Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:08 AM - Re: Flaperon End Caps (JC Propeller Design)
2. 01:02 AM - Re: Towing a banner? YES (Michel Verheughe)
3. 06:31 AM - Re: Re: Towing a banner? YES (Noel Loveys)
4. 07:41 AM - Re: Towing a banner? YES (Michel Verheughe)
5. 11:10 AM - Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? (JetPilot)
6. 03:43 PM - Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? (Tom Jones)
7. 03:50 PM - Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? (Noel Loveys)
8. 06:11 PM - Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? (JetPilot)
9. 07:21 PM - Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? (Lowell Fitt)
10. 08:48 PM - Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? (Lynn Matteson)
11. 09:51 PM - Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? (James Shumaker)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Flaperon End Caps |
I can,
fur, fura, furu (Pinus sylvestris) scandinavian name
Jan
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul A. Franz, P.E." <paul@eucleides.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 8:32 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Flaperon End Caps
> <paul@eucleides.com>
>
>
> On Fri, October 24, 2008 6:43 am, Dee Young wrote:
>> I used fur and it worked just also.
>>
>> Dee Young
>> Model II
>
> You've got to be kidding! Fur? I just can't quite visualize that.
>
> --
> Paul A. Franz, P.E.
> PAF Consulting Engineers
> Office 425.440.9505
> Cell 425.241.1618
>
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
> signature database 3554 (20081025) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
>
>
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| Subject: | RE: Towing a banner? YES |
> From: Charles Boccaccio [charlieboccaccio@yahoo.com]
> I use my Kitfox III regularly to tow banners along the beaches of Puerto Vallarta,
> Mexico. I'll post a link so all can see my kitfox performing an aerial banner
pick up.
That would be nice, Charlie. I am still unsure if I can ever again fly my Kitfox
after my heart attack and I was wondering if I should buy a hang glider and
have my son use the Kitfox as a tow plane. I was thinking that the Kitfox III
two tubes used to fasten the dorsal fin could be used for a towing mechanism.
Cheers,
Michel Verheughe
Norway
Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200 .... grounded.
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
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| Subject: | RE: Towing a banner? YES |
Sounds like the "Fox is able to do the job just make sure it's legal in your
part of the world.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michel
Verheughe
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 5:31 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: Towing a banner? YES
> From: Charles Boccaccio [charlieboccaccio@yahoo.com]
> I use my Kitfox III regularly to tow banners along the beaches of Puerto
Vallarta,
> Mexico. I'll post a link so all can see my kitfox performing an aerial
banner pick up.
That would be nice, Charlie. I am still unsure if I can ever again fly my
Kitfox after my heart attack and I was wondering if I should buy a hang
glider and have my son use the Kitfox as a tow plane. I was thinking that
the Kitfox III two tubes used to fasten the dorsal fin could be used for a
towing mechanism.
Cheers,
Michel Verheughe
Norway
Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200 .... grounded.
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronics.c
om/Navigator?Kitfox-List</a>
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com</a>
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contri
bution</a>
</b></font></pre>
Message 4
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| Subject: | RE: Towing a banner? YES |
> From: Noel Loveys [noelloveys@yahoo.ca]
> Sounds like the "Fox is able to do the job just make sure it's legal in your
> part of the world.
Of course, Noel. Towing banners, etc. is not legal for ultralights in Norway, because
considered as a commercial activity. Ultralights (equavalent to your Sport
Pilot license) are pretty much like radio amateurs, we can build and use but
not commercially. But ... you knew that! :-)
Anyway, light aircraft and even trikes are used here to tow hang gliders. But,
of course, you need to be checked out for that and the interesting point is that
you must be able to fly a weight shift hang glider in order to tow one. That's
the law.
Cheers,
Michel Verheughe
Norway
Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200 ... grounded
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
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| Subject: | Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? |
I am building a Kitfox SS, I am located in Miami so I need to do everything possible
to protect from corrosion. First I will be sloshing the inside and painting
the outside of the wing spars with a 2 part epoxy primer as recommended by
some. What is the best Epoxy primer to use for this ???? I will be covering with
Poly Fiber system, is the epoxy primer sold by Poly Fiber the best I can use
?
My fuselage is powder coated at the factory. I have heard about using Tube Seal
inside the tubing, but am not sure if I am more likely to cause problems drilling
holes in the fuselage tubes to get the tube seal in ?? If the tubes are sealed
on the ends where the welds are, than I think I would be better off not
doing anything.
Is there anything I am missing here, anything else I could do to protect against
corrosion before I build ?
Thanks,
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=210258#210258
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? |
Mike, I used what came with my kit. In 1994 that was poly fiber 2 part epoxy chromate
primer. I think that has been discontinued due to the health hazard.
Whatever you use it needs to be compatible with the poly fiber covering system.
Back then the wing struts came still open on the bottom (fuselage) ends. they may
still be that way. The instructions were that they be sealed with structural
adhesive. Some builders slosh the inside of the struts with linseed oil before
sealing them up.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=210276#210276
Message 7
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| Subject: | Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? |
The two part epoxy primer should be ok for the inside of the spars.
Actually if your plane is kept in a hanger out of rain I doubt you would
need anything in the spars. Aluminium will form its own oxide coating which
protects it as long as it doesn't get wet. For the weight that is involved
prime it if it makes you feel happier. The nice thing about the two part
primer is it won't dissolve with the other finishing chemicals.
As for the fuselage that's a different quintal of fish. I recommend
drilling one small hole 1/16 " close to the top of the frame on the inside.
Use a small syringe to inject about a cup or two of double boiled linseed
oil into the frame. Put a small screw into the hole and then rotate the
frame in every possible direction for about a week. (change the rotation
daily) Then drain the linseed oil out the same hole into a can. (Turn the
frame upside down). Replace the screw with a little epoxy around it to seal
the hole. There are a few things to know about linseed oil. One is it will
never dry until it comes in contact with air. The driest it will get inside
your frame is the consistency of a gel so you don't need to re inhibit your
frame at a later date.
Linseed oil likes to migrate... it will on its own wick into every nook and
cranny of the frame from the inside and inhibit any corrosion that can form
in there. The biggest thing to remember about using linseed oil is it will
spontaneously combust if you allow it to drip on a floor and then wipe it up
with a rag. It usually takes about fifteen minutes to break into fire (from
a wet/damp rag) and I can guarantee you it will produce a lot of white
smoke. If you have to wipe up any drips put the rag outside in a fire
proof rag bin. Funny thing is in a dish or can it will not spontaneously
combust. It needs the larger surface area a cloth gives.
Sigtaturea
Noel Loveys
Campbellton, NL, Canada
CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
582 B box, Ivo IFA, Aerocet 1100 floats
noelloveys@yahoo.ca
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JetPilot
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 3:40 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ????
I am building a Kitfox SS, I am located in Miami so I need to do everything
possible to protect from corrosion. First I will be sloshing the inside and
painting the outside of the wing spars with a 2 part epoxy primer as
recommended by some. What is the best Epoxy primer to use for this ???? I
will be covering with Poly Fiber system, is the epoxy primer sold by Poly
Fiber the best I can use ?
My fuselage is powder coated at the factory. I have heard about using Tube
Seal inside the tubing, but am not sure if I am more likely to cause
problems drilling holes in the fuselage tubes to get the tube seal in ?? If
the tubes are sealed on the ends where the welds are, than I think I would
be better off not doing anything.
Is there anything I am missing here, anything else I could do to protect
against corrosion before I build ?
Thanks,
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
could have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=210258#210258
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? |
Thanks for the suggestion Noel, that brings a question to mind... Is there a place
in all the joints in the fuselage for oil to flow through ? I thought that
many of them might be closed off with metal. Would I not have to drill a hole
in almost every other tube vertical tube in the fuselage to get this stuff
in there ? I have this stuff from Aircraft Spruce called Tube Seal that is made
for corrosion protection of aircraft tubing. More expensive than linseed
oil, but I'm hoping it will work better.
There will most definitely be times when my plane is out in the weather... I
hope just during cross countries, and rainstorms, but it may turn into longer
than that. Hangers here in Miami cost 650 a month at the small GA airport, that
is after you do the three year wait for one [Evil or Very Mad]
Thanks for the warning on Spontaneous Combustion, that would have really sucked
to burn down my house :( But then again, this new knowledge could also lead
to hours of entertainment [Wink]
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=210288#210288
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? |
Having welded on a fuselage frame, I strongly believe that if you drill one
small hole in one portion of the frame for introducing the oil, that tube
and that tube only will be protected. Every tube has it's own welded end,
that is every tube is separated by the joint weld - almost all are butt
welded. The longerons might be continuous on their length but the cross
braces are entirely separate. How do I know? I moved the shoulder harness
attachment points to a position I liked a bit better and if I didn't drill a
hole at the weld point, the heated air within the tube would blow a hole in
the tube near the weld. For my money, especially if the frame is well
coated - epoxy primer, or powder coat - I would leave that part alone.
That said, though, there have been reports in the past of the powder coat
lifting, blistering or light dustings of corrosion on the surface as if
pinpoint defects were in the powder coat. This was years past and I suspect
the factory has addressed this issue with better surface prep before the
powder coating, but, to put it succintly, I wish my new old kit was not
powder coated.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 3:49 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ????
> The two part epoxy primer should be ok for the inside of the spars.
> Actually if your plane is kept in a hanger out of rain I doubt you would
> need anything in the spars. Aluminium will form its own oxide coating
> which
> protects it as long as it doesn't get wet. For the weight that is
> involved
> prime it if it makes you feel happier. The nice thing about the two part
> primer is it won't dissolve with the other finishing chemicals.
>
>
> As for the fuselage that's a different quintal of fish. I recommend
> drilling one small hole 1/16 " close to the top of the frame on the
> inside.
> Use a small syringe to inject about a cup or two of double boiled linseed
> oil into the frame. Put a small screw into the hole and then rotate the
> frame in every possible direction for about a week. (change the rotation
> daily) Then drain the linseed oil out the same hole into a can. (Turn the
> frame upside down). Replace the screw with a little epoxy around it to
> seal
> the hole. There are a few things to know about linseed oil. One is it
> will
> never dry until it comes in contact with air. The driest it will get
> inside
> your frame is the consistency of a gel so you don't need to re inhibit
> your
> frame at a later date.
>
>
> Linseed oil likes to migrate... it will on its own wick into every nook
> and
> cranny of the frame from the inside and inhibit any corrosion that can
> form
> in there. The biggest thing to remember about using linseed oil is it
> will
> spontaneously combust if you allow it to drip on a floor and then wipe it
> up
> with a rag. It usually takes about fifteen minutes to break into fire
> (from
> a wet/damp rag) and I can guarantee you it will produce a lot of white
> smoke. If you have to wipe up any drips put the rag outside in a fire
> proof rag bin. Funny thing is in a dish or can it will not spontaneously
> combust. It needs the larger surface area a cloth gives.
>
>
> Sigtaturea
>
>
> Noel Loveys
>
> Campbellton, NL, Canada
>
> CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
>
> C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
>
> 582 B box, Ivo IFA, Aerocet 1100 floats
>
> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JetPilot
> Sent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 3:40 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ????
>
>
>
>
> I am building a Kitfox SS, I am located in Miami so I need to do
> everything
> possible to protect from corrosion. First I will be sloshing the inside
> and
> painting the outside of the wing spars with a 2 part epoxy primer as
> recommended by some. What is the best Epoxy primer to use for this ???? I
> will be covering with Poly Fiber system, is the epoxy primer sold by Poly
> Fiber the best I can use ?
>
>
> My fuselage is powder coated at the factory. I have heard about using Tube
> Seal inside the tubing, but am not sure if I am more likely to cause
> problems drilling holes in the fuselage tubes to get the tube seal in ??
> If
> the tubes are sealed on the ends where the welds are, than I think I would
> be better off not doing anything.
>
>
> Is there anything I am missing here, anything else I could do to protect
> against corrosion before I build ?
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Mike
>
>
> --------
>
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
> could have !!!
>
>
> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=210258#210258
>
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? |
I wonder if any thought has been given to drilling a small hole into
the main tube right where the "to-be-added" tube will intersect it?
This would insure that the flow of the rust/corrosion inhibiter would
be able to flow freely throughout the entire airframe. Maybe this is
standard practice, I don't know...if not, why not?
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster
Jabiru 2200, 579.1hrs
Sensenich 62x46
flying again (17 hrs) after rebuild, and new Electroair direct-fire
ignition system
On Oct 25, 2008, at 10:17 PM, Lowell Fitt wrote:
> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
> Having welded on a fuselage frame, I strongly believe that if you
> drill one small hole in one portion of the frame for introducing
> the oil, that tube and that tube only will be protected. Every
> tube has it's own welded end, that is every tube is separated by
> the joint weld - almost all are butt welded. The longerons might
> be continuous on their length but the cross braces are entirely
> separate. How do I know? I moved the shoulder harness attachment
> points to a position I liked a bit better and if I didn't drill a
> hole at the weld point, the heated air within the tube would blow a
> hole in the tube near the weld. For my money, especially if the
> frame is well coated - epoxy primer, or powder coat - I would leave
> that part alone.
>
> That said, though, there have been reports in the past of the
> powder coat lifting, blistering or light dustings of corrosion on
> the surface as if pinpoint defects were in the powder coat. This
> was years past and I suspect the factory has addressed this issue
> with better surface prep before the powder coating, but, to put it
> succintly, I wish my new old kit was not powder coated.
>
> Lowell
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ???? |
Lynn=0A=0AI understand that Sean D Tucker (acro pilot) has all the tubes (i
n the Oracle Challenger) drilled at the intesection and then the inhibitors
are introduced and then nitrogen under pressure is introduced.- Then a p
ressure gauge in installed.- Any loss of pressure is a cause for concern.
- So yes it is done.- =0A=0AJim Shumaker=0A=0A=0A=0A----- Original Mess
age ----=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ATo: kitfox-list@matroni
cs.com=0ASent: Saturday, October 25, 2008 8:48:30 PM=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-
List: Corrosion Protection for Kitfox... Any ideas ????=0A=0A--> Kitfox-Lis
t message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0A=0AI wonder if any
thought has been given to drilling a small hole into- =0Athe main tube ri
ght where the "to-be-added" tube will intersect it?- =0AThis would insure
that the flow of the rust/corrosion inhibiter would- =0Abe able to flow
freely throughout the entire airframe. Maybe this is- =0Astandard practic
e, I don't know...if not, why not?=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster
=0AJabiru 2200, 579.1hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0Aflying again (17 hrs) after re
build, and new Electroair direct-fire- =0Aignition system=0A=0A=0A=0AOn O
ct 25, 2008, at 10:17 PM, Lowell Fitt wrote:=0A=0A> --> Kitfox-List message
posted by: "Lowell Fitt"- =0A> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>=0A>=0A> Having wel
ded on a fuselage frame, I strongly believe that if you- =0A> drill one s
mall hole in one portion of the frame for introducing- =0A> the oil, that
tube and that tube only will be protected.- Every- =0A> tube has it's
own welded end, that is every tube is separated by- =0A> the joint weld -
almost all are butt welded.- The longerons might- =0A> be continuous o
n their length but the cross braces are entirely- =0A> separate.- How d
o I know?- I moved the shoulder harness attachment- =0A> points to a po
sition I liked a bit better and if I didn't drill a- =0A> hole at the wel
d point, the heated air within the tube would blow a- =0A> hole in the tu
be near the weld.- For my money, especially if the- =0A> frame is well
coated - epoxy primer, or powder coat - I would leave- =0A> that part alo
ne.=0A>=0A> That said, though, there have been reports in the past of the
- =0A> powder coat lifting, blistering or light dustings of corrosion on
- =0A> the surface as if pinpoint defects were in the powder coat.- Thi
s- =0A> was years past and I suspect the factory has addressed this issue
- =0A> with better surface prep before the powder coating, but, to put it
- =0A> succintly, I wish my new old kit was not powder coated.=0A>=0A> Lo
- - - - - - - - - - - - - -Matt Dralle, List Admi
====
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