---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 06/26/07: 28 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:58 AM - Re: Broken battery Box (Noel Loveys) 2. 05:04 AM - Re: [ Don Usher ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! (Noel Loveys) 3. 05:34 AM - Re: (Barry West) 4. 06:39 AM - Tie Downs (wannafly) 5. 07:28 AM - Re: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (Noel Loveys) 6. 09:01 AM - Re: Tie Downs (wingnut) 7. 09:05 AM - Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV (kitfoxmike) 8. 09:30 AM - Tie Downs (fox5flyer) 9. 09:36 AM - Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (Bob Waldron) 10. 09:44 AM - Re: No Title (skyring) 11. 10:02 AM - Re: Tie Downs (Dennis Golden) 12. 10:06 AM - Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (kitfoxmike) 13. 12:16 PM - Re: Tie Downs (Jim_and_Lucy Chuk) 14. 12:36 PM - Re: Tie Downs (kitfoxmike) 15. 12:48 PM - Re: (Randy Daughenbaugh) 16. 01:04 PM - Re: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (Bob Waldron) 17. 01:41 PM - Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (Michel Verheughe) 18. 01:57 PM - Re: Tie Downs (Lyle Persels) 19. 01:57 PM - Re: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (john oakley) 20. 02:09 PM - Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (kitfoxmike) 21. 05:30 PM - Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (eskflyer) 22. 05:48 PM - Re: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (john oakley) 23. 06:01 PM - Re: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (Noel Loveys) 24. 07:12 PM - Off Topic: Todays flight (Tom Jones) 25. 07:18 PM - Re: Off Topic: Todays flight (Tom Jones) 26. 07:35 PM - Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (kitfoxmike) 27. 08:39 PM - Re: Re: Off Topic: Todays flight (john oakley) 28. 09:10 PM - Re: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 (Bob Waldron) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:58:13 AM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Broken battery Box Especially when the flex is with the grain of the metal! Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern Campbellton, Newfoundland, Canada Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA Aerocet 1100s noelloveys@yahoo.ca Do not archive > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of A Smith > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 1:01 AM > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Broken battery Box > > > > I am no engineer, but the damage looks like it was caused by > flex. The same > for the clamps. The long bolts will let the weight move the > box mounts. Ever > so slightly. Resulting in cracks and then failure. Brackets > should be bolted > right to the tubes. Even if that means runing vertical angle > to bolt the box > onto. Just my thoughts. > Albert Smith > MudLake, Idaho > 5TD NSI turbo ,CAP > > > ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:04:03 AM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: [ Don Usher ] : New Email List Photo Share Available! Amazing! 85 mph hauling what must be the draggiest floats in the world. I doubt I'll hold that kind of speed with my Areocets. Not with a calibrated ASI any way. Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern Campbellton, Newfoundland, Canada Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA Aerocet 1100s noelloveys@yahoo.ca Do not archive > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of > Email List Photo Shares > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 1:03 AM > To: Email List Photo Shares > Subject: Kitfox-List: [ Don Usher ] : New Email List Photo > Share Available! > > > > > > A new Email List Photo Share is available: > > Poster: Don Usher > > Lists: Kitfox-List > > Subject: KF 111 - Floats > > > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare/denver7@xplornet.com.06.25 > .2007/index.html > > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > o Main Photo Share Index > > http://www.matronics.com/photoshare > > o Submitting a Photo Share > > If you wish to submit a Photo Share of your own, please > include the > following information along with your email message and files: > > 1) Email List or Lists that they are related to: > 2) Your Full Name: > 3) Your Email Address: > 4) One line Subject description: > 5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic: > 6) One-line Description of each photo or file: > > Email the information above and your files and photos to: > > pictures@matronics.com > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:34:28 AM PST US From: "Barry West" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Randy and all, the temperature difference was a matter of feel, but one was very obviously colder than the other. Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Randy Daughenbaugh To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 11:57 AM Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Barry, I don't understand what you mean by carburetor temperature. Where do you measure it? I like Rick's suggestion. It maybe that one float valve was better able to contain the pressure than the other when there seemed to be a difference from one side to the other. Randy Daughenbaugh, N10NH Black Hills of South Dakota, - Near Mount Rushmore Home Strip, Grass Room in Hangar for visitors Series 5/7 (7 Firewall Forward) 912S, Warp Drive Taper Tip Gross Weight 1320 lbs, Flying since November 2004 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry West Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 8:37 AM To: Kitfox List Subject: Kitfox-List: Engine Running Rough In January, 2007 my Kitfox IV with a 912 S engine threw all three blades of my GSC propeller. There was one big "bump," the engine stopped and I landed without incidence. Observation of the engine revealed that both carburetors came off and the engine mount was damaged. I sent the gearbox to Lockwood and performed a runout test on the crankshaft with no damage either indicated. After installing a new propeller and engine mount, the engine ran fine for about 12 hours of local flights. Then, Saturday before last, June 16, during a Young Eagles rally, the engine started running rough. It would idle smooth but became very rough at about 3000 rpm. I suspected a kinked fuel line, removed the fire shield, saw nothing, and replaced it. Then it ran smooth and I flew it a few times with no problem. The next day I flew it about an hour with no problem. Last Friday, June 22, I started it and it was rough again at about 3000 rpm - I mean really rough and would not run at a higher rpm. In both of these situations the right carburetor was considerably cooler than the left. At this point, I thought it appropriate to run a compression check but when I removed the first spark plug I saw it was heavily coated with soot. I removed all the plugs and they all were the same way. Then I opened both carburetors, top and bottom, but could see nothing that would cause the mixture to be rich. These plugs only had about 25 hours on them. I installed a set of old but clean plugs and put the carburetors back together, started the engine and this time it went to about 4000 rpm before cutting out and running rough. Now the carburetors are both about the same temperature. I removed the top plugs and the ones on the left side were clean and the ones on the right side were covered with soot. What to do? I tend to believe the shock of losing the propeller blades caused some kind of problem with the carburetors. Barry West ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:39:46 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Tie Downs From: "wannafly" Was wondering if anyone has info on Airtime Mfg. I ordered their titanium tie downs back on May 11 and have gotten no response since. I sent my money thru paypal and have been e-mailing them but no one seems to be there. Anyone with a phone number? I have only been in contact with their e-mail but now that has stopped as well.....ideas??? Mic Thiessen Fox IV Speedster C-FOXX Subaru EA81 Canada do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120704#120704 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:28:17 AM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV I also do a post flight inspection. That's when the niggling little things I noticed during the flight are still fresh in my mind. Inspections are a great way to avoid problems, legal and otherwise. A description of exactly which W&B report is in effect has to be entered into the journey log for the airplane before it is allowed to fly with a new configuration. The running joke around here is when the paperwork is approximately equal to the weight of the plane it MAY be allowed to fly! My kitfox, flying, is almost there :-) Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern Campbellton, Newfoundland, Canada Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA Aerocet 1100s noelloveys@yahoo.ca Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 9:51 PM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV Noel, As a practical matter, we do basically the same thing. For various configurations, we have weight and balance info. This info is always reviewed pre-flight to make sure that we have the flight configuration and the weight and balance in sync. Also, we have the weight and balance data with us as soon as the aircraft is rolled out of the hangar, in the event of a ramp check. Again, all data needs to be logged, and checked pre-flight to insure safety. An airplane that is out of weight and balance limits is not safe to fly. In my mind this is one of the most basic things a pilot can do to ensure a safe flight, along with the rest of the pre-fight checklist. Mike mclayton@rochester.rr.com Mobile: 585-737-5506 8 Adams Trail Spencerport, NY 14559 N16AF (KF II Rebuild in Progress) ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 09:01:04 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Tie Downs From: "wingnut" You can enter a complaint through paypal and they will contact the seller on your behalf. If they still have not responded after some mandatory waiting period, you can escalate. I believe they will eventually go as far as freezing the sellers account. It's amazing how much quicker people will respond. -------- Luis Rodriguez Model IV 1200 Rotax 912UL Flying Weekly Laurens, SC (34A) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120730#120730 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:05:00 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Nose wheel and weight & balance for Classic IV From: "kitfoxmike" I do also, it's called check the oil time. Of course I generally do all the inspection of the airplane at this time, nothing worse than finding something needing attention just before a flight [Crying or Very sad] -------- kitfoxmike model IV, 1200 speedster 912ul building RV7a slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit "if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying enough" Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120731#120731 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:30:16 AM PST US From: "fox5flyer" Subject: Kitfox-List: Tie Downs Sorry about your problem Mic and thanks for sharing this with us. I was thinking about ordering a set myself, but I've suddenly lost interest. Since you paid thru Paypal, it's a good thing because you have recourse. Go to the Paypal site for the next step. Good luck. Deke do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "wannafly" Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 8:38 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Tie Downs > > Was wondering if anyone has info on Airtime Mfg. I ordered their titanium tie downs back on May 11 and have gotten no response since. I sent my money thru paypal and have been e-mailing them but no one seems to be there. Anyone with a phone number? I have only been in contact with their e-mail but now that has stopped as well.....ideas??? > > Mic Thiessen > Fox IV Speedster > C-FOXX > Subaru EA81 > Canada > > do not archive > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120704#120704 > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:36:23 AM PST US From: "Bob Waldron" Subject: Kitfox-List: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 Hi, I'm new to this list. Anyone have experience with replacing the Kitfox Model 3/4 landing gear with the one piece aluminum Grove gear? Thanks, Bob ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:44:01 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: No Title From: "skyring" Barry I offer this information with reservation because I am not a Rotax expert. Like you I would be linking the problem to the trauma the engine underwent with the blades departing but the symptoms you describe sound like the problem we were experiencing for months and have only recently solved. The Rotax 912ULS would run up to about 70% power and then start to run rough and not go any further. This was completely intermittent and unpredictable. Some times full power some times not. It was a new motor. In the end a strip down of the carburettors and a very close inspection found three tiny pieces of metal, possibly pieces of thread, in the sub chamber under the needle at the bottom of the main float chamber. I'm describing this from someone elses description because I didn't see it myself. Apparently, occasionally one of these tiny bits would get under the needle. The Rotax now runs fine and we are getting on with the testing. I stess this is just our experience and may have nothing to do with your problem but the symptoms you describe sound similar to ours. Kerry. Kitfox builders helper. S5 Outback 912 ULS. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120746#120746 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 10:02:25 AM PST US From: Dennis Golden Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Tie Downs fox5flyer wrote: > > Sorry about your problem Mic and thanks for sharing this with us. I was > thinking about ordering a set myself, but I've suddenly lost interest. > Since you paid thru Paypal, it's a good thing because you have recourse. Go > to the Paypal site for the next step. > Good luck. > Deke > do not archive >> >> Was wondering if anyone has info on Airtime Mfg. I ordered their titanium > tie downs back on May 11 and have gotten no response since. I sent my money > thru paypal and have been e-mailing them but no one seems to be there. > Anyone with a phone number? I have only been in contact with their e-mail > but now that has stopped as well.....ideas??? >> Mic Thiessen >> Fox IV Speedster >> C-FOXX >> Subaru EA81 >> Canada I just checked and there web site is still active, so someone must still be paying the bills. Here is the information from the whois database: Registrant: Airtime Manufacturing 29091 Sheephead Rd Brownsville, OR 97327 US Domain Name: AIRTIMEMFG.COM Administrative Contact: Simpson, Randy airtime@PROAXIS.COM Airtime Manufacturing PO BOX 127 ALBANY, OR 97321-0038 US (541) 967-9000 x710 fax: 999 999 9999 Technical Contact: Hostmaster, Proaxis hostmaster@PROAXIS.COM Infinity Internet 1101 S.E. Tech Center Drive, #150 VANCOUVER, WA 98683 US 360-735-3700 fax: 360-254-3898 Record expires on 30-Jan-2008. Record created on 29-Jan-1998. Database last updated on 26-Jun-2007 12:57:53 EDT. Domain servers in listed order: NS.PROAXIS.COM NS2.PROAXIS.COM Dennis -- Dennis Golden Golden Consulting Services, Inc. ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 10:06:00 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 From: "kitfoxmike" YUP -------- kitfoxmike model IV, 1200 speedster 912ul building RV7a slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit "if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying enough" Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120756#120756 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 12:16:09 PM PST US From: "Jim_and_Lucy Chuk" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Tie Downs I've never heard anything bad about Randy, just good things. I do know that he is prone to takeing month long trips with his ultralight. Maybe he is not home and no one else is minding the store. thanks, Jim Chuk Avid MK IV Chisholm Mn >From: Dennis Golden >To: kitfox-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Tie Downs >Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 12:01:48 -0500 > > > >fox5flyer wrote: > > > > Sorry about your problem Mic and thanks for sharing this with us. I was > > thinking about ordering a set myself, but I've suddenly lost interest. > > Since you paid thru Paypal, it's a good thing because you have recourse. > Go > > to the Paypal site for the next step. > > Good luck. > > Deke > > do not archive > > > > > >> > >> Was wondering if anyone has info on Airtime Mfg. I ordered their >titanium > > tie downs back on May 11 and have gotten no response since. I sent my >money > > thru paypal and have been e-mailing them but no one seems to be there. > > Anyone with a phone number? I have only been in contact with their >e-mail > > but now that has stopped as well.....ideas??? > >> Mic Thiessen > >> Fox IV Speedster > >> C-FOXX > >> Subaru EA81 > >> Canada > >I just checked and there web site is still active, so someone must still >be paying the bills. Here is the information from the whois database: > >Registrant: >Airtime Manufacturing > 29091 Sheephead Rd > Brownsville, OR 97327 > US > > Domain Name: AIRTIMEMFG.COM > > Administrative Contact: > Simpson, Randy airtime@PROAXIS.COM > Airtime Manufacturing > PO BOX 127 > ALBANY, OR 97321-0038 > US > (541) 967-9000 x710 fax: 999 999 9999 > > Technical Contact: > Hostmaster, Proaxis hostmaster@PROAXIS.COM > Infinity Internet > 1101 S.E. Tech Center Drive, #150 > VANCOUVER, WA 98683 > US > 360-735-3700 fax: 360-254-3898 > > Record expires on 30-Jan-2008. > Record created on 29-Jan-1998. > Database last updated on 26-Jun-2007 12:57:53 EDT. > > Domain servers in listed order: > > NS.PROAXIS.COM > NS2.PROAXIS.COM > >Dennis >-- >Dennis Golden >Golden Consulting Services, Inc. > > _________________________________________________________________ Like puzzles? Play free games & earn great prizes. Play Clink now. http://club.live.com/clink.aspx?icid=clink_hotmailtextlink2 ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 12:36:52 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Tie Downs From: "kitfoxmike" Let me ask you this, have you called and asked? -------- kitfoxmike model IV, 1200 speedster 912ul building RV7a slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit "if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying enough" Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120787#120787 ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 12:48:24 PM PST US From: "Randy Daughenbaugh" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Barry, I see. I may be late figuring out what everyone else already has, but.. It must be that the carbs are cold due to lots of gasoline being evaporated. This is how icing is caused. And another symptom of "way too rich"! Can you report back when fixed? I am looking forward to hearing that your engine is running great again. Randy . _____ From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry West Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 6:37 AM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Randy and all, the temperature difference was a matter of feel, but one was very obviously colder than the other. Barry ----- Original Message ----- From: Randy Daughenbaugh Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 11:57 AM Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Barry, I don't understand what you mean by carburetor temperature. Where do you measure it? I like Rick's suggestion. It maybe that one float valve was better able to contain the pressure than the other when there seemed to be a difference from one side to the other. Randy Daughenbaugh, N10NH Black Hills of South Dakota, - Near Mount Rushmore Home Strip, Grass Room in Hangar for visitors Series 5/7 (7 Firewall Forward) 912S, Warp Drive Taper Tip Gross Weight 1320 lbs, Flying since November 2004 _____ From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Barry West Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 8:37 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Engine Running Rough In January, 2007 my Kitfox IV with a 912 S engine threw all three blades of my GSC propeller. There was one big "bump," the engine stopped and I landed without incidence. Observation of the engine revealed that both carburetors came off and the engine mount was damaged. I sent the gearbox to Lockwood and performed a runout test on the crankshaft with no damage either indicated. After installing a new propeller and engine mount, the engine ran fine for about 12 hours of local flights. Then, Saturday before last, June 16, during a Young Eagles rally, the engine started running rough. It would idle smooth but became very rough at about 3000 rpm. I suspected a kinked fuel line, removed the fire shield, saw nothing, and replaced it. Then it ran smooth and I flew it a few times with no problem. The next day I flew it about an hour with no problem. Last Friday, June 22, I started it and it was rough again at about 3000 rpm - I mean really rough and would not run at a higher rpm. In both of these situations the right carburetor was considerably cooler than the left. At this point, I thought it appropriate to run a compression check but when I removed the first spark plug I saw it was heavily coated with soot. I removed all the plugs and they all were the same way. Then I opened both carburetors, top and bottom, but could see nothing that would cause the mixture to be rich. These plugs only had about 25 hours on them. I installed a set of old but clean plugs and put the carburetors back together, started the engine and this time it went to about 4000 rpm before cutting out and running rough. Now the carburetors are both about the same temperature. I removed the top plugs and the ones on the left side were clean and the ones on the right side were covered with soot. What to do? I tend to believe the shock of losing the propeller blades caused some kind of problem with the carburetors. Barry West href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronhref "http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:04:20 PM PST US From: "Bob Waldron" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 Any detailed photos? Any CG or GW change? -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxmike Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 YUP -------- kitfoxmike model IV, 1200 speedster 912ul building RV7a slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit "if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying enough" Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120756#120756 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 01:41:26 PM PST US From: Michel Verheughe Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 On Jun 26, 2007, at 6:35 PM, Bob Waldron wrote: > Anyone have experience with replacing the Kitfox Model 3/4 landing > gear with > the one piece aluminum Grove gear? Many of us have the Grove gear, Bob. I have a model 3 with the tube gear but if I had to change, the Grove would be on my wish list. It is stronger, wider thus less prone to ground loop, as I have been told. Cheers, Michel Verheughe Norway Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 01:57:48 PM PST US From: Lyle Persels Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Tie Downs Mic, I did the same thing in July of 06. I ordered the titanium tie downs to have for Oshkosh last year and didn't receive them. I sent a couple of e-mails and received no response. Then I just gave up. Since they're continuing to advertise, this looks like fraud to me. Lyle Persels KF-IV N23PK Rotax 912 ULS Iowa On 06 26, 07, at 8:38 AM, wannafly wrote: > > > Was wondering if anyone has info on Airtime Mfg. I ordered their > titanium tie downs back on May 11 and have gotten no response > since. I sent my money thru paypal and have been e-mailing them > but no one seems to be there. Anyone with a phone number? I have > only been in contact with their e-mail but now that has stopped as > well.....ideas??? > > Mic Thiessen > Fox IV Speedster > C-FOXX > Subaru EA81 > Canada > > do not archive > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120704#120704 > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 01:57:48 PM PST US From: "john oakley" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 Bob, I can send you detailed pictures. I changed mine before flight so I do not know the cg changes. I can tell you they are about 20 lb gain, but worth it. John Oakley -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Waldron Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 2:04 PM Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 Any detailed photos? Any CG or GW change? -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxmike Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 YUP -------- kitfoxmike model IV, 1200 speedster 912ul building RV7a slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit "if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying enough" Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120756#120756 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 02:09:46 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 From: "kitfoxmike" lets see here, any cg change, yup. better weigh it afterwards. I rebuilt the whole plane a couple years back. started out as a long wing, weighed in at 600 lbs. short wing, new horizontal with ribs and an electric trim installed, new fabric with med, paint, and of course the Grove gear. When done, it weighed in at 650. flies great, never would know the extra weight was there. It is nice on handleing on the ground, a little shake in the wheels if I let it role to fast on take off. I need to switch my tires, I see cord now, been 4 years 5000 landings or close to that and about 700 hrs. I guess it is time. THe only issue was the front mounts, used for floats were just a little out, but easy to fix. Put the brackets on first and then stuff the gear on after the brackets are fitted. piece of cake. What happens with the grove gear is that you end up with a little more forward on the wheels and you get a longer front to back so it' not so touchy on ground looping. I haven't even come close to that problem at any time. I did find that it took a little getting use to for doing the quick 180 turn, left is easy, a little more difficult to the right, but I think that's more the matco brakes. -------- kitfoxmike model IV, 1200 speedster 912ul building RV7a slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit "if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying enough" Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120800#120800 ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 05:30:34 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 From: "eskflyer" In my Opinion ther is not one darn thing wrong with the tube bungee gear except for the people who do not understand them , and just want to get wider heavier gear and are not so quick on there feet to control the airplane . I have gone to the AVID wide gear bungee because of a gear failure on the mod 2 and Kitfox said they did not have the jig to build me more gear . Would I myself change to the heavy Grove gear . Nope not in this lifetime . Way to much money for a hunk of weight . Ok hammer me slow feet people JK -------- FLY FUN FLY LOW FLY SLOW John Perry Kitfox 2 N718PD 582 cbox 2:62-1 IVO IFA WHEELS Northair Floats Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120817#120817 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 05:48:10 PM PST US From: "john oakley" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 John Perry, I have tried but can't for the life of me find a listing for Northair floats, is there really a float of this name? John Oakley Looking for new floats (amphibs) -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of eskflyer Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 6:30 PM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 In my Opinion ther is not one darn thing wrong with the tube bungee gear except for the people who do not understand them , and just want to get wider heavier gear and are not so quick on there feet to control the airplane . I have gone to the AVID wide gear bungee because of a gear failure on the mod 2 and Kitfox said they did not have the jig to build me more gear . Would I myself change to the heavy Grove gear . Nope not in this lifetime . Way to much money for a hunk of weight . Ok hammer me slow feet people JK -------- FLY FUN FLY LOW FLY SLOW John Perry Kitfox 2 N718PD 582 cbox 2:62-1 IVO IFA WHEELS Northair Floats Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120817#120817 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 06:01:49 PM PST US From: "Noel Loveys" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 There are a bunch of clips up on U-Tube put there by Dave Fisher.... Haven't seen him around since the signature thingy.... All on either floats or tube gear. Some great ones on the kingfox tires. Hard to tell if he has a plane or a motocross bike! Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern Campbellton, Newfoundland, Canada Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA Aerocet 1100s noelloveys@yahoo.ca Do not archive > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com > [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of eskflyer > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 10:00 PM > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 > > > > In my Opinion ther is not one darn thing wrong with the tube > bungee gear except for the people who do not understand them > , and just want to get wider heavier gear and are not so > quick on there feet to control the airplane . I have gone to > the AVID wide gear bungee because of a gear failure on the > mod 2 and Kitfox said they did not have the jig to build me > more gear . Would I myself change to the heavy Grove gear . > Nope not in this lifetime . Way to much money for a hunk of weight . > > Ok hammer me slow feet people > JK > > -------- > FLY FUN FLY LOW FLY SLOW > John Perry > Kitfox 2 N718PD > 582 cbox 2:62-1 IVO IFA > WHEELS Northair Floats > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120817#120817 > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 07:12:14 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Off Topic: Todays flight From: "Tom Jones" I am at the halw way point through phase one so rewarded myself with a flight around the Kittitas valley this morning. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV, Phase one 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120825#120825 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/manashtash_creek_101.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/badger_pocket_185.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/yakima_river_canyon_196.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/panel_190.jpg ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 07:18:26 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Off Topic: Todays flight From: "Tom Jones" A couple more pictures. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV, Phase one 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120828#120828 ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 07:35:27 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 From: "kitfoxmike" Yup, this thread started a bungee war. Just like tail wheel vs. nose , primer versus not. Jeesh. Lets just get past it and give him what he wants for information. -------- kitfoxmike model IV, 1200 speedster 912ul building RV7a slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit "if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying enough" Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120829#120829 ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 08:39:08 PM PST US From: "john oakley" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Off Topic: Todays flight Looks like a great place to fly, you are lucky. John Oakley -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Jones Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 8:18 PM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Off Topic: Todays flight A couple more pictures. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV, Phase one 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120828#120828 ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 09:10:09 PM PST US From: "Bob Waldron" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 I really looked at the gear brackets today and realize it's pretty straight forward. I thought you had to get under the floorboard but it just bolts on the bottom. The Grove brackets don't quite fit between the front float mount and the front gear mount. A little bit on the grinder will fix that. I will need to reroute the brake lines as this gear has been drilled out for the brake fittings. -Bob Kitfox III N1060U -----Original Message----- From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of kitfoxmike Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2007 3:09 PM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Grove landing gear for Model 3/4 lets see here, any cg change, yup. better weigh it afterwards. I rebuilt the whole plane a couple years back. started out as a long wing, weighed in at 600 lbs. short wing, new horizontal with ribs and an electric trim installed, new fabric with med, paint, and of course the Grove gear. When done, it weighed in at 650. flies great, never would know the extra weight was there. It is nice on handleing on the ground, a little shake in the wheels if I let it role to fast on take off. I need to switch my tires, I see cord now, been 4 years 5000 landings or close to that and about 700 hrs. I guess it is time. THe only issue was the front mounts, used for floats were just a little out, but easy to fix. Put the brackets on first and then stuff the gear on after the brackets are fitted. piece of cake. What happens with the grove gear is that you end up with a little more forward on the wheels and you get a longer front to back so it' not so touchy on ground looping. I h! aven't even come close to that problem at any time. I did find that it took a little getting use to for doing the quick 180 turn, left is easy, a little more difficult to the right, but I think that's more the matco brakes. -------- kitfoxmike model IV, 1200 speedster 912ul building RV7a slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit "if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying enough" Do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=120800#120800 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kitfox-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.