Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:30 AM - Re: Need Opinions! (dave)
2. 08:03 AM - Re: [!! SPAM] S5 NSI Inverted? Deke (Guy Buchanan)
3. 08:03 AM - Re: Need Opinions! (Guy Buchanan)
4. 08:28 AM - Re: uncoordinated turns (kitfoxmike)
5. 08:37 AM - Re: Need Opinions! (kitfoxmike)
6. 09:01 AM - Re: Stalls and Spins (kitfoxmike)
7. 09:11 AM - Re: Need Opinions! (Gary)
8. 10:06 AM - Re: Re: uncoordinated turns (Michel Verheughe)
9. 10:30 AM - Re: Need Opinions! (RockyRim)
10. 10:42 AM - Post Mortem - Matronics List Pummeled By Spam... (Matt Dralle)
11. 11:59 AM - NSI turbo to non turbo (A Smith)
12. 01:04 PM - Re: Re: Need Opinions! (steve eccles)
13. 03:47 PM - Re: Need Opinions! (wingnut)
14. 05:49 PM - Re: NSI turbo to non turbo (fox5flyer)
15. 06:27 PM - Re: uncoordinated turns (rudderdancer)
16. 08:14 PM - Re: uncoordinated turns (kitfoxmike)
17. 08:40 PM - Re: Re: uncoordinated turns (Michael Gibbs)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Need Opinions! |
Chuck,
You could surely operate a Kitfox out of a 700 foot strip on a regular basis with
a 582 or a 912ul, 912s or 914 for you and your son. The key here is weight
and that is why i only mentioned the Rotax engines. Other engine might be
an option as well but you have to keep your plane light. I would empty weights
of 700 lbs or less be close to your limit. I have not flown a Jab powered
Kitfox but it might be a candidate as well.
If you are looking at one , get the owner to fly you in to a short strip like that
on grass and try it to see.
A Kitfox IV with a 912 on wheels should weight 650 average empty and with a 1200
gross you would have plenty there. Just make sure you both sit in the plane
and try it as 6'2" people have long legs and it might be a bit cramped.
--------
Rotax Dealer, Ontario Canada
Flying Videos and Kitfox Info
http://www.cfisher.com/
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145020#145020
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: S5 NSI Inverted? Deke |
At 10:43 PM 11/10/2007, you wrote:
>I was thinking of just learning to pull it up into inverted flight
>and then roling it over to re-right it after a short time. I guess
>I'll stay away from that idea now.
It's called an Immelman and it's a fairly difficult maneuver
to get right. It does involve at least zero g's at the top so
negative oil and fuel systems would be prudent. When I did them in
the Decathlon I would do a very slight push at the top of the loop
and immediately roll, so I never achieved anywhere near negative one
g. The problem in under-powered aircraft is that the roll at the top
is done at very slow speed, requiring a lot of coordinated input to
control the adverse yaw and gyroscopic forces. The other problem was
that when you screwed it up you fell out of the sky in any number of
unusual attitudes. This meant that you should be comfortable with
both upright and inverted spin recovery before you do try an
Immelman. (Or have an instructor along who can recover for you.)
As always I highly recommend basic aerobatic training for
everybody. It teaches you how to fly and it's fun!
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Need Opinions! |
At 10:12 AM 11/9/2007, you wrote:
>My name is Chuck and Im considering a
>Kitfox. I know that if I want opinions, that this is the place!
Unfortunately you're right.
>I do have a climate controlled building with a
>12 door. So, that is why Im looking at folding wing planes.
In the long run you'll find it easier to just
build another building, or expand the door on the
existing building. But for now, you're right that
the Kitfox is a very good alternative for wing
folding. I do it every time I fly and as you've
seen from the archives, it adds less than 20
minutes to my flight, total. HOWEVER, my plane
was built specifically for this purpose. Most
Kitfoxes aren't (my casual statistical
observation,) and will require modification to achieve my levels of expediency.
>STOL the best runway I can arrange is going to
>only be about 700. However, I wont have any
>obstacles on either end to clear except a 4
>fence. The terrain is flat and sparsely populated.
I know a IV will take off high and hot at gross
in well under 700'. Landing is entirely another
matter. Kitfox IV's are floaters, particularly at
or near stall speed and require skill and
concentration to land short. I know people who
NEVER land more than 250', even heavy, high, and
hot, and can get in under 100' if they want to.
However after a year and a half of flying I am
unable to reliably replicate their performance.
I'm getting there, though. (To be fair I wouldn't
blanch at getting in at 700', but it sure wouldn't be casual.)
>Im 61 and 200lbs. My son is 62 and
>160lbs. We would like to be able to routinely use the plane together.
You'll have to use thin seats in a IV and you'll
be somewhat cramped. I'm 6' and change and use
thick seats and am cramped, but my butt's
comfortable enough for a 4 1/2 leg in a 10 hour
flying day so I can't complain. Though I wouldn't
trade the IV's flight characteristics for a 5, (I
haven't flown John's new "hybrid" that supposedly
returned some of the IV's handling to the larger
aircraft,) you might want to get the larger plane for comfort.
Guy Buchanan
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 100% done, thanks mostly to Bob Ducar.
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: uncoordinated turns |
why do we do anything. to spice things up, to make a change. don't want boredom
to ...
also, that's a flat turn on take off not landing. Although I've done flat turns
on landing, usually when changing my mind at the last second for the grass runway.
That in itself is very good practice, last minute change that is. What
do you do when something is on the runway?
--------
kitfoxmike
model IV, 1200
speedster
912ul
building
RV7a
slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit
"if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying
enough"
Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145083#145083
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Need Opinions! |
I fly my fox a bunch. I myself am 170 pounds and my wife is about 150. Now I fly
everyday and the thought of folding the wings is NOT on my want list, but don't
let that deter you. If I take off I can be off the ground very quickly,
usually within 200ft. If I have my wife in the plane it doubles. I generally
have no more than 10gallons of fuel in the plane, it carries 26. Expect the
fox to be a slug with 400 pounds of people on board, but still better than any
cessna. Is the fence yours? If so I would think of cutting it out at the runway
approach ends. That way you can get right down there and drag it in to land.
I don't see any trouble with take off. Make sure you have an IVO prop,
those buggers are great for take off and cruise speed, make it inflight adjust
as well.
--------
kitfoxmike
model IV, 1200
speedster
912ul
building
RV7a
slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit
"if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying
enough"
Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145086#145086
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Stalls and Spins |
dave wrote:
>
> > If a person flies his airplane and maintains 1.3 of stall, or is it 1.2. Then
he won't have a problem with spins or anything else thrown at him. That is
if he keeps within 45degrees of bank. Now if you are crazy like me and do up to
90degrees of bank, then you need to increase your speed, plain and simple.
> >
>
>
> so if your stall is 38 mph then fly a simulated approach at 50 mph which is
a tad more than 1.3 stall speed ........... then fly a skidded turn of 45
degree bank as you would be on base to final but skidded......... now opposite
rudder to line back on runway,......... highly likely you will flip inverted
and spin..... don't try this without at least 3000 feet below you ..... you
will likely lose a minimum of 500 to 1000 feet if you are fast -- if not alot
more..........
>
> Sadly enough enough i know instructors that have never spun an airplane....
go figure.........
I agree totally,
Now when you come in with 1.3 of stall, that is of course if you are doing things
right as well, you know coordinated. If you have troubles with keeping the
ball centered than go grab a CFI and let him tell you that things aren't right
instead of finding out yourself the wrong way.
As long as you factor in extra speed for doing out of the box maneuvers, than the
fox WILL do it without any repercussions.
The fox is very fun and if you treat it with respect you can have many flights
of satisfaction and fun, as well as dazzle anybody on the ground.
I can tell about all the things I do here, but then somebody is going to call the
local FSDO and turn me in. AFter all isn't that what FAA stands for. Frickn'
Aviators against Aviators.
--------
kitfoxmike
model IV, 1200
speedster
912ul
building
RV7a
slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit
"if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying
enough"
Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145092#145092
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Need Opinions! |
Chuck
We seem to have the same requirements! I've thought long and hard over what's
best for me and I recently bought an unbuilt IV, 1200 with the 912UL. I currently
live in Toronto but our (early) retirement home is under construction on
the family farm in Nova Scotia. House and Kitfox are on a 2 yr. build plan.
I wanted an airplane that can roll into a basement garage for storage and operate
off a 600' grass strip next to the house. My other options include mowing
a 1000' strip further away from the house and partly on a neighbors hay field
and/or towing 3 km to the local airport (Trenton) where there's asphalt as far
as the eye can see. My 14 yr old son plans to get his pilots license, maybe
even do his training in the KF. I'm 5/11, 170 so the fit isn't an issue.
--------
Gary Del Bel Belluz
Toronto, IV / 912UL
Just getting started
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145095#145095
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: uncoordinated turns |
On Nov 11, 2007, at 5:26 PM, kitfoxmike wrote:
> What do you do when something is on the runway?
It hasn't happened yet. I am lucky to fly from a place where I can see
around for at least a half a mile without obstructions. But if it
should happen, I hope I'll do the right thing, whatever it is.
Michel Verheughe
Norway
Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Need Opinions! |
Hi Chuck,
What a bag of worms you opened. I'm 6'3 205 flying out of 700'
at 1400' msl. My wife is 5'8. I have a 40' high wire on the west
side about a 100' from the threshold which makes landings just
about need a tail hook and cable, but I'm in the process of going
underground with that. I've got about 1400 hrs. low wing, so
we are a pretty good match.
Denise and Rocky Whitman
S7 912S
Austin, Tx.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145114#145114
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Post Mortem - Matronics List Pummeled By Spam... |
Dear Listers,
Over a 3-day period, Thursday 11/8 though Saturday 11/10, the Matronics Lists were
pummeled with over 450,000 spam emails causing posting delays and a few duplicate
messages. Yeah, I really said nearly half a million spams! The good
news is that I don't believe a single one of them actually made it to the Lists
thanks to the aggressive List filtering code and the Barracuda spam filter.
The bad news was that it caused quite a back log of email messages starting Friday
and continuing until late Saturday when I noticed that delivery seemed a bit
sluggish. By about 11pm on Saturday night, I had managed to get the backlog
cleared out of the spam filter by temporarily adjusting some of the filtering.
A check of the queues this morning, and everything looks like its working great
and there are no incoming filtering delays and spam levels appear to be back
to "normal".
There were a number of people asking what was going on, so I thought that I'd send
out a follow up post mortem on the event...
November is the annual List Fund Raiser. Your contribution directly enables me
to buy systems like the Barracuda spam filter that keep the List free of that
garbage. Please make a contribution to support your Lists!
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | NSI turbo to non turbo |
Here is the readers digest version. I think that with the weight and
drag reduction of removing the turbo there will not be that much
reduction if any in performance. So I am going out to the group for
input on how and what I will need to do. Or find some one that wants to
swap all or part of the install.
Albert
5TD NSI and CAP
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Need Opinions! |
Chuck
I'm flying a model 5 with a Continental O-200 , I routinely go in and out of
my brothers 900 ft strip with wires on one end and a lake on the other and I
come in at 240 at 6'2",,,,, . I do believe that you will find a multitude
of stories and types of Kitfoxes with different setups its all what you are
used to or should I say what you will get used to ..The best thing to do is
try and get a ride in one that is similar to what you will be getting ,..
Good luck in your search you wont be disappointed in a Kitfox.
Steve Eccles
Kitfox 5
Eagle Lake , Minnesota
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of RockyRim
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 12:30 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Need Opinions!
Hi Chuck,
What a bag of worms you opened. I'm 6'3 205 flying out of 700'
at 1400' msl. My wife is 5'8. I have a 40' high wire on the west
side about a 100' from the threshold which makes landings just
about need a tail hook and cable, but I'm in the process of going
underground with that. I've got about 1400 hrs. low wing, so
we are a pretty good match.
Denise and Rocky Whitman
S7 912S
Austin, Tx.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145114#145114
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Need Opinions! |
Do you have any places to land near your runway that you can use in an emergency?
700 ft doesn't leave much room to get back down if the motor burps on takeoff.
I'm in a similar boat; About 1400 ft but with 30ft trees on both ends. Knowing
that I can land at that cow pasture off the end of the runway adds alot to
my comfort factor.
> the best runway I can arrange is going to only be about 700. However, I wont
have any obstacles on either end to clear except a 4 fence. The terrain is flat
and sparsely populated.
--------
Luis Rodriguez
Model IV 1200
Rotax 912UL
Flying Weekly
Laurens, SC (34A)
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145220#145220
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: NSI turbo to non turbo |
Even though they're both EA81 engine blocks, there are many differences,
including pistons, and lifters. The turbo has lower compression pistons
and hydraulic lifters, vs the normal asp has solid lifters and high
compression pistons. Cam is also different as well as the pan, and
several other things.
Making a swap might be the better way to go.
I'm not sure what you mean by the readers digest version, or did you
mean condensed? Did you attach something? I received nothing here.
Deke
----- Original Message -----
From: A Smith
To: Kitfox List
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 2:58 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: NSI turbo to non turbo
Here is the readers digest version. I think that with the weight and
drag reduction of removing the turbo there will not be that much
reduction if any in performance. So I am going out to the group for
input on how and what I will need to do. Or find some one that wants to
swap all or part of the install.
Albert
5TD NSI and CAP
Message 15
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: uncoordinated turns |
I'm new to flying the Kitfox. I have a model II and I've been working to regain
my skills out at a local dry lake. I too have noticed the different yaw and
coordination traits of the Kitfox. It is getting better with practice and I'm
sure it'll get second nature in time. I was wondering if when it comes time
to recover my plane if maybe giving it a vertical similar to the Maule M-5 wouldn't
help keep it's heading easier? Has anyone ever tried this? It seems like
it could be done.
Thanks for any feedback,
Jack
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145254#145254
Message 16
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: uncoordinated turns |
rudderdancer wrote:
> I'm new to flying the Kitfox. I have a model II and I've been working to regain
my skills out at a local dry lake. I too have noticed the different yaw and
coordination traits of the Kitfox. It is getting better with practice and
I'm sure it'll get second nature in time. I was wondering if when it comes time
to recover my plane if maybe giving it a vertical similar to the Maule M-5
wouldn't help keep it's heading easier? Has anyone ever tried this? It seems
like it could be done.
>
> Thanks for any feedback,
> Jack
please explain vertical similar to the maule m-5
--------
kitfoxmike
model IV, 1200
speedster
912ul
building
RV7a
slowbuild wings, fuse, finish kit
"if you're not getting razzed from pilots or the FAA then you're not flying
enough"
Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=145285#145285
Message 17
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: uncoordinated turns |
Jack sez:
>...I was wondering if when it comes time to recover my plane if
>maybe giving it a vertical similar to the Maule M-5 wouldn't help
>keep it's heading easier? Has anyone ever tried this? It seems
>like it could be done.
I assume you are talking about the extended leading edge of the
vertical stabilizer that curves into the top of the fuselage, right?
The dorsal fin, as it were?
I did that on my Kitfox. We welded a piece of steel tube from the
rear of the turtledeck to a point about 8 or 9 inches up the front of
the vertical tail, with a smooth curve just forward of the tail. We
also welded in a couple of vertical stand-offs to support the span.
I've highlighted this portion in the attached photo.
It made covering that area easier and I sure like the look. I don't
know how much improvement in yaw stability it provides because I
don't have anything to compare it to.
Mike G.
N728KF
Phoenix, AZ
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|