---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 07/23/05: 25 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 02:31 AM - Re: Quiet landings (PATRICK LADD) 2. 05:39 AM - Re: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick (Todd Fredricks) 3. 06:05 AM - Challengers and Deadsticks (Todd Fredricks) 4. 06:13 AM - Re: Old thread- Trips (N27SB@aol.com) 5. 06:55 AM - Practice Dead Stick Landings (John Hauck) 6. 07:16 AM - Re: Long Sitting Rotax 582 (Richard Pike) 7. 09:02 AM - Re: Re: Fw: Quiet Landings (Dave & Eve Pelletier) 8. 09:02 AM - Re: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick (Steve Kroll) 9. 09:05 AM - Re: M-IIIC Drivers in Iowa (PATRICK LADD) 10. 09:17 AM - Re:Practice Dead Stick Landings (Mike Pierzina) 11. 09:27 AM - Re: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead StickQuiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick (Steve Kroll) 12. 09:41 AM - Re: Re: Fw: Quiet Landings (ray anderson) 13. 10:10 AM - Re: Quiet landings/proper lubrication /larcneny (Herb Gayheart) 14. 10:27 AM - Re: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick (John Hauck) 15. 10:37 AM - Slipping Kolbs (John Hauck) 16. 11:05 AM - Re: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick (Steve Kroll) 17. 11:37 AM - Re: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick (Steve Garvelink) 18. 11:45 AM - Gear legs (Vic Peters) 19. 12:31 PM - Re: M-IIIC Drivers in Iowa (woody) 20. 12:55 PM - Re: Gear legs (robert bean) 21. 01:31 PM - Gear legs (Vic Peters) 22. 01:58 PM - Re: M-IIIC Drivers in Iowa (Chuck Stonex) 23. 04:37 PM - Re: Gear legs (ElleryWeld@AOL.com) 24. 05:58 PM - Re: Quiet landings (jerb) 25. 06:12 PM - Ducati Wiring Issue (Beauford) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 02:31:11 AM PST US From: "PATRICK LADD" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet landings --> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" Dove for strip. Flaps would not do it so did away with flaps and just dove. Landed on the last 1/3 of runway (2000' grass strip), no problem.>> Hi Jim, on that much runway if you hadn`t landed safely you probably shouldn`t be allowed to fly at all. If it had been a small field it would be a different story. NEVER dive at a field. All that happens is that you arrive at your landing spot going too fast and you will float forever. If it is a small field that probably means going through the far hedge or smacking into a wall. Cheers Pat -- ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:39:14 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick From: Todd Fredricks --> Kolb-List message posted by: Todd Fredricks If I might chime in. My two cents worth is I don't like shutting down good engines, but the best option for those of us in that camp is sailplane flying. In addition to the Army Aerobatics course I went out and got several hours in sailplanes and that was the best deadstick experience I think you can have and be safe. Pulling the spoilers in a sailplane can nicely replicate the descent rate of a single engine airplane and from day one all you think about is what will I do if the rope breaks on tow. Seems like a reasonable alternative to killing a healthy engine. If nothing else it is pretty cheap flying and will teach you a lot about handling quiet flying machines. Todd On 7/22/05 1:54 PM, "Chuck Stonex" wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Chuck Stonex" > > I wonder how many pilots have died because they had a real engine out and no > dead stick experiance? It does not matter if was over a salt flat or a > mountain range, the emergency was the same and the results varied according > to the pilots personal experiances. I'm a rookie pilot, I pray I know the > correct procedures if my engine should fail. How many knew Jim Lee?? He died > when the 912 on a Kolb he was flying failed because he did the wrong thing. > As I understand it, he was preoccupied with restarting the engine and forgot > to fly the plane. I know this because I am in the process of buying one of > the planes (M-IIIC) he built and was told this by his co-builder yesterday. > You cannot know too much about anything your doing. Just too little. If you > asked a musician in New York how to get to Carnagy Hall, he would probably > tell you "Practice, practice, practice". > Chuck S > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" > > > srglink/All: > > Absolutely, cause that is where we are going to have our engine > failures, every time. ;-) > > john h > MKIII > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 06:05:15 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Challengers and Deadsticks From: Todd Fredricks --> Kolb-List message posted by: Todd Fredricks All/ I have a tragic story to tell. My fellow flight surgeon and colleague was very much into getting an ultralight. He came in one day all satisfied that he had found the one. This has been 4 years ago now. I told him flat out, because I had done all the homework, read all the reports of tests to destruction in flight and read about John H's long distance exploits, I said, Mike, if you are going to do ultralights you need to buy a Kolb. Nope, I have researched it and I am buying a Quad City Challenger. I tried to convince him otherwise because I had seen Challengers and as a solid airplane helicopter guy I just didn't like the way they were built, especially the front end vulnerability of the pilots legs. Don't like Quicksilvers either for the same reason. Well he went out and got his Challenger and decided to do some engine out practice and instead of going up to PKB or UNI or some airport with 5-6000 feet to work with he decides to shut the thing down on approach to one of our many 2000 foot fields with 50 foot trees on both ends. Guess what? Yep! Parts of Challenger in the trees. He got away with moderate injury. It descended faster than I thought was all he could say to me. He heads off to Iraq, comes back this February and in less than a month is killed in his Grumman in a classic stall spin accident. I guess the point I am trying to make is that E.P.s (emergency procedures) like deadsticks are great to practice but a lot of people discussing this topic are pretty high time pilots. I feel uncomfortably (whose comfortable with an unexpected engine out) comfortable handling my airplane without a turning fan, but I have 2000 hours of flying helicopters, Beech 1900s, cubs and formalized aerobatic training and sailplane experience. To me, I have been ingrained with pitch for best glide, fly the airplane, situational awareness, winds, all that. I will frequently depart PKB and get to mid downwind, pull the power to idle and tell the tower I have a simulated engine out and land where ever and they are very accommodating. I never pull that during big traffic pushes. For low time pilots I think it really good to spend a lot of time at altitude, say 3-5000 feet and practice slow flight, gliding flight and really get to know the airplane before you start committing yourself fully. And by all means do not kill engines at low altitude for the heck of it. Even practicing deadsticks I would prefer to get to 4000 or so AGL, kill the motor and fly it for a while to get it sorted out. I doubt I would ever want to initiate at say 1000 or lower. Just my thoughts. On 11/15/99 8:54 AM, "Billie Futrell" wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Billie Futrell" > > I would just like to add a little to what Woody has just said about a > Challenger. I was going to buy a Challenger before I bought my Kolb. A > friend of mine had a Challenger with the long wing so I flew with him for 3 > hrs.I won't to tell you that was all I wanted. The first hr I was chasing > the thing all over the sky. You want to make a correction to the left, so > you give it aileron and it goes more to the right and then to the left. The > second hr I figured out that you had to fly with rudder, and a lot of that > and follow up with aileron. The only problem was before the hr was up I had > cramps it the calves of my legs so bad I could hardly use my the rudder > peddles. The third hr was not any better and when I left the field that day > I knew I did not want a Challenger. > I'm glad I go a kolb. > > Bill Futrell MK111Xtra912 > > Do not archive > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "woody" > To: > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: M-IIIC Drivers in Iowa > > >> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "woody" >> >> I told him that if something happened like getting unexpectedly airborn >> don't panic just fly the plane. He was a pilot but it still took him 3 >> passes to figure out the right approach to land. No panic to get it back >> down just kept flying untill he got things figured out. >> Perhaps I am to used to Kolbs. Flying a Challenger was the most >> frighteneing experience I had had in years. I was not prepared for the > extra >> rudder needed to stop a turn. These planes need rudder or it won't get out >> of a turn, The extra stiff rudder pedals and lack of concern about rudders >> in the Kolb had me circling for 10 minutes (felt like hours) trying to >> figure out what to do next. Finally a hard kick to the rudders got some >> movement and I straightened up. Quite frightening. I tried another >> Challenger that day with the same result and need for rudder. Still could >> not keep the nose from wandering around. I do understand the aircraft >> exported to the UK have bigger rudders and may be less needy of rudder >> input. >> You're going to love the Kolb >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "PATRICK LADD" >> To: >> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: M-IIIC Drivers in Iowa >> >> >>> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" >>> >>> He didn't panic just remembered what I had told him>> >>> >>> Chuck, >>> What did you tell him?. I am about to change from Challenger to Kolb and >>> have not flown a tail dragger since I sold the Thruster many years ago. >>> NB. The Challenger is not half as bad as this lot make out :-) >>> >>> Pat >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> >> >> > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:13:00 AM PST US From: N27SB@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Old thread- Trips --> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com In a message dated 7/22/2005 5:12:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, DCulver701@AOL.com writes: > Hi Steve, read your post on locating Lake Yale on your map. Our place is > on > the N.W. corner of the lake, just above a big Baptist retreat, off of Hy. > 452. > Its called Sunlake Estates, Hi Dave, I will let you know what I find. I probably will change the subject line if there is something of interest to the list. Otherwise I will send it to you offline. Steve FF#007 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:55:09 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Kolb-List: Practice Dead Stick Landings --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" Hi Folks: Rolled the old MKIII out late yesterday afternoon. Headed over to Wetumpka Airport. After my initial landing on the paved strip, I took off, climbed to 1,000 feet AGL, entered traffic for 36, the grass strip. On down wind I pulled the power, let the engine cool a few seconds, and hit the kill switch. I flew this one no flaps, normal pattern to left base, and final. Soon as I was on the ground, restarted, climbed back up to 1,000 AGL. Flew the pattern to midfield, upwind, shut down, made a circling left 360 to 36, no flaps. Restarted, climbed back up to 1,000 AGL, midfield up wind, shut down, full flaps, touch down 36. This probably took 10 minutes total time to shoot three dead stick landings. I might add that all radio calls were made as appropriate, announcement that these were dead stick landings, and managed to keep myself clear of other traffic in the area. This was excellent training for me, a much needed refresher on how my MKIII was going to fly dead stick. At 45 mph I was in a 500 FPM decent. At 50 mph I was in a 1,000 FPM decent. That's good info to know. That was in a clean configuration. I didn't check decent rates with full flaps against airspeed, but next time I fly I will make it a point to check that out also. There is a lot of difference in performance between engine idling at 2,000 rpm, throttle to the stop, and dead stick. I can assure you, you will not have time to sort out these kinds of things on your first actual engine out if you have not practiced actual dead stick landings. Coming away from my short practice session last night, I feel much more comfortable with myself and my airplane. I do not welcome an actual engine out, but I am much better prepared to deal with the situation now than prior to my little training period. I was flying with 20 gal of fuel, which works out to about 120 lbs. The old MKIII turns into a pretty good glider when the prop is stopped. Even with full flaps and 50 mph, Miss P'fer did not want to stop flying. She kept on floating in ground effect, on a very calm evening, burning up a lot of airstrip. That is a lot of airstrip for a Kolb, not compared to a "real" airplane. I don't think there is any substitute for actually flying and training in a Kolb airplane. King Airs and sail planes don't have much in common with what I fly. Chopping the throttle, giving one's self a practice engine out is not the same as shutting the engine down. You only get one shot at an actual engine out. When my time comes again, I want to be the best prepared a Kolb pilot can be. I want to be ready. And..........on top of all that, dead stick landings are a lot of fun. Gives me a really good feeling to be able to put the old bird down in the quiet mode. Take care, john h MKIII, 912ULS (Still learning and a lot more to learn in order to safely fly the Kolb) ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 07:16:04 AM PST US From: Richard Pike Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Long Sitting Rotax 582 --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike Do a crankcase pressure test. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) do not archive At 11:01 PM 7/22/05 -0500, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Kolbdriver" > >Folks, > > >It looks like I'm going to stay put for a while, I've landed in North >Central Oklahoma and need to get back to building. Big Lar and I started >about the same time, and I need to get busy so I can beat him in the air. > > >I have a 582 that has been sitting for approx 4 yrs. I've religiously kept >an equal mixture of seafoam, marvel mystery oil, opti 2, amsoil and penzoil >for 2cycle in the cyl and pulled the prop thru several times a week to keep >things lubed up. There seems to be good compression and no feeling of any >kind of binding. > > >Other than the obvious, replacing fuel pump and thoroughly cleaning the >carbs what should I be changing, cleaning etc. prior to start up.?? > >It does have an oil injection system. > > >Thanks, > >Mike (MK III C, she's still with me, lost 2 wives and 3 jobs in the >process.) > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:02:35 AM PST US From: "Dave & Eve Pelletier" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Fw: Quiet Landings --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Dave & Eve Pelletier" I did some power off landings in my Firestar and they went beautifully. When I got my MKIII, I set certain limits for myself and one of them was that I would not take up a passenger until I had completed a minimum of six power off landings. I did them but was surprised that the plane seemed to want to "pancake" in. I increased my airspeed on subsequent landings but it still landed hard, but not hard enough to bend the gear. I never did get the really smooth landings that I got with the Firestar. Gotta go out and do some more. I kind of think that maybe, because I'm kinda scared of "balloning" with no power, I'm not coming up enough on the elevator. We'll see. In any case, I agree with Jim that everyone ought to get the feel of how the aircraft handles when the fan ain't turning. AzDave Do Not Archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "JIM HEFNER" ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 09:02:35 AM PST US From: Steve Kroll Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick --> Kolb-List message posted by: Steve Kroll <<<<< Personally, I would rather take a chance of missing a 3,000 ft strip and learn how to fly my MKIII engine out than do it your way.>>>> John h/everybody I flew yesterday in very gusty crosswind conditions and experienced another reason for not practicing dead-stick with the power off. On the approach to land, I had to be all over the throttle to keep the runway where I needed it (with reference to the airplane). If I hadn't been able to change throttle settngs, I would not have made it to the runway on several of the landings because wind gusts and downdrafts upset my glidepath. I suppose you could choose not to practice dead-stick on those kinds of days but you're not going to have that choice when the real thing happens. I guess my point is this: There is ALWAYS the unexpected to contend with....even during practice. Why not practice with a live engine that will allow you to recover in the event of the unexpected. In my opinion, the practice is just as valuable with the power on because you know that if you do have to touch the throttle, you've done something wrong and you can make an adjustment on your next go round. You've still learned something and you didn't have to risk busting your airplane (or your butt) to learn it. Steve K ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 09:05:35 AM PST US From: "PATRICK LADD" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: M-IIIC Drivers in Iowa --> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" I do understand the Challengers exported to the UK have bigger rudders and may be less needy of rudder input>> Hi , I don`t know about a larger rudder but we have an addition forward of the fin, rather like the extension to the fin on the B17 which adds some yaw stability. I don`t understand this antipathy regards using the rudder, it is there to balance the turn and counteract adverse yaw. Of course those unfortunates who learned to fly power from day one have never learned about such things. .. << You're going to love the Kolb>> Looking forward to it. Not long now???? Cheers Pat -- ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 09:17:56 AM PST US From: Mike Pierzina Subject: Kolb-List: Re:Practice Dead Stick Landings --> Kolb-List message posted by: Mike Pierzina Hi John/ Guys, Well, it seems that it would be alittle SAFER practicing dead stick landings with ELEC START.... If the engine is cooled down like you described.....you have a good chance of RESTARTING if things were misjudged, But if you need to hop out to restart it, your committed. I'm taking tailwheel lessons in a Piper PA-12 now......My new instructor said he wouldn't hold my Aeronca training against me...... actually, when I flew the Piper he said he never touched the controls.....that'll jump ahead a few lessons. After a few full stall landings he told me to do a soft field landing.....I came in, flared , gave it a little throttle , but the first quarter of the throttle is a little "touchy" I ended gaining too much alt.....so I gave it full throttle and did a go around. He reached up and gave me a "pat on the back" and told me that's another thing there looking for"good judgement" At least getting ready to fly my Firestar is FUN now....paperwork all done, it's just endorsements now.... He's headed to Oshkosh , so I won't be flying for a couple of weeks. It's too expensive for me to go this year...I've got a plane to get in the air....Tailwheel endorsement, 5 hrs - "like" aircraft , insurance.....$2,000 should cover it. Gotta Fly... Mike in MN FSII / N381PM Do Not Archive SNIP>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Folks: Rolled the old MKIII out late yesterday afternoon. Headed over to Wetumpka Airport. After my initial landing on the paved strip, I took off, climbed to 1,000 feet AGL, entered traffic for 36, the grass strip. On down wind I pulled the power, let the engine cool a few seconds, and hit the kill switch. I flew this one no flaps, normal pattern to left base, and final My Web Site: http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html Sometimes you just have to take the leap and build your wings on the way down... --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 09:27:04 AM PST US From: Steve Kroll Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead StickQuiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick --> Kolb-List message posted by: Steve Kroll Rick, I don't know about the Mk3 or the FF or other Kolbs, but the Mk2 will easily triple the sink rate in a slip. I don't have flaps but I do have full span, wide chord ailerons. That probably is the difference? Steve K do not archive ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 09:41:17 AM PST US From: ray anderson Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Fw: Quiet Landings --> Kolb-List message posted by: ray anderson Dave I suggest that you practice wheel landings and preserve your gear. Not only are they easy on the gear, they are easy to conrtol in cross winds, short strips and most of all are fun. I've always been able to do O.K. three pointers in the 8 tail dragers I've owned but probably wheeled them on 50 -75% of the time. On a short strip you can keep just a little above normal approach speed, aim it right at the edge of the strip, level out and put the wheels firmly on the ground, keep the tail up in take off position, throttle back slowly, add a little brake or just let the tail drop and you are there. Ray - UltraStar Do Not Archive Dave & Eve Pelletier wrote: --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Dave & Eve Pelletier" I did some power off landings in my Firestar and they went beautifully. When I got my MKIII, I set certain limits for myself and one of them was that I would not take up a passenger until I had completed a minimum of six power off landings. I did them but was surprised that the plane seemed to want to "pancake" in. I increased my airspeed on subsequent landings but it still landed hard, but not hard enough to bend the gear. I never did get the really smooth landings that I got with the Firestar. Gotta go out and do some more. I kind of think that maybe, because I'm kinda scared of "balloning" with no power, I'm not coming up enough on the elevator. We'll see. In any case, I agree with Jim that everyone ought to get the feel of how the aircraft handles when the fan ain't turning. AzDave Do Not Archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "JIM HEFNER" --------------------------------- ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 10:10:20 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet landings/proper lubrication /larcneny From: Herb Gayheart --> Kolb-List message posted by: Herb Gayheart Pat and all Several things. Pat, when you get your Kolb in the air and build an impression of its qualities; Please give us a comparison between it and your Challenger. Guys that I talk to love their Challengers. We Kolb guys love ours ! I think you would do all of us a favor; given the derision you and your Challenger have suffered on this list. Good natured though it might have been :-) . Oil--- Wal Mart semi synthetic-------when one owns a 2 cycle engine--the accessory lubrication--that can also be found at Wally World--is in the Drug department! Makes it a lot easier to have unmentionable acts committed on our wallets and adjacent areas. :-) Comes in a little jar. :-) Herb On Sat, 23 Jul 2005 10:28:23 +0100 "PATRICK LADD" writes: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" > > > Dove for strip. Flaps would not do it so did away with flaps and > just dove. > Landed on the last 1/3 of runway (2000' grass strip), no problem.>> > > Hi Jim, > on that much runway if you hadn`t landed safely you probably > shouldn`t be > allowed to fly at all. > > If it had been a small field it would be a different story. NEVER > dive at a > field. All that happens is that you arrive at your landing spot > going too > fast and you will float forever. If it is a small field that > probably means > going through the far hedge or smacking into a wall. > > Cheers > > Pat > > > -- > > > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 10:27:45 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" contend with....even during practice. Why not practice with a live engine that will allow you to recover in the event of the unexpected. | Steve K Steve K/All: Good. You do it you way and I'll do it my way. Sorry if I came across trying to convert you and the others that don't see it my way. I usually shoot all my landings with closed throttle, and try not to touch it, unless it looks like I am not going to make the runway, even in gusty conditions. The more ways I experiment with flying my airplane under all conditions, the better I am able to fly and control the situation when the unexpected happens. Take care, john h MKIII, 912ULS DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 10:37:21 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Kolb-List: Slipping Kolbs --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" I don't have flaps but I do have full span, wide chord ailerons. That probably is the difference? | | Steve K Steve K/Gang: Isn't slipping more a matter of rudder and the side surface of the fuselage? Some Kolb models will slip better than others. Some models slip sometimes and sometimes they can't be threatened into slipping. My original Firestar would just barely hit 90 mph indicated in a 90 degree dive with engine at idle. In a hurry to get down, push the nose over. Doesn't take much to slow down my Kolbs. Mine have full time airbrakes or so it seems, they are so draggy. john h MKIII/912ULS ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 11:05:07 AM PST US From: Steve Kroll Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick --> Kolb-List message posted by: Steve Kroll <<<<<<>>> John, Rusty. all Rusty has a good point John. Suppose something does go wrong while you are practicing dead-stick with the engine off (by your own choice)and you end up in court because you damaged somebody's property or worse. The prosecution's case is going to be that you WERE doing something dangerous or at the very least, ill-advised and I don't think they would have a hard time proving it to the average jury. Steve K do not archive ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 11:37:37 AM PST US From: "Steve Garvelink" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Steve Garvelink" Shakespeare was right "Kill all the lawyers" sorry if any of you on the list are the good lawyers assuming anyone flying a kolb cant be bad definitely do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Steve Kroll Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet Landings/Practice Dead Stick --> Kolb-List message posted by: Steve Kroll <<<<<<>>> John, Rusty. all Rusty has a good point John. Suppose something does go wrong while you are practicing dead-stick with the engine off (by your own choice)and you end up in court because you damaged somebody's property or worse. The prosecution's case is going to be that you WERE doing something dangerous or at the very least, ill-advised and I don't think they would have a hard time proving it to the average jury. Steve K do not archive ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 11:45:23 AM PST US From: "Vic Peters" Subject: Kolb-List: Gear legs --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Vic Peters" MKIIIXtra In one plans book it says to insert the legs all the way in as far as possible. The next says to leave 1" of non tapper expossed beyond cage frame. The plans show a 14" measurement from cage to where I can't seem to figure out because none of these measurements have any thing to do with the other. I've cut the end of the al. leg at an angle to fit the steel axle fitting and pounded it in place only to realize the tapper tightens up before you know how far it is inserted. I'd rather not ding them all up trying to get them off, They are realy snug. Can I just shorten the distance of 1.5" to 1" to drill the hole to att. the axle fitting to gear leg just to make sure I'm not too near the end of the leg? Are the brake disks listed in Aircraft Spuce (pg 215; 2004-2005) for homebuilts the ones I want for Azusa wheels? What is the attachment from steel axle fitting to calipper made of? I've been given master cylinders and rebuilt dirt bike calipers one fixed shoe. They need little space between disc and tire. The square part with 4 holes in the steel axle fitting seems to bend easily. Is that of concern? There you go. I've saved them all for one email. Vic 3 MKIIIXtra 00040 Maine ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 12:31:00 PM PST US From: "woody" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: M-IIIC Drivers in Iowa --> Kolb-List message posted by: "woody" > > All of these stories from you former Challenger drivers are nice ..... I > just wish one of you would come help me get into this M-III I'm lookin' at. > Then I can be greatful that I bought a Kolb too! I wish I was in your area to help you out. The diamond floor plate must have been a builder modification. Kolb uses only sheet aluminum for the floor. ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 12:55:31 PM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Gear legs --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean Vic, I guess it's too late to tell you you don't need to cut an angle on the end. (BTW are they delivering steel or aluminum legs for the Xtra?) The actual amount inside the leg socket isn't important as long as they are most of the way in. (size doesn't matter ;) the amount sticking out should be the same. As long as one side looks the same as the other works on nearly every part of the airplane. Wait until you have the legs in before you do any drilling for the axle socket. Stick on the whole wheel assembly, parallel them with the tail wheel as center and THEN drill the holes for the axle socket. Some look for a slight toe-in which is better than toe-out. The leg socket on some have a lot of crap inside. The worst is welding wire protruding. The least is a little dimpling or ash bumps. That all has to be sanded and cleaned out. Then grease up the leg and go for it. Leg first, axle socket second. Toe-in: rotate axle socket forward. Toe-out: rotate aft. On my plane the left socket has slightly out of round holes. If I loosen the bolts I can stick a pipe wrench on and get whatever toe I want. -then just scrunch em back down and they will stay put. -BB On 23, Jul 2005, at 2:44 PM, Vic Peters wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Vic Peters" > > MKIIIXtra > In one plans book it says to insert the legs all the way in as far as > possible. > The next says to leave 1" of non tapper expossed beyond cage frame. > The plans show a 14" measurement from cage to where I can't seem to > figure out because none of these measurements have any thing to do > with the other. > I've cut the end of the al. leg at an angle to fit the steel axle > fitting and pounded it in place only to realize the tapper tightens up > before you know how far it is inserted. I'd rather not ding them all > up trying to get them off, > They are realy snug. Can I just shorten the distance of 1.5" to 1" to > drill the hole to att. the axle fitting to gear leg just to make sure > I'm not too near the end of the leg? > > Are the brake disks listed in Aircraft Spuce (pg 215; 2004-2005) for > homebuilts the ones I want for Azusa wheels? > > What is the attachment from steel axle fitting to calipper made of? > I've been given master cylinders and rebuilt dirt bike calipers one > fixed shoe. > They need little space between disc and tire. The square part with 4 > holes in the steel axle fitting seems to bend easily. Is that of > concern? > > There you go. I've saved them all for one email. > > Vic 3 > MKIIIXtra 00040 > Maine > > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 01:31:59 PM PST US From: "Vic Peters" Subject: Kolb-List: Gear legs --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Vic Peters" Thanks Bob, I know I can't drill for the axle yet. No brakes yet. I was concered about drilling too close to that angle I didn't need to cut. And what about being level? Would you make any adjustments in leg length to keep the cage level, assuming that floor is? In 2002 they sent aluminum legs. Vic 3 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 01:58:51 PM PST US From: "Chuck Stonex" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: M-IIIC Drivers in Iowa --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Chuck Stonex" Thanks for the ofer Woody ..... I accept.!! hehe. The diamond plate was a builder modification. It is back to a sheet aluminum floor now. --> Kolb-List message posted by: "woody" > > All of these stories from you former Challenger drivers are nice ..... I > just wish one of you would come help me get into this M-III I'm lookin' at. > Then I can be greatful that I bought a Kolb too! I wish I was in your area to help you out. The diamond floor plate must have been a builder modification. Kolb uses only sheet aluminum for the floor. ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 04:37:10 PM PST US From: ElleryWeld@AOL.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Gear legs --> Kolb-List message posted by: ElleryWeld@aol.com Vic are you the guy that I met in Patten Maine last year at the Mainely Sport Planes flyin where here in maine are you? almost done rebuilding original firestar Do not archive Ellery ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 05:58:46 PM PST US From: jerb Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Quiet landings --> Kolb-List message posted by: jerb Have to agree, diving for a field is not the best option or habit to learn - instead earn to loose altitude by using a slide slip, you can also "S turn", even slow down. I usually make it a practice to be high on final and have to side slip it in - this way I control both my speed and rate of decent but land on my picked spot - your diving method while it does get you down, it does not build your short field skills. I normally will only do a side slip with 2 notches of flaperons, wing down into the wind and counter with opposite rudder for direction control. Practice at altitude then try a few on final. jerb At 10:28 AM 7/23/05 +0100, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" > >Dove for strip. Flaps would not do it so did away with flaps and just dove. >Landed on the last 1/3 of runway (2000' grass strip), no problem.>> > >Hi Jim, >on that much runway if you hadn`t landed safely you probably shouldn`t be >allowed to fly at all. > >If it had been a small field it would be a different story. NEVER dive at a >field. All that happens is that you arrive at your landing spot going too >fast and you will float forever. If it is a small field that probably means >going through the far hedge or smacking into a wall. > >Cheers > >Pat > > >-- > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 06:12:13 PM PST US From: "Beauford" Subject: Kolb-List: Ducati Wiring Issue --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford" Kolbers: Reassembled the 447 today to complete the decarboning drill... pain. heat. sweat. Came across one red-flag item that I wanted to pass along to the List just in case someone else is facing the same situation. As I was putting the wiring back on the side of the engine, I peeked inside the plastic spiral wrap I use to organize the wiring harness. Was highly surprised to see several inches of totally bare wire... the insulation on one particular wire had disintegrated... turned to soft pink goo. Unfortunately, it is the trigger circuit wire for the Ducati ignition module. Only this one segment of this one wire was affected. It is the solid red lead coming out of the engine generator section (where the trigger sensor is located) and leading to the Ducati module. On the 447, It goes through a black rubber coupler plug halfway to the module. Only the segment coming out of the engine case and leading to the coupler plug was defective. From the coupler forward to the module was still bright red and in perfect shape. None of the other wires anywhere in the Ducati system or coming out of the generator were defective in the least. They were all in as-new condition.... still shiny and brightly colored. Since all of these wires were subjected to the same storage environment (closed trailer)and are of the same age (4 years), I believe it logical to assume that this is a case of defective materials. I attempt to find time to tear into the generator tomorrow and see what the rest of the trigger circuit wire inside the engine case looks like. Will report what I find. Meanwhile, I thought this issue to be potentially dangerous... they will certainly not run with a shorted trigger circuit. If there is a bad batch of trigger sensor wire out there installed on engines, it probably needs to be documented.... at the very least, I would think it prudent to take a look at the condition of these trigger leads on your 2-stroke Rotax, just in case your wire came from the same batch as mine... Public Spirited Beauford FF #076 Brandon, FL