---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 04/21/03: 23 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 06:24 AM - Re: fasten floor plates (John Hauck) 2. 06:32 AM - Re: Ergonomic Foam (WillUribe@aol.com) 3. 07:18 AM - Re: Ergonomic Foam (Richard Pike) 4. 07:32 AM - Re: Ergonomic Foam (John Hauck) 5. 08:14 AM - Re: fasten floor plates (CaptainRon) 6. 08:34 AM - Heat Treat Question (David Key) 7. 12:04 PM - Re: fasten floor plates (possums) 8. 12:43 PM - cheapo sling seats (Jack & Louise Hart) 9. 03:00 PM - Re: Securing Floor Plates (Kirby Dennis Contr ASC/TM) 10. 05:53 PM - slingshot VNE (Joe Allman) 11. 06:12 PM - Re: fasten floor plates (CaptainRon) 12. 06:20 PM - Re: slingshot VNE (Bill Woods) 13. 06:24 PM - Re: Re: Securing Floor Plates (CaptainRon) 14. 06:30 PM - Mark III pics ?? (Larry Austin) 15. 06:40 PM - Re: slingshot VNE (Joe Allman) 16. 06:41 PM - Re: slingshot VNE (Joe Allman) 17. 07:07 PM - Re: slingshot VNE (Bill Woods) 18. 07:11 PM - Re: slingshot VNE (Bill Woods) 19. 09:10 PM - Lar's Building (William Herren) 20. 09:34 PM - Re: Lar's Building (Richard Pike) 21. 10:11 PM - Re: wing supports (DAquaNut@aol.com) 22. 10:20 PM - Re: Mark III pics ?? () 23. 11:54 PM - Re: Lar's Building (Larry Bourne) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 06:24:42 AM PST US From: John Hauck Subject: Re: Kolb-List: fasten floor plates --> Kolb-List message posted by: John Hauck > Btw tinkering with butts, I sure would like > some protection between the south end, and those > thorny cacti. Has anyone fastened Al plates under the > seats? they seem to fit with no trouble if they are > fastened from the bottom side (SS rivets of course) RON Ron/Gang: Yes, I have aluminum pans under my plastic (Ultrastar) seats. However, I have a welded square tube seat frame that the seats are mounted on. The aluminum pans are riveted to the seat frame, a trick I learned from the Jungle and Radio Service (JARS) pilots. One of their pilots stalled and pancaked a Helio Courier. He would have walked away from the crash had the seat not gone through the 4130 seat frame, injuring his spine and causing paralysis from the waist down. The aluminum pan, riveted with SS rivets, is to prevent me going through the 4130 seat frame should the need arise. Would also prevent something from coming up through the bottom of the fuselage. I don't know what kind of seats are in the MK IIIX, but imagine they are the old sling seats. Do you plan on mounting the aluminum pans on the top of the bottom longerons and tubes? One thing that bothered me, and one of the reasons we went with the Ultrastar seats, was the cross tube that hits me right in the tail bone on a standard MK III sling seat. I did not like that and felt it might be a problem waiting to happen. I have survived some fairly serious crashes in the Ultrastar, Firestar, and the MK III. Was able to walk away from them all. Contribute that to the excellent crashworthiness built into the kolb line of airplanes. Haven't had a bad one in more than 11 years (knock on wood). Hoping I never see another. Time is getting short. About 3 weeks until I depart for points west. This morning I will build new vertical stabilizer. Probably take 8 days to complete through paint and one more day to reinstall the tail section. That'll give me enough time to fly some before departure for Monument Valley. Usually, if something is going to break or go wrong, it will a day or two before departure. Take care, john h ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:32:59 AM PST US From: WillUribe@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ergonomic Foam --> Kolb-List message posted by: WillUribe@aol.com Greetings, Here is another webpage for TEMPERFOAM http://www.wingsandwheels.com/page40.htm Will Uribe El Paso, TX FireStar II N4GU C-172 N2506U http://home.elp.rr.com/airplane/ do not archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:18:58 AM PST US From: Richard Pike Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ergonomic Foam --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike Best price so far is from Wicks, 16" X 18" X 1" foam pad for $16. Extra soft part# 19016 Soft part# 19017 Medium part# 19018 Stiff part# 19019 1-800-221-9425 It's on page 57 Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:32:35 AM PST US From: John Hauck Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ergonomic Foam --> Kolb-List message posted by: John Hauck > Stiff part# 19019 > Richard Pike Morning Richard/Gang: Can't go wrong with $16 each. The above is what I have been using for almost 10 yrs. I think I paid $25 from Aircraft Spruce. One inch thick gets the job done. When I bought mine, the sales person recommended "stiff". I didn't really think that was the way to go, but since it was recommended went ahead and ordered it. Now that I have had plenty time to use the "stiff" foam I am glad I did. It works in freezing and well as tropical temps. Takes a little longer to warmup and conform when it is cold, but still works great. I have not need for anything thicker than 1". john h ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:14:09 AM PST US From: CaptainRon Subject: Re: Kolb-List: fasten floor plates --> Kolb-List message posted by: CaptainRon People walk away impressed with the elegance and strength of the design, my only embarrassments when I show the M3X off is the cheapo sling seats. For something that is on par with light production aircraft those cheapo hammocks don't belong there. Looking around for something better. Do not archive ================== I don't know what kind of seats are in the MK IIIX, but imagine they are the old sling seats. ===== Building M3X Southern Arizona http://search.yahoo.com ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:34:58 AM PST US From: "David Key" Subject: Kolb-List: Heat Treat Question --> Kolb-List message posted by: "David Key" I bent a gear leg. Found out how much a new one costs. Then sent it to a machine shop to bend it back. They heated it to do it. They said it would ruin the heat treating. I said go ahead. I put the leg back on the plane. It works fine so far. Do I have a more brittle gear leg now? Will it spring back? If I send it off to get heat treated will they have to somehow wash off all the old heat treating. Then start with the new one? I don't understand a thing about this. Dave ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:04:34 PM PST US From: possums Subject: Re: Kolb-List: fasten floor plates --> Kolb-List message posted by: possums At 08:13 AM 4/21/2003 -0700, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: CaptainRon > >People walk away impressed with the elegance and >strength of the design, my only embarrassments when I >show the M3X off is the cheapo sling seats. >For something that is on par with light production >aircraft those cheapo hammocks don't belong there. >Looking around for something better. > >Do not archive I used an "Office Depot" chair with the firm Temperfoam as replacement foam in the bottom seat - one too many crashes. http://www.mindspring.com/~possums/Snapinseat.jpg ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 12:43:06 PM PST US From: Jack & Louise Hart Subject: Kolb-List: cheapo sling seats --> Kolb-List message posted by: Jack & Louise Hart For the weight and comfort, they are hard to beat. Jack B. Hart FF004 Jackson, MO At 08:13 AM 4/21/03 -0700, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: CaptainRon > >People walk away impressed with the elegance and >strength of the design, my only embarrassments when I >show the M3X off is the cheapo sling seats. >For something that is on par with light production >aircraft those cheapo hammocks don't belong there. >Looking around for something better. > >Do not archive > >================== > >I don't know what kind of seats are in the MK >IIIX, but imagine they are the old sling seats. > >===== >Building M3X >Southern Arizona > >http://search.yahoo.com > > Jack & Louise Hart jbhart@ldd.net ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 03:00:20 PM PST US From: Kirby Dennis Contr ASC/TM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Securing Floor Plates --> Kolb-List message posted by: Kirby Dennis Contr ASC/TM CaptainRon wrote: << Has anyone installed and fastened their floor plates without using rivets into the tubing? >> Cap'n Ron, and Kolbers - I secured my floorpans using short stainless steel sheet metal screws. My reasoning was not from concern of weakening cage structure, but to provide easy access to stuff under the floors. And it's already paid off. Glad I did it this way. Dennis Kirby Mark-3, Verner, Powerfin-72 in Cedar Crest, NM ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 05:53:44 PM PST US From: "Joe Allman" Subject: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" Evening kolbers, I'm a long time lurker looking for some slingshot specs. Anyone have a ballpark VNE or VNO for a slingshot? Thanks, Joe ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:12:50 PM PST US From: CaptainRon Subject: Re: Kolb-List: fasten floor plates --> Kolb-List message posted by: CaptainRon I used an "Office Depot" chair with the firm Temperfoam as replacement foam in the bottom seat - one too many crashes. =============== Now thats an excellent idea, we even have one of those in town. I guess I'll go shopping for seats soon. :-) do not archive ===== Building M3X Southern Arizona http://search.yahoo.com ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 06:20:11 PM PST US From: "Bill Woods" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bill Woods" 120 mph. But I've seen 130. Bill Woods 912S Slingshot From: "Joe Allman" Subject: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" Evening kolbers, I'm a long time lurker looking for some slingshot specs. Anyone have a ballpark VNE or VNO for a slingshot? Thanks, Joe ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 06:24:25 PM PST US From: CaptainRon Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Securing Floor Plates --> Kolb-List message posted by: CaptainRon I agree, I bought a box of #6 ss screws earlier today at Ace Aerospace :-) I'll use those on the remaining plates. ================================================ I secured my floorpans using short stainless steel sheet metal screws. My reasoning was not from concern of weakening cage structure, but to provide easy access to stuff under the floors. And it's already paid off. Glad I did it this way. ===== Building M3X Southern Arizona http://search.yahoo.com ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 06:30:05 PM PST US From: "Larry Austin" Subject: Kolb-List: Mark III pics ?? --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Austin" BlankHello Group, Anyone know of a site that has some good pics, inside and out, of a Mark III Xtra? Thanks in advance, Larry ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 06:40:11 PM PST US From: "Joe Allman" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" Thanks Bill, 120 is what I thought I remembered. How about the upper end of the VNO? I'm trying to color code my ASI. Thanks again, Joe -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill Woods Subject: Re: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bill Woods" 120 mph. But I've seen 130. Bill Woods 912S Slingshot From: "Joe Allman" Subject: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" Evening kolbers, I'm a long time lurker looking for some slingshot specs. Anyone have a ballpark VNE or VNO for a slingshot? Thanks, Joe ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 06:41:34 PM PST US From: "Joe Allman" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" 130? Big engine or gravity assist? -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill Woods Subject: Re: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bill Woods" 120 mph. But I've seen 130. Bill Woods 912S Slingshot From: "Joe Allman" Subject: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" Evening kolbers, I'm a long time lurker looking for some slingshot specs. Anyone have a ballpark VNE or VNO for a slingshot? Thanks, Joe ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 07:07:56 PM PST US From: "Bill Woods" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bill Woods" Normal cruise aruond 5000 rpm is about 100-105 mph with 912S. Bill From: "Joe Allman" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" Thanks Bill, 120 is what I thought I remembered. How about the upper end of the VNO? I'm trying to color code my ASI. Thanks again, Joe -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill Woods Subject: Re: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Bill Woods" 120 mph. But I've seen 130. Bill Woods 912S Slingshot From: "Joe Allman" Subject: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" Evening kolbers, I'm a long time lurker looking for some slingshot specs. Anyone have a ballpark VNE or VNO for a slingshot? Thanks, Joe ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 07:11:54 PM PST US From: "Bill Woods" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bill Woods" 5500 rpm will show around 115 mph, add a little dive and watch the speed rise. Bill From: "Joe Allman" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" 130? Big engine or gravity assist? -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com]On Behalf Of Bill Woods Subject: Re: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Bill Woods" 120 mph. But I've seen 130. Bill Woods 912S Slingshot From: "Joe Allman" Subject: Kolb-List: slingshot VNE -- Kolb-List message posted by: "Joe Allman" Evening kolbers, I'm a long time lurker looking for some slingshot specs. Anyone have a ballpark VNE or VNO for a slingshot? Thanks, Joe ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 09:10:00 PM PST US From: "William Herren" Subject: Kolb-List: Lar's Building --> Kolb-List message posted by: "William Herren" From: "Peter Volum" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Discovery Wings --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Peter Volum" DTV does carry it Lar. It's a channel well worth having. When I added it to my programming package, it only required a minor change and minimal extra cost. Give them a call. You won't regret it (though your building will suffer). Peter. Do not archive Peter, don't worry about Lar's building - he lives in a trailer. (and Vamousse is almost finished) Bill ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 09:34:34 PM PST US From: Richard Pike Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Lar's Building --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike At 04:09 AM 4/22/03 +0000, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "William Herren" > >Peter, don't worry about Lar's building - he lives in a trailer. >(and Vamousse is almost finished) Bill I thought Vamousse was something he put on his hair??? Richard Pike MKIII N420p (420ldPoops) Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 10:11:54 PM PST US From: DAquaNut@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List:wing supports --> Kolb-List message posted by: DAquaNut@aol.com Group: Ive been in lurk mode for a while. Ive been working on my trailer when not taking care of my 91year old Mom. Anyway, Ive got my trailer to the point of needing fastening devices for main gear wheels. Also ,I want to make some sort of wing cradles to support the wings in transit when they are removed . I plan on using the wing attach points to secure the root end of the wing. I also need to make a dolly to move my Firefly around. Any ideas? If there is anything in the archives on these subjects I guess I dont know how to bring them up . Ed in Houston Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 10:20:10 PM PST US From: Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Mark III pics ?? --> Kolb-List message posted by: Larry, Check the PhotoShare maybe, and I think Lisa Turners web sight probably has some nice photos of her Extra. You can find a link to her web sight at TNKs web. Denny Rowe Mk-3, western PA ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Austin Subject: Kolb-List: Mark III pics ?? > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Austin" > > BlankHello Group, > Anyone know of a site that has some good pics, inside and out, of a Mark III > Xtra? Thanks in advance, > > Larry > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 11:54:00 PM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Lar's Building --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Years ago, in my salad days, I used Chocolate Mousse. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Kolb Mk III - Vamoose N78LB www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Pike" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Lar's Building > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike > > At 04:09 AM 4/22/03 +0000, you wrote: > > >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "William Herren" > > > >Peter, don't worry about Lar's building - he lives in a trailer. > >(and Vamousse is almost finished) Bill > > I thought Vamousse was something he put on his hair??? > > Richard Pike > MKIII N420p (420ldPoops) > > > Do Not Archive > >