communicate with us, please make it look like it is important enough to
read. If the fix, is simple, why not fix it?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 4:05 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Source code in posts - Off topic
>
> Just wondering if there is actually any one out there who will admit to
> having a big problem with reading the little bit of code that is in some
> of
> the posts? If I had a big problem with it I wouldn't let on.
>
> Noel
> Before I forget do not archive
> BTW I also changed the subject Etc.Etc.
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of fox5flyer
>> Sent: Saturday, March 17, 2007 10:40 AM
>> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Corrosion Protecting Aluminum
>>
>>
>> <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>
>>
>> Emails like this coming from new guys makes me roll my eyes,
>> especially
>> early in the morning before I finish my cup of coffee.
>> "actual Kitfox List
>> web site"? "the List site is only way to go"?
>> First off Steve, I appreciate your input. You seem like a fairly well
>> informed guy, but Jim is right. You are having a
>> configuration problem with
>> your mailer, or perhaps it's the method you use to
>> copy/paste. It isn't the
>> other 500 people here, but you're making it their problem.
>> Your emails are
>> the only ones coming as Jim Crowder described. You've been
>> told about it
>> before, but apparently ignored it.
>> Second, if there is an "actual Kitfox List web site" it would be
>> Sportflight.com. Matronics is a mail server.
>> And third, your opinion about "the List site viewing is only
>> way to go" is
>> noted, but what you don't seem to understand is that this
>> list has been
>> around for close to 20 years, gone through several mail list
>> servers, and
>> still has many of us old timers hanging on, as well as some
>> charter members
>> who kind of like the email version of the list. When we
>> changed to Matt
>> Dralle's Matronics server about two years ago there was no
>> forum at that
>> time, but was added about a year or so ago as an option.
>> What is happening
>> is that many new members are taking the forum option because
>> they aren't
>> aware of the email option and we're getting a mix of forum and email,
>> probably in the neighborhood of 20/80. One of the big
>> problems with the
>> forum version is that for the 80 percent of us using the
>> email version is
>> that we often don't know what the forum contributor is
>> talking about because
>> he/she usually doesn't quote any part of the message they're
>> responding to.
>> Not a huge problem, but definitely an annoyance.
>> Please check your configuration settings and set them to
>> plain text so that
>> we don't have to sift through all the html codes. A lot of us would
>> appreciate it.
>> Deke Morisse
>> List Janitor/Manager/Administrator/whatever...
>>
>>
>> > Sorry... I do realize that my post may show up somewhat
>> "corrupted" when
>> read through misc. e-mail clients. All I can say is when
>> viewed using the
>> actual Kitfox List web site
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewforum.php?f=8&sid=83b6acbe5602
>> af72d6c023eab4688518
>> > all will be right and legible.
>> > I sometimes compose using Microsoft works, then cut and
>> paste to the List
>> Message Body window, and this might be a cause of corrupted
>> e-mail. It does
>> not affect the List site viewing.
>> >
>> > I post right to the site, and forget that others receive
>> through e-mail.
>> While I regret the e-mail corruption, it is not my intention
>> to send e-mail
>> to every viewerreader. IMHO, the List site is the only way to go.
>> > Thanks for the input.
>> > Steve
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Read this topic online here:
>> >
>> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=101168#101168
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 15
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Source code in posts - Off topic |
> "if the message looks like garbage it could very well be garbage and/or the
> source of it is a producer of garbage. "
what's your point?
steve
Message 16
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Please read this sort of OT |
"as here, tend to quote the very commercial publication who's statements are being
contested. Hello?"
Hmm, must have hit someones sore spot eh?
Guess that's why 84KF is now denied access. Gee, who has the access to do that?
perhaps.....
Message 17
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Source code in posts - Off topic |
My point-- if the message is difficult to read because a computer program
changes the typed figure/letters into another form and then the message
literally looks like the message sender had his fingers on the wrong keys,
then the first impression is that the message is garbage or at least not
quickly deciphered or maybe not worth the effort to decipher. If the sender
has a quick fix available, why not use it?
----- Original Message -----
From: <Kitfoxv@comcast.net>
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 8:18 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Source code in posts - Off topic
>
>
>> "if the message looks like garbage it could very well be garbage and/or
>> the
>> source of it is a producer of garbage. "
>
> what's your point?
> steve
>
>
>
Message 18
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Source code in posts - Off topic |
You also have the option to go to the original site of the post and read it
in plain language, exactly as posted. The poster is not sending you e-mail, the
server is. If that facility is not capable of sending accurate copies, why
do YOU use it .(e-mail) ..and why do you rag on the original writer?
I repeat...the writer\poster is not sending it to your personal e-mail box.
Get it?? Duh...?
You still didn't explain your crude, rude and statement.....
"if the message looks like garbage it could very well be garbage and/or the
source of it is a producer of garbage."
You imply the writer is garbage.
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|