Today's Message Index:
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1. 08:18 AM - 582 blues - Bing 54 (Marco Menezes)
2. 08:27 AM - Re: 582 blues - Bing 54 (Dave Fisher)
3. 05:23 PM - how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle (n85ae)
4. 06:04 PM - Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle (dave)
5. 06:29 PM - Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle (Guy Buchanan)
6. 06:45 PM - Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle (n85ae)
7. 09:16 PM - Re: Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle (Michael Gibbs)
Message 1
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| Subject: | 582 blues - Bing 54 |
More info: Plugs are wet and black, especially rear cylinder. It's obviousl
y running super-rich but much more so than would occur from simply having m
oved jet needle clip one knotch. Could worn or plugged float needle be the
cause?=0A-=0AMarco Menezes N99KX=0AModel 2 582-90 C-Box 3:1 w/clutch=0AHe
rsey, MI
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: 582 blues - Bing 54 |
MArco
did you read my post ?
You might have put the plastic plug in the slider prior to the needle.
It happens.
Pull them out and check
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: Marco Menezes
To: Matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2011 11:15 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: 582 blues - Bing 54
More info: Plugs are wet and black, especially rear cylinder. It's
obviously running super-rich but much more so than would occur from
simply having moved jet needle clip one knotch. Could worn or plugged
float needle be the cause?
Marco Menezes N99KX
Model 2 582-90 C-Box 3:1 w/clutch
Hersey, MI
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| Subject: | how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle |
Here's my "Never gonna do that again" experience for the year.
Discovered nearly fatally a aerodynamic combo my plane will not
tolerate.
Steep descent to get through a hole in the clouds, pulled 22 degrees
flaperon's to see how they'd work as a drag producer (aka dive brakes)
never expected an instant accelerated stall, pushing me over vertical.
Everything from the luggage sack plastered on the ceiling. Including
me if not for seat belts. Imagine that you're really nose down to begin,
and then the nose rips out from under you. There was no warning, just
instant drop! Almost like a forward tumble.
Miracle I had presence of mind to push not pull on the stick, nearly pulled
a muscle grabbing for the flaperon handle at near upside down. Recovery
came right away after getting the flaperons back to 11 degrees. Then
it was just a matter of pulling out of a vertical dive like a spin recovery.
Had to land at the nearest airport to literally clean up the cockpit.
Everything that was stowed was no longer in place, but up on the floor
in the front or on the glareshield.
Next mod to N85AE is a mechanical block to remove 22 degrees from
being used (ever).
First time in 7 years flying that plane that I ever had that happen.
Jeff Hays
Series 5, IO240B
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353188#353188
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| Subject: | Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle |
Never flown a mod 5 --
I will tell you that my mod 4 I have 33 degree down on the flapperons and are a
real attribute if you know how to use them.
Take off or landing only 1/2 flaps except when you trying to bust loose from glassy
water or trying to get out of soft sand or mud.
Full power and part flaps only until you ready to fly but plane just ain;t there
yet -- Rip those full flapperons all the way to 33 degrees and it will help
you bust loose - keep nosedown and bleed off to 1/2 flaps as soon as you can.
Kitfox flapperons are not like a cessna with 40 degrees for drag - they limit your
roll control.
I test flew a mod 2 a while back and took off in reflex --scary -- my fault it
was marked take off at the half flap point in mine..... that was zero flapperons.
I had it shoved full forward and once o broke the ground I noticed to roll
control and could not combat the crosswind... within a second I knew what
happened and pull them back to my half way point which was Zero on this one
-- it happens.
--------
Realtime Kitfox movies to separate the internet chatter from the truth
http://www.youtube.com/user/kitfoxflyer
Hundreds of Kitfox Movies
Most viewed Kitfox on youtube
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Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353192#353192
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle |
On 9/25/2011 5:19 PM, n85ae wrote:
> Had to land at the nearest airport to literally clean up the cockpit.
> Everything that was stowed was no longer in place, but up on the floor
> in the front or on the glareshield.
>
> Next mod to N85AE is a mechanical block to remove 22 degrees from
> being used (ever).
>
> First time in 7 years flying that plane that I ever had that happen.
>
YEEHAW! Sounds exciting. Can't say I've ever pulled sustained negative
on the IV. Glad you survived to tell the tale. Interestingly my dad had
that happen flying an AD-1 as a lad, but it was caused by the dive
brakes: he pulled them on during a bombing run and the plane shifted
into a stable -g pitch-down which he was just barely able to arrest with
the elevator until he could get the brakes off.
Guy Buchanan
Ramona, CA
Kitfox IV-1200 / 912-S / Warp 3cs / 500 hrs. and grounded
Now a glider pilot, too.
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle |
I use 11 degrees a lot for landing, the plane handles great, plus I get a better
over the nose view on final and still have no problems flaring for landing even
with the heavy motor. 22 degrees has always felt really horrible, as it takes
full trim and still some back pressure. Not to mention the roll control is really
odd feeling.
Recently I added the spring assist system, and I suspect this led me into a
trap that all that pressure you normally hold is telling you something. With
the spring assist, you don't feel like your holding so much. Pop in 22 degrees
going a bit fast, and probably at a higher than normal AOA and voila instant
stall. Not what I expected at the moment, or attitude I was at. Nose down
in a descent, a sudden stall is not in the program normally.
The other possibility is I got a tail stall which would have snapped the nose down
as well. But I'm really not sure.
Jeff
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353197#353197
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle |
>I use 11 degrees a lot for landing...22 degrees has always felt
>really horrible, as it take full trim and still some back pressure.
>Not to mention the roll control is really odd feeling.
I routinely used full flaps (22 degrees) on my Model IV-1200
Speedster with no ill-effects. While there is less roll authority
with them down that far, it's no less than an ordinary airplane
probably has on a good day. I think Kitfox/Avid drivers become quite
spoiled to the responsiveness these airplanes deliver.
Mike G.
Phoenix, AZ
N728KF, Kitfox IV-1200 Speedster
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