Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:48 AM - Re: Re: Intermittent Ignition Issue (fox5flyer)
2. 03:48 AM - Re: Re: Pitot Static Ports (fox5flyer)
3. 05:06 AM - Re: Re: Intermittent Ignition Issue (Paul Franz - Merlin GT)
4. 05:30 AM - Re: Intermittent Ignition IssueIntermittent Ignition Issue (Catz631@aol.com)
5. 07:58 AM - Re: Re: Intermittent Ignition Issue (Noel Loveys)
6. 07:58 AM - Re: Intermittent Ignition IssueIntermittent Ignition Issue (Noel Loveys)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Intermittent Ignition Issue |
Rique, as has already been mentioned, check your ground wires carefully
for not only good contact, but good continuity also. Don't just wiggle
them. Disconnect and reconnect ensuring no corrosion and ensure contact
is clean. In the past there have been many owners who had similar
problems with ignition wires that were separated inside the insulation.
I believe that most of those were from the hot wire, but I'm sure it
could be either one. It can be a difficult issue to resolve, but a
careful step by step search should find the culprit.
One thing, did you build the aircraft? How many operating hours are on
it?
Deke Morisse
Mikado Michigan
S5/Subaru/CAP 438+ TT
"If you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara
Desert, in five years there'd be a shortage of sand."
-- Nobel prize-winning economist Milton Friedman (1912-2006)
----- Original Message -----
From: riquenkelly@aol.com
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2010 12:22 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Intermittent Ignition Issue
The engine quits when one switch is off (grounding the good side).
But this is intermittent. I'll either get the normal 150-250 rpm drop
and recovery or the engine will quit altogether. And this will happen
within seconds of each other if I perform repeated checks.
-----Original Message-----
From: riquenkelly@aol.com
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Mon, Feb 8, 2010 11:21 pm
Subject: Intermittent Ignition Issue
Listers,
I am out of ideas. I have a Model IV with a 582 and Ducati
ignition. About 50% of the time my aircraft fails ground check on one
side of my ignition. I have checked for every loose connection I can
think of. How frequently have the brushes on the flywheel failed?
Could they be intermittent? I have replaced the DCI I thought was the
failed unit but I'm not sure how likely it is for a DCI to fire
intermittently.
Does anyone have any good suggestions? I've checked everything I can
think of...
Thanks for the help,
Rique Gwin
Kitfox Model IV Classic
582 Grey
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Pitot Static Ports |
Interesting contribution. Would have been more useful with some meaningful
information about building a Kitfox.
Deke
----- Original Message -----
From: "WurlyBird" <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2010 9:51 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Pitot Static Ports
> <james.t.trizzino@us.army.mil>
>
> If ANYONE, EVER, crashed a Kitfox or similar aircraft due to an instrument
> failure they probably needed to be removed from the aviation gene pool
> anyway. The only instruments I rely on are the RPM and TGT. Every other
> instrument in the aircraft is only used to reinforce what the pilot should
> have already felt.
>
> --------
> James
> Kitfox 3 / 582 / GSC prop
> The ink is still drying on my new certificate
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=285912#285912
>
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Intermittent Ignition Issue |
On Wed, February 10, 2010 9:22 pm, riquenkelly@aol.com wrote:
>
> The engine quits when one switch is off (grounding the good side). But this
is
> intermittent. I'll either get the normal 150-250 rpm drop and recovery or the
engine
> will quit altogether. And this will happen within seconds of each other if I
perform
> repeated checks.
Given those details, I would be suspect that one of the composite shielded (high
tension) leads is broken internally. What happens with a vibrating loose internal
connection is that there is intermittent connectivity and when it is open circuit
is
can spark to ground somewhere between the discontinuity and the source. Sorry for
not
naming the leads properly since I don't own your type setup.
Since this is a critical safety issue, I would replace all the high tension leads
rather than doing the painstaking process of tracking down the faulty one. Since
when
the fault occurs it affects all the spark on one side of the redundant system,
it is
probably the single lead that is common rather than the spark plug wires. Since
I
don't know this setup I will use the analogous one for coil and distributor ignition
and imagine the engine had two distributors and two coils and two spark plugs per
cylinder. If you disabled one of the coils in say a check and the engine dies like
yours does intermittently where all spark plugs quit, the high tension lead that
is
bad is the coil wire on the non-disabled coil. It will likely spark to ground
somewhere between the coil and the intermittent discontinuity. You have to transfer
this analogy to the DCI/magneto arrangement you have. So my fix would be to replace
both of the high tension coil wires rather than try to determine where the
intermittent discontinuity is and repairing it.
Now my analogy may be so poor this contribution amounts to little more than idle
hangar talk but I could be making some useful points.
1) replace all like failed components rather than repairing them since they all
have
likely been exposed to similar vibration fatigue.
2) the spark plug wires aren't the problem, given your symptoms, it is a single
wire
(or component) affecting only half of the redundant system.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: riquenkelly@aol.com
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Sent: Mon, Feb 8, 2010 11:21 pm
> Subject: Intermittent Ignition Issue
>
>
> Listers,
>
> I am out of ideas. I have a Model IV with a 582 and Ducati ignition. About
50% of
> the time my aircraft fails ground check on one side of my ignition. I have checked
> for every loose connection I can think of. How frequently have the brushes on
the
> flywheel failed? Could they be intermittent? I have replaced the DCI I thought
was
> the failed unit but I'm not sure how likely it is for a DCI to fire intermittently.
>
> Does anyone have any good suggestions? I've checked everything I can think of...
--
Paul A. Franz
Registration/Aircraft - N14UW/Merlin GT
Engine/Prop - Rotax 914/NSI CAP
Bellevue WA
425.241.1618 Cell
In general, the art of government consists of taking as much money as possible
from
one party of the citizens to give to the other.
-- Voltaire (1764)
One of the lessons of history is that nothing is often a good thing to do and always
a
clever thing to say.
-- Will Durant
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Intermittent Ignition IssueIntermittent Ignition Issue |
Rique,
That is exactly the same thing that happened on my engine ! (see my prior
list) I ended up replacing the P leads etc trying to find the problem but
it ended up being a broken wire !. Swap connectors on your electronic boxes
and see if the problem follows. I would be willing to bet you have a broken
power wire to one of your modules and it is connecting intermittently.
In any case you could call Ronnie @ South Mississippi Light Aircraft or a
tech at Lockwood,LEAF or CPS and ask them about it also. Ronnie solved my
problem . He knows these engines !
Dick Maddux
Milton,Fl
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Intermittent Ignition Issue |
I assume you have tested the switch out of the circuit. That certainly
sounds to me like a faulty switch. Or possibly some of the insulation worn
off inside the shielding and allowing the P-Lead to short ( turn off the
mag) to the shielding.
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
riquenkelly@aol.com
Sent: February 11, 2010 1:52 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Intermittent Ignition Issue
The engine quits when one switch is off (grounding the good side). But this
is intermittent. I'll either get the normal 150-250 rpm drop and recovery
or the engine will quit altogether. And this will happen within seconds of
each other if I perform repeated checks.
-----Original Message-----
From: riquenkelly@aol.com
Sent: Mon, Feb 8, 2010 11:21 pm
Subject: Intermittent Ignition Issue
Listers,
I am out of ideas. I have a Model IV with a 582 and Ducati ignition.
About 50% of the time my aircraft fails ground check on one side of my
ignition. I have checked for every loose connection I can think of. How
frequently have the brushes on the flywheel failed? Could they be
intermittent? I have replaced the DCI I thought was the failed unit but I'm
not sure how likely it is for a DCI to fire intermittently.
Does anyone have any good suggestions? I've checked everything I can think
of...
Thanks for the help,
Rique Gwin
Kitfox Model IV Classic
582 Grey
Message 6
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| Subject: | Intermittent Ignition IssueIntermittent Ignition Issue |
That sounds more than possible to me too
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Catz631@aol.com
Sent: February 11, 2010 9:51 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Intermittent Ignition IssueIntermittent Ignition
Issue
Rique,
That is exactly the same thing that happened on my engine ! (see my prior
list) I ended up replacing the P leads etc trying to find the problem but it
ended up being a broken wire !. Swap connectors on your electronic boxes and
see if the problem follows. I would be willing to bet you have a broken
power wire to one of your modules and it is connecting intermittently.
In any case you could call Ronnie @ South Mississippi Light Aircraft or a
tech at Lockwood,LEAF or CPS and ask them about it also. Ronnie solved my
problem . He knows these engines !
Dick Maddux
Milton,Fl
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