Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:55 AM - off topic request: Aircraft on Google map (Rexinator)
2. 07:13 AM - Re: New Fox (Catz631@aol.com)
3. 08:41 AM - Re: off topic request: Aircraft on Google map (Michael Gibbs)
4. 01:56 PM - Re: off topic request: Aircraft on Google map (Trey Moran)
5. 01:56 PM - Re: Kikfox touring over size trailer (bjones@dmv.com)
6. 01:56 PM - Re: Kikfox touring over size trailer (bjones@dmv.com)
7. 02:20 PM - Re: off topic request: Aircraft on Google map (Rexinator)
8. 09:08 PM - Re: Kikfox touring over size trailer (SkySteve)
Message 1
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| Subject: | off topic request: Aircraft on Google map |
Kitfoxers,
I volunteer at the Pueblo Wiesbrod Aircraft Museum (www.pwam.org). One
of my activities there is to answer emails to the museum. This week we
got an email from this fellow:
> Stanley de Beauvesier Watson
> the Netherlands
> email: plymouth72@hotmail.com
He had located what appears to be a possible aircraft wreck on Google
Earth. He suspected it to be an A-20 and it might interest our museum or
others we could contact. I've checked online submit the following:
Aircraft on Malaspina Glacier West of Yakutat City, AK.
Google map coordinates: 59 47.255 -140 35.170 (paste the coordinates
into Google maps search)
In my opinion it looks like a modern twin engine airplane more than a
A-20 because I think the engine nacelles would still show as bumps
behind the wings.
See this photo:
http://www.47thbombgroup.org/documents/images/night_intruders.jpg
It is difficult to conclude more from the Google map image. It's
possible it was an aircraft in flight captured by satellite imaging as I
have been unable to find anything about a twin engine crash in the area
on the internet. Stanley is suggesting it could be a WWII aircraft
revealed by the melting glacier. I am doubtful.
Anyone have any ideas that could help further this subject? You can
email me direct at: rexinator(at)gmail.com
Rex Hefferan
M2/582
Pueblo, CO
Message 2
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ME TOO ED ! Keep us posted on the Viking. I think that is a great idea ! We
had a guy stop by our airport on his way to So Fl to get a Viking
installed in his Escapade a couple of years ago. He was very unhappy with his
Jabaru. I believe his story is on the Viking web site.
Dick Maddux
Fox 4
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: off topic request: Aircraft on Google map |
Maybe one of our Alaska members could fly over and check it out!
Mike G.
Phoenix, AZ
Kitfox IV-1200 Speedster, Series 6
> On Dec 15, 2013, at 7:55 AM, Rexinator <rexinator@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Kitfoxers,
> I volunteer at the Pueblo Wiesbrod Aircraft Museum (www.pwam.org). One of my activities there is to answer emails to the museum. This week we got an email from this fellow:
> > Stanley de Beauvesier Watson
> > the Netherlands
> > email: plymouth72@hotmail.com
>
> He had located what appears to be a possible aircraft wreck on Google Earth.
He suspected it to be an A-20 and it might interest our museum or others we could
contact. I've checked online submit the following:
> Aircraft on Malaspina Glacier West of Yakutat City, AK.
> Google map coordinates: 59 47.255 -140 35.170 (paste the coordinates into Google
maps search)
>
> In my opinion it looks like a modern twin engine airplane more than a A-20 because
I think the engine nacelles would still show as bumps behind the wings.
> See this photo:
> http://www.47thbombgroup.org/documents/images/night_intruders.jpg
>
> It is difficult to conclude more from the Google map image. It's possible it
was an aircraft in flight captured by satellite imaging as I have been unable
to find anything about a twin engine crash in the area on the internet. Stanley
is suggesting it could be a WWII aircraft revealed by the melting glacier.
I am doubtful.
>
> Anyone have any ideas that could help further this subject? You can email me
direct at: rexinator(at)gmail.com
>
> Rex Hefferan
> M2/582
> Pueblo, CO
>
>
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: off topic request: Aircraft on Google map |
Interestingly, the image is not visible on Bing Maps birdseye view. The
Google Earth image is from 2007; can't get the date on Bing.
As for the plane itself, based on the shadow about where the aft door would
be, and compared to shadows from nearby rocks, I'd say it is on the ground,
and has now been recovered.
Trey Moran
KF 5, EA-81
-----Original Message-----
From: Rexinator
Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2013 7:55 AM
Subject: Kitfox-List: off topic request: Aircraft on Google map
Kitfoxers,
I volunteer at the Pueblo Wiesbrod Aircraft Museum (www.pwam.org). One
of my activities there is to answer emails to the museum. This week we
got an email from this fellow:
> Stanley de Beauvesier Watson
> the Netherlands
> email: plymouth72@hotmail.com
He had located what appears to be a possible aircraft wreck on Google
Earth. He suspected it to be an A-20 and it might interest our museum or
others we could contact. I've checked online submit the following:
Aircraft on Malaspina Glacier West of Yakutat City, AK.
Google map coordinates: 59 47.255 -140 35.170 (paste the coordinates
into Google maps search)
In my opinion it looks like a modern twin engine airplane more than a
A-20 because I think the engine nacelles would still show as bumps
behind the wings.
See this photo:
http://www.47thbombgroup.org/documents/images/night_intruders.jpg
It is difficult to conclude more from the Google map image. It's
possible it was an aircraft in flight captured by satellite imaging as I
have been unable to find anything about a twin engine crash in the area
on the internet. Stanley is suggesting it could be a WWII aircraft
revealed by the melting glacier. I am doubtful.
Anyone have any ideas that could help further this subject? You can
email me direct at: rexinator(at)gmail.com
Rex Hefferan
M2/582
Pueblo, CO
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Kikfox touring over size trailer |
Pete,
This is a great "question". It comes up routinely. It and related
questions deserve discussion.
Simply stated, most states list 102 inches as the maximum width UNLESS the
operator goes on line and obtains an annual oversize blanket permit. Each
state has its own laws in this regard of course. So you can trailer over
wide trailers.
Read on only if you care to. The permit process varies but in general in
the case or a slightly over wide trailer, permitting is the state DOT's
process to try to insure that folks are aware of what should be common
sense. Examples include, not towing oversize loads on unacceptably narrow
roads, night operation limitations, not towing on roads that do not allow
commercial vehicles or trailers such as parkways in New York, how to be
aware of old bridges built before current road width design criteria, as
well as to understand bridge vertical clearance issues. Of course trailers
have special equipment regulations, especially for brakes. It does not
mean that loads over 102 inches can not be towed on the state's roads but
more a matter of trying to assure that folks do it safely.
Having said that, in the real world towing something 108 inches in width
instead of 102 inches is generally much like driving a car at 60 mph in a
zone posted with a 55 mph speed limit. Unless your driving seems to be
hazardous to yourself or others the police don't seem to pay much
attention, although as we all know enforcement is largely at the
discretion of the officer.
Along coastal states, trailer boats well over 102 inches wide are fairly
common. In Florida as well as up and down I-95 thru Maryland the general
rule of thumb among those who trailer large sport fishing boats is that
rigs under 10 feet wide are not an enforcement issue. Because we get
rotten fuel economy, we see each other at gas stations off the interstates
a lot and compare notes. I have yet to run across anyone who still bothers
with an annual permit, if he is under 10 feet wide and not a commercial
hauler. Commercial haulers have to go thru commercial truck weigh
stations. As an aside, most of us avoid trailering when and where
congestion or road conditions might not be a good idea largely because its
a royal PIA to tow in those areas. If you have $200,000 in fancy
fiberglass in tow, you tend to exercise some degree of caution to protect
your own interests.
An ancillary question is , what about registering a 9 foot wide trailer?
If you read various state regulations, they generally make provisions for
oversize equipment that would be somewhat impractical to disassemble to
move on the road like a plane or boat. A common practice among experienced
trailer owners is to save money by registering their trailers in Maine and
Maine Trailer has repeatedly told me they have no problem registering a 9
foot wide trailer.
Lots of folks leave trailers in vacation areas or at second homes in
different states than their primary residence so police tend not to bother
with trying to determine if a trailer should be registered in the state of
primary residence.
Friends in the insurance business tell us that insurance companies
generally do not deny coverage if you are in an accident even if you broke
some law. Most accidents come with some sort of ticket for breaking a law
for at least one party involved. What insurance agents tell us is that if
someone costs an insurance company too much, or has too many claims the
company will raise premium or not renew the policy.
Bottom line, you can trailer a wide load. Getting annual permits MAY be a
good idea. Good trailering skills/techniques/judgement and good equipment
may be even more important.
One mans long winded opinion for what its worth.
BJ
> <pchristensen10@austin.rr.com>
>
> BJ
>
> I see your trailer is 108" wide. Is that width legal in every state?
>
> Pete
> Kitfox III, 912
> Leander, Tx
>
>
> On Dec 13, 2013, at 8:55 PM, bjones@dmv.com wrote:
>
>>
>> If I got Photo Bucket to work, not sure, there should be about 20 photos
>> of the trailer used to take the Kitfox touring with tips in captions
>> under
>> the pictures for anyone interested in "Seeing The USA By Chevrolet And
>> LSA".
>>
>> As time allows I'll try to get more photos up covering scenic flying
>> places, tips on getting thru airports gates with a trailered plane post
>> 911, tips on strapping and protecting the plane while towing, what to
>> look
>> for and avoid in motorhomes as tow vehicles, things to do to keep costs
>> down while touring.
>>
>> BJ
>> Kitfox IV 912 Warp Drive
>> Roadtrek 190
>> bjones@dmv.com
>>
>>
>> http://s1205.photobucket.com/user/N154K/media/Kitfo%20Trailer/IMG_2761.jpg.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Kikfox touring over size trailer |
Pete,
This is a great "question". It comes up routinely. It and related
questions deserve discussion.
Simply stated, most states list 102 inches as the maximum width UNLESS the
operator goes on line and obtains an annual oversize blanket permit. Each
state has its own laws in this regard of course. So you can trailer over
wide trailers.
Read on only if you care to. The permit process varies but in general in
the case or a slightly over wide trailer, permitting is the state DOT's
process to try to insure that folks are aware of what should be common
sense. Examples include, not towing oversize loads on unacceptably narrow
roads, night operation limitations, not towing on roads that do not allow
commercial vehicles or trailers such as parkways in New York, how to be
aware of old bridges built before current road width design criteria, as
well as to understand bridge vertical clearance issues. Of course trailers
have special equipment regulations, especially for brakes. It does not
mean that loads over 102 inches can not be towed on the state's roads but
more a matter of trying to assure that folks do it safely.
Having said that, in the real world towing something 108 inches in width
instead of 102 inches is generally much like driving a car at 60 mph in a
zone posted with a 55 mph speed limit. Unless your driving seems to be
hazardous to yourself or others the police don't seem to pay much
attention, although as we all know enforcement is largely at the
discretion of the officer.
Along coastal states, trailer boats well over 102 inches wide are fairly
common. In Florida as well as up and down I-95 thru Maryland the general
rule of thumb among those who trailer large sport fishing boats is that
rigs under 10 feet wide are not an enforcement issue. Because we get
rotten fuel economy, we see each other at gas stations off the interstates
a lot and compare notes. I have yet to run across anyone who still bothers
with an annual permit, if he is under 10 feet wide and not a commercial
hauler. Commercial haulers have to go thru commercial truck weigh
stations. As an aside, most of us avoid trailering when and where
congestion or road conditions might not be a good idea largely because its
a royal PIA to tow in those areas. If you have $200,000 in fancy
fiberglass in tow, you tend to exercise some degree of caution to protect
your own interests.
An ancillary question is , what about registering a 9 foot wide trailer?
If you read various state regulations, they generally make provisions for
oversize equipment that would be somewhat impractical to disassemble to
move on the road like a plane or boat. A common practice among experienced
trailer owners is to save money by registering their trailers in Maine and
Maine Trailer has repeatedly told me they have no problem registering a 9
foot wide trailer.
Lots of folks leave trailers in vacation areas or at second homes in
different states than their primary residence so police tend not to bother
with trying to determine if a trailer should be registered in the state of
primary residence.
Friends in the insurance business tell us that insurance companies
generally do not deny coverage if you are in an accident even if you broke
some law. Most accidents come with some sort of ticket for breaking a law
for at least one party involved. What insurance agents tell us is that if
someone costs an insurance company too much, or has too many claims the
company will raise premium or not renew the policy.
Bottom line, you can trailer a wide load. Getting annual permits MAY be a
good idea. Good trailering skills/techniques/judgement and good equipment
may be even more important.
One mans long winded opinion for what its worth.
BJ
> <pchristensen10@austin.rr.com>
>
> BJ
>
> I see your trailer is 108" wide. Is that width legal in every state?
>
> Pete
> Kitfox III, 912
> Leander, Tx
>
>
> On Dec 13, 2013, at 8:55 PM, bjones@dmv.com wrote:
>
>>
>> If I got Photo Bucket to work, not sure, there should be about 20 photos
>> of the trailer used to take the Kitfox touring with tips in captions
>> under
>> the pictures for anyone interested in "Seeing The USA By Chevrolet And
>> LSA".
>>
>> As time allows I'll try to get more photos up covering scenic flying
>> places, tips on getting thru airports gates with a trailered plane post
>> 911, tips on strapping and protecting the plane while towing, what to
>> look
>> for and avoid in motorhomes as tow vehicles, things to do to keep costs
>> down while touring.
>>
>> BJ
>> Kitfox IV 912 Warp Drive
>> Roadtrek 190
>> bjones@dmv.com
>>
>>
>> http://s1205.photobucket.com/user/N154K/media/Kitfo%20Trailer/IMG_2761.jpg.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: off topic request: Aircraft on Google map |
That would be great if someone from that area reads this list. I was
also thinking of contacting the town or airport there to ask if they
could answer the question.
Rex Hefferan
M2/582
Pueblo, CO
On 12/15/2013 9:40 AM, Michael Gibbs wrote:
>
> Maybe one of our Alaska members could fly over and check it out!
>
> Mike G.
> Phoenix, AZ
> Kitfox IV-1200 Speedster, Series 6
>
>
>> On Dec 15, 2013, at 7:55 AM, Rexinator <rexinator@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Kitfoxers,
>> I volunteer at the Pueblo Wiesbrod Aircraft Museum (www.pwam.org). One of my activities there is to answer emails to the museum. This week we got an email from this fellow:
>>> Stanley de Beauvesier Watson
>>> the Netherlands
>>> email: plymouth72@hotmail.com
>> He had located what appears to be a possible aircraft wreck on Google Earth.
He suspected it to be an A-20 and it might interest our museum or others we could
contact. I've checked online submit the following:
>> Aircraft on Malaspina Glacier West of Yakutat City, AK.
>> Google map coordinates: 59 47.255 -140 35.170 (paste the coordinates into Google
maps search)
>>
>> In my opinion it looks like a modern twin engine airplane more than a A-20 because
I think the engine nacelles would still show as bumps behind the wings.
>> See this photo:
>> http://www.47thbombgroup.org/documents/images/night_intruders.jpg
>>
>> It is difficult to conclude more from the Google map image. It's possible it
was an aircraft in flight captured by satellite imaging as I have been unable
to find anything about a twin engine crash in the area on the internet. Stanley
is suggesting it could be a WWII aircraft revealed by the melting glacier.
I am doubtful.
>>
>> Anyone have any ideas that could help further this subject? You can email me
direct at: rexinator(at)gmail.com
>>
>> Rex Hefferan
>> M2/582
>> Pueblo, CO
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Kikfox touring over size trailer |
Pete,
Yes, great question.
BJ,
Great answer(s), on both issues. That helps us other old timers. Having pulled
many farm type trailers down the road most of my life I have learned the best
approach is to just keep going down the road like you know all the laws and you
are most often left alone.
--------
Steve Wilson
Huntsville, UT
Kitfox Model 1- 85DD
912A / 3 Blade Warp Drive
Convertible Nosewheel & Tailwheel
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=415641#415641
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