---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 03/06/08: 17 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:55 AM - Re: Cross-Wind T & G (kj7sr@earthlink.net) 2. 09:06 AM - Re: Re: Cross-Wind T & G (Jose M. Toro) 3. 11:13 AM - Lite for sale (fox5flyer) 4. 02:20 PM - Poly Fiber Polybrush (Pat Reilly) 5. 02:41 PM - Completed Phase one (Tom Jones) 6. 02:55 PM - Re: Completed Phase one (patrick reilly) 7. 03:21 PM - Re: Completed Phase one (Tom Jones) 8. 04:18 PM - Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush (darinh) 9. 04:19 PM - Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush (Roger McConnell) 10. 05:06 PM - Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush (Lynn Matteson) 11. 05:12 PM - Re: Completed Phase one (Lynn Matteson) 12. 06:46 PM - Re: Re: Cross-Wind T & G (Paul Morel) 13. 07:17 PM - Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush (patrick reilly) 14. 07:22 PM - Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush (patrick reilly) 15. 07:42 PM - Re: Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush (patrick reilly) 16. 07:50 PM - Re: Re: Completed Phase one (patrick reilly) 17. 08:40 PM - Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush (darinh) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:55:27 AM PST US From: "kj7sr@earthlink.net" Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Cross-Wind T & G I agree with Michael, I flew large acft from 727s to 747s and found the low wing technique to be best. Before you would drag an engine you will scare yourself to the point you will correct the bank, (or should). With that technique you only have to worry about landing straight ahead you are not realigning to a runway, battling a crosswind and landing all at the same time. Chuck do not archive Kitfox Model 1 kj7sr@earthlink.net EarthLink Revolves Around You. ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 09:06:36 AM PST US From: "Jose M. Toro" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Cross-Wind T & G IMHO, for strong cross wind, cross controls (low wing and opposite rudder) is the ONLY correct technique...and this is NOT what the pilot of the A320 did. Jose ex-Kitfox II/582 (still fly it) ----- Original Message ---- From: "kj7sr@earthlink.net" Sent: Thursday, March 6, 2008 11:50:01 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Cross-Wind T & G I agree with Michael, I flew large acft from 727s to 747s and found the low wing technique to be best. Before you would drag an engine you will scare yourself to the point you will correct the bank, (or should). With that technique you only have to worry about landing straight ahead you are not realigning to a runway, battling a crosswind and landing all at the same time. Chuck do not archive Kitfox Model 1 kj7sr@earthlink.net EarthLink Revolves Around You. Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 11:13:37 AM PST US From: "fox5flyer" Subject: Kitfox-List: Lite for sale For those who may be looking, there's a Kitfox Lite package for sale on ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=017&sspagen ame=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=270216665246&rd=1 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 02:20:17 PM PST US From: "Pat Reilly" Subject: Kitfox-List: Poly Fiber Polybrush Kitfoxers, I have completeled the first coat of Poly Brush applied with a brush as directed. It appears to have taken the 1st coat fine. The recommended standard proceedure is to give the plane 2 additional sprayed coats of Poly Brush before applying Poly Spray. Has anyone attempted to apply a 2nd coat of Poly Brush with brush or roller? Pat Reilly Mod 3 Rebuild Rockford, IL ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 02:41:25 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Completed Phase one From: "Tom Jones" I completed the 40 hour phase one flight testing on my kitfox today. Here's a picture after the flight. -------- Tom Jones Classic IV 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168113#168113 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/ready_to_load_190.jpg ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 02:55:36 PM PST US From: patrick reilly Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Completed Phase one Tom, What kind of silver paint is that on your plane? Do not archieve Pat Reilly Mod 3 Rebuild Rockford, ILx-List: Completed Phase one> From: nahsikhs@elltel.net> Date: T hu, 6 Mar 2008 14:38:48 -0800> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > --> Kitfox- List message posted by: "Tom Jones" > > I completed th e 40 hour phase one flight testing on my kitfox today. Here's a picture aft er the flight.> > --------> Tom Jones> Classic IV> 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two b lade Warp> Ellensburg, WA> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://f orums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168113#168113> > > > > Attachments: > =======================> > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 03:21:50 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Completed Phase one From: "Tom Jones" > Tom, What kind of silver paint is that on your plane? > Do not archieve > Pat Reilly Pat, the silver is Polytone "Nevada Silver". The main reason I chose it was to keep the plane light. It is one coat over top of the polyspray. The yellow is polytone "Ag Cat yellow". -------- Tom Jones Classic IV 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168119#168119 ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 04:18:09 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush From: "darinh" Pat, I sprayed mine so I can't answer your question but I would be most worried about even coverage with a brush. Also, the chance of brush marks/roller marks would steer me away from this approach. Just curious, why would you consider brushing or rolling these coats? As I understand it, the Polybrush is one of the most important steps to do right or you get major problems with pinholes. Having just finished my color coats, I am happy to say that my paint went way better than I could have hoped. I followed the Poly Fiber manual to the letter as far as the polybrush and polyspray are considered. -------- Darin Hawkes Series 7 (Painting) 914 Turbo Kaysville, Utah Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168129#168129 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 04:19:46 PM PST US From: "Roger McConnell" Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Poly Fiber Polybrush Yes, I used a short nap roller to apply the second coat and then followed right behind it with a foam brush to smooth out the tiny air bubbles that formed. Worked well for me. Roger McConnell, Duncan, OK Model 7 Trigear, Rotax 912uls Flying sense Jan. 06 _____ From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pat Reilly Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 4:17 PM Subject: Kitfox-List: Poly Fiber Polybrush Kitfoxers, I have completeled the first coat of Poly Brush applied with a brush as directed. It appears to have taken the 1st coat fine. The recommended standard proceedure is to give the plane 2 additional sprayed coats of Poly Brush before applying Poly Spray. Has anyone attempted to apply a 2nd coat of Poly Brush with brush or roller? Pat Reilly Mod 3 Rebuild Rockford, IL ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:06:33 PM PST US From: Lynn Matteson Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Poly Fiber Polybrush Not here...why would you want to? The result with a brush or roller would be just that much more that you'd have to smooth out later, I'm afraid. I think the reason that the first coat is done with a brush is so that you get complete penetration with the first coat. The additional coats smooth out the first coat and "gives additional fill and flexibility to the job without adding excessive weight." ...quoted from the manual...you DO have the manual, right, Pat? Lynn Matteson Grass Lake, Michigan Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200 flying w/475+ hrs On Mar 6, 2008, at 5:17 PM, Pat Reilly wrote: > Kitfoxers, I have completeled the first coat of Poly Brush applied > with a brush as directed. It appears to have taken the 1st coat > fine. The recommended standard proceedure is to give the plane 2 > additional sprayed coats of Poly Brush before applying Poly Spray. > Has anyone attempted to apply a 2nd coat of Poly Brush with brush > or roller? > > > Pat Reilly > Mod 3 Rebuild > Rockford, IL > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_- > ============================================================ _- > forums.matronics.com_- > ============================================================ _- > contribution_- > =========================================================== ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 05:12:51 PM PST US From: Lynn Matteson Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Completed Phase one Congratulations...now you can widen that "circle", eh? Lynn Matteson Grass Lake, Michigan Kitfox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200 flying w/475+ hrs do not archive On Mar 6, 2008, at 5:38 PM, Tom Jones wrote: > > I completed the 40 hour phase one flight testing on my kitfox > today. Here's a picture after the flight. > > -------- > Tom Jones > Classic IV > 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp > Ellensburg, WA > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168113#168113 > > > Attachments: > > http://forums.matronics.com//files/ready_to_load_190.jpg > > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:46:58 PM PST US From: "Paul Morel" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Cross-Wind T & G As a retired Aircraft Dispatcher for a major carrier, I have only one question. Why did this so called "Hero" go around for a 2nd attempt? It was quite evident he exceeded the crosswind limits. Did he not realize the danger he put the lives of the passengers in? After aborting the first landing attempt, he should have focused on his alternate or suitable airport where the winds would have not been a factor. He really dodged that bullet. Paul ----- Original Message ----- From: kj7sr@earthlink.net To: Kitfox-List@matronics.com Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 10:50 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Cross-Wind T & G I agree with Michael, I flew large acft from 727s to 747s and found the low wing technique to be best. Before you would drag an engine you will scare yourself to the point you will correct the bank, (or should). With that technique you only have to worry about landing straight ahead you are not realigning to a runway, battling a crosswind and landing all at the same time. Chuck do not archive Kitfox Model 1 kj7sr@earthlink.net EarthLink Revolves Around You. ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 07:17:55 PM PST US From: patrick reilly Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Poly Fiber Polybrush Lynn, Yes, I do have the manual. And, they state that the 1st coat penetrat ion is better with the brush. The 1st coat is very smooth. Spray coats will not smooth it out as it is aleady as smooth as it could be. The cloth weav e does need more fill. The only place I have to smooth with a mek soaked r ag is along the tapes very slightly. I believe that with the right type rol ler or possibly the right brush technique, it may be as smooth as a spray a pplication. I figured somebody out there had tried. Pat Reilly Mod 3 rebuild Rockford, IL> From: lynnmatt@jps.net> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Poly Fiber Polybrush> Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 20:03:41 -0500> To: kitfox-list@matronics. > Not here...why would you want to? The result with a brush or roller > wo uld be just that much more that you'd have to smooth out later, I'm > afrai d.> I think the reason that the first coat is done with a brush is so > tha t you get complete penetration with the first coat. The additional > coats smooth out the first coat and "gives additional fill and > flexibility to t he job without adding excessive weight." ...quoted > from the manual...you DO have the manual, right, Pat?> > Lynn Matteson> Grass Lake, Michigan> Kit fox IV Speedster w/Jabiru 2200> flying w/475+ hrs> > > On Mar 6, 2008, at 5 :17 PM, Pat Reilly wrote:> > > Kitfoxers, I have completeled the first coat of Poly Brush applied > > with a brush as directed. It appears to have tak en the 1st coat > > fine. The recommended standard proceedure is to give th e plane 2 > > additional sprayed coats of Poly Brush before applying Poly S pray. > > Has anyone attempted to apply a 2nd coat of Poly Brush with brush > > or roller?> >> >> > Pat Reilly> > Mod 3 Rebuild> > Rockford, IL> > htt p://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List_- > > ======== == _- > > forums.matronics.com_- > > =========== > > contribution_- > > ================= ====================> > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:22:31 PM PST US From: patrick reilly Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Poly Fiber Polybrush Roger, Thanks for the reply. I had tested a small patch with a foam roller. The mek made the roller swell up but it held together. There were alot of tiny air bubbles. I wiped them very quickly with a rag. It is pretty smooth and your foam brush idea just may be the ticket. Pat Reilly Mod 3 Rebuild Rockford, IL From: rdmac@swbell.netTo: kitfox-list@matronics.comSubject: RE: Kitfox-List : Poly Fiber PolybrushDate: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 18:17:29 -0600 Yes, I used a short nap roller to apply the second coat and then fol lowed right behind it with a foam brush to smooth out the tiny air bubbles that formed. Worked well for me. Roger McConnell, Duncan, OK Model 7 Trigear, Rotax 912uls Flying sense Jan. 06 From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-serv er@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Pat ReillySent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 4:1 7 PMTo: kitfox-list@matronics.comSubject: Kitfox-List: Poly Fiber Polybrush Kitfoxers, I have completeled the first coat of Poly Brush applied with a b rush as directed. It appears to have taken the 1st coat fine. The recommend ed standard proceedure is to give the plane 2 additional sprayed coats of P oly Brush before applying Poly Spray. Has anyone attempted to apply a 2nd c oat of Poly Brush with brush or roller? Pat Reilly Mod 3 Rebuild Rockford, IL http://www.matronics.com/contribution ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 07:42:34 PM PST US From: patrick reilly Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush Darin, 2 reasons I am considering a roller or brush for the 2nd and maybe 3rd Poly Brush coat is the pinholes that occur when applying the 2nd Poly B rush coat sprayed on must be areas that were not filled with the brushed on 1st coat. A 2nd brushed on coat would eliminate any areas missed with the 1st coat. The 2nd reason is it is easier to roller and I'm not sure a spray ed on coat would be any smoother than a properly rolled one. My 1st brushed on coat is as smooth as it could get. Proper brush technique is, apply and leave it be. Any extra brushing with mek based highly volitile carrier pai nts is futile. I watched my partners at Oshkosh in the mini covering class attempt to "dab" Poly Tak. They couldn't apply an 8" long strip of Poly Tak with their dab method before the 1st 6" of Poly Tak had dried. Pat Reilly Mod 3 RebuildRockford, IL> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush> From: gerns25@netscape.net> Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 16:15:11 -0800> To: kitfo 5@netscape.net>> > Pat,> > I sprayed mine so I can't answer your question b ut I would be most worried about even coverage with a brush. Also, the chan ce of brush marks/roller marks would steer me away from this approach. Just curious, why would you consider brushing or rolling these coats? > > As I understand it, the Polybrush is one of the most important steps to do right or you get major problems with pinholes. Having just finished my color coa ts, I am happy to say that my paint went way better than I could have hoped . I followed the Poly Fiber manual to the letter as far as the polybrush an d polyspray are considered.> > --------> Darin Hawkes> Series 7 (Painting)> 914 Turbo> Kaysville, Utah> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http:/ =======================> > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 07:50:16 PM PST US From: patrick reilly Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Completed Phase one Tom, That silver looks good. I am rebuilding a 3 with yellow wings. I had t o recover the fusalage and am planning on a black fusalage. I might change to that silver though, withthe yellow wings rudder, horiz stab and elevator . I thought 1 coat of black Poly Tone over the Poly Spray might do the job. > Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Completed Phase one> From: nahsikhs@elltel.net> Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 15:18:53 -0800> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > --> Kitfox-List message posted by: "Tom Jones" > > > > To m, What kind of silver paint is that on your plane? > > Do not archieve > > Pat Reilly > > > Pat, the silver is Polytone "Nevada Silver". The main rea son I chose it was to keep the plane light. It is one coat over top of the polyspray. The yellow is polytone "Ag Cat yellow".> > --------> Tom Jones> Classic IV> 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp> Ellensburg, WA> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=1 =========> > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 08:40:43 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Poly Fiber Polybrush From: "darinh" Pat, You are correct in that if you didn't get the proper amount applied with the first brush coat, then a second brush coat would be beneficial to seal and prevent pinholes. However, I have found that if you follow the manual exactly as it is written, you will have no problems with pinholes...at least I didn't. On the brush/roller technique being as smooth as spraying, I will have to respectfully disagree. I have never seen a brushed or rolled finish be even close to as smooth as a sprayed finish. I am not saying it won't work, I just think it is much more work and you have more of a chance of missing an area. If you decide to go this route, let us know how it turns out. -------- Darin Hawkes Series 7 (Painting) 914 Turbo Kaysville, Utah Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=168191#168191 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kitfox-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.