---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 06/18/07: 33 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:13 AM - Re: Re: KitFox 2.fuel level problem,cant see fuel in tanks (Steve Shinabery) 2. 03:21 AM - Re: Re: KitFox 2.fuel level problem,cant see fuel in tanks (Michel Verheughe) 3. 03:24 AM - Re: Impulse Line (fox5flyer) 4. 04:05 AM - Lynn Matteson's trip (fox5flyer) 5. 05:25 AM - Re: Impulse Line (Guy Buchanan) 6. 05:41 AM - Re: Impulse Line (Jim_and_Lucy Chuk) 7. 06:45 AM - Re: Impulse Line (Noel Loveys) 8. 08:19 AM - Re: Lynn Matteson's trip (kerrjohna@comcast.net) 9. 08:51 AM - Are Kitfox I-III and Avid HH ribs interchangeable? (dholly) 10. 09:04 AM - Re: Jabiru 2200 Install Photos (again) (DanM) 11. 09:32 AM - Re: Jabiru 2200 Install Photos (again) (wingnut) 12. 10:20 AM - Re: Landing light lense??? (n85ae) 13. 10:48 AM - Re:rotax pulse pump leaking weep hole (Napier, Mark) 14. 11:57 AM - Re: Jabiru 2200 Install Photos (again) (DanM) 15. 02:02 PM - Start up oil pressure, Jabiru (DanM) 16. 02:04 PM - Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (icaza francisco) 17. 02:52 PM - Re: Start up oil pressure, Jabiru (Michel Verheughe) 18. 03:15 PM - FS: NIB Icom IC-A200 Panel Mount Radio (darinh) 19. 04:18 PM - Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (wingnut) 20. 04:32 PM - Re: Impulse Line (dwight purdy) 21. 04:41 PM - Re: Re: rotax pulse pump leaking weep hole (dwight purdy) 22. 05:31 PM - Re: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (Lowell Fitt) 23. 05:38 PM - Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (Noel Loveys) 24. 05:51 PM - Re: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (Noel Loveys) 25. 05:58 PM - Re: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (Noel Loveys) 26. 06:19 PM - Re: rotax pulse pump leaking weep hole (Tom Jones) 27. 06:36 PM - Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (wingnut) 28. 07:24 PM - Impulse Line (Jim Crowder) 29. 07:31 PM - Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (icaza francisco) 30. 08:21 PM - Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (wingnut) 31. 09:19 PM - Re: Lynn Matteson's trip (Guy Buchanan) 32. 09:19 PM - Re: Re: Jabiru 2200 Install Photos (again) (Guy Buchanan) 33. 09:19 PM - Re: Re: Landing light lense??? (Guy Buchanan) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:13:08 AM PST US From: Steve Shinabery Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: KitFox 2.fuel level problem,cant see fuel in tanks it would just B nice to see how much fuel is in fuel tanks.to B safe.very hard to see fuel in tanks.with sun light etc.on them.yes I do a pre flight.but I do not want to run out of fuel either just because I can not see how much fuel is in tanks.I would hate to put her down some where.just because of a miss jugement in fuel.or worst.there s been alot of planes go down because of no fuel in tanks.and I do not want to B one of thoese pilots.I want to B a safe pilot. thanks Steve Shinabery 554KF wingnut wrote: > > > >> Don't you do a flight plan and navigation before every flight that takes you cross country? I'm hardly ever a mile off course or a half a gallon off on my calculations. >> > > > Yes but you never know if you're going to encounter higher head winds than you expected. With a long cross country in a 95 knt airplane, a little bit of extra head wind can make a huge difference in your range. Cross checking my actual position and actual fuel level against the flight plan was part of my training. > > -------- > Luis Rodriguez > Model IV 1200 > Rotax 912UL > Flying Weekly > Laurens, SC (34A) > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=118974#118974 > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 03:21:46 AM PST US From: Michel Verheughe Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: KitFox 2.fuel level problem,cant see fuel in tanks > From: Steve Shinabery [shinco@bright.net] > it would just B nice to see how much fuel is in fuel tanks.to B > safe. What I do is to rock a bit the plane, to see the fuel level moving in the glass. Another nice feature is a low-fuel warning sensor on the top of the header tank. That should give you another 20 minutes flight. Lowell manufactures such low-level sensors. Cheers, Michel Verheughe Norway Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200
________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 03:24:16 AM PST US From: "fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line Jim, as the rear piston comes down it creates a momentary crankcase pressure that sends this "pulse" of crankcase pressure through the line (usually typical fuel line) to the Mikuni fuel pump nearby. If the line is too long the pressure pulse at the pump is diluted. Also, if the pulse line is too soft, the line can actually expand a little that also dilutes the pressure at the pump. If that happens the pump doesn't get enough of a pulse to pump fuel efficiently. What is recommended--if I recall correctly--is that the line be no more than 12" long and be of a material that won't expand under the pressure pulses. For this reason, some of the very soft urethane types aren't suitable as pulse lines. Hope this helps. Deke Morisse N148DM S5/Soob/CAP NE Michigan "Take time to laugh - it is the music of the soul." ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Crowder" Sent: Monday, June 18, 2007 1:03 AM Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line > > What purpose does it serve? It seems a good way to get fuel into the > crankcase, something I would think was very undesirable. Please understand > I am sure it does serve a purpose, it just is not apparent to me. > > Jim Crowder > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim_and_Lucy > Chuk > Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2007 7:18 PM > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line > > > > The impulse line goes from the crankcase to the Mikuni fuel pump on a 2 > stroke engine. Perhaps some fourstrokes use one, but I don't know about > that for sure. > Jim Chuk > Avid Mk IV > > > >From: "Jim Crowder" > >To: "Kitfox List" > >Subject: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line > >Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2007 19:03:58 -0600 > > > > > >Hey you'al, what is an impulse line? It is a term I have not encountered > >before. When I see something new to me, it is a chance to learn. I have > >installed a lot of fuel pumps on aircraft, motor homes, etc., but none had > >such a line that I am aware of. > > > > > > >You wrote: > > >Heavy clear tubing is recommended for impulse line so you can see what is > >going on in it. > > > >Jim Crowder > >S5/3300 Jabiru (Engine swap in process) > >North Front Range of Colorado > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Don't miss your chance to WIN $10,000 and other great prizes from Microsoft > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:05:19 AM PST US From: "fox5flyer" Subject: Kitfox-List: Lynn Matteson's trip Good morning Listers. For those of you who have been following the cross country trip of Lynn Matteson's, he's back in the air again. Briefly, Lynn began at Grass Lake Michigan, near Jackson, flew down to Texas near Austin, then west to Blythe CA, and finally north to Auburn CA to visit with Duane Roeb where he's been on R&R for the past week or so. Except for the usual weather problems this time of year the trip was essentially uneventful and his Jabiru 2200 KF4 Speedster did it's job nicely. Saturday morning Lynn left Auburn at 0600pt, arriving at Wendover UT approx 1100mt. Total for the leg was 4.2 hours and 487.5 air miles including a stop at Battle Mt. He had a good tailwind and used 17 gallons of fuel. Severe weather was forecast on the way so he wisely decided, rather than try to out run it, that was enough for the day and tied down with an RON at a nearby motel for a toddy and shower. Fortunately, the bad weather passed them by so no damage or problems. Just some worry. Sunday morning (17June07) he departed Wendover at approx 0730 enroute to Brigham City UT via Promontory Pt. Lynn is a flatlander and this is some very mountainous country so he used the advice of the locals to find his way through. He only flew 1.1 hours for 131 miles before he decided to tie down for the day. Today, his plan is to depart Brigham City about 0600 with destination Cheyenne WY. His plan was to do a lot of visiting on the way back to Grass Lake, but he has decided that he wants to just head for home. After I talk with him tonight I'll fill in on today's progress. Deke Morisse N148DM S5/Soob/CAP NE Michigan "Take time to laugh - it is the music of the soul." ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:25:07 AM PST US From: Guy Buchanan Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line At 11:03 PM 6/17/2007, you wrote: >What purpose does it serve? Rotax 2-strokes use a pressure driven diaphragm fuel pump. The "Impulse Line" runs from the crankcase to the drive port of the pump. The variation in the crankcase pressure in a 2-stroke is sufficient to drive the pump. Guy Buchanan San Diego, CA K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar. ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:41:45 AM PST US From: "Jim_and_Lucy Chuk" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line When the piston comes down you get more pressure in the crankcase, and when it goes back up, you get less pressure there. The difference in pressure causes a diaphram in the fuel pump to move back and forth which togeather with one way valves in the fuel pump alow the pump to work and deliver fuel to the carbs. Unless that diaphram has a hole in it, no fuel will go into the crankcase. The impulse line ofcourse alows the fuel pump to feel the differences in pressure in the crankcase. Jim Chuk Avid Mk IV Chisholm Mn >From: "Jim Crowder" >To: >Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line >Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2007 00:03:22 -0600 > > >What purpose does it serve? It seems a good way to get fuel into the >crankcase, something I would think was very undesirable. Please understand >I am sure it does serve a purpose, it just is not apparent to me. > >Jim Crowder > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com >[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Jim_and_Lucy >Chuk >Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2007 7:18 PM >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line > > > > >The impulse line goes from the crankcase to the Mikuni fuel pump on a 2 >stroke engine. Perhaps some fourstrokes use one, but I don't know about >that for sure. >Jim Chuk >Avid Mk IV > > > >From: "Jim Crowder" > >To: "Kitfox List" > >Subject: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line > >Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2007 19:03:58 -0600 > > > > > >Hey you'al, what is an impulse line? It is a term I have not encountered > >before. When I see something new to me, it is a chance to learn. I have > >installed a lot of fuel pumps on aircraft, motor homes, etc., but none >had > >such a line that I am aware of. > > > > > > >You wrote: > > >Heavy clear tubing is recommended for impulse line so you can see what >is > >going on in it. > > > >Jim Crowder > >S5/3300 Jabiru (Engine swap in process) > >North Front Range of Colorado > > > > > > > > > > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Dont miss your chance to WIN $10,000 and other great prizes from Microsoft > > _________________________________________________________________ Picture this share your photos and you could win big! http://www.GETREALPhotoContest.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM&loc=us ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 06:45:27 AM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line Jim: I waited for the other more experienced people in the group to post answers to your questions. As they have said the impulse line is a tube that connects the diaphragm pump ( generally Mikuni) to the base of the engine. The base of a two stroke engine acts as the intake manifold for each cylinder and sends pulses of air mixed with fuel/oil to the cylinders. It is possible for some of the fuel/oil to migrate up the impulse line to the pump. If the pump is installed horizontally with the impulse line entering it from the bottom then any of that gas/oil will drain back to the base of the engine when the engine is stopped. You will find out everything you wanted to know, and a few things you didn't want to know, about two stroke Rotax engines here: http://www.800-airwolf.com/articles.htm There is even more information available on the great Canadian ultralight page (unabashed national plug) here: http://www.ultralightnews.com/ . Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern Campbellton, Newfoundland, Canada Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA Aerocet 1100s noelloveys@yahoo.ca Do not archive > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > Jim Crowder > Sent: Monday, June 18, 2007 3:33 AM > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line > > > > What purpose does it serve? It seems a good way to get fuel into the > crankcase, something I would think was very undesirable. > Please understand > I am sure it does serve a purpose, it just is not apparent to me. > > Jim Crowder > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of > Jim_and_Lucy > Chuk > Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2007 7:18 PM > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line > > > > > The impulse line goes from the crankcase to the Mikuni fuel > pump on a 2 > stroke engine. Perhaps some fourstrokes use one, but I don't > know about > that for sure. > Jim Chuk > Avid Mk IV > > > >From: "Jim Crowder" > >To: "Kitfox List" > >Subject: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line > >Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2007 19:03:58 -0600 > > > > > >Hey you'al, what is an impulse line? It is a term I have > not encountered > >before. When I see something new to me, it is a chance to > learn. I have > >installed a lot of fuel pumps on aircraft, motor homes, > etc., but none had > >such a line that I am aware of. > > > > > > >You wrote: > > >Heavy clear tubing is recommended for impulse line so you > can see what is > >going on in it. > > > >Jim Crowder > >S5/3300 Jabiru (Engine swap in process) > >North Front Range of Colorado > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Don't miss your chance to WIN $10,000 and other great prizes > from Microsoft > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 08:19:50 AM PST US From: kerrjohna@comcast.net Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Lynn Matteson's trip I wish I had checked my mail yesterday. Lynn was within 20 miles of 6 Kitfoxes while he was at Brigham. Two in Ogden, one in Brigham and three here in Logan. We could maybe put together a gaggle and lead him through the mountains. While the peaks east of Brigham would appear imposing they are easily managed and then there is nothing to slow him down. When three of us flew to OSH in our Kitfoxes we took essentially the same route with the most intimidating part of the trip being the ascending to altitude before turning east. John Kerr Logan UT -------------- Original message -------------- From: "fox5flyer" Good morning Listers. For those of you who have been following the cross country trip of Lynn Matteson's, he's back in the air again. Briefly, Lynn began at Grass Lake Michigan, near Jackson, flew down to Texas near Austin, then west to Blythe CA, and finally north to Auburn CA to visit with Duane Roeb where he's been on R&R for the past week or so. Except for the usual weather problems this time of year the trip was essentially uneventful and his Jabiru 2200 KF4 Speedster did it's job nicely. Saturday morning Lynn left Auburn at 0600pt, arriving at Wendover UT approx 1100mt. Total for the leg was 4.2 hours and 487.5 air miles including a stop at Battle Mt. He had a good tailwind and used 17 gallons of fuel. Severe weather was forecast on the way so he wisely decided, rather than try to out run it, that was enough for the day and tied down with an RON at a nearby motel for a toddy and shower. Fortunately, the bad weather passed them by so no damage or problems. Just some worry. Sunday morning (17June07) he departed Wendover at approx 0730 enroute to Brigham City UT via Promontory Pt. Lynn is a flatlander and this is some very mountainous country so he used the advice of the locals to find his way through. He only flew 1.1 hours for 131 miles before he decided to tie down for the day. Today, his plan is to depart Brigham City about 0600 with destination Cheyenne WY. His plan was to do a lot of visiting on the way back to Grass Lake, but he has decided that he wants to just head for home. After I talk with him tonight I'll fill in on today's progress. Deke Morisse N148DM S5/Soob/CAP NE Michigan "Take time to laugh - it is the music of the soul."
I wish I had checked my mail yesterday.  Lynn was within 20 miles of 6 Kitfoxes while he was at Brigham.  Two in Ogden, one in Brigham and three here in Logan.  We could maybe put together a gaggle and lead him through the mountains.  While the peaks east of Brigham would appear imposing they are easily managed and then there is nothing to slow him down.
 
When three of us flew to OSH in our Kitfoxes we took essentially the same route with the most intimidating part of the trip being the ascending to altitude before turning east.
 
John Kerr
Logan UT
 
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "fox5flyer" <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>
Good morning Listers.  For those of you who have been following the cross country trip of Lynn Matteson's, he's back in the air again.  Briefly, Lynn began at Grass Lake Michigan, near Jackson, flew down to Texas near Austin, then west to Blythe CA, and finally north to Auburn CA to visit with Duane Roeb where he's been on R&R for the past week or so.  Except for the usual weather problems this time of year the trip was essentially uneventful and his Jabiru 2200 KF4 Speedster did it's job nicely.
Saturday morning Lynn left Auburn at 0600pt, arriving at Wendover UT approx 1100mt.  Total for the leg was 4.2 hours and 487.5 air miles including a stop at Battle Mt.  He had a good tailwind and used 17 gallons of fuel.  Severe weather was forecast on the way so he wisely decided, rather than try to out run it, that was enough for the day and tied down with an RON at a nearby motel for a toddy and shower.  Fortunately, the bad weather passed them by so no damage or problems.  Just some worry.
Sunday morning (17June07) he departed Wendover at approx 0730 enroute to Brigham City UT via Promontory Pt.  Lynn is a flatlander and this is some very mountainous country so he used the advice of the locals to find his way through.  He only flew 1.1 hours for 131 miles before he decided to tie down for the day. 
Today, his plan is to depart Brigham City about 0600 with destination Cheyenne WY.  His plan was to do a lot of visiting on the way back to Grass Lake, but he has decided that he wants to just head for home.  After I talk with him tonight I'll fill in on today's progress. 
Deke Morisse
N148DM
S5/Soob/CAP
NE Michigan
"Take time to laugh - it is the music of the soul."
________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 08:51:22 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Are Kitfox I-III and Avid HH ribs interchangeable? From: "dholly" You, like I, may have heard or read that Kitfox I-III and Avid HH use the same airfoil and wing ribs, therefore, are exact duplicates of each other. Thanks to a local KF-II builder, I had the opportunity to do a hands-on comparison of both ribs. Pics show results. Note: in photos, KF-II rib is a new replacement which matched original perfectly; Avid HH rib has blue tape on capstrip. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119136#119136 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/cimg5004_155.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/cimg4993_155.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/cimg4990_159.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/cimg4989_185.jpg ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:04:54 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Jabiru 2200 Install Photos (again) From: "DanM" Here's some requested photos of my cowling with the Jabiru 2200, Model IV Kitfox -------- Dan Mc Intyre Kitfox Model IV, Jab 2200 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119137#119137 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1010005_316.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p1010001_172.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p6160010_885.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p6160009_175.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p6120008_204.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p6090002_111.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/p6090001_198.jpg ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:32:17 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Jabiru 2200 Install Photos (again) From: "wingnut" > Here's some requested photos of my cowling with the Jabiru 2200, Model IV Kitfox Beautiful cowling. Did you make it from scratch? Is that a big job? I've never been a big fan of the round cowl but I'm reluctant to spend much time or money on a cosmetic mods. -------- Luis Rodriguez Model IV 1200 Rotax 912UL Flying Weekly Laurens, SC (34A) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119143#119143 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:20:13 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Landing light lense??? From: "n85ae" I would not bother. The wing tip lights are a horrible runway illuminator, at best. I flew a couple years with the wingtip lights, which regardless how well aimed they are, were never better than poor in my opinion. As in this pic: http://www.aselia.com/n85ae/mod1.jpg I made a detachable light bar that attaches to the belly using the float attach brackets to fasten it to. I mount halogen driving lights to it, and use a quick connect plug. Takes two minutes to put on my lights, and I look like a 747 coming in for a landing. A big benefit, is reflected light off the belly illuminates the ground in the flare. I feed the light bar with a 40A rated relay, and have a six inch driving light in the center, and two smaller fog lights on the side. Drag is negligeble, and I pretty much leave the bar on all the time. I still have the wingtip lights on the plane, and comparing the two is like comparing illuminating your garage with a candle to, to illuminating it with shoplites. :) Once you have seen the difference you'd never go back. It is also a LOT easier to make a light bar than it is to fit the wingtip lenses. Here's an early pic when I was trial fitting it: http://www.aselia.com/n85ae/img0786.jpg http://www.aselia.com/n85ae/img0787.jpg It is made from hardware store 1/2" weldable steel tubing. It is an easy afternoon project if you know how to weld. Jeff Hays Series 5, IO-240B Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119149#119149 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:48:52 AM PST US Subject: RE:Kitfox-List: rotax pulse pump leaking weep hole From: "Napier, Mark" Hey Tom, The fuel can't leak out of the weep hole. It is on the other side of the diaphragm. You went through 2 pumps so you can't have a bad one. If the diaphragm had a hole in it the pump wouldn't operate and fuel would run down the impulse line. You must have a leak where one of the 3 fuel lines connects to the pump. If you pull a low vacuum on the impulse side you would notice a slow leak as the air slowly came in the weep hole. I would be very careful doing that as you could damage the pump. FWIW, on my plane the pump is installed per the instructions mounted sideways to the firewall. Since that mounting defeats the weep hole sump I plugged it and drilled a 2nd hold the some diameter (I think it was .025) with a PCB drill bit at a low point down in the aluminum casting. Cheers, Mark Napier Time: 12:32:43 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: rotax pulse pump leaking weep hole From: "Tom Jones" The pulse pump on my 503 rotax leaks fuel out the weep hole. It is installed according to the kitfox manual. It is mounted high on the fire wall in a horizontal position with the weep hole on the bottom. I tried a new pump and rerouting the pulse line up over the carb flanges but it did not even slow the amount of fuel leaking. I am using 30R9 rubber fuel injection hose for the pulse line. It l;eaks about 1/2 to 1 ounce per hour of flight. I asked this question on the Kolb list. They seem to think something is amiss. They don't seem to have this problem Some think the fuel pump diaphram is leaking. I bought a new pump but it does the same. Both pumps I have tried will hold a vacum in the pulse chamber. I am out of ideas on how to fix this. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV, Phase one 503, Warp Ellensburg, WA - - - - - Appended by Scientific Atlanta, a Cisco company - - - - - This e-mail and any attachments may contain information which is confidential, proprietary, privileged or otherwise protected by law. The information is solely intended for the named addressee (or a person responsible for delivering it to the addressee). If you are not the intended recipient of this message, you are not authorized to read, print, retain, copy or disseminate this message or any part of it. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete it from your computer. ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 11:57:29 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Jabiru 2200 Install Photos (again) From: "DanM" Luis, the cowling was supplied by Jabiru with the ffw kit that I purchased with the engine. The bottom cowl fits fine, but the upper cowl needed some modifications because it would not fit against the windshield. I had to remake the lip to match my configuration. I also lowered the instrument panel down and had to modifiy the panel dash. A lot of work but worth it in my opinion. I recieved lot of help from Dave Jalanti, who had already done the same thing. He can be contacted thru Jabiru USA web site. -------- Dan Mc Intyre Kitfox Model IV, Jab 2200 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119180#119180 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:02:49 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Start up oil pressure, Jabiru From: "DanM" Anybody out there now what the new engine (cold) 1st start oil pressure should be?. When I crank the engine, but not starting it, the oil pressure climbs to 75- 80 psi. Seems kinda high to me, any thoughts? Thanks -------- Dan Mc Intyre Kitfox Model IV, Jab 2200 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119214#119214 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 02:04:06 PM PST US From: icaza francisco Subject: Kitfox-List: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV List, I have converted my classic IV into a nose wheel. Ive flown it twice and it has been quite difficult to make the flair before main wheels touch the ground(Grove landing gear). Just two questions: 1. Has someone noticed that after makeing the nose wheel conversion? 2. Where can I get the plot to calculate Weight & balance? My manual has just the tail dragger option. Thanks in advance, Francisco Icaza Classic IV Rotax 912-S Mexico City. ___________________________________________________________ La mejor conexin a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por $100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx
________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 02:52:35 PM PST US From: Michel Verheughe Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Start up oil pressure, Jabiru On Jun 18, 2007, at 11:01 PM, DanM wrote: > Anybody out there now what the new engine (cold) 1st start oil > pressure > should be?. When I crank the engine, but not starting it, the oil > pressure climbs to 75- 80 psi. Seems kinda high to me, any thoughts? When I fly, the oil pressure is about 45 psi, Dan. When I start the engine and it's cold, it may climb as much as 75-80 psi when the engine is cold but, honestly, I don't know what it shows when I crank without starting because ... my Jabiru 2200 always starts at the first turn. Is your engine new has has never started? Do you have an oil cooler? Without the cooler you will see more variation in pressure than with it. Cheers, Michel Verheughe Norway Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:15:53 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: FS: NIB Icom IC-A200 Panel Mount Radio From: "darinh" I have a new in box IC-A200 for sale. I have decided to go with the SL-40. First $650 takes it, I will pay shipping in the lower 48 states. -------- Darin Hawkes Series 7 (under Construction) 914 Turbo Ogden, Utah Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119233#119233 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 04:18:03 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV From: "wingnut" What makes you think the W&B plots would be different for tail dragger vs tri gear? The plane doesn't know the difference when it's in the air right? -------- Luis Rodriguez Model IV 1200 Rotax 912UL Flying Weekly Laurens, SC (34A) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119241#119241 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 04:32:50 PM PST US From: dwight purdy Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line I saw a fellow use one on a ea71 subaru pulling an Avid model one. He said he could shot it eight feet straight up. Thought that was good enough. Dwight Purdy model ll marion IN. At 01:17 AM 6/18/2007 +0000, you wrote: > >The impulse line goes from the crankcase to the Mikuni fuel pump on a 2 >stroke engine. Perhaps some fourstrokes use one, but I don't know about >that for sure. >Jim Chuk >Avid Mk IV > > >>From: "Jim Crowder" >>To: "Kitfox List" >>Subject: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line >>Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2007 19:03:58 -0600 >> >> >>Hey you'al, what is an impulse line? It is a term I have not encountered >>before. When I see something new to me, it is a chance to learn. I have >>installed a lot of fuel pumps on aircraft, motor homes, etc., but none had >>such a line that I am aware of. >> >> >> >You wrote: >> >Heavy clear tubing is recommended for impulse line so you can see what is >>going on in it. >> >>Jim Crowder >>S5/3300 Jabiru (Engine swap in process) >>North Front Range of Colorado >> >> >> >> > >_________________________________________________________________ >Don't miss your chance to WIN $10,000 and other great prizes from Microsoft > > >-- >269.9.0/852 - Release Date: 6/17/2007 8:23 AM -- ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 04:41:08 PM PST US From: dwight purdy Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: rotax pulse pump leaking weep hole I think it was more like 20 in. That was too long for mine. Dwight Purdy model ll marion IN. At 08:28 PM 6/17/2007 -0700, you wrote: > >I also had the same problem on a 503 I used to fly on a n3pup. The pule >line was to long. Their is a specification of no longer than 12". If >memory serves me well. > > >Read this topic online here: > >http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119048#119048 > > >-- >3:02 PM -- ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 05:31:26 PM PST US From: "Lowell Fitt" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV Luis, Actually, I think the airplane would know the difference. a big bunch of weight in the nose gear under the engine, no tail wheel eleven feet back and the aft positioned maingear would definitely alter the CG - nice to know where it actually is and and if it is still in the envelope. From the post, it sounds like it has moved forward a bit. I think he is asking if anyone has the arm lengths for the aft positioned landing gear and the new nose wheel out front for the re-weighing calculations and the form for plugging in all the numbers. Lowell Fitt Cameron Park, CA Model IV-1200 R-912 UL Warp 1998 870 hrs. ----- Original Message ----- From: "wingnut" Sent: Monday, June 18, 2007 4:16 PM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV > > What makes you think the W&B plots would be different for tail dragger vs > tri gear? The plane doesn't know the difference when it's in the air > right? > > -------- > Luis Rodriguez > Model IV 1200 > Rotax 912UL > Flying Weekly > Laurens, SC (34A) > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119241#119241 > > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 05:38:19 PM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV Icaza: Re-weigh the plane. The arm for the datum to the nosewheel will be considered negative. After that the calculations are pretty similar to the conventional gear. E.g. Weight dist arm Nose wheel 100lb. @ -30" = - 3000in lb Left main 275lb. @ 20" = 5500in. lb. Right main 280lb @ 20" = 5600in. lb. Weight 655lb. @ 5600 + 5500 - 3000 = 8100inlb 8100in.lb./655lb. = 12.36" In this example the CG is 12.36" aft of the datum The figures I used in this example do not reflect the weighed values of any particular aircraft. I pulled them and the distances from the datum out of thin air. Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern Campbellton, Newfoundland, Canada Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA Aerocet 1100s noelloveys@yahoo.ca Do not archive > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > icaza francisco > Sent: Monday, June 18, 2007 6:24 PM > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kitfox-List: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV > > > List, > > I have converted my classic IV into a nose wheel. I=B4ve > flown it twice and it has been quite difficult to make > the flair before main wheels touch the ground(Grove > landing gear). > > Just two questions: > > 1. Has someone noticed that after makeing the nose > wheel conversion? > > 2. Where can I get the plot to calculate Weight & > balance? My manual has just the tail dragger option. > > > Thanks in advance, > > > Francisco Icaza > Classic IV Rotax 912-S > Mexico City. > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > La mejor conexi=F3n a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo > por $100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx > > 

>
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> href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://w
> ww.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
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> href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
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________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 05:51:48 PM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV The arms of both the mains and the nose over the tail have moved.... You better believe the CG is moved. Also consider the weight of the nose gear as opposed to the tail wheel. Once the CG is calculated the corrections for loading/fuel will be exactly as before. CG is one of the important changes when ever you change gear configuration. Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern Campbellton, Newfoundland, Canada Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA Aerocet 1100s noelloveys@yahoo.ca Do not archive > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of wingnut > Sent: Monday, June 18, 2007 8:47 PM > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for > Classic IV > > > > What makes you think the W&B plots would be different for > tail dragger vs tri gear? The plane doesn't know the > difference when it's in the air right? > > -------- > Luis Rodriguez > Model IV 1200 > Rotax 912UL > Flying Weekly > Laurens, SC (34A) > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119241#119241 > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 05:58:20 PM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV Lowell: I think the datum on my plane is the leading edge of the wing. All he needs t0o do is drop a plumb bob from there ands measure the linear distance to the nose wheel and then back to the mains. He should re-weigh the plane. Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern Campbellton, Newfoundland, Canada Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA Aerocet 1100s noelloveys@yahoo.ca Do not archive > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > Lowell Fitt > Sent: Monday, June 18, 2007 9:59 PM > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance > for Classic IV > > > > > Luis, > > Actually, I think the airplane would know the difference. a > big bunch of > weight in the nose gear under the engine, no tail wheel > eleven feet back and > the aft positioned maingear would definitely alter the CG - > nice to know > where it actually is and and if it is still in the envelope. > From the post, > it sounds like it has moved forward a bit. > > I think he is asking if anyone has the arm lengths for the > aft positioned > landing gear and the new nose wheel out front for the re-weighing > calculations and the form for plugging in all the numbers. > > Lowell Fitt > Cameron Park, CA > Model IV-1200 R-912 UL Warp > 1998 870 hrs. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "wingnut" > To: > Sent: Monday, June 18, 2007 4:16 PM > Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for > Classic IV > > > > > > > What makes you think the W&B plots would be different for > tail dragger vs > > tri gear? The plane doesn't know the difference when it's > in the air > > right? > > > > -------- > > Luis Rodriguez > > Model IV 1200 > > Rotax 912UL > > Flying Weekly > > Laurens, SC (34A) > > > > > > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119241#119241 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 06:19:14 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: rotax pulse pump leaking weep hole From: "Tom Jones" My answer to those that think fuel can not enter the pulse pump vacum chamber on a two stroke is another Question. What keeps fuel in the crankcase out of the pulse line? The theory I have now, after responses from 2 different 503's with the same problem fixed by shortening the pulse line is: Air pressure keeps fuel ot of the pulse line. If the line is too long the larger volume of air in the line can be compressed by the crankcase pressure, thus allowing the fuel in. With a shorter pulse line, less air to be compressed equals higher pressure in the pulse line. I have moved my pulse pump and shortened the pulse line from 22 to 11 inches. Now I'm waiting for the wind to calm down so I can fly and report the results. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV, Phase one 503, Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119275#119275 ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 06:36:50 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV From: "wingnut" > Actually, I think the airplane would know the difference. a big bunch of > weight in the nose gear under the engine, no tail wheel eleven feet back and > the aft positioned maingear would definitely alter the CG - nice to know > where it actually is and and if it is still in the envelope. From the post, > it sounds like it has moved forward a bit. > > I think he is asking if anyone has the arm lengths for the aft positioned > landing gear and the new nose wheel out front for the re-weighing > calculations and the form for plugging in all the numbers. That's not what I meant. In the original post, Francisco mentioned that he has the manual which has W&B procedures for the tail dragger configuration. I'm just pointing out that the same manual applys for the nose wheel configuration. Of course, his balance has changed. In fact, given his inability to flair on landing, I'd say he's flying very nose heavy. But the aerodynamics haven't changed so same procedures apply and the datum plane hasn't moved. -------- Luis Rodriguez Model IV 1200 Rotax 912UL Flying Weekly Laurens, SC (34A) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119278#119278 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 07:24:29 PM PST US From: "Jim Crowder" Subject: Kitfox-List: Impulse Line Thanks to Noel, Guy, Jim, and Deke, I now for the cost of a few electrons understand how the impulse line drives the pump. If I missed somebody blame my advanced age. There has been traffic on the List regarding this for some time and even though it doesn't apply to me, I needed to know how it worked. Do Not Archive Jim Crowder S5/3300 Jabiru (Engine swap in process) North Front Range of Colorado Today I removed the old engine--progress is being achieved on the swap. ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 07:31:01 PM PST US From: icaza francisco Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV Luis, My concern is that I moved several weights that obviously could change the balance of my plane during flight. I changed the front welded main gear for the heavier Grove landing gear, now in the aft position. As well the nose gear is much more heavier than the tail wheel (but much closer to the C.G.), and so on. I also suppose that it was calculated by SkyStar and by Kitfox Aircraft. I just want to know how I can calculate weight & balance again with that configuration. Its as well mandatory for DGAC (Mexican FAA) for anyone that made those changes. Thanks, Francisco Icaza. Classic IV Rotax 912-S Mexico City. --- wingnut escribi: > > > What makes you think the W&B plots would be > different for tail dragger vs tri gear? The plane > doesn't know the difference when it's in the air > right? > > -------- > Luis Rodriguez > Model IV 1200 > Rotax 912UL > Flying Weekly > Laurens, SC (34A) > > > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119241#119241 > > > > > > > > > browse > Subscriptions page, > FAQ, > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List > > Web Forums! > > > > > Llama gratis a cualquier PC del mundo. Con una excelente calidad de sonido. http://mx.messenger.yahoo.com/ ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 08:21:38 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV From: "wingnut" > My concern is that I moved several weights that > obviously could change the balance of my plane during > flight. Yes, the weights have moved. The procedure to find your new center of gravity is the same. You stick a scale under each wheel, and multiply the weight at each with its distance from the leading edge of the main wing (as Noel pointed out, the distance is negative for the nose gear). There's even an example in the manual. The only difference for you is that all the distances have changed but you just have to measure it like Noel suggested. You can even use the same chart showing the CG limits at different take off weights. I wouldn't fly the airplane until this is sorted out one way or the other. You're probably way past the forward cg limit right now. -------- Luis Rodriguez Model IV 1200 Rotax 912UL Flying Weekly Laurens, SC (34A) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=119300#119300 ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 09:19:23 PM PST US From: Guy Buchanan Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Lynn Matteson's trip At 08:18 AM 6/18/2007, you wrote: >Lynn was within 20 miles of 6 Kitfoxes while he was at Brigham. Two >in Ogden, one in Brigham and three here in Logan. So why weren't you guys at Cameron Park? Well? ;-) Guy Buchanan San Diego, CA K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar. Do not archive ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 09:19:23 PM PST US From: Guy Buchanan Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Jabiru 2200 Install Photos (again) At 11:56 AM 6/18/2007, you wrote: >The bottom cowl fits fine, but the upper cowl needed some >modifications because it would not fit against the windshield. I like the cowl and your installation. I have a recommendation, though. (Meaning, I wish I had done it.) If you haven't finished the cowl I'd replace the fasteners along the sides and front with piano hinge the way the RV guys do. Very clean, and very easy to remove the cowl for inspection. Guy Buchanan San Diego, CA K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar. ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 09:19:24 PM PST US From: Guy Buchanan Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Landing light lense??? At 10:19 AM 6/18/2007, you wrote: >I flew a couple years with the wingtip lights, which regardless >how well aimed they are, were never better than poor in my opinion. Putting landing lights on a tail-dragger is tough, by definition, since your approach attitude is so different from you touchdown and taxi attitude. I guess you'd want two lights, one pointed level and one pointed down, but that would effectively halve your illumination. Guy Buchanan San Diego, CA K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar. 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