---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 05/10/11: 19 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:33 AM - MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE (lane taylor) 2. 06:50 AM - Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE (Tom Jones) 3. 07:24 AM - Re: landing rpm (Patrick Reilly) 4. 07:56 AM - Re: landing rpm (kerrjohna@comcast.net) 5. 08:02 AM - Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE (Guy Buchanan) 6. 08:34 AM - Brake sticks (peteohms) 7. 09:27 AM - Re: Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE (lane taylor) 8. 09:27 AM - Re: Brake sticks (bjones@dmv.com) 9. 09:27 AM - Re: Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE (lane taylor) 10. 10:35 AM - Re: Brake sticks (sourdostan@aol.com) 11. 11:56 AM - Re: landing rpm (Patrick Reilly) 12. 12:14 PM - Re: Brake sticks (Patrick Reilly) 13. 12:59 PM - Re: landing rpm (kerrjohna@comcast.net) 14. 01:37 PM - On Austin Craigs list (Pete Christensen) 15. 02:30 PM - Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE (lane taylor) 16. 03:34 PM - Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE (Dave Fisher) 17. 04:12 PM - Flapperons (Patrick Reilly) 18. 04:22 PM - Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE (Guy Buchanan) 19. 04:23 PM - Mod for strech (Patrick Reilly) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:33:39 AM PST US From: "lane taylor" Subject: Kitfox-List: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE I have a Model IV-1200 with 21 hrs TT; eng/airframe with a 68" GSC GA wood prop. I'm not seeing the performance from the 618 that I expected. I been all over the pitch and static RPM relationship in an attempt to find best climb/speed. Presently, I'm pitched at 14 degrees using the GSC tool provided; showing 6400 RPM static; full throttle flight RPM of 6800 at 82 MPH; at 6000 RPM (cruise), I'm showing 74 MPH; full power climb of 600 ftmin. The plane is OEM except for grove gear with an empty weight of 623lbs. The plane responds very well without any glaring drag issues. EGT's 1120; plugs look great; jetting per the manual. I'm the builder. Any feedback would be much appreciated. Perhaps it is what it is, but I expected more speed and better climb. Lane N356RL KOSC ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:50:56 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE From: "Tom Jones" Lane, there have been a couple times over the years I can remember a performance issue like you are having. The problem was that the tachometer was faulty. have you checked the RPM with an optical tach? Another way to cross check is to install a Tiny Tach. http://www.buycheapr.com/us/result.jsp?ga=us12&q=tiny+tachometer -------- Tom Jones Classic IV 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp Ellensburg, WA Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339420#339420 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:24:12 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: landing rpm From: Patrick Reilly Ed, Thanks for info. My problem, I believe has been pulling stick back too soon and relaunching. I have been negligent in the past about pulling stic k all the way back and am over compensating. Pat Reilly On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 11:19 PM, Ed Gray wrote: > I don=92t get the difficulty with rpms while landing. I stay at 2500 on > final and the prop seems to be producing drag, since I can plop on the fi rst > 100 feet of runway. If flaring too high, try wheel landings for a while. > Just fly it onto the ground and keep the tail up until almost to the turn off > with about 2800 rpm. The Fox makes great wheelies and you can see where you > are going-just keep that stick forward and easy on the brakes. Comments? > > > PS. I am about 2 months from completion of my Lancair 360 and waiting fo r > my Viking (Honda) for the Kitfox 4 in the carshed. ONE FOR SLOW AND ONE FOR > GO. > > > Ed Gray K2 582 GSC Dallas > > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > > -- Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuild Rockford,IL ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:56:09 AM PST US From: kerrjohna@comcast.net Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: landing rpm Frequently in the past, difficulty in landing has been traced back to appro ach speed.=C2- Using the recommended 1.3 x stall speed in the pattern wil l yield improved landings.=C2- Last year, prompted by this discussion I f lew final at 50mph ASI @ 2000 rpm and the stick held firmly in position unt il touch down.=C2- There was no float just a solid arrival.=C2- Using a slight amount of flair generates a greased landing with ~200 feet roll out . Since adding the VG's last month I have been practicing really slow landing s at idle with full 20 degree flaps and the plane is touching down at less than 40 ASI and so gently there is no chance of spinning off the valve stem s as alluded to in another thread.=C2- 20 degrees flaps does provide incr eased adverse yaw and therefore opportunities to improve airmanship. AOPA has a video out entitled Ups and Downs where in the chronical the prob lems of too fast approaches and too slow take offs. John Kerr ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick Reilly" Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 8:20:37 AM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: landing rpm Ed, Thanks for info. My problem, I believe has been pulling stick back too soon and relaunching. I=C2-have been negligent in the past=C2- about pu lling stick all the way back and am over compensating. Pat Reilly=C2- On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 11:19 PM, Ed Gray < egraylaw@swbell.net > wrote: I don=99t get the difficulty with rpms while landing.=C2- I stay at 2500 on final and the prop seems to be producing drag, since I can plop on the first 100 feet of runway.=C2- If flaring too high, try wheel landing s for a while.=C2- Just fly it onto the ground and keep the tail up until almost to the turnoff with about 2800 rpm.=C2- The Fox makes great wheel ies and you can see where you are going-just keep that stick forward and ea sy on the brakes.=C2- Comments? PS.=C2- I am about 2 months from completion of my Lancair 360 and waiting for my Viking (Honda) for the Kitfox 4 in the carshed.=C2- ONE FOR SLOW AND ONE FOR GO. Ed Gray K2 582 GSC Dallas arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigat or?Kitfox-List ttp://forums.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/ contribution -- Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuild Rockford,IL == ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:02:56 AM PST US From: Guy Buchanan Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE On 5/10/2011 3:31 AM, lane taylor wrote: > The plane responds very well without any glaring drag issues. EGT's > 1120; plugs look great; jetting per the manual. I'm the builder. Any > feedback would be much appreciated. Perhaps it is what it is, but I > expected more speed and better climb. Lane, The key here is that the plane "responds well". Sounds like it's working better than your measurements would indicate. So, as Tom already said, the first things to check are your measurements: * Tach with an model airplane optical tach. * ASI with a set of accurate, no wing, GPS runs. * Measure OAT while making the ASI runs to make sure your density altitude is reasonable. * Make time to climb measurements to verify the VSI. One trick I learned while doing this was to get the aircraft in a stable climb, take a picture of the panel with the GPS showing time, then wait a while and take another picture. Get back to base and use the pictures to figure out the rate of climb based on the change in time on the GPS and the change in altitude. Next I have some questions: * What's your gearbox ratio? * How many blades on the prop? * Are the EGT's full throttle? * Is this a single plug head? * Is this a round cowl? * What has been faired? Possible options include: o Wing struts o Jury struts o Radiator o Horizontal stab struts o Vertical / horizontal junction o Gaps on vertical and horizontal * What kind of wing tips are you running? (A picture might answer a lot of these.) * What's your radiator installation look like? Your speeds are low, as my 582 powered IV will top out at 110 mph at 6800 rpm. However I've been told my 582 is "fast" for what it's worth. It has everything faired but the radiator. I understand that "dirty" IV's are much slower. (I've heard 15%, or 15mph for the wing struts alone.) Enough for now. Guy Buchanan Ramona, CA Kitfox IV-1200 / 592-C / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:34:30 AM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Brake sticks From: "peteohms" I have a bit of a problem with a sticking brake on My Ktfox III. When I taxi for a long distance my left brake drags and eventually binds up. I am careful not to apply any brake and this still happens. Any ideas?? -------- Pete Leander, TX Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339433#339433 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:27:12 AM PST US From: "lane taylor" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Jones" Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 9:48 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE > > Lane, there have been a couple times over the years I can remember a > performance issue like you are having. The problem was that the > tachometer was faulty. have you checked the RPM with an optical tach? > Another way to cross check is to install a Tiny Tach. > http://www.buycheapr.com/us/result.jsp?ga=us12&q=tiny+tachometer > > -------- > Tom Jones > Classic IV > 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp > Ellensburg, WA > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339420#339420 > > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:27:15 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Brake sticks From: bjones@dmv.com If the brakes are mid to early 1990 Matcos, Make sure brake pedal(s) return completely back to thier stops after applying brakes at any point. My Matco copilot side brake pedals did not always fully return after being depressed and as pads and rotors warm up, and things expand, braking occured. Matco has provided good technical help when I have called them by the way. > > > I have a bit of a problem with a sticking brake on My Ktfox III. When I > taxi for a long distance my left brake drags and eventually binds up. I > am careful not to apply any brake and this still happens. Any ideas?? > > -------- > Pete > Leander, TX > Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339433#339433 > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:27:43 AM PST US From: "lane taylor" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE Miss fire. I'll check out the tach. Deke's been suggesting the same... Thanks Tom ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Jones" Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 9:48 AM Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE > > Lane, there have been a couple times over the years I can remember a > performance issue like you are having. The problem was that the > tachometer was faulty. have you checked the RPM with an optical tach? > Another way to cross check is to install a Tiny Tach. > http://www.buycheapr.com/us/result.jsp?ga=us12&q=tiny+tachometer > > -------- > Tom Jones > Classic IV > 503 Rotax, 72 inch Two blade Warp > Ellensburg, WA > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339420#339420 > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 10:35:35 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Brake sticks From: sourdostan@aol.com If I recall correctly, there was a similar problem in the mid-nineties, an d Matco sent out a kit to rectify the problem. Seems like the kit included a couple of sleeves/bushings to solve the problem. Stan Specht Lakewood, CO Kitfox IV Speedster 912 ul 1750+ hours -----Original Message----- From: peteohms Sent: Tue, May 10, 2011 9:31 am Subject: Kitfox-List: Brake sticks .net> I have a bit of a problem with a sticking brake on My Ktfox III. When I taxi for a long distance my left brake drags and eventually binds up. I am car eful not to apply any brake and this still happens. Any ideas?? -------- Pete Leander, TX Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339433#339433 ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ======================== =========== ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:56:57 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: landing rpm From: Patrick Reilly John, I am approaching at 60 and have planning on slowing it down to 50. Thanks. Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rwbuilt Rockford, IL On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 9:53 AM, wrote: > Frequently in the past, difficulty in landing has been traced back to > approach speed. Using the recommended 1.3 x stall speed in the pattern w ill > yield improved landings. Last year, prompted by this discussion I flew > final at 50mph ASI @ 2000 rpm and the stick held firmly in position until > touch down. There was no float just a solid arrival. Using a slight amo unt > of flair generates a greased landing with ~200 feet roll out. > > > Since adding the VG's last month I have been practicing really slow > landings at idle with full 20 degree flaps and the plane is touching down at > less than 40 ASI and so gently there is no chance of spinning off the val ve > stems as alluded to in another thread. 20 degrees flaps does provide > increased adverse yaw and therefore opportunities to improve airmanship. > > > AOPA has a video out entitled Ups and Downs where in the chronical the > problems of too fast approaches and too slow take offs. > > > John Kerr > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Patrick Reilly" > To: kitfox-list@matronics.com > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 8:20:37 AM > Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: landing rpm > > Ed, Thanks for info. My problem, I believe has been pulling stick back > too soon and relaunching. I have been negligent in the past about pullin g > stick all the way back and am over compensating. > > Pat Reilly > > On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 11:19 PM, Ed Gray wrote: > >> I don=92t get the difficulty with rpms while landing. I stay at 2500 on >> final and the prop seems to be producing drag, since I can plop on the f irst >> 100 feet of runway. If flaring too high, try wheel landings for a while .. >> Just fly it onto the ground and keep the tail up until almost to the tur noff >> with about 2800 rpm. The Fox makes great wheelies and you can see where you >> are going-just keep that stick forward and easy on the brakes. Comments ? >> >> >> >> PS. I am about 2 months from completion of my Lancair 360 and waiting f or >> my Viking (Honda) for the Kitfox 4 in the carshed. ONE FOR SLOW AND ONE FOR >> GO. >> >> >> >> Ed Gray K2 582 GSC Dallas >> >> * >> >> arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List >> ttp://forums.matronics.com >> _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution >> * >> >> > > > -- > Pat Reilly > Mod 3 582 Rebuild > Rockford,IL > > * > > arget=_blank>http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List > p://forums.matronics.com > blank>http://www.matronics.com/contribution > * > > * > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > > -- Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuild Rockford,IL ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:14:46 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: Brake sticks From: Patrick Reilly Pete, I had a brake sticking. I called Matco. The tech rep said bleed back to relieve pressure was not happening, could be 1 of 2 things. Either a piece of a rubbber snubber in the master cyl was broken off and blocking the bleed back port or a pedal was not returning completely. In my case there was a linkage bind at very top of stroke. The rod was not completely returning, maybe it was only 1/16 of an inch. Yet it still not relieving pressure. Matco is very good on the phone at helping. But, I will bet one of your pedals is not quite fully returning. Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuilt Rockford, IL On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 10:31 AM, peteohms wrote: > apeterchristensen@sbcglobal.net> > > I have a bit of a problem with a sticking brake on My Ktfox III. When I > taxi for a long distance my left brake drags and eventually binds up. I am > careful not to apply any brake and this still happens. Any ideas?? > > -------- > Pete > Leander, TX > Kitfox III, 912ul, Grove > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=339433#339433 > > -- Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuild Rockford,IL ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 12:59:37 PM PST US From: kerrjohna@comcast.net Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: landing rpm It will be good to hear if you find landing at the lower speed an easier ta sk.=C2- You will note that the 60 mph approach is not much different than the adjoining thread this morning talked of cruise speed seen with Model I V with 618 engine. John Kerr ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick Reilly" Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 12:53:34 PM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: landing rpm John, I am approaching at 60 and have planning on slowing it down to 50. Th anks. Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rwbuilt Rockford, IL On Tue, May 10, 2011 at 9:53 AM, < kerrjohna@comcast.net > wrote: Frequently in the past, difficulty in landing has been traced back to appro ach speed.=C2- Using the recommended 1.3 x stall speed in the pattern wil l yield improved landings.=C2- Last year, prompted by this discussion I f lew final at 50mph ASI @ 2000 rpm and the stick held firmly in position unt il touch down.=C2- There was no float just a solid arrival.=C2- Using a slight amount of flair generates a greased landing with ~200 feet roll out . Since adding the VG's last month I have been practicing really slow landing s at idle with full 20 degree flaps and the plane is touching down at less than 40 ASI and so gently there is no chance of spinning off the valve stem s as alluded to in another thread.=C2- 20 degrees flaps does provide incr eased adverse yaw and therefore opportunities to improve airmanship. AOPA has a video out entitled Ups and Downs where in the chronical the prob lems of too fast approaches and too slow take offs. John Kerr ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patrick Reilly" < patreilly43@gmail.com > Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 8:20:37 AM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: landing rpm Ed, Thanks for info. My problem, I believe has been pulling stick back too soon and relaunching. I=C2-have been negligent in the past=C2- about pu lling stick all the way back and am over compensating. Pat Reilly=C2- On Mon, May 9, 2011 at 11:19 PM, Ed Gray < egraylaw@swbell.net > wrote: I don=99t get the difficulty with rpms while landing.=C2- I stay at 2500 on final and the prop seems to be producing drag, since I can plop on the first 100 feet of runway.=C2- If flaring too high, try wheel landing s for a while.=C2- Just fly it onto the ground and keep the tail up until almost to the turnoff with about 2800 rpm.=C2- The Fox makes great wheel ies and you can see where you are going-just keep that stick forward and ea sy on the brakes.=C2- Comments? PS.=C2- I am about 2 months from completion of my Lancair 360 and waiting for my Viking (Honda) for the Kitfox 4 in the carshed.=C2- ONE FOR SLOW AND ONE FOR GO. Ed Gray K2 582 GSC Dallas arget="_blank"> http://www.matronics.com/Naviga tor?Kitfox-List ttp:// forums.matronics.com _blank"> http://www.matronics.c om/contribution -- Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuild Rockford,IL arget=_blank> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List p:// forums. matronics.com blank> http://www.matronics.com/contribution arget="_blank">http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List ttp://forum s.matronics.com _blank">http://www.matronics.com/contribution -- Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuild Rockford,IL == ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 01:37:55 PM PST US From: Pete Christensen Subject: Kitfox-List: On Austin Craigs list Kitfox III Experimental Aircraft - $9800 (Bastrop) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:30:40 PM PST US From: "lane taylor" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE Apparently my earlier email had too many pictures so here's round two.... C box 3:1 Three bladed wood GSC presently set at 14 degrees Cruise and full throttle EGTs remain between 1100 - 1200 F Duel plugs per head Round cowl The only fairing is on the wing struts. I don't have gap seals or any other drag reducing strategies or devices. I've double checked my wing dihedral which is set at 2 degrees per side. All my measurements are within 1 or 2 mm of the manual's recommendation. She flies great--just at a slower than anticipated rate of speed and climb. I'll try your suggestions... ----- Original Message ----- From: Guy Buchanan To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 10:59 AM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE On 5/10/2011 3:31 AM, lane taylor wrote: The plane responds very well without any glaring drag issues. EGT's 1120; plugs look great; jetting per the manual. I'm the builder. Any feedback would be much appreciated. Perhaps it is what it is, but I expected more speed and better climb. Lane, The key here is that the plane "responds well". Sounds like it's working better than your measurements would indicate. So, as Tom already said, the first things to check are your measurements: a.. Tach with an model airplane optical tach. b.. ASI with a set of accurate, no wing, GPS runs. c.. Measure OAT while making the ASI runs to make sure your density altitude is reasonable. d.. Make time to climb measurements to verify the VSI. One trick I learned while doing this was to get the aircraft in a stable climb, take a picture of the panel with the GPS showing time, then wait a while and take another picture. Get back to base and use the pictures to figure out the rate of climb based on the change in time on the GPS and the change in altitude. Next I have some questions: a.. What's your gearbox ratio? b.. How many blades on the prop? c.. Are the EGT's full throttle? d.. Is this a single plug head? e.. Is this a round cowl? f.. What has been faired? Possible options include: a.. Wing struts b.. Jury struts c.. Radiator d.. Horizontal stab struts e.. Vertical / horizontal junction f.. Gaps on vertical and horizontal g.. What kind of wing tips are you running? (A picture might answer a lot of these.) h.. What's your radiator installation look like? Your speeds are low, as my 582 powered IV will top out at 110 mph at 6800 rpm. However I've been told my 582 is "fast" for what it's worth. It has everything faired but the radiator. I understand that "dirty" IV's are much slower. (I've heard 15%, or 15mph for the wing struts alone.) Enough for now. Guy Buchanan Ramona, CA Kitfox IV-1200 / 592-C / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:34:09 PM PST US From: "Dave Fisher" Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE What are you using for Airspeed ? ASI or GPS? ----- Original Message ----- From: lane taylor To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 5:26 PM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE Apparently my earlier email had too many pictures so here's round two.... C box 3:1 Three bladed wood GSC presently set at 14 degrees Cruise and full throttle EGTs remain between 1100 - 1200 F Duel plugs per head Round cowl The only fairing is on the wing struts. I don't have gap seals or any other drag reducing strategies or devices. I've double checked my wing dihedral which is set at 2 degrees per side. All my measurements are within 1 or 2 mm of the manual's recommendation. She flies great--just at a slower than anticipated rate of speed and climb. I'll try your suggestions... ----- Original Message ----- From: Guy Buchanan To: kitfox-list@matronics.com Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 10:59 AM Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE On 5/10/2011 3:31 AM, lane taylor wrote: The plane responds very well without any glaring drag issues. EGT's 1120; plugs look great; jetting per the manual. I'm the builder. Any feedback would be much appreciated. Perhaps it is what it is, but I expected more speed and better climb. Lane, The key here is that the plane "responds well". Sounds like it's working better than your measurements would indicate. So, as Tom already said, the first things to check are your measurements: a.. Tach with an model airplane optical tach. b.. ASI with a set of accurate, no wing, GPS runs. c.. Measure OAT while making the ASI runs to make sure your density altitude is reasonable. d.. Make time to climb measurements to verify the VSI. One trick I learned while doing this was to get the aircraft in a stable climb, take a picture of the panel with the GPS showing time, then wait a while and take another picture. Get back to base and use the pictures to figure out the rate of climb based on the change in time on the GPS and the change in altitude. Next I have some questions: a.. What's your gearbox ratio? b.. How many blades on the prop? c.. Are the EGT's full throttle? d.. Is this a single plug head? e.. Is this a round cowl? f.. What has been faired? Possible options include: a.. Wing struts b.. Jury struts c.. Radiator d.. Horizontal stab struts e.. Vertical / horizontal junction f.. Gaps on vertical and horizontal g.. What kind of wing tips are you running? (A picture might answer a lot of these.) h.. What's your radiator installation look like? Your speeds are low, as my 582 powered IV will top out at 110 mph at 6800 rpm. However I've been told my 582 is "fast" for what it's worth. It has everything faired but the radiator. I understand that "dirty" IV's are much slower. (I've heard 15%, or 15mph for the wing struts alone.) Enough for now. Guy Buchanan Ramona, CA Kitfox IV-1200 / 592-C / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kitfox-List">http://www.matron href="http://forums.matronics.com">http://forums.matronics.com href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 04:12:52 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Flapperons From: Patrick Reilly Kitfoxers, I have a question about my Mod 3 flapperon setting. I was shown how the mod 3 and earlier flapperon flaps deployed reduces alieron ability. What flapperon deployment do you mod 3 and earlier drivers use on landing? The fellow that called this to my attention said not to deploy flapperons for landing because of the loss of alieron roll. I also had an instructor that said not to deploy Kitfox alierons on landing, "it really causes nose down attitude". He didn't explain why though otheer than the nose down comment. Deploying full flapperons to decrease stall speed and ground speed on landing seemed beneficial for landing to me. And, I didn't notice the loss of alieron roll. -- Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuild Rockford,IL ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 04:22:04 PM PST US From: Guy Buchanan Subject: Re: Kitfox-List: MODEL IV-1200 PERFORMANCE On 5/10/2011 2:26 PM, lane taylor wrote: > The only fairing is on the wing struts. I don't have gap seals or any > other drag reducing strategies or devices. I've double checked my > wing dihedral which is set at 2 degrees per side. All my measurements > are within 1 or 2 mm of the manual's recommendation. She flies > great--just at a slower than anticipated rate of speed and climb. > I'll try your suggestions... Yep. Clean enough, and very attractive. You should be going at least my speeds. I'd hope for an ASI or tach error. Guy Buchanan Ramona, CA Kitfox IV-1200 / 592-C / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 04:23:36 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Mod for strech From: Patrick Reilly Kitfoxers, Has anyone streched a mod 4 to accomadate a Lyc 0235 engine. I have seen the standard length fuselage with an 0235 on floats, but the battery was all the way in the tail. It would seem as with a Supercub and the streched Pipers running 0540's, that the mod 4 streched would be a natural. I seem to remember a website that belonged to someone who provided a streched Kitfox fuselage, but can't remember for sure. I guess the normal reply would be, "Why not just get a mod 5, 6, or 7?". -- Pat Reilly Mod 3 582 Rebuild Rockford,IL ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kitfox-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.