---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sun 04/11/10: 9 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:10 AM - Re: Kit Fox N554KF has been sold (Catz631@aol.com) 2. 07:09 AM - Re: Airspeed indicator fail (again) (mikeperkins) 3. 07:54 AM - Re: Re: Airspeed indicator fail (again) (paul wilson) 4. 10:34 AM - Re: Airspeed indicator fail (again) (mikeperkins) 5. 03:44 PM - Fuel Pump IV-1200 w/ 582 (rawheels) 6. 04:24 PM - Re: Fuel Pump IV-1200 w/ 582 (Dave Fisher) 7. 05:34 PM - Re: Fuel Pump IV-1200 w/ 582 (fox5flyer) 8. 05:35 PM - heat shield (CLEMWEHNER) 9. 06:18 PM - Re: heat shield (vetdrem) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:10:26 AM PST US From: Catz631@aol.com Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Kit Fox N554KF has been sold Steve, I am sorry to see you go but I surely understand. This economy has been a bitch to a lot of people! I wish you had been in this area (NW Florida) The economy is no better but you wouldn't of had a problem with condition inspections,tailwheel instruction,etc. This area is very friendly when it comes to experimentals/LSA airplanes. Out of 14 residents on our airpark 4 are AI's,3 A&P's and 3 CFI's (including me) And we have a grass strip. You would fit right in. Tell the purchaser of your aircraft to hop right into this forum. There is a wealth of good information. I know I look forward to my morning coffee and the Kitfox/Rotax list (once in a while I will venture into the Aeroelectric list but it's mostly too hairy for me....God lives in the electrical system !) Best of luck to you Steve and stay flying! Dick Maddux Fox 4 Milton,Fl ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:09:54 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Airspeed indicator fail (again) From: "mikeperkins" Pat, I've torn my house apart looking for a page from an ancient Kitplanes magazine that I used to make my manometer. I think Kitplanes allows archival searches, and I'll go look there in the next couple of days. It's just two water columns in U-shaped tubing that measures pressure that you add by rolling up some surgical hose connected to one of the two columns. Tinting the water with a little dye helps a lot. I chose to take the ASI out of the airplane because I wanted to compare two ASIs at the same time. But a perfectly-sealed pitot system won't leakdown, so it should be possible to test it on the airplane, too. When I find it, I'll attach a copy of the Kitplanes article in a posting. In the mean time, you can review Jim Weir's article on the same topic, but his article is not as easy to follow: http://www.rstengineering.com/rst/articles/KP89JUL.pdf Neither of the articles express the following point very well: the given water displacement is the DIFFERENCE between the two columns of water, not the distance above where the column was when it was at rest. In other words, when you mark the manometer from a fixed 0 point, you have to divide the given displacement numbers by two (because the water goes up in one column and equally down in the other column). Mike Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293834#293834 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:54:23 AM PST US From: paul wilson Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: Airspeed indicator fail (again) The water manometer method has been debunked over and over. It will not yield accurate result unless you are a sea level on a standard atmospheric day. Last time I challenged the EAA article . The EAA tech person agreed . A waste of time to build a manometer. They even sent me a link that proved what I thought was always the case. Keep searching on Google and you will find the link. Just send your meter to a meter company and get it calibrated. Any thermodynamics engineering grad should be able to generate the formulas. Paul ======================= At 08:09 AM 4/11/2010, you wrote: > >Pat, > >I've torn my house apart looking for a page from an ancient >Kitplanes magazine that I used to make my manometer. I think >Kitplanes allows archival searches, and I'll go look there in the >next couple of days. > >It's just two water columns in U-shaped tubing that measures >pressure that you add by rolling up some surgical hose connected to >one of the two columns. Tinting the water with a little dye helps a >lot. I chose to take the ASI out of the airplane because I wanted to >compare two ASIs at the same time. But a perfectly-sealed pitot >system won't leakdown, so it should be possible to test it on the >airplane, too. > >When I find it, I'll attach a copy of the Kitplanes article in a >posting. In the mean time, you can review Jim Weir's article on the >same topic, but his article is not as easy to follow: >http://www.rstengineering.com/rst/articles/KP89JUL.pdf > >Neither of the articles express the following point very well: the >given water displacement is the DIFFERENCE between the two columns >of water, not the distance above where the column was when it was at >rest. In other words, when you mark the manometer from a fixed 0 >point, you have to divide the given displacement numbers by two >(because the water goes up in one column and equally down in the >other column). > >Mike ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 10:34:55 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Airspeed indicator fail (again) From: "mikeperkins" Thanks for bringing that up, Paul. As a TC, I enjoy refining what I know and spreading correct information. You're quite correct about not being able to use a fixed scale on a water manometer. But a water manometer can indeed yield accurate results if density altitude equations are applied. The equations are the same ones used to find TAS. Here's a website that will do all the math for you. Just enter the manometer reading (in inches) plus the existing conditions (temp, baro, altitude, dew pt); it instantly gives you the true airspeed. http://chrusion.com/BJ7/ASICalc.html Or you can premark the manometer scale. Just enter the airspeeds you want to measure; it gives you the manometer markings in inches. . . . . And if you scroll down from the calculation section, there are some simplified plans. I wouldn't want to mess with an ASI in an attempt to calibrate it. But I also think that checking an ASI for accuracy can be a part of being "Experimental." Thanks again, Paul. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293861#293861 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 03:44:18 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Fuel Pump IV-1200 w/ 582 From: "rawheels" How many people have had issues with the mikuni pulse/vacuum fuel pumps not having enough power to pull fuel from the header tank at full RPM? And, do a lot of people have an electric pump for take-off/back-up purposes? I've been trying to diagnose a fuel flow problem; My engine would stumble after a few moments when at full RPM, but seemed fine at other settings. I have found out that the fuel pump will work fine if you have a gas can plugged in close to the engine, but it just doesn't have quite enough power to pull fuel all the way from the header tank @ above 6000 RPM. I tried temporarily installing an electric fuel pump, and the engine worked great. The mikuni pump is fairly new, but I understand it could be the culprit. However, it is a good distance to the header tank, so other than the extra safety, it seems like an electric pump may be warranted to help the vacuum style. -------- Ryan Wheeler Kitfox IV-1200 Indianapolis, IN Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293884#293884 ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:24:05 PM PST US From: "Dave Fisher" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel Pump IV-1200 w/ 582 Should be not an issue. make sure you got the correct impulse line for fuel pump and it secured tightly and WITHOUT gear clamps. Tie down run wide open for 3 mins after doing and fuel system testing. ----- Original Message ----- From: "rawheels" Sent: Sunday, April 11, 2010 6:43 PM Subject: Kitfox-List: Fuel Pump IV-1200 w/ 582 > > How many people have had issues with the mikuni pulse/vacuum fuel pumps > not having enough power to pull fuel from the header tank at full RPM? > And, do a lot of people have an electric pump for take-off/back-up > purposes? > > I've been trying to diagnose a fuel flow problem; My engine would stumble > after a few moments when at full RPM, but seemed fine at other settings. > I have found out that the fuel pump will work fine if you have a gas can > plugged in close to the engine, but it just doesn't have quite enough > power to pull fuel all the way from the header tank @ above 6000 RPM. I > tried temporarily installing an electric fuel pump, and the engine worked > great. The mikuni pump is fairly new, but I understand it could be the > culprit. However, it is a good distance to the header tank, so other than > the extra safety, it seems like an electric pump may be warranted to help > the vacuum style. > > -------- > Ryan Wheeler > Kitfox IV-1200 > Indianapolis, IN > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293884#293884 > > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:34:29 PM PST US From: "fox5flyer" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Fuel Pump IV-1200 w/ 582 Mike, it sounds like you have a "too soft" pulse line, too long, or maybe a little of both. I believe that it should be no longer than 12" and be made of a material that won't expand and absorb the pulses. Rubber fuel injection hose works pretty well. Are you running a 582? If so, the Mikuni should pump adequately if the pulses are getting to the pump. Deke > > How many people have had issues with the mikuni pulse/vacuum fuel pumps > not having enough power to pull fuel from the header tank at full RPM? > And, do a lot of people have an electric pump for take-off/back-up > purposes? > > I've been trying to diagnose a fuel flow problem; My engine would stumble > after a few moments when at full RPM, but seemed fine at other settings. > I have found out that the fuel pump will work fine if you have a gas can > plugged in close to the engine, but it just doesn't have quite enough > power to pull fuel all the way from the header tank @ above 6000 RPM. I > tried temporarily installing an electric fuel pump, and the engine worked > great. The mikuni pump is fairly new, but I understand it could be the > culprit. However, it is a good distance to the header tank, so other than > the extra safety, it seems like an electric pump may be warranted to help > the vacuum style. > > -------- > Ryan Wheeler > Kitfox IV-1200 > Indianapolis, IN > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293884#293884 > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:35:55 PM PST US From: "CLEMWEHNER" Subject: Kitfox-List: heat shield Do we need to make a thin aluminum heat shield to protect the firewall blanket from the muffler heat on a 912 installation in a model IV? If so, how much of the lower firewall does it need to cover? thanks for the help, Clem Oklahoma KFIV, 912 ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:18:40 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: heat shield From: "vetdrem" I have a model III with a 912, and have about 200 hours on it. I noticed that the blanket was getting a little discolored behind the exhaust, and it started getting brittle. I decided to do exactly what you asked about. I cut and shaped some aluminum to cover the blanket right behind the exhaust. The only places that needed it on my installation was for the exhaust lines from the back cylinders to the muffler. I don't know if it is really needed or not, but I don't get as many questions from friends looking things over, and besides, it makes me feel better. Louie Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=293898#293898 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kitfox-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.