Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 07:01 AM - Re: Epoxy Primer (Bob Bean)
2. 01:02 PM - road trip (bryan green)
3. 01:16 PM - Re:Epoxy Primer (Mike Pierzina)
4. 03:07 PM - Houston we have a problem (Paul Petty)
5. 04:53 PM - 800 times ?? (Mike Pierzina)
6. 05:01 PM - Re: Re:Epoxy Primer (Beauford)
7. 05:02 PM - Houston ? (Mike Pierzina)
8. 05:59 PM - Re: Houston we have a problem (Richard Pike)
9. 06:22 PM - Re: Houston we have a problem (Beauford)
10. 08:10 PM - Re: Houston we have a problem (Steven Green)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Epoxy Primer |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Bob Bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
Richard Pike wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org>
>
>Were you spraying it? I brushed mine, & 1/2 gallon would be more than
>plenty,
>
>Richard Pike
>
>
Agreed......spraying all those little tubes might use about 800 times as
much paint
as brushing. I tried SEM self-etching primer in the spray can, outrageously
expensive and not very good stuff. (tried it on a car repair).
Once again though, on my steel airframe tubing I used Rustoleum satin
outdoor furniture paint in spray cans. Very durable, rust-resistant, the
spruce
green "looks like" green chromate. Since I did a lot of structural
repairs and
mods on my used/bent cage and several added tabs it was handy to just
wire brush a newly welded area and give it a touchup shot.
-And YES, I had zero problems gluing directly over it with polytac, after
giving it a reasonable hardening period. -BB
>
>
>>
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>
>
>
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Message 2
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "bryan green" <lgreen1@sc.rr.com>
I will be in Alpharetta Ga. next week at a training school (work related) are there
any Kolb builders or drivers in this town I could visit one afternoon?
Bryan Green Elgin SC
Firestar I 19LBG 377 BRS
Message 3
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
Richard/Guys,
Yeah, I was spraying it...alot of it went anywhere "but" a tube...
Snip>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Were you spraying it? I brushed mine, & 1/2 gallon would be more than
plenty, which is what you get with Randolph at those prices.
Gotta Fly...
Mike in MN
do not archive
---
My Web Site:
http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html
Sometimes you just have to take the leap
and build your wings on the way down...
Gotta Fly...
Message 4
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| Subject: | Houston we have a problem |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Paul Petty" <Lynnp@c-gate.net>
Kolbers,
I really need your help here. Last night I started on the aileron construction.
After making the leading edge I laid it up next to the trailing edge of the wing
to cross check the comic book for correctness length wise and so forth and
noticed for the first time that the trailing edge of the wing has a very slight
warp to it. YIKES!!!! Looked at the first wing and same thing! the warp is
length wise and if you stand at the root and look down the TE you can see it.
My concern is this. How much is too much and has anyone else noticed this? How
did this happen? My saw horses are dead perfect level and I check them each day
before starting work and often check them during construction like between
major phases. They are made of spruce and glued to the floor with bon-doe backed
up with cleats. Reason I check them is because seasons have changed in this
process and I'm checking for swelling and contraction. Never looked at the wing
from this angle. My thinking at this point is that this might cause the aileron
hinges to bind. I plan to break out the laser tonight and get an exact measurement
of the warp. Another concern is wondering if Kolb shipped me the correct
material. The beginning of the aileron construction pages state the wall
thickness for the leading edges are made from .058" stock. But what they sent
me and what is called for in other parts of the big book says .035" material.
I have a set of MarkIII plans for flap construction purposes printed in 1990 calls
for .023"? Makes me wonder if perhaps over the years this problem may have
occurred and going to a thicker material may prevent this from happening.
By the way the warp is upward in the center of the wing with the root and tip being
the low points.
Any ideas here guys?
Shaking my head and going to read more comics down at the hanger.....
Paul Petty
Building Ms. Dixie
Kolbra/912UL/Warp
do not archive
Message 5
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
Hey Bob/Guys,
I used an Air Brush when I sprayed it, So were talkin only about
400 times...he he he
Snip>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Agreed......spraying all those little tubes might use about 800 times as
much paint
Gotta Fly...
do not archive Mike in MN
---
My Web Site:
http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html
Sometimes you just have to take the leap
and build your wings on the way down...
Gotta Fly...
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: re:Epoxy Primer |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford" <beauford@tampabay.rr.com>
Guys:
I shot mine on the cage with an airbrush....A standard Paasche airbrush...
not a regular paint spraygun.... Airbrush gives the nice sprayed finish, is
relatively fast, and shoots the primer only where you want it...wastes very
little primer....
Fer what it's worth...
Do not archive
Cheap Beauford, The Aluminum Butcher of Brandon, FL
FF #076
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
> Richard/Guys,
> Yeah, I was spraying it...alot of it went anywhere "but" a
tube...
>
Message 7
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@lycos.com>
Hey Paul,
Houston would ask you if you rotated the tube before you assembled it...
then they would tell you to put something soft under the middle and (with a
friend) try to get some of the bow out of it without KINKING the tube...
If it helps... they ALL probly have ALITTLE bow to them...
Gotta Fly...
Mike in MN
do not archive
---
My Web Site:
http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html
Sometimes you just have to take the leap
and build your wings on the way down...
Gotta Fly...
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Houston we have a problem |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org>
Without actually seeing how much bend you have it is hard to be dogmatic,
but I suspect you won't have a problem. The .035 thickness of the aileron
leading edge is not all that much and I suspect the aileron will be able to
flex enough that you won't notice any binding.
As concerning Kolb going from .023 to .035 wall thickness, I suspect that
it has more to do with keeping the aileron leading edge from turning into
too flexible a torque tube than keeping it from bending. With the thinner
wall thickness, I can visualize that at high speeds, you have put in a lot
of aileron input, but out at the tip, you get very little deflection. Thus,
go to thicker wall tubing.
Many people have had success with sawhorses, but your situation reaffirms
in my mind that a work table is better than sawhorses, because all ribs are
equally stabilized and aligned by the table.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
do not archive
At 05:14 PM 4/15/04 -0500, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Paul Petty" <Lynnp@c-gate.net>
>
>Kolbers,
>
>I really need your help here. Last night I started on the aileron
>construction. After making the leading edge I laid it up next to the
>trailing edge of the wing to cross check the comic book for correctness
>length wise and so forth and noticed for the first time that the trailing
>edge of the wing has a very slight warp to it. YIKES!!!! Looked at the
>first wing and same thing! the warp is length wise and if you stand at the
>root and look down the TE you can see it. My concern is this. How much is
>too much and has anyone else noticed this? How did this happen? My saw
>horses are dead perfect level and I check them each day before starting
>work and often check them during construction like between major phases.
>They are made of spruce and glued to the floor with bon-doe backed up with
>cleats. Reason I check them is because seasons have changed in this
>process and I'm checking for swelling and contraction. Never looked at the
>wing from this angle. My thinking at this point is tha!
>t this might cause the aileron hinges to bind. I plan to break out the
>laser tonight and get an exact measurement of the warp. Another concern is
>wondering if Kolb shipped me the correct material. The beginning of the
>aileron construction pages state the wall thickness for the leading edges
>are made from .058" stock. But what they sent me and what is called for in
>other parts of the big book says .035" material. I have a set of MarkIII
>plans for flap construction purposes printed in 1990 calls for .023"?
>Makes me wonder if perhaps over the years this problem may have occurred
>and going to a thicker material may prevent this from happening.
>By the way the warp is upward in the center of the wing with the root and
>tip being the low points.
>Any ideas here guys?
>Shaking my head and going to read more comics down at the hanger.....
>
>Paul Petty
>Building Ms. Dixie
>Kolbra/912UL/Warp
>
>
>do not archive
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Houston we have a problem |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford" <beauford@tampabay.rr.com>
Paul:
Mine had exactly the same slight warp in both ailerons on the trailing edge
after covering tightened them up... Roughly three-eighths of an inch curl in
the trailing edge... higher in the middle, lower at each end... Following
a brief (very) period of self-recrimination, during which I considered
wrist-slitting, dog kicking, cat sacrifices, etc... I conducted further
research, and was eventually able to nail the cause of the warpage down to
the lack of enthusiastic family building (emotional) support provided to the
process by the formidible Mrs. Beauford (she thinks I'm an airplane-building
idiot) .... To this day, I have yet to be proven wrong in that non-support
assessment, by the way.... clearly her fault.... If she really loved 'ol
Beauford, this would NOT have happened to my airplane and we would not be
having this painful conversation...
Anyway... no noticeable impact insofar as to the way the Kleenex airplane
flys.... Right-side up mostly.... BOTH wings are heavy... but equally so...
go figure... Overweight pilot?
Betcha you won't be able to detect it when you fly it... cover it all up
with a flashy paint job and change the subject when people bring it up...
Remember, obsessive-compulsive behavior works both ways... These things
ain't Rolex watches.... (one can always tell lies by them, but not always
the correct time...)
Do not archive
Beauford
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Petty" <Lynnp@c-gate.net>
Subject: Kolb-List: Houston we have a problem
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Paul Petty" <Lynnp@c-gate.net>
>
> Kolbers,
>
noticed for the first time that the trailing edge of the wing has a very
slight warp to it. >
>
>
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Houston we have a problem |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Steven Green" <kolbdriver@bellsouth.net>
Paul,
When you riveted your ribs to the main spar did you start at one rivet and
go around the spar or did you go both directions from the first rivet? I
would think the problem is in the rib attachment rather than the trailing
edge material. It would be possible to create the bow you are describing by
riveting the ribs to the main spar with a forward rotation of riveting.
(starting at the top then down the front, under the bottom then up the back
of the spar)
I hope this is not too confusing.... At least I think I know what I am
trying to say.
Steven
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