Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:55 AM - Re: Tuning the EIS for a 582 (Bob, Kathleen, & Kory Brocious)
2. 06:52 AM - Re: Tuning the EIS for a 582 (John Hauck)
3. 12:10 PM - Poly Spray - Cage (Mike Pierzina)
4. 12:21 PM - Biennial flight reviews (Richard Pike)
5. 12:35 PM - Re: Tuning the EIS for a 582 ()
6. 01:39 PM - Fabric Finish (Lawrence M. Rice)
7. 02:04 PM - Kolb BFRs (Ron Aerial)
8. 02:15 PM - Re: Fabric Finish (Ron Aerial)
9. 02:30 PM - Re: Kolb BFRs (John Hauck)
10. 03:14 PM - Re: Fabric Finish (Larry Bourne)
11. 05:27 PM - Latex paint on aircraft (Richard Pike)
12. 05:46 PM - Re: Latex paint on aircraft (Richard Pike)
13. 06:13 PM - AIS (Clay Stuart)
14. 06:21 PM - Re: Fabric Finish (ul15rhb@juno.com)
15. 09:58 PM - Re: Latex paint on aircraft (GeoR38@aol.com)
16. 10:23 PM - Re: Tuning the EIS for a 582 (GeoR38@aol.com)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Tuning the EIS for a 582 |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bob, Kathleen, & Kory Brocious" <bbrocious@hotmail.com>
Richard, the temp climbs slowly. How does the placement of the probe affect the
temps? Is that critical ?
Bob, Kathleen, and Kory Brocious
<EM>Tenacity Farm </EM>
Campbellsburg, Kentucky
From: Richard Pike <RWPIKE@CHARTER.NET>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tuning the EIS for a 582
-- Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <RWPIKE@CHARTER.NET>
Very likely that since the airplane is not in flight, there is just not
enough air moving through the radiators. If it is only getting to 191 on
the ground, you will probably have no problems in flight.
On the other hand... how long does it take (at 6,000 rpm) to get to 191? If
it takes 20-30 seconds to go from 150-160 up to 191, it is OK. But if it
goes up really quick, not so good.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
At 07:03 PM 4/12/03 -0400, you wrote:
-- Kolb-List message posted by: "Bob, Kathleen, Kory Brocious"
<BBROCIOUS@HOTMAIL.COM>
Folks,
N57MB <EM>("Miss B") </EM>is getting close to flying. I'm in the process
of tuning the EIS to the correct temps and RMPsper the manual and then
easing into a WOT test. Today my CHT and EGT were fine up to 6000 RPMs
which is as high as I went. But the coolant temp hit 191. The max is
suppose to be 175. I could bring the idle back down to 3500 and the temp
would drop back to the normal range.
My first inclination is to check the probe to be sure it is set right then
replace the coolant. I will be the first to confess that I know squat
about 2 cycle engines and am intimidated by this little screamer. I would
appreciate any thoughts from those of you more experienced with the Rotax 582.
Suggestions about placement of the probe or anything else to check would
be most appreciated. By the way, the CHT hovered around 210 and the EGT
was 1050, therebouts at 5500 RPMs.
Bob
Campbellsburg, KY
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Tuning the EIS for a 582 |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
> Richard, the temp climbs slowly. How does the placement of the probe affect the
temps? Is that critical ?
> Bob, Kathleen, and Kory Brocious
Bob/Gang:
I agree with Richard. If the temp is increasing
slowly it is probably not getting enough air in
the static, high power setting position. Should
do just fine flying when you have 60 or 70 mph
wind to assist the prop to cool the radiators.
Normal placement of the temp sender for a "normal"
analog gauge is in the cyclinder head, according
to the diagram in the operators manual. I am
ignorant when it comes to EIS procedures.
john h
Message 3
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| Subject: | Poly Spray - Cage |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
Hey Guys,
Thanks for the Info.
I'm not going to spray the inside of the cage and I'll probly
look for some fabric or carpet to protect it from UV rays.
I took my First Bi - annual review today ( Cessna 172 )
I haven't flown for a year and 4 mos. and to top it off the winds were a little
HIGH and mild gusts.
I was a little rusty but I PASSED...Yippieeeeee
It's a good thing too, because it cost 192.50
the price went up on the older Cessnas and it jumped to 35.00per hour for the
instructor.
it's a good thing I'm building my own plane.
How do flight reviews work with the Kolb ?
Do I still have to take it in the Cessna ?
Gotta Fly...
Mike FSII,Color coat soon
---
Sometimes you just have to take the leap
and build your wings on the way down...
Gotta Fly...
Message 4
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| Subject: | Biennial flight reviews |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <rwpike@charter.net>
At 02:09 PM 4/13/03 -0500, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
>
> How do flight reviews work with the Kolb ?
> Do I still have to take it in the Cessna ?
> Gotta Fly...
> Mike FSII,Color coat soon
Depends - on the flight instructor. Since the instructor I fly with was
satisfied that I will be doing all my flying in the Kolb (no VOR, no carb
heat, etc) then he did not feel the need to use a conventional aircraft.
But when I did my power on stalls and retarded the throttle at the break, I
had to be able to justify why I did it differently than would be done in a
conventional aircraft. You have to know why you do what you do, no matter
what you fly.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Tuning the EIS for a 582 |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: <rowedl@highstream.net>
Bob,
Your probe should be near where the hot water exits the engine. Usually
between the engine and the rad, but if the 582 has a place in a cylinder
head for it, that would be fine.
Denny
----- Original Message -----
From: John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tuning the EIS for a 582
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
>
>
> > Richard, the temp climbs slowly. How does the placement of the probe
affect the temps? Is that critical ?
> > Bob, Kathleen, and Kory Brocious
>
> Bob/Gang:
>
> I agree with Richard. If the temp is increasing
> slowly it is probably not getting enough air in
> the static, high power setting position. Should
> do just fine flying when you have 60 or 70 mph
> wind to assist the prop to cool the radiators.
>
> Normal placement of the temp sender for a "normal"
> analog gauge is in the cyclinder head, according
> to the diagram in the operators manual. I am
> ignorant when it comes to EIS procedures.
>
> john h
>
>
Message 6
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Lawrence M. Rice" <tailwind5@juno.com>
Guys,
I'm absolutely terrified of the "nasties" found in polyurethanes and
don't have much more use for the solvents found in other systems (maybe
all those years in the cancer lab I worked in some time ago ruined me). I
heard of a guy in Western Pennsylvania that did his Mk. III with latex
enamel. Have any of y'all heard anything about this? I heard about a year
ago of a water base urethane finish that's supposed to be pretty safe to
work with. Any experience with that?
Thanks,
Larry the MicroMong guy
Message 7
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron Aerial <aerialron@yahoo.com>
A BFR is just a review.
so a 172 review is good enough for a B-747.
As soon as I am done with my M3X I will give BFRs to
any Kolber that wants one in a Kolb. :-)
CaptainRon CFI&I and CFiMei
Also changed my email address
===========================
--- Mike Pierzina <planecrazzzy@lycos.com> wrote:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina"
> <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
>
> Hey Guys,
> Thanks for the Info.
> I'm not going to spray the inside of the cage and
> I'll probly
> look for some fabric or carpet to protect it from UV
> rays.
> I took my First Bi - annual review today (
> Cessna 172 )
> I haven't flown for a year and 4 mos. and to top it
> off the winds were a little HIGH and mild gusts.
> I was a little rusty but I PASSED...Yippieeeeee
> It's a good thing too, because it cost 192.50
> the price went up on the older Cessnas and it
> jumped to 35.00per hour for the instructor.
> it's a good thing I'm building my own plane.
>
> How do flight reviews work with the Kolb ?
> Do I still have to take it in the Cessna ?
> Gotta Fly...
> Mike FSII,Color
> coat soon
> ---
> Sometimes you just have to take the leap
> and build your wings on the way down...
> Gotta Fly...
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm
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Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Fabric Finish |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron Aerial <aerialron@yahoo.com>
My inclination is not to use anything but the tough
urathane paints (as sold with the fabric package), but
I am also interested in that. I am sure though that we
must spray the UV protection for the cloth if we want
any meaningfull life out of it. I guess the question
would be "will latex stick to the UV coating"?
and then just how good will it look.
I painted the fiberglass wing tips on my Beech with
Ace latex paint about 4 years ago. Amazingly enough
its holding really good, it has started to fade a bit,
but can't beat the price.
====================================
> Guys,
> I'm absolutely terrified of the "nasties" found in
> polyurethanes and
> don't have much more use for the solvents found in
> other systems (maybe
> all those years in the cancer lab I worked in some
> time ago ruined me). I
> heard of a guy in Western Pennsylvania that did his
> Mk. III with latex
> enamel. Have any of y'all heard anything about this?
> I heard about a year
> ago of a water base urethane finish that's supposed
> to be pretty safe to
> work with. Any experience with that?
> Thanks,
> Larry the MicroMong guy
>
>
>
> Contributions
> any other
> Forums.
>
> latest messages.
> List members.
>
> http://www.matronics.com/subscription
> http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm
> Digests:http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list
> http://www.matronics.com/archives
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> http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
>
>
>
>
>
Message 9
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
> As soon as I am done with my M3X I will give BFRs to
> any Kolber that wants one in a Kolb. :-)
>
> CaptainRon CFI&I and CFiMei
Ron/Gents/Ladies:
Difficult to get a CFI to give a ride in a MK III,
despite demonstrated reliability for more many,
many years.
A local CFI, who won't fly in my MK III, gives me
mine in a ragged, modified J3 Cub used for banner
towing. The last time I got one in the Cub, also
the first time to flew a Cub from the rear seat, I
never did see where I was going until I landed and
got out of the critter. Was quite an experience.
Much rather fly my MK III.
john h
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Fabric Finish |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
Take a look at the water based paints, Larry. I hear they're very good.
Larry Bourne
Palm Springs, CA
Kolb Mk III - Vamoose
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence M. Rice" <tailwind5@juno.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Fabric Finish
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Lawrence M. Rice" <tailwind5@juno.com>
>
> Guys,
> I'm absolutely terrified of the "nasties" found in polyurethanes and
> don't have much more use for the solvents found in other systems (maybe
> all those years in the cancer lab I worked in some time ago ruined me). I
> heard of a guy in Western Pennsylvania that did his Mk. III with latex
> enamel. Have any of y'all heard anything about this? I heard about a year
> ago of a water base urethane finish that's supposed to be pretty safe to
> work with. Any experience with that?
> Thanks,
> Larry the MicroMong guy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Message 11
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| Subject: | Latex paint on aircraft |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <rwpike@charter.net>
Here are 2 links to using ordinary latex for aircraft use. The second one
has some good pictures of examples.
http://www.lightminiatureaircraft.com/generic34.html
http://www.modelairplanenews.com/how_to/latex1.asp
Several years ago I painted a Hummer with latex with fair results. Here are
the pros and cons:
Pro :
Cheap - very cheap. Sears Weatherbeater works good. Don't buy cheap latex,
get the good stuff, it covers better. I used Weatherbeater black for a base
coat and fabric filler, sprayed it on with a regular paint gun to fill the
weave of the polyester fabric, and UV proof it all with one color. Two
coats gave a good finish and used one gallon of thinned paint.
Use the highest gloss or semi gloss you can get for a top coat, two coats
of yellow covered a black underbase, it covers well.
If you mess up and need to strip any of it off or feather an edge, use
Goof-off, get it at Wal Mart.
Of course latex is totally non toxic, won't orange peel or give a dusty
textured too dry coat, it is really hard to screw it up.
Easy to touch up and repair. Strip the latex off with Goof-Off, patch with
Stits or Randolph glue in the normal fashion, recover with more latex.
Light weight, takes very little paint to fill the fabric & get good color.
Con:
Not nearly as durable as Randolph paints, somewhat less durable than Stits.
Hard to get a high gloss
Dirty, greasy fingerprints show badly. (But 409 takes them off)
Fabric Attachment: I used Rand-O-Bond fabric cement to attach the fabric to
the airframe, it is easier to work with than Stits, ribstitched and taped
in the normal fashion, using Randolph non-taughtening nitrate dope, then
latex from there on.
Would I do it again? I don't know, I have used Randolph, Stits, and el
cheapo latex finishes, and it is sure the easiest. Maybe I won't have to...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Latex paint on aircraft |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <rwpike@charter.net>
At 08:26 PM 4/13/03 -0400, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <rwpike@charter.net>
Note - when I read what I had just sent, it maybe makes it look like I
sprayed all the fabric with Randolph non-taughtening dope - not so. I only
used it on the places where I had taped it or ribstitched it.
Sprayed all the raw fabric (98% of the airplane fabric surface) with latex
after I heat shrank it.
Sorry.
rp
<snip>
>Fabric Attachment: I used Rand-O-Bond fabric cement to attach the fabric to
>the airframe, it is easier to work with than Stits, ribstitched and taped
>in the normal fashion, using Randolph non-taughtening nitrate dope, then
>latex from there on.
>
>Richard Pike
>MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
>
Message 13
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Clay Stuart" <tcstuart@adelphia.net>
What about these wind meters/airspeed indicators for Kolbs? I was wondering about
the possibility of mounting one with a bracket just outside of the windshield.
Would they pass muster with the FAA? Would they be accurate near the windshield?
http://www.benmeadows.com/store/product_group.asp?dept_id2185&cat_prefix3WB
http://www.benmeadows.com/store/product_group.asp?dept_id2185&cat_prefix3WB
I also saw this one:
http://www.windandweather.com/store/Weather_Instruments___Wind_GaugesIN_MAXNOR?SessionIDX2xt6JLo&Args&Pos27
Might look a little dorky with a little aemometer on top of the gap seal or on
the wing, but it could be remotely located.
The only similar ones I can find for airplanes only go up to 60MPH, while these
go to 90 and 200.
Clay Stuart
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Fabric Finish |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: ul15rhb@juno.com
Larry,
A friend of mine painted his Firestar with Latex exterior house paint and
many years later it's doing just fine.
Ralph
Original Firestar painted with Polytone
On Sun, 13 Apr 2003 15:15:43 -0400 "Lawrence M. Rice"
<tailwind5@juno.com> writes:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Lawrence M. Rice"
> <tailwind5@juno.com>
>
> Guys,
> I'm absolutely terrified of the "nasties" found in polyurethanes
> and
> don't have much more use for the solvents found in other systems
> (maybe
> all those years in the cancer lab I worked in some time ago ruined
> me). I
> heard of a guy in Western Pennsylvania that did his Mk. III with
> latex
> enamel. Have any of y'all heard anything about this? I heard about a
> year
> ago of a water base urethane finish that's supposed to be pretty
> safe to
> work with. Any experience with that?
> Thanks,
> Larry the MicroMong guy
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Latex paint on aircraft |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: GeoR38@aol.com
In a message dated 4/13/03 8:28:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
rwpike@charter.net writes:
>
> Here are 2 links to using ordinary latex for aircraft use. The second one
> has some good pictures of examples.
>
> http://www.lightminiatureaircraft.com/generic34.html
>
> http://www.modelairplanenews.com/how_to/latex1.asp
>
> Several years ago I painted a Hummer with latex with fair results. Here are
>
> the pros and cons:
> Pro :
> Cheap - very cheap. Sears Weatherbeater works good. Don't buy cheap latex,
> get the good stuff, it covers better. I used Weatherbeater black for a base
>
> coat and fabric filler, sprayed it on with a regular paint gun to fill the
> weave of the polyester fabric, and UV proof it all with one color. Two
> coats gave a good finish and used one gallon of thinned paint.
> Use the highest gloss or semi gloss you can get for a top coat, two coats
> of yellow covered a black underbase, it covers well.
> If you mess up and need to strip any of it off or feather an edge, use
> Goof-off, get it at Wal Mart.
> Of course latex is totally non toxic, won't orange peel or give a dusty
> textured too dry coat, it is really hard to screw it up.
> Easy to touch up and repair. Strip the latex off with Goof-Off, patch with
> Stits or Randolph glue in the normal fashion, recover with more latex.
> Light weight, takes very little paint to fill the fabric &get good color.
>
> Con:
> Not nearly as durable as Randolph paints, somewhat less durable than Stits.
> Hard to get a high gloss
> Dirty, greasy fingerprints show badly. (But 409 takes them off)
>
>
> Fabric Attachment: I used Rand-O-Bond fabric cement to attach the fabric to
>
> the airframe, it is easier to work with than Stits, ribstitched and taped
> in the normal fashion, using Randolph non-taughtening nitrate dope, then
> latex from there on.
>
> Would I do it again? I don't know, I have used Randolph, Stits, and el
> cheapo latex finishes, and it is sure the easiest. Maybe I won't have to...
>
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
Richard, I latex painted my Firestar with 3 colors of Coronado durothane
latex and it stays on like a champ. The colors are good, the gloss is good,
and the flexibility is very good.
The problems have been that I put it on over polytone by stits and it pulled
the polytone off the fabric over the cage area only...the flexible zipped
part. This caused peeling there which can stick to the adjacent areas of the
wing. I suspect I have too much flexer in my paint as a result of this test.
GeorgeRandolph
447 Firestar driver from Akron O
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Tuning the EIS for a 582 |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: GeoR38@aol.com
In a message dated 4/13/03 9:53:05 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
jhauck@elmore.rr.com writes:
> Normal placement of the temp sender for a "normal"
> analog gauge is in the cyclinder head, according
> to the diagram in the operators manual. I am
> ignorant when it comes to EIS procedures.
>
> john h
>
> Placement of the probes in the exhaust manifold IS critical as (according
to Dennis), there are pulse points of hot and cold. I have placed only one
probe at the Y to pick up both cylinders (kinda a catchall el cheapo
approach) and my temps read higher than most. My temp has gone to 1300 in the
past with no known degradation of the internals. I still make every effort to
keep it lower than 1200 deg F though, such as when the engine is unloaded.
I have experienced a freezeup on an old Cayunna long ago and am familiar with
the quickness of the overtemp dilemma on freezeup.
I have never had a freezeup on my Rotax 447 in spite of the Y probe
placement.
GeorgeRandolph
447 Firestar driver from Akron, O
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