---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 04/28/04: 24 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 04:32 AM - Re: Tortoises (Dave Rains) 2. 06:07 AM - Mark III For Sale (Doug Lawton) 3. 06:27 AM - Carb boots and Ivo prop question (Timandjan@aol.com) 4. 06:47 AM - Re: tire question (David & Maria Lumgair) 5. 07:07 AM - Re: Carb boots and Ivo prop question (John Hauck) 6. 07:48 AM - Re: Tortoises (Larry Bourne) 7. 09:29 AM - Re: : Ivo prop question (Richard Pike) 8. 09:52 AM - Re: Carb boots and Ivo prop question (Bob N.) 9. 11:19 AM - Ultrastar for sale (Bruce L Borg) 10. 11:23 AM - Re: : Ivo prop question (G. Thompson) 11. 11:45 AM - Kiev Hotprop. (Johann) 12. 12:03 PM - Re: : Ivo prop question (ul15rhb@juno.com) 13. 02:39 PM - firestar ll (curtis groote) 14. 02:40 PM - Re: Tortoises (jerb) 15. 02:52 PM - Re: : Ivo prop question (jerb) 16. 02:58 PM - Re: : Ivo prop question (jerb) 17. 04:29 PM - Re: Kiev Hotprop. (John Cooley) 18. 05:18 PM - Re: Tortoises (Larry Bourne) 19. 06:32 PM - Re: : Ivo prop question (Bob Bean) 20. 08:18 PM - Re: Tortoises (woody) 21. 08:28 PM - Re: : Ivo prop question (Christopher Armstrong) 22. 08:36 PM - Re: Tortoises (Larry Bourne) 23. 10:38 PM - Re: : Ivo prop question (DAquaNut@aol.com) 24. 10:39 PM - Re: Tortoises (George Bass) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 04:32:34 AM PST US From: Dave Rains Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Tortoises --> Kolb-List message posted by: Dave Rains Really nice photos of the tortoise. Would make a nice tail flash for Vamoose. Dave Rains Monument Valley or Bust do not archive -----Original Message----- From: Larry Bourne [SMTP:biglar@gogittum.com] Subject: Kolb-List: Tortoises --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Do not Archive. Not Kolb Related. Another installment in my weekend travels............if you're interested in the Desert Tortoise, take a look at: http://www.webpictures.homestead.com/travelling.html and click on "Desert Tortoises." I hope you enjoy. Lar. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:07:23 AM PST US From: "Doug Lawton" Subject: Kolb-List: Mark III For Sale --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Doug Lawton" Herb, Have you any photos of the plane? Any damage history? Logbooks? Are you willing to take anything in trade? I have nice buildable residential land in Brookesville, FL available. Thanks in advance, Doug Lawton NE Georgia & Whitwell TN Mathews Field ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:27:42 AM PST US From: Timandjan@aol.com Subject: Kolb-List: Carb boots and Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: Timandjan@aol.com Thought I sent this a week ago but I guess it did not go through. I am replacing the rubber carb boots between the carbs and the intake maniflds on my 503. I read somewhere that they should be cleaned first and leaf or someone at Sun in Fun where I got them said to coat them with lithium grease. I thought they should be cleaned to remove any grease so this contradicts what I thought to be correct. What is everyone else doing with these. I am mostly concerned with longitivity and to make sure they don't slip because of the grease. Added grip. Also, just out of curiosity, I have always used a jamb nut on the back of my prop bolts as a safety. I ordered new prop bolts from Ivo just to change them out and they said not to use jamb nuts. They are religious about the 200inch pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the jamb nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be overtightned increasing the 200inch pound setting. I have always barely snugged them and used them just as a safety. The factory Kolbs have always had them as well. Thanks for the input. Tim ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:47:05 AM PST US From: "David & Maria Lumgair" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: tire question --> Kolb-List message posted by: "David & Maria Lumgair" > The dot or dots are put on the tire at the lightest point on the > circumfrence of the tire's bead... Rotate the tire so the dot aligns with > the valve stem... Absolutely correct except they are at the heaviest "side" of the tire. Usually the rim is a few oz lighter where the stem hole is. ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:07:52 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Carb boots and Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" intake | maniflds on my 503. I read somewhere that they should be cleaned first and leaf or | someone at Sun in Fun where I got them said to coat them with lithium grease. Hi Tim/Gang: Clean the inside, contact area, then mount carb. The lithium grease goes on the outside to keep the rubber pliable and prevent cracking. No grease on inside!!! | They are religious about the 200inch | pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the jamb | nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be overtightned | increasing the 200inch pound setting. I be the first to admit I do not know anything about IVO props. I fly with them when I fly factory aircraft, but the Kolb guys maintain the prop. However, a requirement to check torque of prop bolts every 10 hours indicates to me that IVO has a problem with this model prop. For some of us, this would mean retorque prop bolts every day or so while on a cross country flight. Again, I qualify myself as not knowing anything about the prop. This is my opinion only. For those interested. Warp Drive props I use are torqued during installation. I have flown as much as 450 hours without ever retorqueing prop bolts. That did not help you with your question on using double nuts to lock the prop bolts. john h ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:48:33 AM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tortoises --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Harrrr...........I can imagine the comments THAT would get. :-) Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Rains" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Tortoises > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Dave Rains > > Really nice photos of the tortoise. Would make a nice tail flash for Vamoose. > Dave Rains > Monument Valley or Bust > do not archive > > -----Original Message----- > From: Larry Bourne [SMTP:biglar@gogittum.com] > Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 11:55 PM > To: Kolb-list@matronics.com > Subject: Kolb-List: Tortoises > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" > > Do not Archive. Not Kolb Related. > > Another installment in my weekend travels............if you're interested in the Desert Tortoise, take a look at: > > http://www.webpictures.homestead.com/travelling.html > > and click on "Desert Tortoises." I hope you enjoy. Lar. Do not Archive. > > Larry Bourne > Palm Springs, CA > Building Kolb Mk III > N78LB Vamoose > www.gogittum.com > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:29:40 AM PST US From: Richard Pike Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike I use fiber lock nut/jamb nuts on the back of my Ivo and only check them once a year during the annual. The prop is always still at 200 inch pounds. Never had a problem. But what do I know? Stick with the Ivo recommendations... Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) At 09:27 AM 4/28/04 -0400, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: Timandjan@aol.com > > >Also, just out of curiosity, I have always used a jamb nut on the back of my >prop bolts as a safety. I ordered new prop bolts from Ivo just to change them >out and they said not to use jamb nuts. They are religious about the 200inch >pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the jamb >nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be >overtightned >increasing the 200inch pound setting. I have always barely snugged them and >used them just as a safety. The factory Kolbs have always had them as well. > >Thanks for the input. > >Tim > > ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:52:20 AM PST US From: "Bob N." Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Carb boots and Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bob N." Re: prop bolts. I recently posted a msg wherein I recounted some "advice" from what I called a "safety inspector" at a fly-in. He said I should put nuts on my IVO prop bolts. Prop/hub came on factory FF from Old Kolb...without the nuts. Bob N. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 11:19:02 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Ultrastar for sale From: Bruce L Borg --> Kolb-List message posted by: Bruce L Borg Listers: Have Ultrastar for sale. Details and pictures on Barnstormers. ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:23:48 AM PST US From: "G. Thompson" Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: "G. Thompson" For what it is worth, I have used IVO props on both of my Kolbs. I too did not use lock nuts behind the prop UNTIL, on one of my preflights while on a long cross country, I discovered one of the bolts had worked out about a quarter inch. I went right down to the auto parts store and bought a set of "Pal" nuts. These are pressed steel nuts that used to be on con- rod bolts on some cars.(before inserts). I put them on just for safety and never had another problem. George, The Bald Eagle of Arizona ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Pike" Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike > > I use fiber lock nut/jamb nuts on the back of my Ivo and only check them > once a year during the annual. The prop is always still at 200 inch pounds. > Never had a problem. But what do I know? Stick with the Ivo recommendations... > > Richard Pike > MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > > > At 09:27 AM 4/28/04 -0400, you wrote: > > >--> Kolb-List message posted by: Timandjan@aol.com > > > > > >Also, just out of curiosity, I have always used a jamb nut on the back of my > >prop bolts as a safety. I ordered new prop bolts from Ivo just to change them > >out and they said not to use jamb nuts. They are religious about the 200inch > >pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the jamb > >nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be > >overtightned > >increasing the 200inch pound setting. I have always barely snugged them and > >used them just as a safety. The factory Kolbs have always had them as well. > > > >Thanks for the input. > > > >Tim > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:45:11 AM PST US From: "Johann" Subject: Kolb-List: Kiev Hotprop. --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Johann" Hi list members. Anyone used a Hotprop from Kiev on a Kolb? Would be very interested to know any pros and cons on that prop, comared to the most used Ivo and Warp props. Best regards. Johann from Iceland. Firestar II. ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 12:03:25 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question From: ul15rhb@juno.com --> Kolb-List message posted by: ul15rhb@juno.com I use stopnuts (nylock) on the back of the prop hub with an Ivo. The prop has been on there for 450 hours without any problem. I check the tightness every year. Do not use stop nuts on a wooden prop as the wood compresses and loosens up the prop bolts. Stop nuts wouldn't do any good. I had to check the prop bolts often with the wooden prop. Composite props, Ivo or Warp, are the only props that should be used on a pusher. Ralph Original Firestar 17 years flying it Rotax 447/Ivo 2-blade -- "G. Thompson" wrote: --> Kolb-List message posted by: "G. Thompson" For what it is worth, I have used IVO props on both of my Kolbs. I too did not use lock nuts behind the prop UNTIL, on one of my preflights while on a long cross country, I discovered one of the bolts had worked out about a quarter inch. I went right down to the auto parts store and bought a set of "Pal" nuts. These are pressed steel nuts that used to be on con- rod bolts on some cars.(before inserts). I put them on just for safety and never had another problem. George, The Bald Eagle of Arizona ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Pike" Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike > > I use fiber lock nut/jamb nuts on the back of my Ivo and only check them > once a year during the annual. The prop is always still at 200 inch pounds. > Never had a problem. But what do I know? Stick with the Ivo recommendations... > > Richard Pike > MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > > > At 09:27 AM 4/28/04 -0400, you wrote: > > >--> Kolb-List message posted by: Timandjan@aol.com > > > > > >Also, just out of curiosity, I have always used a jamb nut on the back of my > >prop bolts as a safety. I ordered new prop bolts from Ivo just to change them > >out and they said not to use jamb nuts. They are religious about the 200inch > >pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the jamb > >nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be > >overtightned > >increasing the 200inch pound setting. I have always barely snugged them and > >used them just as a safety. The factory Kolbs have always had them as well. > > > >Thanks for the input. > > > >Tim > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:39:29 PM PST US From: curtis groote Subject: Kolb-List: firestar ll --> Kolb-List message posted by: curtis groote From the novice: Firestar ll The manual says to install the braces in the horiz. and vert. stabilizers with brackets bent to a 1/32 inch radius. Suggestions on what to use to do that bending, please. Also, did any of you spray zinc chromate primer on any parts or the steel parts after drilling? Thanks to Paul Petty, Richard Pike, and Tim and Jan for their responses back in February on the worktable. It's been slow starting but the table is done, some tools acquired, and hopefully I can get serious now. Thanks. Curt Groote ===== __________________________________ http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:40:30 PM PST US From: jerb Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tortoises --> Kolb-List message posted by: jerb Well let's think about this, it may be very appropriate. It seems the builder is building at about the pace of a turtle. Yup, I think it would definitely fit. Lar, your going to have to change the name of the plane and the picture you had planned for the tail. B ) jerb At 07:48 AM 4/28/04 -0700, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" > >Harrrr...........I can imagine the comments THAT would get. :-) >Do not Archive. > >Larry Bourne >Palm Springs, CA >Building Kolb Mk III >N78LB Vamoose >www.gogittum.com > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Dave Rains" >To: >Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Tortoises > > > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Dave Rains > > > > Really nice photos of the tortoise. Would make a nice tail flash for >Vamoose. > > Dave Rains > > Monument Valley or Bust > > do not archive > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Larry Bourne [SMTP:biglar@gogittum.com] > > Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 11:55 PM > > To: Kolb-list@matronics.com > > Subject: Kolb-List: Tortoises > > > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" > > > > Do not Archive. Not Kolb Related. > > > > Another installment in my weekend travels............if you're interested >in the Desert Tortoise, take a look at: > > > > http://www.webpictures.homestead.com/travelling.html > > > > and click on "Desert Tortoises." I hope you enjoy. Lar. >Do not Archive. > > > > Larry Bourne > > Palm Springs, CA > > Building Kolb Mk III > > N78LB Vamoose > > www.gogittum.com > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:52:16 PM PST US From: jerb Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: jerb Note, there are regular and locking versions of PAL Nuts. Here's a handy link to see what they are. You may also want to note there are AN metal locking nuts - look some thing a castle nut but are locking - used in places like exhaust systems where things get hot and a fiber nut would hold up. http://www.mrgusa.com/pdfs/83-89palnut.pdf jerb At 11:23 AM 4/28/04 -0700, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "G. Thompson" > >For what it is worth, I have used IVO props on both of my Kolbs. I too did >not use lock nuts behind the prop UNTIL, on one of my preflights while on a >long cross country, I discovered one of the bolts had worked out about a >quarter inch. I went right down to the auto parts store and bought a set of >"Pal" nuts. These are pressed steel nuts that used to be on con- rod bolts >on some cars.(before inserts). I put them on just for safety and never had >another problem. > George, The Bald Eagle of Arizona > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Richard Pike" >To: >Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question > > > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike > > > > I use fiber lock nut/jamb nuts on the back of my Ivo and only check them > > once a year during the annual. The prop is always still at 200 inch >pounds. > > Never had a problem. But what do I know? Stick with the Ivo >recommendations... > > > > Richard Pike > > MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > > > > > > At 09:27 AM 4/28/04 -0400, you wrote: > > > > >--> Kolb-List message posted by: Timandjan@aol.com > > > > > > > > >Also, just out of curiosity, I have always used a jamb nut on the back of >my > > >prop bolts as a safety. I ordered new prop bolts from Ivo just to change >them > > >out and they said not to use jamb nuts. They are religious about the >200inch > > >pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the >jamb > > >nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be > > >overtightned > > >increasing the 200inch pound setting. I have always barely snugged them >and > > >used them just as a safety. The factory Kolbs have always had them as >well. > > > > > >Thanks for the input. > > > > > >Tim > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 02:58:38 PM PST US From: jerb Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: jerb Ralph, Why do you say wood props should not be used on a pusher? Seems like fiber (ny-lock) nuts would be even appropriate for wood prop - if they loosened at all it would at least keep them from backing out of the prop mounting flange. jerb At 07:02 PM 4/28/04 +0000, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: ul15rhb@juno.com > > >I use stopnuts (nylock) on the back of the prop hub with an Ivo. The prop >has been on there for 450 hours without any problem. I check the tightness >every year. > >Do not use stop nuts on a wooden prop as the wood compresses and loosens >up the prop bolts. Stop nuts wouldn't do any good. I had to check the prop >bolts often with the wooden prop. > >Composite props, Ivo or Warp, are the only props that should be used on a >pusher. > >Ralph >Original Firestar >17 years flying it >Rotax 447/Ivo 2-blade > >-- "G. Thompson" wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "G. Thompson" > >For what it is worth, I have used IVO props on both of my Kolbs. I too did >not use lock nuts behind the prop UNTIL, on one of my preflights while on a >long cross country, I discovered one of the bolts had worked out about a >quarter inch. I went right down to the auto parts store and bought a set of >"Pal" nuts. These are pressed steel nuts that used to be on con- rod bolts >on some cars.(before inserts). I put them on just for safety and never had >another problem. > George, The Bald Eagle of Arizona > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Richard Pike" >To: >Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question > > > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike > > > > I use fiber lock nut/jamb nuts on the back of my Ivo and only check them > > once a year during the annual. The prop is always still at 200 inch >pounds. > > Never had a problem. But what do I know? Stick with the Ivo >recommendations... > > > > Richard Pike > > MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > > > > > > At 09:27 AM 4/28/04 -0400, you wrote: > > > > >--> Kolb-List message posted by: Timandjan@aol.com > > > > > > > > >Also, just out of curiosity, I have always used a jamb nut on the back of >my > > >prop bolts as a safety. I ordered new prop bolts from Ivo just to change >them > > >out and they said not to use jamb nuts. They are religious about the >200inch > > >pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the >jamb > > >nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be > > >overtightned > > >increasing the 200inch pound setting. I have always barely snugged them >and > > >used them just as a safety. The factory Kolbs have always had them as >well. > > > > > >Thanks for the input. > > > > > >Tim > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 04:29:59 PM PST US From: "John Cooley" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Kiev Hotprop. --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Cooley" Hi Johann/Gang, Check the archives. Gregg Waligroski did a pretty thorough test with a hot prop and a couple of warp props. Sounded like it performed real well. Let me know if you have problems finding it. I still have it in my inbox and can send to you if you need me to. Later, John Cooley Do not archive --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Johann" Hi list members. Anyone used a Hotprop from Kiev on a Kolb? Would be very interested to know any pros and cons on that prop, comared to the most used Ivo and Warp props. Best regards. Johann from Iceland. Firestar II. == direct advertising on the Matronics Forums. == == == ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 05:18:53 PM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tortoises --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Nope ! ! ! Nope ! ! ! The time has come. I'm a-diggin' in my heels. Gotta be The Moose or nuthin'. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "jerb" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tortoises > --> Kolb-List message posted by: jerb > > Well let's think about this, it may be very appropriate. It seems the > builder is building at about the pace of a turtle. Yup, I think it would > definitely fit. Lar, your going to have to change the name of the plane ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 06:32:10 PM PST US From: Bob Bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: Bob Bean Those PAL nuts sound like a good backup for bolts into a threaded hub. -if you torqued into the hub and then retorqued a fibre self-locker as a backup, it makes me wonder what happens to the original hub torque. -might as well bore the hub holes to bolt size and rely on the nuts to do the job singularly. The list has previously been over the subject of stretch vs. shear in this application and it continues to be a matter of considerable import. Every app needs to be well thought out. At first one may be led to think: hey, it's a pusher, shear only! right? Then there are those times of footloose abandon when you pull the power and stand on various pedals to relieve the boredom. Those wingovers and quickchange maneuvers reverse all the normal stresses and do put in a little different perspective. Wood props should be rechecked. 100 hours wouldn't be too frequent. This would include at least a cursory runout. -BB, gardening and mowing do not archive G. Thompson wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "G. Thompson" > >For what it is worth, I have used IVO props on both of my Kolbs. I too did >not use lock nuts behind the prop UNTIL, on one of my preflights while on a >long cross country, I discovered one of the bolts had worked out about a >quarter inch. I went right down to the auto parts store and bought a set of >"Pal" nuts. These are pressed steel nuts that used to be on con- rod bolts >on some cars.(before inserts). I put them on just for safety and never had >another problem. > George, The Bald Eagle of Arizona > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Richard Pike" >To: >Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question > > > > >>--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike >> >>I use fiber lock nut/jamb nuts on the back of my Ivo and only check them >>once a year during the annual. The prop is always still at 200 inch >> >> >pounds. > > >>Never had a problem. But what do I know? Stick with the Ivo >> >> >recommendations... > > >>Richard Pike >>MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) >> >> >>At 09:27 AM 4/28/04 -0400, you wrote: >> >> >> >>>--> Kolb-List message posted by: Timandjan@aol.com >>> >>> >>>Also, just out of curiosity, I have always used a jamb nut on the back of >>> >>> >my > > >>>prop bolts as a safety. I ordered new prop bolts from Ivo just to change >>> >>> >them > > >>>out and they said not to use jamb nuts. They are religious about the >>> >>> >200inch > > >>>pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the >>> >>> >jamb > > >>>nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be >>>overtightned >>>increasing the 200inch pound setting. I have always barely snugged them >>> >>> >and > > >>>used them just as a safety. The factory Kolbs have always had them as >>> >>> >well. > > >>>Thanks for the input. >>> >>>Tim >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > > > > ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 08:18:39 PM PST US From: "woody" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tortoises --> Kolb-List message posted by: "woody" vaturtle dosn't have the same ring to it. > Well let's think about this, it may be very appropriate. It seems the > builder is building at about the pace of a turtle. Yup, I think it would > definitely fit. Lar, your going to have to change the name of the plane > and the picture you had planned for the tail. B ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 08:28:49 PM PST US From: "Christopher Armstrong" Subject: RE: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Christopher Armstrong" Using locknuts is not the traditional practice, using safety wire through holes in the bolt heads is. It is a much more relieable method and is fairly easy to do once you get the hang of it. Drilling the bolt heads is not very difficult or you can buy bolts with the heads drilled. The bolts most definately are not in shear only when you are manvering. The gyroscopic forces on a prop during a quick pitch up can be 20,000 Ft*Pounds! Those loads are tension on half the bolts and compression on the hub on the other half. Wood props need to be re-torqued seasonally with the changes in humidity and temperature. If there is a significant change in the conditions you need to check the torque. -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Bob Bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: Bob Bean Those PAL nuts sound like a good backup for bolts into a threaded hub. -if you torqued into the hub and then retorqued a fibre self-locker as a backup, it makes me wonder what happens to the original hub torque. -might as well bore the hub holes to bolt size and rely on the nuts to do the job singularly. The list has previously been over the subject of stretch vs. shear in this application and it continues to be a matter of considerable import. Every app needs to be well thought out. At first one may be led to think: hey, it's a pusher, shear only! right? Then there are those times of footloose abandon when you pull the power and stand on various pedals to relieve the boredom. Those wingovers and quickchange maneuvers reverse all the normal stresses and do put in a little different perspective. Wood props should be rechecked. 100 hours wouldn't be too frequent. This would include at least a cursory runout. -BB, gardening and mowing do not archive G. Thompson wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "G. Thompson" > >For what it is worth, I have used IVO props on both of my Kolbs. I too did >not use lock nuts behind the prop UNTIL, on one of my preflights while on a >long cross country, I discovered one of the bolts had worked out about a >quarter inch. I went right down to the auto parts store and bought a set of >"Pal" nuts. These are pressed steel nuts that used to be on con- rod bolts >on some cars.(before inserts). I put them on just for safety and never had >another problem. > George, The Bald Eagle of Arizona > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Richard Pike" >To: >Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question > > >>--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike >> >>I use fiber lock nut/jamb nuts on the back of my Ivo and only check them >>once a year during the annual. The prop is always still at 200 inch >> >> >pounds. > > >>Never had a problem. But what do I know? Stick with the Ivo >> >> >recommendations... > > >>Richard Pike >>MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) >> >> >>At 09:27 AM 4/28/04 -0400, you wrote: >> >> >> >>>--> Kolb-List message posted by: Timandjan@aol.com >>> >>> >>>Also, just out of curiosity, I have always used a jamb nut on the back of >>> >>> >my > > >>>prop bolts as a safety. I ordered new prop bolts from Ivo just to change >>> >>> >them > > >>>out and they said not to use jamb nuts. They are religious about the >>> >>> >200inch > > >>>pound torque's that should be checked every 10 hours and are afraid the >>> >>> >jamb > > >>>nuts will keep you from doing that and are afraid that they will be >>>overtightned >>>increasing the 200inch pound setting. I have always barely snugged them >>> >>> >and > > >>>used them just as a safety. The factory Kolbs have always had them as >>> >>> >well. > > >>>Thanks for the input. >>> >>>Tim >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > > ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 08:36:29 PM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tortoises --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Ah, Woody............good to see ya back, old son.............and thanks for the vote. Lar. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "woody" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tortoises > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "woody" > > vaturtle dosn't have the same ring to it. > > > > Well let's think about this, it may be very appropriate. It seems the > > builder is building at about the pace of a turtle. Yup, I think it would > > definitely fit. Lar, your going to have to change the name of the plane > > and the picture you had planned for the tail. B > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 10:38:09 PM PST US From: DAquaNut@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List:: Ivo prop question --> Kolb-List message posted by: DAquaNut@aol.com In a message dated 4/28/04 1:04:08 PM Central Standard Time, ul15rhb@juno.com writes: << Do not use stop nuts on a wooden prop as the wood compresses and loosens up the prop bolts. Stop nuts wouldn't do any good. I had to check the prop bolts often with the wooden prop. Composite props, Ivo or Warp, are the only props that should be used on a pusher. Ralph Original Firestar 17 years flying it Rotax 447/Ivo 2-blade >> Ralph, Are you using a 66" Ivo? If so do you know what pitch you have on it and your static RPM? Ed (in Houston) Do Not Archive ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 10:39:23 PM PST US From: "George Bass" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Tortoises --> Kolb-List message posted by: "George Bass" Lar; Sorry I couldn't find exactly what I was looking for, but, this may give you an idea or two regarding the new logo for renaming the Vamoose. This is a pic of a super turtle MOLD for making models, but, I envision one similar with a cape & maybe stretched out in a nearly horizontal position, on the tail of the "new" Aerial Tortoise, or maybe the "Attack of the Flying Turtle"-type of logo. You know, ....... Protector of the lower limits of the airspaces, Defender of the pastures, Keeper of the gas cans, Etc. George Hope the pic comes thru ---