Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:31 AM - Anyone know anything about the Raven (kitfox clone)? (mcjon77)
2. 02:47 AM - Venturi location - no suction (skyring)
3. 03:48 AM - Re: Venturi location - no suction (Cudnohufsky's)
4. 05:09 AM - Re: Brake Lines (Boilermaker2000)
5. 08:04 AM - Re: Lift Reserve - installation? (Marco Menezes)
6. 08:17 AM - Re: Venturi location - no suction (skyring)
7. 08:51 AM - Re: Venturi location - no suction (Jim Corner)
8. 09:35 AM - Re: Venturi location - no suction (skyring)
9. 09:45 AM - Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use (JetPilot)
10. 10:22 AM - Re: Re: Lift Reserve - installation? (Lowell Fitt)
11. 10:51 AM - Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use (Lowell Fitt)
12. 10:51 AM - Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use (Noel Loveys)
13. 10:56 AM - Re: Re: Lift Reserve - installation? (Lowell Fitt)
14. 11:09 AM - Re: Charging system trouble shooting (WurlyBird)
15. 11:23 AM - Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use (Larry Huntley)
16. 11:25 AM - Re: Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH 701 (Lowell Fitt)
17. 11:33 AM - Emailing: Vagabond red fuselage 018 (Larry Huntley)
18. 11:44 AM - Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use (Noel Loveys)
19. 11:51 AM - Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH 701 (motoadve)
20. 12:08 PM - Re: Re: Lift Reserve - installation? (Summers, Mark)
21. 12:24 PM - Re: Re: Charging system trouble shooting (Noel Loveys)
22. 12:33 PM - Re: Re: Charging system trouble shooting (Paul Franz - Merlin GT)
23. 01:05 PM - Re: Charging system trouble shooting (WurlyBird)
24. 01:35 PM - Re: Re: Charging system trouble shooting (Dave G)
25. 01:43 PM - Re: Re: Charging system trouble shooting (Dave G)
26. 03:03 PM - Re: Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH 701 (Noel Loveys)
27. 03:17 PM - Re: Re: Charging system trouble shooting (Noel Loveys)
28. 03:21 PM - Re: Re: Charging system trouble shooting (Noel Loveys)
29. 03:26 PM - Seal (Leigh Smith)
30. 03:57 PM - Re: Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH 701 (Clint Bazzill)
31. 05:05 PM - Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use (Lowell Fitt)
32. 06:40 PM - Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH 701 (dave)
33. 06:42 PM - Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH 701 (dave)
34. 06:53 PM - Re: Re: Venturi location - no suction (Jim Corner)
35. 07:08 PM - Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use (Noel Loveys)
36. 07:45 PM - Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use (JetPilot)
37. 09:39 PM - Re: Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH 701 (Guy Buchanan)
38. 09:53 PM - Re: Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH 701 (Clint Bazzill)
39. 10:17 PM - VG generators (Clint Bazzill)
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| Subject: | Anyone know anything about the Raven (kitfox clone)? |
Hi guys,
While searching through barnstormers I came across a plans built clone of the kitfox
called the Raven. Does anyone have any info on this design? I have found
virtually nothing about it online, other than a youtube video and a few mentions
on this board. Any info would be appreciated.
Also, do you guys know of any other plans built "kitfox clone" designs out there?
Thanks.
--------
Jon McDonald
Building Sonex #1287
Thinking ahead about a Zenith CH 701 :D
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241285#241285
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| Subject: | Venturi location - no suction |
We have exactly no suction from the 4 inch Venturi mounted under the fuselage of
our S5. You can see the location in the attached photo - just behind the Grove
gear and the top lip of the venturi about in line with the bottom of the gear
horizontal part.
Obviously a dead area. As it's difficult to mount such a big venturi on the side
of a kitfox cowling, where it would probably work ok, we're wondering what others
have done? Drop it further into the airstream in the same location?
kerry
Kitfox S5 912S and loving every minute of it.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241288#241288
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_113.jpg
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| Subject: | Venturi location - no suction |
Kerry,
I have seen one mounted on a 4 just under the door on the fuselage.
Lloyd Cudnohufsky
Model 5 912ul
IVO IFA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of skyring
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 4:47 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Venturi location - no suction
We have exactly no suction from the 4 inch Venturi mounted under the
fuselage of our S5. You can see the location in the attached photo - just
behind the Grove gear and the top lip of the venturi about in line with the
bottom of the gear horizontal part.
Obviously a dead area. As it's difficult to mount such a big venturi on the
side of a kitfox cowling, where it would probably work ok, we're wondering
what others have done? Drop it further into the airstream in the same
location?
kerry
Kitfox S5 912S and loving every minute of it.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241288#241288
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/kitfox_113.jpg
Checked by AVG.
8:29 AM
Checked by AVG.
8:29 AM
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dave wrote:
> Ken,
> You will need new fittings like these
> http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/hapages/polyflofittings.php
Are the old ones reusable, or does the sleeve get crimped on somehow?
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241294#241294
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| Subject: | RE: Lift Reserve - installation? |
Can someone who has installed Kelly Meiste's unit on a Fox please post some
pictures of the installation?
-
Marco Menezes N99KX
Model 2 582-90 C-Box 3:1 w/clutch
GSC
--- On Sat, 4/25/09, R.D.(Ron) Leclerc <infow@mts.net> wrote:
From: R.D.(Ron) Leclerc <infow@mts.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Lift Reserve
Ok here is a summary of all of the info available on Lift Reserve
indicators on the net.- Its all there for you to sort out!!
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID 07040300014143&catname=air&
qty
1&item=21-1623
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/liftreserve-gaugefaces.pdf
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage6.jpg
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage2.jpg
http://glasairproject.com/GlasairI/docs/AirsoobLRI.pdf
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/liftreserve.htm
http://lri.kit.googlepages.com/
http://www.liftreserve.com/
The probes could be had from John Bolding- jnbolding1@teleshare.net--
-and
Scott at http://www.cooknwithgas.com/LRI.html
I purchased mine from John Bolding for $30!
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage5.jpg
http://www.pipcom.com/~cowcam/AOAr.htm
There is a lot of info to go through... the most expensive one you can buy
is a heated unit at- http://www.liftreserve.com/- if you decide to buy
one!
R.D.(Ron) Leclerc
CH701 Plans(Scrap)- Builder #7-6699
Porsche Power- Geared- Redrive
Winnipeg,- MB Canada
infow@mts.net
4/25/2009 11:14:29 AM
***************************************
This E-Mail scanned with AVG Anti-Virus Ver: 7.5!
***************************************
:-(
:-(
:-( Randy,
:-(
:-( Below is the reply from Kelly, along with a shout-out to you.
:-(
:-( His kit is at http://lri.kit.googlepages.com and looks really
:-( good, at the same price you paid for it. I'll be getting one!
:-(
:-( Thanks again for the reference Randy,
:-(
:-( Bob Brennan - N717GB
:-( ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
:-( 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox taildragger
:-( Rotax 582 with 3 blade GSC prop
:-( Wrightsville Pa
:-(
:-(
:-( ------------------------------------------------------------------
:-( ---------- ---- From: Kelly Meiste
:-( [mailto:kellymeiste@jcwifi.com] Sent: 24 April 2009 4:41 pm To:
:-( matronics@bob.brennan.name Subject: Re: Lift Reserve
:-(
:-(
:-( Hi Bob,
:-(
:-( Thank you for the info, glad Randy is enjoying his kit!
:-(
:-( Here's the link to my website, not much has changed.
:-( lri.kit.googlepages.com
:-(
:-( Price is still the same, but I've added a few more options (black
:-( gauge overlay, and a longer tube option).
:-(
:-( Thanks for the interest, let me know if I can answer any more
:-( questions for you.
:-(
:-( Best regards,
:-( Kelly
:-(
:-( PS. Feel free to post anything about my kit (good OR bad).
:-(
:-(
:-( ----- Original Message -----
:-( From: Bob Brennan
:-( To: kellymeiste@jcwifi.com
:-( Sent: Friday, April 24, 2009 12:30 PM
:-( Subject: Lift Reserve
:-(
:-(
:-( Kelly,
:-(
:-( There is a- discussion going on right now about Lift Reserve on
:-( the Matronics Kitfox list, started by Randy Daughenbaugh who has
:-( raved about how good it is. I went to http://www.liftreserve.com/
:-( right away and would have ordered it on the spot just from
:-( Randy's recommendation but was stunned by the $450 +$35 S&H
:-( price. He said he had "paid $175 for it but that was a few years
:-( ago" and that I should get in touch with you directly. At a
:-( better price I would order one right away and if I were to post
:-( it on the mailing list, with your permission of course, I think
:-( you would get several orders today alone.
:-(
:-( Thanks in advance,
:-( Bob Brennan
:-(
:-(
:-( List Features Navigator to browse
:-( =- - - - - - ---- MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
:-( your generous support!
:-( -> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
le, List Admin.
=0A=0A=0A
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Venturi location - no suction |
Thanks Lloyd. Would that be under the pilot's side door? Just trying to figure
out where the best blast from the prop would be. Kerry.
ps to everyone. sorry about the size of that photo.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241314#241314
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| Subject: | Re: Venturi location - no suction |
Mounted mine here, no problems and it works great
Jim
>
>
Jim Corner
Model 2, 582,. Ivo med !FA, 1100 hrs
Model 5 0-235 45hrs
Calgary, AB
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| Subject: | Re: Venturi location - no suction |
Jim that's a great help. Thanks. But I'm presuming you have to disconnect the hose
every time you take the bottom cowl off?
Now I'm really curious and see cuffs on your lift struts and what looks like a
in-flight adjustable trim on the rudder..
Curious about your cruise speed and also - what's the tailwheel?
kerry
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241320#241320
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| Subject: | Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What to use |
Can anyone tell me the best product to use for corrosion prevention in a Kitfox.
I am in Miaim very near salt water and need to pay special attention to this.
So far, the information I have gotten is to Alumiprep to clean and then use
Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy on the Aluminum wing spars where the fabric will be
covering them. Some have also said to slosh the inside of the wing spars with
Epoxy, would the same 2 part Poly Fiber epoxy primer be the best for this also
?
What about the 4130 tubing, what is the best method to clean, and then the best
primer to use on this ? Would the same Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy primer I use
on the Aluminum be good for general corrosion protection of 4130 steel parts ?
Any information or suggestions will be appreciated.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241321#241321
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Lift Reserve - installation? |
Marco,
I am building, so the attached photo may be of little help to you, but I
might offer a couple of suggestions. If you have a spare wing rib from the
original kit, you may be able to fabricate a mount using that that you could
insert through an inspection ring. Or you may be able to fabricate a mount
that will clamp to the tube between the fore and aft lift struts allowing
the probe to extend forward under the wing. This latter idea might be the
easiest as you may be able to route the tubing down the lift struts rather
than fishing it through the wing.
Lowell Fitt
Cameron Park, CA
Model IV-1200 R-912 UL
Still building
----- Original Message -----
From: "Marco Menezes" <msm_9949@yahoo.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 8:01 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: Lift Reserve - installation?
Can someone who has installed Kelly Meiste's unit on a Fox please post some
pictures of the installation?
Marco Menezes N99KX
Model 2 582-90 C-Box 3:1 w/clutch
GSC
--- On Sat, 4/25/09, R.D.(Ron) Leclerc <infow@mts.net> wrote:
From: R.D.(Ron) Leclerc <infow@mts.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Lift Reserve
Ok here is a summary of all of the info available on Lift Reserve
indicators on the net. Its all there for you to sort out!!
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID 07040300014143&catname=air&qty
1&item=21-1623
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/liftreserve-gaugefaces.pdf
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage6.jpg
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage2.jpg
http://glasairproject.com/GlasairI/docs/AirsoobLRI.pdf
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/liftreserve.htm
http://lri.kit.googlepages.com/
http://www.liftreserve.com/
The probes could be had from John Bolding jnbolding1@teleshare.net and
Scott at http://www.cooknwithgas.com/LRI.html
I purchased mine from John Bolding for $30!
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage5.jpg
http://www.pipcom.com/~cowcam/AOAr.htm
There is a lot of info to go through... the most expensive one you can buy
is a heated unit at http://www.liftreserve.com/ if you decide to buy one!
R.D.(Ron) Leclerc
CH701 Plans(Scrap) Builder #7-6699
Porsche Power Geared Redrive
Winnipeg, MB Canada
infow@mts.net
4/25/2009 11:14:29 AM
***************************************
This E-Mail scanned with AVG Anti-Virus Ver: 7.5!
***************************************
:-(
:-(
:-( Randy,
:-(
:-( Below is the reply from Kelly, along with a shout-out to you.
:-(
:-( His kit is at http://lri.kit.googlepages.com and looks really
:-( good, at the same price you paid for it. I'll be getting one!
:-(
:-( Thanks again for the reference Randy,
:-(
:-( Bob Brennan - N717GB
:-( ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
:-( 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox taildragger
:-( Rotax 582 with 3 blade GSC prop
:-( Wrightsville Pa
:-(
:-(
:-( ------------------------------------------------------------------
:-( ---------- ---- From: Kelly Meiste
:-( [mailto:kellymeiste@jcwifi.com] Sent: 24 April 2009 4:41 pm To:
:-( matronics@bob.brennan.name Subject: Re: Lift Reserve
:-(
:-(
:-( Hi Bob,
:-(
:-( Thank you for the info, glad Randy is enjoying his kit!
:-(
:-( Here's the link to my website, not much has changed.
:-( lri.kit.googlepages.com
:-(
:-( Price is still the same, but I've added a few more options (black
:-( gauge overlay, and a longer tube option).
:-(
:-( Thanks for the interest, let me know if I can answer any more
:-( questions for you.
:-(
:-( Best regards,
:-( Kelly
:-(
:-( PS. Feel free to post anything about my kit (good OR bad).
:-(
:-(
:-( ----- Original Message -----
:-( From: Bob Brennan
:-( To: kellymeiste@jcwifi.com
:-( Sent: Friday, April 24, 2009 12:30 PM
:-( Subject: Lift Reserve
:-(
:-(
:-( Kelly,
:-(
:-( There is a discussion going on right now about Lift Reserve on
:-( the Matronics Kitfox list, started by Randy Daughenbaugh who has
:-( raved about how good it is. I went to http://www.liftreserve.com/
:-( right away and would have ordered it on the spot just from
:-( Randy's recommendation but was stunned by the $450 +$35 S&H
:-( price. He said he had "paid $175 for it but that was a few years
:-( ago" and that I should get in touch with you directly. At a
:-( better price I would order one right away and if I were to post
:-( it on the mailing list, with your permission of course, I think
:-( you would get several orders today alone.
:-(
:-( Thanks in advance,
:-( Bob Brennan
:-(
:-(
:-( List Features Navigator to browse
:-( = - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
:-( your generous support!
:-( -> http://www.matronics.com/contribution
le, List Admin.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What |
to use
Mike,
I think in addition to the Alumiprep which is basically a cleaner and
etchant, I would follow that with Alodyne which as a conversion coating with
corrosion resistance and it enhances paint adhesion. Alodyne is used alone
in the interiors of aluminum aircraft as a corrosion coating.
You will need an epoxy coating where the adhesives will contact any
structural member. In the old days, it was a zinc chromate epoxy primer.
This was reformulated, because of the suspicion by the EPA that we were
actually drinking this stuff, and now the zink chromate is available in
aerosol spray cans - which tells us right away that it is not an epoxy
coating - and the "green" epoxy primers claiming corrosion resistant
properties without telling us what they contain, except maybe on the can.
I think if I were buying today, I would go with the Polyfiber product to
keep everything consistant. It comes in green or white. Randolph also has
a green or white primer as well.
A real good alternative down there would be to go to your local automotive
paint store and see what they recommend. They are very familiar with your
environment and what it takes to keep things from turning orange.
Lowell Fitt
Cameron Park, CA
Model IV-1200 R-912 UL
Still building and modifying
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:44 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What
to use
>
> Can anyone tell me the best product to use for corrosion prevention in a
> Kitfox. I am in Miaim very near salt water and need to pay special
> attention to this. So far, the information I have gotten is to Alumiprep
> to clean and then use Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy on the Aluminum wing spars
> where the fabric will be covering them. Some have also said to slosh the
> inside of the wing spars with Epoxy, would the same 2 part Poly Fiber
> epoxy primer be the best for this also ?
>
> What about the 4130 tubing, what is the best method to clean, and then the
> best primer to use on this ? Would the same Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy
> primer I use on the Aluminum be good for general corrosion protection of
> 4130 steel parts ?
>
> Any information or suggestions will be appreciated.
>
> Mike
>
> --------
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
> could have !!!
>
> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241321#241321
>
>
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What |
to use
Two part epoxy zinc chromate should be used. You are almost as close to
salt water as I am, so yes slosh the inside of the spars too and hang them
vertically to drip dry. Well at least close to vertically... At least let
the excess drain out.
If you already have your frame then it's too late to get it powder coated
unless someone in the area does it. I would at least give it a good coat
of two part Zinc-Chromate primer. Painting would be optional depending on
how strict you want to be on weight. In this game less is much better.
One thing I would do which is often forgotten is to inhibit the interior of
the frame. This is done by drilling a small hole in the frame inside where
it won't be in the way of covering or glass installation. Using a big
syringe put about a can of double boiled linseed oil in the frame through
the hole. Put a screw in the hole to seal it and then the fun part. You
will want to rotate the frame and hang in every conceivable attitude for a
few hours each attitude before moving it to the next attitude. This can
take several days. Then turn your filling hole to the lowest point and
drain out the linseed oil. Once you figure you have all the linseed oil out
(it will stop dripping) you can get the last couple of CCs with the syringe.
Then re install the sealing screw preferably with a bit of epoxy on it to
give it a good seal.. The top corner of the cabin seems to be a good spot
or the back of the vertical stab near the bottom to drill the hole.
One hole around 1/16 in should suffice nothing over 1/8 in.. The linseed
oil acts like a penetrant inside the frame and covers everything then it
semi hardens to a gummy sticky coating that protects from internal moisture.
You can also do the same thing with the rudder and elevators.
If you get any quantity of linseed oil on a rag or paper make sure to
dispose of it in a fire proof container immediately. The stuff likes to
spontaneously combust producing a thick, cut it with a knife, white smoke.
Don't ask how I know. Remember the more you put in the frame the longer it
will take to drain out. Use no more than a couple of cups of oil you will
be surprised at how much you get back.
Inhibiting a frame almost requires the frame be in a hangar or warehouse for
that part of the build. If you decide to powder coat it's better to inhibit
first. Check with john and see if his frames are inhibited at the factory.
It's a one shot deal done once and never again.
The idea of the two part zinc chromate is when you go to cover, the
chemicals in the attach glue and the poly brush will dissolve a regular
spirit chromate and the attach glue may not adhere the cloth to the frame
the way you would want .
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of JetPilot
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 2:14 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What
to use
Can anyone tell me the best product to use for corrosion prevention in a
Kitfox. I am in Miaim very near salt water and need to pay special
attention to this. So far, the information I have gotten is to Alumiprep to
clean and then use Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy on the Aluminum wing spars where
the fabric will be covering them. Some have also said to slosh the inside
of the wing spars with Epoxy, would the same 2 part Poly Fiber epoxy primer
be the best for this also ?
What about the 4130 tubing, what is the best method to clean, and then the
best primer to use on this ? Would the same Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy primer
I use on the Aluminum be good for general corrosion protection of 4130 steel
parts ?
Any information or suggestions will be appreciated.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
could have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241321#241321
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Lift Reserve - installation? |
One more thought after looking at the photo again, the six rivet like
projections surrounding the cutout are nutserts.
Lowell
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 10:20 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: RE: Lift Reserve - installation?
> Marco,
>
> I am building, so the attached photo may be of little help to you, but I
> might offer a couple of suggestions. If you have a spare wing rib from
> the
> original kit, you may be able to fabricate a mount using that that you
> could
> insert through an inspection ring. Or you may be able to fabricate a
> mount
> that will clamp to the tube between the fore and aft lift struts allowing
> the probe to extend forward under the wing. This latter idea might be the
> easiest as you may be able to route the tubing down the lift struts rather
> than fishing it through the wing.
>
> Lowell Fitt
> Cameron Park, CA
> Model IV-1200 R-912 UL
> Still building
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Marco Menezes" <msm_9949@yahoo.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 8:01 AM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: Lift Reserve - installation?
>
>
> Can someone who has installed Kelly Meiste's unit on a Fox please post
> some
> pictures of the installation?
>
> Marco Menezes N99KX
> Model 2 582-90 C-Box 3:1 w/clutch
> GSC
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Charging system trouble shooting |
Occom, great reply, thanks.
Dave, I have not done a voltage check yet, today was the first day I have had time
to pull it out of the garage. I can tall you that I am getting 12.5ish volts
off the battery while not running, according to the volt meter on the panel,
and it never goes up when the engine is running. When I check AC between the
two yellow wires I have to disconnect one right? Will there be any chance
of arcing?
Here is what I have found new, I think it is pretty pertinent but it confuses me
since, as always I don't have the appropriate wiring diagrams. Here is a run
down of all tabs on the back of my ignition which is as far as I can trace continuity
from the RED wire off the Key West.
going clockwise and starting arbitrarily;
MAG-this is where the RED Key West wire terminates and I can verify continuity
the whole way.
ACC-there is a thin red wire coming off of this that I did not trace, logic says
it operates a relay for all the accessories.
GND-nothing attached, closed circuit with both MAG tabs when in the OFF position.
BAT-large RED wire going off to the Master switch on the panel. The other end
of the Master Switch is connected directly to the battery.
MAG-nothing wired here. This tab has continuity with the other MAG tab in the
OFF position.
SOL-big white wire going off presumably to the starter.
The only thing that ever happens to the RED wire from the Key West is that it is
closed with a GND and another MAG that are both not wired to anything. I checked
at all ignition settings including START (the battery is out). It seems
that this would be used to ground out Mags to shut off the engine but it is not
wired properly and this would not work using a voltage regulator if I understand
it correctly. I can not figure why this wire would terminate at the ignition.
Shouldn't this wire go directly to the battery? Should there be any sort
of interrupt so the regulator is not trying to develop a charge during the
start? I am pretty sure that this is the cause of my problems and even if it
isn't it is the next step to remedying the charging issue.
So, with this information, what are your thoughts?
By the way, I am reading .5 Ohms across the two yellow wires.
--------
James
Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
Just about ready to take my check ride.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241329#241329
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What |
to use
Mike,
Any thoughts of using a two part Urethane paint over the primer? Primers
are just that, and should be covered with something that is not porous. It
is often thought that because a primer is an epoxy ,it is therefore a good
seal. Those who know much more than I tell me this is not true.
Stewart Systems makes a good one part primer/sealer which they say will
seal well under normal conditions,but even they say to put their 2 pt
urethane over it if it is ,for example, a seaplane.I did that with a
Vagabond that I am restoring even though I expect it to be hangared most of
the time. Will try to send a pc of that in another post. Larry
Huntley,4-1200 Soob
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 12:44 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What
to use
>
> Can anyone tell me the best product to use for corrosion prevention in a
> Kitfox. I am in Miaim very near salt water and need to pay special
> attention to this. So far, the information I have gotten is to Alumiprep
> to clean and then use Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy on the Aluminum wing spars
> where the fabric will be covering them. Some have also said to slosh the
> inside of the wing spars with Epoxy, would the same 2 part Poly Fiber
> epoxy primer be the best for this also ?
>
> What about the 4130 tubing, what is the best method to clean, and then the
> best primer to use on this ? Would the same Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy
> primer I use on the Aluminum be good for general corrosion protection of
> 4130 steel parts ?
>
> Any information or suggestions will be appreciated.
>
> Mike
>
> --------
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
> could have !!!
>
> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241321#241321
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
09:44:00
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or |
a CH 701
Mike,
FYI, and this has been mentioned many times on the list, often by very
careful observers - vortex generators do very little to stall speed
reduction with the Kitfox wing - in most instances not measureable. Control
stability is almost universally reported, but no effect on stall speed.
All this despite what we all know about vortex generators.
I have heard some talk on this and it just might be that the Riblet airfoil
Kitfox uses is not a true airfoil as the design profile only exists at the
fuel tank, rib caps, the false ribs and maybe three inches at the wing tip.
A total of about four feet on each wing. The rest is a different profile
because of the depression due to the fabric shrinking between the ribs and
false ribs. Harry Riblet tells us that the most critical point on this
airfoil is the first five inches. This is exactly where the leading edge
cuff and spar give away to the collapsed fabric. There are several
airplanes currently being built with "D" profile leading edges that will
protect the leading edge shape and these might benefit from vortex
generators. But the proof will be in the testing rather than the hoping.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 25, 2009 6:55 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or
a CH 701
>
>
> motoadve wrote:
>> Thanks a lot for the replies.
>>
>> Wouldnt the CH 701 be safer at a stall speed of 30mph instead of 37of the
>> kitfox 4 or 41 in the Super sport?
>>
>> According to this numbers the Kitfox will stop flying before the CH 701
>> in case of an emergency.
>>
>>
>
>
> You can put VG's ( Vortex Generators ) on the Kitfox, and the stall
> numbers will be very close to the CH-701 if not the same... When you are
> only talking 2 or 3 MPH, there is no safety difference anymore due to
> speed, other things become much more important.
>
> The Superior glide ratio of the Kitfox is a HUGE safety factor. Lets say
> you where at an altitude where you could glide a mile in a Zenair CH-701
> and your engine quit, that would give you an area of 3.14
> Square miles that you could land in. Now lets say you were in a Kitfox
> that has twice the glide ratio and your engine quit, you would have an
> area of 12.5 square miles in which to find a landing area. In other
> words, if you double the glide of an airplane, you have FOUR TIMES the
> amount of area to search potential landing spots. I am not saying the
> Kitfox does have exactly twice the glide, but it is a LOT better than the
> CH-701, and every time you double the glide ratio, landing areas increase
> by a factor of FOUR !!
>
> The Kitfox will also give you more time in an engine out situation due to
> its much lower sink rate. Again, would you rather have 1 minute to chose
> a spot, and execute an emergency landing, or 2 minutes, the Kitfox has a
> HUGE safety advantage over the Zenith CH-701 in an engine out situation.
>
> So that is the engine out performance comparison in a nutshell, Dave, did
> you read my post about the performance comparison of the Kitfox and the
> Zenair CH-701 that is located here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=57516
>
> Mike
>
> --------
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
> could have !!!
>
> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241208#241208
>
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Emailing: Vagabond red fuselage 018 |
This has Stewart's primer/sealer covered with 2 coats of Stewarts
EcoPoly Firethorne Red. Sealed up real nice. Larry
The message is ready to be sent with the following file or link
attachments:
Vagabond red fuselage 018
Message 18
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| Subject: | Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What |
to use
Old days??? Gee I didn't think I was that old. :-)
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 3:20 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum.
What to use
Mike,
I think in addition to the Alumiprep which is basically a cleaner and
etchant, I would follow that with Alodyne which as a conversion coating with
corrosion resistance and it enhances paint adhesion. Alodyne is used alone
in the interiors of aluminum aircraft as a corrosion coating.
You will need an epoxy coating where the adhesives will contact any
structural member. In the old days, it was a zinc chromate epoxy primer.
This was reformulated, because of the suspicion by the EPA that we were
actually drinking this stuff, and now the zink chromate is available in
aerosol spray cans - which tells us right away that it is not an epoxy
coating - and the "green" epoxy primers claiming corrosion resistant
properties without telling us what they contain, except maybe on the can.
I think if I were buying today, I would go with the Polyfiber product to
keep everything consistant. It comes in green or white. Randolph also has
a green or white primer as well.
A real good alternative down there would be to go to your local automotive
paint store and see what they recommend. They are very familiar with your
environment and what it takes to keep things from turning orange.
Lowell Fitt
Cameron Park, CA
Model IV-1200 R-912 UL
Still building and modifying
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:44 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What
to use
>
> Can anyone tell me the best product to use for corrosion prevention in a
> Kitfox. I am in Miaim very near salt water and need to pay special
> attention to this. So far, the information I have gotten is to Alumiprep
> to clean and then use Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy on the Aluminum wing spars
> where the fabric will be covering them. Some have also said to slosh the
> inside of the wing spars with Epoxy, would the same 2 part Poly Fiber
> epoxy primer be the best for this also ?
>
> What about the 4130 tubing, what is the best method to clean, and then the
> best primer to use on this ? Would the same Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy
> primer I use on the Aluminum be good for general corrosion protection of
> 4130 steel parts ?
>
> Any information or suggestions will be appreciated.
>
> Mike
>
> --------
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
> could have !!!
>
> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241321#241321
>
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH |
701
Thanks for the replies.
So vortex generators are made /tested and sold by the Kitfox factory? or is just
an aftermarket product?
Is not totally tested yet?
I wanted the CH 701 becasue is a STOL and I also prefer all aluminum plane, I might
not have a hangar all the time.
What about the Savannah? looks like the CH 701 but has no slats and the performance
claims as STOL are the same.
Is the Highlander full aluminum?
I weight 165 and plan to fly always with friends or wife ect, usually go to the
beach being able to fly low and slow over the shore, pick a place to land take
a swim go up again.
Go following rivers, sightseen ect, just plain flying, not planned cross country
trips because Costa Rica is montaneous windy , rainy and many Cessnas are burried
in the mountains, the area I plan to fly is on the caribeanside which is
totally flat.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241336#241336
Message 20
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|
| Subject: | RE: Lift Reserve - installation? |
There are a couple of these gauges on ebay for around $15.00 ea
________________________________
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Marco
Menezes
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 10:01 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: RE: Lift Reserve - installation?
Can someone who has installed Kelly Meiste's unit on a Fox please post
some pictures of the installation?
Marco Menezes N99KX
Model 2 582-90 C-Box 3:1 w/clutch
GSC
--- On Sat, 4/25/09, R.D.(Ron) Leclerc <infow@mts.net> wrote:
From: R.D.(Ron) Leclerc <infow@mts.net>
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Lift Reserve
To: "Bob Brennan" <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Date: Saturday, April 25, 2009, 12:21 PM
<infow@mts.net
<http://us.mc369.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=infow@mts.net> >
Ok here is a summary of all of the info available on Lift
Reserve
indicators on the net. Its all there for you to sort out!!
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID 07040300014143&catname=ai
r&q
ty
1&item=21-1623
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/liftreserve-gaugefaces.pdf
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage6.jpg
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage2.jpg
http://glasairproject.com/GlasairI/docs/AirsoobLRI.pdf
http://home.hiwaay.net/~sbuc/journal/liftreserve.htm
http://lri.kit.googlepages.com/
http://www.liftreserve.com/
The probes could be had from John Bolding
jnbolding1@teleshare.net
<http://us.mc369.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=jnbolding1@teleshare.net>
and
Scott at http://www.cooknwithgas.com/LRI.html
I purchased mine from John Bolding for $30!
http://www.ronleclerc.com/photos/panel/lri-guage5.jpg
http://www.pipcom.com/~cowcam/AOAr.htm
There is a lot of info to go through... the most expensive one
you can buy
is a heated unit at http://www.liftreserve.com/ if you decide
to buy one!
R.D.(Ron) Leclerc
CH701 Plans(Scrap) Builder #7-6699
Porsche Power Geared Redrive
Winnipeg, MB Canada
infow@mts.net
<http://us.mc369.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=infow@mts.net>
4/25/2009 11:14:29 AM
***************************************
This E-Mail scanned with AVG Anti-Virus Ver: 7.5!
***************************************
:-(
:-(
:-( Randy,
:-(
:-( Below is the reply from Kelly, along with a shout-out to
you.
:-(
:-( His kit is at http://lri.kit.googlepages.com
<http://lri.kit.googlepages.com/> and looks really
:-( good, at the same price you paid for it. I'll be getting
one!
:-(
:-( Thanks again for the reference Randy,
:-(
:-( Bob Brennan - N717GB
:-( ELSA Repairman, inspection rated
:-( 1991 UK Model 2 ELSA Kitfox taildragger
:-( Rotax 582 with 3 blade GSC prop
:-( Wrightsville Pa
:-(
:-(
:-(
------------------------------------------------------------------
:-( ---------- ---- From: Kelly Meiste
:-( [mailto:kellymeiste@jcwifi.com
<http://us.mc369.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=kellymeiste@jcwifi.com>
]
Sent: 24 April 2009 4:41 pm To:
:-( matronics@bob.brennan.name
<http://us.mc369.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=matronics@bob.brennan.nam
e
> Subject: Re: Lift Reserve
:-(
:-(
:-( Hi Bob,
:-(
:-( Thank you for the info, glad Randy is enjoying his kit!
:-(
:-( Here's the link to my website, not much has changed.
:-( lri.kit.googlepages.com
:-(
:-( Price is still the same, but I've added a few more options
(black
:-( gauge overlay, and a longer tube option).
:-(
:-( Thanks for the interest, let me know if I can answer any
more
:-( questions for you.
:-(
:-( Best regards,
:-( Kelly
:-(
:-( PS. Feel free to post anything about my kit (good OR bad).
:-(
:-(
:-( ----- Original Message -----
:-( From: Bob Brennan
:-( To: kellymeiste@jcwifi.com
<http://us.mc369.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=kellymeiste@jcwifi.com>
:-( Sent: Friday, April 24, 2009 12:30 PM
:-( Subject: Lift Reserve
:-(
:-(
:-( Kelly,
:-(
:-( There is a discussion going on right now about Lift Reserve
on
:-( the Matronics Kitfox list, started by Randy Daughenbaugh who
has
:-( raved about how good it is. I went to
http://www.liftreserve.com/
:-( right away and would have ordered it on the spot just from
:-( Randy's recommendation but was stunned by the $450 +$35 S&H
:-( price. He said he had "paid $175 for it but that was a few
years
:-( ago" and that I should get in touch with you directly. At a
:-( better price I would order one right away and if I were to
post
:-( it on the mailing list, with your permission of course, I
think
:-( you would get several orders today alone.
:-(
:-( Thanks in advance,
:-( Bob Brennan
:-(
:-(
:-( List Features Navigator to browse
:-( = - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
:-( your generous support!
:-( -> http://www.matroom/Navigator?Kitfox-List"
target=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigatosp; -
MATRONICS WEB FO href="http://forums.matronics.com/"
target=_blank>http://forums.matronbsp; - List Contribution
Web
Site
-http://www=====================
=
<http://www.matronics.com/contribution>
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Charging system trouble shooting |
I mentioned disconnecting one of the yellow leads so there would be no
chance of the regulator loading the lighting coil and giving you a false low
voltage. If you are worried about arcing simply use a bit of electrical
tape around the connections to the AC voltmeter.
The fact you have continuity between the two yellow wires is good. You can
also check for continuity between either yellow wire and the ground...There
shouldn't be any.
About your ignition switch.. I think you have problems there.
The two MAG tabs are for the two grey wires that come from your magneto.
These are the P-Leads that short out the ignition to stop the engine. They
are also used to do the MAG tests. Grounding either grey lead turns off the
MAG it is connected to.
So when the switch is turned on both tabs should not show any ground. When
the switch is off they both should test as ground with the ohm meter.
Depending on the type of meter you have they should show a small fraction of
an ohm in the off position between the tab and ground.
ACC should power up your panel. B+ (Battery + Terminal ) coming from your
battery to the switch via the big red wire will be switched by the ignition
switch to turn on and off your panel and Hobbs if you have one.
GND is ground. It should be grounded to the frame somewhere to turn off the
MAGs and stop the engine.
BAT is good. This is where your B+ enters your ignition switch. The master
shut off is a nice touch. That wire should be protected by a fuse (15-20A)
at the battery end. It is possible that the charging wire from the
regulator/rectifier may be attached to this terminal also. It is also a
nice idea to switch that wire and label the switch ALT. The alt switch
should be located right beside the Battery master switch which you can label
BAT.
SOL ...That is probably the starter solenoid. Check if you can see a big
white wire disappearing into the starter housing.
NOTE: There should also be a very heavy wire (probably red) between the
battery and the starter. Starter motors require a lot of current ergo, a
dirt big wire.
The charging system and the ignition switch are by the way separate
electrical systems with wires that disappear into the MAG end of the engine.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of WurlyBird
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 3:39 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Charging system trouble shooting
<james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
Occom, great reply, thanks.
Dave, I have not done a voltage check yet, today was the first day I have
had time to pull it out of the garage. I can tall you that I am getting
12.5ish volts off the battery while not running, according to the volt meter
on the panel, and it never goes up when the engine is running. When I check
AC between the two yellow wires I have to disconnect one right? Will there
be any chance of arcing?
Here is what I have found new, I think it is pretty pertinent but it
confuses me since, as always I don't have the appropriate wiring diagrams.
Here is a run down of all tabs on the back of my ignition which is as far as
I can trace continuity from the RED wire off the Key West.
going clockwise and starting arbitrarily;
MAG-this is where the RED Key West wire terminates and I can verify
continuity the whole way.
ACC-there is a thin red wire coming off of this that I did not trace, logic
says it operates a relay for all the accessories.
GND-nothing attached, closed circuit with both MAG tabs when in the OFF
position.
BAT-large RED wire going off to the Master switch on the panel. The other
end of the Master Switch is connected directly to the battery.
MAG-nothing wired here. This tab has continuity with the other MAG tab in
the OFF position.
SOL-big white wire going off presumably to the starter.
The only thing that ever happens to the RED wire from the Key West is that
it is closed with a GND and another MAG that are both not wired to anything.
I checked at all ignition settings including START (the battery is out). It
seems that this would be used to ground out Mags to shut off the engine but
it is not wired properly and this would not work using a voltage regulator
if I understand it correctly. I can not figure why this wire would
terminate at the ignition. Shouldn't this wire go directly to the battery?
Should there be any sort of interrupt so the regulator is not trying to
develop a charge during the start? I am pretty sure that this is the cause
of my problems and even if it isn't it is the next step to remedying the
charging issue.
So, with this information, what are your thoughts?
By the way, I am reading .5 Ohms across the two yellow wires.
--------
James
Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
Just about ready to take my check ride.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241329#241329
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Charging system trouble shooting |
On Sun, April 26, 2009 11:09 am, WurlyBird wrote:
> Dave, I have not done a voltage check yet, today was the first day I have had
time to
> pull it out of the garage. I can tall you that I am getting 12.5ish volts off
the
> battery while not running, according to the volt meter on the panel, and it never
goes
> up when the engine is running.
Something is charging the battery. Is it keeping its charge or are you putting
it on a
battery charger? If you're not having to maintain the charge with supplemental
charging then the system is working to some extent and that voltmeter is not
presenting a valid measurement because if it were charging when the engine is running
the nominal voltage would go up.
> When I check AC between the two yellow wires I have to
> disconnect one right? Will there be any chance of arcing?
Safest way is to check with them under load. Open circuit test might not give you
anything valid.
> Here is what I have found new, I think it is pretty pertinent but it confuses
me
> since, as always I don't have the appropriate wiring diagrams. Here is a run
down of
> all tabs on the back of my ignition which is as far as I can trace continuity
from the
> RED wire off the Key West.
I can't be sure of what you're describing. I think you're going to have to do an
as-built wiring diagram before you can proceed with much confidence.
--
Paul A. Franz
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
THE LAST WORD
"This year federal government spending will rise to 28.5 percent of
GDP, the highest level ever, with the exception of the peak of the
Second World War. The 44th president is proposing to add more to the
national debt than the first 43 presidents combined, doubling it in the
next six years, and tripling it within the decade. But to talk about it
in percentages of this and trillions of that misses the point. It's not
about bookkeeping, it's about government annexation of the economy, and
thus of life: government supervision, government regulation, government
control. No matter how small your small business is -- plumbing,
hairdressing, maple-sugaring -- the state will be burdening you with
more permits, more paperwork, more bureaucracy. And don't plan on
moving. Ahead of this week's G20 summit in London, Timothy Geithner,
America's beloved Toxic Asset, called for 'global regulation.' 'Our
hope,' said Toxic Tim, 'is that we can work with Europe on a global
framework, a global infrastructure which has appropriate global
oversight.' 'Global oversight': Hmm. There's a phrase to savor. 'We
can't,' he continued, 'allow institutions to cherry pick among
competing regulators and ship risk to where it faces the lowest
standards and weakest constraints.' Just as a matter of interest, why
not? If you don't want to be subject to the punitive 'oversight' of
economically illiterate, demagogic legislators-for-life like Barney
Frank, why shouldn't you be 'allowed' to move your business to some
jurisdiction with a lighter regulatory touch?"
-- columnist Mark Steyn
In general, the art of government consists of taking as much money as possible
from
one party of the citizens to give to the other.
-- Voltaire (1764)
Message 23
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| Subject: | Re: Charging system trouble shooting |
I charge my battery in between flights and have about 2-3 hours before incoming
transmissions are unintelligible. The strobes operation can be seen on the voltmeter
in flight as an undulation in voltage, which again, never indicates any
higher then before starting 12.5-13 v. I can say pretty definitively at this
point that there is no charging going on.
So if the red wire is going to the battery, does there need to be an interrupt
that can be turned off during start or can it just be wired directly the whole
time?
--------
James
Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
Just about ready to take my check ride.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241344#241344
Message 24
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| Subject: | Re: Charging system trouble shooting |
I've never seen an aircraft ignition switch with an ACC position so you've
got me there. The big error I can spot is the one Noel Loveys already
pointed out, The Mag terminals are grounded when the switch is set to off,
the left ign. trigger is grounded when set to right and the right trigger
when set to left. The output of the Key West should never go near these
terminals. If you have an ACC terminal, and the switch can handle 16 amps
then you put it there assuming it is actually energized when the switch is
on. I'd put it through a 20 amp fuse and straight into the battery. In fact
I did on my own. I can reach the fuse and remove it if desired.
So I would wire my switch :
MAG: one of the P pleads
MAG: the other P lead
ACC: no advice.
GND: to a good reliable GND
BAT to + lead, it's used to energize the solenoid. should be dead when
master is off in my opinion.
SOL to Solenoid actuator coil.
If you have separate left and right mag switches then nothing should be
wired to the MAG terminals, and you could likely disregard the GND.
----- Original Message -----
From: "WurlyBird" <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 3:09 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Charging system trouble shooting
> <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
>
>
> MAG-this is where the RED Key West wire terminates and I can verify
> continuity the whole way.
> ACC-there is a thin red wire coming off of this that I did not trace,
> logic says it operates a relay for all the accessories.
> GND-nothing attached, closed circuit with both MAG tabs when in the OFF
> position.
> BAT-large RED wire going off to the Master switch on the panel. The other
> end of the Master Switch is connected directly to the battery.
> MAG-nothing wired here. This tab has continuity with the other MAG tab in
> the OFF position.
> SOL-big white wire going off presumably to the starter.
>
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Charging system trouble shooting |
I've never seen an ACC position on an aircraft ignition switch, but it was
common on a lot of other switches that did have ACC positions for that
position to go dead as you moved the switch to start. You could check if
it's something you desire.
----- Original Message -----
From: "WurlyBird" <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:04 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Charging system trouble shooting
> <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
>
> I charge my battery in between flights and have about 2-3 hours before
> incoming transmissions are unintelligible. The strobes operation can be
> seen on the voltmeter in flight as an undulation in voltage, which again,
> never indicates any higher then before starting 12.5-13 v. I can say
> pretty definitively at this point that there is no charging going on.
>
> So if the red wire is going to the battery, does there need to be an
> interrupt that can be turned off during start or can it just be wired
> directly the whole time?
>
> --------
> James
> Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
> Just about ready to take my check ride.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241344#241344
>
>
>
Message 26
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|
| Subject: | Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or |
a CH 701
Several 701 owners have taken the slats off their wings and installed Vortex
Generators (VGs) From what I've read they get similar STOL performance with
better glide and speed.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of motoadve
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 4:20 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or
a CH 701
Thanks for the replies.
So vortex generators are made /tested and sold by the Kitfox factory? or is
just an aftermarket product?
Is not totally tested yet?
I wanted the CH 701 becasue is a STOL and I also prefer all aluminum plane,
I might not have a hangar all the time.
What about the Savannah? looks like the CH 701 but has no slats and the
performance claims as STOL are the same.
Is the Highlander full aluminum?
I weight 165 and plan to fly always with friends or wife ect, usually go to
the beach being able to fly low and slow over the shore, pick a place to
land take a swim go up again.
Go following rivers, sightseen ect, just plain flying, not planned cross
country trips because Costa Rica is montaneous windy , rainy and many
Cessnas are burried in the mountains, the area I plan to fly is on the
caribeanside which is totally flat.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241336#241336
Message 27
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| Subject: | Re: Charging system trouble shooting |
I go along completely with what Dave has said here with one very minor
exception I would connect the output of your regulator to the bat lead
preferably through a switch. In the unlikely event of a diode fusing in the
rectifier there then would be no chance of draining your battery through the
regulator.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave G
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 6:04 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Charging system trouble shooting
I've never seen an aircraft ignition switch with an ACC position so you've
got me there. The big error I can spot is the one Noel Loveys already
pointed out, The Mag terminals are grounded when the switch is set to off,
the left ign. trigger is grounded when set to right and the right trigger
when set to left. The output of the Key West should never go near these
terminals. If you have an ACC terminal, and the switch can handle 16 amps
then you put it there assuming it is actually energized when the switch is
on. I'd put it through a 20 amp fuse and straight into the battery. In fact
I did on my own. I can reach the fuse and remove it if desired.
So I would wire my switch :
MAG: one of the P pleads
MAG: the other P lead
ACC: no advice.
GND: to a good reliable GND
BAT to + lead, it's used to energize the solenoid. should be dead when
master is off in my opinion.
SOL to Solenoid actuator coil.
If you have separate left and right mag switches then nothing should be
wired to the MAG terminals, and you could likely disregard the GND.
----- Original Message -----
From: "WurlyBird" <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 3:09 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Charging system trouble shooting
> <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
>
>
> MAG-this is where the RED Key West wire terminates and I can verify
> continuity the whole way.
> ACC-there is a thin red wire coming off of this that I did not trace,
> logic says it operates a relay for all the accessories.
> GND-nothing attached, closed circuit with both MAG tabs when in the OFF
> position.
> BAT-large RED wire going off to the Master switch on the panel. The other
> end of the Master Switch is connected directly to the battery.
> MAG-nothing wired here. This tab has continuity with the other MAG tab in
> the OFF position.
> SOL-big white wire going off presumably to the starter.
>
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: Charging system trouble shooting |
That feature is supposed to give you full current for the start.
Sometimes designers will put a dirt big diode in reverse polarity across the
lead to the starter and ground. Then any reverse spikes generated when the
starter is released will be shunted to ground through the diode.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Dave G
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 6:12 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Charging system trouble shooting
I've never seen an ACC position on an aircraft ignition switch, but it was
common on a lot of other switches that did have ACC positions for that
position to go dead as you moved the switch to start. You could check if
it's something you desire.
----- Original Message -----
From: "WurlyBird" <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 5:04 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Charging system trouble shooting
> <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
>
> I charge my battery in between flights and have about 2-3 hours before
> incoming transmissions are unintelligible. The strobes operation can be
> seen on the voltmeter in flight as an undulation in voltage, which again,
> never indicates any higher then before starting 12.5-13 v. I can say
> pretty definitively at this point that there is no charging going on.
>
> So if the red wire is going to the battery, does there need to be an
> interrupt that can be turned off during start or can it just be wired
> directly the whole time?
>
> --------
> James
> Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
> Just about ready to take my check ride.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241344#241344
>
>
>
Message 29
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|
Dear Kitfox owners with a subaru EA81=2C
Looking for a good place to get an overhaul kit for my EA81. Also someone m
ade a metal piece to hold the front seal in=2C I think his name is Don Lore
nzen and I am looking for his phone number.
New Kitfox 5 owner
Leigh Smith
574-772-6661
Knox IN.
_________________________________________________________________
Rediscover Hotmail=AE: Get e-mail storage that grows with you.
http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscover_
Storage2_042009
Message 30
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or |
a CH 701
Lowell=2C
I have done very careful testing with my Kitfox Model IV. I have not done
a complete evaluation but will tell you this. My aircraft stalls with vort
ex generators clean at the same speed with full flaps without. Indicated
=2C calibrated=2C and gps ground speeds. Also took videos tuffed wing befo
re installing them.
Clint
> From: lcfitt@sbcglobal.net
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Newbie questions=2C which easier to fly a K
itfox or a CH 701
> Date: Sun=2C 26 Apr 2009 11:24:23 -0700
>
>
> Mike=2C
>
> FYI=2C and this has been mentioned many times on the list=2C often by ver
y
> careful observers - vortex generators do very little to stall speed
> reduction with the Kitfox wing - in most instances not measureable. Contr
ol
> stability is almost universally reported=2C but no effect on stall speed.
>
> All this despite what we all know about vortex generators.
>
> I have heard some talk on this and it just might be that the Riblet airfo
il
> Kitfox uses is not a true airfoil as the design profile only exists at th
e
> fuel tank=2C rib caps=2C the false ribs and maybe three inches at the win
g tip.
> A total of about four feet on each wing. The rest is a different profile
> because of the depression due to the fabric shrinking between the ribs an
d
> false ribs. Harry Riblet tells us that the most critical point on this
> airfoil is the first five inches. This is exactly where the leading edge
> cuff and spar give away to the collapsed fabric. There are several
> airplanes currently being built with "D" profile leading edges that will
> protect the leading edge shape and these might benefit from vortex
> generators. But the proof will be in the testing rather than the hoping.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Saturday=2C April 25=2C 2009 6:55 AM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Newbie questions=2C which easier to fly a Kitfo
x or
> a CH 701
>
>
> >
> >
> > motoadve wrote:
> >> Thanks a lot for the replies.
> >>
> >> Wouldnt the CH 701 be safer at a stall speed of 30mph instead of 37of
the
> >> kitfox 4 or 41 in the Super sport?
> >>
> >> According to this numbers the Kitfox will stop flying before the CH 70
1
> >> in case of an emergency.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > You can put VG's ( Vortex Generators ) on the Kitfox=2C and the stall
> > numbers will be very close to the CH-701 if not the same... When you ar
e
> > only talking 2 or 3 MPH=2C there is no safety difference anymore due to
> > speed=2C other things become much more important.
> >
> > The Superior glide ratio of the Kitfox is a HUGE safety factor. Lets sa
y
> > you where at an altitude where you could glide a mile in a Zenair CH-70
1
> > and your engine quit=2C that would give you an area of 3.14
> > Square miles that you could land in. Now lets say you were in a Kitfox
> > that has twice the glide ratio and your engine quit=2C you would have a
n
> > area of 12.5 square miles in which to find a landing area. In other
> > words=2C if you double the glide of an airplane=2C you have FOUR TIMES
the
> > amount of area to search potential landing spots. I am not saying the
> > Kitfox does have exactly twice the glide=2C but it is a LOT better than
the
> > CH-701=2C and every time you double the glide ratio=2C landing areas in
crease
> > by a factor of FOUR !!
> >
> > The Kitfox will also give you more time in an engine out situation due
to
> > its much lower sink rate. Again=2C would you rather have 1 minute to ch
ose
> > a spot=2C and execute an emergency landing=2C or 2 minutes=2C the Kitfo
x has a
> > HUGE safety advantage over the Zenith CH-701 in an engine out situation
.
> >
> > So that is the engine out performance comparison in a nutshell=2C Dave
=2C did
> > you read my post about the performance comparison of the Kitfox and the
> > Zenair CH-701 that is located here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=57516
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > --------
> > "=3BNO FEAR"=3B - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as
you
> > could have !!!
> >
> > Kolb MK-III Xtra=2C 912-S
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Read this topic online here:
> >
> > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241208#241208
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
Message 31
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What |
to use
Dave,
Nope, not that old. My first kit came with a quart of Stits "Epoxy Chromate
Primer", that was 1993. Today, Polyfiber lists it as Epoxy Primer and no
mention of chromate. They do say corrosion resistant, but somehow I think
that might be just like the labeling on toothpaste. Check the active
ingredient of all toothpasts and they will list some form of fluoride.
Check the label and they will be for cavity prevention, tooth whitening,
ultra tooth whitening, gum disease prevention, you name it. Sort of one
size fits all - this from an "old" dentist.
As mentioned, zinc chromate is still available, but not as an epoxy primer -
at least I can't find any.
Check the links below.
http://www.finishing.com/0600-0799/702.shtml
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cspages/ptizincchromateprimer.php
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 11:43 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum.
What to use
>
> Old days??? Gee I didn't think I was that old. :-)
>
> Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 3:20 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum.
> What to use
>
>
> Mike,
>
> I think in addition to the Alumiprep which is basically a cleaner and
> etchant, I would follow that with Alodyne which as a conversion coating
> with
>
> corrosion resistance and it enhances paint adhesion. Alodyne is used
> alone
> in the interiors of aluminum aircraft as a corrosion coating.
>
> You will need an epoxy coating where the adhesives will contact any
> structural member. In the old days, it was a zinc chromate epoxy primer.
> This was reformulated, because of the suspicion by the EPA that we were
> actually drinking this stuff, and now the zink chromate is available in
> aerosol spray cans - which tells us right away that it is not an epoxy
> coating - and the "green" epoxy primers claiming corrosion resistant
> properties without telling us what they contain, except maybe on the can.
>
> I think if I were buying today, I would go with the Polyfiber product to
> keep everything consistant. It comes in green or white. Randolph also
> has
> a green or white primer as well.
>
> A real good alternative down there would be to go to your local automotive
> paint store and see what they recommend. They are very familiar with your
> environment and what it takes to keep things from turning orange.
>
> Lowell Fitt
> Cameron Park, CA
> Model IV-1200 R-912 UL
> Still building and modifying
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:44 AM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What
> to use
>
>
>>
>> Can anyone tell me the best product to use for corrosion prevention in a
>> Kitfox. I am in Miaim very near salt water and need to pay special
>> attention to this. So far, the information I have gotten is to Alumiprep
>> to clean and then use Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy on the Aluminum wing spars
>> where the fabric will be covering them. Some have also said to slosh the
>> inside of the wing spars with Epoxy, would the same 2 part Poly Fiber
>> epoxy primer be the best for this also ?
>>
>> What about the 4130 tubing, what is the best method to clean, and then
>> the
>
>> best primer to use on this ? Would the same Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy
>> primer I use on the Aluminum be good for general corrosion protection of
>> 4130 steel parts ?
>>
>> Any information or suggestions will be appreciated.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> --------
>> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
>> could have !!!
>>
>> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241321#241321
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH |
701
There is a VG thread started here http://rotaxaircraft.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=33
John Gilpin some STOLSPEED.com is over there too. I have used both Harrison and
Stolspeed VGs. I prefer Stolspeed's to 2 main reasons.
1, rounded edge makes it easier for washing.
2. They come with kickass adhesive the harrioson ones do not.
Now I have tested VGs only at 10% on my Kitfox IV. Results are minimal. I plan
to move them and see what changes.
Only things i noticed was maybe a reduction in stall 1 - 2 mph if that .
Power off stall no buffeting just a controlled mush.
Power on stalls - no warning or buffeting - you will get a fast wing drop
and go into spin.
I think i might have a little steeper angle of climb now .
No change in cruise speed.
I still have them on.
I used some harrison VGs on cowl mod and reduced coolant temps
http://www.cfisher.com/cowl.html
--------
Rotax Dealer, Ontario Canada
http://www.cfisher.com/
Awesome *New Forum *
http://rotaxaircraft.com/forum/
Realtime Kitfox movies to separate the internet chatter from the truth
http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=kitfoxflyer
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241382#241382
Message 33
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or a CH |
701
Clint , when you say full flaps - how many degrees is that ?
Early models only got 10 to 15%
IV went past 30 degrees . mine go to 33 degrees and only useful for taking
off quicker. I usually land with 20 degrees flaps in full stall 3 pointer
--------
Rotax Dealer, Ontario Canada
http://www.cfisher.com/
Awesome *New Forum *
http://rotaxaircraft.com/forum/
Realtime Kitfox movies to separate the internet chatter from the truth
http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=kitfoxflyer
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241384#241384
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Venturi location - no suction |
On 26-Apr-09, at 10:34 AM, skyring wrote:
> <kerryskyring@hotmail.com>
>
> Jim that's a great help. Thanks. But I'm presuming you have to
> disconnect the hose every time you take the bottom cowl off?
Yes I disconnect each time I remove the lower cowling... barb fitting
with inexpensive vinyl tubing
>
> Now I'm really curious and see cuffs on your lift struts and what
> looks like a in-flight adjustable trim on the rudder..
>
Yes I have in-flight rudder trim, normal cruise about 120 mph at
5000 ASL The tailwheel is a Matco supplied by
Kitffox LLC
> Curious about your cruise speed and also - what's the tailwheel?
> kerry
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241320#241320
>
>
Message 35
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| Subject: | Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What |
to use
I think you're right there Lowell. I just checked on Rand-O-Plate which I
knew was dark green. It is recommended for priming steel and a white is
recommended for aluminium. I tried to find MSDS sheets on the Rand-O-Plate
with no results but I think I'd be very surprised if there was any zinc or
chromate in it.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:34 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum.
What to use
Dave,
Nope, not that old. My first kit came with a quart of Stits "Epoxy Chromate
Primer", that was 1993. Today, Polyfiber lists it as Epoxy Primer and no
mention of chromate. They do say corrosion resistant, but somehow I think
that might be just like the labeling on toothpaste. Check the active
ingredient of all toothpasts and they will list some form of fluoride.
Check the label and they will be for cavity prevention, tooth whitening,
ultra tooth whitening, gum disease prevention, you name it. Sort of one
size fits all - this from an "old" dentist.
As mentioned, zinc chromate is still available, but not as an epoxy primer -
at least I can't find any.
Check the links below.
http://www.finishing.com/0600-0799/702.shtml
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/cspages/ptizincchromateprimer.php
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noel Loveys" <noelloveys@yahoo.ca>
Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 11:43 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum.
What to use
>
> Old days??? Gee I didn't think I was that old. :-)
>
> Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lowell Fitt
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 3:20 PM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum.
> What to use
>
>
> Mike,
>
> I think in addition to the Alumiprep which is basically a cleaner and
> etchant, I would follow that with Alodyne which as a conversion coating
> with
>
> corrosion resistance and it enhances paint adhesion. Alodyne is used
> alone
> in the interiors of aluminum aircraft as a corrosion coating.
>
> You will need an epoxy coating where the adhesives will contact any
> structural member. In the old days, it was a zinc chromate epoxy primer.
> This was reformulated, because of the suspicion by the EPA that we were
> actually drinking this stuff, and now the zink chromate is available in
> aerosol spray cans - which tells us right away that it is not an epoxy
> coating - and the "green" epoxy primers claiming corrosion resistant
> properties without telling us what they contain, except maybe on the can.
>
> I think if I were buying today, I would go with the Polyfiber product to
> keep everything consistant. It comes in green or white. Randolph also
> has
> a green or white primer as well.
>
> A real good alternative down there would be to go to your local automotive
> paint store and see what they recommend. They are very familiar with your
> environment and what it takes to keep things from turning orange.
>
> Lowell Fitt
> Cameron Park, CA
> Model IV-1200 R-912 UL
> Still building and modifying
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Sunday, April 26, 2009 9:44 AM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What
> to use
>
>
>>
>> Can anyone tell me the best product to use for corrosion prevention in a
>> Kitfox. I am in Miaim very near salt water and need to pay special
>> attention to this. So far, the information I have gotten is to Alumiprep
>> to clean and then use Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy on the Aluminum wing spars
>> where the fabric will be covering them. Some have also said to slosh the
>> inside of the wing spars with Epoxy, would the same 2 part Poly Fiber
>> epoxy primer be the best for this also ?
>>
>> What about the 4130 tubing, what is the best method to clean, and then
>> the
>
>> best primer to use on this ? Would the same Poly Fiber 2 part epoxy
>> primer I use on the Aluminum be good for general corrosion protection of
>> 4130 steel parts ?
>>
>> Any information or suggestions will be appreciated.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> --------
>> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
>> could have !!!
>>
>> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241321#241321
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: Corrosion Prevention - 4130 Steel and Aluminum. What |
to use
Noel,
right now my Kit is sitting in the garage within 50 feet of salt water, to get
it any closer I would have to put it on floats ;) I really like the idea of treating
the inside of the 4130 steel tubing, I bought a can of Tube Seal, but
have been wondering about putting it in. Are there holes in all the cross members,
and welded parts of that frame ? There are so many different tubes, I
was wondering if I would have to drill a small hole in every tube ??? The time
to do this is definitely before getting to far, later on it wont be an option.
The tubing is powder coated, but there are always scratches, and 4130 parts that
need to be coated, and my friend even had places where the metal was not prepped
well and the powder coating was coming off. So I am anticipating having
to re-prime some areas myself.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241388#241388
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox |
or a CH 701
At 11:50 AM 4/26/2009, you wrote:
>So vortex generators are made /tested and sold by the Kitfox
>factory? or is just an aftermarket product?
>Is not totally tested yet?
Hi,
I think I missed your name. Here on the Kitfox list we
encourage you to put your full name, location, and aircraft
status/type in your signature.
I think Lowell will tell you that VG's have been rather
thoroughly tested on Kitfoxes with little improvement shown. (See the
archives for lots of talk and a little data.) What HAS been shown to
work is leading edge slats. We had one fellow claim stall speeds in
the 20's. What I want to see is someone install the slats made by
Turbine Cubs of Wyoming. These are free-floating slats that
supposedly dramatically reduce stall speeds while reducing top end very little.
Guy Buchanan, Kitfox List Moderator
San Diego, CA
K-IV 1200 / 582-C / Warp / 300 hrs. and counting
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: Newbie questions, which easier to fly a Kitfox or |
a CH 701
The handle is straight up. ? degrees
Clint
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Newbie questions=2C which easier to fly a Kitfo
x or a CH 701
> From: dave@cfisher.com
> Date: Sun=2C 26 Apr 2009 18:41:52 -0700
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
>
>
> Clint =2C when you say full flaps - how many degrees is that ?
>
> Early models only got 10 to 15%
> IV went past 30 degrees . mine go to 33 degrees and only useful for takin
g off quicker. I usually land with 20 degrees flaps in full stall 3 pointer
>
> --------
> Rotax Dealer=2C Ontario Canada
> http://www.cfisher.com/
> Awesome *New Forum *
> http://rotaxaircraft.com/forum/
> Realtime Kitfox movies to separate the internet chatter from the truth
> http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=kitfoxflyer
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=241384#241384
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
>
>
>
Message 39
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Hi all=2C
When testing for stall speeds=2C power off will not work with most Kitfox'e
s. There is just not enough elevator control and it will go into mush. Te
st with enough power to detect stall... I have the vg's under stab. Over
size model IV elevator and gap seal. The AC stalls 5 mph slower with them.
10 percent position of mc=2C that includes flaperons. Did tuff test with
Air Cam as chase plane. Video recorded and any position around 10 percent
would work well. I have calibrated my airspeeds and it these numbers that
I used.
These are TAS
Stall speed clean without generators. 48 mph
Stall Speed with flaps no generators 43 mph
Stall Speed with generators no flaps 43 mph
Stall Speed with generator full flaps 38 mph
I did not list these in past as temp=2C altitude etc were all in this data.
What I listed is a brief summary of what was done. It's reduction in sta
ll is just about what most VG's on AC do.
Clint
Model IV-1200
1450 hours 912-ULS
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