Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:11 AM - Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (darinh)
2. 06:44 AM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (Lynn Matteson)
3. 07:41 AM - Re: Luggage/Cargo Bag FOR SALE (FlyboyTR)
4. 07:45 AM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (Tom Jones)
5. 07:46 AM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (fox5flyer)
6. 08:45 AM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (FlyboyTR)
7. 09:24 AM - Re: Throttle Cables (Kyle)
8. 09:44 AM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (darinh)
9. 09:52 AM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (Marco Menezes)
10. 11:03 AM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (FlyboyTR)
11. 11:54 AM - Re: Anyone Do Spins or Aerobatics in a Kitfox ??? (JetPilot)
12. 12:01 PM - Re: Re: Throttle Cables (Lynn Matteson)
13. 12:29 PM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (dcsfoto)
14. 01:07 PM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (n85ae)
15. 01:30 PM - Re: Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (Randy Daughenbaugh)
16. 01:48 PM - Re: Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (Noel Loveys)
17. 02:01 PM - Heavy stick for aileron's (Dwight Early)
18. 02:18 PM - Re: Carb vent line install - Rotax 2 cycleCarb vent line install (FlyboyTR)
19. 02:34 PM - Re: Heavy stick for aileron's (Pete Christensen)
20. 02:40 PM - Re: Anyone Do Spins or Aerobatics in a Kitfox ??? (Don G)
21. 03:16 PM - Re: Anyone Do Spins or Aerobatics in a Kitfox ??? (JetPilot)
22. 03:34 PM - Re: Heavy stick for aileron's (Dan Billingsley)
23. 03:48 PM - Re: Heavy stick for aileron's (Rick Frederick)
24. 04:04 PM - Re: Heavy stick for aileron's (Pete Christensen)
25. 04:20 PM - Taller wider tube landing gear (Pat Reilly)
26. 04:31 PM - Re: Re: Throttle Cables (Lowell Fitt)
27. 04:46 PM - Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? (JetPilot)
28. 05:36 PM - Re: Taller wider tube landing gear (ElleryWeld@aol.com)
29. 06:03 PM - Re: Heavy stick for aileron's (Dwight Early)
30. 07:30 PM - Re: Heavy stick for aileron's (Dan Billingsley)
31. 07:40 PM - Re: Heavy stick for aileron's (Tom Jones)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
Well, it is time for the first flight of N914KF. It seemed like this day would
never come but it has. I am looking for good advice/tips for my maiden voyage...things
that you guys have done that were good (or bad and wouldn't do again)
that you could pass on. I have never been a test pilot so this is a first
for me and my airplane. Anyone have anything the learned or an idea they implemented
on their 1st flight that worked and was useful?
--------
Darin Hawkes
Series 7 (Airworthiness in Hand - building courage for Maiden flight)
914 Turbo
Kaysville, Utah
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193069#193069
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
I didn't test fly mine, as I wasn't a pilot at the time, but all I've
read says to do it at a large airport or strip with plenty of room
straight ahead in case of a problem at lift-off. Leave your friends
behind (less peer pressure), but let them observe your 2nd and 3rd
flights if you like. Tie the plane down and do a thorough run-up at
max rpm (static) to insure fuel flow.
My test pilot/flight instructor put my plane in the steepest attitude
I've ever seen it in since, and upon questioning him, he said that's
if the plane wanted to quit, he could just point it down and land. We
were on a 1700' strip with trees at the departure end so it was
imperative to get it up quick, or have room to get it back down
straight ahead if something went wrong.
Good luck, Darin, with you and the Maiden. : )
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster
Jabiru 2200
Status: flying w/547+ hrs
On Jul 16, 2008, at 9:07 AM, darinh wrote:
>
> Well, it is time for the first flight of N914KF. It seemed like
> this day would never come but it has. I am looking for good advice/
> tips for my maiden voyage...things that you guys have done that
> were good (or bad and wouldn't do again) that you could pass on. I
> have never been a test pilot so this is a first for me and my
> airplane. Anyone have anything the learned or an idea they
> implemented on their 1st flight that worked and was useful?
>
> --------
> Darin Hawkes
> Series 7 (Airworthiness in Hand - building courage for Maiden flight)
> 914 Turbo
> Kaysville, Utah
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193069#193069
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Luggage/Cargo Bag FOR SALE |
Just wanted to update this post.
The Storage Bag is still available and is FOR SALE!
After some searching, Bob discovered he could not use it in a Model II.
Thanks!
Travis :D
--------
Travis Rayner
Mobile, AL
Skystar Vixen, N-789DF
Continental IO-240, Prince P-Tip Prop
ADI-II Autopilot
AnyWhereMap Navigation with weather
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193093#193093
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
darinh wrote:
> Well, it is time for the first flight of N914KF. It seemed like this day would
never come but it has. I am looking for good advice/tips for my maiden voyage...things
that you guys have done that were good (or bad and wouldn't do again)
that you could pass on. I have never been a test pilot so this is a first
for me and my airplane. Anyone have anything they learned or an idea they implemented
on their 1st flight that worked and was useful?
Darinh, I trust you have a copy of AC 90-89A, "Amateur-Built Aircraft and Ultralight
Flight Testing handbook". This is a must read first. You can download
a copy here.
http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAdvisoryCircular.nsf/0/D08FA9393154B636862569BA006F6D7F?OpenDocument
The EAA Flight Adviser program is a good resource too.
The things I did that were good:
Took some dual in a kitfox similar to mine.
Had a plan!
Inspected the airplane using the annual condition checklist.
Had a ground crew with radio and briefing plan on who does what should an emergency
occur.
My wife had a camera. No one else was even told about a first flight except notified
the FBO at the airport...non tower busy training field...that the Kitfox
First flight was planned.
Stayed over the airport, kept climbing, reversed to make some turns the other direction,
Did a stall, descended and landed.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193095#193095
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
Just a couple opinions, Darin. First, get a few of you fly-buddies to go
over it with a fine tooth comb to see if they can find that little spot you
forgot to safety, that loose nut, wire or hose touching the exhaust pipe,
etc. Just leave and go have breakfast while they go over it so they don't
feel pressured.
Pick your day! Meaning, early in the morning or late in the evening when
all is calm.
Go out and taxi, but not high speed and keep the tail on the runway. Give
it about 20 minutes of this then taxi back to the hangar, pop the hood and
look for any leaks or anything unusual. If all is well and you feel good
about it, taxi back out and firewall it, climbing to pattern altitude.
After that, do what you feel right about.
Good luck,
Deke Morisse
Mikado Michigan
S5/Subaru/CAP 380+ TT
"The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but progress."
- Joseph Joubert
----- Original Message -----
From: "darinh" <gerns25@netscape.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 9:07 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight?
>
> Well, it is time for the first flight of N914KF. It seemed like this day
> would never come but it has. I am looking for good advice/tips for my
> maiden voyage...things that you guys have done that were good (or bad and
> wouldn't do again) that you could pass on. I have never been a test pilot
> so this is a first for me and my airplane. Anyone have anything the
> learned or an idea they implemented on their 1st flight that worked and
> was useful?
>
> --------
> Darin Hawkes
> Series 7 (Airworthiness in Hand - building courage for Maiden flight)
> 914 Turbo
> Kaysville, Utah
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193069#193069
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
Some excellent points have been made so far. I've had the opportunity to do the
first fly on 23 flying machines (a combo of airplane, gyro and helicopter).
I have only had a few trying moments. Some folks say that after take off...go
fly it! This never felt right for me...
Always do the first flight at a large airport...the more room the merrier! Always
try to position yourself so that you can return to the airport or an adjacent
clear area should sudden silence develop! I usually limited my first flight
to 5 minutes...which is not very long...and was always very conservative while
flight maneuvers. There is a BIG difference in forces between doing a 10
minute (or longer) full throttle run up (while tied) versus the forces implied
during flight! ...5 minutes is very short! Now go over all primary controls
and engine systems, etc. If all is ok...you now have one take-off and landing
under your belt. On the second flight I usually took about 15 minutes...and
stayed over the airport. Recheck everything! Third flight about 30 minutes,
climb to at least 3,000 AGL and start with gentle stalls. From there you can
expand.
With all of this being said...from myself and others... being the test pilot is
a wonderful and rewarding thing. However, if you are a low time pilot, or an
average time white-knuckled pilot...the test pilot seat is something you should
avoid! There are too many things that can happen!
While test flying a Rans S-12 for a good friend... I had two major problems that
occurred within 2 minutes of each other. On the second flight the stick locked
up and I lost aileron control. Fortunately I was fairly level at the time.
The elevator control was also "somewhat limited"...very tight but I could manage.
While dealing with this issue at around 1,500' the engine quit. I was
able to land the plane on the runway...albeit a very ugly landing... ...let me
say that again... a very ugly landing!... Cross wind and no ailerons make things
interesting...thank goodness for grass runways! No part were broken. Inspection
of the controls revealed a small pair of Vice-grip pliers that had gotten
jammed into the stick mechanism (I don't really remember how all of that
stuff actually looked...but I remember the pliers!). The builder said he had
them clamped to something...and had forgot about them. Four people missed this
foreign object during preflight inspection!
Always have extra trained eyes looking at everything. I always preferred to have
a day for test flight (early in the morning) with just a few of the "trained
eyes" on hand. Good friends can keep your secret...Then schedule the "first
flight" on another day with family and friends. There is so much less pressure
that way and you do not feel obligated to "do it" because you don't want to
disappoint the attendees.
Sorry to ramble on so long...good luck with the test flight...stay safe!
Travis :D
--------
Travis Rayner
Mobile, AL
Skystar Vixen, N-789DF
Continental IO-240, Prince P-Tip Prop
ADI-II Autopilot
AnyWhereMap Navigation with weather
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193110#193110
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| Subject: | Re: Throttle Cables |
I did find through research that in the early 90's there was a service bulletin
issued saying that because of a couple of solid wire throttle cable failures
it was recommended to convert to the 1/16" (7 x 7) Stainless Steel braided wire
throttle cables. The thought was that the solid wire control work hardened over
time due to vibration and use to cause the failure.
Thanks,
--------
Kyle Dunn
Eddyville, Kentucky
Kitfox IV 1200 912 Rotax
1978 Cessna 172 N
American Aero Phoenix II w/582 Rotax
Rotorway Exec.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193118#193118
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
Thanks for all the advice so far, it has been noted. I have 40 hours or so in
a Kitfox and most of my time is in conventional gear aircraft, so although I may
be still an amateur I am not beginner in respect to Kitfoxes' and tailwheels.
My plan is basically what Deke pointed out and I have done a bunch of mid
speed taxi testing (tail on the ground) and all feels good and have checked and
fixed a couple issues in the process.
Some mention you should do some stalls but I plan to stay in the pattern and will
not be able to do a stall. I think the flight regime in the 7 is pretty well
defined although relatively small variations exist between individuals. My
plan is to approach at a safe speed of 70 - 75 mph and try to be around 60-ish
over the numbers. I have a long runway (in fact 2 runways with the shortest
around 6,000') so I can just let it settle in and bleed off speed.
I don't plan on doing a long test flight...like Travis said, I think it will be
basically a circuit or two in the pattern then back to the hanger to check everything
so short is the key.
On the issue of friends and family present...I will have one buddy on the ground
and will leave the wife and kids home completely. If something major were to
go wrong, I don't really want my wife and kids seeing me auger in. They will
be allowed to watch many flights after the first.
--------
Darin Hawkes
Series 7 (Airworthiness in Hand - building courage for Maiden flight)
914 Turbo
Kaysville, Utah
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193121#193121
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
You've gotten some good advice Darin. I would heartily agree with Deke's as
sessment that high speed taxi testing is to be avoided. You'll "test" that
aspect of the envelope twice: just before you-become airborne, and again
when you land for the first time. I'd advise taking at least one knowledgab
le person along with you to observe from the ground. It can be useful to su
pply them with a hand-held radio to report things you can't observe from wh
ere you'll be sitting.
-
This will possibly be the scariest fun you've ever had. Enjoy it. Pour some
champagne on the spinner (and down your throat) when you're done.
-
Marco Menezes N99KX
Model 2 582-90 C-Box
--- On Wed, 7/16/08, darinh <gerns25@netscape.net> wrote:
From: darinh <gerns25@netscape.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight?
<gerns25@netscape.net>
Well, it is time for the first flight of N914KF. It seemed like this day w
ould
never come but it has. I am looking for good advice/tips for my maiden
voyage...things that you guys have done that were good (or bad and wouldn't
do again) that you could pass on. I have never been a test pilot so this i
s a
first for me and my airplane. Anyone have anything the learned or an idea
they
implemented on their 1st flight that worked and was useful?
--------
Darin Hawkes
Series 7 (Airworthiness in Hand - building courage for Maiden flight)
914 Turbo
Kaysville, Utah
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193069#193069
============0A=0A=0A
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
Darin,
Sounds like you've got all your eggs in the basket! You should go fine. We look
forward to a post-flight report. Good Luck!
Travis :D
--------
Travis Rayner
Mobile, AL
Skystar Vixen, N-789DF
Continental IO-240, Prince P-Tip Prop
ADI-II Autopilot
AnyWhereMap Navigation with weather
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193143#193143
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| Subject: | Re: Anyone Do Spins or Aerobatics in a Kitfox ??? |
Don G,
Thanks for the good information on aerobatics in your Kitfox, that is the exact
information I was looking for. How many G's are you confortable pulling in
your Kitfox on a regular basis ?
I will most definitely build the long wing Super Sport version, there are so many
advantages to having a longer wingspan, that I can live with a slightly slower
roll rate.
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193153#193153
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| Subject: | Re: Throttle Cables |
That sounds reasonable, Lyle, and with the "spring-to-open" throttles
like the Bing carb has, I could see a cable doing the job, but
history...at least my history of looking at them...has shown (me)
that wire is the normal set-up. It depends partly on how many bends
are to be made in the run from knob to throttle arm.
I wouldn't be at all against using a cable to *pull* the throttle
open, but my "shadetree mechanical engineering degree" shudders at
the thought of using a cable to *push* it open...assisted with the
spring, ala Bing.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster
Jabiru 2200
Status: flying w/547+ hrs
On Jul 16, 2008, at 12:21 PM, Kyle wrote:
>
> I did find through research that in the early 90's there was a
> service bulletin issued saying that because of a couple of solid
> wire throttle cable failures it was recommended to convert to the
> 1/16" (7 x 7) Stainless Steel braided wire throttle cables. The
> thought was that the solid wire control work hardened over time due
> to vibration and use to cause the failure.
> Thanks,
>
> --------
> Kyle Dunn
> Eddyville, Kentucky
> Kitfox IV 1200 912 Rotax
> 1978 Cessna 172 N
> American Aero Phoenix II w/582 Rotax
> Rotorway Exec.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193118#193118
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
Have 20 hrs on my Model 7.
I have the old style elevator with trim tabs, the nose pitched up and down as I
tried to correct.I had the horz at the book stated starting point and did not
have the nose up trim needed.
now have the horz ( via a adjustable rod ) set to max nose up ( rod is as short
as possible
use a lot of nose up,seems easier and more stable to push nose down and retrim
David Model 3 and 7
912 and 912S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193166#193166
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
Test fly the plane with the expectation that the engine is going to quit. Fly
every minute of the test flights that way, and every flight forever after
with that expectation, then when it happens you will be ready.
Don't ever fall into the mode that - It's got x hours on it now, therefore
it is reliable.
That's my advice.
If it never fails, then when you finally quit flying or sell the plane you can
tell me I was wrong. :)
Jeff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193181#193181
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
One thing I learned on the first flight concerns a ground adjustable prop.
I had a friend do the flight. He was surprised by the engine over reving
and the engine monitor warning light coming on. This is no big deal, but
the alarm light did cause some concern.
Just watch for it.
Randy
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
And I'll bet you'll be glad to hear that!!
Noel
If it never fails, then when you finally quit flying or sell the plane you
can
tell me I was wrong. :)
Jeff
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http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193181#193181
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| Subject: | Heavy stick for aileron's |
Hi guys, I have recently purchased a Kitfox 1 because I had to give up my medical
and am now flying light sport.
My question is, should the stick be hard to push to the left and right while flying.
It feels real heavy which leaves me to be concerned that something might
break from the force that I have to apply or is this normal. On the ground the
stick moves forward and sideways with no drag. I might add that it has balancers
in the center of the aileron facing forward.
I have nothing to go on except my 150F and my Sonerai did not have these forces.
I did not get any kind of build books or paperwork to reference from, so your answerers
are valued. Thanks
--------
Dwight Early
Kitfox 1/532
Cessna 150F
Daleville, In
Read this topic online here:
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| Subject: | Re: Carb vent line install - Rotax 2 cycleCarb vent line |
install
...It's been a long time since I ran Rotax two strokes...but...If memory serves...
there are 4 holes in each carburator vent line (plugs in each side of the
Bing Carb). The vent holes are suppose to equal or exceed the diameter of the
carb vent outlet.
The stock vent lines were always dirty and soiled other things when they dripped.
This was my solution: At the auto parts store I found a plastic manifold
(this would be like a "T" only it had more teats on it) that had 4 1/8" nipples
and a larger one...I'm thinking it was 5/16 or 3/8". I plumbed all four vents
into this manifold and then ran the larger line down out of the way so when
it dripped it would not be an issue. All lines must NOT have any dependent loops.
In other words...everything must flow downhill.
Travis :)
--------
Travis Rayner
Mobile, AL
Skystar Vixen, N-789DF
Continental IO-240, Prince P-Tip Prop
ADI-II Autopilot
AnyWhereMap Navigation with weather
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193207#193207
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy stick for aileron's |
Dwight,
I feel the same way about my Kitfox III. I flew a Kitfox IV once and it was
very light on the stick. I guess it's all in what you get used to. I have
30 or so hours since I bought my III so I am getting used to the stick feel.
Pete
Hell Paso, TX
Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove gear
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dwight Early" <flywarrior2000@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 2:58 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Heavy stick for aileron's
> <flywarrior2000@yahoo.com>
>
> Hi guys, I have recently purchased a Kitfox 1 because I had to give up my
> medical and am now flying light sport.
>
> My question is, should the stick be hard to push to the left and right
> while flying. It feels real heavy which leaves me to be concerned that
> something might break from the force that I have to apply or is this
> normal. On the ground the stick moves forward and sideways with no drag. I
> might add that it has balancers in the center of the aileron facing
> forward.
> I have nothing to go on except my 150F and my Sonerai did not have these
> forces.
> I did not get any kind of build books or paperwork to reference from, so
> your answerers are valued. Thanks
>
> --------
> Dwight Early
> Kitfox 1/532
> Cessna 150F
> Daleville, In
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193200#193200
>
>
>
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Anyone Do Spins or Aerobatics in a Kitfox ??? |
JP,
How many comfortably?...hmmm....thats kinda like asking how big are your &@LL$.
and theres alot less brass in mine than there used to be!
I will tell you I attempt to keep 3 g's as my limit. Dont always succeed...but
thats what I shoot for. IF I was a better pilot, I am sure it could be accomplished.
My Mk IV Speedster is an old kit...mid 90's design , so I would certainly think
newer is better. And If I were doing it today...I would make the SuperSport long
wing choice as well. Mostly for the load carrying ability.
My bird is right at 700lbs empty, so with me (190) and passenger around 200lbs,
that only leaves 100 lbs for fuel and baggage at the 1200 Gross.
Not that I don't think it would carry more structurally, but it gets sluggish,
and at cruise the there is a noticeable increase in attitude at level flight,
and upon landing at the higher weights it plops down noticeably quicker (at a
higher speed).
For instance, I regularly fly with my wife..@ 150lbs and full fuel. This puts us
25 lbs or so below gross. not counting what she has in her purse!
My "comfortable" 47-4800rpm cruise is about 90 when we go somewhere like this...
but with me alone and half fuel...4800 yields 105 regularly . When you look
down the wing at the horizon, the attitude difference is immediately noticed between
these 2 configurations.
To me...this behavior is simply an indication the craft could use a little more
wing for these jaunts. Yes, It would sacrifice some speed, but a 100 hp engine
should take care of part of that. as far as the roll rate, less wouldnt bother
it a bit, as I dont use full deflection hardly ever if I have any speed at
all.
--------
Don G.
Central Illinois
Kitfox IV Speedster
Luscombe 8A
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193214#193214
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Anyone Do Spins or Aerobatics in a Kitfox ??? |
Don G wrote:
> JP,
> How many comfortably?...hmmm....thats kinda like asking how big are your &@LL$.
and theres alot less brass in mine than there used to be!
>
>
I think you have lots of brass in them if you are willing to publish your wifes
weight on a public list [Wink]
As far as long wings, many planes actually cruise faster at heavier weights with
long wings due to the reduction of angle of attack, the benefit of more lift
more than makes up for the increased drag of 6 feet of wing.
Are you using the 912-S ? Which prop are you using ? I have a 912-s that I
will be using. I have seen some people post cruise numbers of 110 and a bit
higher, do you have wheel pants and strut fairings ? I am not at all familiar
what the difference between the older model and new Super Sport kitfox are.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193225#193225
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy stick for aileron's |
Pete,
Couldn't help but notice you are from Hell Paso, TX. We must live closer to each
other than I thought cuz I tell my wife we live in Hell every summer. :>)
We will be back to 110 degrees by Saturday...UGHHH
Mesa, AZ
Pete Christensen <apeterchristensen@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Dwight,
I feel the same way about my Kitfox III. I flew a Kitfox IV once and it was
very light on the stick. I guess it's all in what you get used to. I have
30 or so hours since I bought my III so I am getting used to the stick feel.
Pete
Hell Paso, TX
Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove gear
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dwight Early"
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 2:58 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Heavy stick for aileron's
>
>
> Hi guys, I have recently purchased a Kitfox 1 because I had to give up my
> medical and am now flying light sport.
>
> My question is, should the stick be hard to push to the left and right
> while flying. It feels real heavy which leaves me to be concerned that
> something might break from the force that I have to apply or is this
> normal. On the ground the stick moves forward and sideways with no drag. I
> might add that it has balancers in the center of the aileron facing
> forward.
> I have nothing to go on except my 150F and my Sonerai did not have these
> forces.
> I did not get any kind of build books or paperwork to reference from, so
> your answerers are valued. Thanks
>
> --------
> Dwight Early
> Kitfox 1/532
> Cessna 150F
> Daleville, In
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193200#193200
>
>
>
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy stick for aileron's |
So Dan,
It would seen that all these years my wife has been telling me to "go to
Mesa, AZ" :)
Rick, Kitfox IV / 912ul / 50%
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Billingsley
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 6:30 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Heavy stick for aileron's
Pete,
Couldn't help but notice you are from Hell Paso, TX. We must live
closer to each other than I thought cuz I tell my wife we live in Hell
every summer. :>)
We will be back to 110 degrees by Saturday...UGHHH
Mesa, AZ
Pete Christensen <apeterchristensen@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Dwight,
I feel the same way about my Kitfox III. I flew a Kitfox IV once and
it was
very light on the stick. I guess it's all in what you get used to. I
have
30 or so hours since I bought my III so I am getting used to the
stick feel.
Pete
Hell Paso, TX
Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove gear
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dwight Early"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 2:58 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Heavy stick for aileron's
>
>
> Hi guys, I have recently purchased a Kitfox 1 because I had to
give up my
> medical and am now flying light sport.
>
> My question is, should the stick be hard to push to the left and
right
> while flying. It feels real heavy which leaves me to be concerned
that
> something might break from the force that I have to apply or is
this
> normal. On the ground the stick moves forward and sideways with no
drag. I
> might add that it has balancers in the center of the aileron
facing
> forward.
> I have nothing to go on except my 150F and my Sonerai did not have
these
> forces.
> I did not get any kind of build books or paperwork to reference
from, so
> your
Message 24
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|
| Subject: | Re: Heavy stick for aileron's |
Dan,
Well, I was born in Phoenix and worked there for years so I know what
the "dry heat" is like. Bought my Fox in Buckeye and flew it back. It's
90 as I type at 5pm here. Muggy.
Pete
----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Billingsley
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Heavy stick for aileron's
Pete,
Couldn't help but notice you are from Hell Paso, TX. We must live
closer to each other than I thought cuz I tell my wife we live in Hell
every summer. :>)
We will be back to 110 degrees by Saturday...UGHHH
Mesa, AZ
Pete Christensen <apeterchristensen@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Dwight,
I feel the same way about my Kitfox III. I flew a Kitfox IV once and
it was
very light on the stick. I guess it's all in what you get used to. I
have
30 or so hours since I bought my III so I am getting used to the
stick feel.
Pete
Hell Paso, TX
Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove gear
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dwight Early"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 2:58 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Heavy stick for aileron's
>
>
> Hi guys, I have recently purchased a Kitfox 1 because I had to
give up my
> medical and am now flying light sport.
>
> My question is, should the stick be hard to push to the left and
right
> while flying. It feels real heavy which leaves me to be concerned
that
> something might break from the force that I have to apply or is
this
> normal. On the ground the stick moves forward and sideways with no
drag. I
> might add that it has balancers in the center of the aileron
facing
> forward.
> I have nothing to go on except my 150F and my Sonerai did not have
these
> forces.
> I did not get any kind of build books or paperwork to reference
from, so
> your
Message 25
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|
| Subject: | Taller wider tube landing gear |
Kitfoxers, Has anyone build tube landing gear with a wider stance and
taller than original still using bungees? I saw Lowell Fitt's higher
wider steel spring gear. Looks good, but wondered about using original
tube design wider and longer than original. With added width, I imagine
increased leverage would require 1 or 2 additional bungee wraps.
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Throttle Cables |
Just a quick note. With the Kitfox 912 set-up, at least for the IV, history
has the stranded cable and a solid wire would be a builder or operator mod.
Not a lot of issues here. Most modifications that I am aware of have to do
with reducing the effective strength of the spring. Several ways to
accomplish that.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 11:57 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Throttle Cables
>
> That sounds reasonable, Lyle, and with the "spring-to-open" throttles
> like the Bing carb has, I could see a cable doing the job, but
> history...at least my history of looking at them...has shown (me) that
> wire is the normal set-up. It depends partly on how many bends are to be
> made in the run from knob to throttle arm.
> I wouldn't be at all against using a cable to *pull* the throttle open,
> but my "shadetree mechanical engineering degree" shudders at the thought
> of using a cable to *push* it open...assisted with the spring, ala Bing.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster
> Jabiru 2200
> Status: flying w/547+ hrs
>
>
> On Jul 16, 2008, at 12:21 PM, Kyle wrote:
>
>>
>> I did find through research that in the early 90's there was a service
>> bulletin issued saying that because of a couple of solid wire throttle
>> cable failures it was recommended to convert to the 1/16" (7 x 7)
>> Stainless Steel braided wire throttle cables. The thought was that the
>> solid wire control work hardened over time due to vibration and use to
>> cause the failure.
>> Thanks,
>>
>> --------
>> Kyle Dunn
>> Eddyville, Kentucky
>> Kitfox IV 1200 912 Rotax
>> 1978 Cessna 172 N
>> American Aero Phoenix II w/582 Rotax
>> Rotorway Exec.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193118#193118
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Tips or Advice for Maiden Flight? |
n85ae wrote:
> Test fly the plane with the expectation that the engine is going to quit. Fly
> every minute of the test flights that way, and every flight forever after
> with that expectation, then when it happens you will be ready.
>
>
> Jeff
There is so much good advice in this thread, I will also be test flying a new airplane
soon, it gives me a lot to think about.
The one think is strongly disagree with is the statement above. If I expected
my engine to quit every flight, I would never leave the ground. Many airports
have NO place to land if the engine quits after takeoff, should all these airports
become ghosts towns because no one trusts their engines ? This is nothing
short of ridiculous.
I am aware that an engine failure can happen any time, but if I flew around " Expecting
" it to happen every second, I would be such a psychological wreck, it
would induce major mistakes and poor judgment while flying. Being comfortable
flying your plane can make the difference between reacting correctly to an
emergency, and reacting out of fear. Know the risks, but don't be overly paranoid
about the engine quitting ever second, this will lead to you making the
wrong choices while flying.
On the first flight, an engine failure is a huge possibility. I read a statistic
that said half of all experimental engine failures are due to the fuel system
problems. I don't know if this statistic is accurate or not, but it is a huge
cause of engine failures. Make sure the fuel system is bullet proof, correct
filters that are big enough to handle all the debris that magically appears
in new tanks and lines are very important.
Good Luck,
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193252#193252
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Taller wider tube landing gear |
I just happen to have just what you are talking about for a kitfox2 are you
interested in the longer & wider set ?
Ellery in Maine
Experimental Airplane Builder
do not archive
In a message dated 7/16/2008 7:21:32 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
patreilly43@hotmail.com writes:
Kitfoxers, Has anyone build tube landing gear with a wider stance and taller
than original still using bungees? I saw Lowell Fitt's higher wider steel
spring gear. Looks good, but wondered about using original tube design wider
and longer than original. With added width, I imagine increased leverage would
require 1 or 2 additional bungee wraps.
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
**************Get the scoop on last night's hottest shows and the live music
scene in your area - Check out TourTracker.com!
(http://www.tourtracker.com?NCID=aolmus00050000000112)
Message 29
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy stick for aileron's |
:? Something I just found out while flying a little while ago, when I use about
a 1/4" to 1/2"of flaperon lever the ailerons are very lite to control and the
nose seems to be in a more level position and the constant force I have to apply
on back elevator goes away. Is my new toy rigged wrong?
--------
Dwight Early
Kitfox 1/532
Cessna 150F
Daleville, In
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193264#193264
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy stick for aileron's |
Rick,
That makes perfect sence to me. ha!
Dan
Rick Frederick <rick@5mike3.com> wrote:
So Dan,
It would seen that all these years my wife has been telling me to "go to Mesa,
AZ" :)
Rick, Kitfox IV / 912ul / 50%
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Billingsley
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 6:30 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Heavy stick for aileron's
Pete,
Couldn't help but notice you are from Hell Paso, TX. We must live closer to each
other than I thought cuz I tell my wife we live in Hell every summer. :>)
We will be back to 110 degrees by Saturday...UGHHH
Mesa, AZ
Pete Christensen <apeterchristensen@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Dwight,
I feel the same way about my Kitfox III. I flew a Kitfox IV once and it was
very light on the stick. I guess it's all in what you get used to. I have
30 or so hours since I bought my III so I am getting used to the stick feel.
Pete
Hell Paso, TX
Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove gear
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dwight Early"
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2008 2:58 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Heavy stick for aileron's
>
>
> Hi guys, I have recently purchased a Kitfox 1 because I had to give up my
> medical and am now flying light sport.
>
> My question is, should the stick be hard to push to the left and right
> while flying. It feels real heavy which leaves me to be concerned that
> something might break from the force that I have to apply or is this
> normal. On the ground the stick moves forward and sideways with no drag. I
> might add that it has balancers in the center of the aileron facing
> forward.
> I have nothing to go on except my 150F and my Sonerai did not have these
> forces.
> I did not get any kind of build books or paperwork to reference from, so
> your
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy stick for aileron's |
Dwight Early wrote:
> :? Something I just found out while flying a little while ago, when I use about
a 1/4" to 1/2"of flaperon lever the ailerons are very lite to control and the
nose seems to be in a more level position and the constant force I have to
apply on back elevator goes away. Is my new toy rigged wrong?
Dwight,
Maybe not wrong, just a little innovation. Your flaperons may be rigged with a
little negative flap (up past zero degrees) with the handle full down. This
would cause the flight characteristic you described.
Some people rig their flaperons this way on purpose to be able to spill a little
bit of lift for various reasons, one of which is to gain a little cruise speed.
The nose should start to pitch down as the flaps are pulled into the positive (down
past zero degrees position).
I would say you have solved your "Heavy stick" problem. You may want to check
the rigging and may or may not decide to change it.
For what it's worth, If I purchased a home built airplane of any kind the first
two things I would do is reweigh it and make a new weight and balance form, then
I would check the rigging.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=193283#193283
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