Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:55 AM - Re: Quiet Props (ActionCrane@aol.com)
2. 07:37 AM - Heavy Alerons & Flapps (Richard & Martha Neilsen)
3. 10:36 AM - Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps (jimmy and jo ann)
4. 11:31 AM - Re: Quiet Props (PATRICK LADD)
5. 01:04 PM - Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps (PATRICK LADD)
6. 01:50 PM - Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps (possums)
7. 02:01 PM - Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps (possums)
8. 02:47 PM - Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps (jimmy and jo ann)
9. 03:02 PM - Quiet props (flykolb)
10. 03:32 PM - Re: Quiet props (robert bean)
11. 04:55 PM - Re: Quiet props (Beauford)
12. 06:53 PM - Re: Quiet props (Larry Bourne)
13. 06:53 PM - fall flight (Dan Charter)
Message 1
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: ActionCrane@aol.com
Some time back someone decribed how to cut prop tips to make them quieter. I
now have a 66" wood prop and it is much louder than the 56" 3 blade IVO that
I did have. It is just an old prop someone gave me and so I tried it and
found that it is the right pitch and the performance is MUCH better,it is just
noiser.If someone knows how to quiet it down please let me know.
Steve H
Original Firestar/377
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 2
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| Subject: | Heavy Alerons & Flapps |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
Things seen to be slow today so....
Over the years I have been hearing people talk about heavy ailerons and what they
have done to fix the problem. More recently one mentioned that they had to
slow down to lower their flaps. Also I have noticed in the Kolb demonstrators
that the ailerons get heavy at higher speeds. I haven't changed the cord of my
control surfaces nor have I changed the leverage with reduced aileron movement
but my controls have a lighter feel. When I built my flaps and ailerons I used
a product, sold by Aircraft Spruce, called trailing edge material Instead of
the stock 3/16" trailing edge. I used this trailing edge material for streamlining
reasons. It tapers to less than 1/16" at the trailing edge of my flaps
and ailerons. I don't know that I have any less drag and I don't know for sure
that this is the cause for the lighter controls but everything else in the control
system is 100% stock. Also I can't understand how this might effect the
control forces. Maybe these stock cord control surfaces aren't deflecting as much
air as those with the 3/16" trailing edge but they seem to be just as effective
and they take less force to use. Maybe some of our less aerodynamic challenged
members can shed some light or throw water on this.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW Powered MKIIIc
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "jimmy and jo ann" <hillstw@jhill.biz>
How many have tried spaces on Kolb ailerons?
Is that a structural possibility, or problem?
Jimmy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
Subject: Kolb-List: Heavy Alerons & Flapps
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen"
<NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
>
> Things seen to be slow today so....
>
> Over the years I have been hearing people talk about heavy ailerons and
what they have done to fix the problem. More recently one mentioned that
they had to slow down to lower their flaps. Also I have noticed in the Kolb
demonstrators that the ailerons get heavy at higher speeds. I haven't
changed the cord of my control surfaces nor have I changed the leverage with
reduced aileron movement but my controls have a lighter feel. When I built
my flaps and ailerons I used a product, sold by Aircraft Spruce, called
trailing edge material Instead of the stock 3/16" trailing edge. I used this
trailing edge material for streamlining reasons. It tapers to less than
1/16" at the trailing edge of my flaps and ailerons. I don't know that I
have any less drag and I don't know for sure that this is the cause for the
lighter controls but everything else in the control system is 100% stock.
Also I can't understand how this might effect the control forces. Maybe
these stock cord control surfa!
> ces aren't deflecting as much air as those with the 3/16" trailing edge
but they seem to be just as effective and they take less force to use. Maybe
some of our less aerodynamic challenged members can shed some light or throw
water on this.
>
> Rick Neilsen
> Redrive VW Powered MKIIIc
>
>
Message 4
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
<<. I now have a 66" wood prop and it is much louder than the 56" 3 blade
IVO that
I did have. .If someone knows how to quiet it down please let me know. >>
Hi ,
how about cutting 10 inches off the diameter? Seems that might do it. If
you increase the diameter you increase the tip speed unless you lower the
revs. With increased tip speed goes increased noise, unfortunately.
Ever listen to a T6? That noise is the tips going supersonic.
Cheers
Pat
pj.ladd@btinternet.com
Do not archive
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
<< More recently one mentioned that
they had to slow down to lower their flaps.>>
Hi all,
is that unusual in Kolbs?. Surely most types of a/c have speed limit with
flaps deployed.
My Challenger has flap limit at 50 knots. I approach around 40/45, over the
hedge 38/43 land around 30/35. It quits flying about 28knots.
Cheers
at pj.ladd@btinternet.com
Do not archive
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: possums <possums@mindspring.com>
At 10:35 AM 10/9/2004, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen"
><NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
>
>Things seen to be slow today so....
>
>Over the years I have been hearing people talk about heavy ailerons and
>what they have done to fix the problem. More recently one mentioned that
>they had to slow down to lower their flaps. Also I have noticed in the
>Kolb demonstrators that the ailerons get heavy at higher speeds. I haven't
>changed the cord of my control surfaces nor have I changed the leverage
>with reduced aileron movement but my controls have a lighter feel. When I
>built my flaps and ailerons I used a product, sold by Aircraft Spruce,
>called trailing edge material Instead of the stock 3/16" trailing edge. I
>used this trailing edge material for streamlining reasons. It tapers to
>less than 1/16" at the trailing edge of my flaps and ailerons. I don't
>know that I have any less drag and I don't know for sure that this is the
>cause for the lighter controls but everything else in the control system
>is 100% stock. Also I can't understand how this might effect the control
>forces. Maybe these stock cord control surfa!
>ces aren't deflecting as much air as those with the 3/16" trailing edge
>but they seem to be just as effective and they take less force to use.
>Maybe some of our less aerodynamic challenged members can shed some light
>or throw water on this.
>
>Rick Neilsen
>Redrive VW Powered MKIIIc
http://www.mindspring.com/~possums/Xhingestrailingedge.jpg
http://www.mindspring.com/~possums/HINGESML.jpg
http://www.mindspring.com/~possums/ailermod.jpg
Covered without the bumps using trailing edge material also. Have counter
balance weights and 2 inch narrower ailerons all the way down.
Just this narrowing allowed me to put extra 2 inches of throw in the "bell
crank", so when you think "turn left" you have already turned.
Moved the holes "in" instead of "out". They are still not heavy like the
old ones were.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: possums <possums@mindspring.com>
At 04:49 PM 10/9/2004, you wrote:
>Moved the holes "in" instead of "out". They are still not heavy like the
>old ones were.
Should have said - moved the holes "out" instead of "in"
This way the stick has to be moved much less to move the ailerons.
I have the old controls - inside and back of the cockpit - not under the
boom tube.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Heavy Alerons & Flapps |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "jimmy and jo ann" <hillstw@jhill.biz>
Excuse the typo. Meant to say "spades", not "spaces"
----- Original Message -----
From: "jimmy and jo ann" <hillstw@jhill.biz>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Heavy Alerons & Flapps
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "jimmy and jo ann" <hillstw@jhill.biz>
>
> How many have tried spaces on Kolb ailerons?
> Is that a structural possibility, or problem?
>
> Jimmy
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
> To: <kolb-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Kolb-List: Heavy Alerons & Flapps
>
>
> > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen"
> <NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
> >
> > Things seen to be slow today so....
> >
> > Over the years I have been hearing people talk about heavy ailerons and
> what they have done to fix the problem. More recently one mentioned that
> they had to slow down to lower their flaps. Also I have noticed in the
Kolb
> demonstrators that the ailerons get heavy at higher speeds. I haven't
> changed the cord of my control surfaces nor have I changed the leverage
with
> reduced aileron movement but my controls have a lighter feel. When I built
> my flaps and ailerons I used a product, sold by Aircraft Spruce, called
> trailing edge material Instead of the stock 3/16" trailing edge. I used
this
> trailing edge material for streamlining reasons. It tapers to less than
> 1/16" at the trailing edge of my flaps and ailerons. I don't know that I
> have any less drag and I don't know for sure that this is the cause for
the
> lighter controls but everything else in the control system is 100% stock.
> Also I can't understand how this might effect the control forces. Maybe
> these stock cord control surfa!
> > ces aren't deflecting as much air as those with the 3/16" trailing edge
> but they seem to be just as effective and they take less force to use.
Maybe
> some of our less aerodynamic challenged members can shed some light or
throw
> water on this.
> >
> > Rick Neilsen
> > Redrive VW Powered MKIIIc
> >
> >
>
>
Message 9
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" <flykolb@carolina.rr.com>
I found out today how to have a very quiet prop. The key holding the flywheel sheered
and turned my Mark III into a glider. Fortunately, I had just turned a
close left base and just glided in for one of my best landings ever!
Jim
Mark III
Charlotte, NC
Message 10
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
Jim, glad to hear you weren't over the piney woods....BB do not archive
On 9, Oct 2004, at 6:03 PM, flykolb wrote:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" <flykolb@carolina.rr.com>
>
> I found out today how to have a very quiet prop. The key holding the
> flywheel sheered and turned my Mark III into a glider. Fortunately, I
> had just turned a close left base and just glided in for one of my
> best landings ever!
>
> Jim
> Mark III
> Charlotte, NC
>
>
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> _-
> =======================================================================
> >
>
>
Message 11
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford" <beauford@tampabay.rr.com>
Good on ya, Jim.... Congrats...
Remember when those old instructors would insist that a man be able to hit
the airport in an upright manner from anywhere in the pattern if it suddenly
became very quiet...? Taint' a bad way of doing business... even in this
day of Super-Connie patterns with Cessnas... there was indeed a method to
their hard-learned madness....
Regards,
Beauford
FF #076
Brandon FL
Do Not Archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "flykolb" <flykolb@carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Quiet props
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" <flykolb@carolina.rr.com>
>
> I found out today how to have a very quiet prop. The key holding the
> flywheel sheered and turned my Mark III into a glider. Fortunately, I had
> just turned a close left base and just glided in for one of my best
> landings ever!
>
> Jim
> Mark III
> Charlotte, NC
>
>
>
Message 12
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
Some people just live right, eh ?? Now if that'd been ME flying that
thing.................?? Good for you, Jim. Lar.
Do not Archive.
Larry Bourne
Palm Springs, CA
Building Kolb Mk III
N78LB Vamoose
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "flykolb" <flykolb@carolina.rr.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Quiet props
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" <flykolb@carolina.rr.com>
>
> I found out today how to have a very quiet prop. The key holding the
> flywheel sheered and turned my Mark III into a glider. Fortunately, I had
> just turned a close left base and just glided in for one of my best
> landings ever!
>
> Jim
> Mark III
> Charlotte, NC
>
>
>
Message 13
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Dan Charter" <lndc@fnbcnet.com>
My flying buddy and myself took off about 10 am to a place called Zim MN. It's
about a half an hour flight. The air was great, cool but great. The temp was probably
40 degrees when we took off. The water bomber that's based in Hibbing
was doing some practice flights just south of where we landed. That big old bird
is impressive. We left Zim about noon. There was lots of thermal action. I
didn't expect that much but it was fun for awhile. Went back up about 4:30. Still
bumpy but we haven't been able to fly because of the weather so it was perfect
by me. I hadn't been up since Sept. 30Th. My buddy didn't stay up long though.
I got 3 hours total in for the day. I ran out of sunlight. What a fantastic
day. I took a few pics but my camera was set at 5.0 so I won't post any. I
was told that the wind will be back up to the 20's again tomorrow. BUMMER Do
not archive.
Dan Charter FS1
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