Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:11 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test Report (Catz631@aol.com)
2. 05:17 AM - Re: ski saver (Catz631@aol.com)
3. 05:38 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Catz631@aol.com)
4. 06:40 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (patrick reilly)
5. 06:46 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test Report (patrick reilly)
6. 06:52 AM - Re: ski saver (patrick reilly)
7. 09:10 AM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09 (b gammon)
8. 09:21 AM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09 (Ed Gray)
9. 04:34 PM - Mogas revisited (Lowell Fitt)
10. 05:08 PM - Re: Mogas revisited (sbennett3)
11. 06:08 PM - Re: Mogas revisited (Randy Daughenbaugh)
12. 06:14 PM - Brake line fittings question... (Cwehner)
13. 07:04 PM - Re: Mogas revisited (Lowell Fitt)
14. 07:05 PM - Re: Mogas revisited (Lowell Fitt)
15. 07:31 PM - Re: Mogas revisited (Weiss Richard)
16. 08:13 PM - Re: Mogas revisited (Roger Lee)
17. 09:21 PM - Re: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09 (Larry Boone)
18. 10:14 PM - Re: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09 (sourdostan@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test |
Report
Patrick,
Thanks for the complement on my TR3. The gap seal on my rudder is a vertical
piece of contoured foam that I covered with 6 inch Polyfiber tape and
painted. If you look at the picture, the hinge areas were not covered so that I
would
have access to the hinge bolts. Previously that entire area between the
vertical stab and rudder was about a 2 inch gap. The contoured foam is available
from John McBean. I epoxied it to the trailing edge of the vertical stab. The
aircraft was already painted but I could not stand to look at that huge gap so
I had to do it. I have enclosed a picture of a taped temporary rudder gap seal
I tried (looked horrible) and it shows the old gap a little better.
Dick Maddux
Pensacola,Fl
**************Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to
stocks and so much more. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)
Message 2
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Patrick,
You will love that elevator trim tab of Lowell's ! It makes the Kitfox a
new airplane ! I have the trim switch(witches hat) on the top of my stick and
use it constently. Flaps never come into play for triming purposes as they used
too. Best investment I ever made !
Dick Maddux
Pensacola,Fl
**************Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to
stocks and so much more. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report |
Chris,
I tried to request a sample from that gap seal website in England but it
wouldn't work. I suspect they are out of business as it is an old website. The
stuff looks good and I sure would like to try a sample.
Dick Maddux
Pensacola,Fl
Do not archive
**************Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to
stocks and so much more. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)
Message 4
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| Subject: | Elevator Gap Seal Test Report |
Dick & Chris=2C I tried to order a sample also. I had same result as you di
d Dick.
do not archivePat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL
From: Catz631@aol.comDate: Tue=2C 3 Feb 2009 08:30:49 -0500Subject: Re: Kit
fox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportTo: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Chris=2C
I tried to request a sample from that gap seal website in England but it w
ouldn't work. I suspect they are out of business as it is an old website. T
he stuff looks good and I sure would like to try a sample.
Dick Maddux
Pensacola=2CFl
Do not archive
Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to stocks and so mu
ch more.
Message 5
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| Subject: | Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test |
Report
Dick=2C WOW!=2C I see the gap in the picture outside. You must have painted
the gap seal material to match the planes paint job. I'm impressed=2C beca
use I really can't see the gap seal material on the picture inside the hang
er. So you still have a gap. But=2C it is very small? You going to fly that
plane to Oshkosh this year?Pat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL
From: Catz631@aol.comDate: Tue=2C 3 Feb 2009 08:09:34 -0500Subject: Re: Kit
fox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test ReportTo: kit
fox-list@matronics.com
Patrick=2C
Thanks for the complement on my TR3. The gap seal on my rudder is a vertic
al piece of contoured foam that I covered with 6 inch Polyfiber tape and pa
inted. If you look at the picture=2C the hinge areas were not covered so th
at I would have access to the hinge bolts. Previously that entire area betw
een the vertical stab and rudder was about a 2 inch gap. The contoured foam
is available from John McBean. I epoxied it to the trailing edge of the v
ertical stab. The aircraft was already painted but I could not stand to loo
k at that huge gap so I had to do it. I have enclosed a picture of a taped
temporary rudder gap seal I tried (looked horrible) and it shows the old ga
p a little better.
Dick Maddu
x
Pensacola
=2CFl
Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to stocks and so mu
ch more.
Message 6
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Dick=2C Thanks for the picture I am about to leave for the hanger to pick u
p my elevator. I will tear into it today. I figure the cost will be about $
450 give or take a few. What electrical wire did you use and what was the s
ource?Pat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL
From: Catz631@aol.comDate: Tue=2C 3 Feb 2009 08:16:37 -0500Subject: Re: Kit
fox-List: ski saverTo: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Patrick=2C
You will love that elevator trim tab of Lowell's ! It makes the Kitfox a
new airplane ! I have the trim switch(witches hat) on the top of my stick a
nd use it constently. Flaps never come into play for triming purposes as th
ey used too. Best investment I ever made !
Dick Maddux
Pensacola=2CFl
Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to stocks and so mu
ch more.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09 |
Is any one planning a "Kitfox" trip to Alaska this Summer?=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A__
______________________________=0AFrom: Kitfox-List Digest Server <kitfox-li
st@matronics.com>=0ATo: Kitfox-List Digest List <kitfox-list-digest@matroni
cs.com>=0ASent: Monday, February 2, 2009 11:59:05 PM=0ASubject: Kitfox-List
Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09=0A=0A*=0A=0A===========
===============0A- Online Versions of Today's
List Digest Archive=0A=================
=========0A=0AToday's complete Kitfox-List Digest can also
be found in either of the =0Atwo Web Links listed below.- The .html file
includes the Digest formatted =0Ain HTML for viewing with a web browser and
features Hyperlinked Indexes =0Aand Message Navigation.- The .txt file i
ncludes the plain ASCII version =0Aof the Kitfox-List Digest and can be vie
wed with a generic text editor =0Asuch as Notepad or with a web browser.
=0A=0AHTML Version:=0A=0A- - http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview
.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter 09-02-02&Archive=Kitfox=0A=0AT
ext Version:=0A=0A- - http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?St
yle=82701&View=txt&Chapter 09-02-02&Archive=Kitfox=0A=0A=0A==
======================0A- EMail
Version of Today's List Digest Archive=0A===========
=============0A=0A=0A- - - - - ----------
------------------------------------------------=0A- - - - - -
- - - - - - - Kitfox-List Digest Archive=0A- - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ---=0A- -
- - - - - - - - Total Messages Posted Mon 02/02/09: 22=0A
- - - - - -------------------------------------------------------
---=0A=0A=0AToday's Message Index:=0A----------------------=0A=0A- - 1.
12:04 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Lowlead)=0A- - 2. 01:
04 AM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09- (b gammon)=0A- -
3. 03:55 AM - Re: Re: ski saver AKFLYERBOB- (Larry Huntley)=0A- - 4.
06:02 AM - Re: Fw: ski saver- (Lynn Matteson)=0A- - 5. 07:01 AM - Re:
Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Catz631@aol
.com)=0A- - 6. 07:03 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (lowflye
r)=0A- - 7. 07:05 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Catz631@AO
L.COM)=0A- - 8. 07:34 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Re
xinator)=0A- - 9. 07:34 AM - Re: air worthiness- (dcsfoto)=0A- -
10. 09:41 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (darinh)=0A- - 11.
10:54 AM - Re: ski saver- (George Wells)=0A- - 12. 03:58 PM - Kitfox
owner location map- (Paul A. Franz, P.E.)=0A- - 13. 04:45 PM - Re: El
evator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test Report- (patrick reilly
)=0A- - 14. 05:09 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver- (patrick reilly)=0A- -
15. 05:27 PM - Re: Kitfox broken motor mount- (Malcolm Brubaker)=0A-
- 16. 05:44 PM - Posting videos- (Paul Franz - Merlin GT)=0A- - 17.
06:39 PM - Re: Re: Kitfox broken motor mount- (Noel Loveys)=0A- - 18
. 06:55 PM - Flaperon hinge brackets- (clemwehner)=0A- - 19. 07:02 PM
- Re: Fw: ski saver- (Lynn Matteson)=0A- - 20. 07:20 PM - Re: Fw: sk
i saver- (patrick reilly)=0A- - 21. 07:33 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver- (
Lynn Matteson)=0A- - 22. 07:46 PM - Re: Flaperon hinge brackets- (Tom
Jones)=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message 1- _______
______________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 12:04:06 AM PST US=0ASubject:
Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0AFrom: "Lowlead" <j.t.cowie
@xoxy.net>=0A=0A=0AThanks Rex (and Lynn)! I wish I could say that it's this
consistent along the entire=0Alength of the gap, but it's not. The gaps te
nd to be smaller on the outboard=0Aends due to the way the tightened fabric
act on the stab and elevator frames.=0A=0A=0AInstallation is hard to descr
ibe but not that hard to do. One thing nice about=0Athis tape is that it's
very pliable and the adhesive is not super-aggressive at=0Afirst. The tape
is applied across the gap (we'll say the top side first) with=0Aa very slig
ht 'drape' down and then firmly pressed onto the LE/TE tubes. Then=0Athe bo
ttom side tape is applied with a very slight drape up (I used a pc of=0A1/4
" tube to force the drape up) and then pressed onto the LE/TE tubes. The tw
o=0Atapes stick to one another like a champ but leaves a triangular 'bubble
' running=0Athe entire length . I used a wooden tongue depressor and finger
s to press=0Athe top and bottom tapes together to eliminate the bubble. (se
e attached). It's=0Atough stuff and stretches well enough to get a tight in
stallation. There's=0Ano worries about tearing or punching through with the
tongue depressor.=0A=0AThe control surface (elevator or rudder) must be in
the neutral position when tape=0Ais applied or else a tension 'bias' might
get built into the installation=0A(ex: rudder now pulls left or right due
to tape..)=0AHope this makes sense...=0A=0ADan H.=0A=0A=0Arexinator wrote:
=0A> That's exactly what I was trying to describe with my- >-<- symbol
and my =0A> little drawn image file.- I agree with Lynn that it's a nice
job. Can =0A> you elaborate on how you applied so well?=0A> =0A> Rex=0A> Co
lorado M2/582=0A> =0A> =0A> =0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp
://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228125#228125=0A=0A=0AAttachments
: =0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal2_183.jpg=0A=0A=0A_______
_________________________- Message 2- _________________________________
____=0A=0A=0ATime: 01:04:57 AM PST US=0AFrom: b gammon <gammon25@yahoo.com>
=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09=0A=0ATh
is is my first attempt to participate in the Kitfox discussions. =0AIs an
=0Ayone planning to fly a Kitfox to Alaska this Summer?=0A=0A=0A=0A
=0A________=0A________________________=0AFrom: Kitfox-List Digest Serve
r <kitfox-list@mat=0Aronics.com>=0ATo: Kitfox-List Digest List <kitfox-li
st-digest@matronics.com=0A>=0ASent: Sunday, February 1, 2009 11:59:13 PM
=0ASubject: Kitfox-List Diges=0At: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09=0A=0A*=0A=0
A==============0A==========
===0A- Online Versions of Today's List =0ADigest Archive=0A==
==================0A=======
0A=0AToday's complete Kitfox-List Digest can also be fou=0And in either o
f the =0Atwo Web Links listed below.- The .html file includ=0Aes the Dige
st formatted =0Ain HTML for viewing with a web browser and featu=0Ares Hy
perlinked Indexes =0Aand Message Navigation.- The .txt file include=0As t
he plain ASCII version =0Aof the Kitfox-List Digest and can be viewed wi
=0Ath a generic text editor =0Asuch as Notepad or with a web browser. =
0A=0AHT=0AML Version:=0A=0A- - http://www.matronics.com/digest/digest
view.php?Sty=0Ale=82701&View=html&Chapter 09-02-01&Archive=Kitfox=0
A=0AText Vers=0Aion:=0A=0A- - http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestv
iew.php?Style=82=0A701&View=txt&Chapter 09-02-01&Archive=Kitfox=0A
=0A=0A=====0A================
====0A- EMail Versi=0Aon of Today's List Digest Archive=0A==
============0A===========0A=0
A=0A- - - - - ----------------=0A----------------------------------------
--=0A- - - - - - - =0A- - - - - - Kitfox-List Digest Archive=0A- - - -
- =0A- - - - - - - - - - - - - - ---=0A- - - =0A- - - - - - - Total Messa
ges Posted Sun 02/01/09: 21=0A- =0A- - - - ------------------------------
----------------------------=0A=0A=0A=0AToday's Message Index:=0A--
--------------------=0A=0A- - 1. 06=0A:38 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Te
st Report- (Catz631@aol.com)=0A- - 2=0A. 09:02 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap
Seal Test Report- (Noel Loveys)=0A- =0A- 3. 11:09 AM - Re: Elevator Gap S
eal Test Report- (Noel Loveys)=0A- =0A- 4. 11:26 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Ga
p Seal Test Report- (Lynn Matteson)=0A=0A- - 5. 12:02 PM - Kitfox with ro
tax fuel injection- (jason Parker)=0A=0A- - 6. 02:02 PM - Re: Re: Elevato
r Gap Seal Test Report- (Randy Da=0Aughenbaugh)=0A- - 7. 02:22 PM - Re: E
levator Gap Seal Test Report- (L=0Aynn Matteson)=0A- - 8. 03:02 PM - Re:
Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- =0A(Bob Brennan)=0A- - 9. 03:13 PM - Ski r
eport/snow conditions- (Lynn M=0Aatteson)=0A- - 10. 03:19 PM - Re: Elevat
or Gap Seal Test Report- (Lyn=0An Matteson)=0A- - 11. 03:24 PM - Re: Elev
ator Gap Seal Test Report- (=0ALarry Huntley)=0A- - 12. 05:00 PM - Re: El
evator Gap Seal Test Report=0A- (Noel Loveys)=0A- - 13. 05:05 PM - Re: El
evator Gap Seal Test Repor=0At- (Lowlead)=0A- - 14. 05:30 PM - Re: Re: El
evator Gap Seal Test Repo=0Art- (Lynn Matteson)=0A- - 15. 05:39 PM - Fw:
ski saver- (Larry Hunt=0Aley)=0A- - 16. 06:11 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver- (pa
trick reilly)=0A- =0A- 17. 06:50 PM - Re: ski saver- (AKFLYERBOB)=0A- -
18. 08:17 PM - R=0Ae: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Rexinator)=0A-
- 19. 09:18 PM =0A- Re: Fw: ski saver- (John Bonewitz)=0A- - 20. 11:08 P
M - Official Ki=0Atfox-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)- (Matt Dralle)
=0A- - 21. 1=0A1:25 PM - Official Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines- (Matt Dra
lle)=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message 1- ___
____________________=0A______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:38:03 AM PST U
S=0AFrom: Catz631@aol.com=0AS=0Aubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap S
eal Test Report=0A=0AThat foam weath=0Aer striping sounds like a good i
dea. You could further refine =0Athis by pu=0Atting a strip of teflon ant
ichafe tape on the other side of the =0Aweather =0Astriping foam(oposite
the adhesive side) or on the elevator leading edge=0A=0A=0Afor that mat
er. This stuff is real slick and I bought a roll of it from =0ASpruce=0A
=0Aas a cowling chafe tape a while back. It works real well.=0AOnl=0Ay
thing is, in the heat the adhesive on weather strip tends to give way =0A
=0Ainto a goo.=0A- That sailplane tape looks interesting also=0A- - -
=0A- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -=0A- - - - - - - Dick Maddux=0A-
- - - - - - - =0A- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -=0A- - - Pensacola,Fl
.=0A**************From Wall Street to Main Street =0Aand everywhere in be
tween, stay =0Aup-to-date with the latest news. (http:/=0A/aol.com?ncid
=emlcntaolcom00000023)=0A=0A________________________________=0A- Mess
age 2- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 09:02:=0A0
6 AM PST US=0AFrom: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>=0ASubject: RE:
Kit=0Afox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AOr you coul
d attach the=0Aseal, on the elevator side only with good old 1 in.=0AVelc
ro.=0A=0AAnother=0Athing to try is to cover the leading edge of the ele
vator and rudder=0Awit=0Ah the plastic tape then attach the gap seal to t
hat tape so when you=0Aremo=0Ave the seal you don't disturb the dope unde
r it.=0A=0ANoel=0A=0A-----Origin=0Aal Message-----=0AFrom: owner-
kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:ow=0Aner-kitfox-list-server@ma
tronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: Sa=0Aturday, January 31,
2009 8:12 AM=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator G=0Aap Seal Test Re
port=0A=0A=0AGood idea, but I'm from the camp that always wa=0Ants to
be able to take- =0Asomething apart if a problem arises. I guess i=0Af a
rock passed through- =0Athe elevator, you could always MEK the Vee of=0A
f from the elevator, and- =0Amaybe reattach it when the repairs were made
=0A. A longer process, by- =0Afar, than the tape method, but cleaner-look
ing=0A.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJab
iru 2200, #206=0A2, 600.2 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fir
e ignition system=0AN=0Aew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Jan 31,
2009, at 2:37 AM, JC Propeller D=0Aesign wrote:=0A=0A> <propellerdesign
@tele2.se>=0A>=0A> You can use that, bu=0At why not take 2 pieces sewn
together at the- =0A> middle and dope one Ve=0Ae to stab and other to ele
vator.=0A>=0A> Or use sail fabric that is air tig=0Aht from start=0A>
=0A> Jan=0A> ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot"=0A<orcabonit
a@hotmail.com>=0A> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>=0A> Sent: Fri=0Aday,
January 30, 2009 9:18 PM=0A> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Se
=0Aal Test Report=0A>=0A>=0A>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A>>=0A>>
Why not just=0Ause a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to- =0A>>
seal the gap ?=0A??- It would be permanent, easy to do, and look- =0A>>
good !- Much b=0Aetter than tape.=0A>>=0A>> Mike=0A>>=0A>> --------
=0A>> "NO FEAR"=0A-- If you have no fear you did not go as fast
- =0A>> as you could have=0A!!!=0A>>=0A>> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S=0
A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>> Read this t=0Aopic online here:=0A>>=0A
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=2=0A27727#227727=0A>>=
0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>
__=0A________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus- =0
A>> s=0Aignature database 3814 (20090131) __________=0A>>=0A>> The mess
age was chec=0Aked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>=0A
>=0A=0A=0A_______________=0A_________________- Message 3- ___________
__________________________=0A=0A=0A=0ATime: 11:09:12 AM PST US=0AFr
om: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>=0A=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: El
evator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0ASunday afte=0Arnoon and I can visualiz
e the X system easy now...- Friday nights=0Anot t=0Ahe best night of the
week for me;-).- =0A=0AI agree the X system allows f=0Aor a light hinge
on a model but a place for=0Agrass and leaves etc. To catc=0Ah in the "R
eal thing".- =0A=0AWhat I was thinking at first was a couple o=0Af piec
es of say 2 1/2 inch tape=0Asewn right down the middle and then one h=0Aa
lf of each tape doped to the=0Astabilizers with the other halves just fin
i=0Ashed to match the plane.- They=0Ashould be stiff enough to seal the g
aps =0Ain flight.- I'll attach a couple of=0Arough diagrams... emphasis o
n the t=0Aerm rough!=0A=0ANoel =0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom
: owner-kitfox-lis=0At-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-s
erver@matronics.com] On=0ABehalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: Saturday, Janua
ry 31, 2009 8:04 AM=0ASubje=0Act: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Report=0A=0A=0ANope, no picture=0Aor drawing. Just visualize...after
the inbibation- =0Awears off....the f=0Alat surface of the stab and elev
ator, as viewed- =0Afrom the side/edge, w=0Aith the tape starting on the
top left, and- =0Acrossing to the bottom rig=0Aht. (This of course assume
s that you have- =0Aproperly made the tape with=0Aan inch of the sticky s
urfaces against- =0Aeach other so that the tape c=0Aan- be stuck down on
the top left and- =0Athe bottom right) Now another=0Atape from the bottom
left crossing to- =0Athe top right. Where they pass=0Aby each other, the
y form an "X". Then- =0Aimagine a piece of tape 2" wid=0Ae being placed f
rom top of stab to- =0Abottom of elev. (top left to botto=0Am right), and
next to it another- =0Atape placed from bottom left to top =0Aright. Con
tinue alternating tapes- =0Auntil gap is sealed. I can imagine =0Ahow thi
s would look on a full-size- =0Aplane, and I don't like what I ima=0Agine
. It worked fine on the models- =0Aand looked ok, and made an especia=0Al
ly lightweight hinge. I personally- =0Adon't like the idea of this "over
=0Aand under" tape application, as it- =0Aalways leaves a place where jun
k =0Acan collect, no matter which way you- =0Ado it. I much prefer to let
the =0Aelevator hang down, apply the tape- =0Aacross the gap, and leave
it at th=0Aat. I use "racer's tape" that I- =0Aordered in orange, which i
s the color=0Aof my plane in that area...the- =0Acolor is not a perfect m
atch...howeve=0Ar, I can't see that mismatch- =0Awhen I'm flying and neit
her can anybody =0Aelse. The owners of "hangar- =0Aqueens" would not like
my reasoning, I'm =0Asure.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, =0A#2062, 600.2 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AE
lectroair direct-fire ignition system=0A=0ANew skis done and flying=0A
=0A=0AOn Jan 30, 2009, at 8:20 PM, Noel Lovey=0As wrote:=0A=0A> Lyn
n:=0A> do you have a picture or drawing of the X system?=0A=0A> Second
inbibation is starting to cut in and I'm having a problem- =0A=0A> visual
izing your X setup.=0A>=0A> Noel=0A>=0A>=0A> --- On Fri, 1/30/09
=0A, Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net> wrote:=0A> From: Lynn Matteson <lyn
nmatt=0A@jps.net>=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Re
port=0A> T=0Ao: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0A> Received: Friday, January
30, 2009, 6:11 P=0AM=0A>=0A>=0A> If you really want to drive yoursel
f nuts over this gap seali=0Ang- =0A> issue, try the=0A> "X" method ins
tead of the "Z" method. We used=0Athe=0A> "X" method on our model planes.
=0A> The "Z" method has been explai=0Aned....from under (or over) the=0
A> trailing portion of the hort. stab, to =0Aover (or under) the leading-
=0A> portion of=0A> the elevator, forming a =0A"Z" when view from the s
ide. The "X"=0A> method is just alternating the pla=0Acement of lengths o
f 2" wide- =0A> tape, over=0A> and under, then under a=0And over, etc.,
until the gap is sealed. In the=0A> "X" method, you make str=0Aips of ta
pe that go, say, 2" wide and=0A> from front to back, instead of th=0Ae "Z
" method where you run the tape=0A> from side of elevator to hinge, the
=0An hinge to hinge, and so on.=0A> The jury is still out on whether this
is a=0Agood method or not...how- =0A> 'bout=0A> some thoughts?=0A>
=0A> As an as=0Aide, when this method is used in model planes, no hinge i
s- =0A> needed, =0Aas=0A> the plastic covering material itself is used
for the "gap seals" and=0A=0A> in using the "X" method, the elevator oper
ates freely without the use=0A=0A> of hinges...not recommended for "live-
in" airplanes.=0A>=0A> Lynn Matt=0Aeson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, tail
dragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 600.2 hrs=0A=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A>
Electroair direct-fire ignition system=0A> New ski=0As done and flying=
0A>=0A>=0A> On Jan 30, 2009, at 12:53 PM, Paul Franz - Me=0Arlin GT wro
te:=0A>=0A> <paul@eucleides.com>=0A> >=0A> > On Fri, January 30,=0A
2009 7:28 am, kirk hull wrote:=0A> >> Does anybody have pictures of the g
a=0Ap seal installation?=0A> >=0A> > I too would be interested in seein
g photos=0A. I'm interested in- =0A> details=0A> of shape,=0A> > over
lap and what ha=0Appens to the slack when you run neutral or down=0A> ele
vator.=0A> >=0A> > D=0Aoes the slack start to peel a tiny bit on either
the stabilizer- =0A> or =0Athe=0A> elevator with=0A> > dirt and debr
is sticking to the small exposed b=0Ait of adhesive?=0A> >=0A> > Which
way is better to put them on - leading ed=0Age on top or- =0A> bottom of
Get the name you've always wanted ! @ymail.c=0Aom or- =0A> @rocketmail.co
m. _- =0A> www.matronics.com/contribution _- =0A=0A> ======
==================0A=======
=====0A=0A=0A________________________________=0A- Message 4-
_____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 11:26:=0A09 AM PS
T US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox=0A-
List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AI just flew my plane
today=0A, and during the pre-flight I noticed that- =0Athe gap-seal tape.
..orange=0ARacer's Tape...that I applied on 10-5-2008- =0Ais still holdin
g fast. I =0Awrote the date onto the tape to keep track- =0Aof how well i
t held up. Th=0Ae same tape that I applied earlier...God- =0Aknows when..
.is also still h=0Aolding fas, so maybe we're overthinking- =0Athis gap-s
eal "problem." Of c=0Aourse, mine is applied over the top of- =0Athe gap
and nothing underneath=0A, so the purists among us...you- know- =0Awho yo
u are...would not buy t=0Ahis fix.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Spe
edster, taildragger=0AJabiru 220=0A0, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46
=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition syste=0Am=0ANew skis done and flying
=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Noel Love=0Ays wrote:=0A=0A
>=0A> Or you could attach the seal, on the elevator side onl=0Ay with goo
d- =0A> old 1 in.=0A> Velcro.=0A>=0A> Another thing to try is t=0Ao
cover the leading edge of the elevator- =0A> and rudder=0A> with the p
l=0Aastic tape then attach the gap seal to that tape so when- =0A> you=
0A> re=0Amove the seal you don't disturb the dope under it.=0A>=0A> Noe
l=0A>=0A> ---=0A--Original Message-----=0A> From: owner-kitfox-list-s
erver@matronics.com=0A=0A> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
] On Behalf Of Lynn- =0A>=0AMatteson=0A> Sent: Saturday, January 31, 20
09 8:12 AM=0A> To: kitfox-list@=0Amatronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox
-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Repo=0Art=0A>=0A>=0A> Good idea, bu
t I'm from the camp that always wants to be abl=0Ae to take=0A> something
apart if a problem arises. I guess if a rock passed=0Athrough=0A> the el
evator, you could always MEK the Vee off from the elevat=0Aor, and=0A> ma
ybe reattach it when the repairs were made. A longer process,=0Aby=0A> fa
r, than the tape method, but cleaner-looking.=0A>=0A> Lynn Mattes=0Aon
=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 600.2 hrs
=0A=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire ignition system=0A
> New ski=0As done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Jan 31, 2009, at 2:37 AM
, JC Propeller Des=0Aign wrote:=0A>=0A>> <propellerdesign@tele2.se>=0
A>>=0A>> You can use that, =0Abut why not take 2 pieces sewn together at
the=0A>> middle and dope one Vee=0Ato stab and other to elevator.=0A>>
=0A>> Or use sail fabric that is air ti=0Aght from start=0A>>=0A>> Ja
n=0A>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPi=0Alot"- =0A>> <orcabon
ita@hotmail.com>=0A>> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>=0A=0A>> Sent: Fri
day, January 30, 2009 9:18 PM=0A>> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re:=0AElevator G
ap Seal Test Report=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A>=0A
>>=0A>>> Why not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to
=0A=0A>>> seal the gap ???- It would be permanent, easy to do, and look
=0A>>> g=0Aood !- Much better than tape.=0A>>>=0A>>> Mike=0A>>>=0
A>>> --------=0A>>>=0A"NO FEAR" -- If you have no fear you did
not go as fast=0A>>> =0Aas you could have !!!=0A>>>=0A>>> Kolb MK-III
Xtra, 912-S=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A=0A>>>=0A>>> Read this topic onl
ine here:=0A>>>=0A>>> http://forums.matroni=0Acs.com/viewtopic.php?p=
227727#227727=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A=0A>>>=
0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD3
2=0AAntivirus, version of virus=0A>>> signature database 3814 (20090131)
_____=0A_____=0A>>>=0A>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivir
us.=0A>>>=0A=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>=0
A>=0A=0A=0A________________________=0A________- Message 5- __________
___________________________=0A=0A=0ATime=0A: 12:02:53 PM PST US=0AF
rom: jason Parker <litesellme@yahoo.com>=0ASubject:=0AKitfox-List: Kitfox
with rotax fuel injection=0A=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=0A=tUrFJi93MI
o=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=nhiMjZGP-=0ADk=0Awww.youtube=0A.com/wat
ch?v=cD4_27rMX6Q=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=XEGx=0A====0A=
=====================0A=0A_____
_=0A__________________________- Message 6- ________________________________
=0A_____=0A=0A=0ATime: 02:02:20 PM PST US=0AFrom: "Randy Daughenbau
gh" <rjdaug=0Ah@rapidnet.com>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Ga
p Seal Test Repo=0Art=0A=0A=0AMike,=0AUnless you get all the coats
and cross coats of poly spr=0Aay on it it won't=0Alast more than a year o
r two in the sun.- Maybe that =0Ais permanent enough,=0Abut I worry that
with all the flexing, and enough co=0Aats or polyspray, it=0Awill crack.
=0A=0ARandy=0A=0A=0A-----Original Message=0A-----=0AFrom: owner
-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox=0A-list-server@m
atronics.com] On Behalf Of JetPilot=0ASent: Friday, January 3=0A0, 2009 1
:19 PM=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A
=0A=0AWhy not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to s
e=0Aal the gap=0A???- It would be permanent, easy to do, and look good !-
M=0Auch better than=0Atape.=0A=0AMike=0A=0A--------=0A"NO
FEAR" -- =0AIf you have no fear you did not go as fast as you=0Acou
ld have !!!=0A=0AKol=0Ab MK-III Xtra, 912-S=0A=0A=0ARead this top
ic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forum=0As.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=2
27727#227727=0A=0A=0A___________________=0A_____________- Message 7-
_____________________________________=0A=0A=0A=0ATime: 02:22:29 PM PS
T US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubj=0Aect: Re: Kitfox-
List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AThe "grass catc=0Aher" is
the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or- =0A"S") method of=0Aappl
ying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under- =0Athe front to =0Aov
er the back" or vice versa, there will always be a- =0Awedge of space t
=0Ahat wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get- =0Aout of the "
X" =0Amethod. That's why I've contented myself with the- =0A"over the fro
nt to =0Aover the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically- =0Adirty, hav
ing a spa=0Ace underneath that can eddy air, but have we a- =0Areally "cl
ean" plane o=0Atherwise?=0A=0AYour diagrams are very understandable, No
el...good job.- =0A- - - Lost- =0ASaturday? : )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=
0AKitfox IV Speedst=0Aer, taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0AS
ensenich 62x46=0AElectroai=0Ar direct-fire ignition system=0ANew skis d
one and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, =0A2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wro
te:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I can visu=0Aalize the X system easy no
w...- =0A> Friday nights=0A> not the best night=0Aof the week for me;-)
.=0A>=0A> I agree the X system allows for a light hin=0Age on a model b
ut a- =0A> place for=0A> grass and leaves etc. To catch in=0Athe "Real
thing".=0A>=0A> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pie=0Aces
of say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A> sewn right down the middle and then
=0Aone half of each tape doped to the=0A> stabilizers with the other halv
es ju=0Ast finished to match the- =0A> plane.- They=0A> should be stiff
enough =0Ato seal the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a- =0A> couple of=0
A> rough di=0Aagrams... emphasis on the term rough!=0A>=0A> Noel=0A
=0A=0A________________=0A________________- Message 8- _________________
____________________=0A=0A=0A=0ATime: 03:02:08 PM PST US=0AFrom: "B
ob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan=0A.name>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: E
levator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AI'=0Am glad to see someone else
used the just-tape-over-the-top method. When=0At=0Ahis topic came up a fe
w months ago I noticed on a magazine cover picture of=0A=0Amy plane I hav
e for my desktop that at that time it had black tape on th=0Ae=0Atop side
of the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I bought the p=0Alane.=0
AI assume it was wide electrical tape which is *everywhere* on the p=0Alane
=0Aincluding the leading edges and vertical stabiliser gap, and which I
=0Aam=0Agradually replacing since it peels.=0A=0AI was hesitant to po
st my me=0Athod since no one else had admitted here to that=0Asimple meth
od. I used a =0Ayellow duct tape across the entire topside of the=0Agaps,
installed with th=0Ae elevator fully down. With the elevator up it tucks
=0Aneatly into the gap.=0AI chose the top instead of the bottom so it wou
ld not=0Aaccumulate anythin=0Ag, and left the bottom open to see the hing
es on=0Apre-flight.=0A=0ASo far =0Ait has lasted a season and made a
difference to control authority on=0Athe =0Ashort-field-over-trees grass
strip that I use. Before sealing the gap my=0A=0Aslowest approach speed w
as determined by when I started losing pitch contro=0Al=0Aversus stall sp
eed, which made it tough to flare properly. Possibly the=0A=0Aunder-cambe
red wings and smaller tail made the gap seals more noticeable=0Aon=0Aa Mo
del 2 than later Models.=0A=0ABob Brennan - N717GB=0AELSA Repairm=0Aa
n, inspection rated=0A1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox=0ARotax 582 with 3 bl
ade=0Aprop=0AWrightsville Pa- =0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFr
om: owner-k=0Aitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list
-server@matronic=0As.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: 01 February
2009 5:18 pm=0ASubjec=0At: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
=0A=0A=0AThe "grass catche=0Ar" is the problem with either the "X" or
the "Z" (or- =0A"S") method of a=0Applying tape...whether you apply the
tape from "under- =0Athe front to ov=0Aer the back" or vice versa, there
will always be a- =0Awedge of space tha=0At wants to collects debris. It'
s just harder to get- =0Aout of the "X" me=0Athod. That's why I've conten
ted myself with the- =0A"over the front to ov=0Aer the back" method....ye
s it's aerodynamically- =0Adirty, having a space=0Aunderneath that can ed
dy air, but have we a- =0Areally "clean" plane oth=0Aerwise?=0A=0AYou
r diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job.- -=0A- - Lost- =0ASa
turday? : )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster,=0Ataildragger
=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair d=0Aire
ct-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1
, 200=0A9, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I
can visuali=0Aze the X system easy now...- =0A> Friday nights=0A> not
the best night of=0Athe week for me;-).=0A>=0A> I agree the X system al
lows for a light hinge =0Aon a model but a- =0A> place for=0A> grass an
d leaves etc. To catch in th=0Ae "Real thing".=0A>=0A> What I was think
ing at first was a couple of pieces=0Aof say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A>
sewn right down the middle and then one=0Ahalf of each tape doped to the=
0A> stabilizers with the other halves just =0Afinished to match the- =0A>
plane.- They=0A> should be stiff enough to =0Aseal the gaps in flight.-
I'll attach a- =0A> couple of=0A> rough diagr=0Aams... emphasis on the
term rough!=0A>=0A> Noel=0A=0A=0A___________________=0A__________
___- Message 9- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0A=0ATime
: 03:13:42 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubj=0A
ect: Kitfox-List: Ski report/snow conditions=0A=0A=0ALast week I had
a "ski=0Atuck" due to the bungees not being set to a- =0Ahigh enough init
ial tens=0Aion. This week I cut 2" from them and- =0Areinstalled and test
flew them=0A- yesterday and today, and could not- =0Aget it to happen ag
ain. Admitt=0Aedly, I wasn't really giving it what- =0Acould be considere
d an acrobatic=0Atest, but I made some (weak) dives- =0Aand pull-ups, and
couldn't get th=0Ae ski, or skis, to drop or tuck. I- =0Aeven flew in bu
mpy-bangy air. I ha=0Ad made a tension check before and- =0Aafter the sho
rtening, and I picked =0Aup about 8 pounds of tension per- =0Acord, or 16
pounds per ski.=0A=0AI f=0Alew today to test the condition of the snow
.- Last week when I- =0Atrie=0Ad to leave here to go to Oshkosh, the snow
was so wet and heavy- =0Athat =0AI could not get over 20 mph on the take
off roll. This was after- =0A2 day=0As of above freezing temps...34-36 de
grees F. Today, the- =0Aconditions we=0Are the same...overnight of over f
reezing, and 34 F when- =0AI took off. I=0At took a bit of coaxing, but I
got up alright, and- =0Alanded at 4 differ=0Aent snow-covered grass stri
ps. It was the same at- =0Aall strips...a bit =0Alonger than normal (most
ski takeoffs take more- =0Arunway, I've read), b=0Aut doable. When I sto
pped for lunch, I parked in- =0Amy own tracks, then =0A30 minutes later j
ust rocked the plane a bit- =0Abefore fire-up, firewall=0Aed it, and away
I went, taxiing to the- =0Arunway...slowly. I used up abo=0Aut 1100 feet
of a crosswind, no-tracks- =0Arunway before giving up and tr=0Aying it o
n a snowmobile-trodden runway- =0Ainto the wind. It still took a=0About 3
00 feet before it got off the- =0Aground due to the sticky snow con=0Adit
ions.=0A=0AAn article I had read (National Research Council of Canada)
t=0Aalked- =0Aabout "snow friction" in this way:=0A=0A"Early in the t
ests, it=0Awas found that sliding resistance and- =0Aadhesion were far mo
re depende=0Ant upon snow conditions than on the- =0Adesign of the ski. F
urther, the s=0Akiing quality of the snow changed- =0Acontinually and it
was not unusual =0Ato observe marked changes taking- =0Aplace in less tha
n an hour. The publ=0Aication notes that there are- =0Atimes when the sli
ding resistance of air=0Acraft skis is so great that- =0Ait is impossible
to reach flying speed."=0A=0A=0AI'm having a blast test-flying my skis
, and seeing first-hand how- =0A=0Asome of the writings that I studied wh
ile building them have merit.=0A=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speed
ster, taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 6=0A05 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=
0AElectroair direct-fire ignition system=0ANew ski=0As done and flying=
0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Lynn=0AMatteson
wrote:=0A=0A>=0A> The "grass catcher" is the problem with either =0At
he "X" or the- =0A> "Z" (or "S") method of applying tape...whether you a
=0Apply the tape- =0A> from "under the front to over the back" or vice ve
rsa=0A, there will- =0A> always be a wedge of space that wants to collect
s debr=0Ais. It's just- =0A> harder to get out of the "X" method. That's
why I've =0Acontented- =0A> myself with the "over the front to over the b
ack" method.=0A...yes- =0A> it's aerodynamically dirty, having a space un
derneath that c=0Aan eddy- =0A> air, but have we a really "clean" plane o
therwise?=0A>=0A> =0AYour diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good
job.- - - - Lost=0A- =0A> Saturday? : )=0A>=0A> Lynn Matteson=0A>
Kitfox IV Speedster, taild=0Aragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0A>
Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair d=0Airect-fire ignition system=0A> New
skis done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Feb =0A1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel
Loveys wrote:=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon and I can=0Avisualize the X sys
tem easy now...- =0A>> Friday nights=0A>> not the bes=0At night of the
week for me;-).=0A>>=0A>> I agree the X system allows for a =0Alight hi
nge on a model but a- =0A>> place for=0A>> grass and leaves etc. =0ATo
catch in the "Real thing".=0A>>=0A>> What I was thinking at first was a
=0Acouple of pieces of say 2 1/2- =0A>> inch tape=0A>> sewn right down
the m=0Aiddle and then one half of each tape doped to- =0A>> the=0A>>
stabilizers=0Awith the other halves just finished to match the- =0A>> pla
ne.- They=0A=0A>> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight.- I'l
l attach a=0A- =0A>> couple of=0A>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the t
erm rough!=0A>>=0A=0A>> Noel=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A________________
________________- Message 10=0A- ____________________________________=0A
=0A=0ATime: 03:19:35 PM PST US=0A=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps
.net>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Eleva=0Ator Gap Seal Test Report=0A
=0A=0AI just tape up to the hinges, then tape ag=0Aain on the other sid
e of- =0Athe hinge...all on the top-to-top surfaces..=0A.I'm gettin' too
old to- =0Abend down and look under there, Bob. : )=0A=0A=0ALynn Matt
eson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 6=0A05 hr
s=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition system=0ANew sk
i=0As done and flying=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 5
:57 PM, Bob =0ABrennan wrote:=0A=0A> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=0A>
=0A> I'm glad to see =0Asomeone else used the just-tape-over-the-top- =
0A> method. When=0A> this =0Atopic came up a few months ago I noticed on
a magazine cover- =0A> pictur=0Ae of=0A> my plane I have for my desktop
that at that time it had black tape=0A- =0A> on the=0A> top side of th
e stabiliser gap, which was not there whe=0An I bought- =0A> the plane.
=0A> I assume it was wide electrical tape whic=0Ah is *everywhere* on the
- =0A> plane=0A> including the leading edges and =0Avertical stabiliser
gap, and which- =0A> I am=0A> gradually replacing sin=0Ace it peels.
=0A>=0A> I was hesitant to post my method since no one else had=0Aadmit
ted- =0A> here to that=0A> simple method. I used a yellow duct tape=0Aa
cross the entire topside- =0A> of the=0A> gaps, installed with the elev
=0Aator fully down. With the elevator up- =0A> it tucks=0A> neatly into
the =0Agap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it- =0A> would not
=0A> accu=0Amulate anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges o
n=0A> pre-flig=0Aht.=0A>=0A> So far it has lasted a season and made a
difference to control=0A- =0A> authority on=0A> the short-field-over-t
rees grass strip that I use=0A. Before sealing- =0A> the gap my=0A> slo
west approach speed was determin=0Aed by when I started losing- =0A> pitc
h control=0A> versus stall speed, w=0Ahich made it tough to flare properl
y. Possibly- =0A> the=0A> under-camber=0Aed wings and smaller tail made
the gap seals more- =0A> noticeable on=0A>=0Aa Model 2 than later Mode
ls.=0A>=0A> Bob Brennan - N717GB=0A> ELSA Repairm=0Aan, inspection ra
ted=0A> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox=0A> Rotax 582 with 3 b=0Alade prop
=0A> Wrightsville Pa=0A>=0A> -----Original Message-----=0A> From:
=0Aowner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-s
erver=0A@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn- =0A> Matteson=0A> Sent: 01 F
ebruary 20=0A09 5:18 pm=0A> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject:
Re: Kitfox-List: =0AElevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A>=0A>=0A> The "gr
ass catcher" is the proble=0Am with either the "X" or the "Z" (or=0A> "S"
) method of applying tape...whe=0Ather you apply the tape from "under=0A>
the front to over the back" or vice=0Aversa, there will always be a=0A>
wedge of space that wants to collects de=0Abris. It's just harder to get=
0A> out of the "X" method. That's why I've co=0Antented myself with the=0
A> "over the front to over the back" method....yes=0Ait's aerodynamically
=0A> dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy ai=0Ar, but have we a
=0A> really "clean" plane otherwise?=0A>=0A> Your diagrams =0Aare ver
y understandable, Noel...good job.- - - - Lost=0A> Saturday?=0A: )=0A>
=0A> Lynn Matteson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru
=0A2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire
ignitio=0An system=0A> New skis done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Feb
1, 2009, at 1:57 P=0AM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon an
d I can visualize the X s=0Aystem easy now...=0A>> Friday nights=0A>> n
ot the best night of the week fo=0Ar me;-).=0A>>=0A>> I agree the X sys
tem allows for a light hinge on a model=0Abut a=0A>> place for=0A>> gra
ss and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thin=0Ag".=0A>>=0A>> What I wa
s thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 =0A1/2=0A>> inch tape
=0A>> sewn right down the middle and then one half of eac=0Ah tape doped
to- =0A>> the=0A>> stabilizers with the other halves just fi=0Anished t
o match the=0A>> plane.- They=0A>> should be stiff enough to seal=0Athe
gaps in flight.- I'll attach a=0A>> couple of=0A>> rough diagrams...
=0Aemphasis on the term rough!=0A>>=0A>> Noel=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0
A_______________=0A_________________- Message 11- _________________________
___________=0A=0A=0A=0ATime: 03:24:36 PM PST US=0AFrom: "Larry Hunt
ley" <asq@roadrunner.com>=0A=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Sea
l Test Report=0A=0A=0AI did th=0Aat with ski saver. Worked fin and no
t too complicated for my brain. =0AI ca=0An make decent 3pt landings with
the Soob on front and no =0Aflaps----Barely=0A, But it works.- - Larry 4
-1200 Soob=0A=0A----- Original Message ----- =0A=0AFrom: "Bob Brennan
" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=0ASent: Sunday, Februar=0Ay 01, 2009 5:57
PM=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Repor=0At=0A=0A
=0A> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=0A>=0A> I'm glad to see someone el
=0Ase used the just-tape-over-the-top method. When=0A> this topic came up
a fe=0Aw months ago I noticed on a magazine cover picture =0A> of=0A>
my plane I h=0Aave for my desktop that at that time it had black tape on th
e=0A> top side =0Aof the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I bough
t the =0A> plane.=0A=0A> I assume it was wide electrical tape which is
*everywhere* on the plane=0A=0A> including the leading edges and vertical
stabiliser gap, and which I a=0Am=0A> gradually replacing since it peels
.=0A>=0A> I was hesitant to post my=0Amethod since no one else had admi
tted here to =0A> that=0A> simple method.=0AI used a yellow duct tape a
cross the entire topside of the=0A> gaps, insta=0Alled with the elevator
fully down. With the elevator up it =0A> tucks=0A> n=0Aeatly into the g
ap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it would not=0A=0A> accumula
te anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges on=0A>=0Apre-flig
ht.=0A>=0A> So far it has lasted a season and made a difference to=0Aco
ntrol authority =0A> on=0A> the short-field-over-trees grass strip that
=0AI use. Before sealing the gap =0A> my=0A> slowest approach speed wa
s determ=0Ained by when I started losing pitch =0A> control=0A> versus
stall speed, wh=0Aich made it tough to flare properly. Possibly the=0A> u
nder-cambered wings =0Aand smaller tail made the gap seals more noticeable
=0A> on=0A> a Model 2 t=0Ahan later Models.=0A>=0A> Bob Brennan - N
717GB=0A> ELSA Repairman, inspecti=0Aon rated=0A> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA
Kitfox=0A> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop=0A=0A> Wrightsville Pa=0A>=0
A> -----Original Message-----=0A> From: owner-kitfox=0A-list-server@matro
nics.com=0A> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.c=0Aom] On Behalf
Of Lynn Matteson=0A> Sent: 01 February 2009 5:18 pm=0A> To: k=0Aitfox-
list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Te=0As
t Report=0A>=0A>=0A> The "grass catcher" is the problem with either t
he "X=0A" or the "Z" (or=0A> "S") method of applying tape...whether you a
pply the t=0Aape from "under=0A> the front to over the back" or vice vers
a, there will a=0Always be a=0A> wedge of space that wants to collects de
bris. It's just hard=0Aer to get=0A> out of the "X" method. That's why I'
ve contented myself with =0Athe=0A> "over the front to over the back" met
hod....yes it's aerodynamicall=0Ay=0A> dirty, having a space underneath t
hat can eddy air, but have we a=0A>=0Areally "clean" plane otherwise?=0
A>=0A> Your diagrams are very understanda=0Able, Noel...good job.- - - -
Lost=0A> Saturday? : )=0A>=0A> Lynn Ma=0Atteson=0A> Kitfox IV Speed
ster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0A=0A> Sensenich 62x4
6=0A> Electroair direct-fire ignition system=0A> New ski=0As done and f
lying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote=0A:
=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...
=0A=0A>> Friday nights=0A>> not the best night of the week for me;-).
=0A>>=0A>> I=0Aagree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model b
ut a=0A>> place fo=0Ar=0A>> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real
thing".=0A>>=0A>> What I=0Awas thinking at first was a couple of piece
s of say 2 1/2=0A>> inch tape=0A=0A>> sewn right down the middle and th
en one half of each tape doped to th=0Ae=0A>> stabilizers with the other
halves just finished to match the=0A>> pl=0Aane.- They=0A>> should be s
tiff enough to seal the gaps in flight.- I'l=0Al attach a=0A>> couple of
=0A>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough=0A!=0A>>=0A>> Noel
=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A------------------------------------------=0A---
-----------------------------------=0A=0A=0AChecked by AVG - http://w
ww.=0Aavg.com=0A6:02 PM=0A=0A=0A________________________________- M
essage 12-=0A____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:00
:25 PM PST US=0AFr=0Aom: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>=0ASubject:
RE: Kitfox-List: Elevato=0Ar Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0ANot lost j
ust out of town until later last n=0Aight.=0A=0AWhat did you think of t
he idea of using Velcro (just on the rudd=0Aer)- Would=0Amake it easy to
clean and also easy to remove the rudder for=0Arepairs due to=0Ahangar ra
sh.=0A=0AI'm going to try a gap seal this spring=0Awhen I get the plane
out again.- At=0Aleast on the rudder to try to give=0Ame more authority
for slips.- Those big=0Afloats hanging three feet or m=0Aore below the CG
really want to right the=0Aplane.- So far I've been givi=0Ang full ruddr
and controlling the slip with the=0Aailerons.- Even doing t=0Ahat the sl
ip is more gentle than what I can get with=0Ano problems from a C=0A-172.
=0A=0ANoel=0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: owner-kitfox-l
ist-s=0Aerver@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.
com] On Be=0Ahalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 6:48
PM=0ASubject: =0ARe: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0
A=0AThe "grass catcher" =0Ais the problem with either the "X" or the "Z"
(or- =0A"S") method of appl=0Aying tape...whether you apply the tape from
"under- =0Athe front to over =0Athe back" or vice versa, there will alwa
ys be a- =0Awedge of space that w=0Aants to collects debris. It's just ha
rder to get- =0Aout of the "X" metho=0Ad. That's why I've contented mysel
f with the- =0A"over the front to over =0Athe back" method....yes it's ae
rodynamically- =0Adirty, having a space un=0Aderneath that can eddy air,
but have we a- =0Areally "clean" plane otherw=0Aise?=0A=0AYour diagra
ms are very understandable, Noel...good job.- - =0A- - Lost- =0ASaturday?
: )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, =0Ataildragger=0AJab
iru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair di=0Arect-fire
ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009
=0A, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I can v
isualiz=0Ae the X system easy now...- =0A> Friday nights=0A> not the be
st night of =0Athe week for me;-).=0A>=0A> I agree the X system allows
for a light hinge o=0An a model but a- =0A> place for=0A> grass and lea
ves etc. To catch in the=0A"Real thing".=0A>=0A> What I was thinking at
first was a couple of pieces =0Aof say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A> sewn
right down the middle and then one =0Ahalf of each tape doped to the=0A>
stabilizers with the other halves just f=0Ainished to match the- =0A> pla
ne.- They=0A> should be stiff enough to s=0Aeal the gaps in flight.- I'll
attach a- =0A> couple of=0A> rough diagra=0Ams... emphasis on the term
Message 13- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0A=0ATime: 05
:05:11 PM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test=0ARep
ort=0AFrom: "Lowlead" <j.t.cowie@xoxy.net>=0A=0A=0AI use a 3M 3372
poly=0Aurethane surface protection tape applied on both top and bottom=0A
of the ga=0Ap (previous posts shown as >-=0A=0A=0ARead this topic onl
ine here:=0A=0Ahtt=0Ap://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#
228084=0A=0A=0AAttachment=0As: =0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/
/files/gapseal1_141.jpg=0A=0A=0A______=0A__________________________-
Message 14- _______________________________=0A_____=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:
30:02 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.=0Anet>=0ASubject:
Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0A=0AThat's
a good-looking job, LL.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, ta
=0Aildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectr
oair dire=0Act-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0Ado not
archive=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 8:01 PM, Lowlead wrote:=0A
=0A>=0A> I use a 3M 3372 po=0Alyurethane surface protection tape applie
d on- =0A> both top and bottom o=0Af the gap (previous posts shown as >-
=0A>=0A>=0A> Read this topic online he=0Are:=0A>=0A> http://forum
s.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084=0A>=0A=0A>=0A> Attach
ments:=0A>=0A> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_1=0A41.jpg
=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message 15- __
=0A__________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:39:40 PM PST U
S=0AFrom:=0A"Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>=0ASubject: Kitfox-List
: Fw: ski saver=0A=0A=0A=0AJust received this. Does it sound like the
same material?- Larry=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----- =0AFrom:
<info@tognar.com>=0ASent: Sunda=0Ay, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM=0ASubjec
t: Re: ski saver=0A=0A=0A>=0A> Yes,=0A=0A> check this link on our
bags/racks page=0A> http://www.tognar.com/bags_rac=0Aks_boot_ski_binding
_snowboard_accessory.html=0A> The top item is the scuff =0Asaver tape,=
0A> Thanks,=0A> Cat=0A> www.tognar.com=0A>=0A>=0A>> Do you stil
=0Al have "ski saver" tape?- Larry Huntley- asq@roadrunner.com=0A> Ye=0
A>=0A=0A=0A=0A-------------------------------------------------------
-----------=0A--------------=0A=0A=0AChecked by AVG - http://www.avg.
com=0A6:02 PM=0A=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message
16- ______________________=0A______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:11:13 PM
PST US=0AFrom: patrick reilly <pat=0Areilly43@hotmail.com>=0ASubject:
RE: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A=0A=0ALar=0Ary=2C Thanks for the w
eb link. I ordered 5 feed just to have on hand. Th=0A=0Aat price for 14"
wide clear tape is unreal. There are many times I wante=0Ad s=0Aome of th
at tape to protect paint on a car=2C motorcycle tank=2C =0Aetc. I'll
=0Ause it on the gap seal=2C Alla Lynn Matteson top side only. =0ALynn
=2C if that=0Acurls down into the gap=2C rather than up=2C I don'
=0At know why anybody woul=0Ad use any other method.=0Ado not archive P
at Reil=0AlyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From: asq@roadrun=0Aner.co
m> To: kitfo=0Ax-list@matronics.com> Subject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=
0A> Date: Sun=2=0AC 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500> > --> Kitfox-List message
posted =0Aby: "Larry=0AHuntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> > Just received thi
s. Does it sou=0And like=0Athe same material? Larry> > ----- Original Mes
sage ----- > From: <i=0Anfo@=0Atognar.com>> To: "Larry Huntley" <asq@road
runner.com>> Sent: Sunday=2C =0A=0AFebruary 01=2C 2009 7:54 PM> Subje
ct: Re: ski saver> > > >> > Yes=2C=0A> > che=0Ack this link on our bags
/racks page> > http://www.tognar.com/bags=0A_racks_boo=0At_ski_binding_sn
owboard_accessory.html> > The top item is the =0Ascuff saver t=0Aape=2C
> > Thanks=2C> > Cat> > www.tognar.com> >> >> >> =0ADo you still have "s
=0Aki saver" tape? Larry Huntley asq@roadrunner.com> > =0AYe> >> > > ----
--------=0A-------------------------------------------------=0A----------
---------> > > >=0A=====> > > =0A=0A___________________=0A_
____________- Message 17- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0A
=0ATime: 06:50:23 PM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver=0AF
rom: "=0AAKFLYERBOB" <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>=0A=0A=0ALarry=0AW
hat material are =0Ayou talking about?=0AI'm sure every one would like to
know.=0ABob=0A=0A----=0A----=0ABob Wolfe..Soldotna, Alaska=0AKF
Mod I and III=0A=0A=0ARead this top=0Aic online here:=0A=0Ahttp:/
/forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228098#2=0A28098=0A=0A=0A____
____________________________- Message 18- ___________=0A___________________
______=0A=0A=0ATime: 08:17:28 PM PST US=0AFrom: Rexinato=0Ar <rexin
ator@gmail.com>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal T=0Aest
Report=0A=0A=0AThat's exactly what I was trying to describe with my-
=0A>-<- symbol and my =0Alittle drawn image file.- I agree with Lynn tha
t =0Ait's a nice job. Can =0Ayou elaborate on how you applied so well?=
0A=0ARex=0A=0AColorado M2/582=0A=0A=0ALowlead wrote:=0A>=0A>
I use a 3M 3372 polyureth=0Aane surface protection tape applied on both top
and=0Abottom of the gap (pr=0Aevious posts shown as >-=0A>=0A>=0A>
Read this topic online here:=0A> http:=0A//forums.matronics.com/viewtopi
c.php?p=228084#228084=0A>=0A>=0A> Attachme=0Ants: =0A> http://for
ums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_141.jpg=0A>- =0A=0A=0A=0A________
________________________- Message 19- ______________________=0A____________
__=0A=0A=0ATime: 09:18:50 PM PST US=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List:=0AF
w: ski saver=0AFrom: John Bonewitz <bonewitz@gmail.com>=0A=0AWe have
a wi=0Anner! I'm going to order some of this stuff. There are probably=0A
lots of o=0Ather uses besides gap seal.=0A=0AThanks,=0AJohn Bonewitz
=0ASeries 5=0A=0AOn=0ASun, Feb 1, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Larry Huntley <asq
@roadrunner.com> wrote:=0A=0A=0A>=0A> Just received this. Does it sou
nd like the same material?- Larry=0A=0A>=0A> ----- Original Message ---
-- From: <info@tognar.com>=0A> To: "Larr=0Ay Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com
>=0A> Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM=0A=0A> Subject: Re: ski s
aver=0A>=0A>=0A>> Yes,=0A>> check this link on our b=0Aags/racks pa
ge=0A>> http://www.tognar.com/bags_racks_boot_ski_binding_snowb=0Aoard_ac
cessory.html=0A>> The top item is the scuff saver tape,=0A>> Thanks,=0A
=0A>> Cat=0A>> www.tognar.com=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>- Do you still have "
ski save=0Ar" tape?- Larry Huntley- asq@roadrunner.com=0A>>>=0A>> Ye=
0A>>=0A>>=0A>=0A=0A>=0A> ------------------------------------------
------------------------=0A--------------=0A>=0A>=0A> Checked by AVG
- http://www.avg.com=0A> 6:02 PM=0A=0A>=0A>=0A=0A________________
________________- Message 20- ___________=0A_________________________=0A
=0A=0ATime: 11:08:00 PM PST US=0AFrom: Matt Dra=0Alle <dralle@matroni
cs.com>=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Official Kitfox-List FAQ=0A(Frequently As
ked Questions)=0A=0A=0ADear Listers,=0A=0APlease read over t=0Ahe
Kitfox-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below.- The=0Acomplete Ki
=0Atfox-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the=0Afol
lowin=0Ag URL:=0A=0A- http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Kitfox-List.FAQ.htm
l=0A=0ATha=0Ank you,=0A=0AMatt Dralle=0AMatronics Email List Admi
nistrator=0A=0A=0A[ Not=0Ae: This FAQ was designed to be displayed wi
th a fixed width font such as=0A=0A- - - - Courier.- Proportional fonts w
ill cause display formattin=0Ag errors. ]=0A=0A=0A- This FAQ can also
be viewed in HTML online at the f=0Aollowing address:=0A- =0A- - - - -
- - - http://www.matro=0Anics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm=0A=0A=0A- - -
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0A=0APLEASE READ.- This=0Adocument contains Kitfox-List policies and info
rmation=0Afor new and old s=0Aubscribers.- Understanding the Kitfox-List
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How to Subscribe and Unsubscribe ***=0A*****************************=0A**
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edistributed to everyone curren=0Atly subscribed=0A- to the List.=0A=
0A=0A*********************************=0A********************=0A*** SPA
M Fighter - You Must be Subscribed to Post **=0A*=0A*********************
********************************=0A=0A- When a n=0Aew post is received
by the system, the From: line of the message=0A- is c=0Ahecked and compar
ed against the current subscription list.- If the=0A- =0Aemail address is
found, the message is passed on to the List Processor.=0A=0A- If the ema
il address isn't found in the current list of subscribers, it=0A=0A- is d
umped.- This serves to very effectively thwart 99% of the SPAM=0Athat=0A-
gets posted to the Lists.=0A=0A- Remember, however, that the =0Asyntax
of your email address is very important=0A- with regard to the con=0Afig
uration of your email application such as Outlook=0A- or Eudora.- Fo=0Ar
example, the following two email addresses may be=0A- functionally equi
=0Avalent, but only one would pass the Matronics Email SPAM=0A- test depe
ndi=0Ang on which was syntax was subscribed to the given List:=0A=0A- -
- =0A- - - - - - smith@machine.domain.com=0A=0A- - - - - =0A- - - - sm
ith@domain.com=0A=0A- Either email address syntax is al=0Aright, just b
e sure that you configure=0A- your email application to matc=0Ah *exactly
* the address you've subscibed to =0A- the List.=0A=0A=0A******=0A*
*******************************=0A*** Enclosure Support on the Lists ***
=0A=0A**************************************=0A=0A- Limited posting o
f enclo=0Asures such as pictures, documents, and spreadsheets=0A- is supp
orted on t=0Ahe Lists.- There are a number of restrictions, and these=0A-
are detail=0Aed below.- Please abide by the rules put forth regarding the
=0A- conten=0At of enclosures.=0A=0A- These are some of the features
and limits of encl=0Aosures on the Matronics =0A- Lists:=0A=0A- 1) En
closures will only be p=0Aosted to the Real Time version of the Lists.=0A
=0A- 2) Enclosures will NO=0AT be included in the Daily Digest version of
the Lists.=0A=0A- 3) Enclosu=0Ares WILL BE forwarded on to the BBS For
um Web site.=0A=0A- 4) Enclosures =0Awill NOT be appended to the Archiv
es.=0A=0A- 5) Enclosures will NOT be av=0Aailable in the List Browse fe
ature.=0A=0A- 6) Only the following file typ=0Aes and extensions will b
e allowed:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - bmp=0Adoc dwg dxf gif jpg pdf png txt x
ls=0A=0A- - - All other enclosures =0Atypes will be rejected and email
returned to=0A- - - sender.- The e=0Anclosure types listed above are rela
tively safe from=0A- - - a virus =0Astandpoint and don't pose a particula
rly large security risk.=0A=0A- 7) !=0A! All incoming enclosures will b
e scanned for viruses prior to posting=0A=0A- - - to the List.- This is d
one in real time and will not slow dow=0An=0A- - - the process of posting
the message !!=0A=0A=0A- Here are =0Asome rules for posting enclosur
es.- Failure to abide by these rules=0A=0A=0A- could result in the remo
val of a subscriber's email address from the Li=0Asts.=0A=0A- 1) Pay at
tention to what you are posting!!- Make sure that =0Athe files=0A- - - yo
u are enclosing aren't HUGE (greater that 1MB).=0A- Remember that there=0
A- - - are still people checking they're ema=0Ail via dial up modem.- If yo
u post=0A- - - 30MB worth of pictures, =0Ayou are placing an unnecessary
burden on these=0A- - - folks and the =0Arest of us, for that matter.=0
A=0A- 2) SCALE YOUR PICTURES DOWN!!!- I d=0Aon't want to see huge 3000 x
2000=0A- - - pictures getting posted tha=0At are 3 or 4MB each.- This is
just =0A- - - unacceptable.- Use a =0Aprogram such as Photoshop to scale
the picture=0A- - - down to someth=0Aing on the order of 800 x 600 and tr
y to keep the=0A- - - file size t=0Ao less-than 200KB, preferably much le
ss.=0A=0A- - - Microsoft has a r=0Aeally awesome utility available for
free that allows=0A- - - you to R=0Aight-Click on a picture in Explorer a
nd automatically =0A- - - scale =0Ait down and resave it.- This is a grea
t utility - get it, use it!=0A- =0A- - http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp
/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.=0Amspx=0A- - - Look for the link "Image
Resizer"=0A=0A- 3) !! This wo=0Auld seem to go without saying, but I'l
l say it anyway.- Do not=0A- - =0A- post anything that would be considere
d offensive by your grandmother.=0A=0A- - - And you know what I'm saying;
I don't want to see anything e=0Aven =0A- - - questionable. !!=0A=0A
- 4) REMEMBER THIS: If you post =0Aa 1MB enclosure to a List with 1000 memb
ers=0A- - - subscribed, your =0A1MB enclosure must be resent 1000 times a
mounting=0A- - - to 1MB X 10=0A00 = 1 Gigabyte of network traffic!!- BE
CAREFUL and =0A- - - BE =0ACOURTEOUS!=0A=0A- Also see the section be
low on the Matronics Photo and F=0Aile Share where=0A- you can have your
files and photos posted on the Matr=0Aonics web server=0A- for long time
viewing and availability.=0A=0A=0A****=0A***************=0A*** Dige
st Mode ***=0A*******************=0A=0A- Each d=0Aay, starting at 12
midnight PST US, a new 'digest' will be started.=0A- T=0Ahis digest will
contain the same information that is currently appended =0A=0A- to the ar
chive file.- It has all of the headers except for the "From:=0A"=0A- and
"Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator cons=0Aisting
=0A- of a line of underscores.=0A=0A- Each day at 23:55 PST US, =0Ath
e day's messages as described above will be=0A- combined and sent as a
=0Asingle message to everyone on the digest email list.=0A=0A- To subsc
ribe =0Ato the digest list, use the same subscription web form =0A- descr
ibed abo=0Ave, and just select the Digest version of the List.=0A=0A- -
- - =0A- - - - http://www.matronics.com/subscribe=0A=0A- Note that you
*=0Acan* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest versions=0A- of t
he Li=0Ast at the same time.- This is perfectly acceptable.=0A=0A- Now
some cav=0Aeats:=0A=0A- * Messages sent to "kitfox-list-digest" will be
forwarded to=0Athe standard=0A- - email list.- In other words, you canno
t post mess=0Aages only to the=0A- - digest List.=0A=0A- * If you are
subscribed to=0Aboth the regular List and the digest List, you=0A- - wil
l receive the =0Arealtime postings as well as the digest at the end of=0A
- - the day.=0A=0A=0A- * If you reply to the digest email, your message
will be forwarded t=0Ao the=0A- - normal list associated with the digest
.- Important Note:=0A- Please change=0A- - the subject line to reflect th
e topic of your r=0Aesponse!- Also, please =0A- - *do not include all or
most of the dige=0Ast in your reply*.=0A=0A=0A***********************
*****=0A*** List Digest B=0Arowser ***=0A****************************
=0A=0A- An archive of all the Li=0Ast Digests can be found online in ei
ther plain text=0A- or HTML format.=0A- These archives contain the exact
Digest that was posted to=0A- the Di=0Agest email list on the given day.-
The Digest Archives can be found=0A-=0Aat the following location: =0A
=0A- - - - - - - - http://ww=0Aw.matronics.com/digest=0A=0A=0A*****
************************************=0A=0A*** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Messag
e Flag ***=0A*******************************=0A**********=0A=0A- At t
imes, your message may concern something that is re=0Avelent only to a very
=0A=0A- small number of persons or to a limited area=0A, and you may no
t wish to archive=0A=0A- it.- In such a case, simply pu=0At the followi
ng phrase anywhere in the =0A- message:=0A=0A- - - -=0A- - - - do not
archive=0A=0A- Your message will not be appended =0Ato the archive, bu
t will be sent to List =0A- email distribution as norma=0Al.=0A=0A=
0A**********************************************=0A***** READ THIS=0A- Au
tomatic Unsubscribes *****=0A*****************************************=0A
*****=0A=0A- Note that if your email address begins to cause problems s
uc=0Ah as bounced=0A- email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your
addr=0Aess will be promptly=0A- removed from the List.- If you discover
that y=0Aou are no longer receiving=0A- messages from the Kitfox-List, go
to the f=0Aollowing Web page, and look=0A- for your email address and a
possible rea=0Ason for your removal.=0A=0A- The Matronics Email List us
es utility called=0Athe "Email Weasel" that =0A- automatically looks thou
gh the day's bounce=0Ad email for addresses that =0A- caused problems due
to common things like=0A"user is unknown", "mailbox =0A- full", etc.- If
the Email Weasel remo=0Aves your email address from the =0A- Lists you w
ill find record of it at =0Athe following URL:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - htt
p://www.matronic=0As.com/unsubscribed=0A=0A- If the problem listed on t
he web site above has=0Abeen resolved, please feel =0A- free to resubscri
be to the Lists of your=0Achoice.=0A=0A=0A***************************
****=0A*** List Member Informat=0Aion ***=0A***************************
****=0A=0A- If you have not done so =0Aalready, please email me your ph
one numbers and =0A- paper mail address i=0An the following format:=0A
=0A- - - - - - - - smith@somehost=0A.com=0A- - - - - - - - Joe Smith=
0A- - - - - - =0A- - 123 Airport Lane=0A- - - - - - - - Tower, CA 91234-
=0A1234=0A- - - - - - - - 098-765-1234 w=0A- - - - -=0A- - - 123-456-78
90 h=0A=0A- Please forward this information to the=0Afollowing email ad
dress:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - requests@mat=0Aronics.com=0A=0A- I have
a file of such things, that I typically use to c=0Aontact you when =0A-
there are problems with your email address.- The i=0Anformation will NOT
=0A- be used for any other commercial purpose.=0A=0A=0A=0A*********
*******************************=0A*** Realtime Web Email List B=0Arowsing
***=0A****************************************=0A=0A- Recent mess=0A
ages posted to the Kitfox-List are also made available on=0A- the Web for
=0Arealtime browsing.- Seven days worth of back postings are=0A- availabl
=0Ae with this feature.- The messages can be sorted by Subject, =0A- Auth
o=0Ar, Date, or Message Thread.- The Realtime List Browser indexes are =0
A-=0Aupdated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45.- You can also reply to a me
ss=0Aage=0A=0A- or start a new message directly from the List Browser I
nterfac=0Ae (coming soon).=0A- You do not have to be subscribed to the gi
ven list t=0Ao use the List=0A- Browser Interface in view-mode.=0A=0A
- - - - =0A- - - - http://www.matronics.com/browselist/kitfox-list=0A=0
A=0A***=0A****************************************=0A*** Web Forums Bul
letin Board In=0Aterface ***=0A******************************************
*=0A=0A- A phpBB =0ABBS web Forums front end is available for all Kitfo
x-List content.=0A- co=0Antent.- The Forums contain all of the same conte
nt available via the emai=0Al=0A=0A- distribution and found on the vari
ous archive viewing formats su=0Ach as the =0A- List Browse, etc.- Any po
sts on the web Forums will be c=0Aross posted to the =0A- respective emai
l List, and posts to the Email Lis=0At will be cross posted to =0A- the w
eb Forums.=0A=0A- You may view all =0AList content on the Forums withou
t any special login.=0A- If you wish to =0Apost a message via the Web For
um interface, however, you=0A- will need to=0ARegister.- This is a simple
process that takes only a few=0A- minutes.=0A- A link to the Registratio
n page can be found at the top of the=0A- ma=0Ain web Forums page.- Note
that registering on the Forum web site also=0A=0A- enables you to send em
ail posts to the Lists as well.- You will also =0Aneed to=0A=0A- Subscr
ibe to the respective Email List as described above =0Ato receive the=0A-
Email Distribution of the List, however.=0A=0A- The =0AMatroincs Email
List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following URL:=0A=0A=0A- - - -
- - - - http://forums.matronics.com=0A=0A=0A****=0A*****************
************=0A*** Matronics Email List Wiki ***=0A*******=0A**********
****************=0A=0AIn an attempt to make it easy to store and =0Afin
d structured and often accessed =0Ainformation, Matronics has installed
=0Aa Wiki at:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - http://wiki.matronics.com=0A=0A=
0AThe Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain useful inf=0Ao
rmation =0Afor other users of the mailing lists and web site. Unlike an o
r=0Adinary web page=0A=0Awhere the content needs to be submitted to Mat
ronics f=0Aor inclusion, the Wiki =0Apermits the users to construct their
own pages an=0Ad have them visible immediately.=0A=0AWhile constructin
g pages for the Wiki=0Ais not difficult, some may not be =0Acomfortable b
uilding pages.- In tha=0At case, simply prepare the text and any =0Aimage
s and email it to:=0A=0A-=0A- - - - - - - wiki-support@matronics.com=
0A=0AOne of the vol=0Aunteers on that list will take your submission and
construct =0Aa Wiki page=0Afor you.=0A=0AOften someone produces a par
ticularly useful posting in emai=0Al one one of the =0ALists that would b
e of general interest. In that case M=0Aatronics may take that =0Apost an
d convert it into a Wiki page.=0A=0A=0A***=0A******************=0A*
** List Archives ***=0A*********************=0A=0A-=0AA file containi
ng of all of the previous postings to the Kitfox-List is=0A=0A- available
on line.- The archive file information is available via the=0A=0A- Web a
nd FTP in a number of forms.- Each are briefly described bel=0Aow:=0A=0
A=0A- * Kitfox-List.FAQ =0A=0A- - - - - - - Latest ve=0Arsion of the
Kitfox-List Frequently Asked Question =0A- - - - - =0A- - page (this docu
ment).=0A=0A- * Kitfox-Archive.digest.complete =0A=0A=0A- - - - - -
- Complete file with most of the email header in=0Afo removed and =0A- -
- - - - - page breaks inserted between =0Amessages.=0A=0A- * Kitfox-Ar
chive.digest.vol-??- =0A=0A- - - - =0A- - - Same as the file above, but
broken up into small sections that =0A=0A- - - - - - - can more easily h
andled.=0A=0A- * Kitfox-A=0Archive.digest.complete.zip =0A=0A- - -
- - - - Same as the Kitf=0Aox-Archive.digest.complete file above, but =0A
- - - - - - - i=0An PKZIP format.- Use "binary" data transfer methods.=0A
=0A- * Kitfox-Ar=0Achive.digest.complete.Z =0A=0A- - - - - - - Same a
s the Kitfox-=0AArchive.digest.complete file above, but in =0A- - - - - -
- U=0ANIX compress format.- Use "binary" data transfer methods.=0A=0A
=0A- Dow=0Anload Via FTP=0A- ----------------=0A=0A- The archive fi
le is available=0Avia anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com=0A- in the "/p
ub/Archives" dire=0Actory.- It is updated daily and can be found in=0A- a
number of formats=0Aas described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.
)=0A=0A- - - =0A- - - - - - ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives=0A
=0A=0A- Do=0Awnload Via Web=0A- ----------------=0A=0A- The archi
ves are also availa=0Able via a web listing.- These can be found=0A- towa
rd the bottom of the=0Afollowing web page:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - - http:
//www.ma=0Atronics.com/archives=0A=0A=0A*****************************
*************=0A*=0A** Complete List Web Archive Browsing ***=0A*******
************************=0A***********=0A=0A- All messages posted to th
e Kitfox-List are also availa=0Able using the=0A- Email List Archive Brow
sing feature.- With this utili=0Aty, all messages=0A- in the List are ind
exed, and individual sub-archives=0Acan be browsed.=0A=0A- - - - - - -
- - http://www.matron=0Aics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?Kitfox=0A=0A
=0A**************************=0A***************=0A**** High-Speed Archi
ve Search Engine ***=0A*************=0A****************************=0A
=0A- You can use the custom, high-performa=0Ance Matronics Email List Sea
rch Engine=0A- to quickly locate and browse a=0Any messages that have bee
n posted to the=0A- List.- The Engine allows t=0Ahe user to easily search
any of the currently=0A- available List archives=0A.=0A=0A- - - - -
- - - - http://www.matronics.com/search=0A=0A=0A=0A******************
**********=0A*** File and Photo Share ***=0A****=0A********************
****=0A=0A- With the Matronics Email List File and Ph=0Aoto Share you c
an share pictures=0A- and other data with members of the L=0Aist without
having to forward a =0A- copy of it to everyone.- To share =0Ayour Files
and Photos, simply email =0A- them to:=0A=0A- - - - =0A- - - - - pict
ures@matronics.com=0A=0A- !! ==> Please inclu=0Ading the following
information with each submission:=0A=0A- - - - =0A- - - - - 1) Email Li
sts that they are related to.=0A- - - =0A- - - - - - 2) Your Full Name.
=0A- - - - - - - =0A- - 3) Your Email Address.=0A- - - - - - - - - 4) O
ne=0Aline Subject description.=0A- - - - - - - - - 5) Multi-l=0Aine, mult
i-paragraph description of topic.=0A- - - - - - - =0A- - 6-x) One-line De
scription of each photo or file=0A=0A- Prior to p=0Aublic availability
of the files and photos, each will be scanned=0A- for =0Aviruses.- Please
also note that the process of making the files and=0A-=0Aphotos availabl
e on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to=0A=0A- process
them every few days.=0A=0A- Following the availability of =0Athe new P
hotoshare, an email message will be=0A- sent to the Email Lists =0Aenumer
ated in 1) above indicating that the new=0A- Share is available and=0Awha
t the direct URL to it is.=0A=0A- For a current list of available Pho
=0Atoshares, have a look at the Main=0A- Index Page:=0A=0A- - - - =0A
- - - - - http://www.matronics.com/photoshare=0A=0A=0A***********=0A*
**************=0A*** List Archive CDROM ***=0A*************************
*=0A=0A=0A- A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available tha
t cont=0Aains=0A- all of the archives since the beginning of each of the
Lists.-=0AThe archives=0A- for all of the Lists are included on the CD al
ong with =0Aa freeware search=0A- engine written by a list member.- The C
D is burne=0Ad the day you order it=0A- and will contain archive received
- up to the=0Alast minute.- They make =0A- great gifts!=0A=0A- - - -
- -=0A- - - http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM=0A=0A=0A***********
*****=0A******************=0A*** List Support Contributions ***=0A*****
************=0A*****************=0A=0A- The Matronics Lists are run *co
mpletely* through=0Athe support of it members.=0A- You won't find any Pop
UpAds, flashing Ban=0Aner ads, or any other form of=0A- annoying commerci
alism on either the Em=0Aail Messages or the List web pages=0A- associate
d with the Matronics Emai=0Al Lists.- Every year during November=0A- I ru
n a low-key, low-pressure =0A"Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month,=0
A- I ask List members to make=0Aa Contribution in any amount with which the
y =0A- are comfortable.=0A=0A=0A- I will often offer free gifts with
certain contribution levels during t=0Ahe=0A- Fund Raiser to increase the
participation.- The gifts are usuall=0Ay donated=0A- by companies that a
re themselves List members.=0A=0A- You=0Ar Contributions go directly to
supporting the operation of the Lists=0A- =0Aincluding the high-speed, b
usiness-class Internet connection, server=0A- =0Asystem hardware and soft
ware upgrades, and to partially offset the many=0A=0A- many hours I spend
running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the=0A=0A- variety of se
rvices found here.=0A=0A- Generally Contributions ran=0Age from $20 to
$100 and are completely voluntary=0A- and non-compulsory.=0A- I ask only
that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains=0A- value from=0Athem, that t
hey make a Contribution of equal magnitude.=0A=0A- Contribut=0Aions are
accepted throughout the year, and if you've just =0A- subscribed=0A, fee
l free to make a Contribution when you've settled in.=0A=0A- The web=0A
site for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below.- There are=0A
=0A- a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, an
d=0A=0A- sending a personal check.=0A=0A- If you enjoy and value the
List, =0Awon't you make a Contribution today to=0A- support its continued
operatio=0An?=0A=0A- - - - - - - - - http://www.matronics.com/contri
=0Abutions=0A=0A- Thank you!=0A- Matt Dralle=0A- Email List Adminis
trato=0Ar=0A=0A=0A***************************************************
**************=0A*************=0A- - - - - - - - - - Kitfox-List Usage G
=0Auidelines=0A**********************************************************
*****=0A***************=0A=0AThe following details the official Usage G
uidelines fo=0Ar the Kitfox-List.=0AYou are encouraged to read it careful
ly, and to abide =0Aby the rules therein.=0AFailure to use the Kitfox-Lis
t in the manner descri=0Abed below may result =0Ain the removal of the su
bscribers from the List.=0A=0A=0A=0AKitfox-List Policy Statement=0A
=0AThe purpose of the Kitfox-List is t=0Ao provide a forum of discussion
for=0Athings related to this particular dis=0Acussion group.- The List's
goals=0Aare to serve as an information resourc=0Ae to its members; to del
iver=0Ahigh-quality content; to provide moral suppo=0Art; to foster camar
aderie=0Aamong its members; and to support safe operatio=0An.- Reaching t
hese goals =0Arequires the participation and cooperation of=0Aeach and ev
ery member of =0Athe List.- To this end, the following guidel=0Aines have
been established:=0A=0A=0A- Please keep all posts related to the =0A
List at some level.- Do not submit=0A- posts concerning computer viruse
=0As, urban legends, random humor, long=0A- lost buddies' phone numbers,
etc=0A. etc.=0A=0A- THINK carefully before you write.- Ask yourself if
your pos=0At will be=0A- relevant to everyone.- If you have to wonder abo
ut that, =0ADON'T send it.=0A=0A- Remember that your post will be inclu
ded for posterit=0Ay in an archive=0A- that is growing in size at an extr
aordinary rate.- =0ATry to be concise and=0A- terse in your posts.- Avoid
overly wordy and =0Alengthy posts and=0A- responses.=0A=0A- Keep you
r signature brief.- Ple=0Aase include your name, email address,=0A- aircr
aft type/tail number, and =0Ageographic location.- A short line=0A- about
where you are in the build=0Aing process is also nice.- Avoid=0A- bulky
signatures with character gr=0Aaphics; they consume unnecessary=0A- space
in the archive.=0A=0A- DON'T p=0Aost requests to the List for informat
ion when that info is=0A- easily obt=0Aainable from other widely availabl
e sources.- Consult the=0A- web page =0Aor FAQ first.=0A=0A- If you w
ant to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject=0A:" line of=0A- your resp
onse the same as that of the original post.- Th=0Ais makes it=0A- easy to
find threads in the archive.=0A=0A- When respondi=0Ang, NEVER quote th
e *entire* original post in your=0A- response.- DO us=0Ae lines from the
original post to help "tune in" the=0A- reader to the to=0Apic at hand, b
ut be selective.- The impact that=0A- quoting the entire =0Aoriginal post
has on the size of the archive =0A- can not be overstated!=0A=0A=0A-
When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT=0A=0A-
then go ahead and reply to the List.- Be aware that clicking the=0A=0A-
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your=0A=0A-
response to the original poster.- You might have to actively addre=0Ass=
0A- your response with the original poster's email address.=0A=0A- DO
=0ANOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something=0A- to
ad=0Ad that is relevant and has a broad appeal.- "Way to go!", "I=0A- ag
ree"=0A, and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent=0A-
to the=0Aoriginal poster directly, rather than to the List at large.=0A
=0A- When re=0Asponding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need
to=0A- comment=0Aon every last point in their posts, unless you can trul
y=0A- contribute =0Asomething valuable.=0A=0A- Feel free to disagree
with other viewpoints, BUT=0Akeep your tone=0A- polite and respectful.- D
on't make snide comments, =0Apersonally attack=0A- other listers, or take
the moral high ground on an =0Aobviously=0A- controversial issue.- This
will only cause a pointless de=0Abate that=0A- will hurt feelings, waste
bandwidth and resolve nothing.=0A=0A=0A- Occasional posts by vendors or
individuals who are regularly =0A- su=0Abscribed to a given List are con
sidered acceptable.- Posts by =0A- List=0Amembers promoting their respect
ive products or items for sale =0A- shoul=0Ad be of a friendly, informal
nature, and should not resemble =0A- a typic=0Aal SPAM message.- The List
isn't about commercialism, but =0A- is about=0Asharing information and k
nowledge.- This applies to =0A- everyone, inc=0Aluding those who provide
products to the entire =0A- community.- Inform=0Aal presentation and mode
ration should be the =0A- operatives with respect=0Ato advertising on the
Lists.=0A=0A-------=0A=0A=0A[This is an automated po=0Asting.]
=0A=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Me
s=0Asage 21- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 11:25
:19 PM P=0AST US=0AFrom: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>=0ASubject:
Kitfox-List: Of=0Aficial Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines=0A=0A=0ADear Li
sters,=0A=0APlease read =0Aover the Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines below.
- The complete=0AKitfox-List =0AFAQ including these Usage Guidelines can
be found at the=0Afollowing URL:=0A=0A=0A- http://www.matronics.com/F
AQs/Kitfox-List.FAQ.html=0A=0AThank you=0A,=0A=0AMatt Dralle=0AMa
tronics Email List Administrator=0A=0A=0A***********=0A**************
*****************************************************=0A- =0A- - - - - -
- - - Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines=0A********=0A*************************
*********************************************=0A=0A=0AThe following det
ails the official Usage Guidelines for the Kitfox-List.=0A=0AYou are enco
uraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules there=0Ain.=0AFail
ure to use the Kitfox-List in the manner described below may resu=0Alt =0
Ain the removal of the subscribers from the List.=0A=0A=0AKitfox-List
=0APolicy Statement=0A=0AThe purpose of the Kitfox-List is to provide
a forum =0Aof discussion for=0Athings related to this particular discussi
on group.- =0AThe List's goals=0Aare to serve as an information resource
to its members; =0Ato deliver=0Ahigh-quality content; to provide moral su
pport; to foster cama=0Araderie=0Aamong its members; and to support safe
operation.- Reaching the=0Ase goals =0Arequires the participation and coo
peration of each and every me=0Amber of =0Athe List.- To this end, the fo
llowing guidelines have been est=0Aablished:=0A=0A=0A- Please keep al
l posts related to the List at some level=0A.- Do not submit=0A- posts co
ncerning computer viruses, urban legends, =0Arandom humor, long=0A- lost
buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.=0A=0A- THIN=0AK carefully before you
write.- Ask yourself if your post will be=0A- re=0Alevant to everyone.- I
f you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.=0A=0A=0A- Remember that
your post will be included for posterity in an archive=0A=0A- that is gr
owing in size at an extraordinary rate.- Try to be conci=0Ase and=0A- ter
se in your posts.- Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts a=0And=0A- respon
ses.=0A=0A- Keep your signature brief.- Please include you=0Ar name, em
ail address,=0A- aircraft type/tail number, and geographic loca=0Ation.-
A short line=0A- about where you are in the building process is =0Aalso n
ice.- Avoid=0A- bulky signatures with character graphics; they co=0Ansume
unnecessary=0A- space in the archive.=0A=0A- DON'T post requests to
=0Athe List for information when that info is=0A- easily obtainable from
ot=0Aher widely available sources.- Consult the=0A- web page or FAQ first
.=0A=0A=0A- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" li
ne of=0A=0A- your response the same as that of the original post.- This m
akes it=0A=0A- easy to find threads in the archive.=0A=0A- When respo
nding, NEVER q=0Auote the *entire* original post in your=0A- response.- D
O use lines fro=0Am the original post to help "tune in" the=0A- reader to
the topic at hand=0A, but be selective.- The impact that=0A- quoting the
entire original po=0Ast has on the size of the archive =0A- can not be o
verstated!=0A=0A- When=0Athe poster asks you to respond to him/her pers
onally, DO NOT=0A- then go=0Aahead and reply to the List.- Be aware that
clicking the=0A- "reply" b=0Autton on your mail package does not necessar
ily send your=0A- response to=0Athe original poster.- You might have to a
ctively address=0A- your resp=0Aonse with the original poster's email add
ress.=0A=0A- DO NOT use the List t=0Ao respond to a post unless you hav
e something=0A- to add that is relevant=0Aand has a broad appeal.- "Way t
o go!", "I=0A- agree", and "Congratulat=0Aions" are all responses that ar
e better sent=0A- to the original poster d=0Airectly, rather than to the
List at large.=0A=0A- When responding to others=0A' posts, avoid the fe
eling that you need to=0A- comment on every last poi=0Ant in their posts,
unless you can truly=0A- contribute something valuable=0A.=0A=0A- Fe
el free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone=0A=0A- poli
te and respectful.- Don't make snide comments, personally attack=0A=0A- o
ther listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously=0A- c=0Aontro
versial issue.- This will only cause a pointless debate that=0A- w=0Aill
hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.=0A=0A- Occasional p
=0Aosts by vendors or individuals who are regularly =0A- subscribed to a
giv=0Aen List are considered acceptable.- Posts by =0A- List members prom
otin=0Ag their respective products or items for sale =0A- should be of a
friendl=0Ay, informal nature, and should not resemble =0A- a typical SPAM
message.=0A- The List isn't about commercialism, but =0A- is about shari
ng informa=0Ation and knowledge.- This applies to =0A- everyone, includin
g those who=0Aprovide products to the entire =0A- community.- Informal pr
esentation =0Aand moderation should be the =0A- operatives with respect t
o advertising =0Aon the Lists.=0A=0A-------=0A=0A=0A[This is an a
utomated posting.]=0A=0Ado =0A=============
============0A=0A=0A=0A- - - =0A=0A______
__________________________- Message 3- ________________________________
_____=0A=0A=0ATime: 03:55:05 AM PST US=0AFrom: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrun
ner.com>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver- - AKFLYERBOB=0A=0A
=0A- - - -Equipment protection-=0A=0A=0A- - - SKUFF SAVER Item
#TYC 7210=0A- - - $2.95 per foot=0A=0A- - - Protect the tops of
your new skis or snowboard from scratches and =0Agouges. This clear tough
Dupont Surlyn tape is backed with a self-adhesive =0Afilm for easy applicat
ion and good bonding. It's 14" wide...enough to span =0Aany single snowboar
d or pair of skis and is sold by the linear foot. Simply =0Aorder the lengt
h you need and trim the width with scissors to fit your =0Aneeds.- - Qu
antity:=0A=0A--------------------------------------------------------------
------------=0A=0A=0A----- Original Message ----- =0AFrom: "AKFLYERBOB" <r.
wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>=0ASent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 9:49 PM=0ASubje
ct: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver=0A=0A=0A> <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>=0A>
=0A> Larry=0A> What material are you talking about?=0A> I'm sure every one
would like to know.=0A> Bob=0A>=0A> --------=0A> Bob Wolfe..Soldotna, Alask
a=0A> KF Mod I and III=0A>=0A>=0A> Read this topic online here:=0A>=0A> htt
p://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228098#228098=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
---=0A=0A=0AChecked by AVG - http://www.avg.com=0A6:02 PM=0A=0A____________
____________________- Message 4- _____________________________________
=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:02:37 AM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A=0A=0AI think- the amount of
"curl down" can be controlled by the amount- =0Athat you press down betw
een the tubes themselves....simply press more- =0Ainto the gap before pre
ssing onto the tubes and it should stay there.- =0AI usually just lay it
over the gap equally spaced on both sides and- =0Apress it down. I didn't
get too worried about whether it went up or- =0Adown, although down woul
d be preferred.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJab
iru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignitio
n system=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 9:08 PM, pat
rick reilly wrote:=0A=0A> Larry, Thanks for the web link. I ordered 5 feed
just to have on- =0A> hand. That price for 14" wide clear tape is unreal.
There are many- =0A> times I wanted some of that tape to protect paint o
n a car,- =0A> motorcycle tank, etc. I'll use it on the gap seal, Alla Ly
nn- =0A> Matteson top side only. Lynn, if that curls down into the gap,
- =0A> rather than up, I don't know why anybody would use any other metho
d.=0A> do not archive=0A>=0A> Pat Reilly=0A> Mod 3 582 Rebuild=0A> Rockford
, IL=0A>=0A>=0A> > From: asq@roadrunner.com=0A> > To: kitfox-list@matronics
.com=0A> > Subject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A> > Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009
20:38:03 -0500=0A> >=0A> <asq@roadrunner.com>=0A> >=0A> > Just received thi
s. Does it sound like the same material? Larry=0A> >=0A> > ----- Original M
essage -----=0A> > From: <info@tognar.com>=0A> > To: "Larry Huntley" <asq@r
oadrunner.com>=0A> > Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM=0A> > Subject:
Re: ski saver=0A> >=0A> >=0A> > >=0A> > > Yes,=0A> > > check this link on
our bags/racks page=0A> > > http://www.tognar.com/ =0A> bags_racks_boot_ski
_binding_snowboard_accessory.html=0A> > > The top item is the scuff saver t
ape,=0A> > > Thanks,=0A> > > Cat=0A> > > www.tognar.com=0A> > >=0A> > >=0A>
> >> Do you still have "ski saver" tape? Larry Huntley- =0A> asq@roadrun
ner.com=0A> > > Ye=0A> > >=0A> >=0A> >=0A> >- =0A> ----------------------
------------------------------------------------ =0A> ----------=0A> >=0A>
>=0A> >=0A> > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com=0A> > 6:02 PM====
==================0A> >======
============0A> >=0A> >=0A> >=0A>=0A> =====
===== _- =0A> =================
================== _- =0A> contribution
_- =0A> ======================
=============0A=0A=0A______________________________
__- Message 5- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 07:0
1:09 AM PST US=0AFrom: Catz631@aol.com=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator
Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0ANoel,=0AIf you are
gap sealing your rudder,John McBean has a very nice contoured =0Ahard foam
for that purpose. I bought some of it and glued it to the horizontal=0A=0As
tab then covered it with 6 inch polyfiber tape. I painted it and it looks n
ice=0A..=0A- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - Dick Maddux=0A- - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Pensacola,Fl=0A
**************Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to
=0Astocks and so much more. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)=0A
=0A________________________________- Message 6- _______________________
______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 07:03:47 AM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re:
Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0AFrom: "lowflyer" <buddcr@yahoo.com>=0A=0A
=0AGuys,=0A=0APlease take a look at the following website.=0A=0Ahttp://www.
aerographic.com/gap_seal.htm=0A=0A=0AThese gap seals are used on Pitts and
Eagle aircraft. They have been used on many=0Aothers as well.- There not
too expensive, easy to install and they are removable=0Aand should last a l
ong, long time!- You can cut to length for your application=0Aand for fit
ting around hinges. My buddy uses them on his beautiful Pitts=0AS2B.- I w
ill probably be getting some soon.=0A=0AChris Budd=0AN53RJ Kitfox IV Speeds
ter=0AVW 2180 240hrs=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forum
s.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228155#228155=0A=0A=0A___________________
_____________- Message 7- _____________________________________=0A=0A
=0ATime: 07:05:18 AM PST US=0AFrom: Catz631@AOL.COM=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-L
ist: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0ALowlead,=0AThat looks like an "X" j
ob and a good one at that. I will have to try that =0Awhen mine peels off.
=0A- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - Dick Maddux=0A- - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - Pensacola,Fl=0A**************Stay up to date on th
e latest news - from sports scores to =0Astocks and so much more. (http://a
ol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)=0A=0A________________________________
- Message 8- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 07:34:
43 AM PST US=0AFrom: Rexinator <rexinator@gmail.com>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-
List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AI think had a small sample
sheet of this material back in 1984 which I =0Aused to protect the front of
a "chin" fairing on my Honda Interceptor. =0AIt had the characteristics yo
u describe, clear, very tough, designed for =0Aprotecting front of sporty c
ars paint from small rock chips.=0A=0ARex=0AColorado M2/582=0Ado not archiv
e=0A=0A=0ALowlead wrote:=0A>=0A> Thanks Rex (and Lynn)! I wish I could say
that it's this consistent along the=0Aentire length of the gap, but it's no
t. The gaps tend to be smaller on the outboard=0Aends due to the way the ti
ghtened fabric act on the stab and elevator frames.=0A=0A>=0A> Installation
is hard to describe but not that hard to do. One thing nice about=0Athis t
ape is that it's very pliable and the adhesive is not super-aggressive=0Aat
first. The tape is applied across the gap (we'll say the top side first) w
ith=0Aa very slight 'drape' down and then firmly pressed onto the LE/TE tub
es.=0AThen the bottom side tape is applied with a very slight drape up (I u
sed a pc=0Aof 1/4" tube to force the drape up) and then pressed onto the LE
/TE tubes. The=0Atwo tapes stick to one another like a champ but leaves a t
riangular 'bubble'=0Arunning the entire length . I used a wooden tongue dep
ressor and fingers to press=0Athe top and bottom tapes together to eliminat
e the bubble. (see attached).=0AIt's tough stuff and stretches well enough
to get a tight installation. There's=0Ano worries about tearing or punching
through with the tongue depressor.=0A>=0A> The control surface (elevator o
r rudder) must be in the neutral position when=0Atape is applied or else a
tension 'bias' might get built into the installation=0A(ex: rudder now pull
s left or right due to tape..)=0A> Hope this makes sense...=0A>=0A> Dan H.
=0A>=0A>=0A> rexinator wrote:=0A>- =0A>> That's exactly what I was trying
to describe with my- >-<- symbol and my =0A>> little drawn image file.
- I agree with Lynn that it's a nice job. Can =0A>> you elaborate on how
you applied so well?=0A>>=0A>> Rex=0A>> Colorado M2/582=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>
- - =0A>=0A>=0A> Read this topic online here:=0A>=0A> http://forums.mat
ronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228125#228125=0A>=0A>=0A> Attachments: =0A>=0A
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal2_183.jpg=0A>=0A>=0A>- =0A=0A
=0A________________________________- Message 9- _______________________
______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 07:34:43 AM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re:
air worthiness=0AFrom: "dcsfoto" <david@kelm.com>=0A=0A=0AA DAR with the c
orrect function code can issue a replacement.=0AAll you need is to have him
look in the FAA files (cost us $3.00) obtain the info=0Afrom the original.
=0Ado a letter requesting a replacement.=0A=0ADavid=0A=0A=0ARead this topic
online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228163#228
163=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message 10- _____________
_______________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 09:41:55 AM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-
List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0AFrom: "darinh" <gerns25@netscape.
net>=0A=0A=0AJohn,=0A=0AAs some have said, use the 3M clear product.- I w
ould bet you can find a car accessory=0Ashop that applies the "clear bra" t
o cars and they will sell you this=0Astuff by the foot.- I found several
local places that had it in widths of 6",=0A12", 24", etc.- I bought the
24" wide stuff and cut it to the length and width=0AI needed for the intend
ed use.- I also applied it to the top side and wrapped=0Ait around the fr
ont of my landing gear for protection and to the front of the=0Astruts for
about the first 4' from the fuse.=0A=0AThe product is very tough, UV resist
ant and crystal clear...the adhesive works=0Aperfectly on painted surfaces
and can be applied using a shot or two of Windex=0Aand a small squeegee to
remove any air bubbles=0A=0A--------=0ADarin Hawkes=0ASeries 7 =0A914 Turbo
=0AKaysville, Utah=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.
matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228179#228179=0A=0A=0A_____________________
___________- Message 11- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0AT
ime: 10:54:57 AM PST US=0AFrom: "George Wells" <georgewells@roadrunner.com>
=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver=0A=0ADidn't you guys see my post fro
m 1 or 2 days ago where I talked about my =0Ause of Ski Saver Tape and wher
e to get it ??=0AGeorge=0A=0A________________________________- Message 12
- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 03:58:02 PM PST US
=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Kitfox owner location map=0AFrom: "Paul A. Franz,
P.E." <paul@eucleides.com>=0A=0A=0AHere's a great resource=0A=0Ahttp://www.
frappr.com/kitfox=0A=0AIt's a dynamic push pin map with information about e
ach Kitfox. It covers the whole=0Aworld. This has Kitfoxen not just from th
e mail list but everyone.=0A=0APut your push pin on the map!=0A=0AIf everyo
ne did, you'd be able to find others in your area easily.=0A=0A--------=0AP
aul A. Franz, P.E.=0ARegistration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT=0AEngine/Prop
- Rotax 914/NSI CAP=0ABellevue WA=0A425.241.1618 Cell=0A425.440.9505 Office
=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/view
topic.php?p=228237#228237=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Mes
sage 13- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 04:45:12 PM P
ST US=0AFrom: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfo
x-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal- Test=0AReport=0A
=0A=0ADick=2C Great picture of the tail of your plane. But=2C I'll be d
amned if I=0Acan see any gap seal. I Like your TR3 also.=0Ado not archivePa
t ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL=0A=0A=0AFrom: Catz631@aol.comDate
: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 09:57:11 -0500Subject: Re: Kit=0Afox-List: Elevator G
ap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test ReportTo: kit=0Afox-list@matronic
s.com=0ANoel=2C=0AIf you are gap sealing your rudder=2CJohn McBean has
a very nice contoured=0Ahard foam for that purpose. I bought some of it and
glued it to the horizo=0Antal stab then covered it with 6 inch polyfiber t
ape. I painted it and it l=0Aooks nice .=0A- - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Dick Maddux=0A
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - Pensacola=2CFl=0A=0AStay up to date on the latest news -
from sports scores to stocks and so mu=0Ach more.=0A=0A___________________
_____________- Message 14- ____________________________________=0A=0A
=0ATime: 05:09:11 PM PST US=0AFrom: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com
>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A=0A=0ALynn=2C Didn't you sa
y you have elavator at full down and then apply tape. =0AThis wouldn't requ
ire any pushing tape into groove. Or would having some ta=0Ape pushed into
groove insure the tape would curl into the groove when eleva=0Ator was rais
ed?Pat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From: lynnmatt@jp=0As.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver> Date: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 08:=0A58
:20 -0500> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > --> Kitfox-List message poste
=0Ad by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>> > I think the amount of "curl do
wn"=0Acan be controlled by the amount > that you press down between the tub
es th=0Aemselves....simply press more > into the gap before pressing onto t
he tubes=0Aand it should stay there. > I usually just lay it over the gap e
qually spa=0Aced on both sides and > press it down. I didn't get too worrie
d about wheth=0Aer it went up or > down=2C although down would be preferr
ed.> > Lynn Mattes=0Aon> Kitfox IV Speedster=2C taildragger> Jabiru 2200
=2C #2062=2C 605 hrs> Se=0Ansenich 62x46> Electroair direct-fire igniti
on system> New skis done and fl=0Aying> > > > > On Feb 1=2C 2009=2C at
9:08 PM=2C patrick reilly wrote:> > > =0ALarry=2C Thanks for the web li
nk. I ordered 5 feed just to have on > > hand=0A. That price for 14" wide c
lear tape is unreal. There are many > > times I =0Awanted some of that tape
to protect paint on a car=2C > > motorcycle tank=0A=2C etc. I'll use i
t on the gap seal=2C Alla Lynn > > Matteson top side onl=0Ay. Lynn=2C i
f that curls down into the gap=2C > > rather than up=2C I don't=0Aknow
why anybody would use any other method.> > do not archive> >> > Pat R=0Aeil
ly> > Mod 3 582 Rebuild> > Rockford=2C IL> >> >> >> >> > > From: asq@roa
=0Adrunner.com> > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > > Subject: Kitfox-List
: F=0Aw: ski saver> > > Date: Sun=2C 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500> > >> > >
--> Kitf=0Aox-List message posted by: "Larry Huntley" > > <asq@roadrunner.c
om>> > >> >=0A> Just received this. Does it sound like the same material? L
arry> > >> > =0A> ----- Original Message -----> > > From: <info@tognar.com>
> > > To: "Larry=0AHuntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> > > Sent: Sunday=2C Feb
ruary 01=2C 2009 7:5=0A4 PM> > > Subject: Re: ski saver> > >> > >> > > >>
> > > Yes=2C> > > > chec=0Ak this link on our bags/racks page> > > > htt
p://www.tognar.com/ > > bags_r=0Aacks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.
html> > > > The top item is the s=0Acuff saver tape=2C> > > > Thanks=2C
> > > > Cat> > > > www.tognar.com> > > >=0A> > > >> > > >> Do you still hav
e "ski saver" tape? Larry Huntley > > asq@r=0Aoadrunner.com> > > > Ye> > >
>> > >> > >> > > > > -------------------------=0A--------------------------
------------------- > > ----------> > >> > >> > >=0A> > > Checked by AVG -
http://www.avg.com> > > 6:02 PM========0A======
=========> > >=========0A=====
=====> > >> > >> > >> >> > ========0A=== _- >
> ====================0A====
============ _- > > contribution_- > > =0A===
=====================> _=0A==
> > > =0A=0A________________________________- Message 15- _____________
_______________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:27:16 PM PST US=0AFrom: Malcolm Br
ubaker <brubakermal@yahoo.com>=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox- broken
motor mount=0A=0Athe mount broke Ware it attaches to the vibration dampene
r on the rear pass=0Aenger side on my mod 2 w/582- 170 hrs airframe has thi
s happened to anybo=0Ady? i plan on having it gas welded by a local pilot/
welder - - malcolm=0A=0A--- On Mon, 2/2/09, George Wells <georgewells@roadr
unner.com> wrote:=0AFrom: George Wells <georgewells@roadrunner.com>=0ASubje
ct: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver=0A=0A=0ADidn't you guys see my post from 1 o
r 2 days ago =0Awhere I talked about my use of Ski Saver Tape-and where to
get it =0A??=0AGeorge=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A- - - =0A=0A____________
____________________- Message 16- ____________________________________
=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:44:07 PM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Posting videos=0A
From: "Paul Franz - Merlin GT" <paul@eucleides.com>=0A=0A=0AMaintaining vid
eo quality when posting is somewhat of a problem with YouTube. I=0Adiscover
ed this site which has few if any ads and the video quality is excellent.
=0A=0A<http://www.vimeo.com/2986295>=0A=0AThe format is very nice with thum
bnail images and a nice indexing scheme.=0A=0A-- =0APaul A. Franz=0ARegistr
ation/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT=0AEngine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP=0ABellev
ue WA=0A425.241.1618 Cell=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Messa
ge 17- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:39:27 PM PST
US=0AFrom: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List:
Re: Kitfox- broken motor mount=0A=0AJust a thought... I think after weld
ing the joint has to be normalized to=0Aprevent it from cracking in the joi
nt again.=0A=0A=0ANoel=0A=0A=0AFrom: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Malcolm=0AB
rubaker=0ASent: Monday, February 02, 2009 9:28 PM=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: R
e: Kitfox broken motor mount=0A=0A=0Athe mount broke Ware it attaches to th
e vibration dampener on the rear=0Apassenger side on my mod 2 w/582- 170
hrs airframe has this happened to=0Aanybody? i plan on having it gas welded
by a local pilot/ welder- - malcolm=0A=0A--- On Mon, 2/2/09, George We
lls <georgewells@roadrunner.com> wrote:=0A=0AFrom: George Wells <georgewell
s@roadrunner.com>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver=0A=0ADidn't you guy
s see my post from 1 or 2 days ago where I talked about my use=0Aof Ski Sav
er Tape and where to get it ??=0A=0AGeorge=0A=0A=0AD=======
==================0A=======
===0AD=====================
====0A==========0AD==========
===============0A==========0A
D========================
=0A==========0A=0A=0A________________________________-
Message 18- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:55:33 P
M PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Flaperon hinge brackets=0AFrom: "clemwehne
r" <clemwehner@sbcglobal.net>=0A=0A=0AMy flaperon hinge brackets were made
and the holes drilled in the ribs before the=0Awing was covered. Now that t
he wing is covered the hinge brackets won't fit=0Aflat onto the wing withou
t putting considerable stress on the rivets at the rear=0Aof the bracket.
- This is because the wing trailing edge is now thicker because=0Aof the
fabric, tapes, and paint. See the attached photo.=0A=0AAny suggestions on w
hat to do.- I can push hard and press the bracket down on to=0Athe wing s
urface, but it puts a lot of bending stress on the bracket.- Any ideas?
=0A=0A=0Athanks for the help,=0A=0A--------=0AClem Wehner=0ATulsa, OK=0AKit
fox IV-912=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronic
s.com/viewtopic.php?p=228263#228263=0A=0A=0AAttachments: =0A=0Ahttp://for
ums.matronics.com//files/img_4120_191.jpg=0A=0A=0A_________________________
_______- Message 19- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime:
07:02:23 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubject: Re:
Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A=0A=0AI put my tape on at- full down, yes,
and like you observed, just- =0Ahaving a little "down into" radius will a
ssure that it stays there- =0Awhen the 'vator is raised. I may try to app
ly some from the bottom- =0Aside with the 'vator held up, and see how tha
t works...along with the- =0Atop being covered.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitf
ox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x4
6=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0Ado
not archive=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 2, 2009, at 8:06 PM, patrick reilly wrote:=0A=0A
> Lynn, Didn't you say you have elavator at full down and then apply- =0A
> tape. This wouldn't require any pushing tape into groove. Or would- =0A
> having some tape pushed into groove insure the tape would curl into-
=0A> the groove when elevator was raised?=0A>=0A> Pat Reilly=0A> Mod 3 582
Rebuild=0A> Rockford, IL=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A________________________________
- Message 20- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 07:20:
15 PM PST US=0AFrom: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>=0ASubject: RE
: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A=0A=0ALynn=2C I was also wondering how cov
ering both sides with your method of fu=0All elevator up and down would wor
k. I'm not to that stage yet. As a matter =0Aof fact I received today the R
AC servo from ACS to use with Lowell Fitts tr=0Aim tab kit. So=2C I will
be tearing my elevator apart.- Have you got a trim=0Atab on the elevator?
Or=2C do you use the Flaperons to trim?Pat ReillyMod =0A3 582 RebuildRoc
kford=2C IL> From: lynnmatt@jps.net> Subject: Re: Kitfox-Li=0Ast: Fw: ski
saver> Date: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 22:01:43 -0500> To: kitfox-list@=0A@jps.n
et>> > I put my tape on at full down=2C yes=2C and like you observed=0A
=2C just > having a little "down into" radius will assure that it stays t
he=0Are > when the 'vator is raised. I may try to apply some from the botto
m > s=0Aide with the 'vator held up=2C and see how that works...along wit
h the > to=0Ap being covered.> > Lynn Matteson> Kitfox IV Speedster=2C ta
ildragger> Jabi=0Aru 2200=2C #2062=2C 605 hrs> Sensenich 62x46> Electro
air direct-fire igniti=0Aon system> New skis done and flying> do not archiv
e> > > > On Feb 2=2C 2009=0A=2C at 8:06 PM=2C patrick reilly wrote:>
> > Lynn=2C Didn't you say you hav=0Ae elavator at full down and then app
ly > > tape. This wouldn't require any =0Apushing tape into groove. Or woul
d > > having some tape pushed into groove =0Ainsure the tape would curl int
o > > the groove when elevator was raised?> >=0A=========
=> > > =0A=0A________________________________- Message 21- __________
__________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 07:33:19 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Ma
tteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A=0A
=0AFactory-built trim tab with RAC servo. Using the flaperons for trim-
=0Aslows the plane down, which is why one of the Speedster mods was the-
=0Aelectric trim.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJ
abiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignit
ion system=0ANew skis done and flying=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 2, 20
09, at 10:19 PM, patrick reilly wrote:=0A=0A> Lynn, I was also wondering ho
w covering both sides with your method- =0A> of full elevator up and down
would work. I'm not to that stage yet.- =0A> As a matter of fact I recei
ved today the RAC servo from ACS to use- =0A> with Lowell Fitts trim tab
kit. So, I will be tearing my elevator- =0A> apart.- Have you got a tri
m tab on the elevator? Or, do you use the- =0A> Flaperons to trim?=0A>=0A
> Pat Reilly=0A> Mod 3 582 Rebuild=0A> Rockford, IL=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A_______
_________________________- Message 22- ________________________________
____=0A=0A=0ATime: 07:46:51 PM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flaperon
hinge brackets=0AFrom: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>=0A=0A=0A=0A> My fl
aperon hinge brackets were made and the holes drilled in the ribs before=0A
the wing was covered. Now that the wing is covered the hinge brackets won't
fit=0Aflat onto the wing without putting considerable stress on the rivets
at the=0Arear of the bracket. This is because the wing trailing edge is no
w thicker because=0Aof the fabric, tapes, and paint. See the attached photo
. =0A> =0A> Any suggestions on what to do. I can push hard and press the br
acket down on=0Ato the wing surface, but it puts a lot of bending stress on
the bracket. Any ideas?=0A=0A=0AClem, The builder's manual says to fit and
drill first then cover as you have done.=0AMine were a tight fit too. =0A
=0AI set the flaperon in place then installed and tightened the hinge bolts
to take=0Athe stress off the rear rivet before I squeezed the brackets tig
ht to the rib=0Awith one hand and riveted with the other hand.=0A=0AThe rea
r bracket rivets have held fine.- I have had the flaperons off a couple
=0Atimes and the bracket bolt holes in the brackets line up perfect when I
reinstall=0Athe flaperons.- Also the bracket to rib rivets are holding ti
ght.=0A=0AI rib laced and put no rib lacing reinforcement tape or rib finis
h tape under the=0Abrackets.=0A=0A--------=0ATom Jones=0AClassic IV=0A503 R
otax, 72 inch Two blade Warp=0AEllensburg, WA=0A=0A=0ARead this topic onlin
e here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228274#228274=0A
===================0A=0A=0A
Message 8
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| Subject: | RE: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09 |
Now putting together the panel for my KII-582, and hope to see some of you
at OSH. I am considering panel mount coms by Flightline 760 (real bargain
but no factory support), XCom, MicroAire and Becker. Does anyone have
input or history of the Flightline com?
Ed Gray, Dallas, KII building 214 734 2524, do not archive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Kitfox-List
Digest Server
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 1:59 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09
*
=================================================
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
=================================================
Today's complete Kitfox-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Kitfox-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&Chapter
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===============================================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
===============================================
----------------------------------------------------------
Kitfox-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Sun 02/01/09: 21
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:38 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Catz631@aol.com)
2. 09:02 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Noel Loveys)
3. 11:09 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Noel Loveys)
4. 11:26 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Lynn Matteson)
5. 12:02 PM - Kitfox with rotax fuel injection (jason Parker)
6. 02:02 PM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Randy
Daughenbaugh)
7. 02:22 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Lynn Matteson)
8. 03:02 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Bob Brennan)
9. 03:13 PM - Ski report/snow conditions (Lynn Matteson)
10. 03:19 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Lynn Matteson)
11. 03:24 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Larry Huntley)
12. 05:00 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Noel Loveys)
13. 05:05 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Lowlead)
14. 05:30 PM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Lynn Matteson)
15. 05:39 PM - Fw: ski saver (Larry Huntley)
16. 06:11 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver (patrick reilly)
17. 06:50 PM - Re: ski saver (AKFLYERBOB)
18. 08:17 PM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Rexinator)
19. 09:18 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver (John Bonewitz)
20. 11:08 PM - Official Kitfox-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)
(Matt Dralle)
21. 11:25 PM - Official Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines (Matt Dralle)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 06:38:03 AM PST US
From: Catz631@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
That foam weather striping sounds like a good idea. You could further refine
this by putting a strip of teflon antichafe tape on the other side of the
weather striping foam(oposite the adhesive side) or on the elevator leading
edge
for that mater. This stuff is real slick and I bought a roll of it from
Spruce
as a cowling chafe tape a while back. It works real well.
Only thing is, in the heat the adhesive on weather strip tends to give way
into a goo.
That sailplane tape looks interesting also
Dick Maddux
Pensacola,Fl.
**************From Wall Street to Main Street and everywhere in between,
stay
up-to-date with the latest news. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000023)
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 09:02:06 AM PST US
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Or you could attach the seal, on the elevator side only with good old 1 in.
Velcro.
Another thing to try is to cover the leading edge of the elevator and rudder
with the plastic tape then attach the gap seal to that tape so when you
remove the seal you don't disturb the dope under it.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 8:12 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Good idea, but I'm from the camp that always wants to be able to take
something apart if a problem arises. I guess if a rock passed through
the elevator, you could always MEK the Vee off from the elevator, and
maybe reattach it when the repairs were made. A longer process, by
far, than the tape method, but cleaner-looking.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 600.2 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Jan 31, 2009, at 2:37 AM, JC Propeller Design wrote:
> <propellerdesign@tele2.se>
>
> You can use that, but why not take 2 pieces sewn together at the
> middle and dope one Vee to stab and other to elevator.
>
> Or use sail fabric that is air tight from start
>
> Jan
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Friday, January 30, 2009 9:18 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
>
>
>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
>>
>> Why not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to
>> seal the gap ??? It would be permanent, easy to do, and look
>> good ! Much better than tape.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> --------
>> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast
>> as you could have !!!
>>
>> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=227727#227727
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
>> signature database 3814 (20090131) __________
>>
>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 11:09:12 AM PST US
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now... Friday nights
not the best night of the week for me;-).
I agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a place for
grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thing".
What I was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2 inch tape
sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape doped to the
stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match the plane. They
should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight. I'll attach a couple of
rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough!
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 8:04 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Nope, no picture or drawing. Just visualize...after the inbibation
wears off....the flat surface of the stab and elevator, as viewed
from the side/edge, with the tape starting on the top left, and
crossing to the bottom right. (This of course assumes that you have
properly made the tape with an inch of the sticky surfaces against
each other so that the tape can be stuck down on the top left and
the bottom right) Now another tape from the bottom left crossing to
the top right. Where they pass by each other, they form an "X". Then
imagine a piece of tape 2" wide being placed from top of stab to
bottom of elev. (top left to bottom right), and next to it another
tape placed from bottom left to top right. Continue alternating tapes
until gap is sealed. I can imagine how this would look on a full-size
plane, and I don't like what I imagine. It worked fine on the models
and looked ok, and made an especially lightweight hinge. I personally
don't like the idea of this "over and under" tape application, as it
always leaves a place where junk can collect, no matter which way you
do it. I much prefer to let the elevator hang down, apply the tape
across the gap, and leave it at that. I use "racer's tape" that I
ordered in orange, which is the color of my plane in that area...the
color is not a perfect match...however, I can't see that mismatch
when I'm flying and neither can anybody else. The owners of "hangar
queens" would not like my reasoning, I'm sure.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 600.2 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Jan 30, 2009, at 8:20 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> Lynn:
> do you have a picture or drawing of the X system?
> Second inbibation is starting to cut in and I'm having a problem
> visualizing your X setup.
>
> Noel
>
>
> --- On Fri, 1/30/09, Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net> wrote:
> From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Received: Friday, January 30, 2009, 6:11 PM
>
>
> If you really want to drive yourself nuts over this gap sealing
> issue, try the
> "X" method instead of the "Z" method. We used the
> "X" method on our model planes.
> The "Z" method has been explained....from under (or over) the
> trailing portion of the hort. stab, to over (or under) the leading
> portion of
> the elevator, forming a "Z" when view from the side. The "X"
> method is just alternating the placement of lengths of 2" wide
> tape, over
> and under, then under and over, etc., until the gap is sealed. In the
> "X" method, you make strips of tape that go, say, 2" wide and
> from front to back, instead of the "Z" method where you run the tape
> from side of elevator to hinge, then hinge to hinge, and so on.
> The jury is still out on whether this is a good method or not...how
> 'bout
> some thoughts?
>
> As an aside, when this method is used in model planes, no hinge is
> needed, as
> the plastic covering material itself is used for the "gap seals" and
> in using the "X" method, the elevator operates freely without the use
> of hinges...not recommended for "live-in" airplanes.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 600.2 hrs
> Sensenich 62x46
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> New skis done and flying
>
>
> On Jan 30, 2009, at 12:53 PM, Paul Franz - Merlin GT wrote:
>
> <paul@eucleides.com>
> >
> > On Fri, January 30, 2009 7:28 am, kirk hull wrote:
> >> Does anybody have pictures of the gap seal installation?
> >
> > I too would be interested in seeing photos. I'm interested in
> details
> of shape,
> > overlap and what happens to the slack when you run neutral or down
> elevator.
> >
> > Does the slack start to peel a tiny bit on either the stabilizer
> or the
> elevator with
> > dirt and debris sticking to the small exposed bit of adhesive?
> >
> > Which way is better to put them on - leading edge on top or
> bottom of Get the name you've always wanted ! @ymail.com or
> @rocketmail.com. _-
> www.matronics.com/contribution _-
> ==========================================================
________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
Time: 11:26:09 AM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
I just flew my plane today, and during the pre-flight I noticed that
the gap-seal tape...orange Racer's Tape...that I applied on 10-5-2008
is still holding fast. I wrote the date onto the tape to keep track
of how well it held up. The same tape that I applied earlier...God
knows when...is also still holding fas, so maybe we're overthinking
this gap-seal "problem." Of course, mine is applied over the top of
the gap and nothing underneath, so the purists among us...you know
who you are...would not buy this fix.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 1, 2009, at 11:32 AM, Noel Loveys wrote:
>
> Or you could attach the seal, on the elevator side only with good
> old 1 in.
> Velcro.
>
> Another thing to try is to cover the leading edge of the elevator
> and rudder
> with the plastic tape then attach the gap seal to that tape so when
> you
> remove the seal you don't disturb the dope under it.
>
> Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
> Matteson
> Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 8:12 AM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
>
>
> Good idea, but I'm from the camp that always wants to be able to take
> something apart if a problem arises. I guess if a rock passed through
> the elevator, you could always MEK the Vee off from the elevator, and
> maybe reattach it when the repairs were made. A longer process, by
> far, than the tape method, but cleaner-looking.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 600.2 hrs
> Sensenich 62x46
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> New skis done and flying
>
>
> On Jan 31, 2009, at 2:37 AM, JC Propeller Design wrote:
>
>> <propellerdesign@tele2.se>
>>
>> You can use that, but why not take 2 pieces sewn together at the
>> middle and dope one Vee to stab and other to elevator.
>>
>> Or use sail fabric that is air tight from start
>>
>> Jan
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot"
>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
>> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
>> Sent: Friday, January 30, 2009 9:18 PM
>> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
>>
>>
>>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
>>>
>>> Why not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to
>>> seal the gap ??? It would be permanent, easy to do, and look
>>> good ! Much better than tape.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> --------
>>> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast
>>> as you could have !!!
>>>
>>> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Read this topic online here:
>>>
>>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=227727#227727
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
>>> signature database 3814 (20090131) __________
>>>
>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
Time: 12:02:53 PM PST US
From: jason Parker <litesellme@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Kitfox with rotax fuel injection
www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUrFJi93MIo=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=nhiMjZGP-
Dk=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=cD4_27rMX6Q=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=XEGx
=======================
________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
Time: 02:02:20 PM PST US
From: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Mike,
Unless you get all the coats and cross coats of poly spray on it it won't
last more than a year or two in the sun. Maybe that is permanent enough,
but I worry that with all the flexing, and enough coats or polyspray, it
will crack.
Randy
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JetPilot
Sent: Friday, January 30, 2009 1:19 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Why not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to seal the gap
??? It would be permanent, easy to do, and look good ! Much better than
tape.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
could have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=227727#227727
________________________________ Message 7
_____________________________________
Time: 02:22:29 PM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
The "grass catcher" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or
"S") method of applying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under
the front to over the back" or vice versa, there will always be a
wedge of space that wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get
out of the "X" method. That's why I've contented myself with the
"over the front to over the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically
dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy air, but have we a
really "clean" plane otherwise?
Your diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job. Lost
Saturday? : )
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...
> Friday nights
> not the best night of the week for me;-).
>
> I agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a
> place for
> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thing".
>
> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2
> inch tape
> sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape doped to the
> stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match the
> plane. They
> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight. I'll attach a
> couple of
> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough!
>
> Noel
________________________________ Message 8
_____________________________________
Time: 03:02:08 PM PST US
From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
I'm glad to see someone else used the just-tape-over-the-top method. When
this topic came up a few months ago I noticed on a magazine cover picture of
my plane I have for my desktop that at that time it had black tape on the
top side of the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I bought the plane.
I assume it was wide electrical tape which is *everywhere* on the plane
including the leading edges and vertical stabiliser gap, and which I am
gradually replacing since it peels.
I was hesitant to post my method since no one else had admitted here to that
simple method. I used a yellow duct tape across the entire topside of the
gaps, installed with the elevator fully down. With the elevator up it tucks
neatly into the gap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it would not
accumulate anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges on
pre-flight.
So far it has lasted a season and made a difference to control authority on
the short-field-over-trees grass strip that I use. Before sealing the gap my
slowest approach speed was determined by when I started losing pitch control
versus stall speed, which made it tough to flare properly. Possibly the
under-cambered wings and smaller tail made the gap seals more noticeable on
a Model 2 than later Models.
Bob Brennan - N717GB
ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
Wrightsville Pa
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Sent: 01 February 2009 5:18 pm
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
The "grass catcher" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or
"S") method of applying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under
the front to over the back" or vice versa, there will always be a
wedge of space that wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get
out of the "X" method. That's why I've contented myself with the
"over the front to over the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically
dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy air, but have we a
really "clean" plane otherwise?
Your diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job. Lost
Saturday? : )
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...
> Friday nights
> not the best night of the week for me;-).
>
> I agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a
> place for
> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thing".
>
> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2
> inch tape
> sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape doped to the
> stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match the
> plane. They
> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight. I'll attach a
> couple of
> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough!
>
> Noel
________________________________ Message 9
_____________________________________
Time: 03:13:42 PM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Ski report/snow conditions
Last week I had a "ski tuck" due to the bungees not being set to a
high enough initial tension. This week I cut 2" from them and
reinstalled and test flew them yesterday and today, and could not
get it to happen again. Admittedly, I wasn't really giving it what
could be considered an acrobatic test, but I made some (weak) dives
and pull-ups, and couldn't get the ski, or skis, to drop or tuck. I
even flew in bumpy-bangy air. I had made a tension check before and
after the shortening, and I picked up about 8 pounds of tension per
cord, or 16 pounds per ski.
I flew today to test the condition of the snow. Last week when I
tried to leave here to go to Oshkosh, the snow was so wet and heavy
that I could not get over 20 mph on the takeoff roll. This was after
2 days of above freezing temps...34-36 degrees F. Today, the
conditions were the same...overnight of over freezing, and 34 F when
I took off. It took a bit of coaxing, but I got up alright, and
landed at 4 different snow-covered grass strips. It was the same at
all strips...a bit longer than normal (most ski takeoffs take more
runway, I've read), but doable. When I stopped for lunch, I parked in
my own tracks, then 30 minutes later just rocked the plane a bit
before fire-up, firewalled it, and away I went, taxiing to the
runway...slowly. I used up about 1100 feet of a crosswind, no-tracks
runway before giving up and trying it on a snowmobile-trodden runway
into the wind. It still took about 300 feet before it got off the
ground due to the sticky snow conditions.
An article I had read (National Research Council of Canada) talked
about "snow friction" in this way:
"Early in the tests, it was found that sliding resistance and
adhesion were far more dependent upon snow conditions than on the
design of the ski. Further, the skiing quality of the snow changed
continually and it was not unusual to observe marked changes taking
place in less than an hour. The publication notes that there are
times when the sliding resistance of aircraft skis is so great that
it is impossible to reach flying speed."
I'm having a blast test-flying my skis, and seeing first-hand how
some of the writings that I studied while building them have merit.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
do not archive
On Feb 1, 2009, at 5:17 PM, Lynn Matteson wrote:
>
> The "grass catcher" is the problem with either the "X" or the
> "Z" (or "S") method of applying tape...whether you apply the tape
> from "under the front to over the back" or vice versa, there will
> always be a wedge of space that wants to collects debris. It's just
> harder to get out of the "X" method. That's why I've contented
> myself with the "over the front to over the back" method....yes
> it's aerodynamically dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy
> air, but have we a really "clean" plane otherwise?
>
> Your diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job. Lost
> Saturday? : )
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
> Sensenich 62x46
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> New skis done and flying
>
>
> On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
>
>> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...
>> Friday nights
>> not the best night of the week for me;-).
>>
>> I agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a
>> place for
>> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thing".
>>
>> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2
>> inch tape
>> sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape doped to
>> the
>> stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match the
>> plane. They
>> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight. I'll attach a
>> couple of
>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough!
>>
>> Noel
>
>
________________________________ Message 10
____________________________________
Time: 03:19:35 PM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
I just tape up to the hinges, then tape again on the other side of
the hinge...all on the top-to-top surfaces...I'm gettin' too old to
bend down and look under there, Bob. : )
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
do not archive
On Feb 1, 2009, at 5:57 PM, Bob Brennan wrote:
> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>
> I'm glad to see someone else used the just-tape-over-the-top
> method. When
> this topic came up a few months ago I noticed on a magazine cover
> picture of
> my plane I have for my desktop that at that time it had black tape
> on the
> top side of the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I bought
> the plane.
> I assume it was wide electrical tape which is *everywhere* on the
> plane
> including the leading edges and vertical stabiliser gap, and which
> I am
> gradually replacing since it peels.
>
> I was hesitant to post my method since no one else had admitted
> here to that
> simple method. I used a yellow duct tape across the entire topside
> of the
> gaps, installed with the elevator fully down. With the elevator up
> it tucks
> neatly into the gap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it
> would not
> accumulate anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges on
> pre-flight.
>
> So far it has lasted a season and made a difference to control
> authority on
> the short-field-over-trees grass strip that I use. Before sealing
> the gap my
> slowest approach speed was determined by when I started losing
> pitch control
> versus stall speed, which made it tough to flare properly. Possibly
> the
> under-cambered wings and smaller tail made the gap seals more
> noticeable on
> a Model 2 than later Models.
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
> Matteson
> Sent: 01 February 2009 5:18 pm
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
>
>
> The "grass catcher" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or
> "S") method of applying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under
> the front to over the back" or vice versa, there will always be a
> wedge of space that wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get
> out of the "X" method. That's why I've contented myself with the
> "over the front to over the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically
> dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy air, but have we a
> really "clean" plane otherwise?
>
> Your diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job. Lost
> Saturday? : )
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
> Sensenich 62x46
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> New skis done and flying
>
>
> On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
>
>> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...
>> Friday nights
>> not the best night of the week for me;-).
>>
>> I agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a
>> place for
>> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thing".
>>
>> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2
>> inch tape
>> sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape doped to
>> the
>> stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match the
>> plane. They
>> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight. I'll attach a
>> couple of
>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough!
>>
>> Noel
>
>
________________________________ Message 11
____________________________________
Time: 03:24:36 PM PST US
From: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
I did that with ski saver. Worked fin and not too complicated for my brain.
I can make decent 3pt landings with the Soob on front and no
flaps----Barely, But it works. Larry 4-1200 Soob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 5:57 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>
>
> I'm glad to see someone else used the just-tape-over-the-top method. When
> this topic came up a few months ago I noticed on a magazine cover picture
> of
> my plane I have for my desktop that at that time it had black tape on the
> top side of the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I bought the
> plane.
> I assume it was wide electrical tape which is *everywhere* on the plane
> including the leading edges and vertical stabiliser gap, and which I am
> gradually replacing since it peels.
>
> I was hesitant to post my method since no one else had admitted here to
> that
> simple method. I used a yellow duct tape across the entire topside of the
> gaps, installed with the elevator fully down. With the elevator up it
> tucks
> neatly into the gap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it would not
> accumulate anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges on
> pre-flight.
>
> So far it has lasted a season and made a difference to control authority
> on
> the short-field-over-trees grass strip that I use. Before sealing the gap
> my
> slowest approach speed was determined by when I started losing pitch
> control
> versus stall speed, which made it tough to flare properly. Possibly the
> under-cambered wings and smaller tail made the gap seals more noticeable
> on
> a Model 2 than later Models.
>
> Bob Brennan - N717GB
> ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox
> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
> Wrightsville Pa
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
> Sent: 01 February 2009 5:18 pm
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
>
>
> The "grass catcher" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or
> "S") method of applying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under
> the front to over the back" or vice versa, there will always be a
> wedge of space that wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get
> out of the "X" method. That's why I've contented myself with the
> "over the front to over the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically
> dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy air, but have we a
> really "clean" plane otherwise?
>
> Your diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job. Lost
> Saturday? : )
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
> Sensenich 62x46
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> New skis done and flying
>
>
> On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
>
>> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...
>> Friday nights
>> not the best night of the week for me;-).
>>
>> I agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a
>> place for
>> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thing".
>>
>> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2
>> inch tape
>> sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape doped to the
>> stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match the
>> plane. They
>> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight. I'll attach a
>> couple of
>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough!
>>
>> Noel
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
6:02 PM
________________________________ Message 12
____________________________________
Time: 05:00:25 PM PST US
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Not lost just out of town until later last night.
What did you think of the idea of using Velcro (just on the rudder) Would
make it easy to clean and also easy to remove the rudder for repairs due to
hangar rash.
I'm going to try a gap seal this spring when I get the plane out again. At
least on the rudder to try to give me more authority for slips. Those big
floats hanging three feet or more below the CG really want to right the
plane. So far I've been giving full ruddr and controlling the slip with the
ailerons. Even doing that the slip is more gentle than what I can get with
no problems from a C-172.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 6:48 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
The "grass catcher" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or
"S") method of applying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under
the front to over the back" or vice versa, there will always be a
wedge of space that wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get
out of the "X" method. That's why I've contented myself with the
"over the front to over the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically
dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy air, but have we a
really "clean" plane otherwise?
Your diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job. Lost
Saturday? : )
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:
> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...
> Friday nights
> not the best night of the week for me;-).
>
> I agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a
> place for
> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thing".
>
> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2
> inch tape
> sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape doped to the
> stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match the
> plane. They
> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight. I'll attach a
> couple of
> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough!
>
> Noel
________________________________ Message 13
____________________________________
Time: 05:05:11 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
From: "Lowlead" <j.t.cowie@xoxy.net>
I use a 3M 3372 polyurethane surface protection tape applied on both top and
bottom
of the gap (previous posts shown as >-
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_141.jpg
________________________________ Message 14
____________________________________
Time: 05:30:02 PM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
That's a good-looking job, LL.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
do not archive
On Feb 1, 2009, at 8:01 PM, Lowlead wrote:
>
> I use a 3M 3372 polyurethane surface protection tape applied on
> both top and bottom of the gap (previous posts shown as >-
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_141.jpg
>
>
________________________________ Message 15
____________________________________
Time: 05:39:40 PM PST US
From: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
Just received this. Does it sound like the same material? Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: <info@tognar.com>
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM
Subject: Re: ski saver
>
> Yes,
> check this link on our bags/racks page
> http://www.tognar.com/bags_racks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html
> The top item is the scuff saver tape,
> Thanks,
> Cat
> www.tognar.com
>
>
>> Do you still have "ski saver" tape? Larry Huntley asq@roadrunner.com
> Ye
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
6:02 PM
________________________________ Message 16
____________________________________
Time: 06:11:13 PM PST US
From: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
Larry=2C Thanks for the web link. I ordered 5 feed just to have on hand. Th
at price for 14" wide clear tape is unreal. There are many times I wanted s
ome of that tape to protect paint on a car=2C motorcycle tank=2C etc. I'll
use it on the gap seal=2C Alla Lynn Matteson top side only. Lynn=2C if that
curls down into the gap=2C rather than up=2C I don't know why anybody woul
d use any other method.
do not archive Pat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From: asq@roadrun
ner.com> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> Subject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
> Date: Sun=2C 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500> > --> Kitfox-List message posted
by: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> > Just received this. Does it sou
nd like the same material? Larry> > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <i
nfo@tognar.com>> To: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> Sent: Sunday=2C
February 01=2C 2009 7:54 PM> Subject: Re: ski saver> > > >> > Yes=2C> > che
ck this link on our bags/racks page> > http://www.tognar.com/bags_racks_boo
t_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html> > The top item is the scuff saver t
ape=2C> > Thanks=2C> > Cat> > www.tognar.com> >> >> >> Do you still have "s
ki saver" tape? Larry Huntley asq@roadrunner.com> > Ye> >> > > ------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------> > > >
=====> > >
________________________________ Message 17
____________________________________
Time: 06:50:23 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver
From: "AKFLYERBOB" <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>
Larry
What material are you talking about?
I'm sure every one would like to know.
Bob
--------
Bob Wolfe..Soldotna, Alaska
KF Mod I and III
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228098#228098
________________________________ Message 18
____________________________________
Time: 08:17:28 PM PST US
From: Rexinator <rexinator@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
That's exactly what I was trying to describe with my >-< symbol and my
little drawn image file. I agree with Lynn that it's a nice job. Can
you elaborate on how you applied so well?
Rex
Colorado M2/582
Lowlead wrote:
>
> I use a 3M 3372 polyurethane surface protection tape applied on both top
and
bottom of the gap (previous posts shown as >-
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084
>
>
> Attachments:
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_141.jpg
>
________________________________ Message 19
____________________________________
Time: 09:18:50 PM PST US
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
From: John Bonewitz <bonewitz@gmail.com>
We have a winner! I'm going to order some of this stuff. There are probably
lots of other uses besides gap seal.
Thanks,
John Bonewitz
Series 5
On Sun, Feb 1, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Larry Huntley <asq@roadrunner.com> wrote:
>
> Just received this. Does it sound like the same material? Larry
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: <info@tognar.com>
> To: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
> Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM
> Subject: Re: ski saver
>
>
>> Yes,
>> check this link on our bags/racks page
>>
http://www.tognar.com/bags_racks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html
>> The top item is the scuff saver tape,
>> Thanks,
>> Cat
>> www.tognar.com
>>
>>
>> Do you still have "ski saver" tape? Larry Huntley asq@roadrunner.com
>>>
>> Ye
>>
>>
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
>
>
> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
> 6:02 PM
>
>
________________________________ Message 20
____________________________________
Time: 11:08:00 PM PST US
From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Official Kitfox-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)
Dear Listers,
Please read over the Kitfox-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below.
The
complete Kitfox-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Kitfox-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
[ Note: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such
as
Courier. Proportional fonts will cause display formatting errors.
]
This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at the following address:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm
************************************************************
******* LIST POLICIES AND FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS *******
************************************************************
PLEASE READ. This document contains Kitfox-List policies and information
for new and old subscribers. Understanding the Kitfox-List policies will
minimize problems for the Administrator, and will help keep the Kitfox-List
running smoothly for all of us.
******************************************
*** Quick Start Guide to List Features ***
******************************************
There are many features available on the Matronics Email Lists and each
one is described in detailed below. However, using the List Navigator
you can quickly access the complete set of features available for this
List. The List Navigator can be found at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List
****************************************
*** How to Subscribe and Unsubscribe ***
****************************************
Simply go to the Web Page shown below and enter your email address and
select the List(s) that you wish to subscribe or unsubscribed from. You
may also use the handy "Find" function to determine the exact syntax of
your email address as it is subscribed to the List. Please see the
complete instructions at the top of the Web Page for more information.
The Subscribe/Unsubscribe web page is:
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Note that you will receive TWO conformation emails regarding your
subsciption
process. The first verifies that your subscription/unsubsciption request
was received, and the second confirms that the process has been
completed.
You should receive the first email within a few minutes of your request.
The second conformation will arrive in less than 24 hours. You cannot
post
until you receive the second conformation email message.
*****************************
*** How to Post a Message ***
*****************************
Send an email message to:
kitfox-list@matronics.com
Your message will be redistributed to everyone currently subscribed
to the List.
*****************************************************
*** SPAM Fighter - You Must be Subscribed to Post ***
*****************************************************
When a new post is received by the system, the From: line of the message
is checked and compared against the current subscription list. If the
email address is found, the message is passed on to the List Processor.
If the email address isn't found in the current list of subscribers, it
is dumped. This serves to very effectively thwart 99% of the SPAM that
gets posted to the Lists.
Remember, however, that the syntax of your email address is very
important
with regard to the configuration of your email application such as
Outlook
or Eudora. For example, the following two email addresses may be
functionally equivalent, but only one would pass the Matronics Email SPAM
test depending on which was syntax was subscribed to the given List:
smith@machine.domain.com
smith@domain.com
Either email address syntax is alright, just be sure that you configure
your email application to match *exactly* the address you've subscibed to
the List.
**************************************
*** Enclosure Support on the Lists ***
**************************************
Limited posting of enclosures such as pictures, documents, and
spreadsheets
is supported on the Lists. There are a number of restrictions, and these
are detailed below. Please abide by the rules put forth regarding the
content of enclosures.
These are some of the features and limits of enclosures on the Matronics
Lists:
1) Enclosures will only be posted to the Real Time version of the Lists.
2) Enclosures will NOT be included in the Daily Digest version of the
Lists.
3) Enclosures WILL BE forwarded on to the BBS Forum Web site.
4) Enclosures will NOT be appended to the Archives.
5) Enclosures will NOT be available in the List Browse feature.
6) Only the following file types and extensions will be allowed:
bmp doc dwg dxf gif jpg pdf png txt xls
All other enclosures types will be rejected and email returned to
sender. The enclosure types listed above are relatively safe from
a virus standpoint and don't pose a particularly large security risk.
7) !! All incoming enclosures will be scanned for viruses prior to
posting
to the List. This is done in real time and will not slow down
the process of posting the message !!
Here are some rules for posting enclosures. Failure to abide by these
rules
could result in the removal of a subscriber's email address from the
Lists.
1) Pay attention to what you are posting!! Make sure that the files
you are enclosing aren't HUGE (greater that 1MB). Remember that there
are still people checking they're email via dial up modem. If you
post
30MB worth of pictures, you are placing an unnecessary burden on these
folks and the rest of us, for that matter.
2) SCALE YOUR PICTURES DOWN!!! I don't want to see huge 3000 x 2000
pictures getting posted that are 3 or 4MB each. This is just
unacceptable. Use a program such as Photoshop to scale the picture
down to something on the order of 800 x 600 and try to keep the
file size to less-than 200KB, preferably much less.
Microsoft has a really awesome utility available for free that allows
you to Right-Click on a picture in Explorer and automatically
scale it down and resave it. This is a great utility - get it, use
it!
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.mspx
Look for the link "Image Resizer"
3) !! This would seem to go without saying, but I'll say it anyway. Do
not
post anything that would be considered offensive by your grandmother.
And you know what I'm saying; I don't want to see anything even
questionable. !!
4) REMEMBER THIS: If you post a 1MB enclosure to a List with 1000 members
subscribed, your 1MB enclosure must be resent 1000 times amounting
to 1MB X 1000 = 1 Gigabyte of network traffic!! BE CAREFUL and
BE COURTEOUS!
Also see the section below on the Matronics Photo and File Share where
you can have your files and photos posted on the Matronics web server
for long time viewing and availability.
*******************
*** Digest Mode ***
*******************
Each day, starting at 12 midnight PST US, a new 'digest' will be started.
This digest will contain the same information that is currently appended
to the archive file. It has all of the headers except for the "From:"
and "Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator consisting
of a line of underscores.
Each day at 23:55 PST US, the day's messages as described above will be
combined and sent as a single message to everyone on the digest email
list.
To subscribe to the digest list, use the same subscription web form
described above, and just select the Digest version of the List.
http://www.matronics.com/subscribe
Note that you *can* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest
versions
of the List at the same time. This is perfectly acceptable.
Now some caveats:
* Messages sent to "kitfox-list-digest" will be forwarded to the standard
email list. In other words, you cannot post messages only to the
digest List.
* If you are subscribed to both the regular List and the digest List, you
will receive the realtime postings as well as the digest at the end of
the day.
* If you reply to the digest email, your message will be forwarded to the
normal list associated with the digest. Important Note: Please change
the subject line to reflect the topic of your response! Also, please
*do not include all or most of the digest in your reply*.
****************************
*** List Digest Browser ***
****************************
An archive of all the List Digests can be found online in either plain
text
or HTML format. These archives contain the exact Digest that was posted
to
the Digest email list on the given day. The Digest Archives can be found
at the following location:
http://www.matronics.com/digest
*****************************************
*** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Message Flag ***
*****************************************
At times, your message may concern something that is revelent only to a
very
small number of persons or to a limited area, and you may not wish to
archive
it. In such a case, simply put the following phrase anywhere in the
message:
do not archive
Your message will not be appended to the archive, but will be sent to
List
email distribution as normal.
**********************************************
***** READ THIS - Automatic Unsubscribes *****
**********************************************
Note that if your email address begins to cause problems such as bounced
email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your address will be
promptly
removed from the List. If you discover that you are no longer receiving
messages from the Kitfox-List, go to the following Web page, and look
for your email address and a possible reason for your removal.
The Matronics Email List uses utility called the "Email Weasel" that
automatically looks though the day's bounced email for addresses that
caused problems due to common things like "user is unknown", "mailbox
full", etc. If the Email Weasel removes your email address from the
Lists you will find record of it at the following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/unsubscribed
If the problem listed on the web site above has been resolved, please
feel
free to resubscribe to the Lists of your choice.
*******************************
*** List Member Information ***
*******************************
If you have not done so already, please email me your phone numbers and
paper mail address in the following format:
smith@somehost.com
Joe Smith
123 Airport Lane
Tower, CA 91234-1234
098-765-1234 w
123-456-7890 h
Please forward this information to the following email address:
requests@matronics.com
I have a file of such things, that I typically use to contact you when
there are problems with your email address. The information will NOT
be used for any other commercial purpose.
****************************************
*** Realtime Web Email List Browsing ***
****************************************
Recent messages posted to the Kitfox-List are also made available on
the Web for realtime browsing. Seven days worth of back postings are
available with this feature. The messages can be sorted by Subject,
Author, Date, or Message Thread. The Realtime List Browser indexes are
updated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45. You can also reply to a
message
or start a new message directly from the List Browser Interface (coming
soon).
You do not have to be subscribed to the given list to use the List
Browser Interface in view-mode.
http://www.matronics.com/browselist/kitfox-list
*******************************************
*** Web Forums Bulletin Board Interface ***
*******************************************
A phpBB BBS web Forums front end is available for all Kitfox-List
content.
content. The Forums contain all of the same content available via the
email
distribution and found on the various archive viewing formats such as the
List Browse, etc. Any posts on the web Forums will be cross posted to
the
respective email List, and posts to the Email List will be cross posted
to
the web Forums.
You may view all List content on the Forums without any special login.
If you wish to post a message via the Web Forum interface, however, you
will need to Register. This is a simple process that takes only a few
minutes. A link to the Registration page can be found at the top of the
main web Forums page. Note that registering on the Forum web site also
enables you to send email posts to the Lists as well. You will also need
to
Subscribe to the respective Email List as described above to receive the
Email Distribution of the List, however.
The Matroincs Email List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following
URL:
http://forums.matronics.com
*********************************
*** Matronics Email List Wiki ***
*********************************
In an attempt to make it easy to store and find structured and often
accessed
information, Matronics has installed a Wiki at:
http://wiki.matronics.com
The Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain useful
information
for other users of the mailing lists and web site. Unlike an ordinary web
page
where the content needs to be submitted to Matronics for inclusion, the Wiki
permits the users to construct their own pages and have them visible
immediately.
While constructing pages for the Wiki is not difficult, some may not be
comfortable building pages. In that case, simply prepare the text and any
images and email it to:
wiki-support@matronics.com
One of the volunteers on that list will take your submission and construct
a Wiki page for you.
Often someone produces a particularly useful posting in email one one of the
Lists that would be of general interest. In that case Matronics may take
that
post and convert it into a Wiki page.
*********************
*** List Archives ***
*********************
A file containing of all of the previous postings to the Kitfox-List is
available on line. The archive file information is available via the
Web and FTP in a number of forms. Each are briefly described below:
* Kitfox-List.FAQ
- Latest version of the Kitfox-List Frequently Asked Question
page (this document).
* Kitfox-Archive.digest.complete
- Complete file with most of the email header info removed and
page breaks inserted between messages.
* Kitfox-Archive.digest.vol-??
- Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that
can more easily handled.
* Kitfox-Archive.digest.complete.zip
- Same as the Kitfox-Archive.digest.complete file above, but
in PKZIP format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
* Kitfox-Archive.digest.complete.Z
- Same as the Kitfox-Archive.digest.complete file above, but in
UNIX compress format. Use "binary" data transfer methods.
Download Via FTP
----------------
The archive file is available via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com
in the "/pub/Archives" directory. It is updated daily and can be found
in
a number of formats as described above. (All filenames are case
sensitive.)
ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives
Download Via Web
----------------
The archives are also available via a web listing. These can be found
toward the bottom of the following web page:
http://www.matronics.com/archives
******************************************
*** Complete List Web Archive Browsing ***
******************************************
All messages posted to the Kitfox-List are also available using the
Email List Archive Browsing feature. With this utility, all messages
in the List are indexed, and individual sub-archives can be browsed.
http://www.matronics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?Kitfox
*****************************************
**** High-Speed Archive Search Engine ***
*****************************************
You can use the custom, high-performance Matronics Email List Search
Engine
to quickly locate and browse any messages that have been posted to the
List. The Engine allows the user to easily search any of the currently
available List archives.
http://www.matronics.com/search
****************************
*** File and Photo Share ***
****************************
With the Matronics Email List File and Photo Share you can share pictures
and other data with members of the List without having to forward a
copy of it to everyone. To share your Files and Photos, simply email
them to:
pictures@matronics.com
!! ==> Please including the following information with each submission:
1) Email Lists that they are related to.
2) Your Full Name.
3) Your Email Address.
4) One line Subject description.
5) Multi-line, multi-paragraph description of topic.
6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file
Prior to public availability of the files and photos, each will be
scanned
for viruses. Please also note that the process of making the files and
photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try to
process them every few days.
Following the availability of the new Photoshare, an email message will
be
sent to the Email Lists enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new
Share is available and what the direct URL to it is.
For a current list of available Photoshares, have a look at the Main
Index Page:
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
**************************
*** List Archive CDROM ***
**************************
A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available that contains
all of the archives since the beginning of each of the Lists. The
archives
for all of the Lists are included on the CD along with a freeware search
engine written by a list member. The CD is burned the day you order it
and will contain archive received up to the last minute. They make
great gifts!
http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM
**********************************
*** List Support Contributions ***
**********************************
The Matronics Lists are run *completely* through the support of it
members.
You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing Banner ads, or any other form of
annoying commercialism on either the Email Messages or the List web pages
associated with the Matronics Email Lists. Every year during November
I run a low-key, low-pressure "Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month,
I ask List members to make a Contribution in any amount with which they
are comfortable.
I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels during the
Fund Raiser to increase the participation. The gifts are usually donated
by companies that are themselves List members.
Your Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the Lists
including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection, server
system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the many
many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing the
variety of services found here.
Generally Contributions range from $20 to $100 and are completely
voluntary
and non-compulsory. I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and
obtains
value from them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude.
Contributions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just
subscribed, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in.
The website for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below. There
are
a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal, and
sending a personal check.
If you enjoy and value the List, won't you make a Contribution today to
support its continued operation?
http://www.matronics.com/contributions
Thank you!
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
****************************************************************************
**
Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines
****************************************************************************
**
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Kitfox-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the Kitfox-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
Kitfox-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the Kitfox-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
________________________________ Message 21
____________________________________
Time: 11:25:19 PM PST US
From: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Official Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines
Dear Listers,
Please read over the Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines below. The complete
Kitfox-List FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the
following URL:
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Kitfox-List.FAQ.html
Thank you,
Matt Dralle
Matronics Email List Administrator
****************************************************************************
**
Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines
****************************************************************************
**
The following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Kitfox-List.
You are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules therein.
Failure to use the Kitfox-List in the manner described below may result
in the removal of the subscribers from the List.
Kitfox-List Policy Statement
The purpose of the Kitfox-List is to provide a forum of discussion for
things related to this particular discussion group. The List's goals
are to serve as an information resource to its members; to deliver
high-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster camaraderie
among its members; and to support safe operation. Reaching these goals
requires the participation and cooperation of each and every member of
the List. To this end, the following guidelines have been established:
- Please keep all posts related to the List at some level. Do not submit
posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends, random humor, long
lost buddies' phone numbers, etc. etc.
- THINK carefully before you write. Ask yourself if your post will be
relevant to everyone. If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.
- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate. Try to be concise and
terse in your posts. Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts and
responses.
- Keep your signature brief. Please include your name, email address,
aircraft type/tail number, and geographic location. A short line
about where you are in the building process is also nice. Avoid
bulky signatures with character graphics; they consume unnecessary
space in the archive.
- DON'T post requests to the List for information when that info is
easily obtainable from other widely available sources. Consult the
web page or FAQ first.
- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of
your response the same as that of the original post. This makes it
easy to find threads in the archive.
- When responding, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your
response. DO use lines from the original post to help "tune in" the
reader to the topic at hand, but be selective. The impact that
quoting the entire original post has on the size of the archive
can not be overstated!
- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT
then go ahead and reply to the List. Be aware that clicking the
"reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
response to the original poster. You might have to actively address
your response with the original poster's email address.
- DO NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something
to add that is relevant and has a broad appeal. "Way to go!", "I
agree", and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent
to the original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.
- When responding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to
comment on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly
contribute something valuable.
- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
polite and respectful. Don't make snide comments, personally attack
other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously
controversial issue. This will only cause a pointless debate that
will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.
- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
subscribed to a given List are considered acceptable. Posts by
List members promoting their respective products or items for sale
should be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble
a typical SPAM message. The List isn't about commercialism, but
is about sharing information and knowledge. This applies to
everyone, including those who provide products to the entire
community. Informal presentation and moderation should be the
operatives with respect to advertising on the Lists.
-------
[This is an automated posting.]
do not archive
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
I got a call from a friend in the central part of California this afternoon.
He has a Model V+ (early 2003 with a 912S - 300 hours). He has been using
avgas for the usual - Mehanol - reasons and is in the process of having
Lockwood split the case and clean the whole thing up after what Lockwood
suspects is lead related problems. He has been changing oil at 50 hours,
Lockwood says 25.
The question he asked had to do with the resin formula on the final batch of
tanks Skyster sold before the bankurptcy. I had no info, but thought if
there was a problem with these tanks with mogas, there would be reports
sufacing on the list. I don't recall any. Does anyone with this era tank
have any advice for Eric.
Thanks in a advance.
Lowell
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Mogas revisited |
Lowell, Has your friend tried running seafoam through the fuel? I had low idle
miss on my 912 and ran it through 2 tanks and its fine now. I went on a couple
cross countries burning 100LL and after 40 gallons it took on a low rpm miss/stuck
valve. Seafoam is some good stuff... I tried 2 tanks of Marvel mystery
oil too. It got better, but not like seafoam did. Steve Bennett 912ul
In a message dated 02/03/09 19:35:25 Eastern Standard Time, lcfitt@sbcglobal.net
writes:
I got a call from a friend in the central part of California this afternoon.
He has a Model V+ (early 2003 with a 912S - 300 hours). He has been using
avgas for the usual - Mehanol - reasons and is in the process of having
Lockwood split the case and clean the whole thing up after what Lockwood
suspects is lead related problems. He has been changing oil at 50 hours,
Lockwood says 25.
The question he asked had to do with the resin formula on the final batch of
tanks Skyster sold before the bankurptcy. I had no info, but thought if
there was a problem with these tanks with mogas, there would be reports
sufacing on the list. I don't recall any. Does anyone with this era tank
have any advice for Eric.
Thanks in a advance.
Lowell
Message 11
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Lowell,
I understood that my V from mid '99 was after the change to a resin that
could stand ethanol. All I burn is premium mogas and have had no problems
yet.
Randy
Series 5/7 912S Warpdrive
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 5:26 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Mogas revisited
I got a call from a friend in the central part of California this afternoon.
He has a Model V+ (early 2003 with a 912S - 300 hours). He has been using
avgas for the usual - Mehanol - reasons and is in the process of having
Lockwood split the case and clean the whole thing up after what Lockwood
suspects is lead related problems. He has been changing oil at 50 hours,
Lockwood says 25.
The question he asked had to do with the resin formula on the final batch of
tanks Skyster sold before the bankurptcy. I had no info, but thought if
there was a problem with these tanks with mogas, there would be reports
sufacing on the list. I don't recall any. Does anyone with this era tank
have any advice for Eric.
Thanks in a advance.
Lowell
Message 12
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| Subject: | Brake line fittings question... |
I've started work on the Brakes and over the years have managed to lose a few Brass
poly-flo fittings. Does it matter if the fittings with the "brass" sleeves
OR the "nylon" sleeves are used, or is one one or the other required using the
Nylaflo pressure tubing.
Thanks for any suggestions!
--------
Chris Wehner
Tulsa, Oklahoma
Kitfox IV, 912, lots a mod's, 80% complete
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228390#228390
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Mogas revisited |
Apparently this problem had nothing to do with the engine, but rather the
clutch and the drive unit.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "sbennett3" <sbennett3@aol.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 5:01 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Mogas revisited
> Lowell, Has your friend tried running seafoam through the fuel? I had low
> idle miss on my 912 and ran it through 2 tanks and its fine now. I went on
> a couple cross countries burning 100LL and after 40 gallons it took on a
> low rpm miss/stuck valve. Seafoam is some good stuff... I tried 2 tanks
> of Marvel mystery oil too. It got better, but not like seafoam did. Steve
> Bennett 912ul
>
>
> In a message dated 02/03/09 19:35:25 Eastern Standard Time,
> lcfitt@sbcglobal.net writes:
>
> I got a call from a friend in the central part of California this
> afternoon.
> He has a Model V+ (early 2003 with a 912S - 300 hours). He has been using
> avgas for the usual - Mehanol - reasons and is in the process of having
> Lockwood split the case and clean the whole thing up after what Lockwood
> suspects is lead related problems. He has been changing oil at 50 hours,
> Lockwood says 25.
>
> The question he asked had to do with the resin formula on the final batch
> of
> tanks Skyster sold before the bankurptcy. I had no info, but thought if
> there was a problem with these tanks with mogas, there would be reports
> sufacing on the list. I don't recall any. Does anyone with this era tank
> have any advice for Eric.
>
> Thanks in a advance.
>
> Lowell
>
>
>
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Mogas revisited |
Thanks Randy,
This is exactly the information he is looking for.
Lowell
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Randy Daughenbaugh" <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 6:07 PM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Mogas revisited
> <rjdaugh@rapidnet.com>
>
> Lowell,
> I understood that my V from mid '99 was after the change to a resin that
> could stand ethanol. All I burn is premium mogas and have had no problems
> yet.
>
> Randy
> Series 5/7 912S Warpdrive
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 5:26 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Mogas revisited
>
>
> I got a call from a friend in the central part of California this
> afternoon.
>
> He has a Model V+ (early 2003 with a 912S - 300 hours). He has been using
> avgas for the usual - Mehanol - reasons and is in the process of having
> Lockwood split the case and clean the whole thing up after what Lockwood
> suspects is lead related problems. He has been changing oil at 50 hours,
> Lockwood says 25.
>
> The question he asked had to do with the resin formula on the final batch
> of
>
> tanks Skyster sold before the bankurptcy. I had no info, but thought if
> there was a problem with these tanks with mogas, there would be reports
> sufacing on the list. I don't recall any. Does anyone with this era tank
> have any advice for Eric.
>
> Thanks in a advance.
>
> Lowell
>
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Mogas revisited |
Lowell,
I have the first Series V aircraft, Kreemed tanks and all. I decided
to use avgas to avoid any issues with mogas/additives. I do use the
lead eliminating chemical that McBean sells to prevent lead buildup.
I don't have enough hours on the engine to have problems - yet, but
I'm not expecting any due to the lead scavenging additive. I have
heard that if the oil isn't changed regularly there could be lead
deposits in the gearbox. I would be sure to use the Lockwood
recommended oil/change time.
Rick Weiss
N39RW Series V Speedster, 912ULS
SkyStar S/N 1
Port Orange, FL
On Feb 3, 2009, at 7:26 PM, Lowell Fitt wrote:
> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
> I got a call from a friend in the central part of California this
> afternoon. He has a Model V+ (early 2003 with a 912S - 300 hours).
> He has been using avgas for the usual - Mehanol - reasons and is in
> the process of having Lockwood split the case and clean the whole
> thing up after what Lockwood suspects is lead related problems. He
> has been changing oil at 50 hours, Lockwood says 25.
>
> The question he asked had to do with the resin formula on the final
> batch of tanks Skyster sold before the bankurptcy. I had no info,
> but thought if there was a problem with these tanks with mogas,
> there would be reports sufacing on the list. I don't recall any.
> Does anyone with this era tank have any advice for Eric.
>
> Thanks in a advance.
>
> Lowell
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Mogas revisited |
If you are using 100LL you should be changing oil at 25 hrs and plugs at 50 hrs.
If you don't then headaches await you soon. If you use 91 oct. then oil and
filter at 50 hrs and plugs at 75 hrs.
Tell your friend not to worry about the ethanol. The lead in 100LL is far worse
in the long run. If he is using 100LL then he should also be using a fuel additive
like Decalin (from Aircraft Spruce) all the time. It is 1/2 oz. for each
10 gal.
The lead in 100LL gets in everything. Pilots in Europe use up to 18% ethanol and
in South America up to 24% so why worry about 7-10% here. Rotax says 5% is ok
in writing, but a good part of the Rotax owners in the USA use 91 Oct. with
ethanol. This question comes up in every class. 91 Oct. is better for the engine
than 100LL!
Even if you use a lead scavenging fuel additive you will have to pull the gear
box at 800 hrs and clean it out and you will probably have to send it to a service
center. You may have lead build up issues in the valve train or cylinders
to deal with. Rotax has some guide lines as to when you have to pull components
when using 100LL that others using 91 octane do not have to bother with.
Here is the old adage if you don't keep up on your Rotax maint:
Pay a little now or pay a lot later.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated
Rotax Service Center
520-574-1080
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228404#228404
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09 |
I will be going to Alaska late August, but will not be flying the
kitfox. If you plan to be in Fairbanks early September, I would like to
try to make contact. It is my old flying area and I might have access
to a C206.
----- Original Message -----
From: b gammon
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 9:09 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09
Is any one planning a "Kitfox" trip to Alaska this Summer?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
From: Kitfox-List Digest Server <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
To: Kitfox-List Digest List <kitfox-list-digest@matronics.com>
Sent: Monday, February 2, 2009 11:59:05 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09
*
Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
Today's complete Kitfox-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below. The .html file includes the Digest
formatted
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked
Indexes
and Message Navigation. The .txt file includes the plain ASCII
version
of the Kitfox-List Digest and can be viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=html&
Chapter 09-02-02&Archive=Kitfox
Text Version:
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&View=txt&C
hapter 09-02-02&Archive=Kitfox
======================
EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
======================
----------------------------------------------------------
Kitfox-List Digest Archive
---
Total Messages Posted Mon 02/02/09: 22
----------------------------------------------------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:04 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Lowlead)
2. 01:04 AM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09 (b
gammon)
3. 03:55 AM - Re: Re: ski saver AKFLYERBOB (Larry Huntley)
4. 06:02 AM - Re: Fw: ski saver (Lynn Matteson)
5. 07:01 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal
Test Report (Catz631@aol.com)
6. 07:03 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (lowflyer)
7. 07:05 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Catz631@AOL.COM)
8. 07:34 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (Rexinator)
9. 07:34 AM - Re: air worthiness (dcsfoto)
10. 09:41 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report (darinh)
11. 10:54 AM - Re: ski saver (George Wells)
12. 03:58 PM - Kitfox owner location map (Paul A. Franz, P.E.)
13. 04:45 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal
Test Report (patrick reilly)
14. 05:09 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver (patrick reilly)
15. 05:27 PM - Re: Kitfox broken motor mount (Malcolm Brubaker)
16. 05:44 PM - Posting videos (Paul Franz - Merlin GT)
17. 06:39 PM - Re: Re: Kitfox broken motor mount (Noel Loveys)
18. 06:55 PM - Flaperon hinge brackets (clemwehner)
19. 07:02 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver (Lynn Matteson)
20. 07:20 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver (patrick reilly)
21. 07:33 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver (Lynn Matteson)
22. 07:46 PM - Re: Flaperon hinge brackets (Tom Jones)
________________________________ Message 1
_____________________________________
Time: 12:04:06 AM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
From: "Lowlead" <j.t.cowie@xoxy.net>
Thanks Rex (and Lynn)! I wish I could say that it's this consistent
along the entire
length of the gap, but it's not. The gaps tend to be smaller on the
outboard
ends due to the way the tightened fabric act on the stab and elevator
frames.
Installation is hard to describe but not that hard to do. One thing
nice about
this tape is that it's very pliable and the adhesive is not
super-aggressive at
first. The tape is applied across the gap (we'll say the top side
first) with
a very slight 'drape' down and then firmly pressed onto the LE/TE
tubes. Then
the bottom side tape is applied with a very slight drape up (I used a
pc of
1/4" tube to force the drape up) and then pressed onto the LE/TE
tubes. The two
tapes stick to one another like a champ but leaves a triangular
'bubble' running
the entire length . I used a wooden tongue depressor and fingers to
press
the top and bottom tapes together to eliminate the bubble. (see
attached). It's
tough stuff and stretches well enough to get a tight installation.
There's
no worries about tearing or punching through with the tongue
depressor.
The control surface (elevator or rudder) must be in the neutral
position when tape
is applied or else a tension 'bias' might get built into the
installation
(ex: rudder now pulls left or right due to tape..)
Hope this makes sense...
Dan H.
rexinator wrote:
> That's exactly what I was trying to describe with my >-< symbol
and my
> little drawn image file. I agree with Lynn that it's a nice job.
Can
> you elaborate on how you applied so well?
>
> Rex
> Colorado M2/582
>
>
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228125#228125
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal2_183.jpg
________________________________ Message 2
_____________________________________
Time: 01:04:57 AM PST US
From: b gammon <gammon25@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09
This is my first attempt to participate in the Kitfox discussions.
=0AIs an
yone planning to fly a Kitfox to Alaska this
Summer?=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A________
________________________=0AFrom: Kitfox-List Digest Server
<kitfox-list@mat
ronics.com>=0ATo: Kitfox-List Digest List
<kitfox-list-digest@matronics.com
>=0ASent: Sunday, February 1, 2009 11:59:13 PM=0ASubject:
Kitfox-List Diges
t: 21 Msgs -
02/01/09=0A=0A*=0A=0A============
=============0A- Online Versions of Today's
List
Digest
Archive=0A==================
=======0A=0AToday's complete Kitfox-List Digest can
also be fou
nd in either of the =0Atwo Web Links listed below.- The .html file
includ
es the Digest formatted =0Ain HTML for viewing with a web browser
and featu
res Hyperlinked Indexes =0Aand Message Navigation.- The .txt file
include
s the plain ASCII version =0Aof the Kitfox-List Digest and can be
viewed wi
th a generic text editor =0Asuch as Notepad or with a web browser.
=0A=0AHT
ML Version:=0A=0A- -
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Sty
le=82701&View=html&Chapter 09-02-01&Archive=Kitfox=0A=0AText
Vers
ion:=0A=0A- -
http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82
701&View=txt&Chapter
09-02-01&Archive=Kitfox=0A=0A=0A===
====================0A- EMail
Versi
on of Today's List Digest
Archive=0A============
===========0A=0A=0A- - - - -
----------------
------------------------------------------=0A- - - - - - -
- - - - - - Kitfox-List Digest Archive=0A- - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - ---=0A- - -
- - - - - - - Total Messages Posted Sun 02/01/09: 21=0A-
- - - - ----------------------------------------------------------
=0A=0A=0AToday's Message
Index:=0A----------------------=0A=0A- - 1. 06
:38 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Catz631@aol.com)=0A- -
2
. 09:02 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Noel
Loveys)=0A-
- 3. 11:09 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Noel Loveys)=0A-
- 4. 11:26 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Lynn Matteson)
=0A- - 5. 12:02 PM - Kitfox with rotax fuel injection- (jason
Parker)
=0A- - 6. 02:02 PM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Randy
Da
ughenbaugh)=0A- - 7. 02:22 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report-
(L
ynn Matteson)=0A- - 8. 03:02 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report-
(Bob Brennan)=0A- - 9. 03:13 PM - Ski report/snow conditions- (Lynn
M
atteson)=0A- - 10. 03:19 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report-
(Lyn
n Matteson)=0A- - 11. 03:24 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report-
(
Larry Huntley)=0A- - 12. 05:00 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Report
- (Noel Loveys)=0A- - 13. 05:05 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Repor
t- (Lowlead)=0A- - 14. 05:30 PM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Repo
rt- (Lynn Matteson)=0A- - 15. 05:39 PM - Fw: ski saver- (Larry Hunt
ley)=0A- - 16. 06:11 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver- (patrick reilly)=0A-
- 17. 06:50 PM - Re: ski saver- (AKFLYERBOB)=0A- - 18. 08:17 PM - R
e: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Rexinator)=0A- - 19. 09:18 PM
- Re: Fw: ski saver- (John Bonewitz)=0A- - 20. 11:08 PM - Official
Ki
tfox-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)- (Matt Dralle)=0A- - 21.
1
1:25 PM - Official Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines- (Matt
Dralle)=0A=0A=0A
=0A________________________________- Message 1-
_______________________
______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:38:03 AM PST US=0AFrom:
Catz631@aol.com=0AS
ubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0AThat
foam weath
er striping sounds like a good idea. You could further refine
=0Athis by pu
tting a strip of teflon antichafe tape on the other side of the
=0Aweather
striping foam(oposite the adhesive side) or on the elevator leading
edge=0A
=0Afor that mater. This stuff is real slick and I bought a roll of
it from
Spruce=0A=0Aas a cowling chafe tape a while back. It works real
well.=0AOnl
y thing is, in the heat the adhesive on weather strip tends to give
way =0A
into a goo.=0A- That sailplane tape looks interesting also=0A- - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - Dick Maddux=0A- - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - Pensacola,Fl.=0A**************From Wall Street to Main Street
and everywhere in between, stay =0Aup-to-date with the latest news.
(http:/
/aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000023)=0A=0A__________________________
______
- Message 2- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime:
09:02:
06 AM PST US=0AFrom: "Noel Loveys"
<noelloveys@yahoo.ca>=0ASubject: RE: Kit
fox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AOr you could
attach the
seal, on the elevator side only with good old 1
in.=0AVelcro.=0A=0AAnother
thing to try is to cover the leading edge of the elevator and
rudder=0Awit
h the plastic tape then attach the gap seal to that tape so when
you=0Aremo
ve the seal you don't disturb the dope under
it.=0A=0ANoel=0A=0A-----Origin
al Message-----=0AFrom:
owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:ow
ner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
Matteson=0ASent: Sa
turday, January 31, 2009 8:12 AM=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re:
Elevator G
ap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AGood idea, but I'm from the camp
that always wa
nts to be able to take- =0Asomething apart if a problem arises. I
guess i
f a rock passed through- =0Athe elevator, you could always MEK the
Vee of
f from the elevator, and- =0Amaybe reattach it when the repairs were
made
. A longer process, by- =0Afar, than the tape method, but
cleaner-looking
.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #206
2, 600.2 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition
system=0AN
ew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Jan 31, 2009, at 2:37 AM, JC
Propeller D
esign wrote:=0A=0A> <propellerdesign@tele2.se>=0A>=0A> You can
use that, bu
t why not take 2 pieces sewn together at the- =0A> middle and dope
one Ve
e to stab and other to elevator.=0A>=0A> Or use sail fabric that
is air tig
ht from start=0A>=0A> Jan=0A> ----- Original Message ----- From:
"JetPilot"
<orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>=0A>
Sent: Fri
day, January 30, 2009 9:18 PM=0A> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator
Gap Se
al Test Report=0A>=0A>=0A>>
<orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A>>=0A>> Why not just
use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to- =0A>> seal the
gap ?
??- It would be permanent, easy to do, and look- =0A>> good !- Much
b
etter than tape.=0A>>=0A>> Mike=0A>>=0A>> --------=0A>>
"NO FEAR"
-- If you have no fear you did not go as fast- =0A>> as you could
have
!!!=0A>>=0A>> Kolb MK-III Xtra,
912-S=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>> Read this t
opic online here:=0A>>=0A>>
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=2
27727#227727=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A
>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>> __
________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus-
=0A>> s
ignature database 3814 (20090131) __________=0A>>=0A>> The message
was chec
ked by ESET NOD32
Antivirus.=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A_______________
_________________- Message 3-
_____________________________________=0A
=0A=0ATime: 11:09:12 AM PST US=0AFrom: "Noel Loveys"
<noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Report=0A=0ASunday afte
rnoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...- Friday
nights=0Anot t
he best night of the week for me;-).- =0A=0AI agree the X system
allows f
or a light hinge on a model but a place for=0Agrass and leaves etc.
To catc
h in the "Real thing".- =0A=0AWhat I was thinking at first was a
couple o
f pieces of say 2 1/2 inch tape=0Asewn right down the middle and
then one h
alf of each tape doped to the=0Astabilizers with the other halves
just fini
shed to match the plane.- They=0Ashould be stiff enough to seal the
gaps
in flight.- I'll attach a couple of=0Arough diagrams... emphasis on
the t
erm rough!=0A=0ANoel =0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom:
owner-kitfox-lis
t-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
] On
Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 8:04
AM=0ASubje
ct: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0ANope,
no picture
or drawing. Just visualize...after the inbibation- =0Awears
off....the f
lat surface of the stab and elevator, as viewed- =0Afrom the
side/edge, w
ith the tape starting on the top left, and- =0Acrossing to the
bottom rig
ht. (This of course assumes that you have- =0Aproperly made the tape
with
an inch of the sticky surfaces against- =0Aeach other so that the
tape c
an- be stuck down on the top left and- =0Athe bottom right) Now
another
tape from the bottom left crossing to- =0Athe top right. Where they
pass
by each other, they form an "X". Then- =0Aimagine a piece of tape 2"
wid
e being placed from top of stab to- =0Abottom of elev. (top left to
botto
m right), and next to it another- =0Atape placed from bottom left to
top
right. Continue alternating tapes- =0Auntil gap is sealed. I can
imagine
how this would look on a full-size- =0Aplane, and I don't like what
I ima
gine. It worked fine on the models- =0Aand looked ok, and made an
especia
lly lightweight hinge. I personally- =0Adon't like the idea of this
"over
and under" tape application, as it- =0Aalways leaves a place where
junk
can collect, no matter which way you- =0Ado it. I much prefer to let
the
elevator hang down, apply the tape- =0Aacross the gap, and leave it
at th
at. I use "racer's tape" that I- =0Aordered in orange, which is the
color
of my plane in that area...the- =0Acolor is not a perfect
match...howeve
r, I can't see that mismatch- =0Awhen I'm flying and neither can
anybody
else. The owners of "hangar- =0Aqueens" would not like my reasoning,
I'm
sure.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 2200,
#2062, 600.2 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire
ignition system
=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Jan 30, 2009, at 8:20
PM, Noel Lovey
s wrote:=0A=0A> Lynn:=0A> do you have a picture or drawing of
the X system?
=0A> Second inbibation is starting to cut in and I'm having a
problem-
=0A> visualizing your X setup.=0A>=0A> Noel=0A>=0A>=0A>
--- On Fri, 1/30/09
, Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net> wrote:=0A> From: Lynn Matteson
<lynnmatt
@jps.net>=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Report=0A> T
o: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0A> Received: Friday, January 30, 2009,
6:11 P
M=0A>=0A>=0A> If you really want to drive yourself nuts over
this gap seali
ng- =0A> issue, try the=0A> "X" method instead of the "Z" method.
We used
the=0A> "X" method on our model planes.=0A> The "Z" method has
been explai
ned....from under (or over) the=0A> trailing portion of the hort.
stab, to
over (or under) the leading- =0A> portion of=0A> the elevator,
forming a
"Z" when view from the side. The "X"=0A> method is just alternating
the pla
cement of lengths of 2" wide- =0A> tape, over=0A> and under, then
under a
nd over, etc., until the gap is sealed. In the=0A> "X" method, you
make str
ips of tape that go, say, 2" wide and=0A> from front to back,
instead of th
e "Z" method where you run the tape=0A> from side of elevator to
hinge, the
n hinge to hinge, and so on.=0A> The jury is still out on whether
this is a
good method or not...how- =0A> 'bout=0A> some
thoughts?=0A>=0A> As an as
ide, when this method is used in model planes, no hinge is- =0A>
needed,
as=0A> the plastic covering material itself is used for the "gap
seals" and
=0A> in using the "X" method, the elevator operates freely without
the use
=0A> of hinges...not recommended for "live-in"
airplanes.=0A>=0A> Lynn Matt
eson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062,
600.2 hrs
=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire ignition
system=0A> New ski
s done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Jan 30, 2009, at 12:53 PM, Paul
Franz - Me
rlin GT wrote:=0A>=0A> <paul@eucleides.com>=0A> >=0A> > On
Fri, January 30,
2009 7:28 am, kirk hull wrote:=0A> >> Does anybody have pictures of
the ga
p seal installation?=0A> >=0A> > I too would be interested in
seeing photos
. I'm interested in- =0A> details=0A> of shape,=0A> > overlap
and what ha
ppens to the slack when you run neutral or down=0A> elevator.=0A>
>=0A> > D
oes the slack start to peel a tiny bit on either the stabilizer-
=0A> or
the=0A> elevator with=0A> > dirt and debris sticking to the small
exposed b
it of adhesive?=0A> >=0A> > Which way is better to put them on -
leading ed
ge on top or- =0A> bottom of Get the name you've always wanted !
@ymail.c
om or- =0A> @rocketmail.com. _- =0A>
=0A>
======================
============0A=0A=0A_________________________
_______
- Message 4- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime:
11:26:
09 AM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubject:
Re: Kitfox
-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AI just flew my
plane today
, and during the pre-flight I noticed that- =0Athe gap-seal
tape...orange
Racer's Tape...that I applied on 10-5-2008- =0Ais still holding
fast. I
wrote the date onto the tape to keep track- =0Aof how well it held
up. Th
e same tape that I applied earlier...God- =0Aknows when...is also
still h
olding fas, so maybe we're overthinking- =0Athis gap-seal "problem."
Of c
ourse, mine is applied over the top of- =0Athe gap and nothing
underneath
, so the purists among us...you- know- =0Awho you are...would not
buy t
his fix.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 220
0, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire
ignition syste
m=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 11:32
AM, Noel Love
ys wrote:=0A=0A>=0A> Or you could attach the seal, on the
elevator side onl
y with good- =0A> old 1 in.=0A> Velcro.=0A>=0A> Another thing
to try is t
o cover the leading edge of the elevator- =0A> and rudder=0A> with
the pl
astic tape then attach the gap seal to that tape so when- =0A>
you=0A> re
move the seal you don't disturb the dope under it.=0A>=0A>
Noel=0A>=0A> ---
--Original Message-----=0A> From:
owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn-
=0A>
Matteson=0A> Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 8:12 AM=0A> To:
kitfox-list@
matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal
Test Repo
rt=0A>=0A>=0A> Good idea, but I'm from the camp that always
wants to be abl
e to take=0A> something apart if a problem arises. I guess if a rock
passed
through=0A> the elevator, you could always MEK the Vee off from the
elevat
or, and=0A> maybe reattach it when the repairs were made. A longer
process,
by=0A> far, than the tape method, but cleaner-looking.=0A>=0A>
Lynn Mattes
on=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062,
600.2 hrs
=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire ignition
system=0A> New ski
s done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Jan 31, 2009, at 2:37 AM, JC
Propeller Des
ign wrote:=0A>=0A>> <propellerdesign@tele2.se>=0A>>=0A>> You
can use that,
but why not take 2 pieces sewn together at the=0A>> middle and dope
one Vee
to stab and other to elevator.=0A>>=0A>> Or use sail fabric that
is air ti
ght from start=0A>>=0A>> Jan=0A>> ----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPi
lot"- =0A>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A>> To:
<kitfox-list@matronics.com>
=0A>> Sent: Friday, January 30, 2009 9:18 PM=0A>> Subject:
Kitfox-List: Re:
Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>>
<orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A>
>>=0A>>> Why not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with
Polytack to=0A
>>> seal the gap ???- It would be permanent, easy to do, and
look=0A>>> g
ood !- Much better than tape.=0A>>>=0A>>> Mike=0A>>>=0A>>>
--------=0A>>>
"NO FEAR" -- If you have no fear you did not go as
fast=0A>>>
as you could have !!!=0A>>>=0A>>> Kolb MK-III Xtra,
912-S=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>
=0A>>>=0A>>> Read this topic online here:=0A>>>=0A>>>
http://forums.matroni
cs.com/viewtopic.php?p=227727#227727=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=
0A>>>=0A>>>
=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>> __________
Information from ESET NOD32
Antivirus, version of virus=0A>>> signature database 3814 (20090131)
_____
_____=0A>>>=0A>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32
Antivirus.=0A>>>=0A
>>>=0A>>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A
________________________
________- Message 5-
_____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime
: 12:02:53 PM PST US=0AFrom: jason Parker
<litesellme@yahoo.com>=0ASubject:
Kitfox-List: Kitfox with rotax fuel
injection=0A=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v
=tUrFJi93MIo=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=nhiMjZGP-=0ADk=0Awww.you
tube
.com/watch?v=cD4_27rMX6Q=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=XEGx=0A===
======================0A=0A
______
__________________________- Message 6-
________________________________
_____=0A=0A=0ATime: 02:02:20 PM PST US=0AFrom: "Randy
Daughenbaugh" <rjdaug
h@rapidnet.com>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal
Test Repo
rt=0A=0A=0AMike,=0AUnless you get all the coats and cross
coats of poly spr
ay on it it won't=0Alast more than a year or two in the sun.- Maybe
that
is permanent enough,=0Abut I worry that with all the flexing, and
enough co
ats or polyspray, it=0Awill
crack.=0A=0ARandy=0A=0A=0A-----Original Message
-----=0AFrom:
owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox
-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JetPilot=0ASent: Friday,
January 3
0, 2009 1:19 PM=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Report
=0A=0A=0AWhy not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with
Polytack to se
al the gap=0A???- It would be permanent, easy to do, and look good
!- M
uch better than=0Atape.=0A=0AMike=0A=0A--------=0A"NO
FEAR" --
If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you=0Acould have
!!!=0A=0AKol
b MK-III Xtra, 912-S=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online
here:=0A=0Ahttp://forum
s.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=227727#227727=0A=0A=0A___________
________
_____________- Message 7-
_____________________________________=0A=0A
=0ATime: 02:22:29 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson
<lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubj
ect: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AThe
"grass catc
her" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or- =0A"S")
method of
applying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under- =0Athe front
to
over the back" or vice versa, there will always be a- =0Awedge of
space t
hat wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get- =0Aout of the
"X"
method. That's why I've contented myself with the- =0A"over the
front to
over the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically- =0Adirty, having
a spa
ce underneath that can eddy air, but have we a- =0Areally "clean"
plane o
therwise?=0A=0AYour diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good
job.-
- - - Lost- =0ASaturday? : )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV
Speedst
er, taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich
62x46=0AElectroai
r direct-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and
flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1,
2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I
can visu
alize the X system easy now...- =0A> Friday nights=0A> not the
best night
of the week for me;-).=0A>=0A> I agree the X system allows for a
light hin
ge on a model but a- =0A> place for=0A> grass and leaves etc. To
catch in
the "Real thing".=0A>=0A> What I was thinking at first was a
couple of pie
ces of say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A> sewn right down the middle
and then
one half of each tape doped to the=0A> stabilizers with the other
halves ju
st finished to match the- =0A> plane.- They=0A> should be stiff
enough
to seal the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a- =0A> couple of=0A>
rough di
agrams... emphasis on the term rough!=0A>=0A>
Noel=0A=0A=0A________________
________________- Message 8-
_____________________________________=0A
=0A=0ATime: 03:02:08 PM PST US=0AFrom: "Bob Brennan"
<matronics@bob.brennan
.name>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Report=0A=0A=0AI'
m glad to see someone else used the just-tape-over-the-top method.
When=0At
his topic came up a few months ago I noticed on a magazine cover
picture of
=0Amy plane I have for my desktop that at that time it had black
tape on th
e=0Atop side of the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I
bought the p
lane.=0AI assume it was wide electrical tape which is *everywhere*
on the p
lane=0Aincluding the leading edges and vertical stabiliser gap, and
which I
am=0Agradually replacing since it peels.=0A=0AI was hesitant to
post my me
thod since no one else had admitted here to that=0Asimple method. I
used a
yellow duct tape across the entire topside of the=0Agaps, installed
with th
e elevator fully down. With the elevator up it tucks=0Aneatly into
the gap.
I chose the top instead of the bottom so it would not=0Aaccumulate
anythin
g, and left the bottom open to see the hinges
on=0Apre-flight.=0A=0ASo far
it has lasted a season and made a difference to control authority
on=0Athe
short-field-over-trees grass strip that I use. Before sealing the gap
my=0A
slowest approach speed was determined by when I started losing pitch
contro
l=0Aversus stall speed, which made it tough to flare properly.
Possibly the
=0Aunder-cambered wings and smaller tail made the gap seals more
noticeable
on=0Aa Model 2 than later Models.=0A=0ABob Brennan -
N717GB=0AELSA Repairm
an, inspection rated=0A1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox=0ARotax 582
with 3 blade
prop=0AWrightsville Pa- =0A=0A-----Original
Message-----=0AFrom: owner-k
itfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matr
onic
s.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: 01 February 2009 5:18
pm=0ASubjec
t: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AThe
"grass catche
r" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or- =0A"S") method
of a
pplying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under- =0Athe front
to ov
er the back" or vice versa, there will always be a- =0Awedge of
space tha
t wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get- =0Aout of the
"X" me
thod. That's why I've contented myself with the- =0A"over the front
to ov
er the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically- =0Adirty, having a
space
underneath that can eddy air, but have we a- =0Areally "clean" plane
oth
erwise?=0A=0AYour diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good
job.- -
- - Lost- =0ASaturday? : )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV
Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich
62x46=0AElectroair d
irect-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and
flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 200
9, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I
can visuali
ze the X system easy now...- =0A> Friday nights=0A> not the best
night of
the week for me;-).=0A>=0A> I agree the X system allows for a
light hinge
on a model but a- =0A> place for=0A> grass and leaves etc. To
catch in th
e "Real thing".=0A>=0A> What I was thinking at first was a couple
of pieces
of say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A> sewn right down the middle and
then one
half of each tape doped to the=0A> stabilizers with the other halves
just
finished to match the- =0A> plane.- They=0A> should be stiff
enough to
seal the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a- =0A> couple of=0A> rough
diagr
ams... emphasis on the term rough!=0A>=0A>
Noel=0A=0A=0A___________________
_____________- Message 9-
_____________________________________=0A=0A
=0ATime: 03:13:42 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson
<lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubj
ect: Kitfox-List: Ski report/snow conditions=0A=0A=0ALast week I
had a "ski
tuck" due to the bungees not being set to a- =0Ahigh enough initial
tens
ion. This week I cut 2" from them and- =0Areinstalled and test flew
them
- yesterday and today, and could not- =0Aget it to happen again.
Admitt
edly, I wasn't really giving it what- =0Acould be considered an
acrobatic
test, but I made some (weak) dives- =0Aand pull-ups, and couldn't
get th
e ski, or skis, to drop or tuck. I- =0Aeven flew in bumpy-bangy air.
I ha
d made a tension check before and- =0Aafter the shortening, and I
picked
up about 8 pounds of tension per- =0Acord, or 16 pounds per
ski.=0A=0AI f
lew today to test the condition of the snow.- Last week when I-
=0Atrie
d to leave here to go to Oshkosh, the snow was so wet and heavy-
=0Athat
I could not get over 20 mph on the takeoff roll. This was after-
=0A2 day
s of above freezing temps...34-36 degrees F. Today, the-
=0Aconditions we
re the same...overnight of over freezing, and 34 F when- =0AI took
off. I
t took a bit of coaxing, but I got up alright, and- =0Alanded at 4
differ
ent snow-covered grass strips. It was the same at- =0Aall strips...a
bit
longer than normal (most ski takeoffs take more- =0Arunway, I've
read), b
ut doable. When I stopped for lunch, I parked in- =0Amy own tracks,
then
30 minutes later just rocked the plane a bit- =0Abefore fire-up,
firewall
ed it, and away I went, taxiing to the- =0Arunway...slowly. I used
up abo
ut 1100 feet of a crosswind, no-tracks- =0Arunway before giving up
and tr
ying it on a snowmobile-trodden runway- =0Ainto the wind. It still
took a
bout 300 feet before it got off the- =0Aground due to the sticky
snow con
ditions.=0A=0AAn article I had read (National Research Council of
Canada) t
alked- =0Aabout "snow friction" in this way:=0A=0A"Early in the
tests, it
was found that sliding resistance and- =0Aadhesion were far more
depende
nt upon snow conditions than on the- =0Adesign of the ski. Further,
the s
kiing quality of the snow changed- =0Acontinually and it was not
unusual
to observe marked changes taking- =0Aplace in less than an hour. The
publ
ication notes that there are- =0Atimes when the sliding resistance
of air
craft skis is so great that- =0Ait is impossible to reach flying
speed."
=0A=0AI'm having a blast test-flying my skis, and seeing
first-hand how-
=0Asome of the writings that I studied while building them have
merit.=0A
=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJabiru
2200, #2062, 6
05 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition
system=0ANew ski
s done and flying=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at
5:17 PM, Lynn
Matteson wrote:=0A=0A>=0A> The "grass catcher" is the problem
with either
the "X" or the- =0A> "Z" (or "S") method of applying tape...whether
you a
pply the tape- =0A> from "under the front to over the back" or vice
versa
, there will- =0A> always be a wedge of space that wants to collects
debr
is. It's just- =0A> harder to get out of the "X" method. That's why
I've
contented- =0A> myself with the "over the front to over the back"
method.
...yes- =0A> it's aerodynamically dirty, having a space underneath
that c
an eddy- =0A> air, but have we a really "clean" plane
otherwise?=0A>=0A>
Your diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job.- - - - Lost
- =0A> Saturday? : )=0A>=0A> Lynn Matteson=0A> Kitfox IV
Speedster, taild
ragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A>
Electroair d
irect-fire ignition system=0A> New skis done and
flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Feb
1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon
and I can
visualize the X system easy now...- =0A>> Friday nights=0A>> not
the bes
t night of the week for me;-).=0A>>=0A>> I agree the X system
allows for a
light hinge on a model but a- =0A>> place for=0A>> grass and
leaves etc.
To catch in the "Real thing".=0A>>=0A>> What I was thinking at
first was a
couple of pieces of say 2 1/2- =0A>> inch tape=0A>> sewn right
down the m
iddle and then one half of each tape doped to- =0A>> the=0A>>
stabilizers
with the other halves just finished to match the- =0A>> plane.- They
=0A>> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight.- I'll
attach a
- =0A>> couple of=0A>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term
rough!=0A>>
=0A>>
Noel=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message
10
- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 03:19:35 PM
PST US
=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubject: Re:
Kitfox-List: Eleva
tor Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AI just tape up to the hinges,
then tape ag
ain on the other side of- =0Athe hinge...all on the top-to-top
surfaces..
.I'm gettin' too old to- =0Abend down and look under there, Bob. :
)=0A
=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJabiru
2200, #2062, 6
05 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition
system=0ANew ski
s done and flying=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at
5:57 PM, Bob
Brennan wrote:=0A=0A> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=0A>=0A> I'm
glad to see
someone else used the just-tape-over-the-top- =0A> method.
When=0A> this
topic came up a few months ago I noticed on a magazine cover- =0A>
pictur
e of=0A> my plane I have for my desktop that at that time it had
black tape
- =0A> on the=0A> top side of the stabiliser gap, which was not
there whe
n I bought- =0A> the plane.=0A> I assume it was wide electrical
tape whic
h is *everywhere* on the- =0A> plane=0A> including the leading
edges and
vertical stabiliser gap, and which- =0A> I am=0A> gradually
replacing sin
ce it peels.=0A>=0A> I was hesitant to post my method since no one
else had
admitted- =0A> here to that=0A> simple method. I used a yellow
duct tape
across the entire topside- =0A> of the=0A> gaps, installed with
the elev
ator fully down. With the elevator up- =0A> it tucks=0A> neatly
into the
gap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it- =0A> would
not=0A> accu
mulate anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges on=0A>
pre-flig
ht.=0A>=0A> So far it has lasted a season and made a difference to
control
- =0A> authority on=0A> the short-field-over-trees grass strip
that I use
. Before sealing- =0A> the gap my=0A> slowest approach speed was
determin
ed by when I started losing- =0A> pitch control=0A> versus stall
speed, w
hich made it tough to flare properly. Possibly- =0A> the=0A>
under-camber
ed wings and smaller tail made the gap seals more- =0A> noticeable
on=0A>
a Model 2 than later Models.=0A>=0A> Bob Brennan - N717GB=0A>
ELSA Repairm
an, inspection rated=0A> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox=0A> Rotax 582
with 3 b
lade prop=0A> Wrightsville Pa=0A>=0A> -----Original
Message-----=0A> From:
owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server
@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn- =0A> Matteson=0A> Sent: 01
February 20
09 5:18 pm=0A> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re:
Kitfox-List:
Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A>=0A>=0A> The "grass catcher" is
the proble
m with either the "X" or the "Z" (or=0A> "S") method of applying
tape...whe
ther you apply the tape from "under=0A> the front to over the back"
or vice
versa, there will always be a=0A> wedge of space that wants to
collects de
bris. It's just harder to get=0A> out of the "X" method. That's why
I've co
ntented myself with the=0A> "over the front to over the back"
method....yes
it's aerodynamically=0A> dirty, having a space underneath that can
eddy ai
r, but have we a=0A> really "clean" plane otherwise?=0A>=0A>
Your diagrams
are very understandable, Noel...good job.- - - - Lost=0A> Saturday?
: )=0A>=0A> Lynn Matteson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster,
taildragger=0A> Jabiru
2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair
direct-fire ignitio
n system=0A> New skis done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Feb 1,
2009, at 1:57 P
M, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon and I can
visualize the X s
ystem easy now...=0A>> Friday nights=0A>> not the best night of
the week fo
r me;-).=0A>>=0A>> I agree the X system allows for a light hinge
on a model
but a=0A>> place for=0A>> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the
"Real thin
g".=0A>>=0A>> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pieces
of say 2
1/2=0A>> inch tape=0A>> sewn right down the middle and then one
half of eac
h tape doped to- =0A>> the=0A>> stabilizers with the other halves
just fi
nished to match the=0A>> plane.- They=0A>> should be stiff enough
to seal
the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a=0A>> couple of=0A>> rough
diagrams...
emphasis on the term rough!=0A>>=0A>>
Noel=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A_______________
_________________- Message 11-
____________________________________=0A
=0A=0ATime: 03:24:36 PM PST US=0AFrom: "Larry Huntley"
<asq@roadrunner.com>
=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Report=0A=0A=0AI did th
at with ski saver. Worked fin and not too complicated for my brain.
=0AI ca
n make decent 3pt landings with the Soob on front and no
=0Aflaps----Barely
, But it works.- - Larry 4-1200 Soob=0A=0A----- Original Message
-----
=0AFrom: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=0ASent:
Sunday, Februar
y 01, 2009 5:57 PM=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal
Test Repor
t=0A=0A=0A> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=0A>=0A> I'm glad to
see someone el
se used the just-tape-over-the-top method. When=0A> this topic came
up a fe
w months ago I noticed on a magazine cover picture =0A> of=0A> my
plane I h
ave for my desktop that at that time it had black tape on the=0A>
top side
of the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I bought the =0A>
plane.=0A
> I assume it was wide electrical tape which is *everywhere* on the
plane
=0A> including the leading edges and vertical stabiliser gap, and
which I a
m=0A> gradually replacing since it peels.=0A>=0A> I was hesitant
to post my
method since no one else had admitted here to =0A> that=0A> simple
method.
I used a yellow duct tape across the entire topside of the=0A> gaps,
insta
lled with the elevator fully down. With the elevator up it =0A>
tucks=0A> n
eatly into the gap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it would
not
=0A> accumulate anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges
on=0A>
pre-flight.=0A>=0A> So far it has lasted a season and made a
difference to
control authority =0A> on=0A> the short-field-over-trees grass
strip that
I use. Before sealing the gap =0A> my=0A> slowest approach speed
was determ
ined by when I started losing pitch =0A> control=0A> versus stall
speed, wh
ich made it tough to flare properly. Possibly the=0A> under-cambered
wings
and smaller tail made the gap seals more noticeable =0A> on=0A> a
Model 2 t
han later Models.=0A>=0A> Bob Brennan - N717GB=0A> ELSA
Repairman, inspecti
on rated=0A> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox=0A> Rotax 582 with 3
blade prop=0A
> Wrightsville Pa=0A>=0A> -----Original Message-----=0A> From:
owner-kitfox
-list-server@matronics.com=0A>
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.c
om] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0A> Sent: 01 February 2009 5:18
pm=0A> To: k
itfox-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap
Seal Te
st Report=0A>=0A>=0A> The "grass catcher" is the problem with
either the "X
" or the "Z" (or=0A> "S") method of applying tape...whether you
apply the t
ape from "under=0A> the front to over the back" or vice versa, there
will a
lways be a=0A> wedge of space that wants to collects debris. It's
just hard
er to get=0A> out of the "X" method. That's why I've contented
myself with
the=0A> "over the front to over the back" method....yes it's
aerodynamicall
y=0A> dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy air, but have
we a=0A>
really "clean" plane otherwise?=0A>=0A> Your diagrams are very
understanda
ble, Noel...good job.- - - - Lost=0A> Saturday? : )=0A>=0A> Lynn
Ma
tteson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru 2200,
#2062, 605 hrs
=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire ignition
system=0A> New ski
s done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel
Loveys wrote
:=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy
now...=0A
>> Friday nights=0A>> not the best night of the week for
me;-).=0A>>=0A>> I
agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a=0A>>
place fo
r=0A>> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real
thing".=0A>>=0A>> What I
was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2=0A>> inch
tape
=0A>> sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape
doped to th
e=0A>> stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match
the=0A>> pl
ane.- They=0A>> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight.-
I'l
l attach a=0A>> couple of=0A>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the
term rough
!=0A>>=0A>>
Noel=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------=0A=0A=0AChecked by AVG -
http://www.
avg.com=0A6:02 PM=0A=0A=0A________________________________-
Message 12-
____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:00:25 PM
PST US=0AFr
om: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List:
Elevato
r Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0ANot lost just out of town until
later last n
ight.=0A=0AWhat did you think of the idea of using Velcro (just on
the rudd
er)- Would=0Amake it easy to clean and also easy to remove the
rudder for
repairs due to=0Ahangar rash.=0A=0AI'm going to try a gap seal
this spring
when I get the plane out again.- At=0Aleast on the rudder to try to
give
me more authority for slips.- Those big=0Afloats hanging three feet
or m
ore below the CG really want to right the=0Aplane.- So far I've been
givi
ng full ruddr and controlling the slip with the=0Aailerons.- Even
doing t
hat the slip is more gentle than what I can get with=0Ano problems
from a C
-172.=0A=0ANoel=0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom:
owner-kitfox-list-s
erver@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com]
On Be
half Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 6:48
PM=0ASubject:
Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AThe
"grass catcher"
is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or- =0A"S") method of
appl
ying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under- =0Athe front to
over
the back" or vice versa, there will always be a- =0Awedge of space
that w
ants to collects debris. It's just harder to get- =0Aout of the "X"
metho
d. That's why I've contented myself with the- =0A"over the front to
over
the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically- =0Adirty, having a
space un
derneath that can eddy air, but have we a- =0Areally "clean" plane
otherw
ise?=0A=0AYour diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job.-
-
- - Lost- =0ASaturday? : )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV
Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich
62x46=0AElectroair di
rect-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and
flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009
, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I can
visualiz
e the X system easy now...- =0A> Friday nights=0A> not the best
night of
the week for me;-).=0A>=0A> I agree the X system allows for a
light hinge o
n a model but a- =0A> place for=0A> grass and leaves etc. To catch
in the
"Real thing".=0A>=0A> What I was thinking at first was a couple of
pieces
of say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A> sewn right down the middle and
then one
half of each tape doped to the=0A> stabilizers with the other halves
just f
inished to match the- =0A> plane.- They=0A> should be stiff enough
to s
eal the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a- =0A> couple of=0A> rough
diagra
ms... emphasis on the term rough!=0A>=0A>
Noel=0A=0A=0A____________________
____________- Message 13-
____________________________________=0A=0A=0A
Time: 05:05:11 PM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap
Seal Test
Report=0AFrom: "Lowlead" <j.t.cowie@xoxy.net>=0A=0A=0AI use a
3M 3372 poly
urethane surface protection tape applied on both top and bottom=0Aof
the ga
p (previous posts shown as >-=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online
here:=0A=0Ahtt
p://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084=0A=0A=0AAt
tachment
s:
=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_141.jpg=0A=0A=
0A______
__________________________- Message 14-
_______________________________
_____=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:30:02 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson
<lynnmatt@jps.
net>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test
Report=0A=0A=0A
That's a good-looking job, LL.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV
Speedster, ta
ildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich
62x46=0AElectroair dire
ct-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0Ado not
archive=0A=0A
=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 8:01 PM, Lowlead wrote:=0A=0A>=0A> I use
a 3M 3372 po
lyurethane surface protection tape applied on- =0A> both top and
bottom o
f the gap (previous posts shown as >-=0A>=0A>=0A> Read this
topic online he
re:=0A>=0A>
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084=0A>
=0A>=0A> Attachments:=0A>=0A>
http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_1
41.jpg=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A________________________________-
Message 15- __
__________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:39:40 PM PST
US=0AFrom:
"Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski
saver
=0A=0A=0AJust received this. Does it sound like the same
material?- Larry
=0A=0A----- Original Message ----- =0AFrom:
<info@tognar.com>=0ASent: Sunda
y, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM=0ASubject: Re: ski
saver=0A=0A=0A>=0A> Yes,=0A
> check this link on our bags/racks page=0A>
http://www.tognar.com/bags_rac
ks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html=0A> The top item is the
scuff
saver tape,=0A> Thanks,=0A> Cat=0A>
www.tognar.com=0A>=0A>=0A>> Do you stil
l have "ski saver" tape?- Larry Huntley- asq@roadrunner.com=0A>
Ye=0A>
=0A=0A=0A----------------------------------------------------------
--------
--------------=0A=0A=0AChecked by AVG -
http://www.avg.com=0A6:02 PM=0A=0A
=0A________________________________- Message 16-
______________________
______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:11:13 PM PST US=0AFrom:
patrick reilly <pat
reilly43@hotmail.com>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski
saver=0A=0A=0ALar
ry=2C Thanks for the web link. I ordered 5 feed just to have on
hand. Th
=0Aat price for 14" wide clear tape is unreal. There are many times
I wante
d s=0Aome of that tape to protect paint on a car=2C motorcycle
tank=2C
etc. I'll =0Ause it on the gap seal=2C Alla Lynn Matteson top side
only.
Lynn=2C if that=0Acurls down into the gap=2C rather than up=2C
I don'
t know why anybody woul=0Ad use any other method.=0Ado not archive
Pat Reil
lyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From: asq@roadrun=0Aner.com>
x-list@matronics.com> Subject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A> Date:
Sun=2
C 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500> > --> Kitfox-List message posted =0Aby:
"Larry
Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> > Just received this. Does it
sou=0And like
the same material? Larry> > ----- Original Message ----- > From:
<i=0Anfo@
tognar.com>> To: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> Sent:
Sunday=2C
=0AFebruary 01=2C 2009 7:54 PM> Subject: Re: ski saver> > > >> >
Yes=2C
> > che=0Ack this link on our bags/racks page> >
http://www.tognar.com/bags
_racks_boo=0At_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html> > The top item
is the
scuff saver t=0Aape=2C> > Thanks=2C> > Cat> > www.tognar.com> >>
>> >>
Do you still have "s=0Aki saver" tape? Larry Huntley
asq@roadrunner.com> >
Ye> >> > >
------------=0A-------------------------------------------------
-------------------> > > >=0A=====> > >
=0A=0A___________________
_____________- Message 17-
____________________________________=0A=0A
=0ATime: 06:50:23 PM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: ski
saver=0AFrom: "
AKFLYERBOB" <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>=0A=0A=0ALarry=0AWhat
material are
you talking about?=0AI'm sure every one would like to
know.=0ABob=0A=0A----
----=0ABob Wolfe..Soldotna, Alaska=0AKF Mod I and
III=0A=0A=0ARead this top
ic online
here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228098#2
28098=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message 18-
___________
_________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 08:17:28 PM PST
US=0AFrom: Rexinato
r <rexinator@gmail.com>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap
Seal T
est Report=0A=0A=0AThat's exactly what I was trying to describe
with my-
>-<- symbol and my =0Alittle drawn image file.- I agree with Lynn
that
it's a nice job. Can =0Ayou elaborate on how you applied so
well?=0A=0ARex
=0AColorado M2/582=0A=0A=0ALowlead wrote:=0A>=0A> I use a
3M 3372 polyureth
ane surface protection tape applied on both top and=0Abottom of the
gap (pr
evious posts shown as >-=0A>=0A>=0A> Read this topic online
here:=0A> http:
//forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084=0A>=0A>=0A>
Attachme
nts: =0A> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_141.jpg=0A>-
=0A=0A
=0A________________________________- Message 19-
______________________
______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 09:18:50 PM PST US=0ASubject: Re:
Kitfox-List:
Fw: ski saver=0AFrom: John Bonewitz <bonewitz@gmail.com>=0A=0AWe
have a wi
nner! I'm going to order some of this stuff. There are
probably=0Alots of o
ther uses besides gap seal.=0A=0AThanks,=0AJohn
Bonewitz=0ASeries 5=0A=0AOn
Sun, Feb 1, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Larry Huntley <asq@roadrunner.com>
wrote:=0A
=0A>=0A> Just received this. Does it sound like the same
material?- Larry
=0A>=0A> ----- Original Message ----- From:
<info@tognar.com>=0A> To: "Larr
y Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>=0A> Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009
7:54 PM
=0A> Subject: Re: ski saver=0A>=0A>=0A>> Yes,=0A>> check
this link on our b
ags/racks page=0A>>
http://www.tognar.com/bags_racks_boot_ski_binding_snowb
oard_accessory.html=0A>> The top item is the scuff saver
tape,=0A>> Thanks,
=0A>> Cat=0A>> www.tognar.com=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>- Do you still
have "ski save
r" tape?- Larry Huntley- asq@roadrunner.com=0A>>>=0A>>
Ye=0A>>=0A>>=0A>
=0A>=0A>
------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------=0A>=0A>=0A> Checked by AVG -
http://www.avg.com=0A> 6:02 PM
=0A>=0A>=0A=0A________________________________- Message 20-
___________
_________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 11:08:00 PM PST
US=0AFrom: Matt Dra
lle <dralle@matronics.com>=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Official
Kitfox-List FAQ
(Frequently Asked Questions)=0A=0A=0ADear
Listers,=0A=0APlease read over t
he Kitfox-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below.-
The=0Acomplete Ki
tfox-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at
the=0Afollowin
g URL:=0A=0A-
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Kitfox-List.FAQ.html=0A=0ATha
nk you,=0A=0AMatt Dralle=0AMatronics Email List
Administrator=0A=0A=0A[ Not
e: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such
as=0A
- - - - Courier.- Proportional fonts will cause display formattin
g errors. ]=0A=0A=0A- This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online
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ollowing address:=0A- =0A- - - - - - - - http://www.matro
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READ.- This
document contains Kitfox-List policies and information=0Afor new and
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ubscribers.- Understanding the Kitfox-List policies will=0Aminimize
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ems for the Administrator, and will help keep the
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othly for all of
us.=0A=0A=0A******************************************=0A*
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types will be rejected and email returned to=0A- - - sender.- The e
nclosure types listed above are relatively safe from=0A- - - a virus
standpoint and don't pose a particularly large security
risk.=0A=0A- 7) !
! All incoming enclosures will be scanned for viruses prior to
posting=0A
- - - to the List.- This is done in real time and will not slow dow
n=0A- - - the process of posting the message !!=0A=0A=0A- Here
are
some rules for posting enclosures.- Failure to abide by these
rules=0A=0A
- could result in the removal of a subscriber's email address from the
Li
sts.=0A=0A- 1) Pay attention to what you are posting!!- Make sure
that
the files=0A- - - you are enclosing aren't HUGE (greater that 1MB).
- Remember that there=0A- - - are still people checking they're ema
il via dial up modem.- If you post=0A- - - 30MB worth of pictures,
you are placing an unnecessary burden on these=0A- - - folks and the
rest of us, for that matter.=0A=0A- 2) SCALE YOUR PICTURES
DOWN!!!- I d
on't want to see huge 3000 x 2000=0A- - - pictures getting posted
tha
t are 3 or 4MB each.- This is just =0A- - - unacceptable.- Use a
program such as Photoshop to scale the picture=0A- - - down to
someth
ing on the order of 800 x 600 and try to keep the=0A- - - file size
t
o less-than 200KB, preferably much less.=0A=0A- - - Microsoft has
a r
eally awesome utility available for free that allows=0A- - - you to
R
ight-Click on a picture in Explorer and automatically =0A- - - scale
it down and resave it.- This is a great utility - get it, use
it!=0A-
- -
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/downloads/powertoys/xppowertoys.
mspx=0A- - - Look for the link "Image Resizer"=0A=0A- 3) !! This
wo
uld seem to go without saying, but I'll say it anyway.- Do not=0A- -
- post anything that would be considered offensive by your
grandmother.
=0A- - - And you know what I'm saying; I don't want to see anything
e
ven =0A- - - questionable. !!=0A=0A- 4) REMEMBER THIS: If you
post
a 1MB enclosure to a List with 1000 members=0A- - - subscribed, your
1MB enclosure must be resent 1000 times amounting=0A- - - to 1MB X
10
00 = 1 Gigabyte of network traffic!!- BE CAREFUL and =0A- - - BE
COURTEOUS!=0A=0A- Also see the section below on the Matronics
Photo and F
ile Share where=0A- you can have your files and photos posted on the
Matr
onics web server=0A- for long time viewing and
availability.=0A=0A=0A****
***************=0A*** Digest Mode
***=0A*******************=0A=0A- Each d
ay, starting at 12 midnight PST US, a new 'digest' will be
started.=0A- T
his digest will contain the same information that is currently
appended =0A
- to the archive file.- It has all of the headers except for the
"From:
"=0A- and "Subject:" lines removed, and includes a message separator
cons
isting =0A- of a line of underscores.=0A=0A- Each day at 23:55
PST US,
the day's messages as described above will be=0A- combined and sent
as a
single message to everyone on the digest email list.=0A=0A- To
subscribe
to the digest list, use the same subscription web form =0A-
described abo
ve, and just select the Digest version of the List.=0A=0A- - - -
- - - - http://www.matronics.com/subscribe=0A=0A- Note that you *
can* be subscribed to both the realtime and digest versions=0A- of
the Li
st at the same time.- This is perfectly acceptable.=0A=0A- Now
some cav
eats:=0A=0A- * Messages sent to "kitfox-list-digest" will be
forwarded to
the standard=0A- - email list.- In other words, you cannot post mess
ages only to the=0A- - digest List.=0A=0A- * If you are
subscribed to
both the regular List and the digest List, you=0A- - will receive
the
realtime postings as well as the digest at the end of=0A- - the
day.=0A
=0A- * If you reply to the digest email, your message will be
forwarded t
o the=0A- - normal list associated with the digest.- Important Note:
- Please change=0A- - the subject line to reflect the topic of your
r
esponse!- Also, please =0A- - *do not include all or most of the
dige
st in your reply*.=0A=0A=0A****************************=0A***
List Digest B
rowser ***=0A****************************=0A=0A- An archive of
all the Li
st Digests can be found online in either plain text=0A- or HTML
format.
- These archives contain the exact Digest that was posted to=0A- the
Di
gest email list on the given day.- The Digest Archives can be
found=0A-
at the following location: =0A=0A- - - - - - - - http://ww
w.matronics.com/digest=0A=0A=0A************************************
*****=0A
*** The "DO NOT ARCHIVE" Message Flag
***=0A*******************************
**********=0A=0A- At times, your message may concern something
that is re
velent only to a very=0A=0A- small number of persons or to a
limited area
, and you may not wish to archive=0A=0A- it.- In such a case,
simply pu
t the following phrase anywhere in the =0A- message:=0A=0A- - -
-
- - - - do not archive=0A=0A- Your message will not be appended
to the archive, but will be sent to List =0A- email distribution as
norma
l.=0A=0A=0A**********************************************=0A*****
READ THIS
- Automatic Unsubscribes
*****=0A*****************************************
*****=0A=0A- Note that if your email address begins to cause
problems suc
h as bounced=0A- email, mailbox is filled, or any other errors, your
addr
ess will be promptly=0A- removed from the List.- If you discover
that y
ou are no longer receiving=0A- messages from the Kitfox-List, go to
the f
ollowing Web page, and look=0A- for your email address and a
possible rea
son for your removal.=0A=0A- The Matronics Email List uses utility
called
the "Email Weasel" that =0A- automatically looks though the day's
bounce
d email for addresses that =0A- caused problems due to common things
like
"user is unknown", "mailbox =0A- full", etc.- If the Email Weasel
remo
ves your email address from the =0A- Lists you will find record of
it at
the following URL:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - http://www.matronic
s.com/unsubscribed=0A=0A- If the problem listed on the web site
above has
been resolved, please feel =0A- free to resubscribe to the Lists of
your
choice.=0A=0A=0A*******************************=0A*** List
Member Informat
ion ***=0A*******************************=0A=0A- If you have not
done so
already, please email me your phone numbers and =0A- paper mail
address i
n the following format:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - smith@somehost
.com=0A- - - - - - - - Joe Smith=0A- - - - - -
- - 123 Airport Lane=0A- - - - - - - - Tower, CA 91234-
1234=0A- - - - - - - - 098-765-1234 w=0A- - - - -
- - - 123-456-7890 h=0A=0A- Please forward this information to the
following email address:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - requests@mat
ronics.com=0A=0A- I have a file of such things, that I typically
use to c
ontact you when =0A- there are problems with your email address.-
The i
nformation will NOT =0A- be used for any other commercial
purpose.=0A=0A
=0A****************************************=0A*** Realtime Web
Email List B
rowsing ***=0A****************************************=0A=0A-
Recent mess
ages posted to the Kitfox-List are also made available on=0A- the
Web for
realtime browsing.- Seven days worth of back postings are=0A-
availabl
e with this feature.- The messages can be sorted by Subject, =0A-
Autho
r, Date, or Message Thread.- The Realtime List Browser indexes are
=0A-
updated twice per hour at xx:15 and xx:45.- You can also reply to a
mess
age=0A=0A- or start a new message directly from the List Browser
Interfac
e (coming soon).=0A- You do not have to be subscribed to the given
list t
o use the List=0A- Browser Interface in view-mode.=0A=0A- - - -
- - - -
http://www.matronics.com/browselist/kitfox-list=0A=0A=0A***
****************************************=0A*** Web Forums Bulletin
Board In
terface ***=0A*******************************************=0A=0A-
A phpBB
BBS web Forums front end is available for all Kitfox-List
content.=0A- co
ntent.- The Forums contain all of the same content available via the
emai
l=0A=0A- distribution and found on the various archive viewing
formats su
ch as the =0A- List Browse, etc.- Any posts on the web Forums will
be c
ross posted to the =0A- respective email List, and posts to the
Email Lis
t will be cross posted to =0A- the web Forums.=0A=0A- You may
view all
List content on the Forums without any special login.=0A- If you
wish to
post a message via the Web Forum interface, however, you=0A- will
need to
Register.- This is a simple process that takes only a few=0A-
minutes.
- A link to the Registration page can be found at the top of the=0A-
ma
in web Forums page.- Note that registering on the Forum web site
also=0A
- enables you to send email posts to the Lists as well.- You will also
need to=0A=0A- Subscribe to the respective Email List as described
above
to receive the=0A- Email Distribution of the List,
however.=0A=0A- The
Matroincs Email List Web BBS Forums can be found at the following
URL:=0A
=0A- - - - - - - - http://forums.matronics.com=0A=0A=0A****
*****************************=0A*** Matronics Email List Wiki
***=0A*******
**************************=0A=0AIn an attempt to make it easy to
store and
find structured and often accessed =0Ainformation, Matronics has
installed
a Wiki at:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - http://wiki.matronics.com
=0A=0AThe Wiki allows individuals to create web pages to contain
useful inf
ormation =0Afor other users of the mailing lists and web site.
Unlike an or
dinary web page=0A=0Awhere the content needs to be submitted to
Matronics f
or inclusion, the Wiki =0Apermits the users to construct their own
pages an
d have them visible immediately.=0A=0AWhile constructing pages for
the Wiki
is not difficult, some may not be =0Acomfortable building pages.- In
tha
t case, simply prepare the text and any =0Aimages and email it
to:=0A=0A-
- - - - - - - wiki-support@matronics.com=0A=0AOne of the vol
unteers on that list will take your submission and construct =0Aa
Wiki page
for you.=0A=0AOften someone produces a particularly useful posting
in emai
l one one of the =0ALists that would be of general interest. In that
case M
atronics may take that =0Apost and convert it into a Wiki
page.=0A=0A=0A***
******************=0A*** List Archives
***=0A*********************=0A=0A-
A file containing of all of the previous postings to the Kitfox-List
is=0A
- available on line.- The archive file information is available via
the
=0A- Web and FTP in a number of forms.- Each are briefly described
bel
ow:=0A=0A=0A- * Kitfox-List.FAQ =0A=0A- - - - - - - Latest
ve
rsion of the Kitfox-List Frequently Asked Question =0A- - - - -
- - page (this document).=0A=0A- * Kitfox-Archive.digest.complete
=0A
=0A- - - - - - - Complete file with most of the email header in
fo removed and =0A- - - - - - - page breaks inserted between
messages.=0A=0A- * Kitfox-Archive.digest.vol-??- =0A=0A- - - -
- - - Same as the file above, but broken up into small sections that
=0A- - - - - - - can more easily handled.=0A=0A- * Kitfox-A
rchive.digest.complete.zip =0A=0A- - - - - - - Same as the Kitf
ox-Archive.digest.complete file above, but =0A- - - - - - - i
n PKZIP format.- Use "binary" data transfer methods.=0A=0A- *
Kitfox-Ar
chive.digest.complete.Z =0A=0A- - - - - - - Same as the Kitfox-
Archive.digest.complete file above, but in =0A- - - - - - - U
NIX compress format.- Use "binary" data transfer
methods.=0A=0A=0A- Dow
nload Via FTP=0A- ----------------=0A=0A- The archive file is
available
via anonymous FTP from ftp.matronics.com=0A- in the "/pub/Archives"
dire
ctory.- It is updated daily and can be found in=0A- a number of
formats
as described above. (All filenames are case sensitive.)=0A=0A- - -
- - - - - - ftp://ftp.matronics.com/pub/Archives=0A=0A=0A- Do
wnload Via Web=0A- ----------------=0A=0A- The archives are also
availa
ble via a web listing.- These can be found=0A- toward the bottom of
the
following web page:=0A=0A- - - - - - - - - http://www.ma
tronics.com/archives=0A=0A=0A**************************************
****=0A*
** Complete List Web Archive Browsing
***=0A*******************************
***********=0A=0A- All messages posted to the Kitfox-List are also
availa
ble using the=0A- Email List Archive Browsing feature.- With this
utili
ty, all messages=0A- in the List are indexed, and individual
sub-archives
can be browsed.=0A=0A- - - - - - - - - http://www.matron
ics.com/archive/archive-index.cgi?Kitfox=0A=0A=0A******************
********
***************=0A**** High-Speed Archive Search Engine
***=0A*************
****************************=0A=0A- You can use the custom,
high-performa
nce Matronics Email List Search Engine=0A- to quickly locate and
browse a
ny messages that have been posted to the=0A- List.- The Engine
allows t
he user to easily search any of the currently=0A- available List
archives
.=0A=0A- - - - - - - - - http://www.matronics.com/search
=0A=0A=0A****************************=0A*** File and Photo
Share ***=0A****
************************=0A=0A- With the Matronics Email List File
and Ph
oto Share you can share pictures=0A- and other data with members of
the L
ist without having to forward a =0A- copy of it to everyone.- To
share
your Files and Photos, simply email =0A- them to:=0A=0A- - - -
- - - - - pictures@matronics.com=0A=0A- !! ==> Please inclu
ding the following information with each submission:=0A=0A- - - -
- - - - - 1) Email Lists that they are related to.=0A- - -
- - - - - - 2) Your Full Name.=0A- - - - - - -
- - 3) Your Email Address.=0A- - - - - - - - - 4) One
line Subject description.=0A- - - - - - - - - 5) Multi-l
ine, multi-paragraph description of topic.=0A- - - - - - -
- - 6-x) One-line Description of each photo or file=0A=0A- Prior
to p
ublic availability of the files and photos, each will be scanned=0A-
for
viruses.- Please also note that the process of making the files
and=0A-
photos available on the web site is a pseudo-manual process, and I try
to
=0A- process them every few days.=0A=0A- Following the
availability of
the new Photoshare, an email message will be=0A- sent to the Email
Lists
enumerated in 1) above indicating that the new=0A- Share is
available and
what the direct URL to it is.=0A=0A- For a current list of
available Pho
toshares, have a look at the Main=0A- Index Page:=0A=0A- - - -
- - - - -
http://www.matronics.com/photoshare=0A=0A=0A***********
***************=0A*** List Archive CDROM
***=0A**************************
=0A=0A- A complete Matronics Email List Archive CD is available
that cont
ains=0A- all of the archives since the beginning of each of the
Lists.-
The archives=0A- for all of the Lists are included on the CD along
with
a freeware search=0A- engine written by a list member.- The CD is
burne
d the day you order it=0A- and will contain archive received- up to
the
last minute.- They make =0A- great gifts!=0A=0A- - - - - -
- - -
http://www.matronics.com/ArchiveCDROM=0A=0A=0A****************
******************=0A*** List Support Contributions
***=0A*****************
*****************=0A=0A- The Matronics Lists are run *completely*
through
the support of it members.=0A- You won't find any PopUpAds, flashing
Ban
ner ads, or any other form of=0A- annoying commercialism on either
the Em
ail Messages or the List web pages=0A- associated with the Matronics
Emai
l Lists.- Every year during November=0A- I run a low-key,
low-pressure
"Fund Raiser" where, throughout the month,=0A- I ask List members to
make
a Contribution in any amount with which they =0A- are
comfortable.=0A=0A
- I will often offer free gifts with certain contribution levels
during t
he=0A- Fund Raiser to increase the participation.- The gifts are
usuall
y donated=0A- by companies that are themselves List
members.=0A=0A- You
r Contributions go directly to supporting the operation of the
Lists=0A-
including the high-speed, business-class Internet connection,
server=0A-
system hardware and software upgrades, and to partially offset the
many=0A
- many hours I spend running, maintaining, upgrading, and developing
the
=0A- variety of services found here.=0A=0A- Generally
Contributions ran
ge from $20 to $100 and are completely voluntary=0A- and
non-compulsory.
- I ask only that if person enjoys the Lists and obtains=0A- value
from
them, that they make a Contribution of equal magnitude.=0A=0A-
Contribut
ions are accepted throughout the year, and if you've just =0A-
subscribed
, feel free to make a Contribution when you've settled in.=0A=0A-
The web
site for making SSL Secure Contributions is listed below.- There
are=0A
- a variety of payment methods including Visa and MasterCard, PayPal,
and
=0A- sending a personal check.=0A=0A- If you enjoy and value the
List,
won't you make a Contribution today to=0A- support its continued
operatio
n?=0A=0A- - - - - - - - - http://www.matronics.com/contri
butions=0A=0A- Thank you!=0A- Matt Dralle=0A- Email List
Administrato
r=0A=0A=0A*********************************************************
********
*************=0A- - - - - - - - - - Kitfox-List Usage G
uidelines=0A***********************************************************
****
***************=0A=0AThe following details the official Usage
Guidelines fo
r the Kitfox-List.=0AYou are encouraged to read it carefully, and to
abide
by the rules therein.=0AFailure to use the Kitfox-List in the manner
descri
bed below may result =0Ain the removal of the subscribers from the
List.=0A
=0A=0AKitfox-List Policy Statement=0A=0AThe purpose of the
Kitfox-List is t
o provide a forum of discussion for=0Athings related to this
particular dis
cussion group.- The List's goals=0Aare to serve as an information
resourc
e to its members; to deliver=0Ahigh-quality content; to provide
moral suppo
rt; to foster camaraderie=0Aamong its members; and to support safe
operatio
n.- Reaching these goals =0Arequires the participation and
cooperation of
each and every member of =0Athe List.- To this end, the following
guidel
ines have been established:=0A=0A=0A- Please keep all posts
related to the
List at some level.- Do not submit=0A- posts concerning computer
viruse
s, urban legends, random humor, long=0A- lost buddies' phone
numbers, etc
. etc.=0A=0A- THINK carefully before you write.- Ask yourself if
your pos
t will be=0A- relevant to everyone.- If you have to wonder about
that,
DON'T send it.=0A=0A- Remember that your post will be included for
posterit
y in an archive=0A- that is growing in size at an extraordinary
rate.-
Try to be concise and=0A- terse in your posts.- Avoid overly wordy
and
lengthy posts and=0A- responses.=0A=0A- Keep your signature
brief.- Ple
ase include your name, email address,=0A- aircraft type/tail number,
and
geographic location.- A short line=0A- about where you are in the
build
ing process is also nice.- Avoid=0A- bulky signatures with character
gr
aphics; they consume unnecessary=0A- space in the
archive.=0A=0A- DON'T p
ost requests to the List for information when that info is=0A-
easily obt
ainable from other widely available sources.- Consult the=0A- web
page
or FAQ first.=0A=0A- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the
"Subject
:" line of=0A- your response the same as that of the original post.-
Th
is makes it=0A- easy to find threads in the archive.=0A=0A- When
respondi
ng, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your=0A- response.- DO
us
e lines from the original post to help "tune in" the=0A- reader to
the to
pic at hand, but be selective.- The impact that=0A- quoting the
entire
original post has on the size of the archive =0A- can not be
overstated!
=0A=0A- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally,
DO NOT
=0A- then go ahead and reply to the List.- Be aware that clicking
the
=0A- "reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send
your
=0A- response to the original poster.- You might have to actively
addre
ss=0A- your response with the original poster's email
address.=0A=0A- DO
NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something=0A-
to ad
d that is relevant and has a broad appeal.- "Way to go!", "I=0A-
agree"
, and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent=0A-
to the
original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.=0A=0A-
When re
sponding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to=0A-
comment
on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly=0A-
contribute
something valuable.=0A=0A- Feel free to disagree with other
viewpoints, BUT
keep your tone=0A- polite and respectful.- Don't make snide
comments,
personally attack=0A- other listers, or take the moral high ground
on an
obviously=0A- controversial issue.- This will only cause a pointless
de
bate that=0A- will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve
nothing.=0A
=0A- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly
=0A- su
bscribed to a given List are considered acceptable.- Posts by =0A-
List
members promoting their respective products or items for sale =0A-
shoul
d be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble =0A- a
typic
al SPAM message.- The List isn't about commercialism, but =0A- is
about
sharing information and knowledge.- This applies to =0A- everyone,
inc
luding those who provide products to the entire =0A- community.-
Inform
al presentation and moderation should be the =0A- operatives with
respect
to advertising on the Lists.=0A=0A-------=0A=0A=0A[This is
an automated po
sting.]=0A=0Ado not
archive=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Mes
sage 21- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime:
11:25:19 PM P
ST US=0AFrom: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>=0ASubject:
Kitfox-List: Of
ficial Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines=0A=0A=0ADear
Listers,=0A=0APlease read
over the Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines below.- The
complete=0AKitfox-List
FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the=0Afollowing
URL:
=0A=0A-
http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Kitfox-List.FAQ.html=0A=0AThank you
,=0A=0AMatt Dralle=0AMatronics Email List
Administrator=0A=0A=0A***********
*******************************************************************=0A-
- - - - - - - - - Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines=0A********
**********************************************************************=
0A
=0AThe following details the official Usage Guidelines for the
Kitfox-List.
=0AYou are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide by the
rules there
in.=0AFailure to use the Kitfox-List in the manner described below
may resu
lt =0Ain the removal of the subscribers from the
List.=0A=0A=0AKitfox-List
Policy Statement=0A=0AThe purpose of the Kitfox-List is to provide
a forum
of discussion for=0Athings related to this particular discussion
group.-
The List's goals=0Aare to serve as an information resource to its
members;
to deliver=0Ahigh-quality content; to provide moral support; to
foster cama
raderie=0Aamong its members; and to support safe operation.-
Reaching the
se goals =0Arequires the participation and cooperation of each and
every me
mber of =0Athe List.- To this end, the following guidelines have
been est
ablished:=0A=0A=0A- Please keep all posts related to the List at
some level
.- Do not submit=0A- posts concerning computer viruses, urban
legends,
random humor, long=0A- lost buddies' phone numbers, etc.
etc.=0A=0A- THIN
K carefully before you write.- Ask yourself if your post will be=0A-
re
levant to everyone.- If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send
it.=0A
=0A- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an
archive
=0A- that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate.- Try to be
conci
se and=0A- terse in your posts.- Avoid overly wordy and lengthy
posts a
nd=0A- responses.=0A=0A- Keep your signature brief.- Please
include you
r name, email address,=0A- aircraft type/tail number, and geographic
loca
tion.- A short line=0A- about where you are in the building process
is
also nice.- Avoid=0A- bulky signatures with character graphics; they
co
nsume unnecessary=0A- space in the archive.=0A=0A- DON'T post
requests to
the List for information when that info is=0A- easily obtainable
from ot
her widely available sources.- Consult the=0A- web page or FAQ
first.
=0A=0A- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subject:"
line of=0A
- your response the same as that of the original post.- This makes it
=0A- easy to find threads in the archive.=0A=0A- When
responding, NEVER q
uote the *entire* original post in your=0A- response.- DO use lines
fro
m the original post to help "tune in" the=0A- reader to the topic at
hand
, but be selective.- The impact that=0A- quoting the entire original
po
st has on the size of the archive =0A- can not be
overstated!=0A=0A- When
the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT=0A-
then go
ahead and reply to the List.- Be aware that clicking the=0A- "reply"
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utton on your mail package does not necessarily send your=0A-
response to
the original poster.- You might have to actively address=0A- your
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onse with the original poster's email address.=0A=0A- DO NOT use
the List t
o respond to a post unless you have something=0A- to add that is
relevant
and has a broad appeal.- "Way to go!", "I=0A- agree", and
"Congratulat
ions" are all responses that are better sent=0A- to the original
poster d
irectly, rather than to the List at large.=0A=0A- When responding
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' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to=0A- comment on every
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.=0A=0A- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep
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- polite and respectful.- Don't make snide comments, personally attack
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ontroversial issue.- This will only cause a pointless debate
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Occasional p
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=0A=0A
________________________________ Message 3
_____________________________________
Time: 03:55:05 AM PST US
From: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver AKFLYERBOB
-Equipment protection-
SKUFF SAVER Item #TYC 7210
$2.95 per foot
Protect the tops of your new skis or snowboard from scratches
and
gouges. This clear tough Dupont Surlyn tape is backed with a
self-adhesive
film for easy application and good bonding. It's 14" wide...enough to
span
any single snowboard or pair of skis and is sold by the linear foot.
Simply
order the length you need and trim the width with scissors to fit your
needs. Quantity:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-
----- Original Message -----
From: "AKFLYERBOB" <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 9:49 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver
> <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>
>
> Larry
> What material are you talking about?
> I'm sure every one would like to know.
> Bob
>
> --------
> Bob Wolfe..Soldotna, Alaska
> KF Mod I and III
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228098#228098
>
>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-------
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
6:02 PM
________________________________ Message 4
_____________________________________
Time: 06:02:37 AM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
I think the amount of "curl down" can be controlled by the amount
that you press down between the tubes themselves....simply press more
into the gap before pressing onto the tubes and it should stay there.
I usually just lay it over the gap equally spaced on both sides and
press it down. I didn't get too worried about whether it went up or
down, although down would be preferred.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 1, 2009, at 9:08 PM, patrick reilly wrote:
> Larry, Thanks for the web link. I ordered 5 feed just to have on
> hand. That price for 14" wide clear tape is unreal. There are many
> times I wanted some of that tape to protect paint on a car,
> motorcycle tank, etc. I'll use it on the gap seal, Alla Lynn
> Matteson top side only. Lynn, if that curls down into the gap,
> rather than up, I don't know why anybody would use any other method.
> do not archive
>
> Pat Reilly
> Mod 3 582 Rebuild
> Rockford, IL
>
>
> > From: asq@roadrunner.com
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
> > Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500
> >
> <asq@roadrunner.com>
> >
> > Just received this. Does it sound like the same material? Larry
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <info@tognar.com>
> > To: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM
> > Subject: Re: ski saver
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Yes,
> > > check this link on our bags/racks page
> > > http://www.tognar.com/
> bags_racks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html
> > > The top item is the scuff saver tape,
> > > Thanks,
> > > Cat
> > > www.tognar.com
> > >
> > >
> > >> Do you still have "ski saver" tape? Larry Huntley
> asq@roadrunner.com
> > > Ye
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
> >
> >
> >
> > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
> > 6:02
PM====================
> >================
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
========
________________________________ Message 5
_____________________________________
Time: 07:01:09 AM PST US
From: Catz631@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap
Seal Test Report
Noel,
If you are gap sealing your rudder,John McBean has a very nice
contoured
hard foam for that purpose. I bought some of it and glued it to the
horizontal
stab then covered it with 6 inch polyfiber tape. I painted it and it
looks nice
..
Dick Maddux
Pensacola,Fl
**************Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores
to
stocks and so much more. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)
________________________________ Message 6
_____________________________________
Time: 07:03:47 AM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
From: "lowflyer" <buddcr@yahoo.com>
Guys,
Please take a look at the following website.
http://www.aerographic.com/gap_seal.htm
These gap seals are used on Pitts and Eagle aircraft. They have been
used on many
others as well. There not too expensive, easy to install and they are
removable
and should last a long, long time! You can cut to length for your
application
and for fitting around hinges. My buddy uses them on his beautiful
Pitts
S2B. I will probably be getting some soon.
Chris Budd
N53RJ Kitfox IV Speedster
VW 2180 240hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228155#228155
________________________________ Message 7
_____________________________________
Time: 07:05:18 AM PST US
From: Catz631@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Lowlead,
That looks like an "X" job and a good one at that. I will have to try
that
when mine peels off.
Dick Maddux
Pensacola,Fl
**************Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores
to
stocks and so much more. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)
________________________________ Message 8
_____________________________________
Time: 07:34:43 AM PST US
From: Rexinator <rexinator@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
I think had a small sample sheet of this material back in 1984 which I
used to protect the front of a "chin" fairing on my Honda Interceptor.
It had the characteristics you describe, clear, very tough, designed
for
protecting front of sporty cars paint from small rock chips.
Rex
Colorado M2/582
do not archive
Lowlead wrote:
>
> Thanks Rex (and Lynn)! I wish I could say that it's this consistent
along the
entire length of the gap, but it's not. The gaps tend to be smaller on
the outboard
ends due to the way the tightened fabric act on the stab and elevator
frames.
>
> Installation is hard to describe but not that hard to do. One thing
nice about
this tape is that it's very pliable and the adhesive is not
super-aggressive
at first. The tape is applied across the gap (we'll say the top side
first) with
a very slight 'drape' down and then firmly pressed onto the LE/TE
tubes.
Then the bottom side tape is applied with a very slight drape up (I
used a pc
of 1/4" tube to force the drape up) and then pressed onto the LE/TE
tubes. The
two tapes stick to one another like a champ but leaves a triangular
'bubble'
running the entire length . I used a wooden tongue depressor and
fingers to press
the top and bottom tapes together to eliminate the bubble. (see
attached).
It's tough stuff and stretches well enough to get a tight
installation. There's
no worries about tearing or punching through with the tongue
depressor.
>
> The control surface (elevator or rudder) must be in the neutral
position when
tape is applied or else a tension 'bias' might get built into the
installation
(ex: rudder now pulls left or right due to tape..)
> Hope this makes sense...
>
> Dan H.
>
>
> rexinator wrote:
>
>> That's exactly what I was trying to describe with my >-< symbol
and my
>> little drawn image file. I agree with Lynn that it's a nice job.
Can
>> you elaborate on how you applied so well?
>>
>> Rex
>> Colorado M2/582
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228125#228125
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal2_183.jpg
>
>
>
________________________________ Message 9
_____________________________________
Time: 07:34:43 AM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: air worthiness
From: "dcsfoto" <david@kelm.com>
A DAR with the correct function code can issue a replacement.
All you need is to have him look in the FAA files (cost us $3.00)
obtain the info
from the original.
do a letter requesting a replacement.
David
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228163#228163
________________________________ Message 10
____________________________________
Time: 09:41:55 AM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
From: "darinh" <gerns25@netscape.net>
John,
As some have said, use the 3M clear product. I would bet you can find
a car accessory
shop that applies the "clear bra" to cars and they will sell you this
stuff by the foot. I found several local places that had it in widths
of 6",
12", 24", etc. I bought the 24" wide stuff and cut it to the length
and width
I needed for the intended use. I also applied it to the top side and
wrapped
it around the front of my landing gear for protection and to the front
of the
struts for about the first 4' from the fuse.
The product is very tough, UV resistant and crystal clear...the
adhesive works
perfectly on painted surfaces and can be applied using a shot or two
of Windex
and a small squeegee to remove any air bubbles
--------
Darin Hawkes
Series 7
914 Turbo
Kaysville, Utah
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228179#228179
________________________________ Message 11
____________________________________
Time: 10:54:57 AM PST US
From: "George Wells" <georgewells@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver
Didn't you guys see my post from 1 or 2 days ago where I talked about
my
use of Ski Saver Tape and where to get it ??
George
________________________________ Message 12
____________________________________
Time: 03:58:02 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Kitfox owner location map
From: "Paul A. Franz, P.E." <paul@eucleides.com>
Here's a great resource
http://www.frappr.com/kitfox
It's a dynamic push pin map with information about each Kitfox. It
covers the whole
world. This has Kitfoxen not just from the mail list but everyone.
Put your push pin on the map!
If everyone did, you'd be able to find others in your area easily.
--------
Paul A. Franz, P.E.
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
425.440.9505 Office
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228237#228237
________________________________ Message 13
____________________________________
Time: 04:45:12 PM PST US
From: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap
Seal Test
Report
Dick=2C Great picture of the tail of your plane. But=2C I'll be
damned if I
can see any gap seal. I Like your TR3 also.
do not archivePat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL
From: Catz631@aol.comDate: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 09:57:11 -0500Subject:
Re: Kit
fox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test
ReportTo: kit
fox-list@matronics.com
Noel=2C
If you are gap sealing your rudder=2CJohn McBean has a very nice
contoured
hard foam for that purpose. I bought some of it and glued it to the
horizo
ntal stab then covered it with 6 inch polyfiber tape. I painted it and
it l
ooks nice .
Dick Maddux
Pensacola=2CFl
Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to stocks and
so mu
ch more.
________________________________ Message 14
____________________________________
Time: 05:09:11 PM PST US
From: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
Lynn=2C Didn't you say you have elavator at full down and then apply
tape.
This wouldn't require any pushing tape into groove. Or would having
some ta
pe pushed into groove insure the tape would curl into the groove when
eleva
tor was raised?Pat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From:
lynnmatt@jp
s.net> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver> Date: Mon=2C 2 Feb
2009 08:
58:20 -0500> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > --> Kitfox-List message
poste
d by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>> > I think the amount of "curl
down"
can be controlled by the amount > that you press down between the
tubes th
emselves....simply press more > into the gap before pressing onto the
tubes
and it should stay there. > I usually just lay it over the gap equally
spa
ced on both sides and > press it down. I didn't get too worried about
wheth
er it went up or > down=2C although down would be preferred.> > Lynn
Mattes
on> Kitfox IV Speedster=2C taildragger> Jabiru 2200=2C #2062=2C
605 hrs> Se
nsenich 62x46> Electroair direct-fire ignition system> New skis done
and fl
ying> > > > > On Feb 1=2C 2009=2C at 9:08 PM=2C patrick reilly
wrote:> > >
Larry=2C Thanks for the web link. I ordered 5 feed just to have on >
> hand
. That price for 14" wide clear tape is unreal. There are many > >
times I
wanted some of that tape to protect paint on a car=2C > > motorcycle
tank
=2C etc. I'll use it on the gap seal=2C Alla Lynn > > Matteson top
side onl
y. Lynn=2C if that curls down into the gap=2C > > rather than
up=2C I don't
know why anybody would use any other method.> > do not archive> >> >
Pat R
eilly> > Mod 3 582 Rebuild> > Rockford=2C IL> >> >> >> >> > > From:
asq@roa
drunner.com> > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > > Subject:
Kitfox-List: F
w: ski saver> > > Date: Sun=2C 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500> > >> > >
--> Kitf
ox-List message posted by: "Larry Huntley" > > <asq@roadrunner.com>> >
>> >
> Just received this. Does it sound like the same material? Larry> >
>> >
> ----- Original Message -----> > > From: <info@tognar.com>> > > To:
"Larry
Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> > > Sent: Sunday=2C February 01=2C
2009 7:5
4 PM> > > Subject: Re: ski saver> > >> > >> > > >> > > > Yes=2C> > >
> chec
k this link on our bags/racks page> > > > http://www.tognar.com/ > >
bags_r
acks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html> > > > The top item is
the s
cuff saver tape=2C> > > > Thanks=2C> > > > Cat> > > >
www.tognar.com> > > >
> > > >> > > >> Do you still have "ski saver" tape? Larry Huntley > >
asq@r
oadrunner.com> > > > Ye> > > >> > >> > >> > > > >
-------------------------
--------------------------------------------- > > ----------> > >> >
>> > >
> > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com> > > 6:02
PM======
===============> >
>=======
==========> > >> > >> > >> >> >
======
=== _- > >
==================
================ _- > > contribution_-
> >
========================>
_
==> > >
________________________________ Message 15
____________________________________
Time: 05:27:16 PM PST US
From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox broken motor mount
the mount broke Ware it attaches to the vibration dampener on the rear
pass
enger side on my mod 2 w/582- 170 hrs airframe has this happened to
anybo
dy? i plan on having it gas welded by a local pilot/ welder - -
malcolm
--- On Mon, 2/2/09, George Wells <georgewells@roadrunner.com> wrote:
From: George Wells <georgewells@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver
Didn't you guys see my post from 1 or 2 days ago
where I talked about my use of Ski Saver Tape-and where to get it
??
George
=0A=0A=0A
________________________________ Message 16
____________________________________
Time: 05:44:07 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Posting videos
From: "Paul Franz - Merlin GT" <paul@eucleides.com>
Maintaining video quality when posting is somewhat of a problem with
YouTube. I
discovered this site which has few if any ads and the video quality is
excellent.
<http://www.vimeo.com/2986295>
The format is very nice with thumbnail images and a nice indexing
scheme.
--
Paul A. Franz
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
________________________________ Message 17
____________________________________
Time: 06:39:27 PM PST US
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox broken motor mount
Just a thought... I think after welding the joint has to be normalized
to
prevent it from cracking in the joint again.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Malcolm
Brubaker
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 9:28 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox broken motor mount
the mount broke Ware it attaches to the vibration dampener on the rear
passenger side on my mod 2 w/582 170 hrs airframe has this happened
to
anybody? i plan on having it gas welded by a local pilot/ welder
malcolm
--- On Mon, 2/2/09, George Wells <georgewells@roadrunner.com> wrote:
From: George Wells <georgewells@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver
Didn't you guys see my post from 1 or 2 days ago where I talked about
my use
of Ski Saver Tape and where to get it ??
George
D========================
========
D========================
========
D========================
========
D========================
========
________________________________ Message 18
____________________________________
Time: 06:55:33 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Flaperon hinge brackets
From: "clemwehner" <clemwehner@sbcglobal.net>
My flaperon hinge brackets were made and the holes drilled in the ribs
before the
wing was covered. Now that the wing is covered the hinge brackets
won't fit
flat onto the wing without putting considerable stress on the rivets
at the rear
of the bracket. This is because the wing trailing edge is now thicker
because
of the fabric, tapes, and paint. See the attached photo.
Any suggestions on what to do. I can push hard and press the bracket
down on to
the wing surface, but it puts a lot of bending stress on the bracket.
Any ideas?
thanks for the help,
--------
Clem Wehner
Tulsa, OK
Kitfox IV-912
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228263#228263
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_4120_191.jpg
________________________________ Message 19
____________________________________
Time: 07:02:23 PM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
I put my tape on at full down, yes, and like you observed, just
having a little "down into" radius will assure that it stays there
when the 'vator is raised. I may try to apply some from the bottom
side with the 'vator held up, and see how that works...along with the
top being covered.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
do not archive
On Feb 2, 2009, at 8:06 PM, patrick reilly wrote:
> Lynn, Didn't you say you have elavator at full down and then apply
> tape. This wouldn't require any pushing tape into groove. Or would
> having some tape pushed into groove insure the tape would curl into
> the groove when elevator was raised?
>
> Pat Reilly
> Mod 3 582 Rebuild
> Rockford, IL
>
>
________________________________ Message 20
____________________________________
Time: 07:20:15 PM PST US
From: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
Lynn=2C I was also wondering how covering both sides with your
method of fu
ll elevator up and down would work. I'm not to that stage yet. As a
matter
of fact I received today the RAC servo from ACS to use with Lowell
Fitts tr
im tab kit. So=2C I will be tearing my elevator apart. Have you got
a trim
tab on the elevator? Or=2C do you use the Flaperons to trim?Pat
ReillyMod
3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From: lynnmatt@jps.net> Subject: Re:
Kitfox-Li
st: Fw: ski saver> Date: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 22:01:43 -0500> To:
kitfox-list@
@jps.net>> > I put my tape on at full down=2C yes=2C and like you
observed
=2C just > having a little "down into" radius will assure that it
stays the
re > when the 'vator is raised. I may try to apply some from the
bottom > s
ide with the 'vator held up=2C and see how that works...along with
the > to
p being covered.> > Lynn Matteson> Kitfox IV Speedster=2C
taildragger> Jabi
ru 2200=2C #2062=2C 605 hrs> Sensenich 62x46> Electroair
direct-fire igniti
on system> New skis done and flying> do not archive> > > > On Feb
2=2C 2009
=2C at 8:06 PM=2C patrick reilly wrote:> > > Lynn=2C Didn't you
say you hav
e elavator at full down and then apply > > tape. This wouldn't require
any
pushing tape into groove. Or would > > having some tape pushed into
groove
insure the tape would curl into > > the groove when elevator was
raised?> >
==========> > >
________________________________ Message 21
____________________________________
Time: 07:33:19 PM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
Factory-built trim tab with RAC servo. Using the flaperons for trim
slows the plane down, which is why one of the Speedster mods was the
electric trim.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
do not archive
On Feb 2, 2009, at 10:19 PM, patrick reilly wrote:
> Lynn, I was also wondering how covering both sides with your method
> of full elevator up and down would work. I'm not to that stage yet.
> As a matter of fact I received today the RAC servo from ACS to use
> with Lowell Fitts trim tab kit. So, I will be tearing my elevator
> apart. Have you got a trim tab on the elevator? Or, do you use the
> Flaperons to trim?
>
> Pat Reilly
> Mod 3 582 Rebuild
> Rockford, IL
>
>
________________________________ Message 22
____________________________________
Time: 07:46:51 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flaperon hinge brackets
From: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
> My flaperon hinge brackets were made and the holes drilled in the
ribs before
the wing was covered. Now that the wing is covered the hinge brackets
won't fit
flat onto the wing without putting considerable stress on the rivets
at the
rear of the bracket. This is because the wing trailing edge is now
thicker because
of the fabric, tapes, and paint. See the attached photo.
>
> Any suggestions on what to do. I can push hard and press the bracket
down on
to the wing surface, but it puts a lot of bending stress on the
bracket. Any ideas?
Clem, The builder's manual says to fit and drill first then cover as
you have done.
Mine were a tight fit too.
I set the flaperon in place then installed and tightened the hinge
bolts to take
the stress off the rear rivet before I squeezed the brackets tight to
the rib
with one hand and riveted with the other hand.
The rear bracket rivets have held fine. I have had the flaperons off
a couple
times and the bracket bolt holes in the brackets line up perfect when
I reinstall
the flaperons. Also the bracket to rib rivets are holding tight.
I rib laced and put no rib lacing reinforcement tape or rib finish
tape under the
brackets.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
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Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09 |
One never knows! Last year at the Desert Fox Squadron fly-in, some talk cent
ered around a trip this year. The fly-in is coming up the end of March, so w
e might hear more. I've made the trip four times--twice in my Kitfox. What a
re your plans/ideas, where are you located, what do you fly, have you been t
o Alaska before, and who are you?
Stan Specht
Model IV Speedster 912ul (1440 hrs.)
Lakewood, Colorado
-----Original Message-----
From: b gammon <gammon25@yahoo.com>
Sent: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 10:09 am
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09
Is any one planning a "Kitfox" trip to Alaska this Summer?
From: Kitfox-List Digest Server <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Monday, February 2, 2009 11:59:05 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List Digest: 22 Msgs - 02/02/09
*
========================
=C2- Online Versions of Today's List Digest Archive
========================
Today's complete Kitfox-List Digest can also be found in either of the
two Web Links listed below.=C2- The .html file includes the Digest formatt
ed
in HTML for viewing with a web browser and features Hyperlinked Indexes
and Message Navigation.=C2- The .txt file includes the plain ASCII version
of the Kitfox-List Digest and c
an be
viewed with a generic text editor
such as Notepad or with a web browser.
HTML Version:
=C2- =C2- http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&V
iew=html&Chapter 09-02-02&Archive=Kitfox
Text Version:
=C2- =C2- http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82701&V
iew=txt&Chapter 09-02-02&Archive=Kitfox
======================
=C2- EMail Version of Today's List Digest Archive
======================
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -----------------------------------------
-----------------
=C2- =C2-
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- Kitfox-List Digest Archive
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- ---
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- Total
Messages Posted Mon 02/02/09: 22
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- -----------------------------------------
-----------------
Today's Message Index:
----------------------
=C2- =C2- 1. 12:04 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=C2- (Lowlead
)
=C2- =C2- 2. 01:04 AM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09=C2
- (b gammon)
=C2- =C2- 3. 03:55 AM - Re: Re: ski saver AKFLYERBOB=C2- (Larry Huntle
y)
=C2- =C2- 4. 06:02 AM - Re: Fw: ski saver=C2- (Lynn Matteson)
=C2- =C2- 5. 07:01 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Re
portElevator Gap Seal Test Report=C2- (Catz631@aol.com)
=C2- =C2- 6. 07:03 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=C2- (lowflye
r)
=C2- =C2- 7. 07:05 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=C2- (Catz631
@AOL.COM)
=C2- =C2- 8. 07:34 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=C2- (Rex
inator)
=C2- =C2- 9. 07:34 AM - Re: air worthiness=C2- (dcsfoto)
=C2- =C2- 10. 09:41 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=C2- (darinh
)
=C2- =C2- 11. 10:54 AM - Re: ski saver=C2- (George Wells)
=C2- =C2- 12. 03:58 PM - Kitfox owner location map=C2- (Paul A. Franz,
P.E.)
=C2- =C2- 13. 04:45 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap S
eal Test Report=C2- (patrick reilly)
=C2- =C2- 14. 05:09 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver=C2- (patrick reilly)
=C2- =C2- 15. 05:27 PM - Re: Kitfox broken motor
mount=C2- (Malcolm Brubaker)
=C2- =C2- 16. 05:44 PM - Posting videos=C2- (Paul Franz - Merlin GT)
=C2- =C2- 17. 06:39 PM - Re: Re: Kitfox broken motor mount=C2- (Noel L
oveys)
=C2- =C2- 18. 06:55 PM - Flaperon hinge brackets=C2- (clemwehner)
=C2- =C2- 19. 07:02 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver=C2- (Lynn Matteson)
=C2- =C2- 20. 07:20 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver=C2- (patrick reilly)
=C2- =C2- 21. 07:33 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver=C2- (Lynn Matteson)
=C2- =C2- 22. 07:46 PM - Re: Flaperon hinge brackets=C2- (Tom Jones)
________________________________=C2- Message 1=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 12:04:06 AM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
From: "Lowlead" <j.t.cowie@xoxy.net>
Thanks Rex (and Lynn)! I wish I could say that it's this
consistent along the entire
length of the gap, but it's not. The gaps tend to be smaller on the outboard
ends due to the way the tightened fabric act on the stab and elevator frames
.
Installation is hard to describe but not that hard to do. One thing nice abo
ut
this tape is that it's very pliable and the adhesive is not super-aggressive
at
first. The tape is applied across the gap (we'll say the top side first) wit
h
a very slight 'drape' down and then firmly pressed onto the LE/TE tubes. The
n
the bottom side tape is applied with a very slight drape up (I used a pc of
1/4" tube to force the drape up) and then pressed onto the LE/TE tubes. The
two
tapes stick to one another like a champ but leaves a triangular 'bubble' run
ning
the entire length . I used a wooden tongue depressor and fingers to press
the top and bottom tapes together to eliminate the bubble. (see attached). I
t's
tough stuff and stretches well
enough to get a tight installation. There's
no worries about tearing or punching through with the tongue depressor.
The control surface (elevator or rudder) must be in the neutral position whe
n tape
is applied or else a tension 'bias' might get built into the installation
(ex: rudder now pulls left or right due to tape..)
Hope this makes sense...
Dan H.
rexinator wrote:
> That's exactly what I was trying to describe with my=C2- >-<=C2- symbo
l and my
> little=2
0drawn image file.=C2- I agree with Lynn that it's a nice job. Can
> you elaborate on how you applied so well?
>
> Rex
> Colorado M2/582
>
>
>
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228125#228125
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal2_183.jpg
________________________________=C2- Message 2=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 01:04:57 AM PST US
From: b gammon <gammon25@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09
This is my first attempt to participate in the Kitfox discussions. =0AIs a
n
yone planning to fly a Kitfox to Alaska this Summer?=0A=0A=0A=0A=0
A________
________________________=0AFrom: Kitfox-List Digest Server <kitfox-list@ma
t
ronics.com>=0ATo: Kitfox-List Digest List <kitfox-list-digest@matronics.co
m
>=0ASent: Sunday, February 1, 2009 11:59:13 PM=0ASubject: Kitfox-List
Diges
t: 21 Msgs - 02/01/09=0A=0A*=0A=0A===========
=
=============0A- Online Versions of Today's List
Digest Archive=0A==================
=======0A=0AToday's complete Kitfox-List Digest can also be
fou
nd in either of the =0Atwo Web Links listed below.- The .html file includ
es the Digest formatted =0Ain HTML for viewing with a web browser and feat
u
res Hyperlinked Indexes =0Aand Message Navigation.- The .txt file include
s the plain ASCII version =0Aof the Kitfox-List Digest and can be viewed w
i
th a generic text editor =0Asuch as Notepad or with a web browser.
0A=0AHT
ML Version:=0A=0A- - http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Sty
le=82701&View=html&Chapter 09-02-01&Archive=Kitfox=0A=0AText Vers
ion:=0A=0A- - http://www.matronics.com/digest/digestview.php?Style=82
701&View=txt&Chapter 09-02-01&Archive=Kitfox=0A=0A=0A===
====================0A- EMail Versi
on of Today's List Digest Archive=0A============
===========0A=0A=0A- - - - - ----------------
------------------------------------------=0A- - - - - - -
- - - - - - Kitfox-List Digest Archive=0A- - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - ---=0A- - -
- - - - - - - Total Messages Posted Sun 02/01/09: 21=0A-
- - - - ----------------------------------------------------------
=0A=0A=0AToday's Message Index:=0A----------------------=0A=0A-
- 1. 06
:38 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Catz631@aol.com)=0A- - 2
. 09:02 AM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Noel Loveys)=0A-
- 3. 11:09 AM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Noel Loveys)=0A-
- 4. 11:26 AM -
Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Lynn Matteson)
=0A- - 5. 12:02 PM - Kitfox with rotax fuel injection- (jason Parker)
=0A- - 6. 02:02 PM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Randy Da
ughenbaugh)=0A- - 7. 02:22 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (L
ynn Matteson)=0A- - 8. 03:02 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report-
(Bob Brennan)=0A- - 9. 03:13 PM - Ski report/snow conditions- (Lynn M
atteson)=0A- - 10. 03:19 PM - Re: Elevator
Gap Seal Test Report- (Lyn
n Matteson)=0A- - 11. 03:24 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (
Larry Huntley)=0A- - 12. 05:00 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
- (Noel Loveys)=0A- - 13. 05:05 PM - Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Repor
t- (Lowlead)=0A- - 14. 05:30 PM - Re: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Repo
rt- (Lynn Matteson)=0A- - 15. 05:39 PM - Fw: ski saver- (Larry Hunt
ley)=0A- - 16. 06:11 PM - Re: Fw: ski saver- (patrick reilly)=0A-
- 17. 06:50 PM - Re: ski saver-
(AKFLYERBOB)=0A- - 18. 08:17 PM - R
e: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report- (Rexinator)=0A- - 19. 09:18 PM
- Re: Fw: ski saver- (John Bonewitz)=0A- - 20. 11:08 PM - Official Ki
tfox-List FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions)- (Matt Dralle)=0A- - 21. 1
1:25 PM - Official Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines- (Matt Dralle)=0A=0A=0
A
=0A________________________________- Message 1- _______________________
______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:38:03 AM PST US=0AFrom: Catz631@aol.
com=0AS
ubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0AThat foam we
ath
er striping sounds like a good idea. You could further refine =0Athis by p
u
tting a strip of teflon antichafe tape on the other side of the =0Aweather
striping foam(oposite the adhesive side) or on the elevator leading edge=0
A
=0Afor that mater. This stuff is real slick and I bought a roll of it from
Spruce=0A=0Aas
a cowling chafe tape a while back. It works real well.=0AOnl
y thing is, in the heat the adhesive on weather strip tends to give way =0
A
in
to a goo.=0A- That sailplane tape looks interesting also=0A- - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - Dick Maddux=0A- - - - - - - -
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
- - - Pensacola,Fl.=0A**************From Wall Street to Main Street
and everywhere in between, stay =0Aup-to-date with the latest news. (http:
/
/aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000023)=0A=0A_____________________________
___
- Message 2- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 09:02
:
06 AM PST US=0AFrom: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>=0ASubject: RE:
Kit
fox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AOr you could attac
h the
seal, on the elevator side only with good old 1
in.=0AVelcro.=0A=0AAnother
thing to try is to cover the leading edge of the elevator and rudder=0Awit
h the plastic tape then attach the gap seal to that tape so when you=0Arem
o
ve the seal you don't disturb the dope under it.=0A=0ANoel=0A=0A----
-Origin
al Message-----=0AFrom: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto
:ow
ner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: S
a
turday, January 31, 2009 8:12 AM=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator
G
ap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AGood idea, but I'm from the camp that alwa
ys wa
nts to be able to take- =0Asomething apart if a problem arises. I guess i
f a rock passed through- =0Athe elevator, you could always MEK the Vee of
f
from the elevator, and- =0Amaybe reattach it when the repairs were made
. A longer process, by-=2
0=0Afar, than the tape method, but cleaner-looking
.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJabiru 220
0, #206
2, 600.2 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition system
=0AN
ew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Jan 31, 2009, at 2:37 AM, JC Propel
ler D
esign wrote:=0A=0A> <propellerdesign@tele2.se>=0A>=0A> You can use t
hat, bu
t why not take 2 pieces sewn together at the- =0A> middle and dope one Ve
e to stab and other to elevator.=0A>=0A> Or use sail fabric that is air
tig
ht from start=0A>=0A> Jan=0A> ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetP
ilot"
<orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>=0A> Sent: F
ri
day, January 30, 2009 9:18 PM=0A> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap S
e
al Test Report=0A>=0A>=0A>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A>>=0A>> Why
not just
use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to- =0A>> seal the gap ?
??- It would be permanent, easy to do, and look- =0A>> good !- Much b
etter than tape.=0A>>=0A>> Mike=0A>>=0A>> --------=0A>> "NO F
EAR"
-- If you have no fear you did not go as fast- =0A>> as you could have
!!!=0A>>=0A>> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>
Read this t
opic online here:=0A>>=0A>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p
=2
27727#227727=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>
=0A>>=0A>>=0A>> __
________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus- =0A>> s
ignature database 3814 (20090131) __________=0A>>=0A>> The message was c
hec
ked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>
0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A_______________
_________________- Message 3- _____________________________________=0A
=0A=0ATime: 11:09:12 AM PST US=0AFrom: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo
.ca>
=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0ASunday
afte
rnoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...- Friday nights=0Anot t
he best night of the week
for me;-).- =0A=0AI agree the X system allows f
or a light hinge on a model but a place for=0Agrass and leaves etc. To cat
c
h in the "Real thing".- =0A=0AWhat I was thinking at first was a couple
o
f pieces of say 2 1/2 inch tape=0Asewn right down the middle and then one
h
alf of each tape doped to the=0Astabilizers with the other halves just fin
i
shed to match the plane.- They=0Ashould be stiff enough to seal the gaps
in flight.- I'll attach a couple of=0Arough diagrams... emphasis on the t
erm rough!=0A=0ANoel =0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: owner-kit
fox-lis
t-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] O
n
Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 8:04 AM=0ASub
je
ct: Re:
Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0ANope, no picture
or drawing. Just visualize...after the inbibation- =0Awears off....the f
lat surface of the stab and elevator, as viewed- =0Afrom the side/edge, w
ith the tape starting on the top left, and- =0Acrossing to the bottom rig
ht. (This of course assumes that you have- =0Aproperly made the tape with
an inch of the sticky surfaces against- =0Aeach other so that the tape20c
an- be stuck down on the top left and- =0Athe bottom right) Now another
tape from the bottom left crossing to- =0Athe top right. Where they pass
by each other, they form an "X". Then- =0Aimagine a piece of tape 2" wid
e being placed from top of stab to- =0Abottom of elev. (top left to botto
m right), and next to it another- =0Atape placed from bottom left to top
right. Continue alternating tapes- =0Auntil gap is sealed. I can imagine
how this would look on a full-size- =0Aplane, and I
don't like what I ima
gine. It worked fine on the models- =0Aand looked ok, and made an especia
lly lightweight hinge. I personally- =0Adon't like the idea of this "over
and under" tape application, as it- =0Aalways leaves a place where junk
can collect, no matter which way you- =0Ado it. I much prefer to let the
elevator hang down, apply the tape- =0Aacross the gap, and leave it at th
at. I use "racer's tape" that I- =0Aordered in orange, which is the color
of my plane in that area...the- =0Acolor is not a perfect match...howeve
r, I can't see that mismatch- =0Awhen I'm flying and neither can anybody
else. The owners of "hangar- =0Aqueens" would not like my reasoning, I'm
sure.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJabiru
2200,
#2062, 600.2 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition sys
tem
=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Jan 30, 2009, at 8:20 PM, Noe
l Lovey
s
wrote:=0A=0A> Lynn:=0A> do you have a picture or drawin
g of the X system?
=0A> Second inbibation is starting to cut in and I'm having a problem-
=0A> visualizing your X setup.=0A>=0A> Noel=0A>=0A>=0A> --- On F
ri, 1/30/09
, Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net> wrote:=0A> From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmat
t
@jps.net>=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A
> T
o: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0A> Received: Friday, January 30, 2009, 6:11
P
M=0A>=0A>=0A> If you really want to drive yourself nuts over this gap
seali
ng- =0A> issue, try the=0A> "X" method instead of the "Z" method. We use
d
the=0A> "X" method on our model planes.=0A> The "Z" method has been expl
ai
ned....from under (or over)
the=0A> trailing portion of the hort. stab, to
over (or under) the leading- =0A> portion of=0A> the elevator, forming a
"Z" when view from the side. The "X"=0A> method is just alternating the pl
a
cement of lengths of 2" wide- =0A> tape, over=0A> and under, then under
a
nd over, etc., until the gap is sealed. In the=0A> "X" method, you make st
r
ips of tape that go, say, 2" wide and=0A> from front to back, instead of t
h
e "Z" method where you run the tape=0A> from side of elevator to hinge, th
e
n hinge to hinge, and so on.=0A> The jury is still out on whether this is
a
good method or not...how- =0A> 'bout=0A> some thoughts?=0A>=0A> As a
n as
ide, when this method is used in model planes, no hinge is- =0A> needed,
as=0A> the plastic covering material itself is used for the "gap seals" an
d
=0A> in using t
he "X" method, the elevator operates freely without the
use
=0A> of hinges...not recommended for "live-in" airplanes.=0A>=0A> Lynn
Matt
eson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 600.2
hrs
=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire ignition system=0A> Ne
w ski
s done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Jan 30, 2009, at 12:53 PM, Paul Franz
- Me
rlin GT wrote:=0A>=0A> <paul@eucleides.com>=0A> >=0A> > On Fri, Janu
ary 30,
2009 7:28 am, kirk hull wrote:=0A> >> Does anybody have pictures of the ga
p seal installation?=0A> >=0A> > I too would be interested in seeing pho
tos
. I'm interested in- =0A> details=0A> of shape,=0A> > overlap and what
ha
ppens to the slack when you run neutral or down=0A> elevator.=0A> >=0A
> > D
oes the slack start to peel a tiny bit on either the stabilizer-
=0A> or
the=0A> elevator with=0A> > dirt and debris sticking to the small expose
d b
it of adhesive?=0A> >=0A> > Which way is better to put them on - leading
ed
ge on top or- =0A> bottom of Get the name you've always wanted ! @ymail.c
=0A> ======================
============0A=0A=0A____________________________
____
- Message 4- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 11:26
:
09 AM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubject: Re: Kit
fox
-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AI just flew my plane
today
, and during the pre-flight20I noticed that- =0Athe gap-seal tape...orange
Racer's Tape...that I applied on 10-5-2008- =0Ais still holding fast. I
wrote the date onto the tape to keep track- =0Aof how
well it held up. Th
e same tape that I applied earlier...God- =0Aknows when...is also still h
olding fas, so maybe we're overthinking- =0Athis gap-seal "problem." Of c
ourse, mine is applied over the top of- =0Athe gap and nothing underneath
, so the purists among us...you- know- =0Awho you are...would not buy t
his fix.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJab
iru 220
0, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition sy
ste
m=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 11:32 AM, No
el Love
ys wrote:=0A=0A>=0A> Or you could attach the seal, on the elevator sid
e onl
y with good- =0A> old 1 in.=0A> Velcro.=0A>=0A> Another thing to try
is t
o cover the leading edge of the elevator- =0A> and rudder=0A> with the p
l
astic tape then attach the gap seal to that tape so when- =0A> you=0A> r
e
move the seal you don't disturb the dope under
it.=0A>=0A> Noel=0A>=0A> ---
--Original Message-----=0A> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
=0A
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn- =0A>
Matteson=0A> Sent: Saturday, January 31, 2009 8:12 AM=0A> To: kitfox-lis
t@
matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Rep
o
rt=0A>=0A>=0A> Good idea, but I'm from the camp that always wants to b
e abl
e to take=0A> something apart i
f a problem arises. I guess if a rock passed
through=0A> the elevator, you could always MEK the Vee off from the elevat
or, and=0A> maybe reattach it when the repairs were made. A longer process
,
by=0A> far, than the
tape method, but cleaner-looking.=0A>=0A> Lynn Mattes
on=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 600.2 hr
s
=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire ignition system=0A> Ne
w ski
s done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Jan 31, 2009, at 2:37 AM, JC Propelle
r Des
ign wrote:=0A>=0A>> <propellerdesign@tele2.se>=0A>>=0A>> You can use
that,
but why not take 2 pieces sewn together at the=0A>> middle and dope one Ve
e
to stab and other to elevator.=0A>>=0A>> Or use sail fabric that is air
ti
ght from start=0A>>=0A>> Jan=0A>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "
JetPi
lot"- =0A>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>=0A>> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com
>
=0A>> Sent: Friday, January 30, 2009 9:18 PM=0A>> Subject: Kitfox-List:
Re:
Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
=0A>
>>=0A>>> Why not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack to
=0A
>>> seal the gap ???- It would be permanent, easy to do, and look=0A>>> g
ood !- Much better than tape.=0A>>>=0A>>> Mike=0A>>>=0A>>> --------
=0A>>>
"NO FEAR" -- If you have no fear you did not go as fast=0A>>>
as you could have !!!=0A>>>=0A>>> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S=0A>>>=0A>>
>=0A>>>
=0A>>>=0A>>> Read
this topic online here:=0A>>>=0A>>> http://forums.matroni
cs.com/viewtopic.php?p=227727#2277273D0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>
>=0A>>>
=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>>=0A>>> __________ Information from
ESET NOD32
Antivirus, version of virus=0A>>> signature database 3814 (20090131) _____
_____=0A>>>=0A>>> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.=0A>
>>=0A
>>>=0A>>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A___
_____________________
________- Message 5- _____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATim
e
: 12:02:53 PM PST US=0AFrom: jason Parker <litesellme@yahoo.com>=0ASubje
ct:
Kitfox-List: Kitfox with rotax fuel injection=0A=0Awww.youtube.com/watch
?v
=tUrFJi93MIo=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=nhiMjZGP-=0ADk=0Awww.youtub
e
.com/watch?v=cD4_27rMX6Q=0Awww.youtube.com/watch?v=XEGx=0A==
======================0A=0A___
___
__________________________- Message 6- ________________________________
_____=0A=0A=0ATime: 02:02:20 PM PST US=0AFrom: "Randy Daughenbaugh"
<rjdaug
h@rapidnet.com>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Rep
o
rt=0A=0A=0AMike,=0AUnless you get all the coats and cross coats of p
oly spr
ay on it it won't=0Alast more than a year or two in the sun.- Maybe that
is permanent enough,=0Abut I worry that with all the flexing, and enough c
o
ats or polyspray, it=0Awill crack.=0A=0ARandy=0A=0A=0A-----Origi
nal Message
-----=0AFrom:
owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox
-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JetPilot=0ASent: Friday, January
3
0, 2009 1:19 PM=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
=0A=0A=0AWhy not just use a piece of PolyFiber attached with Polytack
to se
al
the gap=0A???- It would be permanent, easy to do, and look good !- M
uch better than=0Atape.=0A=0AMike=0A=0A--------=0A"NO FEAR&
quot; --
If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you=0Acould have !!!=0A
=0AKol
b MK-III Xtra, 912-S=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0A=0Ahtt
p://forum
s.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=227727#227727=0A=0A=0A______________
_____
_____________- Message
7- _____________________________________=0A=0A
=0ATime: 02:22:29 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0
ASubj
ect: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AThe "grass
catc
her" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or- =0A"S") method of
applying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under- =0Athe front to
over the back" or vice versa, there will always be a- =0Awedge of space t
hat wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get- =0Aout of the "X"
method. That's why I've contented myself with the- =0A"over the front to
over the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically- =0Adirty, having a spa
ce underneath that can eddy air, but have we a- =0Areally "clean" plane o
therwise?=0A=0AYour diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job.-
- - - Lost- =0ASaturday? : )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV
Speedst
er, taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElec
troai
r direct-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn
Feb 1,
2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I can v
isu
alize the X system easy now...- 3D0A> Friday nights=0A> not the best night
of the week for me;-).=0A>=0A> I agree the X system allows for a light h
in
ge on a model but a- =0A> place for=0A> grass and leaves etc. To catch i
n
the "Real thing".=0A>=0A> What I was thinking at first was a couple of p
ie
ces of say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A> sewn right down the middle and then
one half of each tape doped to the=0A> stabilizers with the other halves j
u
st finished to match the- =0A> plane.- They=0A> should be stiff enough
to seal the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a- =0A> couple of=0A> rough di
agrams... emphasis on the term rough!=0A>=0A>
Noel=0A=0A=0A________________
________________- Message 8- _____________________________________=0A
=0A=0ATime: 03:02:08 PM PST US=0AFrom: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.br
ennan
.name>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A
=0AI'
m glad to see someone else used the just-tape-over-the-top method. When=0A
t
his topic came up a few months ago I noticed on a magazine cover picture of
=0Amy plane I have for my desktop that at that time it had black tape on t
h
e=0Atop side of the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I bought the
p
lane.=0AI assume it was wide electrical tape which is *everywhere* on the
p
lane=0Aincluding the leading edges and vertical stabiliser gap, and which
I
am=0Agradually replacing since it peels.=0A=0AI was hesitant to post m
y me
thod since no one else had admitted here to that=0Asimple
method. I used a
yellow duct
tape across the entire topside of the=0Agaps, installed with th
e elevator fully down. With the elevator up it tucks=0Aneatly into the gap
.
I chose the top instead of the bottom so it would not=0Aaccumulate anythin
g, and left the bottom open to see the hinges on=0Apre-flight.=0A=0ASo
far
it has lasted a season and made a difference to control authority on=0Athe
short-field-over-trees grass strip that I use. Before sealing the gap my=0
A
slowest approach speed was determined by when I started losing pitch contro
l=0Aversus stall speed, which made it tough to flare properly. Possibly th
e
=0Aunder-cambered wings and smaller tail made the gap seals more noticeabl
e
on=0Aa Model 2 than later Models.=0A=0ABob Brennan - N717GB=0AELSA R
epairm
an, inspection rated=0A1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox=0ARotax 582 with 3 bl
ade
prop=0AWrightsville Pa- =0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: own
er-k
itfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matroni
c
s.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: 01 February 2009 5:18 pm=0ASub
jec
t: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AThe "grass c
atche
r" is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or- =0A"S") method of a
pplying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under- =0Athe front to ov
er the back" or vice versa, there will always be a- =0Awedge of space tha
t wants to collects debris. It's just harder to get- =0Aout of the "X" me
thod. That's why I've contented myself with the- =0A"over the front to ov
er the back" method....ye
s it's aerodynamically- =0Adirty, having a space
underneath that can eddy air, but have we a- =0Areally "clean" plane oth
erwise?=0A=0AYour diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job.- -
- - Lost-
=0ASaturday? : )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroa
ir d
irect-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb
1, 200
9, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I can visu
ali
ze the X system easy now...- =0A> Friday nights=0A> not the best night o
f
the week for me;-).=0A>=0A> I agree the X system allows for a light hing
e
on a model but a- =0A> place for=0A> grass and leaves etc. To catch in t
h
e "Real thing".=0A>=0A> What I was thinking at first was a couple of pie
ces
of say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A> sewn right down the middle and then one
half of each tape doped to the=0A> stabilizers with the other halves just
finished to match the- =0A> plane.- They=0A> should be stiff enough to
seal the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a- =0A> couple of=0A> rough diagr
ams...
emphasis on the term rough!=0A>=0A> Noel=0A=0A=0A________________
___
_____________- Message 9- _____________________________________=0A=0A
=0ATime: 03:13:42 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0
ASubj
ect: Kitfox-List: Ski report/snow conditions=0A=0A=0ALast week I had a
"ski
tuck" due to the bungees not being set to a- =0Ahigh enough initial tens
ion. This week I cut 2" from them=2
0and- =0Areinstalled and test flew them
- yesterday and today, and could not- =0Aget it to happen again. Admitt
edly, I wasn't really giving it what- =0Acould be considered an acrobatic
test, but I made some (weak) dives- =0Aand pull-ups, and couldn't get th
e ski, or skis, to drop or tuck. I- =0Aeven flew in bumpy-bangy air. I ha
d made a tension check before and- =0Aafter the shortening, and I picked
up about 8 pounds of tension per- =0Acord, or
16 pounds per ski.=0A=0AI f
lew today to test the condition of the snow.- Last week when I- =0Atrie
d to leave here to go to Oshkosh, the snow was so wet and heavy- =0Athat
I could not get over 20 mph on the takeoff roll. This was after- =0A2 day
s of above freezing temps...34-36 degrees F. Today, the- =0Aconditions we
re the same...overnight of over freezing, and 34 F when- =0AI took off. I
t took a bit of coaxing, but I got up alright, and- =0Alanded at 4 differ
ent snow-covered grass strips. It was the same at- =0Aall strips...a bit
longer than normal (most ski takeoffs take more- =0Arunway, I've read), b
ut doable. When I stopped for lunch, I parked in- =0Amy own tracks, then
30 minutes later just rocked the plane a bit- =0Abefore fire-up, firewall
ed it, and away I went, taxiing to the- =0Arunway...slowly. I used up abo
ut 1100 feet of a crosswind, no-tracks- =0Arunway before giving up and tr
ying it on a
snowmobile-trodden runway- =0Ainto the wind. It still took a
bout 300 feet
before it got off the- =0Aground due to the sticky snow con
ditions.=0A=0AAn article I had read (National Research Council of Canada
) t
alked- =0Aabout "snow friction" in this way:=0A=0A"Early in the tests,
it
was found that sliding resistance and- =0Aadhesion were far more depende
nt upon snow conditions than on the- =0Adesign of the ski. Further, the s
kiing quality of the snow changed- =0Acontinually and it was not unusual
to observe marked changes taking- =0Aplace in less than an hour. The publ
ication notes that there are- =0Atimes when the sliding resistance of air
craft skis is so great that- =0Ait is impossible to reach flying speed."
=0A=0AI'm having a blast test-flying my skis, and seeing first-hand how-
=0Asome of the writings that I studied while building them have merit.=0
A
=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 6
05 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition system=0ANe
w ski
s done and flying=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 5:17 P
M, Lynn
Matteson wrote:=0A=0A>=0A> The "grass catcher" is the problem with eit
her
the "X" or the- =0A> "Z" (or "S") method of applying tape...whether you a
pply the tape- =0A> from "under the front to over the back" or vice versa
, there will- =0A> always be a wedge of space that wants to collects debr
is. It's just- =0A> harder to get out of the "X" method. That's why I've
contented- =0A> myself with the "over the front to over the back" method.
...yes- 3D0A> it's aerodynamically dirty, having a space underneath that c
an eddy- =0A> air, but have we a really "clean" plane otherwise?=0A>=0
A>
Your diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job.- - - - Lost
- =0A> Saturday? : )=0A>=0A> Lynn
Matteson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taild
ragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electro
air d
irect-fire ignition system=0A> New skis done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A>
On Feb
1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon and I
can
visualize the X system easy now...- =0A>> Friday nights=0A>> not the bes
t night of the week for me;-).=0A>>=0A>> I agree the X system allows for
a
light hinge on a model but a- =0A>> place for=0A>> grass and leaves etc.
To catch in the "Real thing".=0A>>=0A>> What I was thinking at first was
a
couple of pieces of say 2 1/2- =0A>> inch tape=0A>> sewn right down the
m
iddle and then one half of each tape doped to- =0A>> the=0A>> stabilizer
s
with the other halves just finished to match the- =0A>> plane.- They
=0A>> should be stiff enough to
seal the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a
- =0A>> couple of=0A>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term rough!=0
A>>
=0A>> Noel=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Mes
sage 10
- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 03:19:35 PM PST U
S
=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: El
eva
tor Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AI just tape up to the hinges, then ta
pe ag
ain on t
he other side of- =0Athe hinge...all on the top-to-top surfaces..
.I'm gettin' too old to- =0Abend down and look under there, Bob. : )=0A
=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #20
62, 6
05 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair direct-fire ignition system=0ANe
w ski
s done and flying=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 5:57 P
M, Bob
Brennan wrote:=0A=0A> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=0A>=0A> I'm glad
to see
someone else used the just-tape-over-the-top- =0A> method. When=0A> this
topic came up a few months ago I noticed on a magazine cover- =0A> pictur
e of=0A> my plane I have for my desktop that at that time it had black tap
e
- =0A> on the=0A> top side of the stabiliser gap, which was not there wh
e
n I bought- =0A> the plane.=0A> I assume it was wide electrical tape whi
c
h is *everywhere* on the- =0A> plane=0A> including the leading edges and
vertical stabiliser gap, and which- =0A> I am=0A> gradually replacing si
n
ce it peels.=0A>=0A> I was hesitant to post my method since no one else
had
admitted- =0A> here to that=0A> simple method. I used a yellow duct tape
across the entire topside- =0A> of the=0A> gaps, installed with
the elev
ator fully down. With the elevator up- =0A> it tucks=0A> neatly into the
gap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it- =0A> would not=0A> acc
u
mulate anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges on=0A> pre-fli
g
ht.=0A>=0A> So far it has lasted a season and made a d
ifference to control
- =0A> authority on=0A> the short-field-over-trees grass strip that I us
e
. Before sealing- =0A> the gap my=0A> slowest approach speed was determi
n
ed by when I started losing- =0A> pitch control=0A> versus stall speed,
w
hich made it tough to flare properly. Possibly- =0A> the=0A> under-cambe
r
ed wings and smaller tail made the gap seals more- =0A> noticeable on=0A
>
a Model 2 than later Models.=0A>=0A> Bob Brennan - N717GB=0A> ELSA Rep
airm
an, inspection rated=0A> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox=0A> Rotax 582 with
3 b
lade prop=0A> Wrightsville
Pa=0A>=0A> -----Original Message-----=0A> From:
owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com=0A> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-serve
r
@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn- =0A> Matteson=0A> Sent: 01 February 2
0
09 5:18 pm=0A> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-Lis
t:
Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A>=0A>=0A> The "grass catcher" is the p
roble
m with either the "X" or the "Z" (or=0A> "S") method of applying tape...wh
e
ther you apply the tape from "under=0A> the front to over the back" or vic
e
versa, there will always be a=0A> wedge of space that wants to collects de
bris. It's just harder to get=0A> out of the "X" method. That's why I've c
o
ntented myself with the=0A>
"over the front to over the back" method....yes
it's aerodynamically=0A> dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy ai
r, but have we a=0A> really "clean" plane otherwise?=0A>=0A> Your diag
rams
are very understandable, Noel...good job.- - - - Lost=0
A> Saturday?
: )=0A>=0A> Lynn Matteson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> J
abiru
2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire igni
tio
n system=0A> New skis done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Feb 1, 2009, at
1:57 P
M, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the
X s
ystem easy now...=0A>> Friday nights=0A>> not the best night of the week
fo
r me;-).=0A>>=0A>> I agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a mo
del
but a=0A>> place for=0A>> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real th
in
g".=0A>>=0A>> What I was thinking
at first was a couple of pieces of say 2
1/2=0A>> inch tape=0A>> sewn right down the middle and then one half of
eac
h tape doped to- =0A>> the=0A>> stabilizers with the other halves just f
i
nished to match the=0A>> plane.- They=0A>> should be stiff enough to sea
l
the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a=0A>> couple of=0A>> rough diagrams...
emphasis on the term rough!=0A>>=0A>> Noel=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A___
____________
_________________- Message 11- ____________________________________=0A
=0A=0ATime: 03:24:36 PM PST US=0AFrom: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner
.com>
=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AI
did th
at with ski saver. Worked fin and not too complicated for my brain. =0AI c
a
n make decent 3pt landings with the Soob on front and no
=0Aflaps----Barely
, But it works.- - Larry 4-1200 Soob=0A=0A----- Original Message -----
=0AFrom: "Bob Brennan" <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=3
D0ASent: Sunday, Februar
y 01, 2009 5:57 PM=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Repo
r
t=0A=0A=0A> <matronics@bob.brennan.name>=0A>=0A> I'm glad to see s
omeone el
se used the just-tape-over-the-top method. When=0A> this topic came up a f
e
w months ago I noticed on a magazine cover picture =0A> of=0A> my plane
I h
ave for my desktop that at that time it had black tape on the=0A> top side
of the stabiliser gap, which was not there when I bought the =0A> plane.
=0A
> I assume it was wide electrical tape which is *everywhere* on the plane
=0A> including
the leading edges and vertical stabiliser gap, and which I a
m=0A> gradually replacing since it peels.=0A>=0A> I was hesitant to po
st my
method since no one else had admitted here to =0A> that=0A> simple metho
d.
I used a yellow duct tape across the entire topside of the=0A> gaps, insta
lled with the elevator fully down. With the elevator up it =0A> tucks=0A
> n
eatly into the gap. I chose the top instead of the bottom so it would not
=0A> accumulate anything, and left the bottom open to see the hinges on
=0A>
pre-flight.=0A>=0A> So far it has lasted a season and made a difference
to
control authority =0A> on=0A> the short-field-over-trees grass strip tha
t
I use. Before sealing the gap =0A> my=0A> slowest approach speed was det
erm
ined by when I started losing pitch =0A> control=0A> versus stall speed,
wh
ich made it tough to flare properly. Possibly the=0A>
under-cambered wings
and smalle
r tail made the gap seals more noticeable =0A> on=0A> a Model 2 t
han later Models.=0A>=0A> Bob Brennan - N717GB=0A> ELSA Repairman, ins
pecti
on rated=0A> 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox=0A> Rotax 582 with 3 blade prop
=0A
> Wrightsville Pa=0A>=0A> -----Original Message-----=0A> From: owner-k
itfox
-list-server@matronics.com=0A> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.
c
om] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson=0A> Sent: 01 February 2009 5:18 pm=0A> To
: k
itfox-list@matronics.com=0A> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal T
e
st Report=0A>=0A>=0A> The "grass catcher"
is the problem with either the "X
" or the "Z" (or=0A> "S") method of applying tape...whether you apply the
t
ape from "under=0A> the front to over the back" or vice versa, there will
a
lways be a=0A> wedge of space that wants to collects debris. It's just har
d
er to get=0A> out of the "X" method. That's why I've contented myself with
the=0A> "over the front to over the back" method....yes it's aerodynamical
l
y=0A> dirty, having a space underneath that can eddy air, but have we a
=0A>
really "clean" plane otherwise?=0A>=0A> Your diagrams are very understan
da
ble, Noel...good job.- - - - Lost=0A> Saturday? : )=0A>=0A> Lynn Ma
tteson=0A> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger=0A> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605
hrs
=0A> Sensenich 62x46=0A> Electroair direct-fire ignition system=0A> Ne
w ski
s done and flying=0A>=0A>=0A> On Feb 1, 2009, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys
wrote
:=0A>=0A>> Sunday afternoon and I can visualize the X system easy now...
=0A0A>> Friday nights=0A>> not the best night of the week for me;-).=0
A>>=0A>> I
agree the X system allows for a light hinge on a model but a=0A>> place fo
r=0A>> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the "Real thing".=0A>>=0A>> W
hat I
was thinking at first was a couple of pieces of say 2 1/2=0A>> inch tape
=0A>> sewn right down the middle and then one half of each tape doped to t
h
e=0A>> stabilizers with the other halves just finished to match the=0A>>
pl
ane.- They=0A>> should be stiff enough to seal the gaps in flight.- I'l
l attach a=0A>> couple of=0A>> rough diagrams... emphasis on the term ro
ugh
!=0A>>=0A>> Noel=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A-----------------------------
-------------
--------------------------------------=0A=0A=0AChecked by
AVG - http://www.
avg.com=0A6:02 PM=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message
12-
____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:00:25 PM PST US
=0AFr
om: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>=0ASubject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevat
o
r Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0ANot lost just out of town until later l
ast n
ight.=0A=0AWhat did you think of the idea of using Velcro (just on the r
udd
er)- Would=0Amake it easy to clean and also easy to remove the rudder for
repairs due to=0Ahangar rash.=0A=0AI'm going to try a gap seal this sp
ring
when I get the plane out again.- At=0Aleast on the rudder to try to give
me more authority for slips.- Those big=0Afloats hanging three feet or m
ore below the CG really want to right the=0Aplane.- So far I've been givi
ng full ruddr and controlling the slip with
the=0Aailerons.- Even doing t
hat the slip is more gentle than what I can get with=0Ano problems from a
C
-172.=0A=0ANoel=0A=0A-----Original Message-----=0AFrom: owner-kitf
ox-list-s
erver@matronics.com=0A[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On B
e
half Of Lynn Matteson=0ASent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 6:48 PM=0ASubjec
t:
Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A=0A=0AThe "grass catc
her"
is the problem with either the "X" or the "Z" (or- =0A"S") method of appl
ying tape...whether you apply the tape from "under- =0Athe front to over
the back" or vice versa, there will always be a- =0Awedge of space that w
ants to collects debris. It's just harder to get- =0Aout of the "X" metho
d. That's why I've contented myself
with the- =0A"over the front to over
the back" method....yes it's aerodynamically- =0Adirty, having a space un
derneath that can eddy air, but have we a- =0Areally "clean" plane otherw
ise?=0A=0AYour diagrams are very understandable, Noel...good job.- -
- - Lost- =0ASaturday? : )=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedster,
taildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroa
ir di
rect-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0A=0A=0AOn Feb
1, 2009
, at 1:57 PM, Noel Loveys wrote:=0A=0A> Sunday afternoon and I can visua
liz
e the X system easy now...- =0A> Friday nights=0A> not the best night of
the week for me;-).=0A>=0A> I agree the X system allows for a light hing
e o
n a model b
ut a- =0A> place for=0A> grass and leaves etc. To catch in the
"Real thing".=0A>=0A> What I was thinking at first was a couple of piece
s
of say 2 1/2- =0A> inch tape=0A> sewn right
down the middle and then one
half of each tape doped to the=0A> stabilizers with the other halves just
f
inished to match the- =0A> plane.- They=0A> should be stiff enough to s
eal the gaps in flight.- I'll attach a- =0A> couple of=0A> rough diagra
ms... emphasis on the term rough!=0A>=0A> Noel=0A=0A=0A___________
_________
____________- Message 13- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0
A
Time: 05:05:11 PM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Tes
t
Report=0AFrom: "Lowlead" <j.t.cowie@xoxy.net>=0A=0A=0AI use a 3M 337
2 poly
urethane surface protection tape applied on both top and bottom=0Aof the g
a
p (previous posts shown as >-=0A=0A=0ARead this topic online here:=0
A=0Ahtt
p://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084=0A=0A=0AAttac
hment
s: =0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_141.jpg=0A=0A
=0A______
__________________________- Message 14- _______________________________
_____=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:30:02 PM PST US=0AFrom: Lynn Matteson <lynnma
tt@jps.
net>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report=0A
=0A=0A
That's a good-looking job, LL.=0A=0ALynn Matteson=0AKitfox IV Speedste
r, ta
ildragger=0AJabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs=0ASensenich 62x46=0AElectroair
dire
ct-fire ignition system=0ANew skis done and flying=0Ado not archive=0A
=0A
=0AOn Feb 1, 2009, at 8:01 PM, Lowlead wrote:=0A=0A>=0A
> I use a 3M 3372 po
lyurethane surface protection tape applied on- =0A> both top and bottom o
f the gap (previous posts shown as >-=0A>=0A>=0A> Read this topic onli
ne he
re:=0A>=0A> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084
=0A>
=0A>=0A> Attachments:=0A>=0A> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gap
seal1_1
41.jpg=0A>=0A>=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message 1
5- __
__________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 05:39:40 PM PST US
=0AFrom:
"Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
=0A=0A=0AJust received this. Does it sound like the same material?- La
rry
=0A=0A----- Original Message ----- =0AFrom: <info@tognar.com>=0ASent
: Sunda
y, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM=0ASubject: Re: ski saver=0A=0A=0A>=0A
> Yes,=0A
> check
this link on our bags/racks page=0A> http://www.tognar.com/bags_rac
ks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html=0A> The top item is the scuff
saver tape,=0A> Thanks,=0A> Cat=0A> www.tognar.com=0A>=0A>=0A>>;
Do you stil
l have "ski saver" tape?- Larry Huntley- asq@roadrunner.com=0A> Ye=0A>
=0A=0A=0A-------------------------------------------------------------
-----
--------------=0A=0A=0AChecked by AVG - http://www.avg.com=0A6:02 PM
=0A=0A
=0A________________________________- Message 16- ______________________
______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 06:11:13 PM PST US=0AFrom: patrick reil
ly <pat
reilly43@hotmail.com>=0ASubject: RE:
Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A=0A=0ALar
ry=2C Thanks for the web link. I ordered 5 feed just to have on hand. Th
=0Aat price for 14" wide clear tape is unreal. There are ma
ny times I wante
d s=0Aome of that tape to protect paint on a car=2C motorcycle tank=2C
etc. I'll =0Ause it on the gap seal=2C Alla Lynn Matteson top side only.
Lynn=2C if that=0Acurls down into the gap=2C rather than up=2C I don
'
t know why anybody woul=0Ad use any other method.=0Ado not archive Pat R
eil
lyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From: asq@roadrun=0Aner.com> To: kitf
o
x-list@matronics.com> Subject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver=0A> Date: Sun
=2
C 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500> > --> Kitfox-List message posted =0Aby: "Larr
y
Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> > Just
received this. Does it sou=0And like
the same material? Larry> > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <i=0Anfo@
tognar.com>> To: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>> Sent: Sunday=2C
=0AFebruary 01=2C 2009 7:54 PM> Subject: Re: ski saver> > > >> > Yes=2
C
> > che=0Ack this link on our bags/racks page> > http://www.tognar.com/bag
s
_racks_boo=0At_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html> > The top item is the
scuff saver t=0Aape=2C> > Thanks=2C> > Cat> > www.tognar.com>; >> >> >
>
Do you still have "s=0Aki saver" tape? Larry Huntley asq@roadrunner.com> >
Ye> >> > >
------------=0A-------------------------------------------------
-------------------> > > >=0A=====> > > =0A=0A______________
_____
_____________- Message 17- ____________________________________=0A=0A
=0ATime: 06:50:23 PM PST US=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver=0AFr
om: "
AKFLYERBOB" <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>=0A=0A=0ALarry=0AWhat materi
al are
you talking about?=0AI'm sure eve
ry one would like to know.=0ABob=0A=0A----
----=0ABob Wolfe..Soldotna, Alaska=0AKF Mod I and III=0A=0A=0ARead
this top
ic online here:=0A=0Ahttp://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=22809
8#2
28098=0A=0A=0A________________________________- Message 18- __________
_
_________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 08:17:28 PM PST US=0AFrom: R
exinato
r <rexinator@gmail.com>=0ASubject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal
T
est Report=0A=0A=0AThat's exactly what I was trying to describe with m
y-
>-<- symbol and my =0Alittle drawn image file.- I agree with Lynn that
it's a nice job. Can =0Ayou elaborate on how you applied so well?=0A=0
ARex
=0AColorado M2/582=0A=0A=0ALowlead wrote:=0A>=0A> I use a 3M 337
2 polyureth
ane surface protection tape applied on both top and=0Abottom of the gap (p
r
evious posts shown as >-=0A>=0A>=0A> Read this topic online here:=0A
> http:
//forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228084#228084=0A>=0A>=0A> Att
achme
nts: =0A> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal1_141.jpg=0A>- =0A
=0A
=0A________________________________- Message 19-
______________________
______________=0A=0A=0ATime: 09:18:50 PM PST US=0ASubject: Re: Kitfo
x-List:
Fw: ski saver=0AFrom: John Bonewitz <bonewitz@gmail.com>=0A=0AWe have
a wi
nner! I'm going to order some of this stuff. There are probably=0Alots of
o
ther uses besides gap seal.=0A=0AThanks,=0AJohn Bonewitz=0ASeries 5
=0A=0AOn
Sun, Feb 1, 2009 at 7:38 PM, Larry Huntley <asq@roadrunner.com> wrote:=0A
=0A>=0A> Just received this. Does it sound like the same material?- Larr
y
=0A>=0A> -----
Original Message ----- From: <info@tognar.com>=0A> To: "Larr
y Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>=0A> Sent: Sunday,
February 01, 2009 7:54 PM
=0A> Subject: Re: ski saver=0A>=0A>=0A>> Yes,=0A>> check this link
on our b
ags/racks page=0A>> http://www.tognar.com/bags_racks_boot_ski_binding_snow
b
oard_accessory.html=0A>> The top item is the scuff saver tape,=0A>> Than
ks,
=0A>> Cat=0A>> www.tognar.com=0A>>=0A>>=0A>>- Do you still have "s
ki save
r" tape?- Larry Huntley- asq@roadrunner.com=0A>>>=0A>> Ye=0A>>=0A>>
=0A>
=0A>=0A> ---------------------------------------------------------------
---
--------------=0A>=0A>=0A> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com=0A> 6
:02 PM
=0A>=0A>=0A=0A________________________________- Message
20- ___________
_________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 11:08:00 PM PST US=0AFrom: M
att Dra
lle <dralle@matronics.com>=0ASubject: Kitfox-List: Official Kitfox-List FA
Q
(Frequently Asked Questions)=0A=0A=0ADear Listers,=0A=0APlease rea
d over t
he Kitfox-List Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) below.- The=0Acomplete Ki
tfox-List FAQ including the Usage Guidelines can be found at the=0Afollowi
n
g URL:=0A=0A- http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Kitfox-List.FAQ.html=0A
=0ATha
nk you,=0A=0AMatt Dralle=0AMatronics Email List Administrator=0A=0
A=0A[ Not
e: This FAQ was designed to be displayed with a fixed width font such as=0
A
- - - - Courier.- Proportional fonts will cause display formattin
g errors. ]=0A=0A=0A- This FAQ can also be viewed in HTML online at th
e
f
ollowing address:=0A- =0A- - - - - - - - http://www.matro
nics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm=0A=0A
0A- - - - **********************
**************************************=0A- - - - ******* LIST POLIC
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his
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ubscribers.- Understanding the Kitfox-List policies will=0Aminimize probl
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=0A- - - - - - - can more easily handled.=0A=0A- *
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Administrato
r=0A=0A=0A************************************************************
*****
*************=0A- - - - - - - - - - Kitfox-List Usage G
uidelines=0A**************************************************************
*
***************=0A=0AThe following details the official Usage Guidelines
fo
r the Kitfox-List.=0AYou are encouraged to read it carefully, and to abide
by the rules therein.=0AFailure to use the Kitfox-List in the manner descr
i
bed below may result =0Ain the removal of the subscribers from the List.
=0A
=0A=0AKitfox-List Policy Statement=0A=0AThe purpose of the Kitfox-Li
st is t
o provide a forum of discussion for=0Athings related to this particular di
s
cussion group.- The List's goals=0Aare to serve as an information resourc
e to its members; to deliver=0Ahigh-quality content; to provide moral supp
o
rt; to foster camaraderie=0Aamong its members; and to support safe operati
o
n.- Reaching these goals
=0Arequires the
participation and cooperation of
each and every member of =0Athe List.- To this end, the following guidel
ines have been established:=0A=0A=0A- Please keep all posts related to
the
List at some level.- Do not submit=0A- posts concerning computer viruse
s, urban legends, random humor, long=0A- lost buddies' phone numbers, etc
. etc.=0A=0A- THINK carefully before you write.- Ask yourself if your po
s
t will be=0A- relevant to everyone.- If you have to wonder about that,
DON'T send it.=0A=0A- Remember that your post will be included for poste
rit
y in an archive=0A- that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate.-
Try to be concise and=0A- terse in your posts.- Avoid overly wordy and
lengthy posts and=0A- responses.=0A=0A- Keep your signature brief.- Pl
e
ase include your name, email address,=0A- aircraft type/tail number, and
geographic location.- A short line=0A- about where you are in the
build
ing process is also nice.- Avoid=0A- bulky signatures with character gr
aphics; they consume unnecessary=0A- space in the archive.=0A=0A- DON'
T p
ost requests to the List for information when that info is=0A- easily obt
ainable from other widely available sources.- Consult the=0A- web page
or FAQ first.=0A=0A- If you want to respond to a post, DO keep the "Subj
ect
:" line of=0A- your response the same as that of the original post.- Th
is makes it=0A- easy to find threads in the archive.=0A=0A- When respo
ndi
ng, NEVER quote the *entire* original post in your=0A- response.-
DO us
e lines from the original post to help "tune in" the=0A- reader to the to
pic at hand, but be selective.- The impact that=0A- quoting the entire
original post has on the size of the archive =0A- can not be overstated!
=0A=0A- When the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NO
T
=0A- then go ahead and reply to the List.-
Be aware that clicking the
=0A- "reply" button on your mail package does not necessarily send your
=0A- response to the original poster.- You might have to actively addre
ss=0A- your response with the original poster's email address.=0A=0A-
DO
NOT use the List to respond to a post unless you have something=0A- to ad
d that is relevant and has a broad appeal.- "Way to go!", "I=0A- agree"
, and "Congratulations" are all responses that are better sent=0A- to the
original poster directly, rather than to the List at large.=0A=0A- When
re
sponding to others' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to=0A- comment
on every last point in their posts, unless you can truly=0A- contribute
something valuable.=0A=0A- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints,
BUT
keep your tone=0A- polite and respectful.- Don't make snide comments,
personally attack=0A- other listers, or take the moral high ground on an
obviously=0A-
controversial issue.- This will only cause a pointless de
bate that=0A- will hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.=0
A
=0A- Occasional posts by vendors or individuals who are regularly =0A- s
u
bscribed to a
given List are considered acceptable.- Posts by =0A- List
members promoting their respective products or items for sale =0A- shoul
d be of a friendly, informal nature, and should not resemble =0A- a typic
al SPAM message.- The List isn't about commercialism, but =0A- is about
sharing information and knowledge.- This applies to =0A- everyone, inc
luding those who provide products to the entire =0A- community.- Inform
al presentation and moderation should be the =0A- operatives with respect
to advertising on the Lists.=0A=0A-------=0A=0A=0A[This is an auto
mated po
sting.]=0A=0Ado not archive=0A=0A=0A______________________________
__- Mes
sage 21- ____________________________________=0A=0A=0ATime: 11:25:19
PM P
ST US=0AFrom: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>=0ASubject: Kitfox-List:
Of
ficial Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines=0A=0A=0ADear Listers,=0A=0APle
ase read
over the Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines below.- The complete=0AKitfox-List
FAQ including these Usage Guidelines can be found at the=0Afollowing URL:
=0A=0A- http://www.matronics.com/FAQs/Kitfox-List.FAQ.html=0A=0AThan
k you
,=0A=0AMatt Dralle=0AMatronics Email List Administrator=0A=0A=0A
***********
*******************************************************************=0A-
- - - - - - - - - Kitfox-List Usage Guidelines=0A********
**********************************************************************=0A
=0AThe following details the official Usage Guidelines for the Kitfox-List
.
=0AYou are encouraged
to read it carefully, and to abide by the rules there
in.=0AFailure to use the Kitfox-List in the manner d
escribed below may resu
lt =0Ain the removal of the subscribers from the List.=0A=0A=0AKitfo
x-List
Policy Statement=0A=0AThe purpose of the Kitfox-List is to provide a for
um
of discussion for=0Athings related to this particular discussion group.-
The List's goals=0Aare to serve as an information resource to its members;
to deliver=0Ahigh-quality content; to provide moral support; to foster cam
a
raderie=0Aamong its members; and to support safe operation.- Reaching the
se goals =0Arequires the participation and cooperation of each and every m
e
mber of =0Athe List.- To this end, the following guidelines have been est
ablished:=0A=0A=0A- Please keep all posts related to the List at some
level
.- Do not submit=0A- posts concerning computer viruses, urban legends,
random humor, long=0A- lost buddies' phone numbers,
etc. etc.=0A=0A- THIN
K carefully before you write.- Ask yourself if your post will be=0A- re
levant to everyone.- If you have to wonder about that, DON'T send it.=0A
=0A- Remember that your post will be included for posterity in an archive
=0A- that is growing in size at an extraordinary rate.- Try to be conci
se and=0A- terse in your posts.- Avoid overly wordy and lengthy posts a
nd=0A- responses.=0A=0A- Keep your signature brief.- Please include yo
u
r name, email address,=0A- aircraft type/tail number, and geographic loca
tion.- A short line=0A- about where you are in the building process is
also nice.- Avoid=0A- bulky signatures with character graphics; they co
nsume u
nnecessary=0A- space in the archive.=0A=0A- DON'T post requests to
the List for information when that info is=0A- easily obtainable from ot
her widely available sources.- Consult the=0A- web page or FAQ first.
=0A=0A- If you want to respond to a
post, DO keep the "Subject:" line of=0A
- your response the same as that of the original post.- This makes it
=0A- easy to find threads in the archive.=0A=0A- When responding, NEVE
R q
uote the *entire* original post in your=0A- response.- DO use lines fro
m the original post to help "tune in" the=0A- reader to the topic at hand
, but be selective.- The impact that=0A- quoting the entire original po
st has on the size of the archive =0A- can not be overstated!=0A=0A- W
hen
the poster asks you to respond to him/her personally, DO NOT=0A- then go
ahead and reply to the List.- Be aware that clicking the=0A- "reply" b
utton on your mail package does not necessarily send your=0A- response to
the original poster.- You might have to actively address=0A- your resp
onse with the original poster's email address.=0A=0A- DO NOT use the Lis
t t
o respond to a post unless you have something=0A- to add that is relevant
and has a
broad appeal.- "Way to go!", "I=0A- agree", and "Congratulat
ions" are all responses that are better sent=0A- to the original poster d
irectly, rather than to the List at large.=0A=0A- When responding to oth
ers
' posts, avoid the feeling that you need to=0A- comment on every last poi
nt in their pos
ts, unless you can truly=0A- contribute something valuable
.=0A=0A- Feel free to disagree with other viewpoints, BUT keep your tone
=0A
- polite and respectful.- Don't make snide comments, personally attack
=0A- other listers, or take the moral high ground on an obviously=0A- c
ontroversial issue.- This will only cause a pointless debate that=0A- w
ill hurt feelings, waste bandwidth and resolve nothing.=0A=0A- Occasiona
l p
osts by vendors or individuals who are regularly =0A- subscribed to a giv
en List are considered acceptable.- Posts by =0A- List members promotin
g their respective products or items for sale =0A- should
be of a friendl
y, informal nature, and should not resemble =0A- a typical SPAM message.
- The List isn't about commercialism, but =0A- is about sharing informa
tion and knowledge.- This applies to =0A- everyone, including those who
provide products to the entire =0A- community.- Informal presentation
and moderation should be the =0A- operatives with respect to advertising
on the Lists.=0A=0A-------=0A=0A=0A[This is an automated posting.]
=0A=0Ado
=========================0
A
=0A=0A=C2- =C2- =C2-
________________________________=C2- Message 3=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 03:55:05 AM PST US
From: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver=C2- =C2- AKFLYERBOB
=C2- =C2- =C2- -Equipment protection-
=C2- =C2- =C2- SKUFF SAVER
Item #TYC 7210
=C2- =C2- =C2- $2.95 per foot
0A=C2- =C2- =C2- Protect the tops of your new skis or snowboard from s
cratches and
gouges. This clear tough Dupont Surlyn tape is backed with a self-adhesive
film for easy application and good bonding. It's 14" wide...enough to span
any single snowboard or pair of skis and is sold by the linear foot. Simply
order the length you need and trim the width with scissors to fit your
needs.=C2- =C2- Quantity:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
----- Original Message -----
From: "AKFLYERBOB" <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 9:49 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: ski saver
> <r.wolfejr@worldnet.att.net>
>
> Larry
> What material are you talking about?
> I'm sure every one would like to know.
> Bob
>
> --------
> Bob Wolfe..Soldotna, Alaska
> KF Mod I and III
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228098#228098
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
6:02 PM
________________________________=C2- Message 4=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 06:02:37 AM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
I think=C2- the amount of "curl down" can be controlled by the amount=C2
-
that you press down between the tubes themselves....simply press more=C2-
into the gap before pressing onto the tubes and it should stay there.=C2-
I usually just lay it over the gap equally spaced on both si
des and=C2-
press it down. I didn't get too worried about whether it went up or=C2-
down, although down would be preferred.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
On Feb 1, 2009, at 9:08 PM, patrick reilly wrote:
> Larry, Thanks for the web link. I ordered 5 feed just to have on=C2-
> hand. That price for 14" wide clear tape is unreal. There are many=C2-
>
times I wanted some of that tape to protect paint on a car,=C2-
> motorcycle tank, etc. I'll use it on the gap seal, Alla Lynn=C2-
> Matteson top side only. Lynn, if that curls down into the gap,=C2-
> rather than up, I don't know why anybody would use any other method.
> do not archive
>
> Pat Reilly
> Mod 3 582 Rebuild
> Rockford, IL
>
>
> > From: asq@roadrunner.com
> > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> > Subject: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
> > Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500
> >
> <asq@roadrunner.com>
> >
> > Just received this. Does it sound like the same material?
Larry
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: <info@tognar.com>
> > To: "Larry Huntley" <asq@roadrunner.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 7:54 PM
> > Subject: Re: ski saver
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Yes,
> > > check this link on our bags/racks page
> > > http://www.tognar.com/
> bags_racks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html
> > > The top item is the scuff saver tape,
> > > Th
anks,
> > > Cat
> > > www.tognar.com
> > >
> > >
> > >> Do you still have "ski saver" tape? Larry Huntley=C2-
> asq@roadrunner.com
> > > Ye
> > >
> >
> >
> >=C2-
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
> >
> >
> >
> > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
> > 6:02 PM====================
> >================
> >
> >
> >
>
> ========================
> ========================
> ========================
=========
________________________________=C2- Message 5=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 07:01:09 AM PST US
From: Catz631@aol.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Tes
t Report
Noel,
If you are gap sealing your rudder,John McBean has a very nice contoured
hard foam for that purpose. I bought some of it and glued it to the horizont
al
stab then covered it with 6 inch polyfiber tape. I painted it and it looks n
ice
..
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2-
=C2- =C2- Dick Maddux0A=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2-
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- Pensacola,Fl
**************Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to
stocks and so much more. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)
________________________________=C2- Message 6=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 07:03:47 AM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
From: "lowflyer" <buddcr@yahoo.com>
Guys,
Please take a look at the following website.
http://www.aerographic.com/gap_seal.htm
These gap seals are used on Pitts and Eagle aircraft. They have been used on
many
others as well.=C2- There not too expensive, easy to install and they are
removable
and should last a long, long time!=C2- You can cut to length for your appl
ication
and for fitting around hinges. My buddy uses them on his beautiful Pitts
S2B.=C2- I will probably be getting some soon.
Chris
Budd
N53RJ Kitfox IV Speedster
VW 2180 240hrs
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228155#228155
________________________________=C2- Message 7=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 07:05:18 AM PST US
From: Catz631@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
Lowlead,
That looks like an "X" job and a good one at that. I will have to try that
when mine peels off.
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2-
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- Dick Maddux
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2-
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- Pensacola,Fl
**************Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to
stocks and so much more. (http://aol.com?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000022)
________________________________=C2- Message 8=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 07:34:43 AM PST US
From: Rexinator <rexinator@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
I think had a small sample sheet of this material back in 1984 which I
used to protect the front of a "chin" fairing on my Honda Interceptor.
It had the characteristics you describe, clear, very tough, designed for
protecting front of sporty cars paint from small rock
chips.
Rex
Colorado M2/582
do not archive
Lowlead wrote:
>
> Thanks Rex (and Lynn)! I wish I could say that it's this consistent along
the
entire length of the gap, but it's not. The gaps tend to be smaller on the o
utboard
ends due to the way the tightened fabric act on the stab and elevator frames
.
>
> Installation is hard to describe but not that hard to do. One thing nice a
bout
this tape is that it's very pliable and the adhesive is not super-aggressive
at first. The tape is applied across the gap (we'll say the top side first)
with
a very slight 'drape' down and then f
irmly pressed onto the LE/TE tubes.
Then the bottom side tape is applied with a very slight drape up (I used a p
c
of 1/4" tube to force the drape up) and then pressed onto the LE/TE tubes. T
he
two tapes stick to one another like a champ but leaves a triangular 'bubble'
running the entire length . I used a
wooden tongue depressor and fingers to press
the top and bottom tapes together to eliminate the bubble. (see attached).
It's tough stuff and stretches well enough to get a tight installation. Ther
e's
no worries about tearing or punching through with the tongue depressor.
>
> The control surface (elevator or rudder) must be in the neutral position w
hen
tape is applied or else a tension 'bias' might get built into the installati
on
(ex: rudder now pulls left or right due to tape..)
> Hope this makes sense...
>
> Dan H.
>
>
> rexinator wrote:
>=C2-
>> That's exactly what I was trying to describe with my=C2- >-<=C2- symb
ol and my
>> little drawn image file.=C2- I agree with Lynn that it's a nice job. Ca
n
>> you elaborate on how you applied so well?
>>
>> Rex
>> Colorado
M2/582
>>
>>
>>
>>=C2- =C2-
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228125#228125
>
>
> Attachments:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com//files/gapseal2_183.jpg
>
>
>=C2-
________________________________=C2- Message 9=C2- _____________________
________________
Time: 07:34:43 AM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: air worthiness
From: "dcsfoto" <david@kelm.com>
A DAR wi
th the correct function code can issue a replacement.
All you need is to have him look in the FAA files (cost us $3.00) obtain the
info
from the
original.
do a letter requesting a replacement.
David
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228163#228163
________________________________=C2- Message 10=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 09:41:55 AM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Elevator Gap Seal Test Report
From: "darinh" <gerns25@netscape.net>
John,
As some have said, use the 3M clear product.=C2- I would bet you can find
a car accessory
shop that applies the "clear bra" to cars and they will sell you this
stuff by the foot.=C2- I found several local places that had it in widths
of 6",
12", 24", etc.=C2- I bought the 24" wide stuff and cut it to the length an
d width
I needed for the
intended use.=C2- I also applied it to the top side and wrapped
it around the front of my landing gear for protection and to the front of th
e
struts for about the first 4' from the fuse.
The product is very tough, UV resistant and crystal clear...the adhesive wor
ks
perfectly on painted surfaces and can be applied using a shot or two of Wind
ex
and a small squeegee to remove any air bubbles
--------
Darin Hawkes
Series 7
914 Turbo
Kaysville, Utah
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228179#228179
________________________________=C2- Message 11=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 10:54:57 AM PST US
From:
"George Wells" <georgewells@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver
Didn't you guys see my post from 1 or 2 days ago where I talked about my
use of Ski Saver Tape and where to get it ??
George
________________________________=C2- Message 12=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 03:58:02 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Kitfox owner location map
From: "Paul A. Franz, P.E." <paul@eucleides.com>
Here's a great resource
http://www.frappr.com/kitfox
It's a dynamic push pin map with information about each Kitfox. It covers th
e whole
world. This has Kitfoxen not just from the mail list but everyone.
Put your push pin on the map!
If everyone did, you'd be able to find others in your
area easily.
--------
Paul A. Franz, P.E.
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
425.440.9505 Office
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228237#228237
________________________________=C2- Message 13=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 04:45:12 PM PST US
From: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal=C2
- Test
Report
Dick=2C Great picture of the tail of your plane. But=2C I'll be damned i
f I
can see any gap seal. I Like your TR3 also.
do not archivePat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C
IL
From: Catz631@aol.comDate: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 09:57:11 -0500Subject: Re: Ki
t
fox-List: Elevator Gap Seal Test ReportElevator Gap Seal Test ReportT
o: kit
fox-list@matronics.com
Noel=2C
If you are gap sealing your rudder=2CJohn McBean has a very nice contoured
hard foam for that purpose. I bought some of it and glued it to the horizo
ntal stab then covered it with 6 inch polyfiber tape. I painted it and it l
ooks nice .
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2-
=C2- =C2- Dick Maddux
=C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2
- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2- =C2-
=C2- =C2-
Pensacola=2CFl
Stay up to date on the latest news - from sports scores to stocks and so mu
ch more.
________________________________=C2- Message 14=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 05:09:11 PM PST US
From: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
Lynn=2C Didn't you say you have elavator at full down and then apply tape.
This wouldn't require any pushing tape into groove. Or would having some ta
pe pushed into groove insure the tape would curl into the groove when eleva
tor was raised?Pat ReillyMod 3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From: lynnmatt@j
p
s.net> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver> Date: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 08
:
58:20 -0500> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > --> Kitfox-List message poste
d by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>> > I think the amount of "curl down"
can be controlled by the amount > that you press down between the tubes th
emselves..
..simply press more > into the gap before pressing onto the tubes
and it should stay there. > I usually just lay it over the gap equally spa
ced on both sides and > press it down. I didn't get too worried about wheth
er it went up or > down=2C although down would be preferred.> > Lynn Matte
s
on> Kitfox IV Speedster=2C taildragger> Jabiru 2200=2C #2062=2C 605 hr
s> Se
nsenich 62x46> Electroair direct-fire ignition system> New skis done and fl
ying> > > > > On Feb 1=2C 2009=2C at 9:08 PM=2C patrick reilly wrote:>
> >
Larry=2C Thanks for the web link. I ordered 5 feed just to have on > > han
d
. That price for 14" wide clear tape is unreal. There are many > > times I
wanted some of that tape to protect paint on a car=2C > > motorcycle tank
=2C etc. I'll use it on the gap seal=2C Alla Lynn > > Matteson top side
onl
y. Lynn=2C if that curls down into the gap=2C > > rather than up=2C I
don't
know why anybody would use any other method.> > do not archive> >> > Pat R
eilly> > Mod 3 582 Rebuild> > Rockford=2C IL> >> >> >> >> > > From: asq@ro
a
drunner.com> > > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com> > > Subject: Kitfox-List: F
w: ski saver> > > Date: Sun=2C 1 Feb 2009 20:38:03 -0500> > >> > > --> Kit
f
ox-List message posted
by: "Larry Huntley" > > <asq@roadrunner.com>> > >> >
> Just received this. Does it sound like the same material? Larry> > >> >
> ----- Original Message -----> > > From: <info@tognar.com>> > > To: "Larry
Huntley" <
asq@roadrunner.com>> > > Sent: Sunday=2C February 01=2C 2009 7:5
4 PM> > > Subject: Re: ski saver> > >> > >> > > >> > > > Yes=2C> > > > che
c
k this link on our bags/racks page> > > > http://www.tognar.com/ > > bags_r
acks_boot_ski_binding_snowboard_accessory.html> > > > The top
item is the s
cuff saver tape=2C> > > > Thanks=2C> > > > Cat> > > > www.tognar.com>; >
> >
> > > >> > > >> Do you still have "ski saver" tape? Larry Huntley > > asq@r
oadrunner.com> > > > Ye> > > >> > >> > >> > > > > -------------------------
--------------------------------------------- > > ----------> > >> > >> > >
> > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com> > > 6:02 PM======
===============> > >=======
==========> > >> > >> > >> >> > ======
=== _- > > ==================
================ _- > > contribution_- > >
========================> _
==> > >
________________________________=C2- Message
15=C2- ____________________________________
Time: 05:27:16 PM PST US
From: Malcolm Brubaker <brubakermal@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox=C2- broken motor mount
the mount broke Ware it attaches to the vibration dampener on the rear pass
enger side on my mod 2 w/582- 170 hrs airframe has this happened to anybo
dy? i plan on having it gas welded by a local pilot/ welder - - malcolm
--- On Mon, 2/2/09, George Wells <geor
gewells@roadrunner.com> wrote:
From: George Wells <georgewells@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver
Didn't you guys see my post from 1 or 2 days ago
where I talked about my
use of Ski Saver Tape-and where to get it
??
George
=0A=0A=0A=C2- =C2- =C2-
________________________________=C2- Message 16=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 05:44:07 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Posting videos
From: "Paul Franz - Merlin GT" <paul@eucleides.com>
Maintaining video quality when posting is somewhat of a problem with YouTube
. I
discovered this site which has few if any ads and the video quality is excel
lent.
<http://www.vimeo.com/2986295>
The format is very nice with thumbnail images and a nice indexing scheme.
--
Paul A. Franz
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
________________________________=C2-
Message 17=C2- ____________________________________
Time: 06:39:27 PM PST US
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox=C2- broken motor mount
Just a thought... I think after welding the joint has to be normalized to
prevent it from cracking in the joint again.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Malcolm
Brubaker
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 9:28 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox broken motor mount
the mount broke Ware it attaches to the vibration
dampener on the rear
passenger side on my mod 2 w/582=C2- 170
hrs airframe has this happened to
anybody? i plan on having it gas welded by a local pilot/ welder=C2- =C2
- malcolm
--- On Mon, 2/2/09, George Wells <georgewells@roadrunner.com> wrote:
From: George Wells <georgewells@roadrunner.com>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: ski saver
Didn't you guys see my post from 1 or 2 days ago where I talked about my use
of Ski Saver Tape and where to get it ??
George
D=======================
========
D=======================
========
D=======================
========
D=======================
========
________________________________=C2- Message 18=C2-
____________________________________
Time: 06:55:33 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Flaperon hinge brackets
From: "clemwehner" <clemwehner@sbcglobal.net>
My flaperon hinge brackets were made and the holes drilled in the ribs befor
e the
wing was covered. Now that the wing is covered the hinge brackets won't fit
flat onto the wing without putting considerable stress on the rivets at the
rear
of the bracket.=C2- This is because the wing trailing edge is now thicker
because
of the fabric, tapes, and paint. See the attached photo.
Any suggestions on what to do.=C2- I can push hard and press the bracket d
own on to
the wing surface, but it puts a lot of bending stress on the bracket.=C2-
Any ideas?
thanks for the help,
--------
Clem Wehner
Tulsa, OK
Kitfox IV-912
Read this
topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=228263#228263
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/img_4120_191.jpg
________________________________=C2- Message 19=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 07:02:23 PM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fw: ski saver
I put my tape on at=C2- full down, yes, and like you observed, just=C2-
having a little "down into" radius will assure that it stays there=C2-
when the 'vator is raised. I may try to apply some from the bottom=C2-
side with the 'vator held up, and see how that works...along with the=C2-
top
being covered.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
do not archive
On Feb 2, 2009, at 8:06 PM, patrick reilly wrote:
> Lynn, Didn't you say you have elavator at full down and then apply=C2-
> tape. This wouldn't require any pushing tape into groove. Or would=C2-
> having some tape pushed into groove insure the tape would curl into=C2-
> the groove when elevator was raised?
>
> Pat Reilly
> Mod 3 582 Rebuild
> Rockford, IL
>
>
________________________________=C2- Message 20=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 07:20:15 PM PST US
From: patrick reilly <patreilly43@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List:
Fw: ski saver
Lynn=2C I was also wondering how covering both sides with your method20of
fu
ll elevator up and down would work. I'm not to that stage yet. As a matter
of fact I received today the RAC servo from ACS to use with Lowell Fitts tr
im tab kit. So=2C I will be tearing my elevator apart.=C2- Have you got
a trim
tab on the elevator? Or=2C do you use the Flaperons to trim?Pat ReillyMod
3 582 RebuildRockford=2C IL> From: lynnmatt@jps.net> Subject: Re: Kitfox-L
i
st: Fw: ski saver> Date: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 22:01:43 -0500> To: kitfox-list
@
@jps.net>> > I put my tape on at full down=2C yes=2C and like you observ
ed
=2C just > having a little "down into" radius will assure that it stays th
e
re > when the 'vator is raised. I may try to apply some from the bottom > s
ide with the 'vator held up=2C and see how that
works...along with the > to
p being covered.> > Lynn Matteson> Kitfox IV Speedster=2C taildragger> Jab
i
ru 2200=2C #2062=2C 605 hrs> Sensenich 62x46> Electroair direct-fire ign
iti
on system> New skis done and flying> do not archive> > > > On Feb 2=2C 200
9
=2C at 8:06 PM=2C patrick reilly wrote:> > > Lynn=2C Didn't you say yo
u hav
e elavator at full down and then apply > > tape. This wouldn't require any
pushing tape into groove. Or would > > having some tape pushed into groove
insure the tape would curl into > > the groove when elevator was raised?> >
==========> > >
________________________________=C2- Message 21=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 07:33:19 PM PST US
From: Lynn Matteson
<lynnmatt@jps.net>
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List:
Fw: ski saver
Factory-built trim tab with RAC servo. Using the flaperons for trim=C2-
slows the plane down, which is why one of the Speedster mods was the=C2-
electric trim.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 605 hrs
Sensenich 62x46
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
New skis done and flying
do not archive
On Feb 2, 2009, at 10:19 PM, patrick reilly wrote:
> Lynn, I was also wondering how covering both sides with your method=C2-
> of full elevator up and down would work. I'm not to that stage yet.=C2-
> As a matter of fact I received today the RAC servo from ACS to use=C2-
> with Lowell Fitts trim tab kit. So, I will be tearing my elevator=C2-
> apart.=C2- Have you got a trim tab on the elevator? Or, do you use the
=C2-
> Flaperons to trim?
>
> Pat Reilly
> Mod 3 582 Rebuild
>
Rockford, IL
>
>
________________________________=C2- Message 22=C2- ____________________
________________
Time: 07:46:51 PM PST US
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Flaperon hinge brackets
From: "Tom Jones" <nahsikhs@elltel.net>
> My flaperon hinge brackets were made and the holes drilled in the ribs bef
ore
the wing was covered. Now that the wing is covered the hinge brackets won't
fit
flat onto the wing without putting considerable stress on the rivets at the
rear of the bracket. This is because the wing trailing edge is now thicker b
ecause
of the fabric, tapes, and paint. See the attached photo.
>
> Any suggestions on what to do. I can push hard and press the bracket down
on
to the wing surface, but it puts a lot of bending stress on the bracket. Any
ideas?
Clem, The builder's
manual says to fit and drill first then cover as you have done.
Mine were a tight fit too.
I set the flaperon in place then installed and tightened the hinge bolts to
take
the stress off the rear rivet before I squeezed the brackets tight to the ri
b
with one hand and riveted with the other hand.
The rear bracket rivets have held fine.=C2- I have had the flaperons off a
couple
times and the bracket bolt holes in the brackets line up perfect when I rein
stall
the flaperons.=C2- Also the bracket to rib rivets are holding tight.
I rib laced and put no rib lacing reinforcement tape or rib finish tape unde
r the
brackets.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
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igator?Kitfox-List
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