Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:36 AM - Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! (kitfoxjunky)
2. 04:58 AM - Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! (Paul Seehafer)
3. 05:07 AM - Fw: Seaplane-List: Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! (Paul Seehafer)
4. 05:20 AM - Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! (John W. Hart)
5. 07:22 AM - Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! (Guy Buchanan)
6. 07:32 AM - Re: Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! (Guy Buchanan)
7. 08:37 AM - Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! (John W. Hart)
8. 01:06 PM - nose gear (Eric)
9. 04:55 PM - Re: Morning Flight (Torgeir Mortensen)
10. 05:43 PM - Re: nose gear (Rick)
11. 06:34 PM - Ivo prop (Eric)
12. 06:51 PM - McMinnville Antique Fly-in (Lowell Fitt)
13. 08:09 PM - Re: Ivo prop (Clint Bazzill)
14. 10:21 PM - Re: "The thing that hath been... (Mdkitfox@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! |
How do you tell the diff between 1x19 and 7x19 wire?
Gary Walsh
KF IV Anphib 912S
C-GOOT
www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox
do not archive
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! |
Guy,
I never knew anything about what you are saying here. So thank you for
informing me. I also had a friend tell me he converted to threaded rod like
is used on larger floats. I think that will be the route I will take. I'm
currently checking availability.
For what it's worth, I did test the new cables I made up and they passed the
1200 pound pull test listed for 1/8" wire. But as you say, if I shouldn't
be using this setup, I will convert either to the threaded rod or swage on
different ends.
It's simply amazing what one can learn by sharing information...
Thanks again for the info.
Paul Seehafer
Kitfox IV-1200 912ul Aerocet Amphibs
----- Original Message -----
From: "Guy Buchanan" <bnn@nethere.com>
> Paul,
> Thanks for the pictures, without them your diagnosis would have
> been wrong and you would have had more failures. Your nico sleeve failed
> because it was on 1x19 wire. Nico sleeves are intended solely for 7x19
> wire and should NEVER be used on 1x19! (Yes, that's CAPITAL N - NEVER!
> Some people try two sleeves on 1x19, thinking that will work. DON'T DO IT!
> You can also use them on 7x7, but you shouldn't be using 7x7 for
> structural applications anyway.) ANY STRUCTURAL 1X19 WIRE TERMINATED WITH
> NICO SLEEVES SHOULD BE IMMEDIATELY REPLACED BY 1X19 WITH SWAGED AIRCRAFT
> FITTINGS.
> If you require references I'll dig them up, but I know this well,
> having worked in yacht rigging and design for 20 years. I also can't tell
> you, off the top of my head, what fraction of the wire's capability a 1x19
> nico will carry, since we never did it; but I saw many failures, mostly
> Hobie cat rigs.
> Now I know this is going to require some work on your part, since
> your tabs may not provide enough clearance for the air-fork clevis, but
> please take the time to do it right. And please spread the word. If your
> hardware came from Aerocet, you might let them know that they have taken
> on excess liability in this regard.
>
>
> Guy Buchanan
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 |
FLOATS!!
Thanks for the information Michel. You sailing enthusiasts apparently know
a lot more about nicopress failures than the rest of us (Guy Buchanan
pretty
much said the same thing, and has a background in boats as well). So I am
looking into alternatives for my cables.
Sharing information is a great thing! Thanks again for sharing what you
know.
Paul Seehafer
Kitfox IV-1200 912ul Aerocet Amphibs
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Michel Verheughe" <michel@online.no>
>>
>> On Aug 15, 2007, at 6:03 PM, Paul Seehafer wrote:
>>> You will need a nicopress go/no-go gauge to be able to tell if they are
>>> good or not (a $6 tool).
>>
>> I don't want to sound arrogant or patronising but ... as a sailor I would
>> never trust Nicopress to support anything aboard. All sailing rigs use a
>> conical terminal device to end the stays. The more you pull on the stay,
>> the more it tightens. Of course, those are a tad more expensive than
>> Nicopress but ... safety first, isn't it?
>> Yes, I know, I have Nicopress on the wires of my rudder but the force it
>> must sustain is minimal compare to floats.
>>
>> In any case, I am glad it went well for you, Paul. And thank you for
>> letting the word out. While I don't have floats, it's nice to know that
>> we have this list to report our problem because learning from others'
>> experience is the best way to safe flying.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Michel Verheughe
>> Norway
>> Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200
Message 4
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| Subject: | ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! |
Here's a drawing of the end view many of the cables made today.
John Hart
1x7 Preformed Stainless Steel Strand Non-Flexible Type 302/304 (18)
For straight load applications, in smaller diameters used as fishing
leaders and line. In larger diameters it's used for guy wire and messenger
strand applications.
Stainless Steel Miniature Strand and Cable Type 302/304 (12)
All Commercial Grade
1x19 Preformed Stainless Steel Strand Non-Flexible Type 302/304
(31)
Widely used as standing rigging on sail boats. It is also well suited
for push-pull, and guying applications.
Search 31 Items
3x7 Preformed Stainless Steel Aircraft Cable Type 302/304 (2)
7x7 Preformed Stainless Steel Aircraft Cable Flexible Type 302/304
(23)
For use where extreme flexibility is not necessary. Commonly used in
aircraft and automotive controls, It performs highly in a wide range of
mechanical application.
7x19 Preformed Stainless Steel Aircraft Cable Flexible Type 302/304
(22)
Used when flexibility and fatigue are concerns. Aircraft controls,
running rigging on sailboats, exercise equipment, winches and garage doors
are all common applications.
6x19 Class Preformed Stainless Steel Wire Rope I.W.R.C.-Type
302/304 (9)
True working wire ropes, extensively in heavy duty shovels, dredges,
skidders, applications.
6x36 Preformed Stainless Steel Wire Rope I.W.R.C.-Type 302/304 (13)
These constructions are used etensively in heavy duty hoisting cranes.
Also used in shovels, dredges, skidders, excavators, logging and oil field
applications.
6x42 Non- Preformed Stainless Steel Wire Rope Type 302/304 (14)
19x7 Preformed Stainless Steel Wire Rope Type 302/304 (8)
Used when a single line hoisting operation is necessary. Standard
equipment on helicopter rescue winch applications.
1x7 Preformed Stainless Steel Strand Type 316 (Extra
Corrosion-Resistant) Non-Flexible (7)
For straight load applications, in smaller diameters used as fishing
leaders and line. In larger diameters it's used for guy wire and messenger
strand applications.
1x19 Preformed Stainless Steel Strand Type 316 (Extra
Corrosion-Resistant) (11)
Widely used as standing rigging on sail boats. It is also well suited
for push-pull and guying applications.
7x7 Preformed Stainless Steel Cable Type 316 (Extra
Corrosion-Resistant) (3)
For use where extreme flexibility is not necessary. Commonly used in
aircraft and automotive controls, It performs highly in a wide range of
mechanical application.
7x19 Preformed Stainless Steel Cable Type 316 (Extra
Corrosion-Resistant) (6)
Used when flexibility and fatigue are concerns. Aircraft controls,
running rigging on sailboats, exercise equipment, winches and garage doors
are all common applications.
6x19 Class Preformed Stainless Steel Wire Rope I.W.R.C.- Type 316
(Extra Corrosion-Resistant) (9)
True working wire ropes, extensively in heavy duty shovels, dredges,
skidders, applications.
6x37 Class Preformed Stainless Steel Wire Rope I.W.R.C.- Type 316
(Extra Corrosion-Resistant) (13)
These construction are used extensively in heavy duty hoisting crane.
Also used in sholves, dredges, skidders, excavators, logging and oil field
applications.
7x7 Preformed Stainless Steel Wire Cable Type 305 Non-Magnetic (2)
For use where extreme flexibility is not necessary. Commonly used in
aircraft and automotive controls, It performs highly in a wide range of
mechanical application.
7x19 Preformed Stainless Steel Cable Type 305 Non-Magnetic (6)
Used when flexibility and fatigue are concerns. Aircraft controls,
running rigging on sailboats, exercise equipment, winches and garage doors
are all common applications.
6x19 Preformed Stainless Steel Wire Rope I.W.R.C. Type 305
Non-Magnetic (7)
7x7 Monel Cable (11)
7x19 Monel Cable (9)
Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of kitfoxjunky
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2007 6:34 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!!
How do you tell the diff between 1x19 and 7x19 wire?
Gary Walsh
KF IV Anphib 912S
C-GOOT
www.decisionlabs.com/kitfox
do not archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! |
At 05:17 AM 8/16/2007, you wrote:
>Here's a drawing of the end view many of the cables made today.
>John Hart
Thanks John, for covering for me. If you don't mind my asking, where
did you get this info?
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! |
At 04:55 AM 8/16/2007, you wrote:
>For what it's worth, I did test the new cables I made up and they
>passed the 1200 pound pull test listed for 1/8" wire. But as you
>say, if I shouldn't be using this setup, I will convert either to
>the threaded rod or swage on different ends.
Loosco lists a 1/8" 1x19 break of 2100 lbs, giving your max working
load of 1150 lbs. or so. If you can, try your pull test to break and
see what you get. I'm glad you're switching.
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Message 7
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| Subject: | ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!! |
Can't remember the website. I just Googled "aircraft cables" and one of the
search results had a link to it. Copied and pasted to the email.
John Hart
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Guy Buchanan
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2007 9:19 AM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: ALERT! ANYONE FLYING AEROCET 1100 FLOATS!!
At 05:17 AM 8/16/2007, you wrote:
Here's a drawing of the end view many of the cables made today.
John Hart
Thanks John, for covering for me. If you don't mind my asking, where did
you get this info?
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Message 8
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There is a nose gear on eBay right now.
Eric
do not archive
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Morning Flight |
Joe, great, great report - isn't this what's all about...
Michel, Michel, you're really on the target...
"Hildringstimen" is a very moment of your life that you'll never forget,
-and you'll always try to repeat that moment as often as you can... :)
:) (Those very moment you'll never give away.)
Well Michel, I've tried..
Cheers
Torgeir.
Do not archive
On Wed, 15 Aug 2007 17:45:33 +0200, Michel Verheughe <michel@online.no>
wrote:
>> From: Joe & Jan Connell [jconnell@fmwildblue.com]
>> Here is an article I submitted to Country magazine which
>> appeared in their October/November issue...
>
> Isn't this the essence of the idea behind the Kitfox? Fly from your
> backyard for a nice early morning birdview of your surroundings. Nice
> article, Joe!
> And now, for Torgeir:
> "I hildringstimen er det god fly ... "
>
> (sorry guys, Norwegian poesy in not translatable!)
>
> Cheers,
> Michel Verheughe
> Norway
> Kitfox 3- Jabiru 2200
--
Torgeir
Kitfox Model II, 1993
Engine: Rotax 532 with B gearbox
Propeller: IVO UL 366Q
Tromsoe
NORWAY.
Weather in Tromso right now:
http://met.no/troms/index.html
City map of Tromso:
http://www.avinor.no/English/Airports/Tromso_Airport/?module=Articles;action=ArticleFolder.publicOpenFolder;ID=1453
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/
Message 10
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FYI, I have new bushings, and almost new set of elastomers for the nose
gear.
Rick
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Eric
Sent: Thursday, August 16, 2007 1:05 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: nose gear
There is a nose gear on eBay right now.
Eric
do not archive
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List"http://www.matronics.com
/Navigator?Kitfox-List
"http://forums.matronics.com"http://forums.matronics.com
8/15/2007 4:55 PM
8/15/2007 4:55 PM
Message 11
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Is anyone using a 72" in-flight adjustable Ivo prop on a Speedster with
912UL ?
How is the performance?
Eric
Message 12
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| Subject: | McMinnville Antique Fly-in |
The California, Nevada and Idaho contingents of the Informal flying group
will be at the McMinnville (Oregon) Antique fly-in this Saturday. It would
be nice to hook up with any other locals there for a hand shake and some
talk.
Lowell Fitt
Cameron Park, CA
Model IV-1200 R-912 UL Warp
1998 870 hrs.
Message 13
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You need a 68 inch prop for the 912UL. Clint
From: "Eric" <iworonko@cox.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Ivo prop
Is anyone using a 72" in-flight adjustable Ivo prop on a Speedster with
912UL ?
How is the performance?
Eric
_________________________________________________________________
Messenger Caf open for fun 24/7. Hot games, cool activities served daily.
Visit now. http://cafemessenger.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_AugHMtagline
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: "The thing that hath been... |
Johannes, et al,
How nice to hear from a voice from the past! Everything you mentioned about
Morgan Huntington is very true. When I met him back in the 80's, I was an
engineer in the Cockpit Technology Office at FAA HQ and he was an old guy with
an invention he was trying to sell (by having the FAA mandate that it be in
all aircraft.) The flight standards folks had sent him to me because they
probably did not want to deal with him. Morgan was very nice and I might add,
quite competent. We went to Lee Airport in Annapolis where he had a Cessna
150 equipped with his device. We took off and he kept that mush indicator, as
he called it, right on the hairy edge of a stall. That old 150 must have
had a 20+degree deck angle and was climbing right on out. When we got to a
couple of thousand feet he let that needle get in the red and the wing stalled
as advertised. Lower the nose and keep the needle out of the red and she flew
right out and continued to climb. Okay, his device worked. But, the FAA
was never going to mandate it. I sent Morgan to some friends I had at NASA's
at Langley Research Center. Bottom line, they put on an old 737 and sure
enough, it worked there to. That was pretty much all I ever heard about the LRI
until about 10 years ago at Oshkosh. Seems Morgan had passed, but his
family, I believe it was a son, continued selling the device, but ran into a legal
issue with another fellow selling the same product under a different name.
They were in competition, but I never did hear the results of the legal fray.
When I told Morgan's son about my experience with his Dad, he was really
moved. He gave me a system and I have it installed in my Kitfox. Now,if I can
just finish building the plane, I can find out if it works on the very
sophisticated Kitfox V.
Rick Weiss
13 years and still building - but the end is near!
Series V Speedster (Factory serial number 1) N39RW
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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