Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:19 AM - AVGAS /mogas (eric hendriks)
2. 03:39 AM - Re: airframe grounding (Lynn Matteson)
3. 06:12 AM - Re: new old topic windshield fitting (PMorel)
4. 06:57 AM - Re: airframe grounding (Lynn Matteson)
5. 08:14 AM - Re: airframe grounding (KITFOXZ@aol.com)
6. 05:07 PM - Kitfox crash Glendale, AZ (Pete Christensen)
7. 05:12 PM - Re: airframe grounding (Noel R.C. Loveys)
8. 05:21 PM - Re: AVGAS /mogas (Roger Lee)
9. 05:23 PM - Re: airframe grounding (Noel R.C. Loveys)
10. 05:34 PM - Re: airframe grounding (Noel R.C. Loveys)
Message 1
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Hello
I can buy a Rotax 912 A2 who has 423 hr in 12 years.
The engine has always been run on avgas.
Can i switch without problems to Mogas because on my airfield there is no avgas
available ?
Thank You
Eric hendriks
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=324887#324887
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: airframe grounding |
I don't like that practice....I feel the engine mount bolts should do
JUST that, with nothing else between the bolt and the mount/airframe.
Running the wires directly to the battery or to where the ground
cable connects to the engine is a better procedure, in my estimation.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062
Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
do not archive
On Dec 28, 2010, at 6:35 PM, bob noffs wrote:
> hi all, i was visiting a friend who bought a ''second hand
> ''kitfox. i noticed that on at least 2 engine mount to airframe
> bolts there was an elect. ring terminal on the bolt . terminals
> were to ground all to the battrey. is this recommended/accepted
> practice with engine mount bolts?
> bob noffs
> ===========================================================
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: new old topic windshield fitting |
I also used heat and cargo tie down strap to help contour the windshield during
my build.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=324906#324906
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/dsc04526_284.jpg
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: airframe grounding |
Maybe I ought to give a reason for why I feel as I do...if the
terminal that you are putting under a bolt/nut is copper, it stands
to reason that the copper is soft, and under vibration will squash,
and this leaves the bolt/nut with less tension than when first
installed. Maybe if the bolt/nut were topped off with the terminal
and then another nut that holds the terminal in place would be
acceptable. Has anybody thought of looking in AC43.13 to see the
"acceptable methods"?
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062
Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
On Dec 29, 2010, at 6:37 AM, Lynn Matteson wrote:
>
> I don't like that practice....I feel the engine mount bolts should
> do JUST that, with nothing else between the bolt and the mount/
> airframe. Running the wires directly to the battery or to where the
> ground cable connects to the engine is a better procedure, in my
> estimation.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062
> Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> Rotec TBI-40 injection
> Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
> do not archive
>
>
> On Dec 28, 2010, at 6:35 PM, bob noffs wrote:
>
>> hi all, i was visiting a friend who bought a ''second hand
>> ''kitfox. i noticed that on at least 2 engine mount to airframe
>> bolts there was an elect. ring terminal on the bolt . terminals
>> were to ground all to the battrey. is this recommended/accepted
>> practice with engine mount bolts?
>> bob noffs
>> ===========================================================
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: airframe grounding |
As an avionics technician I have to say that you should always strive to
make electrical connections clean, dry, tight and separate from any other
mechanical purpose. Any engine/airframe bolt or fastener should be for that
mechanical purpose only and not shared as an electrical connection.
If four engine bolts hold the engine to the engine mount, that should be
their only purpose. A separate grounding bolt should be connected to the
engine block for the purpose of connecting a grounding ring terminal. This
grounding connection is, among other things, the electrical current path for
the negative side of the battery/starter circuit. -A high current
connection. You want it to be infallible.
The theory is that an engine mount bolt is there to hold the engine to
it's mount. It is a "working" bolt. It is doing an important job of flexing
and holding a working member of the aircraft. Although small, this working
(flexing) will eventually cause undue wear and tear (corrosion) at the
electrical connection if it is a shared connection.
While I am preaching: Additional strain relief of electrical connections
is desirable too. You don't want to allow your precious engine block
grounding wire ring terminal to be tugged on and flexed while in use. Secure
the ring terminal to it's engine block bolt and then protect it from ever
seeing any mechanical loads by securing the cable to the engine block via wire
tie downs, etc.
John
Columbus, Ohio
Outback, 912S, building
In a message dated 12/29/2010 9:58:31 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
lynnmatt@jps.net writes:
--> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
Maybe I ought to give a reason for why I feel as I do...if the
terminal that you are putting under a bolt/nut is copper, it stands
to reason that the copper is soft, and under vibration will squash,
and this leaves the bolt/nut with less tension than when first
installed. Maybe if the bolt/nut were topped off with the terminal
and then another nut that holds the terminal in place would be
acceptable. Has anybody thought of looking in AC43.13 to see the
"acceptable methods"?
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062
Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
On Dec 29, 2010, at 6:37 AM, Lynn Matteson wrote:
> --> Kitfox-List message posted by: Lynn Matteson <lynnmatt@jps.net>
>
> I don't like that practice....I feel the engine mount bolts should
> do JUST that, with nothing else between the bolt and the mount/
> airframe. Running the wires directly to the battery or to where the
> ground cable connects to the engine is a better procedure, in my
> estimation.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062
> Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> Rotec TBI-40 injection
> Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
> do not archive
>
>
> On Dec 28, 2010, at 6:35 PM, bob noffs wrote:
>
>> hi all, i was visiting a friend who bought a ''second hand
>> ''kitfox. i noticed that on at least 2 engine mount to airframe
>> bolts there was an elect. ring terminal on the bolt . terminals
>> were to ground all to the battrey. is this recommended/accepted
>> practice with engine mount bolts?
>> bob noffs
>> ===========================================================
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Kitfox crash Glendale, AZ |
Looks like the pilot is ok.
http://www.azcentral.com/community/glendale/articles/2010/12/23/20101223glendale-plane-crash-abrk.html
Pete
Kitfox III, 912
Leander, TX
Message 7
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| Subject: | airframe grounding |
I'm in agreement with Lynn on this one... I think the jumper (Ground braid)
should connect the base of the engine to a solid ground buss on the frame
not to an engine mount where possible electrically induced corrosion can
become an issue.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Sent: December 29, 2010 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: airframe grounding
I don't like that practice....I feel the engine mount bolts should do
JUST that, with nothing else between the bolt and the mount/airframe.
Running the wires directly to the battery or to where the ground
cable connects to the engine is a better procedure, in my estimation.
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062
Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
do not archive
On Dec 28, 2010, at 6:35 PM, bob noffs wrote:
> hi all, i was visiting a friend who bought a ''second hand
> ''kitfox. i noticed that on at least 2 engine mount to airframe
> bolts there was an elect. ring terminal on the bolt . terminals
> were to ground all to the battrey. is this recommended/accepted
> practice with engine mount bolts?
> bob noffs
> ===========================================================
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: AVGAS /mogas |
Hi Eric,
Absolutely you can change and it will be for the better. If you are going to buy
a 12 yr. old engine just peruse through the SB's for Rotax and make sure your
up to date.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Light Sport Repairman - Maintenance Rated
Rotax Repair Center
Home 520-574-1080 TRY HOME FIRST
Cell 520-349-7056
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=324967#324967
Message 9
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| Subject: | airframe grounding |
Lynn: the copper in the ring against the 4130 steel of the washer and bolts
is a good place for dissimilar metal corrosion to start... I never
considered the softness of the ring mostly because it is backed by the
rubber elastometric mounting pads which are even softer. I should have
considered that to.
Noel
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Lynn Matteson
Sent: December 29, 2010 11:25 AM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: airframe grounding
Maybe I ought to give a reason for why I feel as I do...if the
terminal that you are putting under a bolt/nut is copper, it stands
to reason that the copper is soft, and under vibration will squash,
and this leaves the bolt/nut with less tension than when first
installed. Maybe if the bolt/nut were topped off with the terminal
and then another nut that holds the terminal in place would be
acceptable. Has anybody thought of looking in AC43.13 to see the
"acceptable methods"?
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062
Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
On Dec 29, 2010, at 6:37 AM, Lynn Matteson wrote:
>
> I don't like that practice....I feel the engine mount bolts should
> do JUST that, with nothing else between the bolt and the mount/
> airframe. Running the wires directly to the battery or to where the
> ground cable connects to the engine is a better procedure, in my
> estimation.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062
> Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> Rotec TBI-40 injection
> Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
> do not archive
>
>
> On Dec 28, 2010, at 6:35 PM, bob noffs wrote:
>
>> hi all, i was visiting a friend who bought a ''second hand
>> ''kitfox. i noticed that on at least 2 engine mount to airframe
>> bolts there was an elect. ring terminal on the bolt . terminals
>> were to ground all to the battrey. is this recommended/accepted
>> practice with engine mount bolts?
>> bob noffs
>> ===========================================================
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | airframe grounding |
Having received my share of slices from unfinished nylon ties under the
cowls of aircraft I am left with two words. Cora Seal... learn how to use
it!
Noel
From: owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kitfox-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of KITFOXZ@aol.com
Sent: December 29, 2010 12:40 PM
Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: airframe grounding
As an avionics technician I have to say that you should always strive to
make electrical connections clean, dry, tight and separate from any other
mechanical purpose. Any engine/airframe bolt or fastener should be for that
mechanical purpose only and not shared as an electrical connection.
If four engine bolts hold the engine to the engine mount, that should be
their only purpose. A separate grounding bolt should be connected to the
engine block for the purpose of connecting a grounding ring terminal. This
grounding connection is, among other things, the electrical current path for
the negative side of the battery/starter circuit. -A high current
connection. You want it to be infallible.
The theory is that an engine mount bolt is there to hold the engine to it's
mount. It is a "working" bolt. It is doing an important job of flexing and
holding a working member of the aircraft. Although small, this working
(flexing) will eventually cause undue wear and tear (corrosion) at the
electrical connection if it is a shared connection.
While I am preaching: Additional strain relief of electrical connections is
desirable too. You don't want to allow your precious engine block grounding
wire ring terminal to be tugged on and flexed while in use. Secure the ring
terminal to it's engine block bolt and then protect it from ever seeing any
mechanical loads by securing the cable to the engine block via wire tie
downs, etc.
John
Columbus, Ohio
Outback, 912S, building
In a message dated 12/29/2010 9:58:31 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
lynnmatt@jps.net writes:
Maybe I ought to give a reason for why I feel as I do...if the
terminal that you are putting under a bolt/nut is copper, it stands
to reason that the copper is soft, and under vibration will squash,
and this leaves the bolt/nut with less tension than when first
installed. Maybe if the bolt/nut were topped off with the terminal
and then another nut that holds the terminal in place would be
acceptable. Has anybody thought of looking in AC43.13 to see the
"acceptable methods"?
Lynn Matteson
Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
Jabiru 2200, #2062
Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
Electroair direct-fire ignition system
Rotec TBI-40 injection
Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
On Dec 29, 2010, at 6:37 AM, Lynn Matteson wrote:
>
> I don't like that practice....I feel the engine mount bolts should
> do JUST that, with nothing else between the bolt and the mount/
> airframe. Running the wires directly to the battery or to where the
> ground cable connects to the engine is a better procedure, in my
> estimation.
>
> Lynn Matteson
> Kitfox IV Speedster, taildragger
> Jabiru 2200, #2062
> Sensenich 62"x 55.5 Wood (winter) until the Prince prop arrives
> Electroair direct-fire ignition system
> Rotec TBI-40 injection
> Status: flying...1074 hrs (since 3-27-2006)
> do not archive
>
>
> On Dec 28, 2010, at 6:35 PM, bob noffs wrote:
>
>> hi all, i was visiting a friend who bought a ''second hand
>> ''kitfox. i noticed that on at least 2 engine mount to airframe
>> bolts there was an elect. ring terminal on the bolt . terminals
>> were to ground all to the battrey. is this recommended/accepted
>> practice with engine mount bolts?
>> bob noffs
>> ===========================================================
>
>
&g========================; nbsp; (And Get Some AWESOME FREE to
find Gifts ilder's ELP b k you for p; -Matt Dralle,
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