---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Wed 09/07/05: 25 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 01:59 AM - Re: UL crash video (PATRICK LADD) 2. 02:30 AM - Re: Re: Re: UL crash video (PATRICK LADD) 3. 02:33 AM - Re: BRS use- Re: Re: UL crash video (PATRICK LADD) 4. 06:00 AM - Re: UL crash video (John Hauck) 5. 06:21 AM - Re: Re: Re: UL crash video (John Hauck) 6. 06:58 AM - Re: Re: UL crash video (Chuck Stonex) 7. 07:04 AM - Re: UL crash video (George E. Myers Jr.) 8. 07:06 AM - Re: UL crash video (John Jung) 9. 07:08 AM - Re: Re: Re: UL crash video (Larry Bourne) 10. 07:19 AM - Cows & Kolbs (Jack B. Hart) 11. 07:40 AM - Geo engine (flykolb) 12. 08:45 AM - Re: Re: Re: UL crash video (PENGUIN) 13. 08:50 AM - Re: Re: UL crash video (Arksey@aol.com) 14. 08:55 AM - Re: Re: UL crash video (Arksey@aol.com) 15. 09:17 AM - Re: Re: Re: UL crash video (Ron) 16. 09:36 AM - Re: Geo engine (Ron) 17. 10:06 AM - Re: FireFly Getting Around (Jack B. Hart) 18. 03:04 PM - Kolb Database Problems (dama) 19. 03:39 PM - MK III X FLYING CHARACTERISTICS WITH A PASSENGER (Jim Ballenger) 20. 04:25 PM - Re: Geo engine (Richard & Martha Neilsen) 21. 06:06 PM - Re: MK III X FLYING CHARACTERISTICS WITH A PASSENGER (John Hauck) 22. 06:06 PM - Re: Engine (Don Martin) 23. 10:55 PM - Re: Engine (Richard Pike) 24. 11:13 PM - Re: MK III X FLYING CHARACTERISTICS WITH A PASSENGER (Richard Pike) 25. 11:13 PM - Re: Geo engine (Richard Swiderski) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 01:59:33 AM PST US From: "PATRICK LADD" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" Hi All, I noticed that several of the `saves` on the BRS page listed airobatics as the reason for the emergency. I am surprised that anyone daft enough to airobat an ultralight had the sense to fit a `chute. Unless it was part of a proper test programme of course. Pat do not archive ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:30:11 AM PST US From: "PATRICK LADD" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" shoot for the approach end of the field,>> Hi, if I remember my gliding training the search for a field started with `Size, shape and slope` Added swiftly to that was `wires`. After that, and if there is time, my personal list then added `Care`(can I land close enough to get help, a house or a farmworker in case I screw up) `Can` I fly out again. `Cows` because cows eat small airplanes. They love the dope. Lastly, it is better to roll into the far hedge at 20 knots than fly into the near one at 40. Of course there was more time for decisions in a glider but the basis is valid. I think. I must say when I flew last night I remembered that damned video and flew about a 1000ft higher than usual and kept a sharp eye out for landable fields. Cheer Pat do not archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:33:53 AM PST US From: "PATRICK LADD" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: BRS use- Re: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" As for the video of that fellow crushing into trees>> Hi All, the argument about `what he should have done if there was time`. Anyone any experience of crunching into trees. Is it better to stall into the tops or fly into them?. Looking at the video again the crash didn`t look that bad until about the last frame when the guy seemed to fall clear of the trees and start a clear drop to the ground. Cheers Pat do not archive ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:00:37 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" | I am surprised that anyone daft enough to airobat an ultralight had the | sense to fit a `chute. Unless it was part of a proper test programme of | course. | | Pat Patrick/All: Some of us were daft enough to fly aerobatics and also had the sense to wear a parachute. Whether part of a proper test program or not, very useful information was obtained in most cases where an airframe or component failed. john h DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 06:21:06 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" | `Cows` because cows eat small airplanes. They love the dope. | I must say when I flew last night I remembered that damned video and flew | about a 1000ft higher than usual and kept a sharp eye out for landable | fields. | | Cheer | | Pat Patrick/All: You are talking ancient history reference "cows eating small airplanes". I can not speak for cotton/linen covered, doped fabric, but polyester and Stitts are not appetizing to cows. I can speak from experience on this subject. My airplanes have been living and flying with cows since 1984. On one occassion I discovered the teeth marks of a new calf on the trailing edge of the elevators of my Ultrastar. He did the taste test, decided it was not as good as mother's milk and grass. Never had any other problems with them. Seems the video did do someone some good. Got you up to a little higher altitude. john h MKIII DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 06:58:35 AM PST US From: "Chuck Stonex" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Chuck Stonex" now his wife is saying "I TOLD YOU YOU WOULD GET HURT! YOU NEVER LISTEN TO ME!!!" CHUCK S --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" | The fellow was a 100-hr Cessna driver, and low-time UL pilot (first flight | in his QS was 8/6/2005). -- Robert Robert L/Gang: Seems he was also a low-time Cessna driver. john h MKIII DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 07:04:30 AM PST US From: "George E. Myers Jr." Subject: Re: Kolb-List: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: "George E. Myers Jr." Actually in 1984 Quicksilver built around 80 super acrobatic ultralights, with double cambered wings and beefed up tubes & wires, one of which (#5) I have owned & flown for the past 2 years. I have done hundreds of loops, rolls, spirals and flown upside down (as long as I could stand it). The plane is rated plus or minus 9 G's. It all works great & has been loads of fun. The biggest problem I have had has been finding a good pumper carb. George Do Not Archive At 09-07-2005, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" > >Hi All, >I noticed that several of the `saves` on the BRS page listed airobatics as >the reason for the emergency. > >I am surprised that anyone daft enough to airobat an ultralight had the >sense to fit a `chute. Unless it was part of a proper test programme of >course. > >Pat > >do not archive > > >-- George E. Myers Jr. San Marcos Tx. http://www.geohome.sytes.net gmyers@corridor.net -- ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 07:06:17 AM PST US From: John Jung Subject: Kolb-List: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: John Jung Group, I owned two Quicksilvers before getting a Kolb, and here is what I think after seeing the video: The pilot was too low over the trees. At the point his engine quit, he had no choice, he was not going to aviod the trees. He did not immediately put the stick forward and his stall started two seconds after the engine quit. I believe that he would not have hit the trees as hard if he had maintained control and flaired into the trees. But we didn't see the rest of the crash, and couldn't tell if he hit the ground and how much of his injuries were caused by that. John Jung Currently visiting Wisconsin and away from my Firestar ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:08:34 AM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Kinda kills the idea of low and slow, doesn't it, Pat ?? Lar. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "PATRICK LADD" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Re: UL crash video > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "PATRICK LADD" > > > I must say when I flew last night I remembered that damned video and flew > about a 1000ft higher than usual and kept a sharp eye out for landable > fields. > > Cheer > > Pat > > do not archive > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:19:55 AM PST US From: "Jack B. Hart" Subject: Kolb-List: Cows & Kolbs --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jack B. Hart" FireFlyers & Kolbers, Being new in the Winchester, Indiana area, I had to find barber. In the course of getting my hair cut the barber asked all the important questions that are asked in rural America. Where do you live? What do you do? What did you do before you retired? And finally what do you do now that you are retired? When he found out that I flew a ultra light vehicle he related the following story. A man south west of Winchester has his own strip and a Kolb. It seems a neighbors cattle got out and wandered on to his property, and into the barn/hangar. One of the heifers was in heat and took a liking to the Kolb and mounted the front of the machine. When the owner came to reclaim the cattle, he was shown the damaged aircraft. His comment was that "You should have kept the barn door closed." I have flown over his strip, but I have not met him or verified the above story. But it seems so ridiculous that it must be true. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN Do not archive ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 07:40:57 AM PST US From: "flykolb" Subject: Kolb-List: Geo engine 2.33 DATE_IN_FUTURE_12_24 Date: is 12 to 24 hours after Received: date --> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" Does anyone have a geo/metro on their Mark III Kolb and actually flying with it? Jim Mark III ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:45:27 AM PST US From: PENGUIN Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: PENGUIN --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Rusty" <13brv3c@bellsouth.net> > >Interesting discussion. I would say that the aircraft condition should not >be taken into consideration at all. Too many people have lost their lives >by trying to "save the plane". Forget that! Save yourself, and get a new >plane. Applies to all kinds of flying things. Penguin's Paragliding Proverbs # 2: (http://www.humboldt.net/~penguin/PROVERBS.HTM) Land your body, not your wing. Friend of mine made a last minute turn during approach in high winds to get his *new* wing on a road, instead of into some low brush - which would have cost him 45 minutes or so to get out. Might have put a small tear or two in the wing, as well. Cost him his life. The wing, however, didn't have a scratch on it when we recovered it. Penguin Do not archive ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:50:29 AM PST US From: Arksey@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: Arksey@aol.com group, here is statement that i copyed off the ultralight yahoo group page about the video crash. It is interesting. Jim Swan Michigan do not archive.... ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:55:15 AM PST US From: Arksey@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: Arksey@aol.com group, i screwed up the last post, so will try again. this pertains to video crash. jim swan michigan The following crash report, comes from ultralight pilot Marty Lunsford, from North Carolina. Marty suffered injuries as a result of a recent crash. Ironically, he happened to have a video camera mounted on his plane, and running at the time of the crash. I applaud Marty for sharing his story with everyone, and for being candid about "mistakes" he may have made. We can all learn from this. - Bob Comperini Marty Lunsford's Crash On Saturday, August 27th 2005 I took my Quicksilver MX to the Raleigh (NC) East airport to do a little flying. On previous flights I had noticed that the engine was only developing about 5700 RPMs at full power. It should be hitting about 6200 RPMs, so a friend of mine, who is familiar with 2 stroke engines and carbs, met me at the airport to see if we could tweak the engine a little. When I first pulled the plane out of the trailer, I noticed that I had left the fuel valve on after the previous flight. As a result, the air filter was saturated with fuel and oil, and it was even dripping off of the filter. After assembling the plane we tried to start the engine. It normally only takes a few pulls to get the engine going, but this time it took several minutes. We turned off the fuel valve, opened the choke, and opened the throttle to pull lots of air through the engine. Eventually it caught, and we let it run at about 2500 RPMs for a few minutes to warm up. After the engine had warmed up, we ran it up to mid range, and then full throttle to check the RPMs. It was still only hitting about 5700, so we throttled back to idle and I went to get the Cuyuna manual while my friend held the plane. We looked at the diagram of the carburetor in the book, and after a minute or two, realized that the carb on my plane was slightly different from the carb in my book. Realizing that we weren't going to be able to make any adjustments right then, I decided to just go fly a little. Here is where the memories of my friend and I break down. We think we had turned the fuel valve at the bottom of the fuel tank back on, but we're not really sure. I had already done my preflight and walkaround, so I didn't check the valve immediately before taxiing out to the runway. The video shows the outcome of the flight. I was taken away by ambulance, and the next day a couple of friends went back out to the airport to put the wreckage back into the trailer and take it to my house. I asked them to check the fuel valve to see if it was on or off. When they got to the airport, the fuel valve was OFF, but the fuel filter, which is located between the tank and the carb, was full of fuel (it has a clear cover). We don't know how long the engine will run with the valve in the off position, but I suppose it could idle for several minutes, just sipping on the fuel in the carb bowl and the filter. However, we had the engine running at various power settings for approximately ten minutes before I actually took off. I don't think the engine could possibly run that long if the valve was off, so I'm assuming we turned it back on. But that is one of the "unknowns". If we had turned the valve back on, then how did it get turned off before my friends picked up the plane the next day? Well, I crashed right next to an airport, and some of the people who came to rescue me were from the airport. It is possible that one of them had enough airplane smarts to realize that the fuel valve being "on" was a safety hazard. Maybe they turned it off shortly after my crash. That would make sense, since the valve was off, but the filter was full of fuel. Of course, all of this is just a guess. My friends also told me that the prop turned freely, so the engine didn't seize. They tried to start it, but it would not start. I have also been wondering about the engine kill switch. The previous owner of the plane told me to be careful of it because it was easy to kill the engine when grabbing ahold of the tube by the pilots head. Looking at the video, I clearly did not grab that tube until after the engine died, however, the switch might have some corrosion in it which caused it to short out, or the wire may have gotten pinched somewhere, and the vibration of the engine may have caused it to short out. It will be several weeks before I have recovered enough to investigate what caused the engine failure. I'll update you when I have more info. do not archive ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:17:04 AM PST US From: Ron Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Re: UL crash video --> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron I must say when I flew last night I remembered that damned video and flew about a 1000ft higher than usual and kept a sharp eye out for landable fields. Cheer Pat ======================= Great! it means the video is doing its job. Because of the video I decided to get a BRS. To this point I didn't think it was needed, that clip though changed my mind. I rather part with 4K than the alternative, that I need it and it ain't available. :-) ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:36:18 AM PST US From: Ron Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Geo engine --> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" > >Does anyone have a geo/metro on their Mark III Kolb and actually >flying with it? > >Jim >Mark III ================================ Go to the Geo metro group on yahoo. There are a few people flying that engine. I have decided on that engine, but can't find any. The recommended engine is the 13 B for our type airplane the M3. You would figure there will be many of these engines out there and yet.... Richard Siderski is converting one for his M3X but he is not yet flying. There is another fellow who has one and he *is* flying. Which brings up another point Great Plaines has a water cooled VW conversion that looks real promising any thoughts on their offerings? ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 10:06:30 AM PST US From: "Jack B. Hart" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly Getting Around --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jack B. Hart" At 06:29 PM 9/6/05 -0700, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron > >Which one was faster? :-) > >Ron >Arizona > > Do not archive > >====================== > > >Today I rode the mower for five hours. > Ron, Speed is not the issue. I like to float above the grass at 1,500 feet agl rather than bounce along just 2 - 3 feet agl. Now if I could get equal or more time in the FireFly than the mower, I would be a very happy man. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:04:17 PM PST US From: "dama" Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb Database Problems --> Kolb-List message posted by: "dama" Some of you have already noticed that the database is blank. I am having trouble with publishing and it appears to be in my software. I am no techno geek and can barely maintain the site that I have but I will try to fix it ASAP. If you need any contacts, you may email me directly to look it up. Thanks, Kip http://www.springeraviation.net/ ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 03:39:38 PM PST US From: "Jim Ballenger" Subject: Kolb-List: MK III X FLYING CHARACTERISTICS WITH A PASSENGER --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jim Ballenger" Fellow Kolbers I am nearing 40 hours on my rotax 582 powered MkIII and starting to experiment with flying different weight sand bags to simulate passenger weights. I have flown with 60 , 120 and 180 pounds of sand in the passenger seat. I have been changing my HZ Stab LE height to keep my trim in check. When flying solo. I have the LE in the top hole of the 4 hole adjustable HZ Stab bracket and it flies great. For each 60 pounds of increased weight, I am moving the LE down one hole and so far it is working out. Has anyone else experimented with the HZ stab incidence when flying different weights in the passenger seat? Thanks Jim Ballenger Selling a FS KXP 447 Flying a MK III X 582 Virginia Beach, VA ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 04:25:56 PM PST US From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Geo engine --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Ron/All The water cooled Greatplanes heads look to be great but at $3400 that's a bunch of money. That would make the VW about twice as expensive as a stock VW and with the extra weight you might be getting close to the weight of a Subaru. Then will the engine handle the extra power for the long term. And we really don't have a great reduction drive for the VW engine. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW powered MKIIIc ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Geo engine > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron > >>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" >> >>Does anyone have a geo/metro on their Mark III Kolb and actually >>flying with it? >> >>Jim >>Mark III > ================================ > > Go to the Geo metro group on yahoo. There are a few people flying that > engine. > > I have decided on that engine, but can't find any. The recommended > engine is the 13 B for our type airplane the M3. > You would figure there will be many of these engines out there and yet.... > > Richard Siderski is converting one for his M3X but he is not yet > flying. There is another fellow who has one and he *is* flying. > > Which brings up another point Great Plaines has a water cooled VW > conversion that looks real promising any thoughts on their offerings? > > > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 06:06:39 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: MK III X FLYING CHARACTERISTICS WITH A PASSENGER --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" Has anyone else experimented with the HZ stab incidence when flying different weights in the passenger seat? Hi Jim B/Gang: Don't know about the Xtra, but I knew I needed some help with pitch trim based on experience flying passengers in the Factory MKIII. When I built my MKIII, Jim Hauck and I came up with 4130 mounting fittings that allowed three difference settings. My top setting originally was set about an inch below the top of the tail boom. That wasn't enough, so I drilled them out and moved them down some more. Ended leaving them set in the middle position for all loads. That is where the airplane and I fly the best. That is where we are the most comfortable. Don't know that that experiement was ever done prior to ours, February 1991. Take care, john h hauck's holler, alabama MKIII - 2,371.5 hours 912ULS - 1,025.6 hours ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 06:06:40 PM PST US From: "Don Martin" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Engine --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Don Martin" Thanks for the info. Need to get a pressure tester. What's your take on AFS (Aircraft Finishing Systems)? One nice thing about this covering system is the lack of noxious fumes. And there will be a workshop near me in a month or so. Don >From: Richard Pike >Reply-To: kolb-list@matronics.com >To: kolb-list@matronics.com >Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Engine >Date: Sun, 04 Sep 2005 07:43:19 -0400 > >--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike > >I would expect the engine to be in OK shape. Do a crankcase test on it just >to be sure. You need to have a crankcase pressure tester anyway, now is a >good time to get one. > >Randolph fabric coatings are great. I have used both Randolph and Stits, >and the same techniques apply to both. IMO, Randolph coatings dry a bit >quicker, which helps when you are applying all the tapes. This is a very >subjective opinion, but I remember Randolph as a bit quicker to work with. >Or maybe I was just getting old by the time I got to the Stits... > >Richard Pike >MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) > >At 11:59 PM 9/3/05 -0700, you wrote: > > >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Don Martin" > > > >Kolb group: > > > >I've got a chance to pick up a 2003 Rotax 503 with oil injection for what > >seems a reasonable price. The engine is still in its transport box. >Would > >problems like internal corosion or deteriorating seals have developed >over > >the 2 year period? What protective measures should I use if kept in >storage > >for another year? > > > >Anybody familiar with the Randolph method of coverings/paints? Good?Bad? > > > >Thanks > > > >Don > > > > > > ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 10:55:44 PM PST US From: Richard Pike Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Engine --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike No experience. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) do not archive At 06:06 PM 9/7/05 -0700, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Don Martin" > >Thanks for the info. Need to get a pressure tester. > >What's your take on AFS (Aircraft Finishing Systems)? One nice thing about >this covering system is the lack of noxious fumes. And there will be a >workshop near me in a month or so. > >Don ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 11:13:55 PM PST US From: Richard Pike Subject: Re: Kolb-List: MK III X FLYING CHARACTERISTICS WITH A PASSENGER --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike I found it easier to modify the flap handle so that when carrying a passenger, I could have the flap handle move to a higher position, and reflex the flaps. That makes a huge difference in how the airplane trims out with the extra weight. For your first flight with a passenger, set your trim lever for a lot more up elevator than you normally use, and do not plan to land with full flaps. Flaps and a passenger cause a really nose down pitch. Should you need to go around, or extend the base leg, etc., full power with a passenger and full flaps will make you go "Hmmm..." Not a happy time. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) do not archive At 06:39 PM 9/7/05 -0400, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jim Ballenger" > >Fellow Kolbers >I am nearing 40 hours on my rotax 582 powered MkIII and starting to >experiment with flying different weight sand bags to simulate passenger >weights. I have flown with 60 , 120 and 180 pounds of sand in the >passenger seat. I have been changing my HZ Stab LE height to keep my trim >in check. When flying solo. I have the LE in the top hole of the 4 hole >adjustable HZ Stab bracket and it flies great. For each 60 pounds of >increased weight, I am moving the LE down one hole and so far it is >working out. Has anyone else experimented with the HZ stab incidence when >flying different weights in the passenger seat? >Thanks >Jim Ballenger >Selling a FS KXP 447 >Flying a MK III X 582 >Virginia Beach, VA > > ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 11:13:57 PM PST US From: "Richard Swiderski" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Geo engine --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard Swiderski" Rick, Check out the SPG-2, it is very robust & affordable. See it at http://www.airtrikes.net/engines.shtml It is being used with VW's but not shown on that site, Vassli the importer would be happy to talk with you. Richard Swiderski -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard & Martha Neilsen Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Geo engine --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Ron/All The water cooled Greatplanes heads look to be great but at $3400 that's a bunch of money. That would make the VW about twice as expensive as a stock VW and with the extra weight you might be getting close to the weight of a Subaru. Then will the engine handle the extra power for the long term. And we really don't have a great reduction drive for the VW engine. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW powered MKIIIc ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Geo engine > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Ron > >>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" >> >>Does anyone have a geo/metro on their Mark III Kolb and actually >>flying with it? >> >>Jim >>Mark III > ================================ > > Go to the Geo metro group on yahoo. There are a few people flying that > engine. > > I have decided on that engine, but can't find any. The recommended > engine is the 13 B for our type airplane the M3. > You would figure there will be many of these engines out there and yet.... > > Richard Siderski is converting one for his M3X but he is not yet > flying. There is another fellow who has one and he *is* flying. > > Which brings up another point Great Plaines has a water cooled VW > conversion that looks real promising any thoughts on their offerings? > > >