---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Thu 11/10/05: 15 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:10 AM - LOC... (Matt Dralle) 2. 04:19 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (N27SB@AOL.COM) 3. 05:02 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (Bob Dalton) 4. 05:03 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (Don Gherardini) 5. 05:23 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (N27SB@aol.com) 6. 05:50 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (John Hauck) 7. 05:50 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (Dwight.Kottke@hti.htch.com) 8. 05:56 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (John Hauck) 9. 06:05 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (N27SB@aol.com) 10. 06:39 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (N27SB@aol.com) 11. 06:45 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (N27SB@aol.com) 12. 07:36 AM - Re: Future Seaplane Base (pat ladd) 13. 02:33 PM - Re: Two or Three Blade Propellers (Jack B. Hart) 14. 07:27 PM - Re: Mark III vs Mark III Xtra (Jim Clayton) 15. 10:21 PM - SeaPlane Base (Flycrazy8@aol.com) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:10:19 AM PST US From: Matt Dralle Subject: Kolb-List: LOC... --> Kolb-List message posted by: Matt Dralle Hi Listers, Each year at the end of the List Fund Raiser, I post a message acknowledging everyone that so generously made a Contribution to support the Lists. Its sort of my way of publicly thanking everyone that took a minute to show their appreciation for the Lists. Won't you take a moment and assure that your name is on that List of Contributors (LOC)? As a number of members have pointed out over the years, the List seems at least - if not a whole lot more - valuable as a building/flying/recreating/entertainment tool as your typical magazine subscription! Please take minute and assure that your name is on this year's LOC? Show others that you appreciate the Lists. Making a Contribution to support the Lists is fast and easy using your Credit card or Paypal on the Secure Web Site: http://www.matronics.com/contribution or by popping a personal check in the mail to: Matronics Email Lists c/o Matt Dralle PO Box 347 Livermore CA 94551-0347 I would like to thank everyone that has so generously made a Contribution thus far in this year's List Fund Raiser! Remember that its YOUR support that keeps these Lists going and improving! Don't forget to include a little comment about how the Lists have helped you! Best regards, Matt Dralle Email List Administrator Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551 925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft do not archive ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 04:19:14 AM PST US From: N27SB@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com To All, Well it has been an exciting week. I just secured a Contract to purchase a house on Eagle Lake in Winter Haven, Florida. The lake is over 200 acres and is deep and clear and there are currently several Seaplanes based there. The back yard has over 140 ft of white sand beach. It is also only about 15 miles from Lakeland. It looks like I will be able to fulfill a lifelong dream and be able to fly out of my own back yard. And the Aircraft will be a Kolb Firefly. I wonder what the Bigboy Fatcats will think of a little old Firefly on Floats. do not archive Steve B ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:02:14 AM PST US From: "Bob Dalton" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bob Dalton" Steve, That s so cool! I must admit that would also be a dream come true for me. Send pics to us all ASAP. "CONGRATULATIONS" Bob Dalton Manteca,CA Still lurkin, building nothing! Do not archive -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of N27SB@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com To All, Well it has been an exciting week. I just secured a Contract to purchase a house on Eagle Lake in Winter Haven, Florida. The lake is over 200 acres and is ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 05:03:19 AM PST US From: "Don Gherardini" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Don Gherardini" Congrats Steve, A Lifelong dream fullfilled is a blessing, and I am happy to see you make yours, particularly since it is mine too! I have never flown a plane on floats..but as I have been contemplateing buying enough ground to build a runway..the thought of all the mowing involved makes me think more of floats , and a fishing boat! Don Gherardini OEM.Sales / Engineering dept. American Honda Engines Power Equipment Company CortLand, Illinois 800-626-7326 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 05:23:10 AM PST US From: N27SB@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com Thanks for the comments Don and Bob, The existing house was built in 1949 and has been rented for 20 years. Fortunately it is concrete block on an elevated slab so you can do anything with it. It is pretty ugly right now but what potential. It is dwarfed by the surrounding mansions. I hope to have it cleaned up and usable by SnF 2006. If I get that far I would be happy to host a Kolb get together. Long term plans would be to build a second floor and use the bottom for a hanger. I will try to do some pictures but right now it is so ugly it made my Girlfriend cry. Steve B do not archive ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 05:50:20 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" purchase a | house on Eagle Lake in Winter Haven, Florida. | Steve B Hi Steve/Gang: Sometimes women just do not understand. ;-) Looks like you are snuggled up next to Bartow Airport also. That means you won't have to drive so far to pick me up when I fly down your way. If your area in Florida is like my area in Alabama, the water front property will more than pay for itself in a few short years. john h DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 05:50:21 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base From: Dwight.Kottke@hti.htch.com 07:48:53 AM, Serialize complete at 11/10/2005 07:48:53 AM, Itemize by SMTP Server on HUDOMGW1/HTI(Release 6.5.4|March 27, 2005) at 11/10/2005 07:49:38 AM, Serialize by Router on HUDOMGW1/HTI(Release 6.5.4|March 27, 2005) at 11/10/2005 07:49:39 AM, Serialize complete at 11/10/2005 07:49:39 AM --> Kolb-List message posted by: Dwight.Kottke@hti.htch.com Old Chinese Proverb: It is not better to have ugly house that makes girlfriend cry; than ugly girlfriend that makes house cry? The Flying Farmer Still repairing Firestar from hard landing do not archive --> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com Thanks for the comments Don and Bob, The existing house was built in 1949. It is pretty ugly right now, it is so ugly it made my Girlfriend cry. Steve B do not archive ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:56:53 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" contemplateing | buying enough ground to build a runway..the thought of all the mowing | involved makes me think more of floats , and a fishing boat! | | Don Gherardini Don G/Gang: I am in the same boat you are Don. Never flown off water. However, I have been lucky enough to have use of a friends cow pasture for the last 21 years. As far as cutting the grass goes, that involves my other hobby, antique tractors. I like firing up these old gals and cutting grass. I live on a large lake. Thought originally that I would go with floats. Then I got to thinking about trying to control a light vessel 30 feet wide in and amongst the trees and docks during an unannounced summer squall. Decided to stay on the ground rather than water. john h DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 06:05:08 AM PST US From: N27SB@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com In a message dated 11/10/2005 8:51:00 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, jhauck@elmore.rr.com writes: Sometimes women just do not understand. ;-) Looks like you are snuggled up next to Bartow Airport also. That means you won't have to drive so far to pick me up when I fly down your way. If your area in Florida is like my area in Alabama, the water front property will more than pay for itself in a few short years. john h You are right John, it is about 4 miles north of Bartow which means that it is inside their control zone. Talked to the tower already and they said a UL is no problem and I could get a letter of waiver. Give me a few months and I sill have an airconditioned bunkhouse for you and a Vespa. Waterfront here is explosive. this was the childhood home of a local millionaire. Guess he did not feel like selling it after his parents died. It is a Time Capsule. I was very lucky to stumble on it. Steve B do not archive ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 06:39:00 AM PST US From: N27SB@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com In a message dated 11/10/2005 8:50:58 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, Dwight.Kottke@hti.htch.com writes: It is pretty ugly right now, it is so ugly it made my Girlfriend cry. FUNNY Steve B do not archive ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 06:45:34 AM PST US From: N27SB@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com In a message dated 11/10/2005 8:57:38 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, jhauck@elmore.rr.com writes: I live on a large lake. Thought originally that I would go with floats. Then I got to thinking about trying to control a light vessel 30 feet wide in and amongst the trees and docks during an unannounced summer squall. Decided to stay on the ground rather than water. john h You are right John, even with a MKIIIc it is nice to have a nice wide sand beach clear of trees and docks for your final taxi approach. With a 10 kt tailwind as you taxi to the beach you have to hold a bunch of power right up to the last second. steve b do not archive ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 07:36:32 AM PST US From: "pat ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Future Seaplane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" It looks like I will be able to fulfill a lifelong dream and be able to fly out of my own back yard>> Hi Steve, I envy you. many years ago I stayed for a a couple of days with a guy named Jack Pullman who had a house on Lake Wales. He was a dealer for an amphibian ultralight which he thought I was going to buy. He had a slipway from his garden into the water and we just sat in the plane, took off the brake and slid gently backward into the lake. Out with a paddle to get the plane into position and then pulled the string and away we went. I thought it was the best thing since sliced bread. When we landed back on the lake we just slowed down, dropped the undercarriage and taxied up the slip. Magnificent. Many happy flying hours to you. Pat -- Checked by AVG Free Edition. ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:33:30 PM PST US From: "Jack B. Hart" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Two or Three Blade Propellers --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jack B. Hart" At 04:14 PM 11/9/05 -0500, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: Earl & Mim Zimmerman > >That is not what my experience has found! I don't think that your >example is inaccurate on at least one point in that the "90 hp" that you >pulled from the Rotax power curve is probably 5000 rpm WOT and not an >accurate measure of the power used to obtain 5000 rpm at 80 mph with a 2 >or 3 blade prop. >I agree with Mr. Pike. ~ Earl > Earl, You may well be correct about the hp. Since John H. did not mention his propeller pitch I had to pick off a hp value to be able to use the propeller selector program. There is no disagreement with Mr Pike. For the same propeller diameter, rpm and thrust, and switching from two to three blades, the program verifies what Richard Pike said. Also to find an equivalent two blade propeller, one must increase propeller diameter and reduce pitch. If this is done, you end up with a 80 inch propeller. It will develop the same thrust and efficiency as the 72 inch three blade propeller with the engine putting out 90 hp. The pitch difference between the three blade 72 inch to the two blade 80 inch propeller is not very large. Three blade pitch is 57.2 inches and the two blade pitch is 55.7 inches. I am pleased that we are both in agreement with Richard Pike. Jack B. Hart FF004 Winchester, IN ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 07:27:01 PM PST US From: Jim Clayton Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Mark III vs Mark III Xtra Michael Bigelow --> Kolb-List message posted by: Jim Clayton Hi Mike, Rick/All, First of all, sorry for the delayed response. Things are hopping again in Silicon Valley...so as my dad says "make hay while the sun is shining" ;-) I am building an Xtra and did choose to go with the flaps, and larger horizontal stabilizer. The factory folks were great about accommodating my request: they sent the wing drawings with the flaps, and charged a fee to change the cage to accept the flap linkages (all different from the flaperons). The good news for us is the early Xtras had the flaps same as the Classic, so they have the jigs to make the cage special by request (I don't recall the difference in price--Travis at TNK can help you there). Why did I go with the flaps and larger stab? The flaps are easy: All my flight experience has been in planes with flaps, and I can't imagine flying without them. For me this plane is to be a short-field bush plane, and flaps are VERY effective at adding lift and *lots* of drag--use with caution and practice landings with an instructor experienced in Kolb flaps! The larger stab was a more difficult choice: The Xtra has more frontal area, and that longer nose has a greater arm against the stab, but many are quite happy with their Xtra's with the same stab as the Classic. I spoke with several people that had flown both sizes, and since I personally favor stability over speed, I choose to go with the larger stabilizer. I've had the uncomfortable experience of flying a plane in rough weather with a too small horizontal stab and it was a nerve-wracking workout! So for me I tend to avoid all that excitement and favor stability, over the tiny possible difference in speed (less than one mph!?)the slight increase in wetted area will give. Regarding the electric trim: I am going to go with a trim tab at the back of an elevator (and possibly rudder, aileron), actuated by an electric trim servo. I must give credit to the inventor, Mark German (builder of a Kolbra) who designed beautiful, strong, and light trim tabs, and came up with the connection to a readily available trim servo. This bit is being sorted out this winter, and I would be happy to report it's effectiveness and the details once tested. But I'm quite sure this will work out, in terms of planning for your build--just the details, and proving it out left. Hope this helps, Jim Jim Clayton California Mark-3X, 912ULS.....Building www.quantumwrench.com/Kolb.htm -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Richard & Martha Neilsen Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Mark III vs Mark III Xtra --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" --> I have a MKIIIc and bought it because that was the only one available at the time. My thoughts on the differences are the Extra is faster and gives you more room for your feet, the potential for a larger instrument panel, and the panel is closer. The down side of the Extra is they don't come standard with flaps but can be ordered and there are some who believe that there isn't enough horizontal stabilizer area because of the wide flat nose. The classic is 10 MPH slower and the instrument panel is too far away to reach when strapped in. I also don't notice the foot angle except that I have better forward and down visibility. If I were to choose now I would likely pick the Extra but get the flap option (no question here), make a larger horizontal stabilizer and likely the larger panel. Check with Jim Clayton he is building one with these changes and I think 1-3 axis electric trim. Rick Neilsen Redrive VW powered MKIIIc ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 10:21:33 PM PST US From: Flycrazy8@aol.com Subject: Kolb-List: SeaPlane Base --> Kolb-List message posted by: Flycrazy8@aol.com Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com The b I wonder what the Bigboy Fatcats will think of a little old Firefly on Floats. back yard has over 140 ft of white sand beach. Hey Steve Reckon them FatCats will say " well there goes the neighborhood " :-) Who needs an airport when you can land a "fly" in less than 140 ft ? Congratulations to You on the other part of your dream (other than flying ) Stephen Do Not Archve