Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:21 AM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (Ralph)
2. 05:59 AM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (Beauford)
3. 08:51 AM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (Ralph)
4. 09:35 AM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (Richard Pike)
5. 11:35 AM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (Ralph)
6. 11:51 AM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (Richard Pike)
7. 12:21 PM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (DAquaNut@aol.com)
8. 07:30 PM - Re: Kolb 1986 Twinstar w Rotax 503 (Ron)
9. 07:57 PM - Re: Pre Mix made easy (Ron)
10. 08:28 PM - Re: Kolb 1986 Twinstar w Rotax 503 (HShack@aol.com)
11. 10:16 PM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (possums)
12. 10:33 PM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (possums)
13. 11:24 PM - Re: Bing Enrichment Piston (possums)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is that it
cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the carb. This is
because it takes a pump to get the fuel up to the carburetor. Should the pump
fail or leak, nothing happens. After the engine starts, the fuel in the primer
line always backs down the line and it takes several pumps to get it back to
the carb level. I did have a leaking primer pump once and it didn't shoot fuel
into the carb or make the engine run rough at idle.
Another good reason to use a primer instead of the enrichner (choke), is the enrichner
keeps the rich fuel coming into the engine longer which only adds up to
the amount of carbon buildup inside the engine. Using the enrichner often will
have the tendency to wear out the rubber washer or it may not shut the fuel
supply off when it's supposed to (I mentioned this in an earlier post). Should
the primer line leak or come off, it will not lean the mixture to the point
of engine seizure because that 1/4" line does not leak enough air into the carb
to cause this to happen. Compared to the large volume of air coming through
the air cleaner, the primer line is nothing (I mentioned this earlier too).
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- ElleryWeld@aol.com wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: ElleryWeld@aol.com
I never use the enrichment only the Primer pump and it does get cold here in
Maine but it usually starts the first pull but on real cold days when it
starts it will run for a few seconds and start to die thats when you give it
another squirt with the primer pump to keep it running. on real cold days you
might have to Do this a couple times untill it will stay running on its own You
gotta warm it up anyway befor you take off
Original firestar Plus
in Maine Ellery
do not archive
Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pumpis that it
cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the carb. This is because
it takes a pump to get the fuel up to the carburetor. Should the pump fail
or leak, nothing happens. After the engine starts, the fuel in the primer
line alwaysbacks down the line and it takes several pumps to get it back to the
carb level. I did have a leaking primer pump once and it didn't shoot fuel into
the carb or make the engine run rough at idle.
Another good reason to use a primer instead of the enrichner (choke), is the enrichner
keeps the rich fuel coming into the engine longer which only adds up to
the amount of carbon buildup inside the engine. Using the enrichner often will
have the tendency to wear out the rubber washer or it may not shut the fuel
supply off when it's supposed to (I mentioned this in an earlier post). Should
the primer line leak or come off, it will not lean the mixture to the point
of engine seizure because that 1/4" line does notleak enough air into the carb
to cause this to happen. Compared to the large volume of air coming through the
air cleaner, the primer line is nothing (I mentioned this earlier too).
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--ElleryWeld@aol.comwrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:ElleryWeld@aol.com
IneverusetheenrichmentonlythePrimerpumpanditdoesgetcoldherein
Mainebutitusuallystartsthefirstpullbutonrealcolddayswhenit
startsitwillrunforafewsecondsandstarttodiethatswhenyougiveit
anothersquirtwiththeprimerpumptokeepitrunning.onrealcolddaysyou
mighthavetoDothisacoupletimesuntillitwillstayrunningonit
sownYou
gottawarmitupanywaybeforyoutakeoff
OriginalfirestarPlus
inMaineEllery
donotarchive
nbsp;
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford" <beauford@tampabay.rr.com>
Ralph...
Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
hot
2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
child for that particular malfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
>
> Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is
> that it cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the
> carb. . Should the pump fail or leak, nothing happens. > Ralph, Original
> Firestar, 18 years flying it
> > inMaineEllery
> donotarchive
>
>
> nbsp;
>
> >
>
>
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
Beauford and others,
I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a faulty
primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer nipple in the
carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The primer on mine
is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so if there was a leaking
problem, it would be more severe than one fed into the carburetor body. By
the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the nipple (I'm using cable ties
now instead of those plastic rachet clamps. They work so much better with
no leaking).
The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty enrichner can
(you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax mechanics would say this
(below). This might even explain why some guys have such good luck with their
Rotax's and others don't. I have not used the choke (enrichner) in years and
have not had a carbon problem. I did have the usual carbon problem that everyone
else has when I used the choke for starting it.
Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and reliability. I
prefer it this way.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
-- \"Beauford\" wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford"
Ralph...
Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
hot
2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
child for that particular malfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralph"
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph"
>
> Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is
> that it cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the
> carb. . Should the pump fail or leak, nothing happens. > Ralph, Original
> Firestar, 18 years flying it
> > inMaineEllery
> donotarchive
>
>
> nbsp;
>
> >
>
>
Beauford and others,
I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a faulty
primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer nipple in the
carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The primer on mine
is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so if there was a leaking
problem, it would be more severe than one fed into the carburetor body. By
the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the nipple (I'm using cable ties
now instead of those plasticrachet clamps. They work so much better with no
leaking).
The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty enrichner can
(you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax mechanics would say this
(below). This might even explain why some guys have such good luck with their
Rotax's and others don't. I have not used the choke (enrichner)in years and have
not had a carbon problem. I did have the usual carbon problem that everyone
else has when I used the choke for starting it.
Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and reliability. I
prefer it this way.
Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
--\"Beauford\"<BEAUFORD@TAMPABAY.RR.COM>wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"<BEAUFORD@TAMPABAY.RR.COM>
Ralph...
Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
Theysaidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
hot
2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpump 
;failureinthepast.
Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
childforthatparticularmalfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
-----OriginalMessage-----
From:"Ralph"<UL15RHB@JUNO.COM>
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"<UL15RHB@JUNO.COM>
Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
Firestar,18yearsflyingit
inMaineEllery
donotarchive
nbsp;
sp;
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org>
Several years ago one of our locals had a defective primer. It tended to
creep out from the closed position and would then allow fuel to be go
through the primer nipple and into the engine. This engine had been a real
pain to figure out, seemed like it was always jetted wrong. Removed the
primer and capped the nipple, problem solved. Don't remember if his primer
was upstream or downstream of the fuel pump, (I think upstream, been too
long ago...) but that could certainly have been a factor as well.
Moral of the story:
Enrichners can fail
Primers can fail.
Anything can (and probably eventually will) fail.
Primers do not leak fuel into the carb,
- but -
Faulty primers will allow fuel to be sucked into the engine.
If you have a fuel pump between the tank and the faulty primer,
then a faulty primer turns the primer nipple into an aux main jet.
Protect yourself at all times...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
At 03:48 PM 8/18/05 +0000, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
>
>Beauford and others,
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a
>faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer
>nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The
>primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so
>if there was a leaking problem, it would be more severe than one fed into
>the carburetor body. By the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the
>nipple (I'm using cable ties now instead of those plastic rachet clamps.
>They work so much better with no leaking).
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can (you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax
>mechanics would say this (below). This might even explain why some guys
>have such good luck with their Rotax's and others don't. I have not used
>the choke (enrichner) in years and have not had a carbon problem. I did
>have the usual carbon problem that everyone else has when I used the choke
>for starting it.
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
>
>
>-- \"Beauford\" wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford"
>
>Ralph...
>Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
>contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
>
>They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
> 1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
>hot
> 2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
>
>They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
>
>Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
>child for that particular malfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
>FF#076
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ralph"
>
>
> > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph"
> >
> > Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is
> > that it cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the
> > carb. . Should the pump fail or leak, nothing happens. > Ralph, Original
> > Firestar, 18 years flying it
> > > inMaineEllery
> > donotarchive
> >
> >
> > nbsp;
> >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>Beauford and others,
>
>
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a
>faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer
>nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The
>primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so
>if there was a leaking problem, it would be more severe than one fed into
>the carburetor body. By the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the
>nipple (I'm using cable ties now instead of those plasticrachet clamps.
>They work so much better with no leaking).
>
>
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can (you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax
>mechanics would say this (below). This might even explain why some guys
>have such good luck with their Rotax's and others don't. I have not used
>the choke (enrichner)in years and have not had a carbon problem. I did
>have the usual carbon problem that everyone else has when I used the choke
>for starting it.
>
>
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>
>
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
>
>
>--\"Beauford\"<BEAUFORD@TAMPABAY.RR.COM>wrote:
>--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"<BEAUFORD@TAMPABAY.RR.COM>
>
>Ralph...
>Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
>contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
>
>Theysaidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
>1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
>hot
>2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
>
>Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpump 
> ;failureinthepast.
>
>Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
>childforthatparticularmalfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
>FF#076
>
>
>-----OriginalMessage-----
>From:"Ralph"<UL15RHB@JUNO.COM>
>
>
>--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"<UL15RHB@JUNO.COM>
>
>Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
>thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
>carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
>
> Firestar,18yearsflyingit
>inMaineEllery
>donotarchive
>
>
>nbsp;
>
>
> sp;
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
Richard,
Do you remember if the tank on this plane was about the same level or higher than
the carburetor (gravity fed, similar to the Quicksilvers)?
Ralph
-- Richard Pike wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike
Several years ago one of our locals had a defective primer. It tended to
creep out from the closed position and would then allow fuel to be go
through the primer nipple and into the engine. This engine had been a real
pain to figure out, seemed like it was always jetted wrong. Removed the
primer and capped the nipple, problem solved. Don't remember if his primer
was upstream or downstream of the fuel pump, (I think upstream, been too
long ago...) but that could certainly have been a factor as well.
Moral of the story:
Enrichners can fail
Primers can fail.
Anything can (and probably eventually will) fail.
Primers do not leak fuel into the carb,
- but -
Faulty primers will allow fuel to be sucked into the engine.
If you have a fuel pump between the tank and the faulty primer,
then a faulty primer turns the primer nipple into an aux main jet.
Protect yourself at all times...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
At 03:48 PM 8/18/05 +0000, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph"
>
>Beauford and others,
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a
>faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer
>nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The
>primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so
>if there was a leaking problem, it would be more severe than one fed into
>the carburetor body. By the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the
>nipple (I'm using cable ties now instead of those plastic rachet clamps.
>They work so much better with no leaking).
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can (you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax
>mechanics would say this (below). This might even explain why some guys
>have such good luck with their Rotax's and others don't. I have not used
>the choke (enrichner) in years and have not had a carbon problem. I did
>have the usual carbon problem that everyone else has when I used the choke
>for starting it.
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
>
>
>-- \"Beauford\" wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford"
>
>Ralph...
>Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
>contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
>
>They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
> 1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
>hot
> 2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
>
>They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
>
>Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
>child for that particular malfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
>FF#076
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Ralph"
>
>
> > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph"
> >
> > Kolbers, another thing I forgot to mention about using a primer pump is
> > that it cannot over richen the mixture by shooting extra fuel into the
> > carb. . Should the pump fail or leak, nothing happens. > Ralph, Original
> > Firestar, 18 years flying it
> > > inMaineEllery
> > donotarchive
> >
> >
> > nbsp;
> >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>Beauford and others,
>
>
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due to a
>faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the primer
>nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air cleaner. The
>primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the intake manifold, so
>if there was a leaking problem, it would be more severe than one fed into
>the carburetor body. By the way, always cable tie the fuel line around the
>nipple (I'm using cable ties now instead of those plasticrachet clamps.
>They work so much better with no leaking).
>
>
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can (you found that one out). I don't know why the Rotax
>mechanics would say this (below). This might even explain why some guys
>have such good luck with their Rotax's and others don't. I have not used
>the choke (enrichner)in years and have not had a carbon problem. I did
>have the usual carbon problem that everyone else has when I used the choke
>for starting it.
>
>
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>
>
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
>
>
>--\"Beauford\"wrote:
>--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
>
>Ralph...
>Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
>contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
>
>Theysaidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
>1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
>hot
>2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
>
>Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpump
> ;failureinthepast.
>
>Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
>childforthatparticularmalfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
>FF#076
>
>
>-----OriginalMessage-----
>From:"Ralph"
>
>
>--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"
>
>Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
>thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
>carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
>
> Firestar,18yearsflyingit
>inMaineEllery
>donotarchive
>
>
>nbsp;
>
>
> sp;
>
>
Richard,
Do you remember if the tank on this plane was about the same level or higher than
the carburetor (gravity fed, similar to the Quicksilvers)?
Ralph
--RichardPike<RICHARD@BCCHAPEL.ORG>wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:RichardPike<RICHARD@BCCHAPEL.ORG>
Severalyearsagooneofourlocalshadadefectiveprimer.Ittendedto
creepoutfromtheclosedpositionandwouldthenallowfueltobego
throughtheprimernippleandintotheengine.Thisenginehadbeenareal
paintofigureout,seemedlikeitwasalwaysjettedwrong.Removedthe
primerandcappedthenipple,problemsolved.Don'trememberifhisprimer
wasupstreamordownstreamofthefuel&nb
sp;pump,(Ithinkupstream,beentoo
longago...)butthatcouldcertainlyhavebeenafactoraswell.
Moralofthestory:
Enrichnerscanfail
Primerscanfail.
Anythingcan(andprobablyeventuallywill)fail.
Primersdonotleakfuelintothecarb,
-but-
Faultyprimerswillallowfueltobesuckedintotheengine.
Ifyouhaveafuelpumpbetweenthetankandthefaultyprimer,
thenafaultyprimerturnstheprimernippleintoanauxmainjet.
Protectyourselfatalltimes...
RichardPike
MKIIIN420P(420ldPoops)
At03:4
8PM8/18/05+0000,youwrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"<UL15RHB@JUNO.COM>
Beaufordandothers,
Isawthispost.Theamountofairthatisleakedintothecarb,duetoa
faultyprimer,doesnotamounttomuch.Lookatthesizeoftheprimer
nippleinthecarb.Nowcomparethatwiththesizeoftheaircleaner.The
primeronmineisfedintoanippleonthesideoftheintakemanifold,so
iftherewasaleakingproblem,itwouldbemoreseverethanonefed
into
thecarburetorbody.Bytheway,alwayscabletiethefuellinearoundthe
nipple(I'musingcabletiesnowinsteadofthoseplasticrachetclamps.
Theyworksomuchbetterwithnoleaking).
Theprimerdoesnotleakrawfuelintothecarb,whereasafaulty
enrichnercan(youfoundthatoneout).Idon'tknowwhytheRotax
mechanicswouldsaythis(below).Thismightevenexplainwhysomeguys
havesuchgoodluckwiththeirRotax'sandothersdon't.Ihavenotused
thechoke(e
nrichner)inyearsandhavenothadacarbonproblem.Idid
havetheusualcarbonproblemthateveryoneelsehaswhenIusedthechoke
forstartingit.
Lesscarbonbuildup,ina2-stroke,meanslongerenginelifeand
reliability.Ipreferitthisway.
Ralph,OriginalFirestar,18yearsflyingit
--\"Beauford\"wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"
Ralph...
Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
They
saidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
hot
2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpumpfailureinthepast.
Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
childforthatparticularmalfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
-----OriginalMessage-----
From:"Ra
lph"
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"
Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
Firestar,18yearsflyingit
inMaineEllery
donotarchive
nbsp;
Beaufordandothers,
Isaw&
nbsp;thispost.Theamountofairthatisleakedintothecarb,duetoa
faultyprimer,doesnotamounttomuch.Lookatthesizeoftheprimer
nippleinthecarb.Nowcomparethatwiththesizeoftheaircleaner.The
primeronmineisfedintoanippleonthesideoftheintakemanifold,so
iftherewasaleakingproblem,itwouldbemoreseverethanonefedinto
thecarburetorbody.Bytheway,alwayscabletiethefuellinearoundthe
nipple(I'musingcableties 
;nowinsteadofthoseplasticrachetclamps.
Theyworksomuchbetterwithnoleaking).
Theprimerdoesnotleakrawfuelintothecarb,whereasafaulty
enrichnercan(youfoundthatoneout).Idon'tknowwhytheRotax
mechanicswouldsaythis(below).Thismightevenexplainwhysomeguys
havesuchgoodluckwiththeirRotax'sandothersdon't.Ihavenotused
thechoke(enrichner)inyearsandhavenothadacarbonproblem.Idid
havetheusualcarbonproblemthateveryoneelsehas
whenIusedthechoke
forstartingit.
Lesscarbonbuildup,ina2-stroke,meanslongerenginelifeand
reliability.Ipreferitthisway.
Ralph,OriginalFirestar,18yearsflyingit
--\"Beauford\"<BEAUFORD@TAMPABAY.RR.COM>wrote:
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Beauford"<BEAUFORD@TAMPABAY.RR.COM>
Ralph...
Thoughtyouwouldwanttoknow...Whatyousaidinyourpost(seebelow)
contradictswhattheRotaxmechstoldme...
Theysaidtheprimerpumpcanfailintwodifferentmodes...
1.Permitsextraairtobedrawnintocarb,makingenginerunleanand
hot
2.Permitsrawfueltobedrawnintocarb,loadingenginewithcarbon
Theysaidthattheyhadseenbothtypesofprimerpump
;failureinthepast.
&
gt;
Ofcoursetheenrichment(choke)pistoncanfailtoo,andIamtheposter
childforthatparticularmalfunction...
Regards,
Beauford
FF#076
-----OriginalMessage-----
From:"Ralph"<UL15RHB@JUNO.COM>
--Kolb-Listmessagepostedby:"Ralph"<UL15RHB@JUNO.COM>
Kolbers,anotherthingIforgottomentionaboutusingaprimerpumpis
thatitcannotoverrichenthemixturebyshootingextrafuelintothe
carb..Shouldthepumpfailorleak,nothinghappens.Ralph,Original
Firestar,18yearsflyingit
inMaineEllery
donotarchive
nbsp;
sp;
ortobrowse
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org>
Maxair Drifter, tank was lower than the engine.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
do not archive
At 06:33 PM 8/18/05 +0000, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
>
>Richard,
>Do you remember if the tank on this plane was about the same level or
>higher than the carburetor (gravity fed, similar to the Quicksilvers)?
>Ralph
>
>-- Richard Pike wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike
>
>Several years ago one of our locals had a defective primer. It tended to
>creep out from the closed position and would then allow fuel to be go
>through the primer nipple and into the engine. This engine had been a real
>pain to figure out, seemed like it was always jetted wrong. Removed the
>primer and capped the nipple, problem solved. Don't remember if his primer
>was upstream or downstream of the fuel pump, (I think upstream, been too
>long ago...) but that could certainly have been a factor as well.
>
>Moral of the story:
>Enrichners can fail
>Primers can fail.
>Anything can (and probably eventually will) fail.
>Primers do not leak fuel into the carb,
>- but -
>Faulty primers will allow fuel to be sucked into the engine.
>If you have a fuel pump between the tank and the faulty primer,
>then a faulty primer turns the primer nipple into an aux main jet.
>Protect yourself at all times...
>
>Richard Pike
>MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: DAquaNut@aol.com
In a message dated 8/18/2005 1:52:01 P.M. Central Standard Time,
richard@bcchapel.org writes:
>Faulty primers will allow fuel to be sucked into the engine.
>If you have a fuel pump between the tank and the faulty primer,
>then a faulty primer turns the primer nipple into an aux main jet.
>Protect yourself at all times...
Richard,
Have you looked at Jack Harts home- made primer it has a tiny petcock
valve where it is turned off and no fuel can enter until it is turned on again.
Maybe a similar valve could be put on Rotax's primer.
Ed
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Kolb 1986 Twinstar w Rotax 503 |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron <CaptainRon1@cox.net>
For me that would be the clincher. If they are going to take the old
one off my hands for 750 smackers towards a new one I'd do it in a
heart beat.
=========================================
And to put a little more urgency to the question Rotax is offering a $750
trade in of older engines on a new 503 til the end of this month.
The new engine would be nice with dual ignition and oil injection but it
will always be a 2 cycle..
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Pre Mix made easy |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron <CaptainRon1@cox.net>
MMO is easier on you, she only got's to sniff it.
We got WD40 here too, but we use that on hinges.
=====================================
Pat
If you want to know how to use it as a contraceptive. The girl hold the tin
firmly between her knees.
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Kolb 1986 Twinstar w Rotax 503 |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: HShack@aol.com
In a message dated 8/18/2005 10:31:25 PM Eastern Standard Time,
CaptainRon1@cox.net writes:
And to put a little more urgency to the question Rotax is offering a $750
trade in of older engines on a new 503 til the end of this month.
The new engine would be nice with dual ignition and oil injection but it
will always be a 2 cycle..
When I heard of this a couple weeks ago, I thought they were taking only
Hirth & 2si engines on trade- not Rotaxes. Am I wrong?
Howard Shackleford
FS II
SC
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: possums <possums@mindspring.com>
At 11:48 AM 8/18/2005, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
>
>Beauford and others,
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due
>to a faulty primer, does not amount to much.
Try taking off the capped nipple on the carb and see what happens.
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: possums <possums@mindspring.com>
At 09:06 AM 8/18/2005, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Beauford" <beauford@tampabay.rr.com>
>
>Ralph...
>Thought you would want to know...What you said in your post (see below)
>contradicts what the Rotax mechs told me...
>
>They said the primer pump can fail in two different modes...
> 1. Permits extra air to be drawn into carb , making engine run lean and
>hot
> 2. Permits raw fuel to be drawn into carb, loading engine with carbon
>
>They said that they had seen both types of primer pump failure in the past.
>
>Of course the enrichment (choke) piston can fail too, and I am the poster
>child for that particular malfunction...
>
>Regards,
>Beauford
That part (enrichment choke piston) is a "One piece" cylinder with a
"rubber bottom".......I can't believe that it
is defective very often. It either works or it doesn't - "Except for
yours, Beauford" . Both mine still look the same after 650 hrs.
I've got two of them so I guess that would equate to 1300 hours using
the recent thread of the 2 engines vs. 1 engine theory.
I rebuilt both my carburetors about 14 months ago and replaced
"everything" that was indicated in the rebuild.
There was nothing said about the enrichment (choke) piston. The
springs that push it down or shut off the
fuel are very strong. I don't think that would be a problem unless
your cables wouldn't let it seat.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Bing Enrichment Piston |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: possums <possums@mindspring.com>
OK ... me and Ralph been flyin these things for a while ... since
1983 for both of us ...I guess.
BTW I like talking to somebody that's been watching these things
evolve from bicycles with wings.
I've never had a primer, Ralph's never used the "coke" that comes
with the engine.
Both of us have had unbelievable success in starting our respective
engines on the first pull.
Hell ....I'll bet we could blow on the prop real hard and it would
start, right Ralph??
Belive it or not---I can "hand prop" my 503 DC using the method
discussed before.
And I'm sure Ralph can do the same -
Now .....you "yearlings" ( that would be those of you that have been
flying for a year or so and
ain't dead yet) have to keep in mind that neither of us have had
experience in "both" areas.
So nobody is dead wrong on anything. BOTH OF US are probably right
on. That can happen.
That's what's good about this list, if you don't let it get into the
"I'm right and your wrong" debate.
Just good clean fun - most of the time.
-------------------------
>I saw this post. The amount of air that is leaked into the carb, due
>to a faulty primer, does not amount to much. Look at the size of the
>primer nipple in the carb. Now compare that with the size of the air
>cleaner. The primer on mine is fed into a nipple on the side of the
>intake manifold, so if there was a leaking problem, it would be more
>severe than one fed into the carburetor body. By the way, always
>cable tie the fuel line around the nipple (I'm using cable ties now
>instead of those plastic rachet clamps. They work so much better
>with no leaking).
>The primer does not leak raw fuel into the carb, whereas a faulty
>enrichner can -snip- I have not used the choke (enrichner) in years
>and have not had a carbon problem. I did have the usual carbon
>problem that everyone else has when I used the choke for starting it.
>Less carbon buildup, in a 2-stroke, means longer engine life and
>reliability. I prefer it this way.
>Ralph, Original Firestar, 18 years flying it
----------------------------------------------------
Try taking off the capped nipple on the carb and see what happens.
-----------------------------------------------------
That part (enrichment choke piston) is a "One piece" cylinder with a
"rubber bottom".......I can't believe that it
is defective very often. It either works or it doesn't - "Except for
yours, Beauford" . Both mine still look the same after 650 hrs.
I've got two of them so I guess that would equate to 1300 hours using
the recent thread of the 2 engines vs. 1 engine theory.
I rebuilt both my carburetors about 14 months ago and replaced
"everything" that was indicated in the rebuild.
There was nothing said about the enrichment (choke) piston. The
springs that push it down or shut off the
fuel are very strong. I don't think that would be a problem unless
your cables wouldn't let it seat.
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