---------------------------------------------------------- Kitfox-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 09/27/11: 4 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:24 AM - Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 09/26/11 (EMAproducts@aol.com) 2. 12:06 PM - Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle (av8rps) 3. 04:05 PM - Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle (dave) 4. 04:51 PM - Re: Feather with ailerons (av8rps) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:24:36 AM PST US From: EMAproducts@aol.com Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Kitfox-List Digest: 7 Msgs - 09/26/11 In a message dated 9/27/2011 12:09:11 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, kitfox-list@matronics.com writes: Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Feather with ailerons From: "mikeperkins" _michael.perkins@rauland.com_ (mailto:michael.perkins@rauland.com) Spoilers would certainly be an interesting addition to a Kitfox. My experience with float is that the approach is flown too fast, and stall times 1.3 makes landings pretty float-free in my Model I. For sure 1.3Vso is where we fly all aircraft for precision, Also where I recommend setting up our RiteAngle AOA systems. Set it for your aircraft, not where some engineer thought it would be! 1.3Vso works on ultra light to ~~ however if it has flaps be sure and correct for the positions you use! 50 years &25,000 hours flying for work and play. Elbie Mendenhall CFI, ASMEL A&I, ATP ASMEL CE-500. B-737, DC-9 Retired but still instructing ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 12:06:32 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle From: "av8rps" After flying a multitude of Kitfoxes and Avids for over 25 years, and doing just about anything you can imagine with one, I agree that this situation was likely caused by a tail stall and not the flaperons. Unlike many that think our flaperons are useless, I use flaperons for every takeoff and landing (I've modified my flaps so I get nearly 30 degrees of throw). And yet, I've never experienced anything that I would say is unusual or scary. Here's just one example of the extent I've tested my flaperons; I recently blew out (!) both back quarter windows on my Kitfox amphib while practicing SEVERE slips both directions in an effort to figure out how to land my speedy little amphib shorter. (I began the testing at high altitude to be safe. I didn't want to learn at low altitude that my severe fuselage angle combined with a slow airspeed, a huge sink rate, and totally uncoordinated flight would result in something like a snap roll). But even in that situation, the Kitfox was solid and stable. So I think you hit the nail on the head when talking about the tail stall. Thank you for sharing that information. It is very good to know. If it happened to you, it can happen to others. -------- Model IV-1200 912ul Amphib Avid Flyer Sn#1 and Sn#26 Highlander 912s taildragger Lake Amphibian Central Wisconsin paul676@tds.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353336#353336 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 04:05:46 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: how to kill yourself with the flaperon handle From: "dave" Paul ,well said !! Flapperons on my mod 4 ROCK - and I gotta say anyone that tells you others just does not know how to utilize them to the max. I will that say on mod 1 ,2 flapperons really suck compared to my mod 4. Not totally useless but close. Dave Realtime Kitfox movies to separate the internet chatter from the truth http://www.youtube.com/user/kitfoxflyer Hundreds of Kitfox Movies Most viewed Kitfox on youtube Most popular on youtube Highest rated on youtube av8rps wrote: > After flying a multitude of Kitfoxes and Avids for over 25 years, and doing just about anything you can imagine with one, I agree that this situation was likely caused by a tail stall and not the flaperons. > > Unlike many that think our flaperons are useless, I use flaperons for every takeoff and landing (I've modified my flaps so I get nearly 30 degrees of throw). And yet, I've never experienced anything that I would say is unusual or scary. > > Here's just one example of the extent I've tested my flaperons; I recently blew out (!) both back quarter windows on my Kitfox amphib while practicing SEVERE slips both directions in an effort to figure out how to land my speedy little amphib shorter. (I began the testing at high altitude to be safe. I didn't want to learn at low altitude that my severe fuselage angle combined with a slow airspeed, a huge sink rate, and totally uncoordinated flight would result in something like a snap roll). But even in that situation, the Kitfox was solid and stable. > > So I think you hit the nail on the head when talking about the tail stall. Thank you for sharing that information. It is very good to know. If it happened to you, it can happen to others. -------- Realtime Kitfox movies to separate the internet chatter from the truth http://www.youtube.com/user/kitfoxflyer Hundreds of Kitfox Movies Most viewed Kitfox on youtube Most popular on youtube Highest rated on youtube Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353363#353363 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:51:29 PM PST US Subject: Kitfox-List: Re: Feather with ailerons From: "av8rps" As I recall, the Kitfox Light Squared model (or whatever they called that tri gear M4) used the flaperons as spoilers. I believe the info to set it up is either in that version of the build manual, or is a service bulletin. I know I read it somewhere as I tried it on my Model IV after reading about it. And I found that it did work, and actually pretty well. It was nice to descend like the airliners with spoilers do - relatively flat and level on approach. But my Kitfox did feel less stable, almost as if I was flying with an extreme rearward center of gravity. I'm guessing the flaperon going up as a spoiler may cause the center of lift on the wing to shift? If it weren't for the fact that I have my Kitfox set to provide all the down travel I can get, I would have left mine set up to act as a spoiler for when I want to use that feature. But I can't have both with the existing control setup. And since the Kitfox slips so well, I just use slips. Plus, slips are just so much fun! :D -------- Model IV-1200 912ul Amphib Avid Flyer Sn#1 and Sn#26 Highlander 912s taildragger Lake Amphibian Central Wisconsin paul676@tds.net Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=353366#353366 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kitfox-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kitfox-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kitfox-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kitfox-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.