Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:11 AM - Web Site (Larry Bourne)
2. 04:00 AM - Re: Web Site (ronnie wehba)
3. 04:41 AM - Re: landing gear (ronnie wehba)
4. 05:37 AM - Exhaust brackets (Mike Pierzina)
5. 05:52 AM - KXP?????????? (Kirk Smith)
6. 07:52 AM - Momument Valley (jrodebush)
7. 08:18 AM - Re: Web Site (Larry Bourne)
8. 08:26 AM - Wing Rack (Mike Pierzina)
9. 09:01 AM - Re: Wing Rack (John Cooley)
10. 09:44 AM - GPS (Richard Harris)
11. 10:15 AM - Re: GPS (Dallas Shepherd)
12. 11:05 AM - Re: KXP?????????? (George Thompson)
13. 02:17 PM - The Factory... (Paul Petty)
14. 02:28 PM - Re: KXP?????????? (Jim Ballenger)
15. 02:53 PM - Re: Wing Rack (Richard Pike)
16. 07:48 PM - Re: Wing Rack ()
17. 08:07 PM - Re: landing gear (Richard Swiderski)
18. 08:19 PM - Re: KXP?????????? (HShack@aol.com)
19. 08:22 PM - Re: KXP?????????? (GeoR38@aol.com)
Message 1
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
Do not Archive.
Not Kolb related, I guess, but several people have asked why the "Jasper N.P."
link on my website doesn't do anything. Mainly cause there wasn't anything for
it to open, but since I've been on a roll lately, I went ahead tonight, and
built the page. It was kind of a shame..............one of the most beautiful
drives in the world, and it was quite un-pleasant in some ways. I'm going back
thru there again in mid July, to see if it was just me. I hope you-all enjoy
it. Same with the British Columbia pages.................I sure had a ball
on that trip, and Jasper was the next step after Hyder, AK. Now, I hafta
bring "Building Vamoose" up to date.
http://www.webpictures.homestead.com/travelling.html
Click on "Jasper N.P." Lar. Do not Archive.
Larry Bourne
Palm Springs, CA
Kolb Mk III - Vamoose N78LB
www.gogittum.com
Message 2
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DATE_IN_FUTURE_06_12, ORIGINAL_MESSAGE, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,
REFERENCES)
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba@wtxs.net>
what kind of camera you using, JUST great pictures!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Web Site
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
>
> Do not Archive.
> Not Kolb related, I guess, but several people have asked why the "Jasper
N.P." link on my website doesn't do anything. Mainly cause there wasn't
anything for it to open, but since I've been on a roll lately, I went ahead
tonight, and built the page. It was kind of a shame..............one of the
most beautiful drives in the world, and it was quite un-pleasant in some
ways. I'm going back thru there again in mid July, to see if it was just
me. I hope you-all enjoy it. Same with the British Columbia
pages.................I sure had a ball on that trip, and Jasper was the
next step after Hyder, AK. Now, I hafta bring "Building Vamoose" up to
date.
>
> http://www.webpictures.homestead.com/travelling.html
>
> Click on "Jasper N.P." Lar. Do not
Archive.
>
> Larry Bourne
> Palm Springs, CA
> Kolb Mk III - Vamoose N78LB
> www.gogittum.com
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: landing gear |
DATE_IN_FUTURE_06_12, ORIGINAL_MESSAGE, QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,
REFERENCES)
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba@wtxs.net>
What is involved in the change?off list is ok.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Swiderski" <swiderski@advanced-connect.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: landing gear
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard Swiderski"
<swiderski@advanced-connect.net>
>
> Ronnie,
>
> My reasons were as follows:
> 1) every bump is transmitted to every rivot & bolt in the airframe.
> 2) I was using my US as a lawn mower too often.
> 3) It restricted the prop diameter.
> 4) Tortoise holes, ant hills & hidden ruts too often bent or broke the
gear.
> Going to a shock absorbing taller gear solved all of these (for me,
> serious) problems. Raising the gear a foot, dropping the engine a few
> inches & adding a gearbox (which replaced the multi-V belt redrive that
was
> prone to cracking & no longer available for parts, plus it made a few more
> inches clearance between prop & boomtube) gave me greater ground clearance
&
> allowed the use of a 60" prop which in turn boosted the static thrust from
> 225lb with the 50" prop to 275lb with the 60" prop. Later, I inlaid
p-tips
> into the prop which took the thrust to over 300lbs. Over all, it made a
> huge difference in performance and rough field capability. ...Richard
> Swiderski
>
> .
> > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba@wtxs.net>
> >
> > I have read about a gear leg change on the ultrastar?, why is that, mine
> is completely stock.
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Exhaust brackets |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
Hey Guys,
This is a RE- post (most of you were outa town)
I tried searching the archives concerning the problem that was talked about
the exhaust brackets that were cracking....( NO LUCK ).did you guys replace
them
I would like to make it right the FIRST time.
Gotta Fly...Mike
---
Sometimes you just have to take the leap
and build your wings on the way down...
Gotta Fly...
Get advanced SPAM filtering on Webmail or POP Mail ... Get Lycos Mail!
Message 5
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Kirk Smith" <snuffy@usol.com>
Group,
What is the KXP model Kolb? Is it the firestar 2? Features? Thanks!!! Kirk
Message 6
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "jrodebush" <jrodebush@cinci.rr.com>
Time: 09:45:54 PM PST US
From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Monument Valley
Great pictures and narrative. Thanks. This is a great incentive to get my butt
in gear & start building.
Rex Rodebush do not archive
Message 7
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
Olympus C-720, 3 megapixel digital. Thanks................all compliments
gratefully accepted. Do not Archive.
Larry Bourne
Palm Springs, CA
Kolb Mk III - Vamoose N78LB
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba@wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Web Site
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba@wtxs.net>
>
> what kind of camera you using, JUST great pictures!
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
> To: <Kolb-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Kolb-List: Web Site
>
>
> > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
> >
> > Do not Archive.
> > Not Kolb related, I guess, but several people have asked why the "Jasper
> N.P." link on my website doesn't do anything. Mainly cause there wasn't
> anything for it to open, but since I've been on a roll lately, I went
ahead
> tonight, and built the page. It was kind of a shame..............one of
the
> most beautiful drives in the world, and it was quite un-pleasant in some
> ways. I'm going back thru there again in mid July, to see if it was just
> me. I hope you-all enjoy it. Same with the British Columbia
> pages.................I sure had a ball on that trip, and Jasper was the
> next step after Hyder, AK. Now, I hafta bring "Building Vamoose" up to
> date.
> >
> > http://www.webpictures.homestead.com/travelling.html
> >
> > Click on "Jasper N.P." Lar. Do not
> Archive.
> >
> > Larry Bourne
> > Palm Springs, CA
> > Kolb Mk III - Vamoose N78LB
> > www.gogittum.com
> >
> >
>
>
Message 8
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
Hey Guys,
While I've been building my plane I've aways been TIGHT on SPACE.
When the wings were done (skeleton) they took up alot of room, but they could
be HUNG UP,but it seemed they were always in the way...
Once I started the "fabric stage" I thought they would really be a "bear" to deal
with.
I had a little furniture cart (4caster swivel wheels) so I put a 1" sq.tubing
frame,higher than the wing so it could be secured to the rack.... It works great
, The wings can be moved anywhere,any direction, one wing or both. the leading
edge rests on the carpet of the cart and I slapped some duct tape on the sq.
tubing to smooth it out. The carts are around $14.
Some guys asked for pictures of it , but the ones I had didn't
show it very good...
I took some pictures of it on my last roll, and their back....So if you would
like to see it just let me know. I think the cart is going to be handy to have
even after it's done,or is it ever done ?
I know after mine is flying I'll have alot of other MOD'S to improve it , and
I'm sure the wings will be in the way....
Gotta Fly...
Mike
---
Sometimes you just have to take the leap
and build your wings on the way down...
Gotta Fly...
Get advanced SPAM filtering on Webmail or POP Mail ... Get Lycos Mail!
Message 9
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Cooley" <johnc@datasync.com>
Hi Mike,=0D
I would like to see your rack. I have similar problems moving the wings
around.=0D
=0D
Thanks,=0D
John =0D
=0D
-------Original Message-------=0D
=0D
From: kolb-list@matronics.com=0D
Subject: Kolb-List: Wing Rack=0D
=0D
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>=0D
=0D
Hey Guys,=0D
While I've been building my plane I've aways been TIGHT on
SPACE.=0D
When the wings were done (skeleton) they took up alot of room, but they
could be HUNG UP,but it seemed they were always in the way...=0D
Once I started the "fabric stage" I thought they would really be a "bear" to
deal with.=0D
I had a little furniture cart (4caster swivel wheels) so I put a 1" sq
tubing frame,higher than the wing so it could be secured to the rack.... It
works great , The wings can be moved anywhere,any direction, one wing or
both. the leading edge rests on the carpet of the cart and I slapped some
duct tape on the sq. tubing to smooth it out. The carts are around $14.=0D
Some guys asked for pictures of it , but the ones I had
didn't show it very good...=0D
I took some pictures of it on my last roll, and their back....So if you
would like to see it just let me know. I think the cart is going to be handy
to have even after it's done,or is it ever done ?=0D
I know after mine is flying I'll have alot of other MOD'S to improve it ,
and I'm sure the wings will be in the way....=0D
Gotta Fly...=0D
Mike=0D
=0D
=0D
---=0D
Sometimes you just have to take the leap=0D
and build your wings on the way down...=0D
Gotta Fly...=0D
=0D
=0D
Get advanced SPAM filtering on Webmail or POP Mail ... Get Lycos Mail!=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=2E
Message 10
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard Harris" <rharris@magnolia-net.com>
Hey Gang, I need some input.. I have a opportunity to buy a Garmin GPS 90
that a friend of a friend had in his airplane when crashed.
I can get the unit and everything that came with the original GPS 90 kit for
$150.00. Anyone know anything about this GPS?
Thanks,
Richard Harris
MK3 N912RH
Lewisville, Arkansas
Message 11
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Dallas Shepherd" <cen23954@centurytel.net>
Richard: I have used a GPS 90 since 1997 and was considered right up with
the top=0D
hand helds at that time. I like it and have used it a lot. Takes some
practice to use =0D
all the programs. Try to get the direction book with it so you won't be
lost with all =0D
the things its capable of. I hooked it into the 12 volts of my kolb and
used it constantly=0D
while flying. Liked to check my speed with it also. You'll like it for
that price. It=0D
survives crashes too.=0D
Dallas Shepherd=0D
Norfork, Arkansas=0D
Former Kolb owner=0D
=0D
-------Original Message-------=0D
=0D
From: kolb-list@matronics.com=0D
Subject: Kolb-List: GPS=0D
=0D
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard Harris" <rharris@magnolia-net.com>=0D
=0D
Hey Gang, I need some input.. I have a opportunity to buy a Garmin GPS 90=0D
that a friend of a friend had in his airplane when crashed.=0D
I can get the unit and everything that came with the original GPS 90 kit for=0D
$150.00. Anyone know anything about this GPS?=0D
=0D
Thanks,=0D
=0D
Richard Harris=0D
MK3 N912RH=0D
Lewisville, Arkansas=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=0D
=2E
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: KXP?????????? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "George Thompson" <eagle1@commspeed.net>
The KXP is the single place heavy duty Firestar. It has the stronger 7 rib
wing as opposed to the earler 6 rib.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kirk Smith" <snuffy@usol.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: KXP??????????
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Kirk Smith" <snuffy@usol.com>
>
> Group,
>
> What is the KXP model Kolb? Is it the firestar 2? Features?
Thanks!!! Kirk
>
>
Message 13
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Paul Petty" <ppetty@c-gate.net>
Kolbers,
What a ride!!!! First ride in a Kolb for Charlie and I and let me say...WOW!!!!
way more than Charley or I expected.
I guess that I have been apprehensive about flying in one of these planes from
the start but love the way they look and respect the way they are admired by all
of you. Second the numbers of the aircraft are very impressive and sorta like
my HD power numbers grabbed some of you guys attention, so did the Kolb. Before
I tell you of the great experience we had, let me first thank the folks at
the TNK factory. What a class act!
Charley and I punched out at 0500 from LUL and had planned to be there by 10:00am
to spend the day. So much for that. We made it about 40 miles north, in hopes
that conditions would improve when the call was made that it was IFR to any
stops that we had planned for fuel. So back to LUL we went and waited it out.
At 0900 it looked like we may be able to make Huntsville, our only gas stop
so we went for it. How did that go? NOT TOO GOOD... Was forced west into Muscle
Shoals because of IFR conditions.
Determined, we waited there for a while and conditions improved for a shot at Shelbyville.So
off we went. Made Shelbyville no probe but still a ways from London.
I called Linda from there and told her that depending on conditions we should
be able to make it by late Friday. She said that they would set up a Saturday
visit for us and that was the plan. As you know, I'm a student pilot with
only 23 hrs. This for me was an adventure in it's self so I'm not complaining.
Had the opportunity to see a lot of airports,FBO's, dandy aircraft and FBO attendants!!!!:-)
Acutely did a weight load chart to see if one darling FBO attendant
would fit...errs got to lose 20 more lbs.... oh well..... Back to the
trip. We hammered out of Shelbyville and from there on I'm glad I was flying
with a veteran pilot like Charley Harris. Geezzz folks I was butt puckered for
the next 2.8 hrs we flew through the mountains (as we flat Landers call them)
Hills to the rest of the aviation public, very poor conditions, clouds just
over the top of the wings, who knows what just under. Spooky stuff for me folks.
But in the end we arrive at LON at 4:00pm and jump on the cell phones.
Yall all know the factory's answering service.. I could not reach Linda so went
for parts. Turns out parts guy, forgive me cant remember his name answers....
Thank god!!! and turns out he is a "Beast fan" said he is a cloak listener of
the list but got a gas out of my project. After all was said and done with the
phone tag Norm arrived and we crammed into his sports car for a ride to the
factory. Note to Kolb customers.... If Norm come's to pick you up? Fasten your
seatbelt... Just a note......trust me.....
Norm was kind enough as well as Linda and Don to stay late and give us a demo ride
and tour of the factory.
After we had a look around the facility's Norm had made a few fly by's in the Mark
III Xtra and Charley as well as myself were worn slap out from the whole trip
but hopes were high weather was perfect and the time came to shut up, get
in, and go flying.....
Norm as I understand is a great pilot (also a salesperson for Kolb) Hell of a sports
car driver...(needs to have the right rear checked on that 100mph sports
car Only if ya ask me)
He does a great job I strapped in after signing the waivers""" reminded me of Disney
World""" and scared shitless of ' First time in a Stick and Rudder tail
dragger (only after hearing all the horror stories about these contraptions).......
here we go............
Norm, Our Demo Pilot was very good to explain the aircraft as we taxied onto the
runway. He fully explained how Kolb aircraft worked and was personal to me as
a Cessna 150 student pilot. He said " I flew Cessna's for 20 years and in the
70's "Ultralight aircraft was introduced to me and I said nope'''' no thanks'''''
He went on to demonstrate to me how Cessna student pilots tend to climb
out at higher altitudes and veer away from possible landing site in case of trouble.
The Mark III X-TRA has been the plane of my choice from the get-go............
After Meeting John Hauck and Looking at his unique MkIII I wanted taller landing
gear.....
Charley was so tired from the trip he went up with Norm and was Highly impressed...but.....
We hung around ad drilled the factory folks about engines/Kits/competition
Let me close with this......
The Kolbra.... WOW after all we did and all we were able to do there... the KOLBRA
No doubt the first Kolb that we will build hands down..........
Trip home out of London was wonderful I flew 217 out of Huntsville to LUL and Charley
flew the CO-150 to the farm. TAT 12.6
Thanks to everyone @ the TNK Factory
pp....
N4958P
archive if you wish
God Bless
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: KXP?????????? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jim Ballenger" <ulpilot@cavtel.net>
Kirk
The FS KXP is of the 1990 vintage. It is a single place with each wing
having 7 ribs instead of 5 as the FS KX does. In addition to the stronger
wing, a rotax 503 can be used for power instead of the 447. The FS 1 and 2
model have larger cockpits than the KXP.
Jim Ballenger
Flying a FS KXP 447
Building a MK III X
Virginia Beach, VA
DO NOT ARCHIVE
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kirk Smith" <snuffy@usol.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: KXP??????????
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Kirk Smith" <snuffy@usol.com>
>
> Group,
>
> What is the KXP model Kolb? Is it the firestar 2? Features?
Thanks!!! Kirk
>
>
Message 15
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <rwpike@charter.net>
At 10:25 AM 5/24/03 -0500, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
>
>Hey Guys,
> While I've been building my plane I've aways been TIGHT
> on SPACE.
> When the wings were done (skeleton) they took up alot of room, but they
> could be HUNG UP,but it seemed they were always in the way... <snip>
I hang my wings up one on either side of a two car garage, horizontally &
next to the ceiling, airfoil bottom side down. At the root end of the wing,
I have a six foot long section of 2" pvc pipe suspended horizontally from
the ceiling. About 2/3's toward the tip, I have another 6' length of 2"
pvc hung from the ceiling by one end. Hanging adjacent to the other end of
the 6' length of pvc is a loop of cord. The pvc pipe is just far enough
from the ceiling that the wings will lay flat on them, yet my wife and I
can still reach high enough to get the wings on them. My wife and I raise
the wing up and I slide the wing root end over the one level pvc tube. Then
while she continues to hold the wingtip end up, I raise the other pvc pipe
to horizontal, taking up the weight of the wing, and slip the cord loop
over the end of the pipe. Then all I need to do is anchor the ailerons and
flaps because they tend to hang down too far.
Maybe that is something useful to somebody.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Message 16
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: <rowedl@highstream.net>
Mike,
The photos worked fine, where did you buy the cart?
Denny
----- Original Message -----
From: Mike Pierzina <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Wing Rack
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
>
> Hey Guys,
> While I've been building my plane I've aways been TIGHT
on SPACE.
> When the wings were done (skeleton) they took up alot of room, but they
could be HUNG UP,but it seemed they were always in the way...
> Once I started the "fabric stage" I thought they would really be a "bear"
to deal with.
> I had a little furniture cart (4caster swivel wheels) so I put a 1"
sq.tubing frame,higher than the wing so it could be secured to the rack....
It works great , The wings can be moved anywhere,any direction, one wing or
both. the leading edge rests on the carpet of the cart and I slapped some
duct tape on the sq. tubing to smooth it out. The carts are around $14.
> Some guys asked for pictures of it , but the ones I had
didn't show it very good...
> I took some pictures of it on my last roll, and their back....So if you
would like to see it just let me know. I think the cart is going to be
handy to have even after it's done,or is it ever done ?
> I know after mine is flying I'll have alot of other MOD'S to improve it
> Gotta Fly...
> Mike
>
>
> ---
> Sometimes you just have to take the leap
> and build your wings on the way down...
> Gotta Fly...
>
>
> Get advanced SPAM filtering on Webmail or POP Mail ... Get Lycos Mail!
>
>
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: landing gear |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard Swiderski" <swiderski@advanced-connect.net>
Ronnie,
Its a long story, its already in the archives. If you can't find it
give me a call some evening before 10pm.
Richard Swiderski
352-307-9009
----- Original Message -----
From: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba@wtxs.net>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: landing gear
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba@wtxs.net>
>
> What is involved in the change?off list is ok.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard Swiderski" <swiderski@advanced-connect.net>
> To: <kolb-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: landing gear
>
>
> > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard Swiderski"
> <swiderski@advanced-connect.net>
> >
> > Ronnie,
> >
> > My reasons were as follows:
> > 1) every bump is transmitted to every rivot & bolt in the airframe.
> > 2) I was using my US as a lawn mower too often.
> > 3) It restricted the prop diameter.
> > 4) Tortoise holes, ant hills & hidden ruts too often bent or broke the
> gear.
> > Going to a shock absorbing taller gear solved all of these (for me,
> > serious) problems. Raising the gear a foot, dropping the engine a few
> > inches & adding a gearbox (which replaced the multi-V belt redrive that
> was
> > prone to cracking & no longer available for parts, plus it made a few
more
> > inches clearance between prop & boomtube) gave me greater ground
clearance
> &
> > allowed the use of a 60" prop which in turn boosted the static thrust
from
> > 225lb with the 50" prop to 275lb with the 60" prop. Later, I inlaid
> p-tips
> > into the prop which took the thrust to over 300lbs. Over all, it made a
> > huge difference in performance and rough field capability. ...Richard
> > Swiderski
> >
> > .
> > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "ronnie wehba" <rwehba@wtxs.net>
> > >
> > > I have read about a gear leg change on the ultrastar?, why is that,
mine
> > is completely stock.
> >
> >
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: KXP?????????? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: HShack@aol.com
In a message dated 5/24/03 5:29:00 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
ulpilot@cavtel.net writes:
> The FS KXP is of the 1990 vintage. It is a single place with each wing
> having 7 ribs instead of 5 as the FS KX does. In addition to the stronger
> wing, a rotax 503 can be used for power instead of the 447. The FS 1 and 2
> model have larger cockpits than the KXP.
> Jim Ballenger
>
With a 503 DCDI it seems to fly a little better than a FS II. There seems to
be no way to put more than a 5 gallon fuel tank in [permanently].
Shack
FS II
SC
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: KXP?????????? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: GeoR38@aol.com
In a message dated 5/24/03 8:53:13 AM Eastern Daylight Time, snuffy@usol.com
writes:
>
> Group,
>
> What is the KXP model Kolb? Is it the firestar 2? Features? Thanks!!!
> Kirk
>
>
I have a KX, which is just after the Original, I think....it has the option
to not cover the fuselage behind the pilots head, and is supposed to have a new
technique for folding the elevator (although mine still had the old original
approach) and the KXP was the same thing except for the 7 rib wing.
George Randolph
driver of the first KX, I think 1992
Akron, ohio, home of LeBron James
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