Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 03:21 AM - Re: Fuel situation (Lynn Matteson)
2. 04:46 AM - Re: Fuel situation (Cudnohufsky's)
3. 04:46 AM - Re: Painting Question (Cudnohufsky's)
4. 05:42 AM - Re: Painting Question (Lynn Matteson)
5. 05:51 AM - Re: Fuel situation (Lynn Matteson)
6. 05:52 AM - Re: Painting Question (Lynn Matteson)
7. 05:56 AM - Re: Painting Question (larry huntley)
8. 06:50 AM - Re: Fuel situation (Catz631@aol.com)
9. 07:25 AM - Re: Painting Question (Vic Baker)
10. 08:13 AM - Re: Painting Question (Lowell Fitt)
11. 08:31 AM - Re: Painting Question (Lowell Fitt)
12. 08:32 AM - Re: Fuel situation (Lowell Fitt)
13. 09:37 AM - Re: Fuel situation (Lynn Matteson)
14. 10:02 AM - Re: Fuel situation (Lynn Matteson)
15. 12:11 PM - Fuel requirement for 532 (mikeperkins)
16. 12:11 PM - Re: Fuel situation (Tom Jones)
17. 12:35 PM - Re: Fuel requirement for 532 (Dave Fisher)
18. 02:30 PM - Re: Re: Fuel situation (Lynn Matteson)
19. 02:43 PM - Re: Re: Fuel situation (Lynn Matteson)
20. 02:56 PM - Re: Fuel situation (Tom Jones)
21. 03:00 PM - Re: Fuel situation (Tom Jones)
22. 03:23 PM - Re: Re: Fuel situation (Lynn Matteson)
23. 03:32 PM - Re: Re: Fuel situation (Lynn Matteson)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
You know what's strange about it....I was telling my neighbor about
it, and he wondered why the fuel in the left tank didn't just spew
out the open hole when I was banking the plane left to get the fuel
to flow to the left rear corner of the right tank. The only thing I
can think of is that the air blowing over the open hole sort of
"sheared" over the hole and maybe prevented the.....what I would
think would be...gushing of the fuel out of that open hole.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:16 PM, fox5flyer wrote:
> <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>
>
> Good report, Lynn. Similar situation happened to me, however I
> replaced the cap, but didn't get both tangs locked under the lip
> which caused what happened to you. Don't feel bad though. It's
> happened to many others here on this list. Some have actually lost
> their cap in flight, never to be found again.
> It became one of my "check it twice" items.
> Thanks for sharing.
> Deke
Message 2
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Lynn,
Could it be that you were in a coordinated 1 G turn and the same centrifugal
force that keep you centered in your seat kept the fuel in the bottom of the
tank?
Lloyd C
Northern Mi
Mod 5 912ul IVO IFA
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Sent: Friday, March 19, 2010 5:21 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel situation
You know what's strange about it....I was telling my neighbor about
it, and he wondered why the fuel in the left tank didn't just spew
out the open hole when I was banking the plane left to get the fuel
to flow to the left rear corner of the right tank. The only thing I
can think of is that the air blowing over the open hole sort of
"sheared" over the hole and maybe prevented the.....what I would
think would be...gushing of the fuel out of that open hole.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:16 PM, fox5flyer wrote:
> <fox5flyer@idealwifi.net>
>
> Good report, Lynn. Similar situation happened to me, however I
> replaced the cap, but didn't get both tangs locked under the lip
> which caused what happened to you. Don't feel bad though. It's
> happened to many others here on this list. Some have actually lost
> their cap in flight, never to be found again.
> It became one of my "check it twice" items.
> Thanks for sharing.
> Deke
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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| Subject: | Painting Question |
Guys,
Cannot comment on the tape type but here is a little trick I learned to help
get crisp clean trim lines, after masking, shoot our first coat with the
base color along the tape, it will seal the edge of the tape and any bleed
through will be the same color as the paint beneath. Then shoot the trim
color.
Lloyd
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Reilly
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 9:44 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
Vic, Did you like that propylene tape? I tried it and went back to the std
masking tape. The plastic tape streched and didn't stick as well.
Pat Reilly
On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 10:05 AM, Vic Baker <vr_baker@nvbell.net> wrote:
Lowell,
Using Polytone here. The blush retarder I use to slow drying (improve
gloss) makes paint prone to run unless great care is used. I shot almost
all paint (trim and main) onto horizontal surfaces. (rotate part being
painted) The spinner was especially interesting to paint. After twice
getting runs I built a little fixture to slowly rotate while drying. For
the trim I used propylene masking tape from ACS, I pulled the tape shortly
after one cross coat (perhaps no longer than 5 minutes). Again -
horizontal surfaces only - had no runs.
On the paint booth, I spent quite a bit of time trying to get it right.
Lighting, sealed motor exhaust fan, incoming air filters from a "paint
booth" supplier. I used a bunch of Lowes air filters (home heating return
duct filters) to filter to overspray out of the exhaust.
Finally, although I used a quality breathing mask, I discovered when
painting the blue trim that my beard was blue around where the mask fit. It
had been leaking all through the building process and I did not notice it.
Now, two years later, I still cannot smell MEK. You are shooting
Aerothane so I know you have a forced air supply for breathing.
Hope this helps.
Vic
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message ----- From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 3:42 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
Tomorrow or Friday latest, I plan on painting the trim colors on my
fuselage. It has been ten years since I did the deed and want to ask for
advice from those that have painted more recently and can remember. I am
using Aerothane in a home made paint booth.
1. Did you rotate the fuselage and only paint horizontal surfaces?
2 when did you pull the masking tape?
Thanks,
Lowell<br
y Browse, Chat, FAQ,
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Pat Reilly
Mod 3 582 Rebuild
Rockford,IL
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14:33:00
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Painting Question |
I've also heard that painting some clear at the tape edge will also
prevent color creep under the tape. If nothing else, the best way to
prevent creep under, is to use the vinyl tape, but don't stretch it
when you apply it. Just get it taut to produce a straight line...if
that's what you want....and lay it down....DON'T pull on it. And most
important....whatever form of taping you do, be sure the use a
fingernail to press down on all the taped edges JUST before painting,
or even just ahead of where you're painting. Tape always wants to
lift, so the less time between pressing it down and actual shooting
is best.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
On Mar 18, 2010, at 6:30 PM, Patrick Reilly wrote:
> Lowell, If your able to rotate and paint in the flat, it sure is
> easier. I did everything horizontal to avoid runs on vertical
> surfaces. The guys that paint everyday can paint vertical surfaces,
> but it is definitely harder. You might want to get The EAA "How to
> Paint Your Own Airplane" book. I used it as reference. It states to
> pull tape after about 2 hours. Pull the tape "into" the fresh
> paint. Also, do you know the proceedure of painting at the tape
> line with the underlying base color to seal the tape to prevent any
> bleed under the tape?
>
> Pat Reilly
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
My flight instructor would doubt that I'm EVER coordinated, Lloyd,
but you might have a point. However, I wasn't turning, just going
straight, so it doesn't seem like that would apply, but I could be
wrong.
I certainly didn't lose much fuel, as that flight lasted 0.8 hours,
and involved two take-offs and landings. After assessing the
situation on the ground afterwards, I was amazed at how much fuel was
transferred to the left tank, and how much there was left, totally,
between the two tanks after the settling/leveling period.
The scientist in me wants to try it again with an observer plane, but
my skivvies aren't back from the laundry yet. : )
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
On Mar 19, 2010, at 7:26 AM, Cudnohufsky's wrote:
> <7suds@chartermi.net>
>
> Lynn,
> Could it be that you were in a coordinated 1 G turn and the same
> centrifugal
> force that keep you centered in your seat kept the fuel in the
> bottom of the
> tank?
>
> Lloyd C
> Northern Mi
> Mod 5 912ul IVO IFA
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn
> Matteson
> Sent: Friday, March 19, 2010 5:21 AM
> To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel situation
>
>
> You know what's strange about it....I was telling my neighbor about
> it, and he wondered why the fuel in the left tank didn't just spew
> out the open hole when I was banking the plane left to get the fuel
> to flow to the left rear corner of the right tank. The only thing I
> can think of is that the air blowing over the open hole sort of
> "sheared" over the hole and maybe prevented the.....what I would
> think would be...gushing of the fuel out of that open hole.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
> Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
> Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
> Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> Rotec TBI-40 injection
> Status: flying (and learning)
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Painting Question |
Re the beard.....I had a beard when working with cyanoacrylate (SP?)
(superglue) and it snuck around the mask and affected me, so I shaved
the beard off, and it's been off ever since.
Masks just don't seal well over facial hair.
Lowell, I used a fuselage "spit" and a wing spit, and only shot
horizontal surfaces whenever possible. I also had any item that was
to be painted, statically grounded to the damp floor that I was
working on.
I pulled the tape early enough on so that any edge was still soft
enough so that it could sort of "heal" or smooth out after the tape
was pulled.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
On Mar 18, 2010, at 11:05 AM, Vic Baker wrote:
>
> Lowell,
>
> Using Polytone here. The blush retarder I use to slow drying
> (improve gloss) makes paint prone to run unless great care is
> used. I shot almost all paint (trim and main) onto horizontal
> surfaces. (rotate part being painted) The spinner was
> especially interesting to paint. After twice getting runs I built
> a little fixture to slowly rotate while drying. For the trim I
> used propylene masking tape from ACS, I pulled the tape shortly
> after one cross coat (perhaps no longer than 5 minutes). Again -
> horizontal surfaces only - had no runs.
>
> On the paint booth, I spent quite a bit of time trying to get it
> right. Lighting, sealed motor exhaust fan, incoming air filters
> from a "paint booth" supplier. I used a bunch of Lowes air
> filters (home heating return duct filters) to filter to overspray
> out of the exhaust.
>
> Finally, although I used a quality breathing mask, I discovered
> when painting the blue trim that my beard was blue around where the
> mask fit. It had been leaking all through the building process and
> I did not notice it. Now, two years later, I still cannot smell
> MEK. You are shooting Aerothane so I know you have a forced air
> supply for breathing.
>
> Hope this helps.
> Vic
>
>
> Vic Baker
> S7 912S Warp
> Carson City, Nv
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lowell Fitt"
> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 3:42 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
>
>
>> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>>
>> Tomorrow or Friday latest, I plan on painting the trim colors on
>> my fuselage. It has been ten years since I did the deed and want
>> to ask for advice from those that have painted more recently and
>> can remember. I am using Aerothane in a home made paint booth.
>>
>> 1. Did you rotate the fuselage and only paint horizontal surfaces?
>>
>> 2 when did you pull the masking tape?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Lowell
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Painting Question |
Yep, I can verify that works great! My first paint job had lots of
little defects on the trim line. No more. Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: Cudnohufsky's
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Friday, March 19, 2010 7:34 AM
Subject: RE: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
Guys,
Cannot comment on the tape type but here is a little trick I learned
to help get crisp clean trim lines, after masking, shoot our first coat
with the base color along the tape, it will seal the edge of the tape
and any bleed through will be the same color as the paint beneath. Then
shoot the trim color.
Lloyd
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Patrick
Reilly
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 9:44 PM
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
Vic, Did you like that propylene tape? I tried it and went back to the
std masking tape. The plastic tape streched and didn't stick as well.
Pat Reilly
On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 10:05 AM, Vic Baker <vr_baker@nvbell.net>
wrote:
Lowell,
Using Polytone here. The blush retarder I use to slow drying (improve
gloss) makes paint prone to run unless great care is used. I shot
almost all paint (trim and main) onto horizontal surfaces. (rotate
part being painted) The spinner was especially interesting to paint.
After twice getting runs I built a little fixture to slowly rotate while
drying. For the trim I used propylene masking tape from ACS, I pulled
the tape shortly after one cross coat (perhaps no longer than 5
minutes). Again - horizontal surfaces only - had no runs.
On the paint booth, I spent quite a bit of time trying to get it
right. Lighting, sealed motor exhaust fan, incoming air filters from a
"paint booth" supplier. I used a bunch of Lowes air filters (home
heating return duct filters) to filter to overspray out of the exhaust.
Finally, although I used a quality breathing mask, I discovered when
painting the blue trim that my beard was blue around where the mask fit.
It had been leaking all through the building process and I did not
notice it. Now, two years later, I still cannot smell MEK. You are
shooting Aerothane so I know you have a forced air supply for breathing.
Hope this helps.
Vic
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message ----- From: "Lowell Fitt"
<lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 3:42 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
<lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Tomorrow or Friday latest, I plan on painting the trim colors on my
fuselage. It has been ten years since I did the deed and want to ask
for advice from those that have painted more recently and can remember.
I am using Aerothane in a home made paint booth.
1. Did you rotate the fuselage and only paint horizontal surfaces?
2 when did you pull the masking tape?
Thanks,
Lowell<br
y Browse, Chat, FAQ,
="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List"
target="_blank">http:====
http://forums.mle, List Admin.
====
--
Pat Reilly
Mod 3 582 Rebuild
Rockford,IL
http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-Listhttp://forums.matronics.com
http://www.matronics.com/contribution No virus found in this incoming
message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
14:33:00
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-----
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
03/18/10 07:33:00
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
Lynn,
You bring up a good point ....distraction. By talking with the farmer you
lost your train of thought and forgot to fasten the gas cap (lucky you found
it) I did a similar thing.
A friend of mine was talking to me when I had just replaced my spark plugs
and buttoning up the cowl. I taxied out to go flying and during the runup
had a bad mag check. I taxied back, removed the cowl, and there it was ! I
had reversed the #3 and #4 top spark plug wires.
I guess the moral of this story is if you are going to talk,finish what
you were doing first or stop working,talk and then resume when the distraction
is gone.
Dick Maddux
Fox 4
Milton,Fl
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Painting Question |
Pat, the propylene tape seemed to work ok. I put down blue masking
tape about 1/4" outside my intended paint line then laid the propylene
tape half on the masking tape and half on the surface being painted.
Next go around I will also shoot a little base color on the tape/surface
edge before painting the trim color. Sticking did not seem to be an
issue, but I agree, it's not very sticky. I did clean the surface very
well with my 50/50 IPA disti H20 mix right before applying.
..........now that I'm talking about it, I really miss building........
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message -----
From: Patrick Reilly
To: kitfox-list@matronics.com
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 6:43 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
Vic, Did you like that propylene tape? I tried it and went back to the
std masking tape. The plastic tape streched and didn't stick as well.
Pat Reilly
On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 10:05 AM, Vic Baker <vr_baker@nvbell.net>
wrote:
Lowell,
Using Polytone here. The blush retarder I use to slow drying
(improve gloss) makes paint prone to run unless great care is used. I
shot almost all paint (trim and main) onto horizontal surfaces.
(rotate part being painted) The spinner was especially interesting to
paint. After twice getting runs I built a little fixture to slowly
rotate while drying. For the trim I used propylene masking tape from
ACS, I pulled the tape shortly after one cross coat (perhaps no longer
than 5 minutes). Again - horizontal surfaces only - had no runs.
On the paint booth, I spent quite a bit of time trying to get it
right. Lighting, sealed motor exhaust fan, incoming air filters from a
"paint booth" supplier. I used a bunch of Lowes air filters (home
heating return duct filters) to filter to overspray out of the exhaust.
Finally, although I used a quality breathing mask, I discovered
when painting the blue trim that my beard was blue around where the mask
fit. It had been leaking all through the building process and I did not
notice it. Now, two years later, I still cannot smell MEK. You are
shooting Aerothane so I know you have a forced air supply for breathing.
Hope this helps.
Vic
Vic Baker
S7 912S Warp
Carson City, Nv
----- Original Message ----- From: "Lowell Fitt"
<lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 3:42 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
<lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
Tomorrow or Friday latest, I plan on painting the trim colors on
my fuselage. It has been ten years since I did the deed and want to ask
for advice from those that have painted more recently and can remember.
I am using Aerothane in a home made paint booth.
1. Did you rotate the fuselage and only paint horizontal
surfaces?
2 when did you pull the masking tape?
Thanks,
Lowell y Browse, Chat, FAQ,
="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List"
target="_blank">http:====
http://forums.mle, List Admin.
====
--
Pat Reilly
Mod 3 582 Rebuild
Rockford,IL
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Painting Question |
Thanks for the tips on painting. Actually my question was poorly phrased.
I am painting in Lemon Yellow which recommends a white primary coat. The
trim is white, so the primary coat will serve as the trim highlights and the
base color will be the final coat. In talking to a local that restored a
Stearman with Stits, I will be painting upright after yellow on the belly
only and fighting the runs with careful light coats as recommended. I am
looking forward for this part of the process to be completed.
Then it will jigging up the engine and fuselage for the assembly of an
engine mount. Just coming along.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Vic Baker" <vr_baker@nvbell.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 8:05 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
>
> Lowell,
>
> Using Polytone here. The blush retarder I use to slow drying (improve
> gloss) makes paint prone to run unless great care is used. I shot almost
> all paint (trim and main) onto horizontal surfaces. (rotate part being
> painted) The spinner was especially interesting to paint. After twice
> getting runs I built a little fixture to slowly rotate while drying. For
> the trim I used propylene masking tape from ACS, I pulled the tape
> shortly after one cross coat (perhaps no longer than 5 minutes).
> Again - horizontal surfaces only - had no runs.
>
> On the paint booth, I spent quite a bit of time trying to get it right.
> Lighting, sealed motor exhaust fan, incoming air filters from a "paint
> booth" supplier. I used a bunch of Lowes air filters (home heating
> return duct filters) to filter to overspray out of the exhaust.
>
> Finally, although I used a quality breathing mask, I discovered when
> painting the blue trim that my beard was blue around where the mask fit.
> It had been leaking all through the building process and I did not notice
> it. Now, two years later, I still cannot smell MEK. You are shooting
> Aerothane so I know you have a forced air supply for breathing.
>
> Hope this helps.
> Vic
>
>
> Vic Baker
> S7 912S Warp
> Carson City, Nv
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lowell Fitt" <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 3:42 PM
> Subject: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
>
>
>>
>> Tomorrow or Friday latest, I plan on painting the trim colors on my
>> fuselage. It has been ten years since I did the deed and want to ask for
>> advice from those that have painted more recently and can remember. I am
>> using Aerothane in a home made paint booth.
>>
>> 1. Did you rotate the fuselage and only paint horizontal surfaces?
>>
>> 2 when did you pull the masking tape?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Lowell
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Painting Question |
Thanks again for the tips.
I painted my first Model IV with Aerothane and it was in the upright
postion. I think Aeothane requires close attention to details. I have also
painted, in the past, with automotive urethanes as well as lacquers.
Lacquers are easy as they are color sanded and then buffed to the shine you
want. Automotive urethanes are syruppy thick, as I recall and level very
well and the coats can be a bit heavy without getting runs - a friends
motorcycle tank, colorcoat - clearcoat, somewhat like the spinner.
Aerothane needs several very thin coats and the wicking of the reducer into
previous coats allows for the leveling without too much risk of runs. The
two hour tape pull is what I recalled from the past and the pulling in the
direction of the latest coat also.
As a gun, I am using a turbine from Campbell Hausfield, I think from Home
Depot fifteen years ago. It looks like a piece of junk and probably is, by
comparison to the $1000 units, but it minimizes overspray and the coats
level very well. At something like $230 a gallon for yellow from ACS, I
really need to limit overspray. I am using a paint booth made from PVC pipe
and vinyl sheeting with flourescents positioned for lighting. It also has
an exhaust fan and inlet filters. It exhausts through a vent to the back
window. I appologized to the neighbor down wind and he said he liked the
smell, it smelled like progress to him. He flys a C-206 and restores
Harleys.
Thanks again all.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick Reilly" <patreilly43@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2010 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Painting Question
> Lowell, If your able to rotate and paint in the flat, it sure is easier. I
> did everything horizontal to avoid runs on vertical surfaces. The guys
> that
> paint everyday can paint vertical surfaces, but it is definitely harder.
> You
> might want to get The EAA "How to Paint Your Own Airplane" book. I used it
> as reference. It states to pull tape after about 2 hours. Pull the tape
> "into" the fresh paint. Also, do you know the proceedure of painting at
> the
> tape line with the underlying base color to seal the tape to prevent
> any bleed under the tape?
>
> Pat Reilly
> On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 6:42 PM, Lowell Fitt <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>>
>> Tomorrow or Friday latest, I plan on painting the trim colors on my
>> fuselage. It has been ten years since I did the deed and want to ask for
>> advice from those that have painted more recently and can remember. I am
>> using Aerothane in a home made paint booth.
>>
>> 1. Did you rotate the fuselage and only paint horizontal surfaces?
>>
>> 2 when did you pull the masking tape?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Lowell
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Pat Reilly
> Mod 3 582 Rebuild
> Rockford,IL
>
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
I too have experienced this, but with full fuel and a partially positioned
fuel cap like Deke describes. I think in the leg we flew - a flight of six
up from the Desert Fox fly-in years ago - I lost a full tank of fuel.
One further thought. I agree with Lynn about the reading of the sight guage
not being accurate in level flight and on the ground. I made a very
accurate card marking fuel gallons at both three point and in level flight.
At some point, the readings became the same. I don't recall the details as
that airplane is gone, but as I recall it was somwhere about mid capacity
that the geometry of the tank compensated for the tank angle.
Lowell
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Sent: Friday, March 19, 2010 3:20 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel situation
>
> You know what's strange about it....I was telling my neighbor about it,
> and he wondered why the fuel in the left tank didn't just spew out the
> open hole when I was banking the plane left to get the fuel to flow to
> the left rear corner of the right tank. The only thing I can think of is
> that the air blowing over the open hole sort of "sheared" over the hole
> and maybe prevented the.....what I would think would be...gushing of the
> fuel out of that open hole.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
> Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
> Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
> Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> Rotec TBI-40 injection
> Status: flying (and learning)
>
>
> On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:16 PM, fox5flyer wrote:
>
>>
>> Good report, Lynn. Similar situation happened to me, however I replaced
>> the cap, but didn't get both tangs locked under the lip which caused
>> what happened to you. Don't feel bad though. It's happened to many
>> others here on this list. Some have actually lost their cap in flight,
>> never to be found again.
>> It became one of my "check it twice" items.
>> Thanks for sharing.
>> Deke
>
>
>
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
Your point is good too, Dick....don't forget where you left off after
the distraction is gone. Jabiru came out with a bulletin on how to
torque the prop flange, after a guy answered he phone during doing
just that task. The bulletin said "Once you start this job, do not
answer the phone or otherwise get distracted until the job is finished."
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
On Mar 19, 2010, at 9:44 AM, Catz631@aol.com wrote:
> Lynn,
> You bring up a good point ....distraction. By talking with the
> farmer you lost your train of thought and forgot to fasten the gas
> cap (lucky you found it) I did a similar thing.
> A friend of mine was talking to me when I had just replaced my
> spark plugs and buttoning up the cowl. I taxied out to go flying
> and during the runup had a bad mag check. I taxied back, removed
> the cowl, and there it was ! I had reversed the #3 and #4 top spark
> plug wires.
> I guess the moral of this story is if you are going to talk,finish
> what you were doing first or stop working,talk and then resume when
> the distraction is gone.
> Dick Maddux
> Fox 4
> Milton,Fl
> www.matronics.com/contribution _-
> ===========================================================
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
I've seen that too, Lowell. With a certain amount of fuel onboard,
the tail-low reading will be faulty in the low direction. Level the
plane up and presto....you have more fuel than you thought. I've left
the ground with the readings on both tanks in the "red"...."no take-
off" zone. Took off anyway, or level the tail dragger, and the sight
gauges will show 4-5 gallons.
Which brings up a question.....somewhere in "How to fly a Kitfox" it
says something to the effect of "do not make long descents with a low
fuel situation in the Kitfox" and I'll be damned if I can find it
again, after I read it. (This point was driven home to me last year
going into Oshkosh, when my engine quit 20 feet after pulling off the
runway. Two minutes later, enough fuel had drizzled into the header
tank to start the engine, and taxi a half-mile to Homebuilt camping.)
I'd appreciate it anybody could find that warning, and let me know
what page it is on.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
On Mar 19, 2010, at 11:30 AM, Lowell Fitt wrote:
> <lcfitt@sbcglobal.net>
>
> I too have experienced this, but with full fuel and a partially
> positioned fuel cap like Deke describes. I think in the leg we
> flew - a flight of six up from the Desert Fox fly-in years ago - I
> lost a full tank of fuel.
>
> One further thought. I agree with Lynn about the reading of the
> sight guage not being accurate in level flight and on the ground.
> I made a very accurate card marking fuel gallons at both three
> point and in level flight. At some point, the readings became the
> same. I don't recall the details as that airplane is gone, but as
> I recall it was somwhere about mid capacity that the geometry of
> the tank compensated for the tank angle.
>
> Lowell
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lynn Matteson" <lynnmatt@jps.net>
> To: <kitfox-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 19, 2010 3:20 AM
> Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel situation
>
>
>>
>> You know what's strange about it....I was telling my neighbor
>> about it, and he wondered why the fuel in the left tank didn't
>> just spew out the open hole when I was banking the plane left to
>> get the fuel to flow to the left rear corner of the right tank.
>> The only thing I can think of is that the air blowing over the
>> open hole sort of "sheared" over the hole and maybe prevented
>> the.....what I would think would be...gushing of the fuel out of
>> that open hole.
>>
>> Lynn Matteson
>> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
>> Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
>> Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
>> Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
>> Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
>> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
>> Rotec TBI-40 injection
>> Status: flying (and learning)
>>
>>
>>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Fuel requirement for 532 |
A notable expert in 2-stroke engines was recently quoted has having said that non-ethanol
87 octane can be used in two-stroke Rotax engines. However, so far
the only written information I've found about it mentions the 447, 503, and 582;
the 532 is not mentioned.
I'd like to stop toting 92 octane to the airport in jerry cans when non-ethanol
87 octane auto fuel soon becomes available at my home airport. But I recently
reviewed my 532 engine manual for fuel specifications and found the basis for
my use of 92 octane fuel (premium) the 532. I've attached a copy of that page
to this post. It specifies 87 MON minimum and 96 RON minimum. Since the AKI rating
on American pumps is calculated as RON+MON/2, the fuel requirement for a
532 would be 91.5 AKI.
In other recent research, I learned that dual ignition engines tolerate somewhat
lower octane fuels than an identical engine with single ignition - the flame
front from two spark plugs burns the fuel faster in the chamber. My understanding
is that this prevents detonation that would be more likely to occur with
a single spark plug. That may or may not account for use of 87 in 582s when its
use in a 532 was put in writing. I don't know.
In any case, right now it seems that Im left with some conflicting information.
To use 87 AKI, prudence would call for some flight testing accompanied with frequent
internal engine inspection.
I'm not trying to start a fuel debate or an ethanol discussion war. I'm looking
for factual information from you guys who fly behind 532s and 582s related to
using non-ethanol 87 octane but who also keep track of the condition of their
pistons, plugs, and cylinders through inspection. I would appreciate hearing
from you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290946#290946
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/rotax_532_manual__fuel_specification_519.pdf
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
Lynn mattison asked:
> Which brings up a question.....somewhere in "How to fly a Kitfox" it
> says something to the effect of "do not make long descents with a low
> fuel situation in the Kitfox" and I'll be damned if I can find it
> again, after I read it. (This point was driven home to me last year
> going into Oshkosh, when my engine quit 20 feet after pulling off the
> runway. Two minutes later, enough fuel had drizzled into the header
> tank to start the engine, and taxi a half-mile to Homebuilt camping.)
>
> I'd appreciate it anybody could find that warning, and let me know
> what page it is on.
Managment of the fuel during descents is discussed near the end of this Service
letter.
http://www.kitfoxaircraft.com/support/service_letters/sl45.htm
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290945#290945
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel requirement for 532 |
We use ethanol gas Regular grade here in Canada. I have usually up to 10
Rotax power 2 stroke planes at my strip annualy wiht annual hours in the
thousands of hours. Everyone uses the same pump gas and so far not issues.
We have 503 532 and 582s currently that use regualr grade gas.
What I like now is importing Kitfoxs at 30% cheaper that 5 years ago with
the dollar at par. I can hardly wait till that 30% turns into 60% cheaper
as the US $ vaporizes :)
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "mikeperkins" <michael.perkins@rauland.com>
Sent: Friday, March 19, 2010 2:07 PM
Subject: Kitfox-List: Fuel requirement for 532
<michael.perkins@rauland.com>
A notable expert in 2-stroke engines was recently quoted has having said
that non-ethanol 87 octane can be used in two-stroke Rotax engines. However,
so far the only written information I've found about it mentions the 447,
503, and 582; the 532 is not mentioned.
I'd like to stop toting 92 octane to the airport in jerry cans when
non-ethanol 87 octane auto fuel soon becomes available at my home airport.
But I recently reviewed my 532 engine manual for fuel specifications and
found the basis for my use of 92 octane fuel (premium) the 532. I've
attached a copy of that page to this post. It specifies 87 MON minimum and
96 RON minimum. Since the AKI rating on American pumps is calculated as
RON+MON/2, the fuel requirement for a 532 would be 91.5 AKI.
In other recent research, I learned that dual ignition engines tolerate
somewhat lower octane fuels than an identical engine with single ignition -
the flame front from two spark plugs burns the fuel faster in the chamber.
My understanding is that this prevents detonation that would be more likely
to occur with a single spark plug. That may or may not account for use of 87
in 582s when its use in a 532 was put in writing. I don't know.
In any case, right now it seems that I?Tm left with some conflicting
information. To use 87 AKI, prudence would call for some flight testing
accompanied with frequent internal engine inspection.
I'm not trying to start a fuel debate or an ethanol discussion war. I'm
looking for factual information from you guys who fly behind 532s and 582s
related to using non-ethanol 87 octane but who also keep track of the
condition of their pistons, plugs, and cylinders through inspection. I would
appreciate hearing from you.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290946#290946
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/rotax_532_manual__fuel_specification_519.pdf
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
Thanks for pointing me in that direction, Tom.....good reading, but
not really what I was looking for. I was specifically looking for the
passage in the book "Kitfox pilot's Guide" by Earl S. Downs, and not
in "How to fly a Kitfox", as I previously requested (gettin' old is
hell). I own this book, and I saw that passage just a week or so ago,
and can't for the life of me find it again. I was hoping that someone
who has the book might have earmarked that page and could jump right
to it....and save me having to go through the book page by page
*again* just to find it. I know the drill by heart by now,
(descending in "stair-steps") having been through this same scenario
again and again....I just want to see *that* passage in *that* book
again...maybe just to prove to myself that I wasn't just imagining
things.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
do not archive
On Mar 19, 2010, at 2:07 PM, Tom Jones wrote:
>
> Lynn mattison asked:
>
>> Which brings up a question.....somewhere in "How to fly a Kitfox" it
>> says something to the effect of "do not make long descents with a low
>> fuel situation in the Kitfox" and I'll be damned if I can find it
>> again, after I read it. (This point was driven home to me last year
>> going into Oshkosh, when my engine quit 20 feet after pulling off the
>> runway. Two minutes later, enough fuel had drizzled into the header
>> tank to start the engine, and taxi a half-mile to Homebuilt camping.)
>>
>> I'd appreciate it anybody could find that warning, and let me know
>> what page it is on.
>
>
> Managment of the fuel during descents is discussed near the end of
> this Service letter.
> http://www.kitfoxaircraft.com/support/service_letters/sl45.htm
>
> --------
> Tom Jones
> Classic IV
> 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
> Ellensburg, WA
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290945#290945
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
Call off the dogs.....I found the passage I was looking for.....page
195 of "(The) Kitfox Pilot's Guide" continued onto p.196, under the
heading "Descent" item #4 "Avoid prolonged, steep descents if only
minimal useable fuel remains in tanks."
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
do not archive
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
Page 176
"4. Avoid prolonged, steep descents if only minimal unusable fuel remains in tanks."
There are some things that I have read that can't be found now too.
I read in Discovery magazine a while back that every time we pull a memory out
of our memory bank we have to re-remember it when we put it back in the memory
bank. Each time we do this we change it a little bit, then after awhile the
memory can change significantly from what actually happened. I think that's what
it said anyhow if I remember it correctly.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290964#290964
Message 21
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
I think your last post and mine collided in cyberspace and it knocked mine into
a time warp. It is posted an hour before I wrote it. do not archive.
--------
Tom Jones
Classic IV
503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
Ellensburg, WA
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290965#290965
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
Just for fun, Tom, re-check that page number....it's 196 in my book,
and is your clock set right (daylight savings time) on your computer?
A swell prize is being offered to the guy who posted it first, and I
think I won. : )
I could've sworn I saw that "Avoid...." in a body of text somewhere
in the book, but this was probably what I saw, and like Discovery
mentioned, I might have "changed it a little bit". It is this
changing of facts that prevents me from giving away good books when
I've read them....I always need to re-check some facts after time has
passed. : (
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
do not archive
On Mar 19, 2010, at 4:53 PM, Tom Jones wrote:
>
> Page 176
>
> "4. Avoid prolonged, steep descents if only minimal unusable fuel
> remains in tanks."
>
> There are some things that I have read that can't be found now too.
>
> I read in Discovery magazine a while back that every time we pull a
> memory out of our memory bank we have to re-remember it when we put
> it back in the memory bank. Each time we do this we change it a
> little bit, then after awhile the memory can change significantly
> from what actually happened. I think that's what it said anyhow if
> I remember it correctly.
>
> --------
> Tom Jones
> Classic IV
> 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
> Ellensburg, WA
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290964#290964
>
>
Message 23
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|
| Subject: | Re: Fuel situation |
And your reply got here before my comment did.....maybe Guy and Mike
are holding it for ransom. : ) do not archive
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062, 880.5 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
Countdown to 1000 hrs~120 to go(128 days to go)
Sensenich 62"x46" Wood (summer)
Sensenich 55.5" x 46" Wood (winter)
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying (and learning)
do not archive
On Mar 19, 2010, at 4:57 PM, Tom Jones wrote:
>
> I think your last post and mine collided in cyberspace and it
> knocked mine into a time warp. It is posted an hour before I wrote
> it. do not archive.
>
> --------
> Tom Jones
> Classic IV
> 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp
> Ellensburg, WA
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=290965#290965
>
>
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