Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:03 AM - Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims (jdmol2002)
2. 05:01 AM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (akflyer)
3. 05:03 AM - Re: Broken EGT probe (wingnut)
4. 05:22 AM - Broken EGT probe (fox5flyer)
5. 05:56 AM - Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims (Tom Jones)
6. 06:07 AM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (Tom Jones)
7. 06:09 AM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (jdmcbean)
8. 06:11 AM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (RRTRACK@aol.com)
9. 06:38 AM - Re: Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale ()
10. 06:50 AM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (wingnut)
11. 07:06 AM - Re: Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (Paul Morel)
12. 08:38 AM - Re: Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (kerrjohna@comcast.net)
13. 09:09 AM - Re: Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale / E-LSA certification deadline (RRTRACK@AOL.COM)
14. 11:17 AM - Radiator and fairing for sale (fox5flyer)
15. 11:57 AM - Re: Stalls and Spins (dave)
16. 02:59 PM - Re: Re: Broken EGT probe (Noel Loveys)
17. 03:11 PM - Re: Re: Broken EGT probe (Noel Loveys)
18. 03:11 PM - Re: Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims (Noel Loveys)
19. 04:30 PM - Re: Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims (Noel Loveys)
20. 04:32 PM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (Noel Loveys)
21. 04:32 PM - Re: Re: Temp Sensor location was Broken EGT probe (Roger McConnell)
22. 05:06 PM - Re: Broken EGT probe (wingnut)
23. 05:27 PM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale / E-LSA (RRTRACK@aol.com)
24. 05:31 PM - Re: Re: Broken EGT probe / EGT temps (RRTRACK@aol.com)
25. 05:48 PM - Re: Re: Temp Sensor location was Broken EGT probe (Noel Loveys)
26. 06:24 PM - Time to Fold Wings (Guy Buchanan)
27. 07:05 PM - cross wind technique was scuffed wing tip (Malcolmbru@aol.com)
28. 07:07 PM - Fw: New Personal Message: welcome to the dark side (Malcolmbru@aol.com)
29. 07:23 PM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (Scott)
30. 08:16 PM - Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale (dcsfoto)
31. 08:34 PM - Re: Re: Temp Sensor location was Broken EGT probe (James Shumaker)
32. 08:39 PM - Re: cross wind technique was scuffed wing tip (akflyer)
33. 08:42 PM - Re: Time to Fold Wings (James Shumaker)
34. 09:37 PM - Re: Time to Fold Wings (Rexinator)
35. 09:44 PM - Sport Pilot vs. LSA (was: Aircraft Bill of Sale) (Michael Gibbs)
36. 10:05 PM - Re: Sport Pilot vs. LSA (was: Aircraft Bill of Sale) (84KF)
37. 10:16 PM - Re: Sport Pilot vs. LSA (was: Aircraft Bill of Sale) (Michael Gibbs)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims |
I forgot to mention. My kitfox is a Kitfox Lite. It is lighter and quiker to unfold
than a 2-seater. Also it is 4 minutes off the trailer,wings unfolded. Not
to include pre-flight.
J.D. Molstad
Cottage Grove,WI
Kitfox Lite (Ridgerunner FWF with 447)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143933#143933
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale |
if the plane was never registered then you wont need it. That is the only form
FAA will accept for "changes" to the registration. At least this is what the
local office in Anchorage told me when I purchased mine.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
95% complete
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143937#143937
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Broken EGT probe |
Wow. Problem solved. Thanks guys :-)
--------
Luis Rodriguez
Model IV 1200
Rotax 912UL
Flying Weekly
Laurens, SC (34A)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143938#143938
Message 4
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| Subject: | Broken EGT probe |
Personally, one can get along without EGT, CHT, oil temp, fuel pressure,
oil pressure, fuel flow, and even fuel gauges, but I find them very nice
to have for reference. We know what is normal for our airplanes and
when any one of them begins to change it gives us early warning that
something isn't right.
Deke Morisse
S5, NE Michigan
----- Original Message -----
From: kerrjohna@comcast.net
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 8:59 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Broken EGT probe
I don't know if this is true or not, but I read someplace that
the rotax 912 does not need an EGT, but you do need the CHT, oil temp
and oil pressure! I'm no expert!!
Luis, I rely heavily on the relative EGT readings to guide the
seasonal changes to the main jets on my 912. I can not imagine flying
without. I check it every flight every time I change the throttle
setting to be aware of how the engine is operating.
I would recommend going with the westach probe to maintain and
"apples" comparison.
John Kerr, approaching 800 hours.
-------------- Original message --------------
From: RAY Gignac <kitfoxpilot@msn.com>
I don't know if this is true or not, but I read someplace that the
rotax 912 does not need an EGT, but you do need the CHT, oil temp and
oil pressure! I'm no expert!!
Ray
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Broken EGT probe
> From: wingnut@spamarrest.com
> Date: Sun, 4 Nov 2007 14:55:11 -0800
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>
<wingnut@spamarrest.com>
>
> I lost my EGT readings on my last flight. Checking the probe, I
noticed that it seems to have come apart near the point where it enters
the pipe. I have Westach combination gage and I was wondering if I need
to replace the probe with a Westach probe or if any EGT probe will do.
>
> --------
> Luis Rodriguez
> Model IV 1200
> Rotax 912UL
> Flying Weekly
> Laurens, SC (34A)
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://f orums. matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143849#143849
>
>
>
>
> ===
>
>
>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
Climb to the top of the charts! Play Star Shuffle: the word
scramble challenge with star power. Play Now!
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims |
I trailer my classic 4 to the airport for each flight. Last time I set a personal
record for unloading time. 15 minutes to unload, spread the wings and put
the turtle deck on. I still had to fuel up and preflight.
It actually takes me about an hour by the time all the monkey motion is finished
and I'm ready to crank the engine. I am continually thinking and looking for
ways to make it easier and speed the process up. I have already picked up a
few ideas from this thread. The hinged flip up tail support is a good example
of an excellent idea that is simple to make. Lets hear some more. Do not archive.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV, Phase one
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143945#143945
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale |
Paul, I think you do need the bill of sale for the kit to register it for the first
time. I had to get one from from the old skystar...I was lucky they were
still around at that time. Of corse government employees...I was one...all interpret
the rules their own way.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV, Phase one
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143948#143948
Message 7
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| Subject: | Aircraft Bill of Sale |
Yes it is.. the FAA wants a paperwork trail from the original purchaser to
the current owner
Fly Safe !!
John & Debra McBean
208.337.5111
www.kitfoxaircraft.com
"It's not how Fast... It's how Fun!"
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Paul Morel
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 9:59 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Aircraft Bill of Sale
I read from the Kitfox site the "Bill of Sale" regulations posted by John.
It says "If you purchased your kit from another builder you will need to
have that person complete an AC8050-2" Does anyone know if that form is
required even if the kit was never registered?
Paul Morel
11:05 AM
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale |
When you apply for registration on the plane, I believe you will need this
form. AC 8050-2
And also when you apply for registration you choose between
Experimental-Home Built or Experimental - Light Sport Aircraft. Once you get it
registered
you cannot change this.
Also the deadline for getting an E-LSA certified is January 31, 2008. And if
the plane is not yet registered your chances of getting it certified before
that date are slim to none unless they extend that date.
As an Experimental - Home Built you must prove 51% was Home Built. And I
have read they are going to be more diligent on this with all the companies out
there that will assist (build) your plane
I have just certified an E-LSA through an FAA FSDO and they said they are
overwhelmed with applications
for E-LSA certification already.
IF YOU HAVE A REGISTERED "E-LSA" IT MUST BE CERTIFIED BEFORE JANUARY 31,
2008 OR IT WILL BE PARTS AFTER THAT.
Mark
Kitfox 5 Vixen
912UL IVO
Hartford, Wisconsin
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale |
I keep hearing this. What does it mean "deadline 1/31/08"? No more E-LSA aircraft
after that date? That would be stupid, as well as arbitrary and capricious.
What does it mean? Why would they do that? Does it just mean 'up for review'?
John, ridgecrest, ca (land of fruits and nuts)
kitfox 7 tri gear constructor-man
<<<<<From: RRTRACK@aol.comAlso the deadline for gettingan E-LSA certified is January
31, 2008. And if the plane is not yet registeredyour chances of getting
it certified before that dateare slim to none unless they extend that date. IF
YOU HAVE A REGISTERED "E-LSA" IT MUST BE CERTIFIED BEFORE JANUARY 31, 2008 OR
IT WILL BE PARTS AFTER THAT.Mark>>>>>>>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale |
> I keep hearing this. What does it mean "deadline 1/31/08"? No more E-LSA aircraft
after that date? That would be stupid, as well as arbitrary and capricious.
What does it mean? Why would they do that? Does it just mean 'up for review'?
John, ridgecrest, ca (land of fruits and nuts)
I understood that the deadline applied to all those non conforming ultralights
that the FAA used to not care about. They're all supposed to convert to ELSA before
the deadline or things get... complicated for them.
--------
Luis Rodriguez
Model IV 1200
Rotax 912UL
Flying Weekly
Laurens, SC (34A)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143959#143959
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale |
After giving this more thought......Since the kit by Denny Aircraft with a
serial number assigned to it was sold to the original purchaser, wouldn't it
then qualify to be a traceable aircraft and require the FAA form?
Paul Morel
----- Original Message -----
From: "akflyer" <akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 8:00 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale
>
> if the plane was never registered then you wont need it. That is the only
> form FAA will accept for "changes" to the registration. At least this is
> what the local office in Anchorage told me when I purchased mine.
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> 95% complete
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143937#143937
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale |
Others may respond but the 1/31/2008 dead line is for the transfer of "heavy" ultralites
approved for ultralite training to be registered as light sport. After
that date they go into some sort of ill-defined but not legal status.
John Kerr
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "wingnut" <wingnut@spamarrest.com>
>
>
> > I keep hearing this. What does it mean "deadline 1/31/08"? No more E-LSA
> aircraft after that date? That would be stupid, as well as arbitrary and
> capricious. What does it mean? Why would they do that? Does it just mean 'up
for
> review'? John, ridgecrest, ca (land of fruits and nuts)
>
> I understood that the deadline applied to all those non conforming ultralights
> that the FAA used to not care about. They're all supposed to convert to ELSA
> before the deadline or things get... complicated for them.
>
> --------
> Luis Rodriguez
> Model IV 1200
> Rotax 912UL
> Flying Weekly
> Laurens, SC (34A)
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143959#143959
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
<html><body>
<DIV>Others may respond but the 1/31/2008 dead line is for the transfer of "heavy"
ultralites approved for ultralite training to be registered as light sport.
After that date they go into some sort of ill-defined but not legal status.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>John Kerr</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px
solid">-------------- Original message -------------- <BR>From: "wingnut" <wingnut@spamarrest.com>
<BR><BR>> --> Kitfox-List message posted by:
"wingnut" <WINGNUT@SPAMARREST.COM><BR>> <BR>> <BR>> > I keep hearing
this. What does it mean "deadline 1/31/08"? No more E-LSA <BR>> aircraft
after that date? That would be stupid, as well as arbitrary and <BR>> capricious.
What does it mean? Why would they do that? Does it just mean 'up for
<BR>> review'? John, ridgecrest, ca (land of fruits and nuts) <BR>> <BR>>
I understood that the deadline applied to all those non conforming ultralights
<BR>> that the FAA used to not care about. They're all supposed to convert
to ELSA <BR>> before the deadline or things get... complicated for them.
<BR>> <BR>> -------- <BR>> Luis Rodriguez <BR>> Model IV 1200
<BR>> Rotax 912UL <BR>> Flying Weekly <BR>>
Laure
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale / E-LSA certification deadline |
I am not sure what happens to the fat ultralights after 1/31/08, but I just
wanted to remind anyone that "has" registered there aircraft as an E-LSA it
must be certified before this date. If you never registered your plane or
project as an E-LSA you can register it as an Experimental at any time and there
is no time limit for certification. Fat ultralights that where factory built
would not qualify for the 51% rule and would be left in limbo (just "parts" as
the FAA told me).
Mark
Kitfox 5 Vixen
912UL IVO
Hartford, Wisconsin
Message 14
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| Subject: | Radiator and fairing for sale |
If anyone is looking to streamline their Fox or Avid, this might do the
trick. Price is right.
Deke
S5
NE, Michigan
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Radiator-with-ducting_W0QQitemZ23018668225
5QQihZ013QQcategoryZ26439QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Stalls and Spins |
Wow, has this topic stopped ?
Certainly should not be as I have read of many accidents in the last year alone
that stem back to the same thing and alot of Kitfoxes too.
What does happen in the below scenario ?
Dave
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Stalls and Spins -departure and approach
>
> I think also that stalls should have more intense training for departure and
approach stalls.
>
> What happens when going too slow turning final and too wide? you feed more aileron
then you need to straighten out your yaw with opposite rudder ==> BOOM you
inverted at 300 AGL or less. Did they teach that in the "awareness course "
? I really doubt it , but it happens time and time again as does departure stalls.
>
--------
Rotax Dealer, Ontario Canada
Flying Videos and Kitfox Info
http://www.cfisher.com/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=144016#144016
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Broken EGT probe |
I would expect both instruments have advantages and are worth having.
CHT tells you how hard your engine is working and when it is working too
hard.
EGT tells you how the tune of your engine is. Whether it is too lean or
too
rich.
Most of the instruments used in amateur built planes really need some
calibration and that's where the fun comes in.
The EGT can be calibrated by looking at the spark plugs... Once the
plugs
are giving a nice tan colouration what ever the EGT has been reading is
optimal for you.
When flying you keep an eye on the CHT too. If it unexpectedly starts
to
climb you may have a problem.... Land and get it checked out. Obviously
when you are climbing WOT or close to WOT then you will be generating a
bit
more heat and you should be able to see this in your CHT. Remember the
cylinder heads are liquid cooled so a noticeable increase in CHT can
mean a
problem with your liquid cooling system.
Personally, a little off topic, I hate idiot lights. Gauges tell the
whole
story at a glance the thing to remember is not to fixate on the EGT, or
any
instrument for that matter, and fly de plane! There are few idiot
lights on
planes, they're called enunciator panels. They will draw your attention
to
a problem. The gauges will tell the story of the problem. I once had
someone take the oil light out of a car because it was glaring in their
eyes. The engine ran through a ten hour road rally with no oil in the
base.
Some how I didn't lose the engine!
Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern
Campbellton, Newfoundland,
Canada
Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA
Aerocet 1100s
<mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of wingnut
> Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 9:09 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Broken EGT probe
>
>
>
>
> > I don't know if this is true or not, but I read someplace
> that the rotax 912 does not need an EGT, but you do need the
> CHT, oil temp and oil pressure! I'm no expert!!
>
>
> Hmm. That would be interesting. I don't have CHT but I have
> EGT... Anyone else running with no CHT?
>
> --------
> Luis Rodriguez
> Model IV 1200
> Rotax 912UL
> Flying Weekly
> Laurens, SC (34A)
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143863#143863
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Broken EGT probe |
In your case the Water Temp is your cylinder head temp.... The hear is
liquid (water) cooled. Temp is the temp of the liquid leaving the heads.
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of wingnut
> Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 10:48 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Broken EGT probe
>
>
>
>
> > Interesting topic. Six months ago, when I was designing my
> panel, I ask Lockwood about EGT. He said "forget that". And so I did.
>
>
> I guess things just got more complicated for me then. The
> gage I have is a combo gage with EGT, Water Temp, Oil Temp
> and Oil pressure. There's no room in my panel for a new gage
> so I guess I'd have to find a similar gage with CHT instead
> of EGT. That's going to pinch a bit more than a new probe. Bummer.
>
> --------
> Luis Rodriguez
> Model IV 1200
> Rotax 912UL
> Flying Weekly
> Laurens, SC (34A)
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143893#143893
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims |
If my plane were kept in a hangar rather than the garage and I didn't
have
to defuel my wings and tie down the floats for transport I expect I
could
get the wings unfurled and all ready fly launch within the fifteen
minute
mark.
>From the time I leave the house with the plane in tow I count on close
to an
hour and a half to be in the air.
Recovering the plane to the trailer, de-fuelling, folding the wings,
tying
down and towing home is about another hour plus. I also like to do a
post
flight inspection. That takes another ten minutes.
All totalled when I go flying I will spend close to four hours not
including
the duration of the flight itself. No wonder I hardly ever go for less
than
two or three hours of flight.
BTW the pond is about 15 min from the house towing at a ripping 20
km/hr.
Noel Loveys, RPP, AME intern
Campbellton, Newfoundland,
Canada
Kitfox Mod III-A, 582, B box, Ivo IFA
Aerocet 1100s
<mailto:noelloveys@yahoo.ca> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marco
Menezes
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 9:59 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims
I agree. I trailer for every flight too. But I'd love to see someone
unload,
set up and be ready to fly in four minutes. It takes me more like 25-30,
including filling the tanks.
Kevin Cozik <Kcozik@cablespeed.com> wrote:
That's a great option. There is a guy that live just north of me who
does
the same thing. Waits for the nice weather and pulls it over to a local
grass strip and within 15 minutes can be airborne.
Kevin Cozik
----- Original Message -----
From: "jdmol2002"
Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 5:40 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims
>
> Seeing
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims |
Loading ramps that are hinged to flip up, reverse and trap the main gear
is
a real time saver. My ramps, steel class A crusher screen, have a
channel
up each side that helps trap the main gear laterally. Blocks only allow
the
main gear to go so far back on the trailer. One loading ratchet ting
strap
holds each loading ramp in place. With the ramps trapping the main gear
the
tail cannot move a half an inch in any direction except the tail up and
down
and the tail support stops that.
I only loaded my plane, on wheels, for transport three times. The first
time was twenty minutes to load. The second was just under fifteen as
was
the third etc.. Unloading was a bit faster... Less cranking on the
winch.
Each time the plane was towed to Gander International Airport and from
the
airport home. A distance of around 87 km. (52 mi.) Travelling speed was
around 80 km/hr (50 mph).
Loading and unloading on wheels is a joke next to floats!
Noel
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Tom Jones
> Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 10:26 AM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering Kitfox WAS: King Fox rims
>
>
>
> I trailer my classic 4 to the airport for each flight. Last
> time I set a personal record for unloading time. 15 minutes
> to unload, spread the wings and put the turtle deck on. I
> still had to fuel up and preflight.
>
> It actually takes me about an hour by the time all the monkey
> motion is finished and I'm ready to crank the engine. I am
> continually thinking and looking for ways to make it easier
> and speed the process up. I have already picked up a few
> ideas from this thread. The hinged flip up tail support is a
> good example of an excellent idea that is simple to make.
> Lets hear some more. Do not archive.
>
> --------
> Tom Jones
> Classic IV, Phase one
> 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
> Ellensburg, WA
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143945#143945
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Aircraft Bill of Sale |
I think the Jan deadline is for "fat" UL that want to register. I don't
think it also includes a plane that has not yet flown. Check your local
FSDO
You may also want to consider there are several restrictions on flying
LSA
that are not in the Home Built category. Of course you will need a PPL
for
the homebuilt. Some consider that a restriction too.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
RRTRACK@aol.com
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aircraft Bill of Sale
When you apply for registration on the plane, I believe you will need
this
form. AC 8050-2
And also when you apply for registration you choose between
Experimental-Home Built or Experimental - Light Sport Aircraft. Once you
get
it registered you cannot change this.
Also the deadline for getting an E-LSA certified is January 31, 2008.
And if
the plane is not yet registered your chances of getting it certified
before
that date are slim to none unless they extend that date.
As an Experimental - Home Built you must prove 51% was Home Built. And
I
have read they are going to be more diligent on this with all the
companies
out there that will assist (build) your plane
I have just certified an E-LSA through an FAA FSDO and they said they
are
overwhelmed with applications
for E-LSA certification already.
IF YOU HAVE A REGISTERED "E-LSA" IT MUST BE CERTIFIED BEFORE JANUARY 31,
2008 OR IT WILL BE PARTS AFTER THAT.
Mark
Kitfox 5 Vixen
912UL IVO
Hartford, Wisconsin
_____
See what'
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Temp Sensor location was Broken EGT probe |
Jim,
You bring up an interesting point. Is it more accurate to locate
a sensor in the spider tank or on the side of the radiator where the water
from the engine enters? One in the spider tank will give you temperature
before it enters the engine while the other gives you the temperature after
it leaves the engine. Which one is better to know? I'm getting ready to
install just such a probe.
Roger McConnell, Duncan, OK
Model 7 Trigear, Rotax 912uls
Flying sense Jan. 06
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Shumaker
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 11:57 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Broken EGT probe
Luis
The water temperature is the cylinder head temperature. Rotax engines come
with a sensor (or two) already installed in the cylinder head. That is
correct location to take a temperature reading that you can call a cylinder
head reading. There is actually not enough room to install a standard
cylinder head temp sensor under the spark plug. When I built my plane, the
water temperature gauge was installed in the spyder tank. This is a pretty
accurate reading for the water temperature and thus the cylinder head
temperature. It is actually more accurate to use the sensor in the cylinder
head for those rare instances when the cylinder boils the coolant and then
with the sensor in the head you will get a warning of a problem. The
instructions that came with the engine (1994 era) actually had the water
temp in the spyder and the oil temp in the dry sump. The dry sump oil
sensor is a measure of the bypass gases and is not even close to the oil
temp so that sensor was relocated. Then an oil cooler had to be installed
because the actual oil temps were much higher than recorded in the dry sump.
The point is that the water temp sensor you have will be fine, especially if
it is connected to the sensor in the cylinder head.
Jim Shumaker
Salinas, CA
Kitfox III, 912ul, 835 hours
http://forums.matronicsp;
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Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Broken EGT probe |
One issue I've always had with the EGT readings is that during normal cruise on
a cold day, it normally reads near the top of the gage (around 1450). The gage
only reads to 1500 so there's not much movement there for me to pick out a problem.
Is this consistent with what others are reading?
> When flying you keep an eye on the CHT too. If it unexpectedly starts to climb
you may have a problem.... Land and get it checked out. Obviously when you are
climbing WOT or close to WOT then you will be generating a bit more heat and
you should be able to see this in your CHT. Remember the cylinder heads are
liquid cooled so a noticeable increase in CHT can mean a problem with your liquid
cooling system.
--------
Luis Rodriguez
Model IV 1200
Rotax 912UL
Flying Weekly
Laurens, SC (34A)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=144051#144051
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale / E-LSA |
Yes, it does! I just certified an E-LSA Avid MK IV that was just completed.
And yes, there are restrictions on it's use as an LSA. But for those who do
not want to chance not getting there next Physical, or just have the Sport
Pilot license, they have something they can fly. I had lot's of interest in
pilots that were looking for an LSA plane because of this.
Mark
Kitfox 5 Vixen
912UL IVO
Hartford, Wisconsin
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Broken EGT probe / EGT temps |
This is the same as I am getting in my 912 UL. 1450 degrees on the EGT
almost all the time.
Mark
Kitfox 5 Vixen
912UL IVO
Hartford, Wisconsin
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| Subject: | Re: Temp Sensor location was Broken EGT probe |
out... That is the temp closest to the head temp.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Roger
McConnell
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 8:56 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Temp Sensor location was Broken EGT probe
Jim,
You bring up an interesting point. Is it more accurate to
locate
a sensor in the spider tank or on the side of the radiator where the
water
from the engine enters? One in the spider tank will give you temperature
before it enters the engine while the other gives you the temperature
after
it leaves the engine. Which one is better to know? I'm getting ready to
install just such a probe.
Roger McConnell, Duncan, OK
Model 7 Trigear, Rotax 912uls
Flying sense Jan. 06
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James
Shumaker
Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 11:57 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Broken EGT probe
Luis
The water temperature is the cylinder head temperature. Rotax engines
come
with a sensor (or two) already installed in the cylinder head. That is
correct location to take a temperature reading that you can call a
cylinder
head reading. There is actually not enough room to install a standard
cylinder head temp sensor under the spark plug. When I built my plane,
the
water temperature gauge was installed in the spyder tank. This is a
pretty
accurate reading for the water temperature and thus the cylinder head
temperature. It is actually more accurate to use the sensor in the
cylinder
head for those rare instances when the cylinder boils the coolant and
then
with the sensor in the head you will get a warning of a problem. The
instructions that came with the engine (1994 era) actually had the water
temp in the spyder and the oil temp in the dry sump. The dry sump oil
sensor is a measure of the bypass gases and is not even close to the oil
temp so that sensor was relocated. Then an oil cooler had to be
installed
because the actual oil temps were much higher than recorded in the dry
sump.
The point is that the water temp sensor you have will be fine,
especially if
it is connected to the sensor in the cylinder head.
Jim Shumaker
Salinas, CA
Kitfox III, 912ul, 835 hours
http://forums.matronicsp;
<http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=143893#143893>
&nbs/Navigator?Kitfox-List"
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| Subject: | Time to Fold Wings |
Today I timed myself as I put the plane into it's folding wing
"hangar". It took just over seven minutes, rather than the twenty
seconds it would have taken to push it into a full size hangar. I'm
guessing the set-up takes about the same time, for a grand total of
14 minutes of wing folding overhead per flight. If I fly four times a
week, it's costing me almost an hour a week, or four hours a month,
which works out to about $500 per month to fold the wings. Hmmm.
Maybe I should just rent the hangar. ($450 per month, versus the $100
per month I'm paying for a tie-down now.) My break even is therefore
12 flights per month. Guess I'm going to have to give this more thought.
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Message 27
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| Subject: | cross wind technique was scuffed wing tip |
someone suggested a cross control technique. any ideas on that?
malcolm mi 582 totally completed by the guy I bought it from.
Message 28
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| Subject: | Fwd: New Personal Message: welcome to the dark side |
SMF-c7066ab7222789cf7a3cc54061af0af6--
Message 29
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| Subject: | Aircraft Bill of Sale |
Just wondering? If you register as an experimental but still fit the limits
of a LSA can't you still fly it with a LSA liscence?
If so what is the advantage to registering it as a LSA?
Scott
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 4:28 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Aircraft Bill of Sale
I think the Jan deadline is for "fat" UL that want to register. I don't
think it also includes a plane that has not yet flown. Check your local
FSDO
You may also want to consider there are several restrictions on flying LSA
that are not in the Home Built category. Of course you will need a PPL for
the homebuilt. Some consider that a restriction too.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RRTRACK@aol.com
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Aircraft Bill of Sale
When you apply for registration on the plane, I believe you will need this
form. AC 8050-2
And also when you apply for registration you choose between
Experimental-Home Built or Experimental - Light Sport Aircraft. Once you get
it registered you cannot change this.
Also the deadline for getting an E-LSA certified is January 31, 2008. And if
the plane is not yet registered your chances of getting it certified before
that date are slim to none unless they extend that date.
As an Experimental - Home Built you must prove 51% was Home Built. And I
have read they are going to be more diligent on this with all the companies
out there that will assist (build) your plane
I have just certified an E-LSA through an FAA FSDO and they said they are
overwhelmed with applications
for E-LSA certification already.
IF YOU HAVE A REGISTERED "E-LSA" IT MUST BE CERTIFIED BEFORE JANUARY 31,
2008 OR IT WILL BE PARTS AFTER THAT.
Mark
Kitfox 5 Vixen
912UL IVO
Hartford, Wisconsin
_____
See what'
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/chref
"http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronhref="http
://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Aircraft Bill of Sale |
you will need a BILL of Sale or invoice from Kitfox to register your aircraft.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=144080#144080
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Temp Sensor location was Broken EGT probe |
Roger=0A=0AI believe that it is best to use the sensors in the heads. The
spider collects the water from the tops of the heads and sends it to the ra
diator, I think that is the way it flows. If it flows the other way then i
t is even more important to use the senors in the heads. They are already
in the engine, your indicator just needs to be able to recieve their signal
.=0A=0AJim Shumaker=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----=0AFrom: Roger McCon
nell <rdmac@swbell.net>=0ATo: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0ASent: Monday, Nov
ember 5, 2007 4:25:39 PM=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Temp Sensor locati
on was Broken EGT probe=0A=0A=0AJim,=0A You bring up an interest
ing point. Is it more accurate to locate a sensor in the spider tank or on
the side of the radiator where the water from the engine enters? One in the
spider tank will give you temperature before it enters the engine while th
e other gives you the temperature after it leaves the engine. Which one is
better to know? I=A2m getting ready to install just such a probe.=0A =0ARo
ger McConnell, Duncan , OK=0AModel 7 Trigear, Rotax 912uls =0AFlying sense
Jan. 06=0A =0A=0A=0A=0AFrom: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto
:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of James Shumaker=0ASent
: Sunday, November 04, 2007 11:57 PM=0ATo: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0ASubj
ect: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Broken EGT probe=0A =0ALuis=0A =0AThe water tempe
rature is the cylinder head temperature. Rotax engines come with a sensor
(or two) already installed in the cylinder head. That is correct location
to take a temperature reading that you can call a cylinder head reading. T
here is actually not enough room to install a standard cylinder head temp s
ensor under the spark plug. When I built my plane, the water temperature g
auge was installed in the spyder tank. This is a pretty accurate reading f
or the water temperature and thus the cylinder head temperature. It is act
ually more accurate to use the sensor in the cylinder head for those rare i
nstances when the cylinder boils the coolant and then with the sensor in th
e head you will get a warning of a problem. The instructions that came wit
h the engine (1994 era) actually had the water temp in the spyder and the o
il temp in the dry sump. The dry sump oil sensor is a measure of the bypas
s gases and is not even close to the oil temp so that
sensor was relocated. Then an oil cooler had to be installed because the
actual oil temps were much higher than recorded in the dry sump. The point
is that the water temp sensor you have will be fine, especially if it is c
onnected to the sensor in the cylinder head.=0A =0AJim Shumaker=0ASalinas ,
CA=0AKitfox III, 912ul, 835 hours=0Ahttp://forums.matronicsp;
&nbs/Navigator?Kitfox-List" target=_blank>http://www.matronics.co
m/Navigator?f="http://forums.matronics.com/" ====0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A=0A=0A =0A =0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/
contribution=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0Ahttp://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-Lis
===
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: cross wind technique was scuffed wing tip |
when landing in a cross wind you should have your up wind wing banked to the wind
and use opposite rudder to keep the nose pointed straight down the runway.
If the wind in coming from the right side, you will be right wing low and left
rudder. Same with takeoff. you would hold full right aileron then as speed
builds and you get light on the gear start relaxing the right till you have just
enough in to keep the right wing slightly low. As soon as a climb is established,
let the nose weather vane and set up a crab that keeps you on the centerline
of the runway on climb out.
Do not archive
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
95% complete
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=144083#144083
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Time to Fold Wings |
Not to mention the added benifit of being a whole lot of storage space for a price
that is much cheaper than a commercial storage locker.
Jim Shumaker
Mod III, 912ul
800+hours
oh yeah California
----- Original Message ----
From: Guy Buchanan <bnn@nethere.com>
Sent: Monday, November 5, 2007 6:22:37 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Time to Fold Wings
Today I timed myself as I put the plane into it's folding wing
"hangar". It took just over seven minutes, rather than the twenty
seconds it would have taken to push it into a full size hangar. I'm
guessing the set-up takes about the same time, for a grand total of
14 minutes of wing folding overhead per flight. If I fly four times a
week, it's costing me almost an hour a week, or four hours a month,
which works out to about $500 per month to fold the wings. Hmmm.
Maybe I should just rent the hangar. ($450 per month, versus the $100
per month I'm paying for a tie-down now.) My break even is therefore
12 flights per month. Guess I'm going to have to give this more thought.
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Time to Fold Wings |
Guy Buchanan wrote:
>
> Today I timed myself as I put the plane into it's folding wing
> "hangar". It took just over seven minutes, rather than the twenty
> seconds it would have taken to push it into a full size hangar. I'm
> guessing the set-up takes about the same time, for a grand total of 14
> minutes of wing folding overhead per flight. If I fly four times a
> week, it's costing me almost an hour a week, or four hours a month,
> which works out to about $500 per month to fold the wings. Hmmm. Maybe
> I should just rent the hangar. ($450 per month, versus the $100 per
> month I'm paying for a tie-down now.) My break even is therefore 12
> flights per month. Guess I'm going to have to give this more thought.
>
>
> Guy Buchanan
> San Diego, CA
> K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
If I'm understanding this right you're saying that's about $125 per
hour for your time?
I'm shocked to think how little my time is worth by comparison. =-O
I would agree that renting a hangar would be a good trade off for you.
Go for it.
--
Rex Hefferan
SE Colorado / K-II / 582-C / still waiting repairs
do not archive
Message 35
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| Subject: | Sport Pilot vs. LSA (was: Aircraft Bill of Sale) |
Scott asks:
>If you register as an experimental but still fit
>the limits of a LSA can't you still fly it with
>a LSA liscence?
Yes, Noel and Mark are mistaken, but it's a sport
pilot license not an LSA license. Sport pilots
can fly any experimental, experimental light
sport, or certified aircraft that meets the
restrictions for a light sport aircraft:
"...as discussed in the section-by-section
preamble discussion for 1.1, Definition of
Light-Sport Aircraft, a sport pilot can operate
an aircraft meeting the light-sport aircraft
definition in 1.1, regardless of the
airworthiness certificate issued."
--Final Rule, Docket No. FAA-2001-11133; Amendment No. 1-53;
21-85; 43-39; 45-24; 61-110; 65-45; 91-282
The FAA considers any airplane (other rules apply
to helicopters and lighter-than-air vehicles) to
be a "light sport aircraft" if it has met the
following criteria continuously since its
original certification:
Maximum takeoff weight of 1320 lbs for land planes or 1430 for float planes.
Maximum airspeed of 120 KCAS.
Maximum stall speed (Vsi) of 45 KCAS at max takeoff weight.
Maximum seating capacity of 2.
Maximum of one engine.
A fixed or ground adjustable prop.
A non-pressurized cabin.
Fixed landing gear (except for float planes).
For more information, check out:
<http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/sport_pilot/>.
Mike G.
N728KF
Phoenix, AZ
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: Sport Pilot vs. LSA (was: Aircraft Bill of Sale) |
Excellent.
And let's not forget, quoted from the same source.....
" The maximum weight of
a light-sport aircraft is the sum of:
(1) Aircraft empty weight;
(2) Weight of the passenger for each
seat installed;
(3) Baggage allowance for each
passenger; and
(4) Full fuel, including a minimum of
the half-hour fuel reserve required for
day visual flight rules in 91.151(a)(1).
You won't find the term "Gross weight" used, or implied, anywhere by
the FAA in regards to LSA issues. Period.
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Sport Pilot vs. LSA (was: Aircraft Bill of Sale) |
Steve sez:
>You won't find the term "Gross weight" used, or implied, anywhere by
>the FAA in regards to LSA issues. Period.
What does that have to do with the discussion, Steve? Just want to
beat that dead horse or yours some more?
Mike G.
N728KF
Phoenix, AZ
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