Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:38 AM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
2. 05:43 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Chuck Popenoe)
3. 06:29 AM - Re: Towing a Kitfox (Noel Loveys)
4. 06:34 AM - Re: First Flight - finally (Weiss Richard)
5. 06:58 AM - Re: First Flight - finally (fox5flyer)
6. 07:11 AM - Re: Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (Noel Loveys)
7. 07:12 AM - Re: Towing a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
8. 07:26 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (akflyer)
9. 07:35 AM - Re: Towing a Kitfox (Noel Loveys)
10. 07:41 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
11. 07:54 AM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
12. 08:20 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (paul wilson)
13. 08:20 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Lowell Fitt)
14. 08:24 AM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Vic Baker)
15. 08:38 AM - Re: First Flight - finally (Lynn Matteson)
16. 08:40 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
17. 08:48 AM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
18. 08:55 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
19. 09:22 AM - Re: Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (Marco Menezes)
20. 09:28 AM - Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (akflyer)
21. 09:33 AM - Flight Simulator (Bob Brennan)
22. 10:09 AM - Re: Flight Simulator (akflyer)
23. 10:15 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (akflyer)
24. 10:52 AM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (815TL)
25. 11:06 AM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Bob Brennan)
26. 11:09 AM - Re: Flight Simulator (815TL)
27. 11:36 AM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Bob Brennan)
28. 11:54 AM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
29. 12:55 PM - Re: Trailering a Kitfox (paul wilson)
30. 12:57 PM - Re: Flight Simulator (815TL)
31. 12:57 PM - Re: Flight Simulator (akflyer)
32. 01:33 PM - Re: Flight Simulator (Steven Didier)
33. 01:38 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Bob Brennan)
34. 01:55 PM - Re: Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (Larry Huntley)
35. 01:58 PM - Re: Flight Simulator (Michel Verheughe)
36. 02:03 PM - Re: Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (gary.algate@sandvik.com)
37. 02:08 PM - Kitfox lV Speedster For Sale (wannafly)
38. 02:09 PM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Noel Loveys)
39. 02:10 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Bob Brennan)
40. 02:13 PM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Vic Baker)
41. 02:22 PM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (mic thiessen)
42. 02:27 PM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Noel Loveys)
43. 02:28 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Michael Gibbs)
44. 02:28 PM - Re: Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (gary.algate@sandvik.com)
45. 02:34 PM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
46. 02:43 PM - Re: Flight Simulator (Noel Loveys)
47. 02:46 PM - Re: Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (Larry Huntley)
48. 02:46 PM - Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (akflyer)
49. 02:48 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Noel Loveys)
50. 02:48 PM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (Bob Brennan)
51. 03:02 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Noel Loveys)
52. 03:02 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Bob Brennan)
53. 03:10 PM - Re: Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (Noel Loveys)
54. 03:33 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Noel Loveys)
55. 03:36 PM - Re: Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (gary.algate@sandvik.com)
56. 03:49 PM - Re: Towing a Kitfox (John W. Hart)
57. 03:58 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Bob Brennan)
58. 04:03 PM - Re: Re: Trailering a Kitfox (kirk hull)
59. 04:17 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Bob Brennan)
60. 04:20 PM - Re: Flight Simulator (815TL)
61. 04:32 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (patrick reilly)
62. 04:43 PM - Re: Flight Simulator (akflyer)
63. 05:10 PM - Fw: Flight Simulator (Pete Christensen)
64. 05:45 PM - Re: Towing a Kitfox (Noel Loveys)
65. 05:48 PM - Fuel monitor (Larry Huntley)
66. 05:50 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (Noel Loveys)
67. 06:13 PM - Re: Re: Flight Simulator (patrick reilly)
68. 07:52 PM - Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (Lynn Matteson)
69. 08:44 PM - Re: sight glass fuel indicator? (Paul Franz - Merlin GT)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with
the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the original
engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the frame.
Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red spar
brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red braces
that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
transit.
Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as low as
tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in previous
posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is due
to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a crosswind
or updraft.
I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 06 January 2009 11:14 pm
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
The idea was good but towing a plane on its own main gear has a raft of
other problems that have been discussed to death here. You are spot on
though in noticing they always towed with the wings level. If memory serves
correctly the very first Avid was towed halfway across the continent and
back on its own gear.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 11:29 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
been biting my tongue on this one for awhile... Have any the rocket
scientists here bothered to look at what the factory designed for towing?
These were designed by the original engineers, and were made to tow the dang
plane wings level. I bet they were on to something when they came up with
this hair brained idea to tow a plane down a road...
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223264#223264
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
Also biting my tongue! I have towed my Avid for 15 years backwards with
the wings level at 65-70 mph and have never noticed any wind induced
oscillations except from truck wake vortices. Of course, even with the
wings level, the angle of attack is not zero due to the downwash from
the towing vehicle,, which applies a small downward force to the folded
wings.Far more damaging are the inertial forces on the wing hinges from
bouncing down the road. This did cause the wing carry-through tube in
my bird to fatigue which I luckedly discovered upon preflight. I
repaired that and beefed up both hinge tubes with welded gussets and
doubling up the tube internally. Adding braces to triangulate the
foldback struts also limits any movement due to the inertial loads. See
the photos under Pops' Avid A. Towing is harder on the plane than
anything except crashing!
Pops
Flying and grinning since 1956
Message 3
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He would need wheel pants and DOT spec tires (this side of the pond). Some
jurisdictions require his plane to be licensed as a trailer and have
appropriate signal lights added to it.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dee Young
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:21 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
I have a friend who tows his model V tail first using the tow bar as
designed. Seems to work just fine for him.
Dee Young
Model II
N345DY
Do not archive
been biting my tongue on this one for awhile... Have any the rocket
scientists here bothered to look at what the factory designed for towing?
These were designed by the original engineers, and were made to tow the dang
plane wings level. I bet they were on to something when they came up with
this hair brained idea to tow a plane down a road...
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223264#223264
<Bnbsp; Features Chat, http://www.matronnbsp;
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List> via the Web
title=http://forums.matronics.com/
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
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| Subject: | Re: First Flight - finally |
On Jan 6, 2009, at 10:08 AM, Patrick Best wrote:
> So you continued to fly test manoeuvres despite a lack of airspeed
> indication?
Yes. The maneuvers were necessary to return to the airport and land
anyway. (Turns, slow flight, etc.)
Lack of an airspeed indicator is not the end of the world. Just had
to look outside at the wingtip and see the angle it made with the
horizon. Also, your senses come into play. Air noise levels, seat of
the pants, visual cues, engine sound, etc. It really was a non issue.
You're in the air, flying fine, and you know you have to return to
earth. What would you do differently?
Rick Weiss
N39RW Series V Speedster, 912ULS
SkyStar S/N 1
Port Orange, FL
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| Subject: | Re: First Flight - finally |
Agreed, Rick. During takeoff I don't look at my airspeed indicator as
it's all done by "seat of the pants". Twice, in the past, after takeoff
I found I had no airspeed. However, flying the airplane was not an
issue as I simply maneuvered back to my airstrip, landed, and determined
the problem. Both times it was caused from me forgetting to put my
pitot cover on and after only a couple of days a bug (of some sort) had
laid an egg inside it that turned into a little green maggot that
completely the tube. Simple fix. Of course, I'm much more careful now
about remembering that cover.
Also, congrats on your completion and first flight, Rick. Kudos to you
for sticking with it for all of these years. Many would not have ever
completed it. Keep us in the loop regarding your fly off.
Deke Morisse
Mikado Michigan
S5/Subaru/CAP 402+ TT
"The aim of an argument or discussion should not be victory, but
progress."
- Joseph Joubert
----- Original Message -----
From: Weiss Richard
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 9:34 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: First Flight - finally
On Jan 6, 2009, at 10:08 AM, Patrick Best wrote:
So you continued to fly test manoeuvres despite a lack of airspeed
indication?
Yes. The maneuvers were necessary to return to the airport and land
anyway. (Turns, slow flight, etc.)
Lack of an airspeed indicator is not the end of the world. Just had
to look outside at the wingtip and see the angle it made with the
horizon. Also, your senses come into play. Air noise levels, seat of
the pants, visual cues, engine sound, etc. It really was a non issue.
You're in the air, flying fine, and you know you have to return to
earth. What would you do differently?
Rick Weiss
N39RW Series V Speedster, 912ULS
SkyStar S/N 1
Port Orange, FL
=
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| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all those vids
on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of those
units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-) ... (Sorry,
thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's still
accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price $109 U.S.
this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html . I'm
going to be looking into this one.
Noel Loveys
Campbellton, NL, Canada
CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
912 almost installed
Aerocet 1100 floats
noelloveys@yahoo.ca
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 11:36 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
I have the 210 and love it. Seems to be pretty dang accurate. It says
within 5% out of the box, and it can be calibrated with a known quantity to
get it within 2%. So far I have not seen a need to calibrate it any closer.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223266#223266
Message 7
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Good info Noel, that's the first time I've heard some actual facts. I asked
as many authorities as I could find about how to legally tow my KFII on the
factory-supplied towbar and no one could answer, or even refer me to someone
who could. Due to that and the stress I knew I would put on the main gear
with the poor roads in rural PA I opted to get the flatbed trailer instead.
Plus any excuse to buy a new toy is a good one.
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 9:28 am
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
He would need wheel pants and DOT spec tires (this side of the pond). Some
jurisdictions require his plane to be licensed as a trailer and have
appropriate signal lights added to it.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dee Young
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:21 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
I have a friend who tows his model V tail first using the tow bar as
designed. Seems to work just fine for him.
Dee Young
Model II
N345DY
Do not archive
been biting my tongue on this one for awhile... Have any the rocket
scientists here bothered to look at what the factory designed for towing?
These were designed by the original engineers, and were made to tow the dang
plane wings level. I bet they were on to something when they came up with
this hair brained idea to tow a plane down a road...
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223264#223264
<Bnbsp; Features Chat, http://www.matronnbsp;
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List> via the Web
title=http://forums.matronics.com/
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
_p; generous bsp;
title=http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c====
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with
> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the original
> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the frame.
>
> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red spar
> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red braces
> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
> transit.
>
> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as low as
> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in previous
> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>
> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is due
> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a crosswind
> or updraft.
>
> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> --
Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice burner.
I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would be real dang
close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
Message 9
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I've only towed my plane a few times on wheels. I used a converted double
snowmobile trailer. The deciding factors were the need for DOT certified
tires and the fact the trailer has a lot wider axel so the chances of having
an overturn are a lot less. The extra suspension of the trailer was a
bonus.
Sigtaturea
Noel Loveys
Campbellton, NL, Canada
CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
912 almost installed
Aerocet 1100 floats
noelloveys@yahoo.ca
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 11:42 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
Good info Noel, that's the first time I've heard some actual facts. I asked
as many authorities as I could find about how to legally tow my KFII on the
factory-supplied towbar and no one could answer, or even refer me to someone
who could. Due to that and the stress I knew I would put on the main gear
with the poor roads in rural PA I opted to get the flatbed trailer instead.
Plus any excuse to buy a new toy is a good one.
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 9:28 am
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
He would need wheel pants and DOT spec tires (this side of the pond). Some
jurisdictions require his plane to be licensed as a trailer and have
appropriate signal lights added to it.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dee Young
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:21 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
I have a friend who tows his model V tail first using the tow bar as
designed. Seems to work just fine for him.
Dee Young
Model II
N345DY
Do not archive
been biting my tongue on this one for awhile... Have any the rocket
scientists here bothered to look at what the factory designed for towing?
These were designed by the original engineers, and were made to tow the dang
plane wings level. I bet they were on to something when they came up with
this hair brained idea to tow a plane down a road...
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223264#223264
<Bnbsp; Features Chat, http://www.matronnbsp;
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List> via the Web
title=http://forums.matronics.com/
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
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href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c====
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Message 10
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| Subject: | Trailering a Kitfox |
Thanks for the facts Pops and sorry about the tongue, mine gets pretty sore
too trying to sort out facts from opinion here. After hearing that so many
Kitfoxers trailer their birds with the wings level I am wondering if I
should modify my rig to do the same, but so far have only seen evidence to
the contrary.
Could I ask for a few more facts about your experience please? You say you
had wing carry-through tube metal fatigue after 15 years of trailering with
wings level but attribute that to "bouncing down the road" rather than
aerodynamic effects, and have never noticed "induced oscillations" - I
assume in your rear view mirror while travelling at speed. Obviously (to me
at least) you would have to already have catastrophic failure of the attach
points to see physical movement from that distance and would not be able to
see loads capable of causing metal fatigue, don't you agree? And since you
did have failure and did not see the cause the question is rhetorical. If I
noticed any effect from truck wake vortices, other than the entire trailer
being pushed to one side, I would seriously rethink my rigging.
Questions - do you install front spar braces while towing? Before the
failures? What kind of trailer do you use? What kind of suspension does it
have, since you believe it is road bounces that caused your failures? I use
a 21ft car trailer with tandem axles and load-levelling leafspring
suspension, although since the trailer is rated for 7,000 lb I suspect the
suspension doesn't do a lot for my 500 lb bird.
Has anyone else on the list had, or know of, similar failures at those
particular points? Or know of any factory ADs addressing that type of
failure? If anyone had a similar failure - to what did you attribute the
cause? And obviously do you trailer, and how?
A lack of response to the above questions obviously does not prove anything,
but Pop's fatigue failures (your plane, not you Pops!) is exactly what I
would expect given the way the plane was rigged for trailering, and exactly
what I wish to avoid.
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Popenoe
Sent: 07 January 2009 8:43 am
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
Also biting my tongue! I have towed my Avid for 15 years backwards with the
wings level at 65-70 mph and have never noticed any wind induced
oscillations except from truck wake vortices. Of course, even with the
wings level, the angle of attack is not zero due to the downwash from the
towing vehicle,, which applies a small downward force to the folded
wings.Far more damaging are the inertial forces on the wing hinges from
bouncing down the road. This did cause the wing carry-through tube in my
bird to fatigue which I luckedly discovered upon preflight. I repaired that
and beefed up both hinge tubes with welded gussets and doubling up the tube
internally. Adding braces to triangulate the foldback struts also limits
any movement due to the inertial loads. See the photos under Pops' Avid A.
Towing is harder on the plane than anything except crashing!
Pops
Flying and grinning since 1956
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
C'mon Leonard, to get the wings level with my factory-supplied tow kit the
hitch would have to be more than 3ft off the ground. It's a Class 2 hitch,
not a 5th wheel!
If the designers had meant the wings to be level they would have built a bar
that raised it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2 hitch
ball. While there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most
class 2 hitch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off the
road.
Do not archive
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: 07 January 2009 10:26 am
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with
> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the original
> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the
frame.
>
> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red
spar
> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red braces
> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
> transit.
>
> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as low
as
> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in
previous
> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>
> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is due
> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a
crosswind
> or updraft.
>
> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> --
Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice
burner. I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would be
real dang close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
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| Subject: | Trailering a Kitfox |
Way back when -- Skystar was queried at either Osh or at the flyinn?
about trailering an possible damage to the plane. At that time
Skystar was using an enclosed locally built trailer. They had
instrumented the trailer & plane and the result were acceleration
spikes that exceeded the calculated plane design limits. The
conclusion was that any trailer must be designed with a very soft
ride and driven at a very slow speed. They left it up to the builder
to go from there.
Paul
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
All this talk about trailering kitfoxes reminds me of a time when I was in
Dental School lectures and after an instructor would explain a time worn
dental procedure, there was always someone who would raise his hand and give
his reasons why the procedure wouldn't work - this is a true story.
I don't have a trailer so for me this is all really theoritical, but Denney
built trailers that towed tail first with the tailwheel elevated, Skystar
did the same. I am absolutely certain that if there were issues with this
method, the opinions would be backed up by at least one certified event -
lots of years and miles here. The only instance of an issue directly
involved with trailering I can recall (other than the all too frequent
hangar rash type incidental damage) was when a guy was trailering his
airplane to the airport nose first and the straps holding the wings back
failed. In that instance, aerodynamic forces unfolded the wings and they
extended and mowed down a couple of roadside signs including a stop sign. I
don't know if this report is in the archives or was on the list long before
Matronics. This instance was usually brought up during periodic discussions
of what would happen if the forward spar attach clevis should come out in
flight. The consesus is that aerodynamic forces would hold the wings
forward in a flying configuration.
As chuck mentions and this has been discussed many times before, the sprung
weight and the spring capacity is the greatest issue in trailering. This is
why most who have built a Kitfox dedicated trailer has opted for a boat
trailer as the base structure- something that is designed to carry about
1000 lbs. rather than a two ton car. This also reminds me of the time I
went on a bigrig delivery with a long haul driver freind. We dropped the
trailer once and rode the tractor to find some food. Without the weight of
the trailer, it was as if there was absolutely no springs on the tractor.
Put a Kitfox on a flat bed car hauler and effectively no springs.
And Bob, regarding your latest post. Yes it was designed that way but
imagine the structure required to put the wings at any other angle. The
design was simply to put the attatch points at solid locations - bottom
longerons and at a bulkhead - and use a simple bar for the hook up. The
wing angle just happened.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Popenoe" <cpops@verizon.net>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 5:42 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
Also biting my tongue! I have towed my Avid for 15 years backwards with the
wings level at 65-70 mph and have never noticed any wind induced
oscillations except from truck wake vortices. Of course, even with the
wings level, the angle of attack is not zero due to the downwash from the
towing vehicle,, which applies a small downward force to the folded
wings.Far more damaging are the inertial forces on the wing hinges from
bouncing down the road. This did cause the wing carry-through tube in my
bird to fatigue which I luckedly discovered upon preflight. I repaired that
and beefed up both hinge tubes with welded gussets and doubling up the tube
internally. Adding braces to triangulate the foldback struts also limits
any movement due to the inertial loads. See the photos under Pops' Avid A.
Towing is harder on the plane than anything except crashing!
Pops
Flying and grinning since 1956
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
This method seems to work well. I would never exceed 55mph while towing.
Note the wing braces and safety line insuring wings stay in folded position
while towing. Vert stab protected by pad. Elevator tied in down (nose
down) position via control stick. The transport kit is avail from
KitfoxAircraft.
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Phase 1 flight testing
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:53 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>
> C'mon Leonard, to get the wings level with my factory-supplied tow kit the
> hitch would have to be more than 3ft off the ground. It's a Class 2 hitch,
> not a 5th wheel!
>
> If the designers had meant the wings to be level they would have built a
> bar
> that raised it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2 hitch
> ball. While there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most
> class 2 hitch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off
> the
> road.
>
> Do not archive
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
> Sent: 07 January 2009 10:26 am
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>
>
>
> matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
>> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with
>> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the
>> original
>> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the
> frame.
>>
>> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red
> spar
>> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
>> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red braces
>> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
>> transit.
>>
>> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as low
> as
>> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
>> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in
> previous
>> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>>
>> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
>> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is
>> due
>> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
>> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a
> crosswind
>> or updraft.
>>
>> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
>> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
>> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>>
>> Bob Brennan - N717GB
>> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
>> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
>> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
>> Wrightsville Pa
>>
>> --
>
>
> Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice
> burner. I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would
> be
> real dang close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: First Flight - finally |
I agree....at one point in my training (in my Kitfox) my instructor
reached over and covered the ASI, and told me to land, which I did
because by then it was registered in the seat of my pants just how
the plane should feel when it is at the right speed to land.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 596+ hrs
Sensenich 62x46
flying again after engine rebuild, and new Electroair direct-fire
ignition system;
also building a new pair of snow skis
On Jan 7, 2009, at 9:34 AM, Weiss Richard wrote:
>
> On Jan 6, 2009, at 10:08 AM, Patrick Best wrote:
>
>> So you continued to fly test manoeuvres despite a lack of airspeed
>> indication?
>
> Yes. The maneuvers were necessary to return to the airport and
> land anyway. (Turns, slow flight, etc.)
>
> Lack of an airspeed indicator is not the end of the world. Just
> had to look outside at the wingtip and see the angle it made with
> the horizon. Also, your senses come into play. Air noise levels,
> seat of the pants, visual cues, engine sound, etc. It really was a
> non issue.
>
> You're in the air, flying fine, and you know you have to return to
> earth. What would you do differently?
>
> Rick Weiss
> N39RW Series V Speedster, 912ULS
> SkyStar S/N 1
> Port Orange, FL
>
> www.matronics.com/contribution _-
> ===========================================================
Message 16
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| Subject: | Trailering a Kitfox |
Good input Lowell. And yes I can "imagine the structure required to put the
wings at any other angle" = a simple bend in the bar with gussets or more
load-bearing = an extra piece welded vertically to form an "A" to bring the
longeron above horizontal and the wings level. Not a big challenge for a
welder and probably more stable than the very long single bar that I have.
And saying "the wing angle just happened" negates the original poster who
said the original engineers must have known what they were doing and who are
we to question.
Sorry, not convinced, but nice try. I'm just a trouble-maker at heart ;-) If
I had gone to Dental School I would say "I was that guy"
Do you have any pictures, diagrams, specs, or anything on the "Denney built
trailers that towed tail first with the tailwheel elevated, Skystar did the
same" please?
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
Sent: 07 January 2009 11:17 am
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
All this talk about trailering kitfoxes reminds me of a time when I was in
Dental School lectures and after an instructor would explain a time worn
dental procedure, there was always someone who would raise his hand and give
his reasons why the procedure wouldn't work - this is a true story.
I don't have a trailer so for me this is all really theoritical, but Denney
built trailers that towed tail first with the tailwheel elevated, Skystar
did the same. I am absolutely certain that if there were issues with this
method, the opinions would be backed up by at least one certified event -
lots of years and miles here. The only instance of an issue directly
involved with trailering I can recall (other than the all too frequent
hangar rash type incidental damage) was when a guy was trailering his
airplane to the airport nose first and the straps holding the wings back
failed. In that instance, aerodynamic forces unfolded the wings and they
extended and mowed down a couple of roadside signs including a stop sign. I
don't know if this report is in the archives or was on the list long before
Matronics. This instance was usually brought up during periodic discussions
of what would happen if the forward spar attach clevis should come out in
flight. The consesus is that aerodynamic forces would hold the wings
forward in a flying configuration.
As chuck mentions and this has been discussed many times before, the sprung
weight and the spring capacity is the greatest issue in trailering. This is
why most who have built a Kitfox dedicated trailer has opted for a boat
trailer as the base structure- something that is designed to carry about
1000 lbs. rather than a two ton car. This also reminds me of the time I
went on a bigrig delivery with a long haul driver freind. We dropped the
trailer once and rode the tractor to find some food. Without the weight of
the trailer, it was as if there was absolutely no springs on the tractor.
Put a Kitfox on a flat bed car hauler and effectively no springs.
And Bob, regarding your latest post. Yes it was designed that way but
imagine the structure required to put the wings at any other angle. The
design was simply to put the attatch points at solid locations - bottom
longerons and at a bulkhead - and use a simple bar for the hook up. The
wing angle just happened.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chuck Popenoe" <cpops@verizon.net>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 5:42 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
Also biting my tongue! I have towed my Avid for 15 years backwards with the
wings level at 65-70 mph and have never noticed any wind induced
oscillations except from truck wake vortices. Of course, even with the
wings level, the angle of attack is not zero due to the downwash from the
towing vehicle,, which applies a small downward force to the folded
wings.Far more damaging are the inertial forces on the wing hinges from
bouncing down the road. This did cause the wing carry-through tube in my
bird to fatigue which I luckedly discovered upon preflight. I repaired that
and beefed up both hinge tubes with welded gussets and doubling up the tube
internally. Adding braces to triangulate the foldback struts also limits
any movement due to the inertial loads. See the photos under Pops' Avid A.
Towing is harder on the plane than anything except crashing!
Pops
Flying and grinning since 1956
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
Good picture Vic, with the wings pitched down into the wind at what I would
consider the perfect angle exactly the same as the towbar kit. I sure hope
this picture isn't representative of what others have called "wings level"!
What are the thingies on the prop tips if you don't mind my asking? I
promise not to start another thread about them....
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic Baker
Sent: 07 January 2009 11:22 am
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
This method seems to work well. I would never exceed 55mph while towing.
Note the wing braces and safety line insuring wings stay in folded position
while towing. Vert stab protected by pad. Elevator tied in down (nose
down) position via control stick. The transport kit is avail from
KitfoxAircraft.
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Phase 1 flight testing
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:53 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>
> C'mon Leonard, to get the wings level with my factory-supplied tow kit the
> hitch would have to be more than 3ft off the ground. It's a Class 2 hitch,
> not a 5th wheel!
>
> If the designers had meant the wings to be level they would have built a
> bar
> that raised it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2 hitch
> ball. While there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most
> class 2 hitch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off
> the
> road.
>
> Do not archive
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
> Sent: 07 January 2009 10:26 am
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>
>
>
> matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
>> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with
>> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the
>> original
>> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the
> frame.
>>
>> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red
> spar
>> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
>> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red braces
>> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
>> transit.
>>
>> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as low
> as
>> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
>> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in
> previous
>> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>>
>> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
>> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is
>> due
>> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
>> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a
> crosswind
>> or updraft.
>>
>> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
>> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
>> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>>
>> Bob Brennan - N717GB
>> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
>> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
>> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
>> Wrightsville Pa
>>
>> --
>
>
> Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice
> burner. I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would
> be
> real dang close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
>
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Trailering a Kitfox |
So they only measured road shock and nothing to do with aerodynamic effects
of an open trailer?
Glad I trailer using a tandem axle with load-leveling suspension, it goes
through potholes one wheel at a time and very little effect on the bed.
Can't afford "fully enclosed" though. I assume their test trailer was single
axle?
bob
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of paul wilson
Sent: 07 January 2009 11:19 am
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
Way back when -- Skystar was queried
at either Osh or at the flyinn? about trailering an possible damage to
the plane. At that time Skystar was using an enclosed locally built
trailer. They had instrumented the trailer & plane and the result
were acceleration spikes that exceeded the calculated plane design
limits. The conclusion was that any trailer must be designed with a very
soft ride and driven at a very slow speed. They left it up to the builder
to go from there.
Paul
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
Noel: I've had one of these in-Lola for 2 years now. Cheap and easy to in
stall. Displays fuel burn, gallons used, gallons remaining. It's so accurat
e I've gotten to-using-fuel burn instead of-rpms as primary power set
ting indication. You'll love it.
-
Marco Menezes N99KX
Model 2 582-90 C-Box 3:1 w/clutch-
--- On Wed, 1/7/09, Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca> wrote:
From: Noel Loveys <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all those vids
on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of those
units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-) ...
(Sorry,
thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's
still
accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price $109 U.S
.
this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html . I'm
going to be looking into this one.
Noel Loveys
Campbellton, NL, Canada
CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
912 almost installed
Aerocet 1100 floats
noelloveys@yahoo.ca
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 11:36 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
<akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>
I have the 210 and love it. Seems to be pretty dang accurate. It says
within 5% out of the box, and it can be calibrated with a known quantity to
get it within 2%. So far I have not seen a need to calibrate it any closer
.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223266#223266
=0A=0A=0A
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
Float Flyr wrote:
> I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all those vids
> on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of those
> units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-) ... (Sorry,
> thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's still
> accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price $109 U.S.
> this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html . I'm
> going to be looking into this one.
>
>
>
>
> Noel Loveys
> Campbellton, NL, Canada
> CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
> C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
> 912 almost installed
> Aerocet 1100 floats
> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
>
>
>
> --
That is where mine came from, but I think it was more when I ordered it last year.
Get it, you wont be dissapointed. And it will really open your eyes when
you see what 100 RPM can do to fuel burn versus cruise speed. I think you will
find that you fly just a couple MPH slower and can stay up alot longer ant
get farther down the trail....
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223362#223362
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| Subject: | Flight Simulator |
I hope this isn't too off topic for a Kitfox forum but does anyone use MS
Flight Simulator X? I had hoped to get some simulator time in while the
weather is so gruesome but it is unusable on my PC. I bought FSX, then the
Saitek Aviator joystick to hopefully make it work better, then more Ram,
then a new video card, and most recently the Acceleration Expansion Pack.
But nothing gets it going faster than about 2-3 frames per second, even at
minimal settings, which is unusable.
MS lists minimum requirements as Good, Better, Best - my PC falls into the
Best category with a 3g P4, 1.5g Ram, and new 512m GeForce video card.
MS support have been very helpful so far and my problem has been "elevated"
to the highest level as I await yet another phone call from them. My
question is simply - is anyone using FSX successfully?
Thanks,
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
I dont have any problems with it on my laptop, but I bought it knowing I would
be gaming with it so I built it for that purpose. I can run all settings on max
without a hick up
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223365#223365
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> Good picture Vic, with the wings pitched down into the wind at what I would
> consider the perfect angle exactly the same as the towbar kit. I sure hope
> this picture isn't representative of what others have called "wings level"!
>
> What are the thingies on the prop tips if you don't mind my asking? I
> promise not to start another thread about them....
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> --
you are right, the wings are not perfectly level, but the tail is not sitting on
the deck either.... I have not put the incidence meter on it so I cant give
you a exact degree.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223366#223366
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc02155_162.jpg
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
Lynn Matteson wrote:
> Out of curiosity, what kind of tailwheel spring do/did you have, and
> how many leaves? Count all the leaves, whether or not they are long
> or short. Or do you have the one-piece Grove spring?
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 596+ hrs
> Sensenich 62x46
> flying again after engine rebuild, and new Electroair direct-fire
> ignition system;
> also building a new pair of snow skis
> do not archive
>
> I have a dual leaf spring, with a Maul wheel I believe. When trailering I did
prop a 2x4 under the leaf spring attatch point so that the wheel and spring
were not taking all the bouncing.
>
> Andrew
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 6, 2009, at 8:47 AM, 815TL wrote:
>
>
> >
> >
> > Ya know, I never realy gave it any thought as to if the wings
> > should be level or not, or wind preassure on the top of the wings.
> > It all makes sense. That being said, I trailered mine over 1100
> > miles with the tailwheel down on the deck. Most of the ime I was
> > doing 65-75 on the highway. As far as I can tell nothing was
> > damaged. So it may put more stresses on the top of the wing in the
> > tail down configuration, but the bird seems to handle it just fine.
> >
> > Andrew
> > 815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 23118#223118
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223372#223372
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
Thanks for the reply Leonard, but how does your laptop compare to my PC
spec-wise?
Mine: 3ghz Pentium4, 1.5g Ram, great big disk, and new 512m GeForce 8400GS
video card
Running at default settings I get 2 to 3 frames per second (hit shift-z
twice to display real time fps), at absolute minimums the max I get is 6 to
7 fps, at high settings it goes into seconds per frame and control inputs
can take many seconds if not completely ignored. What frame rates can you
get?
Thanks for taking the time to compare, I'm needing as much info as possible
for when(if) MS support ever calls back.
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: 07 January 2009 1:09 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
I dont have any problems with it on my laptop, but I bought it knowing I
would be gaming with it so I built it for that purpose. I can run all
settings on max without a hick up
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223365#223365
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
Bob,
Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much better
simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better, higher
frame rate, and feels more 'real'. Plus I have a nice model of a Kitfox II that
I repainted, and re did the cockpit on, to look like my plane. The orginal
was created by Michel Verheughe, who is a member here. I modified it for my
use.
The only down side to x-plane is it can be hard to set up and configure properly,
but I can help you out with that. Also invest in a set of rudder pedals, they
are worth it.
More on x-plane here: www.x-plane.com
And here: www.x-plane.org
Andrew
815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223373#223373
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_in_921_577.jpg
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the moment
I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my PC, or
some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it most
likely won't run X-plane well either.
bob
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 815TL
Sent: 07 January 2009 2:09 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
Bob,
Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much
better simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better,
higher frame rate, and feels more 'real'. Plus I have a nice model of a
Kitfox II that I repainted, and re did the cockpit on, to look like my
plane. The orginal was created by Michel Verheughe, who is a member here.
I modified it for my use.
The only down side to x-plane is it can be hard to set up and configure
properly, but I can help you out with that. Also invest in a set of rudder
pedals, they are worth it.
More on x-plane here: www.x-plane.com
And here: www.x-plane.org
Andrew
815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223373#223373
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_in_921_577.jpg
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
Leonard - from the picture Vic Baker sent(attached) I would guess the wings
are between 5 and 10 degrees down into the wind, in my opinion a good angle
for trailering but certainly nowhere near "level". In my most humble opinion
"level" means level means 0 degrees to the wind, which I have been trying to
determine is a bad thing or not.
Trailering using the factory-supplied towbar or tailwheel-down "on the deck"
puts the wing incidence angle at between 10 and 15 degrees down I estimate,
and should be towed within the factory recommended range of no more than
40mph. If I were to tow my bird any distance or at any speed I would install
the braces and raise the tailwheel to between 5 and 10 degrees down, but
never to "level".
Kirk Hull's picture (hope you don't mind me attaching here Kirk) shows a
setup where the wings are level.
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: 07 January 2009 1:15 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> Good picture Vic, with the wings pitched down into the wind at what I
would
> consider the perfect angle exactly the same as the towbar kit. I sure hope
> this picture isn't representative of what others have called "wings
level"!
>
> What are the thingies on the prop tips if you don't mind my asking? I
> promise not to start another thread about them....
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> --
you are right, the wings are not perfectly level, but the tail is not
sitting on the deck either.... I have not put the incidence meter on it so
I cant give you a exact degree.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223366#223366
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc02155_162.jpg
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| Subject: | Trailering a Kitfox |
For my long journey to the new home I used a tandem axle car hauler &
low pressure tires. The trailer had 4' high sides so I strapped the
wings to the side with lots of padding. I strapped the fuge down and
supported the tail so the wheel had no load, Then I covered the whole
trailer with a trap to get rid of the air loads.
Sorry I don't remember details about their trailer. The newer trailer
with cabinets inside was a tandem unit.
Paul
At 08:55 AM 1/7/2009, you wrote:
>So they only measured road shock and nothing to do with aerodynamic
>effects of an open trailer?
>
>Glad I trailer using a tandem axle with load-leveling suspension, it
>goes through potholes one wheel at a time and very little effect on
>the bed. Can't afford "fully enclosed" though. I assume their test
>trailer was single axle?
>
>bob
>
>
>----------
>From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of paul wilson
>Sent: 07 January 2009 11:19 am
>To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Trailering a Kitfox
>
>
>Way back when -- Skystar was queried
>at either Osh or at the flyinn? about trailering an possible damage to
>the plane. At that time Skystar was using an enclosed locally built
>trailer. They had instrumented the trailer & plane and the result
>were acceleration spikes that exceeded the calculated plane design
>limits. The conclusion was that any trailer must be designed with a very
>soft ride and driven at a very slow speed. They left it up to the builder
>to go from there.
>Paul
>
>
>href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronhref="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
>href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
>
>
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the moment
> I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my PC, or
> some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it most
> likely won't run X-plane well either.
>
> bob
> Do not archive
>
> --
I have a fairly impressive computer, but was never able to run FSX at a decent
frame rate either. What video card do you have, Nvidia or ATI based, and what
chipset? I believe that FSX runs in DirectX, and X-plane runs in OpenGL or
something equivelent. When I was running an ATI card, I had good preformance
in Direct X, but realy poor in OpenGL. I switched to a Nvidia based card and
the OpenGL preformance went way up, but I did notice that some DirectX games slowed
down, maybe 5-10%. It was worth it to get the much better OGL preformance
though.
Let me fire up FSX tonight and play with some settings and see if we can't get
you figured out. One thing to turn down, is water textures, and shadow complexity.
They are frame rate killers.
Andrew
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223392#223392
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> Thanks for the reply Leonard, but how does your laptop compare to my PC
> spec-wise?
> Mine: 3ghz Pentium4, 1.5g Ram, great big disk, and new 512m GeForce 8400GS
> video card
>
> Running at default settings I get 2 to 3 frames per second (hit shift-z
> twice to display real time fps), at absolute minimums the max I get is 6 to
> 7 fps, at high settings it goes into seconds per frame and control inputs
> can take many seconds if not completely ignored. What frame rates can you
> get?
>
> Thanks for taking the time to compare, I'm needing as much info as possible
> for when(if) MS support ever calls back.
>
> bob
>
> --
Sager NP9262
17" Wide Viewing Angles WSXGA+ LCD with super glossy surface (1920X1200)
Intel core 2 quad processor Q9450 / 12 mb L2 Cache, 2.66 Ghz, 1333 Mhz FSB
Nvidia GeForce 9800M GT / 512 MB DDR3 Vid Memory
Vista home Premium
4 GB Dual Channel DDR2 SD RAM @ 800 Mhz (2X 2048 MB)
200 & 320 GB 7200 RPM SATA 300 HD
8X DVD +_ R/RW/ 4X +DL Super Multi Drive
Intel Pro Wireless 4965AGN 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless LAN Module
Internal BlueTooth Module
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223393#223393
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
I use FSX along with Xplane 9 on my iMac FSX under Bootcamp in XP with
no hiccups full frame rates and all of the eye candy turned on. I
can't, however, run it in a virual machine in eithr VmWare or
Parallels at an acceptable setting.
Steve Didier
C172
Idaho
On Jan 7, 2009, at 9:32 AM, Bob Brennan wrote:
> I hope this isn't too off topic for a Kitfox forum but does anyone
> use MS Flight Simulator X? I had hoped to get some simulator time in
> while the weather is so gruesome but it is unusable on my PC. I
> bought FSX, then the Saitek Aviator joystick to hopefully make it
> work better, then more Ram, then a new video card, and most recently
> the Acceleration Expansion Pack. But nothing gets it going faster
> than about 2-3 frames per second, even at minimal settings, which is
> unusable.
>
> MS lists minimum requirements as Good, Better, Best - my PC falls
> into the Best category with a 3g P4, 1.5g Ram, and new 512m GeForce
> video card.
>
> MS support have been very helpful so far and my problem has been
> "elevated" to the highest level as I await yet another phone call
> from them. My question is simply - is anyone using FSX successfully?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
>
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
Video card is brand new Nvidea GeForce 8400 GS on an ATI bus which is all my
motherboard has on it other than AGP. DirectX is the latest downloaded from
M$ yesterday. FSX has service packs 1 & 2 installed from the Acceleration
disk. I tried turning off every option in the Custom Settings dialog, off if
I can and absolute minimum otherwise, lowest resolution on the list. Target
frame rate is 17, the best it will actually do in a very blurry dull jerky
world is 7.
Still waiting for the call from the M$ expert who promised to call at noon
(is now 4:30 EST here). I'm glad real airplanes aren't this much trouble!
Do not archive
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 815TL
Sent: 07 January 2009 3:57 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the
moment
> I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my PC, or
> some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it most
> likely won't run X-plane well either.
>
> bob
> Do not archive
>
> --
I have a fairly impressive computer, but was never able to run FSX at a
decent frame rate either. What video card do you have, Nvidia or ATI based,
and what chipset? I believe that FSX runs in DirectX, and X-plane runs in
OpenGL or something equivelent. When I was running an ATI card, I had good
preformance in Direct X, but realy poor in OpenGL. I switched to a Nvidia
based card and the OpenGL preformance went way up, but I did notice that
some DirectX games slowed down, maybe 5-10%. It was worth it to get the
much better OGL preformance though.
Let me fire up FSX tonight and play with some settings and see if we can't
get you figured out. One thing to turn down, is water textures, and shadow
complexity. They are frame rate killers.
Andrew
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223392#223392
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|
| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
G'day Foxy Folks,
I called to order this fuel monitor. I see they also list a transducer. Is
this needed? The girl at the phone thought so. Makes a substantial
difference in price. Also, how do these hook up? Do they go in the line ,or
around it or ???
Sounds great to me as I am in the final processes of putting my Kitfox
back in the air after a fuel shortage off field landing. Thanx for the info.
Larry
Larry Huntley
Dundee,NY
4-1200 EA81
Amax redrive Warp Drive prop
----- Original Message -----
From: "akflyer" <akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:28 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
>
>
> Float Flyr wrote:
>> I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all those
>> vids
>> on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of those
>> units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-) ...
>> (Sorry,
>> thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's still
>> accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price $109
>> U.S.
>> this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html .
>> I'm
>> going to be looking into this one.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Noel Loveys
>> Campbellton, NL, Canada
>> CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
>> C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
>> 912 almost installed
>> Aerocet 1100 floats
>> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>
>
> That is where mine came from, but I think it was more when I ordered it
> last year. Get it, you wont be dissapointed. And it will really open
> your eyes when you see what 100 RPM can do to fuel burn versus cruise
> speed. I think you will find that you fly just a couple MPH slower and
> can stay up alot longer ant get farther down the trail....
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223362#223362
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
8:49 AM
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
> From: 815TL [lawrenceaw@corning.com]
> Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much better
> simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better, higher
frame
> rate, and feels more 'real'.
Well, X-Plane feels more real, that's for sure. But MS FS is "nicer" in the way
that it has many fine eye-candy features and a very large existing database of
airfields and sceneries.
The difference in the simulators models is that MS FS use what can be called "look-up
tables." When you build an aircraft, you enter the stall speed, Vne, etc.
and for speeds in-between, the values are interpolated.
X-Plane, on the other hand, uses what is called "blade theory." It takes any part
of the aircraft into an airfoil with own lift, drag and moment. Then it goes
through each computation for each frame refresh.
When you build an aircraft in X-Plane, you have to enter what you think is the
closest model then you go and fly. If the aircraft then stalls at the speed intended
then you are very lucky! You can then work with the actual airfoil, the
wash-out, the CoG, learn about aviation and see how the model changes.
I often work with X-Plane, PlaneMaker and AirfoilMaker programs open at the same
time. Tiny adjustments, testing, back to the drawing board ... you get the picture!
With MS FS, if you enter a value for stall speed, the aircraft will always stall
exactly at that speed!
X-Plane is in fact a digital wind tunnel. Even small change in the step of the
fuselage of a seaplane makes great difference. It is truly a wind (and water)
modeller.
However, two warnings about simulators.
- None of them can simulate properly a spin. That is because data about airfoil
is known for "normal" angles; not when the apparent wind meets the wing and perhaps
an angle of 80 degrees and certainly not when e.g. because of the spinning
motion, one of the horizontal stabs is in the "shade" of the tail. The only
way to simulate that is with Computerized Fluid Dynamics (CFD) and that just
can't be done in real time.
- You can set the angle of view of the screen as you want. But if you do a bit
of geometry, in order to match the actual angle the screen makes and your perspective
view of everything around you, the angle should be put to perhaps 25 or
30 degrees and that's too little to be able to see the panel.
Imagine you are in your Kitfox and you hold at arm's length a piece of cardboard
that represents the frame of your screen when you are at home. You will see
only a tiny part of the panel and landing with only that angle of view would be
suicide.
Otherwise, it's fun, harmless and you are all welcomed to use my or Andrew's model.
Cheers,
Michel Verheughe
Norway
Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200
Do not archive
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
</b></font></pre></body></html>
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| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
Likewise I have the Navman Fuel flow meter and checked accuracy after
3,000 Ltr (792 US Gals) and it read about 15 Ltrs high. Less than 2% and
probably more due to draining at fuel checks than internal accuracy.
Gary Algate
Classic 4 Jab2200
Office Phone: +61 8 8276 7655
This e-mail is confidential and it is intended only for the addressees.
Any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message by
persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If
you have received this e-mail in error, kindly notify us immediately by
telephone or e-mail and delete the message from your system. The sender
does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of
this message which may arise as a result of the e-mail transmission.
?This year, instead of sending you a Christmas card in the mail, we have
made a contribution to UNICEF Australia. We wish you a safe and happy
Christmas".
"Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
08/01/2009 02:01 AM
Please respond to
kitfox-list@matronics.com
To
<kitfox-list@matronics.com>
cc
Subject
RE: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all those vids
on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of those
units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-) ...
(Sorry,
thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's still
accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price $109
U.S.
this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html . I'm
going to be looking into this one.
Noel Loveys
Campbellton, NL, Canada
CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
912 almost installed
Aerocet 1100 floats
noelloveys@yahoo.ca
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 11:36 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
I have the 210 and love it. Seems to be pretty dang accurate. It says
within 5% out of the box, and it can be calibrated with a known quantity
to
get it within 2%. So far I have not seen a need to calibrate it any
closer.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223266#223266
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|
| Subject: | Kitfox lV Speedster For Sale |
Its time to sell...my wife would like a larger plane...seems she wants to take
a bag or 2 along when we go cross country...so I am looking for a Glastar... so
unfortunately C-FOXX is for sale or trade for a Glastar.
empty weight 749 lbs. cruise is 90 mph. Two 13 gal wing tanks and one gal behind
seat. EA81 113 hp fuel injected, Ram Engines from Ohio did the up grades.
equipment list includes water temp, oil temp, oil pressure, amp meter, volt meter,
fuel pressure, hobbs, tach, vert speed, turn co ordinator, altimeter,speed
indicator, and yaw indicator, VG's, transponder and comm. Comes with a custom
made trailer and all the needed braces for transport. One small scratch left
wing tip (hanger rash). Asking $27,549
any other questions feel free to ask off line at
wannaflyfox4@hotmail.com
thanks mic
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223412#223412
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/aug_11_1306_035_153.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/jan_06_088_821.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dec_05_053_278.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscf0069_750.jpg
http://forums.matronics.com//files/111_056_708.jpg
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|
| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
I did see a hitch for towing a 'Fox that had a screw that made the hitch
adjustable up and down several inches. I was part of the arm not the hitch.
Another idea would be to cut the arms and plate them back together like a
roof truss. I'd only bother with that if you are consistently 0towing long
distances at highway speeds.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:23 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
<matronics@bob.brennan.name>
C'mon Leonard, to get the wings level with my factory-supplied tow kit the
hitch would have to be more than 3ft off the ground. It's a Class 2 hitch,
not a 5th wheel!
If the designers had meant the wings to be level they would have built a bar
that raised it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2 hitch
ball. While there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most
class 2 hitch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off the
road.
Do not archive
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: 07 January 2009 10:26 am
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with
> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the original
> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the
frame.
>
> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red
spar
> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red braces
> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
> transit.
>
> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as low
as
> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in
previous
> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>
> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is due
> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a
crosswind
> or updraft.
>
> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> --
Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice
burner. I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would be
real dang close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
Thanks Michel, that is a glowing endorsement for X-plane. Now can you fold
the wings on your Kitfox model and trailer it backwards at different angles?
(just kidding!)
My reason for wanting FSX is to review my former days of talking to ATC,
exploring local airports (the scenery in FSX is amazingly accurate),
simulating cross-country flights, and maybe learn a bit of IFR on the cheap.
It certainly seems capable of all that and more, if I could get the darn
thing to do more than a frame a second. Heck, I might even visit your
country.
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michel
Verheughe
Sent: 07 January 2009 4:58 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
> From: 815TL [lawrenceaw@corning.com]
> Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much
better
> simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better,
higher frame
> rate, and feels more 'real'.
Well, X-Plane feels more real, that's for sure. But MS FS is "nicer" in the
way that it has many fine eye-candy features and a very large existing
database of airfields and sceneries.
The difference in the simulators models is that MS FS use what can be called
"look-up tables." When you build an aircraft, you enter the stall speed,
Vne, etc. and for speeds in-between, the values are interpolated.
X-Plane, on the other hand, uses what is called "blade theory." It takes any
part of the aircraft into an airfoil with own lift, drag and moment. Then it
goes through each computation for each frame refresh.
When you build an aircraft in X-Plane, you have to enter what you think is
the closest model then you go and fly. If the aircraft then stalls at the
speed intended then you are very lucky! You can then work with the actual
airfoil, the wash-out, the CoG, learn about aviation and see how the model
changes.
I often work with X-Plane, PlaneMaker and AirfoilMaker programs open at the
same time. Tiny adjustments, testing, back to the drawing board ... you get
the picture!
With MS FS, if you enter a value for stall speed, the aircraft will always
stall exactly at that speed!
X-Plane is in fact a digital wind tunnel. Even small change in the step of
the fuselage of a seaplane makes great difference. It is truly a wind (and
water) modeller.
However, two warnings about simulators.
- None of them can simulate properly a spin. That is because data about
airfoil is known for "normal" angles; not when the apparent wind meets the
wing and perhaps an angle of 80 degrees and certainly not when e.g. because
of the spinning motion, one of the horizontal stabs is in the "shade" of the
tail. The only way to simulate that is with Computerized Fluid Dynamics
(CFD) and that just can't be done in real time.
- You can set the angle of view of the screen as you want. But if you do a
bit of geometry, in order to match the actual angle the screen makes and
your perspective view of everything around you, the angle should be put to
perhaps 25 or 30 degrees and that's too little to be able to see the panel.
Imagine you are in your Kitfox and you hold at arm's length a piece of
cardboard that represents the frame of your screen when you are at home. You
will see only a tiny part of the panel and landing with only that angle of
view would be suicide.
Otherwise, it's fun, harmless and you are all welcomed to use my or Andrew's
model.
Cheers,
Michel Verheughe
Norway
Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200
Do not archive
<pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face="courier new,courier">
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronics.c
om/Navigator?Kitfox-List</a>
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com</a>
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contri
bution</a>
</b></font></pre>
Message 40
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|
| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
Prop tips, rags and clamps, softens the blow when I run my head into the
prop. (tight fit in garage)
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Phase 1 flight testing
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 8:47 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>
> Good picture Vic, with the wings pitched down into the wind at what I
> would
> consider the perfect angle exactly the same as the towbar kit. I sure hope
> this picture isn't representative of what others have called "wings
> level"!
>
> What are the thingies on the prop tips if you don't mind my asking? I
> promise not to start another thread about them....
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic Baker
> Sent: 07 January 2009 11:22 am
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>
> This method seems to work well. I would never exceed 55mph while towing.
> Note the wing braces and safety line insuring wings stay in folded
> position
> while towing. Vert stab protected by pad. Elevator tied in down (nose
> down) position via control stick. The transport kit is avail from
> KitfoxAircraft.
>
>
> Vic Baker
> S7 912S Warp
> Phase 1 flight testing
> Carson City, Nv
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:53 AM
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>
>
>> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>>
>> C'mon Leonard, to get the wings level with my factory-supplied tow kit
>> the
>> hitch would have to be more than 3ft off the ground. It's a Class 2
>> hitch,
>> not a 5th wheel!
>>
>> If the designers had meant the wings to be level they would have built a
>> bar
>> that raised it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2
>> hitch
>> ball. While there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most
>> class 2 hitch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off
>> the
>> road.
>>
>> Do not archive
>> Bob Brennan - N717GB
>> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
>> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
>> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
>> Wrightsville Pa
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
>> Sent: 07 January 2009 10:26 am
>> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>>
>>
>>
>> matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
>>> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip
>>> with
>>> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the
>>> original
>>> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the
>> frame.
>>>
>>> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red
>> spar
>>> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
>>> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red
>>> braces
>>> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
>>> transit.
>>>
>>> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as
>>> low
>> as
>>> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
>>> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in
>> previous
>>> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>>>
>>> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
>>> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is
>>> due
>>> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
>>> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a
>> crosswind
>>> or updraft.
>>>
>>> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
>>> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
>>> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>>>
>>> Bob Brennan - N717GB
>>> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
>>> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
>>> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
>>> Wrightsville Pa
>>>
>>> --
>>
>>
>> Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice
>> burner. I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would
>> be
>> real dang close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
>>
>> --------
>> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>> Leonard Perry
>> Soldotna AK
>> Avid "C" / Mk IV
>> 582 IVO IFA
>> Full Lotus 1260
>> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes
>> over.
>>
>> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 41
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|
| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
I just posted my kitfox for sale and I have some pictures with it on the tr
ailer. Towed it more than 3000 miles home at 50-60 mph with no effect on th
e kitfox. have used it for the past 4 years with no issues.
mic> From: noelloveys@yahoo.ca> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> Subject: RE:
Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox> Date: Wed=2C 7 Jan 2009 18:38:35 -03
>> > I did see a hitch for towing a 'Fox that had a screw that made the hit
ch> adjustable up and down several inches. I was part of the arm not the hi
tch.> > Another idea would be to cut the arms and plate them back together
like a> roof truss. I'd only bother with that if you are consistently 0towi
ng long> distances at highway speeds. > > Noel> > -----Original Message----
-> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-
server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan> Sent: Wednesday=2C January
07=2C 2009 12:23 PM> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> Subject: RE: Kitfox-Lis
an"> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>> > C'mon Leonard=2C to get the wings leve
l with my factory-supplied tow kit the> hitch would have to be more than 3f
t off the ground. It's a Class 2 hitch=2C> not a 5th wheel!> > If the desig
ners had meant the wings to be level they would have built a bar> that rais
ed it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2 hitch> ball. Wh
ile there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most> class 2 hi
tch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off the> road.> >
Do not archive> Bob Brennan - N717GB> ELSA Repairman=2C inspection rated>
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop> Wrightsville Pa >
> -----Original Message-----> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer> Sen
t: 07 January 2009 10:26 am> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> Subject: Kitfox
er" <akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>> > > matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:> > Here
is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with> > the
original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the original> >
engineers=2C I assume this because the attach points are built into the> fr
ame.> > > > Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see
the red> spar> > brace installed to give the front spar some support and m
ainly to stop> > vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 s
mall red braces> > that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they canno
t swing out in> > transit.> > > > Note that the wings are most definitely n
ot level=2C but are carried as low> as> > tailwheel clearance will allow. I
make an assumption in saying it was> > designed that way for all the aerod
ynamic reasons I have stated in> previous> > posts=2C but it was certainly
designed to be that way.> > > > The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way
are clearly stated in the> > owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farth
er than 10 miles. This is due> > to the size of the wheels=2C bearing toler
ances=2C narrow wheelbase=2C and> > aerodynamic safety considerations - it
could easily flip over in a> crosswind> > or updraft.> > > > I choose to tr
ailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to> > eliminate the rest
rictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the> > original designers in
tended - wings low into the wind.> > > > Bob Brennan - N717GB> > ELSA Repai
rman=2C inspection rated> > 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox> > Rotax 582 with 3
blade prop> > Wrightsville Pa> > > > --> > > Wings low on yours are due to
having it hooked to the bumper of a rice> burner. I would have to say that
if it were hooked to a truck=2C it would be> real dang close to wings leve
l=2C just like mine is when hooked to a truck.> > --------> DO NOT ARCHIVE>
Leonard Perry> Soldotna AK> Avid "=3BC"=3B / Mk IV > 582 IVO IFA>
Full Lotus 1260> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinker
itis takes over.> > hander outer of humorless darwin awards> > > > > Read t
his topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223
==> > >
_________________________________________________________________
Keep in touch and up to date with friends and family. Make the connection n
ow.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/
Message 42
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|
| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
My trailer is a similar idea except it has a platform around 8'X10'. That
makes my trailer higher and wider. The double snowmobile trailer is
designed to carry under 1800 lb. I extended the tow arm to take the tail of
the plane and built a stand to lift the tail.
One of the things I noticed about this unit is the weight is still on the
tail wheel when the wings are folded. I think I'd build a small support for
the fuselage just forward of the tail spring.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic Baker
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
This method seems to work well. I would never exceed 55mph while towing.
Note the wing braces and safety line insuring wings stay in folded position
while towing. Vert stab protected by pad. Elevator tied in down (nose
down) position via control stick. The transport kit is avail from
KitfoxAircraft.
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Phase 1 flight testing
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:53 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>
> C'mon Leonard, to get the wings level with my factory-supplied tow kit the
> hitch would have to be more than 3ft off the ground. It's a Class 2 hitch,
> not a 5th wheel!
>
> If the designers had meant the wings to be level they would have built a
> bar
> that raised it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2 hitch
> ball. While there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most
> class 2 hitch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off
> the
> road.
>
> Do not archive
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
> Sent: 07 January 2009 10:26 am
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>
>
>
> matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
>> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with
>> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the
>> original
>> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the
> frame.
>>
>> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red
> spar
>> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
>> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red braces
>> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
>> transit.
>>
>> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as low
> as
>> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
>> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in
> previous
>> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>>
>> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
>> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is
>> due
>> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
>> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a
> crosswind
>> or updraft.
>>
>> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
>> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
>> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>>
>> Bob Brennan - N717GB
>> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
>> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
>> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
>> Wrightsville Pa
>>
>> --
>
>
> Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice
> burner. I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would
> be
> real dang close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
>
>
>
Message 43
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|
| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
One way to figure out if the problem is with FSX would be to try X-
Plane. You can download it for free from their website: <http://www.x-plane.com
>.
Mike G.
N728KF, Kitfox IV-1200 Speedster
Phoenix, AZ
On Jan 7, 2009, at 12:35 PM, "Bob Brennan"
<matronics@bob.brennan.name> wrote:
> >
>
> I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the
> moment
> I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my
> PC, or
> some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it
> most
> likely won't run X-plane well either.
>
> bob
> Do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 815TL
> Sent: 07 January 2009 2:09 pm
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
>
>
> Bob,
> Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much,
> much
> better simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks
> better,
> higher frame rate, and feels more 'real'. Plus I have a nice model
> of a
> Kitfox II that I repainted, and re did the cockpit on, to look like my
> plane. The orginal was created by Michel Verheughe, who is a member
> here.
> I modified it for my use.
>
> The only down side to x-plane is it can be hard to set up and
> configure
> properly, but I can help you out with that. Also invest in a set of
> rudder
> pedals, they are worth it.
>
> More on x-plane here: www.x-plane.com
>
> And here: www.x-plane.org
>
> Andrew
> 815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223373#223373
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_in_921_577.jpg
>
>
Message 44
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|
| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
I think you'll find the transducer is the small turbine that fits in the
fuel line to record fuel flow - a simple 12 V wire connection runs back to
the Fuel Flow meter to feed the system.
It is suggested that the transducer is located cabin side of the firewall
i possible as they are normally made from glass reinforced plastic and
will melt if exposed to extremely high temps (engine fire), I had
difficulty dong this as mine has barbed connections and I don't have any
hose inside the cabin so I connected it between the engine bay fuel filter
and the carby. I then wrapped it completely in fire proof material so that
it is full protected.
Hope this helps
Gary
Gary Algate
Classic 4 Jab2200
Office Phone: +61 8 8276 7655
This e-mail is confidential and it is intended only for the addressees.
Any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message by
persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If
you have received this e-mail in error, kindly notify us immediately by
telephone or e-mail and delete the message from your system. The sender
does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of
this message which may arise as a result of the e-mail transmission.
?This year, instead of sending you a Christmas card in the mail, we have
made a contribution to UNICEF Australia. We wish you a safe and happy
Christmas".
"Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
08/01/2009 08:32 AM
Please respond to
kitfox-list@matronics.com
To
<kitfox-list@matronics.com>
cc
Subject
Re: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
G'day Foxy Folks,
I called to order this fuel monitor. I see they also list a transducer.
Is
this needed? The girl at the phone thought so. Makes a substantial
difference in price. Also, how do these hook up? Do they go in the line
,or
around it or ???
Sounds great to me as I am in the final processes of putting my Kitfox
back in the air after a fuel shortage off field landing. Thanx for the
info.
Larry
Larry Huntley
Dundee,NY
4-1200 EA81
Amax redrive Warp Drive prop
----- Original Message -----
From: "akflyer" <akflyer=5F2000@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:28 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
>
>
> Float Flyr wrote:
>> I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all those
>> vids
>> on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of those
>> units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-) ...
>> (Sorry,
>> thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's
still
>> accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price $109
>> U.S.
>> this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html .
>> I'm
>> going to be looking into this one.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Noel Loveys
>> Campbellton, NL, Canada
>> CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
>> C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
>> 912 almost installed
>> Aerocet 1100 floats
>> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>
>
> That is where mine came from, but I think it was more when I ordered it
> last year. Get it, you wont be dissapointed. And it will really open
> your eyes when you see what 100 RPM can do to fuel burn versus cruise
> speed. I think you will find that you fly just a couple MPH slower and
> can stay up alot longer ant get farther down the trail....
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes
over.
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223362#223362
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
8:49 AM
=5F-=======================
===========
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=5F-= Use the Matronics List Features Navigator to browse
=5F-= the many List utilities such as List Un/Subscription,
=5F-= Archive Search & Download, 7-Day Browse, Chat, FAQ,
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===========
Message 45
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|
| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
Head protection... I wouldn't have guessed!
Do not archive
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic Baker
Sent: 07 January 2009 5:04 pm
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
Prop tips, rags and clamps, softens the blow when I run my head into the
prop. (tight fit in garage)
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Phase 1 flight testing
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 8:47 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>
> Good picture Vic, with the wings pitched down into the wind at what I
> would
> consider the perfect angle exactly the same as the towbar kit. I sure hope
> this picture isn't representative of what others have called "wings
> level"!
>
> What are the thingies on the prop tips if you don't mind my asking? I
> promise not to start another thread about them....
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic Baker
> Sent: 07 January 2009 11:22 am
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>
> This method seems to work well. I would never exceed 55mph while towing.
> Note the wing braces and safety line insuring wings stay in folded
> position
> while towing. Vert stab protected by pad. Elevator tied in down (nose
> down) position via control stick. The transport kit is avail from
> KitfoxAircraft.
>
>
> Vic Baker
> S7 912S Warp
> Phase 1 flight testing
> Carson City, Nv
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:53 AM
> Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>
>
>> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>>
>> C'mon Leonard, to get the wings level with my factory-supplied tow kit
>> the
>> hitch would have to be more than 3ft off the ground. It's a Class 2
>> hitch,
>> not a 5th wheel!
>>
>> If the designers had meant the wings to be level they would have built a
>> bar
>> that raised it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2
>> hitch
>> ball. While there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most
>> class 2 hitch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off
>> the
>> road.
>>
>> Do not archive
>> Bob Brennan - N717GB
>> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
>> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
>> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
>> Wrightsville Pa
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
>> Sent: 07 January 2009 10:26 am
>> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>>
>>
>>
>> matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
>>> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip
>>> with
>>> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the
>>> original
>>> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the
>> frame.
>>>
>>> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red
>> spar
>>> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
>>> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red
>>> braces
>>> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
>>> transit.
>>>
>>> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as
>>> low
>> as
>>> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
>>> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in
>> previous
>>> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>>>
>>> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
>>> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is
>>> due
>>> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
>>> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a
>> crosswind
>>> or updraft.
>>>
>>> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
>>> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
>>> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>>>
>>> Bob Brennan - N717GB
>>> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
>>> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
>>> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
>>> Wrightsville Pa
>>>
>>> --
>>
>>
>> Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice
>> burner. I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would
>> be
>> real dang close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
>>
>> --------
>> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>> Leonard Perry
>> Soldotna AK
>> Avid "C" / Mk IV
>> 582 IVO IFA
>> Full Lotus 1260
>> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes
>> over.
>>
>> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 46
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|
| Subject: | Flight Simulator |
I have a similar system... A P4, 3.2 gHz W/ i gig of RAM and a GeForce 6200
card. 256 VRAM the computer is a second hand return from lease. $250 tx
incl. The monitor is considerably more. The FS-X runs great on this. I
like the FS 9 better only because my Kitfox flys great on it. I fiddled
with the program so tha plane gives closer to what I get in the real
plane... Then I did a repaint and a new panel. Now if I could only figure
out how to add floats. BTW there are more and better ponds in FS 9.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 2:03 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Flight Simulator
I hope this isn't too off topic for a Kitfox forum but does anyone use MS
Flight Simulator X? I had hoped to get some simulator time in while the
weather is so gruesome but it is unusable on my PC. I bought FSX, then the
Saitek Aviator joystick to hopefully make it work better, then more Ram,
then a new video card, and most recently the Acceleration Expansion Pack.
But nothing gets it going faster than about 2-3 frames per second, even at
minimal settings, which is unusable.
MS lists minimum requirements as Good, Better, Best - my PC falls into the
Best category with a 3g P4, 1.5g Ram, and new 512m GeForce video card.
MS support have been very helpful so far and my problem has been "elevated"
to the highest level as I await yet another phone call from them. My
question is simply - is anyone using FSX successfully?
Thanks,
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
Message 47
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|
| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
Gary,
Do you know if the transducer is part of the unit that is for sale?
Also,what do you think of the chances of the little turbine plugging or
failing and stopping fuel flow?
Thanx, Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: gary.algate@sandvik.com
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 5:28 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
I think you'll find the transducer is the small turbine that fits in
the fuel line to record fuel flow - a simple 12 V wire connection runs
back to the Fuel Flow meter to feed the system.
It is suggested that the transducer is located cabin side of the
firewall i possible as they are normally made from glass reinforced
plastic and will melt if exposed to extremely high temps (engine fire),
I had difficulty dong this as mine has barbed connections and I don't
have any hose inside the cabin so I connected it between the engine bay
fuel filter and the carby. I then wrapped it completely in fire proof
material so that it is full protected.
Hope this helps
Gary
Gary Algate
Classic 4 Jab2200
Office Phone: +61 8 8276 7655
This e-mail is confidential and it is intended only for the
addressees. Any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this
message by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is
prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, kindly notify us
immediately by telephone or e-mail and delete the message from your
system. The sender does not accept liability for any errors or omissions
in the contents of this message which may arise as a result of the
e-mail transmission.
"This year, instead of sending you a Christmas card in the mail, we
have made a contribution to UNICEF Australia. We wish you a safe and
happy Christmas".
"Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
Sent by: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
08/01/2009 08:32 AM
Please respond to
kitfox-list@matronics.com
To <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
cc
Subject Re: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
<asq@roadrunner.com>
G'day Foxy Folks,
I called to order this fuel monitor. I see they also list a
transducer. Is
this needed? The girl at the phone thought so. Makes a substantial
difference in price. Also, how do these hook up? Do they go in the
line ,or
around it or ???
Sounds great to me as I am in the final processes of putting my
Kitfox
back in the air after a fuel shortage off field landing. Thanx for the
info.
Larry
Larry Huntley
Dundee,NY
4-1200 EA81
Amax redrive Warp Drive prop
----- Original Message -----
From: "akflyer" <akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>
To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:28 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
<akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>
>
>
> Float Flyr wrote:
>> I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all
those
>> vids
>> on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of
those
>> units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-)
...
>> (Sorry,
>> thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's
still
>> accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price
$109
>> U.S.
>> this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html
.
>> I'm
>> going to be looking into this one.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Noel Loveys
>> Campbellton, NL, Canada
>> CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
>> C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
>> 912 almost installed
>> Aerocet 1100 floats
>> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>
>
> That is where mine came from, but I think it was more when I ordered
it
> last year. Get it, you wont be dissapointed. And it will really
open
> your eyes when you see what 100 RPM can do to fuel burn versus
cruise
> speed. I think you will find that you fly just a couple MPH slower
and
> can stay up alot longer ant get farther down the trail....
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes
over.
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223362#223362
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
8:49 AM
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
1/7/2009 8:49 AM
Message 48
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|
| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
Mine came with the transducer
Northstar Explorer F210 NSTF210 1 113.99
Digital Fuel Display
w/Single Engine Kit
Subtotal 113.99
Shipping 23.47
Tax 0.00
Total 137.46
This was from my order on 6-30-07
I have a kitfox header tank installed behind the seat. I have a filter then the
transducer coming off the bottom of the header, then reduce the line down to
5/16" and run aluminum tubing along the floor through the firewall into the gascolator.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223430#223430
Message 49
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|
| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
My best guess is there is a problem with the way your video card
communicates with your confuser. Make sure you have consistant RAM cards.
You may also have to enable the graphics card in control.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 4:06 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
<matronics@bob.brennan.name>
I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the moment
I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my PC, or
some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it most
likely won't run X-plane well either.
bob
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 815TL
Sent: 07 January 2009 2:09 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
Bob,
Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much
better simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better,
higher frame rate, and feels more 'real'. Plus I have a nice model of a
Kitfox II that I repainted, and re did the cockpit on, to look like my
plane. The orginal was created by Michel Verheughe, who is a member here.
I modified it for my use.
The only down side to x-plane is it can be hard to set up and configure
properly, but I can help you out with that. Also invest in a set of rudder
pedals, they are worth it.
More on x-plane here: www.x-plane.com
And here: www.x-plane.org
Andrew
815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223373#223373
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_in_921_577.jpg
Message 50
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
I don't know if your model has it but my model 2 has a tube for the tow bar
right where you are thinking of adding support - already designed to take
the weight.
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 5:26 pm
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
My trailer is a similar idea except it has a platform around 8'X10'. That
makes my trailer higher and wider. The double snowmobile trailer is
designed to carry under 1800 lb. I extended the tow arm to take the tail of
the plane and built a stand to lift the tail.
One of the things I noticed about this unit is the weight is still on the
tail wheel when the wings are folded. I think I'd build a small support for
the fuselage just forward of the tail spring.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Vic Baker
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:52 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
This method seems to work well. I would never exceed 55mph while towing.
Note the wing braces and safety line insuring wings stay in folded position
while towing. Vert stab protected by pad. Elevator tied in down (nose
down) position via control stick. The transport kit is avail from
KitfoxAircraft.
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Phase 1 flight testing
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:53 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>
> C'mon Leonard, to get the wings level with my factory-supplied tow kit the
> hitch would have to be more than 3ft off the ground. It's a Class 2 hitch,
> not a 5th wheel!
>
> If the designers had meant the wings to be level they would have built a
> bar
> that raised it to that height while attached to a regulation class 2 hitch
> ball. While there is no regulation height for a class 2 hitch ball most
> class 2 hitch trailers are designed for anywhere between 12" to 20" off
> the
> road.
>
> Do not archive
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
> Sent: 07 January 2009 10:26 am
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
>
>
>
> matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
>> Here is a picture of my model 2 being towed away from my UK airstrip with
>> the original tow kit as supplied by Denney and as designed by the
>> original
>> engineers, I assume this because the attach points are built into the
> frame.
>>
>> Slightly blocked by me and my feigned tears (sorry) you can see the red
> spar
>> brace installed to give the front spar some support and mainly to stop
>> vibration at the attach points. Not in the picture are 2 small red braces
>> that secure the wings to the tail assembly so they cannot swing out in
>> transit.
>>
>> Note that the wings are most definitely not level, but are carried as low
> as
>> tailwheel clearance will allow. I make an assumption in saying it was
>> designed that way for all the aerodynamic reasons I have stated in
> previous
>> posts, but it was certainly designed to be that way.
>>
>> The limitations of towing a Kitfox this way are clearly stated in the
>> owner's manual - don't go over 40mph or farther than 10 miles. This is
>> due
>> to the size of the wheels, bearing tolerances, narrow wheelbase, and
>> aerodynamic safety considerations - it could easily flip over in a
> crosswind
>> or updraft.
>>
>> I choose to trailer on a flatbed with wheels strapped to the bed to
>> eliminate the restrictions and keep the aerodynamics the same as the
>> original designers intended - wings low into the wind.
>>
>> Bob Brennan - N717GB
>> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
>> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
>> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
>> Wrightsville Pa
>>
>> --
>
>
> Wings low on yours are due to having it hooked to the bumper of a rice
> burner. I would have to say that if it were hooked to a truck, it would
> be
> real dang close to wings level, just like mine is when hooked to a truck.
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223335#223335
>
>
>
Message 51
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
I forgot to say my platform is XP SP-3 for the Flight Sim.... More and more
I'm switching to Dreamlinux distribution for internet browsing and office.
I still haven't seen a linux program with the flexibility of MS Outlook.
When I do that's the way I'll go.
Noel
Message 52
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
> Make sure you have consistant RAM cards.?
I formerly had just an onboard Intel chipset for video, now my monitor is
plugged into the Nvidea card so the video must be coming from there.
Checking My Computer > Manage > Device Manager > Display Adapters shows the
Intel chipset disabled and the Nvidea enabled. FSX only shows the Nvidea in
the Graphics dialog. Funny thing though - none of my programs show the
slightest difference, including all performance problems in FSX, when I
upgraded to the Nvidea. That can't be right... I expected more for my 120
bucks.
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 5:48 pm
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
My best guess is there is a problem with the way your video card
communicates with your confuser. Make sure you have consistant RAM cards.
You may also have to enable the graphics card in control.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 4:06 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
<matronics@bob.brennan.name>
I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the moment
I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my PC, or
some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it most
likely won't run X-plane well either.
bob
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 815TL
Sent: 07 January 2009 2:09 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
Bob,
Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much
better simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better,
higher frame rate, and feels more 'real'. Plus I have a nice model of a
Kitfox II that I repainted, and re did the cockpit on, to look like my
plane. The orginal was created by Michel Verheughe, who is a member here.
I modified it for my use.
The only down side to x-plane is it can be hard to set up and configure
properly, but I can help you out with that. Also invest in a set of rudder
pedals, they are worth it.
More on x-plane here: www.x-plane.com
And here: www.x-plane.org
Andrew
815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223373#223373
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_in_921_577.jpg
Message 53
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| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
I emailed boatersland and the reply I got was the transducer, which is
needed, is included in the kit.
This is part of the reply I got this afternoon.
<snip>
yes it does come with the sender
yes we do ship to Canada
<end of snip>
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Huntley
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 6:25 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
G'day Foxy Folks,
I called to order this fuel monitor. I see they also list a transducer. Is
this needed? The girl at the phone thought so. Makes a substantial
difference in price. Also, how do these hook up? Do they go in the line ,or
around it or ???
Sounds great to me as I am in the final processes of putting my Kitfox
back in the air after a fuel shortage off field landing. Thanx for the info.
Larry
Larry Huntley
Dundee,NY
4-1200 EA81
Amax redrive Warp Drive prop
----- Original Message -----
From: "akflyer" <akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:28 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
>
>
> Float Flyr wrote:
>> I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all those
>> vids
>> on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of those
>> units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-) ...
>> (Sorry,
>> thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's still
>> accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price $109
>> U.S.
>> this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html .
>> I'm
>> going to be looking into this one.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Noel Loveys
>> Campbellton, NL, Canada
>> CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
>> C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
>> 912 almost installed
>> Aerocet 1100 floats
>> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>
>
> That is where mine came from, but I think it was more when I ordered it
> last year. Get it, you wont be dissapointed. And it will really open
> your eyes when you see what 100 RPM can do to fuel burn versus cruise
> speed. I think you will find that you fly just a couple MPH slower and
> can stay up alot longer ant get farther down the trail....
>
> --------
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
> Leonard Perry
> Soldotna AK
> Avid "C" / Mk IV
> 582 IVO IFA
> Full Lotus 1260
> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
>
> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223362#223362
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
8:49 AM
Message 54
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
I was referring to your RAM sticks... Sometimes different sizes and speeds
of chips appear magically in the ram slots. Having different sizes ,speeds
etc can slow down a computer.
Perhaps you should run the possibility of removing the onboard video from
control panel past the people at Micro Soft... It is possible the onboard
and the NVidia are having a tug of war for every frame.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:30 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
<matronics@bob.brennan.name>
> Make sure you have consistant RAM cards.?
I formerly had just an onboard Intel chipset for video, now my monitor is
plugged into the Nvidea card so the video must be coming from there.
Checking My Computer > Manage > Device Manager > Display Adapters shows the
Intel chipset disabled and the Nvidea enabled. FSX only shows the Nvidea in
the Graphics dialog. Funny thing though - none of my programs show the
slightest difference, including all performance problems in FSX, when I
upgraded to the Nvidea. That can't be right... I expected more for my 120
bucks.
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 5:48 pm
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
My best guess is there is a problem with the way your video card
communicates with your confuser. Make sure you have consistant RAM cards.
You may also have to enable the graphics card in control.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 4:06 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
<matronics@bob.brennan.name>
I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the moment
I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my PC, or
some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it most
likely won't run X-plane well either.
bob
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 815TL
Sent: 07 January 2009 2:09 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
Bob,
Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much
better simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better,
higher frame rate, and feels more 'real'. Plus I have a nice model of a
Kitfox II that I repainted, and re did the cockpit on, to look like my
plane. The orginal was created by Michel Verheughe, who is a member here.
I modified it for my use.
The only down side to x-plane is it can be hard to set up and configure
properly, but I can help you out with that. Also invest in a set of rudder
pedals, they are worth it.
More on x-plane here: www.x-plane.com
And here: www.x-plane.org
Andrew
815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223373#223373
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_in_921_577.jpg
Message 55
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| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
Larry
when I purchased mine I paid about $250 and this included the transducer -
most of the systems I have seen always include the transducer as they
really do come as a set!
The turbine in the transducer is designed so that if for any reason it
stops rotating it can still supply full flow through the blades of the
turbine.
I know this works as on one occasion after transporting my plane to
Australia when I started the engine I was showing fuel flow (up to max RPM
on the ground) yet my EGT's were all in the green proving there was ample
flow to the engine. After a few minutes the transducer started turning and
all read normal.
I pulled the transducer and found that there was some fine residue in it
which I cleaned out with no further problems.
I guess the 3 months in a shipping container with a dry fuel system
allowed some crap to settle out.
Regards
Gary
Gary Algate Classic 4 jab2200
Office Phone: +61 8 8276 7655
This e-mail is confidential and it is intended only for the addressees.
Any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message by
persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If
you have received this e-mail in error, kindly notify us immediately by
telephone or e-mail and delete the message from your system. The sender
does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of
this message which may arise as a result of the e-mail transmission.
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made a contribution to UNICEF Australia. We wish you a safe and happy
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Message 56
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Well, in OK, it don't need a license plate (or title or registration as a
land vehicle), DOT tires are not an issue, and magnetic mount towing lights
are acceptable. Any "trailer" for private use does not require paperwork,
including my 30' flatbed gooseneck, with dual tandem wheels and 20,000 lb.
axles.
John Hart
KF IV, NSI Subaru
Wilburton, OK
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 9:12 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
Good info Noel, that's the first time I've heard some actual facts. I asked
as many authorities as I could find about how to legally tow my KFII on the
factory-supplied towbar and no one could answer, or even refer me to someone
who could. Due to that and the stress I knew I would put on the main gear
with the poor roads in rural PA I opted to get the flatbed trailer instead.
Plus any excuse to buy a new toy is a good one.
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 9:28 am
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
He would need wheel pants and DOT spec tires (this side of the pond). Some
jurisdictions require his plane to be licensed as a trailer and have
appropriate signal lights added to it.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dee Young
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:21 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
I have a friend who tows his model V tail first using the tow bar as
designed. Seems to work just fine for him.
Dee Young
Model II
N345DY
Do not archive
been biting my tongue on this one for awhile... Have any the rocket
scientists here bothered to look at what the factory designed for towing?
These were designed by the original engineers, and were made to tow the dang
plane wings level. I bet they were on to something when they came up with
this hair brained idea to tow a plane down a road...
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223264#223264
<Bnbsp; Features Chat, http://www.matronnbsp;
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List> via the Web
title=http://forums.matronics.com/
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
_p; generous bsp;
title=http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c====
===========
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http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
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Message 57
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
Thanks Mike, I downloaded the free trial version from their website, a 30
minute download for a 10 minute preview. 10 minutes wasn't nearly enough to
figure out how to do anything other than crash, but the frame rate as I
plunged toward the earth was good and the detailed scenery rushing toward me
was impressive.
So likely not my PC then, and at $39.95 I just might order that DVD and do
it right.
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Michael Gibbs
Sent: 07 January 2009 5:28 pm
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
One way to figure out if the problem is with FSX would be to try X-
Plane. You can download it for free from their website:
<http://www.x-plane.com
>.
Mike G.
N728KF, Kitfox IV-1200 Speedster
Phoenix, AZ
On Jan 7, 2009, at 12:35 PM, "Bob Brennan"
<matronics@bob.brennan.name> wrote:
<matronics@bob.brennan.name
> >
>
> I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the
> moment
> I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my
> PC, or
> some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it
> most
> likely won't run X-plane well either.
>
> bob
> Do not archive
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 815TL
> Sent: 07 January 2009 2:09 pm
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
>
>
> Bob,
> Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much,
> much
> better simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks
> better,
> higher frame rate, and feels more 'real'. Plus I have a nice model
> of a
> Kitfox II that I repainted, and re did the cockpit on, to look like my
> plane. The orginal was created by Michel Verheughe, who is a member
> here.
> I modified it for my use.
>
> The only down side to x-plane is it can be hard to set up and
> configure
> properly, but I can help you out with that. Also invest in a set of
> rudder
> pedals, they are worth it.
>
> More on x-plane here: www.x-plane.com
>
> And here: www.x-plane.org
>
> Andrew
> 815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223373#223373
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_in_921_577.jpg
>
>
Message 58
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| Subject: | Re: Trailering a Kitfox |
I could be wrong but other aircraft has the grove gear which is taller then
the stock gear which may be adding to the 5 to 10 deg down
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 1:54 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
Leonard - from the picture Vic Baker sent(attached) I would guess the wings
are between 5 and 10 degrees down into the wind, in my opinion a good angle
for trailering but certainly nowhere near "level". In my most humble opinion
"level" means level means 0 degrees to the wind, which I have been trying to
determine is a bad thing or not.
Trailering using the factory-supplied towbar or tailwheel-down "on the deck"
puts the wing incidence angle at between 10 and 15 degrees down I estimate,
and should be towed within the factory recommended range of no more than
40mph. If I were to tow my bird any distance or at any speed I would install
the braces and raise the tailwheel to between 5 and 10 degrees down, but
never to "level".
Kirk Hull's picture (hope you don't mind me attaching here Kirk) shows a
setup where the wings are level.
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of akflyer
Sent: 07 January 2009 1:15 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Trailering a Kitfox
matronics(at)bob.brennan. wrote:
> Good picture Vic, with the wings pitched down into the wind at what I
would
> consider the perfect angle exactly the same as the towbar kit. I sure hope
> this picture isn't representative of what others have called "wings
level"!
>
> What are the thingies on the prop tips if you don't mind my asking? I
> promise not to start another thread about them....
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> --
you are right, the wings are not perfectly level, but the tail is not
sitting on the deck either.... I have not put the incidence meter on it so
I cant give you a exact degree.
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223366#223366
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc02155_162.jpg
Message 59
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
The RAM sticks have been there for ages, I upgraded from the original 512m
by adding a 1g stick back when 1g sticks cost real money (I recently put 4g
in my Garmin for $18!), and never a problem. The Performance Monitor rarely
shows over 400m in use anyway. BTW I ran FSX with *everything* else shut
down, no difference.
The instructions for installing the Nvidea said to uninstall the onboard
drivers, I declined to follow a step that would leave me unable to read the
next step! Now that I know the Nvidea card is working I have uninstalled the
onboard chipset and restarted the PC - M$ plug-and-pray of course then
starts the whole Found New Hardware thing with no options to ignore it. It
re-installed the chipset as an "unknown" video controller which I had to
then disable.
Sadly, no difference, FSX is still doing an average of 2 frames per second
on default settings. And no phone calls from M$, what a surprise...
Do not archive
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 6:32 pm
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
I was referring to your RAM sticks... Sometimes different sizes and speeds
of chips appear magically in the ram slots. Having different sizes ,speeds
etc can slow down a computer.
Perhaps you should run the possibility of removing the onboard video from
control panel past the people at Micro Soft... It is possible the onboard
and the NVidia are having a tug of war for every frame.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:30 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
<matronics@bob.brennan.name>
> Make sure you have consistant RAM cards.?
I formerly had just an onboard Intel chipset for video, now my monitor is
plugged into the Nvidea card so the video must be coming from there.
Checking My Computer > Manage > Device Manager > Display Adapters shows the
Intel chipset disabled and the Nvidea enabled. FSX only shows the Nvidea in
the Graphics dialog. Funny thing though - none of my programs show the
slightest difference, including all performance problems in FSX, when I
upgraded to the Nvidea. That can't be right... I expected more for my 120
bucks.
bob
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 5:48 pm
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
My best guess is there is a problem with the way your video card
communicates with your confuser. Make sure you have consistant RAM cards.
You may also have to enable the graphics card in control.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Brennan
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 4:06 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
<matronics@bob.brennan.name>
I might give X-plane a try as well as FSX Andrew thanks, but for the moment
I really need to determine if it is FSX that is the problem or my PC, or
some magical setting I don't know about yet. If my PC is at fault it most
likely won't run X-plane well either.
bob
Do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of 815TL
Sent: 07 January 2009 2:09 pm
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
Bob,
Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much
better simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better,
higher frame rate, and feels more 'real'. Plus I have a nice model of a
Kitfox II that I repainted, and re did the cockpit on, to look like my
plane. The orginal was created by Michel Verheughe, who is a member here.
I modified it for my use.
The only down side to x-plane is it can be hard to set up and configure
properly, but I can help you out with that. Also invest in a set of rudder
pedals, they are worth it.
More on x-plane here: www.x-plane.com
And here: www.x-plane.org
Andrew
815TL, Kitfox II, Rotax 582-C
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223373#223373
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_in_921_577.jpg
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
Bob,
Make sure you have the latest video drivers as well, that makes a world of difference.
About x-plane, let me get a couple of screen shots. With the new version 9+, full
detail and forests, I believe it looks much better than FSX. Of course that
is my own opinion.
Like I said, the program with all the add ons is huge, and a little complicated
to get set up for the beginner, but I can help you out.
Oh, it also simulates ATC, and the airport database is more up to date. On FSX,
it still shows 7N1 in Painted Post NY, as a grass srtip, at its old location.
X-plane has it correct, with the new paved runway and taxiway.
Andrew
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223452#223452
Message 61
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
Has anybody got experience with MS Flight Simulator 2004?Pat ReillyMod 3 58
2 RebuildRockford=2C IL> Date: Wed=2C 7 Jan 2009 22:57:57 +0100> From: mich
el@online.no> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flig
ht Simulator> > > From: 815TL [lawrenceaw@corning.com]> > Take The MS fligh
t sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much=2C much better > > simula
tor in my opinion. I have used both=2C and x-plane looks better=2C higher f
rame> > rate=2C and feels more 'real'.> > Well=2C X-Plane feels more real
=2C that's for sure. But MS FS is "nicer" in the way that it has many fine
eye-candy features and a very large existing database of airfields and scen
eries.> > The difference in the simulators models is that MS FS use what ca
n be called "look-up tables." When you build an aircraft=2C you enter the s
tall speed=2C Vne=2C etc. and for speeds in-between=2C the values are inter
polated.> > X-Plane=2C on the other hand=2C uses what is called "blade theo
ry." It takes any part of the aircraft into an airfoil with own lift=2C dra
g and moment. Then it goes through each computation for each frame refresh.
> > When you build an aircraft in X-Plane=2C you have to enter what you th
ink is the closest model then you go and fly. If the aircraft then stalls a
t the speed intended then you are very lucky! You can then work with the ac
tual airfoil=2C the wash-out=2C the CoG=2C learn about aviation and see how
the model changes.> > I often work with X-Plane=2C PlaneMaker and AirfoilM
aker programs open at the same time. Tiny adjustments=2C testing=2C back to
the drawing board ... you get the picture!> > With MS FS=2C if you enter a
value for stall speed=2C the aircraft will always stall exactly at that sp
eed!> > X-Plane is in fact a digital wind tunnel. Even small change in the
step of the fuselage of a seaplane makes great difference. It is truly a wi
nd (and water) modeller.> > However=2C two warnings about simulators.> > -
None of them can simulate properly a spin. That is because data about airfo
il is known for "normal" angles=3B not when the apparent wind meets the win
g and perhaps an angle of 80 degrees and certainly not when e.g. because of
the spinning motion=2C one of the horizontal stabs is in the "shade" of th
e tail. The only way to simulate that is with Computerized Fluid Dynamics (
CFD) and that just can't be done in real time.> > - You can set the angle o
f view of the screen as you want. But if you do a bit of geometry=2C in ord
er to match the actual angle the screen makes and your perspective view of
everything around you=2C the angle should be put to perhaps 25 or 30 degree
s and that's too little to be able to see the panel.> > Imagine you are in
your Kitfox and you hold at arm's length a piece of cardboard that represen
ts the frame of your screen when you are at home. You will see only a tiny
part of the panel and landing with only that angle of view would be suicide
.> > Otherwise=2C it's fun=2C harmless and you are all welcomed to use my o
r Andrew's model.> > Cheers=2C> Michel Verheughe> Norway> Kitfox 3 - Jabiru
2200> > Do not archive> > <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" face=
nics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-L
=> > </b></font></pre>
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
I have 2004 also. Whats your question and I MAY be of some use lol..
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223457#223457
Message 63
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| Subject: | Flight Simulator |
Noel,
How about sending me a copy of your fixed up FS 9 kitfox?
Pete
apeterchristensen@sbcglobal.net
----- Original Message -----
From: Noel Loveys
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 3:42 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Flight Simulator
I have a similar system... A P4, 3.2 gHz W/ i gig of RAM and a GeForce
6200 card. 256 VRAM the computer is a second hand return from lease.
$250 tx incl. The monitor is considerably more. The FS-X runs great on
this. I like the FS 9 better only because my Kitfox flys great on it.
I fiddled with the program so tha plane gives closer to what I get in
the real plane... Then I did a repaint and a new panel. Now if I could
only figure out how to add floats. BTW there are more and better ponds
in FS 9.
Noel
Message 64
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|
You live in a good jurisdiction for trailers!
Here, all those points have to be met and a person is well advised to also
carry PL-PD insurance on the trailer/Plane. Motor vehicle registration will
license just about anything as a trailer but it must have a suspension and
DOT tires. That includes farm trailers and attachments towed on public
roads behind tractors. It gets worse. We have to remember to renew our
trailers every year and carry all the paperwork with us.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John W. Hart
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 8:18 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
Well, in OK, it don't need a license plate (or title or registration as a
land vehicle), DOT tires are not an issue, and magnetic mount towing lights
are acceptable. Any "trailer" for private use does not require paperwork,
including my 30' flatbed gooseneck, with dual tandem wheels and 20,000 lb.
axles.
John Hart
KF IV, NSI Subaru
Wilburton, OK
_____
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Noel Loveys
Sent: 07 January 2009 9:28 am
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
He would need wheel pants and DOT spec tires (this side of the pond). Some
jurisdictions require his plane to be licensed as a trailer and have
appropriate signal lights added to it.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dee Young
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:21 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Towing a Kitfox
I have a friend who tows his model V tail first using the tow bar as
designed. Seems to work just fine for him.
Dee Young
Model II
N345DY
Do not archive
been biting my tongue on this one for awhile... Have any the rocket
scientists here bothered to look at what the factory designed for towing?
These were designed by the original engineers, and were made to tow the dang
plane wings level. I bet they were on to something when they came up with
this hair brained idea to tow a plane down a road...
--------
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Leonard Perry
Soldotna AK
Avid "C" / Mk IV
582 IVO IFA
Full Lotus 1260
As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes over.
hander outer of humorless darwin awards
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223264#223264
<Bnbsp; Features Chat, http://www.matronnbsp;
<http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List> via the Web
title=http://forums.matronics.com/
href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
_p; generous bsp;
title=http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c====
===========
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronhref
"http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
http://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Message 65
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|
Thanx to all for the fuel monitor help. It is ordered and on its way.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 6:09 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
>
> I emailed boatersland and the reply I got was the transducer, which is
> needed, is included in the kit.
>
> This is part of the reply I got this afternoon.
> <snip>
> yes it does come with the sender
> yes we do ship to Canada
> <end of snip>
>
> Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Huntley
> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 6:25 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
>
>
> G'day Foxy Folks,
> I called to order this fuel monitor. I see they also list a transducer.
> Is
>
> this needed? The girl at the phone thought so. Makes a substantial
> difference in price. Also, how do these hook up? Do they go in the line
> ,or
> around it or ???
> Sounds great to me as I am in the final processes of putting my Kitfox
> back in the air after a fuel shortage off field landing. Thanx for the
> info.
>
> Larry
> Larry Huntley
> Dundee,NY
> 4-1200 EA81
> Amax redrive Warp Drive prop
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "akflyer" <akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 12:28 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: sight glass fuel indicator?
>
>
>>
>>
>> Float Flyr wrote:
>>> I just got this in from Dave Fisher. He's the one who puts all those
>>> vids
>>> on youtube. He claims to have run over 5000 gal. through one of those
>>> units... He didn't say if they were real gallons or the U.S. :-) ...
>>> (Sorry,
>>> thats right we don't have gallons here any more...Right!) and it's still
>>> accurate. He was also nice enough to pass along the current price $109
>>> U.S.
>>> this was from a marine supply shop. www.boatersland.com/f210.html .
>>> I'm
>>> going to be looking into this one.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Noel Loveys
>>> Campbellton, NL, Canada
>>> CDN AME intern, PP-Rec
>>> C-FINB, Kitfox III-A
>>> 912 almost installed
>>> Aerocet 1100 floats
>>> noelloveys@yahoo.ca
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>
>>
>> That is where mine came from, but I think it was more when I ordered it
>> last year. Get it, you wont be dissapointed. And it will really open
>> your eyes when you see what 100 RPM can do to fuel burn versus cruise
>> speed. I think you will find that you fly just a couple MPH slower and
>> can stay up alot longer ant get farther down the trail....
>>
>> --------
>> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>> Leonard Perry
>> Soldotna AK
>> Avid "C" / Mk IV
>> 582 IVO IFA
>> Full Lotus 1260
>> As done as any plane will ever be.... cause now the tinkeritis takes
>> over.
>>
>> hander outer of humorless darwin awards
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=223362#223362
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----
>
>
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
> 8:49 AM
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
8:49 AM
Message 66
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
a.k.a. FS - 9 the one with the better description of waterways and all the
free planes on the net??
Never heard of it! J
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of patrick reilly
Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 9:01 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
Has anybody got experience with MS Flight Simulator 2004?
Pat Reilly
Mod 3 582 Rebuild
Rockford, IL
> Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 22:57:57 +0100
> From: michel@online.no
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator
>
> > From: 815TL [lawrenceaw@corning.com]
> > Take The MS flight sim back and in invest in x-plane. It is a much, much
better
> > simulator in my opinion. I have used both, and x-plane looks better,
higher frame
> > rate, and feels more 'real'.
>
> Well, X-Plane feels more real, that's for sure. But MS FS is "nicer" in
the way that it has many fine eye-candy features and a very large existing
database of airfields and sceneries.
>
> The difference in the simulators models is that MS FS use what can be
called "look-up tables." When you build an aircraft, you enter the stall
speed, Vne, etc. and for speeds in-between, the values are interpolated.
>
> X-Plane, on the other hand, uses what is called "blade theory." It takes
any part of the aircraft into an airfoil with own lift, drag and moment.
Then it goes through each computation for each frame refresh.
>
> When you build an aircraft in X-Plane, you have to enter what you think is
the closest model then you go and fly. If the aircraft then stalls at the
speed intended then you are very lucky! You can then work with the actual
airfoil, the wash-out, the CoG, learn about aviation and see how the model
changes.
>
> I often work with X-Plane, PlaneMaker and AirfoilMaker programs open at
the same time. Tiny adjustments, testing, back to the drawing board ... you
get the picture!
>
> With MS FS, if you enter a value for stall speed, the aircraft will always
stall exactly at that speed!
>
> X-Plane is in fact a digital wind tunnel. Even small change in the step of
the fuselage of a seaplane makes great difference. It is truly a wind (and
water) modeller.
>
> However, two warnings about simulators.
>
> - None of them can simulate properly a spin. That is because data about
airfoil is known for "normal" angles; not when the apparent wind meets the
wing and perhaps an angle of 80 degrees and certainly not when e.g. because
of the spinning motion, one of the horizontal stabs is in the "shade" of the
tail. The only way to simulate that is with Computerized Fluid Dynamics
(CFD) and that just can't be done in real time.
>
> - You can set the angle of view of the screen as you want. But if you do a
bit of geometry, in order to match the actual angle the screen makes and
your perspective view of everything around you, the angle should be put to
perhaps 25 or 30 degrees and that's too little to be able to see the panel.
>
> Imagine you are in your Kitfox and you hold at arm's length a piece of
cardboard that represents the frame of your screen when you are at home. You
will see only a tiny part of the panel and landing with only that angle of
view would be suicide.
>
> Otherwise, it's fun, harmless and you are all welcomed to use my or
Andrew's model.
>
> Cheers,
> Michel Verheughe
> Norway
> Kitfox 3 - Jabiru 2200
>
> Do not archive
>
> <pre><b><font size=2 color="#000000" Archive Search & Download, 7-Day
Browse, Chat, FAQ,
> --> <a
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matronics.c
om/Navigator?Kitfox-List</a>
> orums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com</a>
>lt;a href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matro
>
> </b></font></pre>
Message 67
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| Subject: | Re: Flight Simulator |
Lenoard=2C I am considering buying the MS 2004 Simulator on recommendation
of a friend. He said it takes a very powerful computer to run the X and he
says his 2004 suits him just fine. Are you satisfied with yours? What joy s
tick would you recommend and someone mentioned rudder pedals. I didn't know
you could use rudder pedals with a simulator. Of course the last simulator
I tried was on a Tandy computer. Pat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flight Simulator> From: akflyer_2000@yahoo.com>
Date: Wed=2C 7 Jan 2009 16:42:20 -0800> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > -
ave 2004 also. Whats your question and I MAY be of some use lol..> > ------
--> DO NOT ARCHIVE> Leonard Perry> Soldotna AK> Avid "=3BC"=3B / Mk
IV > 582 IVO IFA> Full Lotus 1260> As done as any plane will ever be.... c
ause now the tinkeritis takes over.> > hander outer of humorless darwin awa
rds> > > > > Read this topic online here:> > http://forums.matronics.com/vi
===> > >
Message 68
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| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
When I go to this site: http://www.northstarnav.com/en/Products/Fuel-
Management/F210-Fuel/ two pictures come up....what is the D210?
They only seem to describe the F210.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 596+ hrs
Sensenich 62x46
flying again after engine rebuild, and new Electroair direct-fire
ignition system;
also building a new pair of snow skis
do not archive
On Jan 6, 2009, at 5:07 PM, paul wilson wrote:
>
> Kinda late reply. Thanks for jogging my brain.
> Anyway here are 2 more solutions:
> http://www.cruzpro.com/fu30.html
> Very cool and simple!!
> and
> http://www.northstarnav.com/en/Products/Fuel-Management/F210-Fuel/
> Very popular. The "Northstar F210" is the same product as the
> "Navman Fuel 2100". It has a new price and supplier.
> Get these gadgets from the boat places.
> Paul
> ========
> At 12:40 PM 12/8/2008, Paul Morel wrote:
>> <pmorel@bellsouth.net>
>>
>> Here's about the cheapest Fuel Flow system I found. I got it a
>> little cheaper at Oshkosh this past summer and it's going in my
>> Speedster.
>> http://www.fdatasystems.com/
>>
>> Paul Morel
>> Model IV Speedster
>> Locust Grove, GA
>
>
Message 69
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| Subject: | Re: sight glass fuel indicator? |
On Wed, January 7, 2009 7:51 pm, Lynn Matteson wrote:
>
> When I go to this site: http://www.northstarnav.com/en/Products/Fuel-
> Management/F210-Fuel/ two pictures come up....what is the D210?
> They only seem to describe the F210.
Depth Display
<http://www.boatersland.com/d210.html>
Here's the manual
<http://primus.northstarnav.com/icrns/Northstar%20FAQS/Manuals/D210_manual.pdf>
--
Paul A. Franz
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
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