Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 12:17 AM - 2005 List of Contributors - Thank You... (Matt Dralle)
2. 01:02 AM - Re: Re: Seat-of-the-Pants (Ed Chmielewski)
3. 05:55 AM - Re: Prop Clearance (John Jung)
4. 06:09 AM - Re: Re: Seat-of-the-Pants (Wayne T. McCullough)
5. 06:10 AM - Re: Re: Seat-of-the-Pants (robert bean)
6. 06:37 AM - Re: Wire wheel? (Jeremy Casey)
7. 06:38 AM - Re: Wire wheel? (Jeremy Casey)
8. 06:57 AM - Hanger Trailers (Judy or Larry Gitt)
9. 07:22 AM - Re: Hangar (JIM HEFNER)
10. 07:36 AM - Kolb Laser (Don Gherardini)
11. 07:43 AM - Seat of the pants (ray anderson)
12. 07:58 AM - Re: Re: (pat ladd)
13. 08:08 AM - Re: Re: Seat-of-the-Pants (pat ladd)
14. 08:16 AM - Re: Seat of the pants (lucien stavenhagen)
15. 08:17 AM - Re: Seat of the pants (robert bean)
16. 08:24 AM - kolb airport, safty (b young)
17. 08:26 AM - Re: Seat of the pants (Don Gherardini)
18. 08:40 AM - Re: R laird - Kolb owner? (lucien stavenhagen)
19. 08:47 AM - Re: Seat of the pants (robert bean)
20. 08:53 AM - Re: Seat of the pants (JIM HEFNER)
21. 09:46 AM - Re: Re: (lucien stavenhagen)
22. 09:57 AM - Re: Re: Seat of the pants (Juan Puerto/Aeroservei)
23. 01:32 PM - Re: Re: Hangar (DCulver701@aol.com)
24. 03:48 PM - Re: Re: Hangar (JIM HEFNER)
25. 04:48 PM - Re: Seat of the pants (Wayne T. McCullough)
26. 05:19 PM - Re: Prop Clearance (John Hauck)
27. 05:25 PM - Re: Seat of the pants (Ralph)
28. 05:29 PM - Re: Re: Flying without instruments??? (John Hauck)
29. 05:49 PM - You know that you live in 2005 when... (Mitty)
30. 05:51 PM - Re: Re: Seat-of-the-Pants/No Instruments??? (John Hauck)
31. 06:02 PM - 'manners' (russ kinne)
32. 06:12 PM - Re: Seat of the pants/No Flight Instruments??? (John Hauck)
33. 06:14 PM - Re: Re: Hangar (John Hauck)
34. 06:24 PM - Re: You know that you live in 2005 when... (John Hauck)
35. 06:32 PM - Re: Seat of the pants/No Flight Instruments??? (John Hauck)
36. 06:35 PM - Re: Re: Flying without instruments??? (Ed Chmielewski)
37. 06:44 PM - Re: Seat of the pants (Michael Bigelow)
38. 06:45 PM - Re: You know that you live in 2005 when... (Ed Chmielewski)
39. 07:09 PM - Re: Prop Clearance (Michael Bigelow)
40. 07:31 PM - Re: Re: Seat-of-the-Pants/No Instruments??? (N27SB@aol.com)
41. 10:39 PM - Re: You know that you live in 2005 when... (Mitty)
Message 1
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| Subject: | 2005 List of Contributors - Thank You... |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Matt Dralle <dralle@matronics.com>
Dear Listers,
Let me say *thank you* to everyone that made a Contribution in
support of the Lists this year! It was really nice to hear all the
great comments people had regarding what the Lists mean to them and
how much they look forward to reading the new posts each day. As I
have said many times before, running these Lists and creating the
many new features is truly a labor of love. This is why your
comments of support and appreciation have particular meaning for
me. Your generosity during this time of List support only
underscores the great sentiments people have made regarding the Lists.
If you haven't yet made a Contribution in support of this year's Fund
Raiser please feel free to do so. There are still a number of the
various Free Gifts to be had as well. Once again, the URL for the
Contribution web site is:
http://www.matronics.com/contribution
I would like to thank Andy Gold of the Builder's Bookstore (
http://www.buildersbooks.com ), Paul Besing of Aeroware Enterprises (
http://www.kitlog.com ), and Jon Croke of Homebuilt HELP (
http://www.homebuilthelp.com ) for their extremely generous support
during this year's Fund Raiser through the contribution of
merchandise. These are three great guys that support this industry
and I encourage each and every Lister to have a look at their
respective web sites. Thank you Andy, Paul, and Jon!! Your support
is very much appreciated!
And finally, below you will find the 2005 List of Contributors
current as of 12/4/05! Have a look at this list of names as these
are the people that make all of these List services possible! I
can't thank each of you enough for your support and great feedback
during this year's Fund Raiser! THANK YOU!
I will be shipping out all of the gifts in the next few weeks and
hope to have everything out by the end of the month. In most cases,
gifts will be shipped via US Postal Service.
Once again, thank you for making this year's List Fund Raiser successful!
Best regards,
Matt Dralle
Email List Administrator
------------------ 2005 List of Contributors ---------------------
Ackerman, John P
Ackland, Andrew
Ackworth, Robert
Adamson, Arden
Akerstrom, Ed
Alberti, David
Alexander, George
Allee, Joseph
Allen, Mark L
Alley, Brian
Allington, Wally
Allsop, Bryan
Alons, Kevin
Al, Rupp
Altenhein, Gary
Anderson, Edward
Anderson, John
Anderson, Ken
Andrews, Ronald
Anliker, Mark
Anthony, Bruce
Anton, Bill
Applefeld, Gerald
Archer, Matt
Ashcraft, Keith
Atkinson, Paul
Austin, Peter
Babb, Tony
Bahrns, Stan
Baker, Mike
Baker, Owen
Baker, Roger
Baker, Victor
Baleshta, Doug
Ballenger, James
Barba, Alberto
Barnes, Thomas
Barrie, Darwin
Barson, Ron
Barter, Tom
Basiliere, Rick
Bass, George
BatchelderJr, Ellery
Bates Jr, Marcus
Bean, Jim
Bean, Robert
Bearden, Jeff
Beauchamp, Norm
Bellach, Robin
Bell, Bruce B
Bell, Jack
Belvin, Thomas
Benjamin, Hal
Benson, Lonn
Benson, Lonnie
Berges, Duncan
Berg, Wayne
Bermudez, John
Berner, Walter
Bernier, Jim
Berry, Bert
Berry, Jim
Bertz, Gary
Berube, Bob
Betz, Judie
Bezzard, Richard
Bickham, John
Bidle, Jerry
Bieberdorf, Roger
Billingsley, Dan
Billington, Chuck
Bish, Dan
Black, Milton
Blackwell, Jimmie
Blackwell, Rodney
Blair, Sean
Blank, Stephen
Boeshaar, David
Boetto, Steve
Bohannon, Larry
Bollaert, Brian
Bonds, Kevin
Boothe, Gary
Booze, Greg
Bope, David
Bordelon, Bruce
Borger, Robert
Boucher, Michel
Boulet, Paul
Bourne, Larry
Bowen, Gordon
Bowen, James
Bowen, Larry
Bowman, Brice
Bowman, John
Boxill, Mike
Boyd, Bill
Boyer, James R
Boyle, Neville
Brame, Charles
Brandt, Leroy
Brasch, Glenn
Breckenridge, Bruce
Bressler, Wes
Bressler, Wesley
Brick, John
Brien, Tim
Briggs, Gary
Brogley, Michael
Brooks, John
Brooks, Kenyon
Brooks, Sterling
Broom, Richard
Brown, Allen
Brown, Bob
Brunke, Judy
Bryan, Mark
Buchanan, Guy
Buchmann, Keith
Buckthal, Robert
Buess, Alfred
Bullett, Charles
Bullock, Jack
Bumhoffer, Al
Burden, Ron
Burke, James
Burkhardt, Michael
Burnaby, John
Burnett, Ron
Burns, Mark
Burrill, Phil
Burrows, Alan
Burton, James
Busch, Rob
Butcher, James
Butcher, Ron
Butler, Francis
Butler, Sherman
Butterfield, John
Buyse, Lieven
Caldwell, Rick
Cannon, Michael
Cannon, Paul
Cann, Tony
Cantrell, Jim
Cantrell, Jimmy
Capen, Ralph
Capra, Sal
Cardell, Bill
Carillon Sr, Paul
Carpenter, Jeffrey
Carpenter, Kenneth
Carriere, James
Carroll, Randy
Carter, David
Carter, Howard
Carter, PaulQ
Carter, Preston
Cary, William
Casson, Perry
Challgren, Stanley
Chambers, Ken
Champion, Robert
Chandler, Rick
Chang, Ted
Chatham, Robert
Checkoway, Dan
Chelvanayagam, Indran
Chenoweth, William
Chevaillier, Mason
Circle, Roger
Clarke, Christopher
Clarke, Paddy
Clark, James
Clark, Michael
Clay, Dennis
Cleaveland Aircraft Tool
Cliff, John
Clifford, Dewayne
Clyma, Frank
Coalwell, Timothy
Cochran, Mark
Cochran, Stewart
Coggins, Mickey
Cole, Gary
Cole, Gerry
Cole, Roger
Colucci, Tony
Combs, Doyle
Combs, Jim
Comfort, Gordon
Compton, Scott
Condrey, Bob
Connell, Joseph
Conrad, Gerald
Constant, Jeremy
Cook, Doug
Cook, Marc
Cooling, John
Cooper, James
Cooper, Marcus
Corbalis, Leo
Corder, Michael
Corner, Jim
Corriveau, Grant
Cottingham, Richard
Cottrell, Larry
Coursey, William
Courtney, James
Coussons, Herb
Cox, John
Cravener, Donald
Crawford, Corey
Creer, Michael
Cribb, William
Crockett, Jim
Crosby, Harry
Crosley, Rich
Cross, Brian
Crothers, Bill
Cruikshank, Bruce
Culver, Ronald
Curtis, William
Dalstrom, Douglas
Dalton, Bob
Daniell, William
Danielsen, HansJ%c3%b8rgen
Daves, Russell
Davidson, Jeff
Davies, Brian
Davis, Barry
Davis, Deems
Davis, Robert
Dawson, Clif
Dawson, Garth
Decker, Daniel
Decramer, Dick
Deford, David
De Jong, Jan
Delaney, Tom
Deloach, Reginald
DelPeso, Jose
Delsol, Mich%c3%a8le
Dennis, Chris
Dewees, Ron
Dewey, Debbie
Dial, Larry
Dickson, Robert
Dieh, Donald
Dietrich, Klaus
Disher, John
Dominy, Kenneth
Donato, John
Dondlinger, Leo
Doran, Thomas
Dorsey, Robert
Doud, Herbert
Dovey, Martin
Doyle, Mike
Draper, Mike
Dresden, Robert
Dufresne, Robert
Duke, Gordon
Dunne, John
Durakovich, David
East, David
Eckenroth, Paul
Edgerton, Wayne
Edwards, Ed
Edwards, Joe
Ehlers, Clyde D
Eli, Robert
Ellenberger, Christopher
Ellenberger, Mike
Elliott, Andrew
Ellis, Dale
Elrod, Michael
Engel, Jerry
Engh, Duncan
England, Charles
Erickson, Alan
Erickson, Gerald
Erickson, Ken
Ervin, Thomas
Evenson, Roger
Fackler, Ken
Fair, Deal
Falik, Donald
Farmer, Daniel
Faulkner, Thomas
F, Dwight
Featherston, Les
Feldman, Herb
Felker, Timothy
Fetterman, Lanny
Fillinger, Fred
Filucci, Michael
Finley, John
Fischer, Douglas
Fischer, John
Fishe, James
Fisher, Richard
Fitzpatrick, Robert
Fix, Douglas
Flamini, Dennis
Flavin, John
Fluent, Grant
Flynn, Harold
Ford, Dean
Ford, John
Ford, Michael
Forrest, Gerald
Forsberg, Erik
Fosse, James M
Fox, Byron
Fox, Stephen
Franz, Carl
Fray, Jerry
Frazier, Ford
French, Edwin
French, James
Fromm, John
Fulgham, Bill
Fullilove, Ken
Fulmer, Joseph
Fussell, Larry
Fux, Franz
Gabbard, Gary
Gallagher, Noel
Gallenbach, Craig
Gantzer, Charles G
Gardner, Albert
Gardner, Terrence
Garland, Doug
Garrou, Douglas
Gates, Leo
Geese, Ronald
Geldermann, Daniel
Genzlinger, Reade
George, Joe
George, Neal
German, Mark
Giacona, William
Gibbons, Robert
Giddens, Gerald
Gillespie, Byron
Gillespie, Rl
Gilliatt, Jim
Glaeser, Dennis
Gleason, Mike
Goff, George
Goguen, Jon
Goguen, Nelson
Golden, Dennis
Goode, Richard
Goodings, John
Goodridge, Stuart
Goolsby, James
Gordon, Keith
Gottelt, Herbert
Gott, Shelby
Goudinoff, Peter
Gower, Gary
Gowing, John
Grabb, Gary
Graham, Jim
Graham Jr, W Doyce
Graichen, Peter
Grajek, Al
Grant, Jordan
Grantz, Alan
Green, Luther
Greenough, Jim
Griffin, Bill
Griffin, Jim
Griffin, Robert
Grigson, Greg
Grimmonpre, Jerry
Groell, Pascal
Groote, Curtis
Grosse, John
Gummo, Thomas
Gustafson, Aaron
Gwin, Rique
Hackler, Douglas
Haertlein, Frank
Hagar, Steve
Hale, Ade
Haley, Gary
Hall, Charles
Hall, Joel
Halvorsen, Lyf
Hamer, Steve
Hamilton, Red
Hamilton, William J
Hand, Christopher
Hankinson, Julian
Hanley, BrettAlan
Hanley, Mark
Hansen, ArnoldKristian
Hansen, Graham
Happ, Paul
Harcourt, David
Haring, Robert
Harmon, John
Harrill, Roy
Harrison, Nigel
Harrod, Peter
Hart, Rob
Hasbrouck, John
Hatch, Fletcher
Hatfield, Cecil
Hatfield, William
Hauck, John
Haverlah, Dennis
Haynes, Joel
Heaton, Herb
Hedrick, Keith
Hefferan, Rex
Hefner, Jim
Hegenauer, Elmar
Hegenauer, Manuela
Heindl, Karl
Hein, Jim
Heller, Martin
Helming, LarryRobert
Henwick, Mark
Heritch, Ian
Herminghaus, John
Herron, Al
Hershberger, Edward
Herzner, Fred
Hetrick, Dale
Heykoop, John
Hibbing, William
Higgins, Floran
Hill, Jeff
Hill, Ken
Hill, Kenneth
Hill, StanleyA
Hinde, Frank
Hodges, Mitchell
Hoffman, Allan
Hoffman, Carl
Holifield, Steve
Holland, James
Holland, Rick
Holliday, Robert
Holyoke, Ed
Honer, Michael
Hooper, Randy
Horne, Gilbert
Horton, Kevin
Howell, Kenneth
Howey, Ralph
Huft, John
Hughes, Robert
Hukill, Chris
Hunter, Robert
Hunt, Malcolm
Hunton, Jim
Hunt, Wallace
Hurd, James
Hurn, JohnAllen
Hurst, Kingsley
Hutchins, Mike
Hyde, Ken
Isler, Jerry
Jacko, Victor W
Jaussi, Curtis
Jensen, Charles
Jensen, Marinus
Jernigan, Carroll
Jessen, John
Johannsson, Johann G
Johansson, Max
John, Kent
Johnsen, Svein
Johnson, David
Johnson, DennisL
Johnson, Forrest
Johnson, Ken
Johnson, Russell
Johnson, William
Johnston, Christopher
Johnston, Dudley
Johnston, Stephen
Jones, David
Jones, Don W
Jones, Eric M
Jones, Kenneth
Joosten, Craig
Jordan, JR
Joyce, David
Jula, TheodoreF
Julian, Raymond
Jung, John
Jurotich, Matthew
Kaluza, Charles
Katra, James
Kaufmann, Robert
Kayner, Dennis
Kearney, John
Keener, Forest
Kelly, Michael
Kemp, Roger
Kenney, Thomas
Kerr, Dennis
Kesterton, Donald
Kilburg, Larry
Killion, Clay
Kimsey, Thomas
King, John
Kinkade, Les
Kinne, Russ
Kinney, Kevin
Kirk, Floyd
Kister, Dale
Klein, Larry
Klingmuller, Lothar
Knievel, Gerald
Knoll, Barrett
Knotts, F Barry
Knott, Vernon
Kohles, Jerry
Koonce, RL
Kramer, Ed
Krueger, Grant
Kruleski, Chet
Kulp, David
Kummer, Gerald
Kuntz, Paul
Kuss, Charles
Kyle, Fergus
Kyle, Larry
Lackwitz, Raymond
Ladd, Pat
Laird, Dave
Lammers, Dave
Lannon, Walter
Lansden, John
Larsen, Gene
Larson, Joseph
Larzilliere, Alain
Lathrop, Jim
Laundy, Mike
Laurie, Kip
Ledbetter, Gene
Lederman, Howard
Ledoux, Paul
Lee, Terrence
Lee, Thomas
Leggette, Edward
Lehman, Ken
Leinberger, Gary
Lekven, Carl
Lendon, Ron
Lenton, Dennis
Lerohl, Gaylen
Levy, Pierre
Lewis, Scott
Lewis, Terry
Lewis, Tim
Ligon, Howard
Lilja, Ken
Lind, David
Lindsay, Robert
Linebaugh, Jeff
Lineberry, Gary
Linse, Mike
Lively, Chad
Lloyd, Brian
Lloyd, Daniel
Loer, Stanley
Logan, Michael
Long, Charles
Long, Eugene
Long, Patrick
Longwell, Anna
Loring, Arthur
Loring Jr, Arthur P
Loubert, Gary
Lovley, Forrest
Lucas, David
Lundin, Richard
Lynch, Charles
Lyscars, Alan
Macdonald, Larry
Macinnes, Bruce
Mackay, Alex
Macon, Mike
Mahurin, Jerry
Mains, Ralph
Malczynski, Francis
Markle, Jim
Marlow, Sam
Marshall, Aaron
Marshall, FR
Martin, Jay
Martin, Mickey
Mason, John
Mason, Marty
Massari, Stephen
Massey, Allen
Masys, Daniel
Matejcek, Glen
Matlack, Dean
Matteson, Lynn
May, George
May, James
Mcallister, Paul
Mcbean, John
Mcbride, Duncan
Mccallister, Don
Mccallum, Robert
Mcchesney, James
Mcconnell, Roger
Mcdaniel, Steve
Mcdonald, Stephen
Mcfarland, Larry
Mcfarlane, Lloyd
Mckeon, Vincent
Mckervey, Joseph
Mckinnon, Greg
Mcmahon, John
Mcnutt, George
Medeiros, Joel
Melenyzer Iv, Cl
Mell, Roger
Merchant, Dean
Merrill, Dj
Messinger, Paul
Meyers, Jess
Meyers, John
Meylor, Dean
Milgrom, Mark
Miller, David
Miller, John
Miller, Michael
Miller, Terrence
Mills, Jack
Mitchell, Paul
Montagne, Ray
Montague, Neita
Montoure, Kenneth
Moore, Dave
Moore, David
Moore, Goff
Moore, Paul
Moore, Tom
Moore, Warren
Moran, Felix
Morawski, Brett
Morehead, Jim
Morley, Hal
MorrisN75up, Dave
Morris, Steven
Morrow, Dan
Mortimore, Terry
Moser, Scott
Mountain, Patrick
Mrotzek, Dan
Mulcahy, Bob
Muldoon Jr, Francis
Muller, Albert
Muller, Mick
Mulwitz, Paul
Munn, Mike
Munro, Robert
Murphy, Walt
Myers, George
Myers, Gerald
Myers, John
Nadeau, Michael
Naumuk, William
Navratil, Mark
Navratil, Richard
Naylor, Doug
Needham, James
Neilsen, Richard
Neitzel, Richard
Nelson, James
Nelson, Larry
Newkirk, Bill
Newsum, James
Nicely, Vince
Nichols, Clem
Niles, Bruce
Nimigon, David
Noyer, Robert
Nuckolls Iii, Robert L
Nutt, James
Obrien, John
Ochs, James
Ockuly, Bernie
Oconnor, Edward
O'Day, Jim
Offill, Danny
O'Hara, Tom
Ohnigian, Steve
Okeefe, Lawrence
Oke, Jim
Oldford, David
Oliver, Bradley
Olsen, Paul
Olson, Bob
Olson, Brad
Olson, Gary
Olson, Tim
Orear, Jeff
Orsborn, Thomas
Overgaard, Allan
Owens, Donald
Packard, Tom
Palamarek, Ted
Pansier, Don
Partyka, LeeM
Paulich, John
Payne, Craig
Pearsall, Don
Peck, Kenneth
Peerenboom, Paul
Pelletier, David
Pellien, James
Peoples, James
Perez, M Domenic
Perkinson, Robert
Perry, Ilan
Perry, Richard
Persels, Lyle
Peterson, Alex
Peterson, David A
Petri, David
Petty, Paul
Pfeifer, Michael
Pfundt, Jan
Phillips, Mark
Phillips, Terrence
Pierce, Roger
Pierce, Tony
Pierson Jr, Edward
Pierzina, Michael
Pike, Richard
Pilling, Kevin
Plecenik, Michael
Pocock, Graham
Point, Jeff
Polits, Richard
Ponzio, John
Porter, Richard
Portouw, Lawrence
Powell, Ken
Prater, Michael
Preston, Doug
Prevost, Guy
Princell, Bill
Pritchard, Jeff
Pritchard, Roger
Puglise, James
Puls, Jeffrey
Quinn, Rollie
Quist, David
Rabbers, Richard
Raby, Ron
Radford, Joe
Rammos, Ricardo
Randolph, George
Ransom, Brad
Rataj, Mark
Ray, Carl
Reel, David
Reese, Craig
Reese, Wayne
Reeves, Dan
Reid, Greg
Reining, Bill
Reining, Jonathan
Reusser, Hans-peter
Reynolds, Richard
Ribb, Dan
Rice, Paul
Richardson, Colin
Richardson, Paul
Richards, Stephen
Rickard, Ian
Rickman, Loy
Ricks, Allen
Rigby, David
Riggs, Lynn
Rigney, Bruce
Risch, Robert
Ritter, Mark T
Roberts, Gary
Roberts, John
Robertson, Bob
Roberts, Rick
Robinette, William
Robson, Peter
Rodebush, James
Rodgers, Paul
Rodriguez, Paul
Rodriguez, Pedro
Roehr, Michael
Ronnau, James
Ross, Christopher
Ross, Jonathan
Rousselle, Kenneth
Rowbotham, Chuck
Rowe, Denny
Rowe, Jay
Rueb, Duane
Ruksnaitis, WilliamF
Russell, Larry
Ryan, Michael
Sa, Carlos
Sagerser, James
Sager, Truman
Saligman, Ira
Sallas, C William
Salter, Phillip
Sanders, Andrew
Sanford, Fred
Sapp, Douglas
Sargeant, Jack
Sargent, Thomas
Savarese, Anthony Dennis
Sax, Sam
Saylor, David
Schemmel, Grant
Schertz, William
Schieber, Cedric
Schieffer, Charles
Schilf, Richard
Schlafly, Fred
Schlatterer, Bill
Schlosser, Kevin
Schmidt, John
Schmitendorf, Bill
Schneider, Benjamin
Schneider, Werner
Schoenberger, Robert
Schott, Jared
Schrader, Kurt
Schreck, Ron
Schrimmer, Mark
Schroeder, Earl
Schroeder, John
Schulke, Thomas
Scott,Jr, Fred W
Scott, Mark
Scroggs, Ross
Seagrave, Scott
Seal, John
Selby,Jr, Jim
Setser, David
Seve, Eddie
Shablow, John
Shafer, James
Shanks, Jim
Shank, William
Shannon, Kevin
Sharp, Michael
Sharp, Ralph
Shaw, Cliff
Shaw, Rex
Shepherd, Dallas
Shepherd, Stanislaus
Sheridan, Roger
Sherry, James
Shiple, Fred
Shipley, RobWM
Shipley, Walt
Shumaker, Jim
Siegfried, Oldbob
Simmons, Kendall
Simpson, Skip
Simutis, Frank J
Sinclair, Michael
Sinke, Jim
Sipp, Richard
Sisson, Phil
Skelly, Brian
Skyring, Kerry
Slatt, Gary
Small, Thomas
Smart, Steven
Smith, Bret
Smith, DannyL
Smith, Gene
Smith, Jeff
Smith, Kirk
Smith, Roland
Smith, Ronal
Smith, Zed
Snedaker, Bob
Snyder, Bruce
Soikkeli, Robert
Solecki, John
Sparks, Timothy
Spaur, Chuck
Specht, Stan
Spencer, Scott
Springer, Gerald
Spudis, Robert
Staal, Stephen
Staley, Dick
Starnes, Robert
Starn, JH "kabong"
Stefan, Leon
Steitle, Mark
Stelwagon, Frank
Stephanak, Bob
Stevenson, Will
Stewart, Michael
Stinemetze, Thomas
St-laurent, Ray
Stone, Christopher
Stone, Jim
Strange, Ted
Stribling, James
Strong, Gary
Sutterfield, Stan
Swaney, Mark
Swankie, Ian
Swartout, John
Swinford, George
Syverson, David
Szantho, John B
Tarmar, Brian
Tasker, Richard
Tatro, John
Tatz, Norm
Tauchen, Bryan
Taupier, John
Teegarden, Vaughn
Testement, John
Tew, Stanley
Textor, Jack
Tezyk, Robert
Thatcher, Scott
Therrien, Michel
Tholen, Tom
Thomas, Bruce
Thomas, Glenn
Thomas, James
Thomas, Lee
Thomason, Mannan
Thomason, Michael
Thomas, Stephen
Thorp, Kevin
Thwing, Randy
Tichy, Robert
Tilford, Stephen
Tillmann, Johan
Timm, Peter
Timoney, James
Tinker, R Rupert
Tomlin, Thomas
Tomm, Bevan
Tompkins, Jeff
Toro, Jose
Tower, John
Trombley, Erich
Trost, Sebastian
Trotter, Paul
Tuck, John
Tupper, Kirby
Turrell, Mike
Turrentine, Donna
Tuton, Bill
Tyler, George
Unruh, Brian
Unternaehrer, Rolf
Upshaw, Roman
Usrey, Reed
Utsey, Randy
Utterback, ThomasE
Vader, Tim
Valovich, Paul
Vandenberg, Daniel
Van Der Voort, Hans
VanDerZouw, Henkjan
Van Eldik, Anthony
Vangrunsven, Stan
VanHeeswijk, J
Van Lanen, David
Van Winkle, Alden
Varnes, William
Vaughan, Cye
Vaughan, Lee
Venables, JohnRoger
Verdev, Victor
Versteeg, Maarten
Vervoort, Jef
Vetterli, Richard
Vinal, Adelbert
Vinroot, Robert
Vogt, Gary
Von Bevern, Brian
Von Doymi, Carl
VonRuden, Dennis
Voss, Richard
Vranken, Karel
Wade, Jim
Wagner Jr, James E
Wagoner, Richard
Waligroski, Gregg
Walker, Robbie
Walker, Tommy
Walker, Valerie
Walker, Weston
Walmsley, Brett
Walrath, Howard
Walsh, Denis
Wambolt, Charles
Ward, Ann
Washburn, Oliver
Watson, Terrence
Weaver, Fred
Webb, Randol
Wehner, Clem
Weiler, Douglas C
Weinstock, Steven
Weisfeld, Hans-peter
Weiss, Richard
Welsch, Philip
Welsh, Don
Werner, Russell
Wetzel, Bob
Whelan, Thomas
White, Bob
White, Charles
Whiteley, Kenneth
White, Phil
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Whittington, Dewitt
Wigney, John
Wilde, Daniel
Williamson, Richard
Williamson, William
Williams, Terry
Willis, Tim
Wilson, James
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Winings, James
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Woboril, David
Wood, Larry
Woods, Donald
Wsiaki, Michael
Wynn, Michael
Yeamans, David
York, Richard
Young, Al
Young, Dan
Young, Dee
Young, Greg
Zakreski, Steve
Zecherle, John
Zelinski, Alan
Zilz, Dave
Zirges, Malcolm
Zollinger, Duane
Zuniga, Oscar
Matt G Dralle | Matronics | PO Box 347 | Livermore | CA | 94551
925-606-1001 V | 925-606-6281 F | dralle@matronics.com Email
http://www.matronics.com/ WWW | Featuring Products For Aircraft
do not archive
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Seat-of-the-Pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Kolbers All,
I must be crazy but I consider an airspeed indicator an essential
device, up there with CHT/EGT or RPM gauge. My ears (and butt) just aren't
that finely tuned to sense decaying airspeed due to wind shear or shift, and
that's when one needs it most. It's a must-have for me. I'm not saying one
can't fly the plane without it (pitch + power = performance and all that),
but it makes it much easier and can save one's bacon on occasion.
Not picking on ya Jack, but some things stuck out:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart@onlyinternet.net>
> I agree with you! I did not intend to imply overuse or the need for
> instruments while flying a 103 vehicle.
I don't think an ASI can be overused. One can always ignore it.
> Good stick and rudder habits should be a given, but why give up
> instruments
> that can help you analyze unusual situations? Why do so many 103 pilots
> roll their vehicles into a ball below the pattern?
Precisely. Probably because they were ignoring the ASI for starters. An
ASI doesn't prevent stall/spin accidents, but it can help avoid them much
more than one's tush IMO.
> I like my vertical air speed indicator the best. It lets me detect ridge
> rotors, and high speed thermal sink early, and on very very hot days tells
> me if I can maintain a healthy climb rate
? I think it's VSI. (grin) I agree the VSI helps on those occasions
and others.
At above normal cruise
> speeds, one can pick up a little more speed by re flexing the flaperons a
> bit. Not important for bumming around, but it helps stretch five gallons
> of fuel on cross countries.
How do you know you're changing a few knots without an ASI?
> Altimeter and air speed indicator could be replaced with the gps and
> throttle position as an in flight speed reference. Typically I like to
> fly
> 2,000 to 3,000 feet above ground level
I suppose one could put notches, magic marker or tape next to the throttle
lever to indicate RPM. And hope a plug doesn't foul, or a cable don't
stretch, or an air leak develop... Seriously, GPS lags much more than an
ASI, and I've seen it be quite inaccurate on some days. The GPS's I've used
don't tell AGL, but MSL when given the local altimeter. The GPS makes a
nice backup, but I wouldn't rely on it for primary info. (Other than where
the he!! on the planet I'm precisely at, of course.) ;
)
> As long as I have to run a two cycle engine, I would find it difficult to
> give up engine instruments.
If you're in an airplane, why not have a couple of airplane instruments
(ASI/altimeter)?
I think the airspeed of my craft is important, and there are times
when I am very interested in its smallest change. Just my opinion, folks.
Ed in JXN
MkII/503
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Prop Clearance |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: John Jung <jrjungjr@yahoo.com>
Michael and Group,
The reason that I wasn't concerned about a prop strike with one inch of
clearance was that the 68" prop on a Firestar was recommended to me by
the designer, Dennis S. Also, I didn't have a prop strike in 4 years
of running that way.
John Jung
Firestar II N6163J
Surprise, AZ
On Dec 5, 2005, at 12:56 AM, Kolb-List Digest Server wrote:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Michael Bigelow"
> <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
>
> Im very suprised how many people are running just one inch of prop
> clearance
> on thier Kolbs. The increased noise is bad enough, but even worse is
> you
> also have a greatly increased chance of a prop strike on the tail boom
> :(
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Seat-of-the-Pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Wayne T. McCullough" <blackbird754@alltel.net>
And just a quick reply to all ,
I was taught...........Airspeed and Altitude are a pilots best friends...
Wayne McCullough
President EAA chapter 330
Kolbra # 004
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: RE: Seat-of-the-Pants
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski"
> <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
>
> Kolbers All,
>
> I must be crazy but I consider an airspeed indicator an essential
> device, up there with CHT/EGT or RPM gauge. My ears (and butt) just
> aren't
> that finely tuned to sense decaying airspeed due to wind shear or shift,
> and
> that's when one needs it most. It's a must-have for me. I'm not saying
> one
> can't fly the plane without it (pitch + power = performance and all that),
> but it makes it much easier and can save one's bacon on occasion.
>
> Not picking on ya Jack, but some things stuck out:
>
>
>> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart@onlyinternet.net>
>
>> I agree with you! I did not intend to imply overuse or the need for
>> instruments while flying a 103 vehicle.
>
> I don't think an ASI can be overused. One can always ignore it.
>
>> Good stick and rudder habits should be a given, but why give up
>> instruments
>> that can help you analyze unusual situations? Why do so many 103 pilots
>> roll their vehicles into a ball below the pattern?
>
> Precisely. Probably because they were ignoring the ASI for starters. An
> ASI doesn't prevent stall/spin accidents, but it can help avoid them much
> more than one's tush IMO.
>
>> I like my vertical air speed indicator the best. It lets me detect ridge
>> rotors, and high speed thermal sink early, and on very very hot days
>> tells
>> me if I can maintain a healthy climb rate
>
> ? I think it's VSI. (grin) I agree the VSI helps on those occasions
> and others.
>
> At above normal cruise
>> speeds, one can pick up a little more speed by re flexing the flaperons a
>> bit. Not important for bumming around, but it helps stretch five gallons
>> of fuel on cross countries.
>
> How do you know you're changing a few knots without an ASI?
>
>> Altimeter and air speed indicator could be replaced with the gps and
>> throttle position as an in flight speed reference. Typically I like to
>> fly
>> 2,000 to 3,000 feet above ground level
>
> I suppose one could put notches, magic marker or tape next to the throttle
> lever to indicate RPM. And hope a plug doesn't foul, or a cable don't
> stretch, or an air leak develop... Seriously, GPS lags much more than an
> ASI, and I've seen it be quite inaccurate on some days. The GPS's I've
> used
> don't tell AGL, but MSL when given the local altimeter. The GPS makes a
> nice backup, but I wouldn't rely on it for primary info. (Other than
> where
> the he!! on the planet I'm precisely at, of course.) ;
> )
>
>> As long as I have to run a two cycle engine, I would find it difficult to
>> give up engine instruments.
>
> If you're in an airplane, why not have a couple of airplane instruments
> (ASI/altimeter)?
>
>
> I think the airspeed of my craft is important, and there are times
> when I am very interested in its smallest change. Just my opinion, folks.
>
> Ed in JXN
> MkII/503
>
>
>
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Seat-of-the-Pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
There are qualifiers as to how many instruments and gadgets you
need. First is personal taste. Some like lots of stuff, we won't
deny your right, although if you stuck every bauble inside from
the latest "pilot shop" flyer the plane would be too heavy to get off
the ground.
second is the type of plane. Some, which I have been fortunate
enough to fly, have tremendous feedback. -airspeed directly
proportional to control force. Some, especially primitive ultralight
designs have little or no feedback. An ASI might come in handy
in one of these. If you have a couple hundred hours in a well designed
airplane you should have a pretty good feel for what's going on.
Third is the pilot and his basic ability. There are a few out there,
even with a lot of time who are lacking seat of the pants senses,
fly pretty much by the numbers on the gages, but still love flying.
-As for me, I'm just beginning to get the feel of my flying loaf of
bread
Kolb. There's hope.
-BB do not archive
Message 6
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jeremy Casey" <n79rt@kilocharlie.us>
Thanks for the tip...got a couple locally to try out.
Jeremy
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Baker [mailto:jlbaker@telepath.com]
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Wire wheel?
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jim Baker" <jlbaker@telepath.com>
> >Is a BRASS wire wheel acceptable for removing old flaky primer
and
> >surface rust from 4130 aircraft tubing?
> >
> >Enquiring minds want to know...
Got something better for ya...do a search for 3M surface conditioning
discs.....come in several different grades and there are other 3M
Roloc items that are very nice to work with when cleaning/prepping
surfaces.....
http://search.store.yahoo.com/cgi-
bin/nsearch?query=roloc&first=20&only=0&categ=all&catalog=levine
auto
or if you don't want to cut/paste...
http://tinyurl.com/9jl5v
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
'71 SV, 492TC
Elmore City, OK
Message 7
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jeremy Casey" <n79rt@kilocharlie.us>
Thanks...
Jeremy
<snip>
Jeremy,
Check FAA pub AC 43.13 for acceptable practices. It is available online,
although I don't have the address at this time. You can download the
whole
pub in .pdf format.
A brass wheel would work provided you go easy with it and don't dwell on
one
spot for too long at a time. The preferred method is always the least
destructive first. I prefer chemical stripping if possible, then plastic
media bead blasting, and abrasive last. Hope this helps.
Guy Morgan
Galveston, TX Firefly
From: "Jeremy Casey" <n79rt@kilocharlie.us>
Subject: Kolb-List: Wire wheel?
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jeremy Casey" <n79rt@kilocharlie.us>
Is a BRASS wire wheel acceptable for removing old flaky primer and
surface rust from 4130 aircraft tubing?
Enquiring minds want to know...
Jeremy Casey
Kilocharlie Drafting, Inc.
www.kilocharlie.us
Message 8
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Judy or Larry Gitt" <gittj@earthlink.net>
Hay, guys I'm not nocking the trailer and if you can do it your self that
great , I had other U/L the wings fold up , and cost me trying to do it by my
self , I well take a exter hand from now on . I'm lucky i share a hanger were
i don't have that problem . And it always nice to have your own strip and
hanger . Kolbra Larry
Message 9
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "JIM HEFNER" <hefner_jim@msn.com>
Since I use my trailer as my hangar, it is nice having a large trailer.... 27'
x 8.5' on the floor inside. The trailer is parked at the airport most of the
year, snuggled nose first into the T part of the hangar on the end.... no problem
with microbursts parked there! I roll the plane out and 10-12 minutes later
I'm taxiing.... I did it in 8 minutes once just to see how fast I could do
it. Most of the GA guys take quite a bit longer than that for preflight. The
Firefly is light enough that I can easily pull it up the ramps tail first.
I pay $12.50 a year to park the trailer at the airport.... my kind of hangar fees!!
I even have electric hooked up to the trailer from the adjacent hangar
via extension cord.... nice to have lights and power to charge batteries, radio,
etc when I stay overnight. My trailer is big enough to hold all my gear, fuel
and I can get a cot in there, even with the plane in the trailer. For hauling
the plane, it works well but can be a problem on really windy days... I often
haul it at night when winds are light. It weighs 2200#, which is pretty
light for a trailer of that size. The tandem axles are great for smooth hauling.
I've thought about buying or building a smaller lightweight trailer for when
I pull the plane on trips, but decided I didn't need one more trailer sitting
around most of the time. This one is a good compromise for using as a hangar
and for hauling on trips.
To get a Mark III in there would require a winch for sure. AZ Dave has a winch
for his and it sits really low compared to my trailer. Lots of difference in
weight of a Firefly and a Mark III!! Having to use a winch would take a lot
longer and would make using the trailer as a hangar a lot more painful! I'm very
happy with my setup. I pulled the trailer/plane 1750 miles and flew some
incredible places, including Monument Valley, in May. Hope to do more of that
in the future!
Jim Hefner
Tucson, AZ
Firefly #022 219 hrs 1" prop clearance on the 66" IVO 2 blade...
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com<mailto:biglar@gogittum.com?subjectRe: Hanger&replyto200512042004.jB4K4wTj006642@mail.matronics.com>>
I think it depends a lot on your situation. I agree with you, and with Ray,
Vince and Richard. Squeezing Vamoose into that tiny trailer of mine works,
but it's an exercise in strain and frustration.........and the thing hasn't
even flown yet. Arizona Dave has his down to a science and zips his Mk III
right in there, tho' his trailer is a *little* larger. I haven't seen this
for myself, but my thought is that Jim Hefner has the right idea. His
trailer is huge, and that little FireFly must be a breeze to load and
unload. (wanna swap trailers, Jim ??) :-) I thought I was saving a few
bucks on the trailer I bought for Vamoose - and I did - but it was false
economy. Wish now that I'd waited, spent more money, (if necessary) and
gotten a bigger trailer. Wiser Lar.
Message 10
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
I just read the Jan. issue of Kitplanes and caught a couple of blips about
the "New Laser". Several quotes by Donnie S. about it and Bruces plans to
have it ready for Oshkosh 06. This one really stirred my interest. Cant wait
to see it.
Also...it made me wonder about the Kolb website and if they are properly
promoting their project there. I thought ..well I better go and see, and if
they are not I oughtta tell em all they should try and tell the world all
about the Laser II way before they get one ready that way there is a certain
"pent-up demand" waiting production. I thought I would even rub em a little
about the RV 12 pages at Vans website to spur em along.
Pretty obvious after visitibng the New KOlb website just now......they need
NO advice from me!
Already did all that stuff and much more!!!!!
Wonderful Site Izek.....
Although I still think a ELSA would sell awful well for us that wont be able
to spend the bucks for a RTF airplane....and would enjoy building our own!
IN fact, I still like the IDea of a Tube and fabric fuse, and a typical Kolb
wing....maybe a slightly different airfoil for the higher speed
envelope...alot like the first version of the Laser.....Since I have already
built airplanes in this fashion...nothing about the construction would
intimidate me....or any other Past Kolb builder.
Course....what do I know......could be all wrong about all this !!!
Don Gherardini
FireFly 098
http://www.geocities.com/dagger369th/my_firefly.htm
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 11
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| Subject: | Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: ray anderson <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
May I respectfully say that 'seat of the pants' flying is a myth or an old wives
tale. Don't believe it for one minute. The graveyards are full of 'seat of
the pants' pilots who depended on that, going all the way back to the Wright
Brothers. An airspeed indicator is the first instrument needed for long time
survival, whether its in a Weedhopper or a Boeing 747.
I learned to fly in 1935 in a Curtiss Wright Jr. with only an oil pressure gage,
and most important of all, a vane type air speed mounted out on a wing strut.
(and an Esso road map courtesy of my friendly filling station). That is about
as close to seat of the pants as I want to get. No compass, no altimeter
or anything else, but no one, no one would have tried to fly without the basic
airspeed indicator, even though it was the primitive vane type. It still holds
true, 'there are old pilots and there are bold pilots'. The old pilots always
had an airspeed indicator ..... and kept an eye on it.
Just an old pilot's personal opinion. (almost 88)
Ray A.
Kolb UltraStar, Tenn.
DO NOT ARCHIVE
---------------------------------
Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet.
Message 12
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
only one flight instrument in my airplane it'd be an altimeter.>>
Hi Lucien,
thats interesting. The one instrument I would do without is
the altimeter.
The only time you might need the alt. is when landing and you should be able
to judge the height accurately below about 800ft above ground.
Of course if you need an altitude to comply with Air traffic control thats
different but in and out of fields, farm strips etc. no problem.
Pat
do not archive
--
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Seat-of-the-Pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
..Airspeed and Altitude are a pilots best friends...>>
No argument there Wayne, but that refers to the `real` thing not the
intrument.
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
--
Message 14
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| Subject: | Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "lucien stavenhagen" <lstavenhagen@hotmail.com>
>From: ray anderson <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: kolb-list@matronics.com
>To: kolb-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kolb-List: Seat of the pants
>Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 07:43:01 -0800 (PST)
>
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: ray anderson <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
>
>May I respectfully say that 'seat of the pants' flying is a myth or an
>old wives tale. Don't believe it for one minute. The graveyards are full
>of 'seat of the pants' pilots who depended on that, going all the way
>back to the Wright Brothers. An airspeed indicator is the first instrument
>needed for long time survival, whether its in a Weedhopper or a Boeing 747.
>
Again, with all due respect and not meaning to be argumentative, this is
just simply not true. The pilots who can fly the _airplane first_ (and the
instruments second) have the longest, least expensive careers.
As any pilot with even a moderate amount of time knows, learning to fly by
AOA first and airspeed second is life to the pilot, particularly in light
aircraft.
I know of NO pilots that have died due to good seat-of-the-pants flying
abilities, but I do know of some that have died due to failed instruments
(and poor stick-rudder skills).
> I learned to fly in 1935 in a Curtiss Wright Jr. with only an oil
>pressure gage, and most important of all, a vane type air speed mounted
>out on a wing strut. (and an Esso road map courtesy of my friendly filling
>station). That is about as close to seat of the pants as I want to get. No
>compass, no altimeter or anything else, but no one, no one would have tried
>to fly without the basic airspeed indicator, even though it was the
>primitive vane type. It still holds true, 'there are old pilots and there
>are bold pilots'. The old pilots always had an airspeed indicator ..... and
>kept an eye on it.
>
Again I make my comments with all due respect to you and the list - it is
only my opinion. In my personal experience, I've transitioned to several
different light aircraft types in my flying career and in all cases, good
basic command of the stick and rudder (and control bar when I flew trikes)
saved my bacon more times than I can count and in virtually all cases
without reference to an ASI at all. 2 of my planes had no functioning
airspeed indicators on them at all, yet I never so much as bent metal due to
poor AOA or energy management.
This is not to say that ASI's are worthless or anything like that - for
example, an ASI is critical for telling you you've exceeded maneuvering
speed or flap-extended speed, and so on. I'm only saying that, in light day
VFR airplanes, it shouldn't _ever_ be absolutely essential for flight. Nice
to have yes, but absolutely required, no....
Again, JMHO,
LS
N646F
> Just an old pilot's personal opinion. (almost 88)
> Ray A.
>
> Kolb UltraStar, Tenn.
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
>---------------------------------
> Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet.
>
>
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
OK Ray, I retract seat of the pants and substitute "elbow torque".
-however, I have been subjected to several minutes of "fill the pants"
flying in my lifetime. :)
-BB do not archive
On 5, Dec 2005, at 10:43 AM, ray anderson wrote:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: ray anderson <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
>
> May I respectfully say that 'seat of the pants' flying is a myth or
> an old wives tale. Don't believe it for one minute. The graveyards
> are full of 'seat of the pants' pilots who depended on that, going
> all the way back to the Wright Brothers. An airspeed indicator is the
> first instrument needed for long time survival, whether its in a
> Weedhopper or a Boeing 747.
>
> I learned to fly in 1935 in a Curtiss Wright Jr. with only an oil
> pressure gage, and most important of all, a vane type air speed
> mounted out on a wing strut. (and an Esso road map courtesy of my
> friendly filling station). That is about as close to seat of the pants
> as I want to get. No compass, no altimeter or anything else, but no
> one, no one would have tried to fly without the basic airspeed
> indicator, even though it was the primitive vane type. It still holds
> true, 'there are old pilots and there are bold pilots'. The old pilots
> always had an airspeed indicator ..... and kept an eye on it.
>
> Just an old pilot's personal opinion. (almost 88)
> Ray A.
>
> Kolb UltraStar, Tenn.
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet.
>
>
Message 16
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| Subject: | kolb airport, safty |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "b young" <by0ung@brigham.net>
Ultralite are aloud to fly here they will no longer insure
the airport. It is a big mess, they are going to have a hearing on the 8th
of this month. All ultralites should have at least a handheld radio and
follow the rules set be the FAA around airports.
---------------------------------------------
remind those in charge that unless it is a controlled airport that the use
of a radio is not required.... it is a very good idea but not a
requirement..... also you should observe some of the other operations at the
airport and document some of the others that do not follow the
guidelines..... example... an ex military plane.... t33 jet.... at my field,
while others are in the pattern comes on the radio and announces " t33 jet
( cant remember the manufacture or tail number ) is on a 15 mile straight in
final, everybody get out of my way" it seems to me that he did not want to
burn the extra fuel necessary to go around and join the pattern properly....
some how he seemed to think he owned the place because he burned more
gal/hour than the rest of us.... now the odd part is that the city airport
director was real happy to have him around because of the uniqueness of the
aircraft... also that he could justify the need for a longer runway because
of the needs of the faster aircraft.... when this event happened I had just
turned final.... and because he would routinely make a high speed pass at
250 ( plus) I just got as far away as possible as I was not wanting a
push.... it seems to me that a "ul" is not a safety problem..... it is the
level of education and willingness of the pilot to use the education
properly that makes an airport safe, not the type of plane flown.... now it
seems that many of the ul pilots do not have the level of training as do
private pilots.... but the issue should be " if you will get some training
so you can join the rest of us safely, you can use the airport, if not you
should stay away until you get some training." and this should include t33
jet drivers as well........
if you would like to use any of this during the hearing please feel free to
do so.
boyd young
brigham city utah.
do archive
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Don Gherardini" <donghe@one-eleven.net>
I have been watching this thread on insturments and reminising about the old
days...(late 70s and early 80's) and my early experiences with weedhoppers.
I was John Chotias 1st dealer on the east side of the mississippi for
weedhoppers...Fresh outta college and gonna make a fortune selling
weedhopper to midwest farmers!!!!hehe....well.....anyway, I remember well
that the only insturment we had was a Halls ASI clamped to a strut....dont
know if it even qualified as a "Insturment"...but I sure would not have
flown with out it , And I NEVER recommended that anyone I sold a Hopper to
that they should attempt to fly with out it either...
ALso I can hear my First flight instructor back at SPARTAN, when I was first
learning to fly those 150s....."Keep you airspeed"....."watch your speed".
I still hear his voice today as I am on final in any airplane I am flying...
and of course we all know we are required to know the V speeds of any
certificated bird we fly...
Now I ask....How we gonna know these things without a ASI?
Don Gherardini
FireFly 098
http://www.geocities.com/dagger369th/my_firefly.htm
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: R laird - Kolb owner? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "lucien stavenhagen" <lstavenhagen@hotmail.com>
Hey Robert,
Oh yeah, ok, it's all coming back to me now.... I remember we corresponded a
bit a while back, back during my trike days I believe....
Anyway, let me know when you're coming up this way and I'll try to make it
out there and shake your hand...
I love my FS II (though it's not a high wind/turbulence airplane really),
enough that I'm giving serious consideration to another Kolb when/if I do go
ahead and upgrade to a larger plane. The MKIII xtra is what I have my eyes
on these days, though that's still a few years away I think...
LS
N646F
do not archive
>Lucien --
>
>Well, I guess we belong to a mutual admiration society. At one point
>I owned a trike and I followed your exploits in your trike and we
>probably even exchanged a few messages over the last several years.
>
>I got a Kolb MkIIIC w/ 912S... brought it home last weekend, but
>haven't gotten it out of the trailer yet (too busy at work and home).
>
>There are two good reasons I bought the Kolb... first and foremost was
>that the wings fold, and I want to be about to take it on vacations
>with me (like Monument Valley <g>). But the other reasons are all
>mixed together: the design, the strength, the speed, the lightness of
>controls, the performance on landing/takeoff, etc.... and a very close
>3rd place reason is this list, which is without a doubt the best
>UL/LSA/Experimental aircraft list on the planet!
>
>I'm headed out to the airport right now to get it out of the trailer
>and, if the weather holds, to do a few laps around the pattern.
>
>Yes, I've been to Lockhart a few times... always asked around for you
>but always seemed to miss you. I'll make it up there again pretty
>soon...
>
> -- Robert
>
>do not archive
>
>
>On 12/3/05, lucien stavenhagen <lstavenhagen@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "lucien stavenhagen"
><lstavenhagen@hotmail.com>
> >
> > Hey Robert,
> >
> > I thought I recognized your name - I used to read TX flyer at least once
>a
> > week to recount your trips (I say used to, I've backed down to about
>once a
> > month lately hah)...
> > But I see that now you're a Kolb owner. What Kolb do you have now and
>why
> > did you choose one?
> >
> > Well I'm a Kolb owner now too, so I probably already know the answer to
>that
> > heh... I recently bought a FS II from a gentleman down in Victoria, TX.
>It
> > was so well built and taken care of I wrote him a check on the spot
>about
> > the time he got the wings unfolded and I was sitting in it ;).
> >
> > Anyway, you should fly up to Lockhart where I'm hangared (50R, I think
> > you've flown in there before) so I can shake your hand and look at your
> > Kolb....
> >
> > Apologies to the list, just wanted to say hi to a new fellow
> > lister/Kolber....
> >
> > LS
> > N646F
> >
> > Do Not Archive
>
>
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
One glaring exception to no gauges: please include rotor tach
for autorotation, at least until you get comfy with perceived angle
and main rotor/transmission noise.
-BB do not archive
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "JIM HEFNER" <hefner_jim@msn.com>
Ray, I agree with you. I can fly comfortably without any instrument but ASI.
I flew once when I forgot to remove the red flag and had no problem landing,
but for safety sake I wouldn't make that a habit. I generally land at idle with
with full flaps, so I'm flirting around stall speed and wouldn't do that if
I didn't have an ASI instrument to look at.... I could land with partial power
or no flaps with more speed without it, but I like having the plane done flying
when it touches down and it's good practice for engine out landings. The
VSI is the 2nd most useful instrument and the altimeter is the least used instrument
for the kind of flying I do.
Jim Hefner
Tucson, AZ
Firefly #022 219hrs
Message 21
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "lucien stavenhagen" <lstavenhagen@hotmail.com>
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
>
>only one flight instrument in my airplane it'd be an altimeter.>>
>
>Hi Lucien,
> thats interesting. The one instrument I would do without
>is
>the altimeter.
>The only time you might need the alt. is when landing and you should be
>able
>to judge the height accurately below about 800ft above ground.
>
>Of course if you need an altitude to comply with Air traffic control thats
>different but in and out of fields, farm strips etc. no problem.
>Pat
>
>do not archive
Yeah, it's mainly a watch-out-for-the-other-planes thing for me. I fly out
of a GA airport, so being able to report my altitude accurately is a real
help. Also, when I fly at higher altitudes, I like to avoid the typical VFR
cruise altitudes by a few hundred feet so I don't run into (so to speak) any
of the faster GA planes zipping along there.
It also serves as my poor-man's VSI.....
LS
N646F
do not archive
>
>--
>
>
Message 22
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Juan Puerto/Aeroservei" <aerotecnik@terra.es>
Hi Kolbers,
ASIs are useful for navigation but for aircraft performance and stall
avoidance it is posible to use only a yaw string. You can SEE angle of
attack with it and this is all you need.
Of course, engine instruments are definitely a good thing.
-Juan Puerto
EC-ZCU
Spain
Do not archive
Message 23
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: DCulver701@aol.com
Hi Jim, that is a nice write-up on trailer usage! Who is the
manufacturer, and how much did it cost? Saw most of the pictures posted on Monument
valley, what a gorgeous place. The pictures from the air are fantastic, compared
to ground shots. Hopefully i will make it there someday. Best regards,
Dave Culver
Message 24
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "JIM HEFNER" <hefner_jim@msn.com>
--> Kolb-List message posted by: DCulver701@aol.com<mailto:DCulver701@aol.com?subjectRe: Re: Hangar&replyto200512052131.jB5LVYKf009288@mail.matronics.com>
Hi Jim, that is a nice write-up on trailer usage! Who is the
manufacturer, and how much did it cost? Saw most of the pictures posted on Monument
valley, what a gorgeous place. The pictures from the air are fantastic, compared
to ground shots. Hopefully i will make it there someday. Best regards,
Dave Culver
------------------------------------
Hi Dave, the trailer was custom built. It's built mostly from 1" square steel
tubing. The floor is 1/2" plywood to keep the weight down, so it gives a little
when you walk on it but it's plenty stong. The original owner said he paid
$4500 to have it custom built. He had it around 8-10 years and had just put
new tires on it when I bought it from him. I pulled it from Tucson up to Seattle,
to Arlington airport, where I purchased the Firefly and hauled it home in
it. At that time I was pulling it with a Ford Explorer. Now I have a 5.4L V8
Expedition, which is much better suited for pulling it. It has a side entry
door on the right side near the front. Ramps store in racks underneath behind
the wheels. Contact me off-list if you want more info, pic's, etc.
Jim
Message 25
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Wayne T. McCullough" <blackbird754@alltel.net>
Reply to ray,
I love all of you "OLD" pilots......LOL.......and for sharing all of this
information.........I was taught by an 89 year old......12 years ago...do
the math.........I really enjoy hearing all the experiences and stories....
1st flight (as 3rd seater of course)................Gulfstream G
4.......then the following, (let me say , boy are their differences in
flying)
Quicksilver MX
Powered parachute
Challenger
1983 Tierra 2 (converted to single seat)
Aircommand gyro
Robinson R-22
Many single engines in between....
Recently.......blackhawk simulator (wow ...John Hauck....did you really
fly a BUBBLE? ) Instructor ...LOL
Wayne
President EAA 330 and Kolbra 004......
Larry Gitt and John Williamson, and Paul Petty, and Mark German....I'm
coming.....hold on...LOL
----- Original Message -----
From: "ray anderson" <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: Seat of the pants
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: ray anderson <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
>
> May I respectfully say that 'seat of the pants' flying is a myth or an
> old wives tale. Don't believe it for one minute. The graveyards are full
> of 'seat of the pants' pilots who depended on that, going all the way
> back to the Wright Brothers. An airspeed indicator is the first
> instrument needed for long time survival, whether its in a Weedhopper or a
> Boeing 747.
>
> I learned to fly in 1935 in a Curtiss Wright Jr. with only an oil
> pressure gage, and most important of all, a vane type air speed mounted
> out on a wing strut. (and an Esso road map courtesy of my friendly filling
> station). That is about as close to seat of the pants as I want to get. No
> compass, no altimeter or anything else, but no one, no one would have
> tried to fly without the basic airspeed indicator, even though it was the
> primitive vane type. It still holds true, 'there are old pilots and there
> are bold pilots'. The old pilots always had an airspeed indicator .....
> and kept an eye on it.
>
> Just an old pilot's personal opinion. (almost 88)
> Ray A.
>
> Kolb UltraStar, Tenn.
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet.
>
>
>
Message 26
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| Subject: | Re: Prop Clearance |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Hi Michael B/Gang:
Thought I would respond to your post:
| Im very suprised how many people are running just one inch of prop
clearance
| on thier Kolbs. The increased noise is bad enough, but even worse
is you
| also have a greatly increased chance of a prop strike on the tail
boom :(
I have 3/4" clearance between prop tip and tail boom. If there was a
chance of of blade strike, I would increase the clearance.
| The engines are mounted in rubber mounts which flex, and metal and
aluminum
| also flex given enough force... With a hard landing, or getting
into
| aircraft wake or severe turbulance ( it happens ) could easily
reduce that
| one inch to a negative number !
Don't think so!!! Take a close look at the Lord Mounts we use for
engine mounts. Where do you get your info?
| When you take the center of thrust on the Kolb and compare it to the
center
| of gravity and drag, another inch or two is just not that big a
precentage
| change and should not make much of a difference in the flying
qualities.
But it does make a lot of difference.
| I would not build my MK III with less than 3 inches clearance, and 6
would be
| better... Im suprised we are not hearing about more boom strikes
here.
If there was a problem, we would be hearing of blade strikes on the
tail boom. However, I don't personally know of anyone who has
experienced this.
I think you will be very unhappy with that much clearance. I believe
you might find you get much better performance and handling with a
minimum prop tip clearance to the boom tube.
Probably be a good idea to qualify these types of comments so the new
comer will know from whence they come!!!
john h
MKIII - 2,444.0 hours
912S - 1,098.1 hours
Ultrastar, 1984, and a Firestar, 1987
hauck's holler, alabama
|
Message 27
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| Subject: | Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph" <ul15rhb@juno.com>
A few years back, I test flew a new Firestar for a friend. First thing I noticed
in flight was the ASI not working. I continued the flight as normal because
I was used to flying my own without being glued to the airspeed indicator. I had
several onlookers that day and once on the ground, the first thing I said to
the owner was, "the ASI didn't work". There was a GA pilot that looked at me
as though I was a little nuts flying around without it.
Ralph
Original Firestar
19 years flying it
-- "lucien stavenhagen" <lstavenhagen@hotmail.com> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "lucien stavenhagen" <lstavenhagen@hotmail.com>
>From: ray anderson <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
>Reply-To: kolb-list@matronics.com
>To: kolb-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kolb-List: Seat of the pants
>Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 07:43:01 -0800 (PST)
>
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: ray anderson <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
>
>May I respectfully say that 'seat of the pants' flying is a myth or an
>old wives tale. Don't believe it for one minute. The graveyards are full
>of 'seat of the pants' pilots who depended on that, going all the way
>back to the Wright Brothers. An airspeed indicator is the first instrument
>needed for long time survival, whether its in a Weedhopper or a Boeing 747.
>
Again, with all due respect and not meaning to be argumentative, this is
just simply not true. The pilots who can fly the _airplane first_ (and the
instruments second) have the longest, least expensive careers.
As any pilot with even a moderate amount of time knows, learning to fly by
AOA first and airspeed second is life to the pilot, particularly in light
aircraft.
I know of NO pilots that have died due to good seat-of-the-pants flying
abilities, but I do know of some that have died due to failed instruments
(and poor stick-rudder skills).
> I learned to fly in 1935 in a Curtiss Wright Jr. with only an oil
>pressure gage, and most important of all, a vane type air speed mounted
>out on a wing strut. (and an Esso road map courtesy of my friendly filling
>station). That is about as close to seat of the pants as I want to get. No
>compass, no altimeter or anything else, but no one, no one would have tried
>to fly without the basic airspeed indicator, even though it was the
>primitive vane type. It still holds true, 'there are old pilots and there
>are bold pilots'. The old pilots always had an airspeed indicator ..... and
>kept an eye on it.
>
Again I make my comments with all due respect to you and the list - it is
only my opinion. In my personal experience, I've transitioned to several
different light aircraft types in my flying career and in all cases, good
basic command of the stick and rudder (and control bar when I flew trikes)
saved my bacon more times than I can count and in virtually all cases
without reference to an ASI at all. 2 of my planes had no functioning
airspeed indicators on them at all, yet I never so much as bent metal due to
poor AOA or energy management.
This is not to say that ASI's are worthless or anything like that - for
example, an ASI is critical for telling you you've exceeded maneuvering
speed or flap-extended speed, and so on. I'm only saying that, in light day
VFR airplanes, it shouldn't _ever_ be absolutely essential for flight. Nice
to have yes, but absolutely required, no....
Again, JMHO,
LS
N646F
> Just an old pilot's personal opinion. (almost 88)
> Ray A.
>
> Kolb UltraStar, Tenn.
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
>---------------------------------
> Single? There's someone we'd like you to meet.
>
>
Try Juno Platinum for Free! Then, only $9.95/month!
Visit http://www.juno.com/value to sign up today!
Message 28
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Flying without instruments??? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
my
| airplane it'd be an altimeter. Altitude is the hardest to judge
without a
| gauge. The rest should only be nice to have in a light aircraft,
and
| _never_ essential for flight....
|
| JMHO,
|
| LS
| N646F
Hi LS/Gang:
Reckon I'll have to disagree with this one too. ;-)
Personally, I can see the ground a hell'uva lot easier than I can see
stall speed. Stall speed is much more important than knowing how high
I am, in my own humble opinion.
Even is an air speed indicator is not calibrated accurately, it will
always indicate the same stall speed, no matter what altitude.
From my poor memory, most Kolb fatal accidents are the result of
stalls low to the ground. Folks forget to cross check their airspeed
indicators, or they rely on their "instincts" to keep them above stall
speed. Very, very difficult to determine accurate airspeed by the
seat of the pants, especially when turning down wind at very low
altitudes.
john h
MKIII/912S
hauck's holler, alabama
Message 29
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| Subject: | You know that you live in 2005 when... |
0.22 FROM_HAS_ULINE_NUMS From": contains.an.underline.and.numbers/letters@roxy.matronics.com
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Mitty <benny_bee_01@yahoo.com>
YOU KNOW YOU ARE LIVING IN 2005 when...
1. You accidentally enter your password on the
microwave.
2. You haven't played solitaire with real cards in
years.
3. You have a list of 15 phone numbers to reach your
family of 3.
4. You e-mail the person who works at the desk next
to you.
5. Your reason for not staying in touch with friends
and family is that they don't have e-mail addresses.
6. You pull up in your own driveway and use your cell
phone to see if anyone is home to help you carry in
the groceries.
7. Every commercial on television has a web site at
the bottom of the screen.
8. Leaving the house without your cell phone, which
you didn't have the first 20 or 30 (or 60) years of
your life, is now a cause for panic and you turn
around to go and get it.
10. You get up in the morning and go on line before
getting your coffee.
11. You start tilting your head sideways to smile. :
)
12. You're reading this and nodding and laughing.
13. Even worse, you know exactly to whom you are
going to forward this message.
14. You are too busy to notice there was no #9 on this
list.
15. You actually scrolled back up to check that there
wasn't a #9 on this list.
AND NOW U R LAUGHING at yourself.
Go on, forward this to your friends you know you want
to!
Have a good holidays,everyone!
http://home.earthlink.net/~mr_d/index.html
Just $16.99/mo. or less.
dsl.yahoo.com
Message 30
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|
| Subject: | Re: RE: Seat-of-the-Pants/No Instruments??? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
| ASI, and I've seen it be quite inaccurate on some days.
| > As long as I have to run a two cycle engine, I would find it
difficult to
| > give up engine instruments.
| I think the airspeed of my craft is important, and there are
times
| when I am very interested in its smallest change. Just my opinion,
folks.
|
| Ed in JXN
| MkII/503
Hi Ed/Gang:
Good post.
GPS is fine for informing me of how fast I am moving over the ground,
but has nothing to do with air speed. Air speed is important to me to
keep me flying. Yep, I can fly an airplane and a helicopter (well,
last time I was flying helicopters) with the instrument panel blanked
out, but that was part of training, not something to do at all times.
I can fly without an engine and engine instruments, Jack H, but I need
that air speed indicator to keep me honest, especially when
maneuvering near the ground.
I agree with Ed 100% on the airspeed indicator being the most
important instrument in my Kolb.
john h
Message 31
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|
--> Kolb-List message posted by: russ kinne <kinnepix@earthlink.net>
List
Lots of recent talk about how UL and other lightplane pilots get dumped
on by the GA bunch and sometime FBO's & airports managers too.
Unfortunately it's always happened and always will.
And I used to spend a little time with ATP's, heard them complain about
"bugsmashers" -- any aircraft twin-Otter size or smaller! When I could
I always asked what they started to train in, as zero-time pilots.
Usually the same planes they were bitching about now.
Point is, Big Egos abound, and when you fly the smallest and simplest
aircraft, you may be scorned by everyone whose ego is inflated or who
flies anything bigger than your craft. Got to accept that it will
happen.
But also you MUST be sure you know all the rules, and don't bend any
of them. Nor get in anyone's way if you can avoid it. And to be honest,
there are some Big Egos in the UL and even Kolb group too. But we've
all got to get along together if we're to be allowed to fly at all.
My personal approach is "if there's a conflict in the air, he wins" --
and we can sort it out on the ground later. And I confess I have, on a
couple rare occasions, reported a dangerously aggressive pilot (once an
instructor!) to the Feds. Didn't like to but felt it was necessary for
all our safety.
We have more flying freedom than any other country in the world, and
I'd hate to see us lose any of it. The fewer confrontations, accidents,
incidents, we have, the better off we all are. Let's all try to fly
safely and be friendly. And obey the bloody rules, even when we think
(know?) they're stupid. Got to obey them anyway. We can work to have
them changed, but it's a slow process.
do not archive
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants/No Flight Instruments??? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
|
| Don Gherardini
Hi Don G/Gang:
Reckon you gotta be "good" like some on the List. hehehe
I just finished a five day flight to Texas, down the beach from Port
Authur to the Rio Grande, up the river to Sonara, TX, with some border
crossing thrown in there to say I've been to Mexico. Haven't totalled
my time or distance flown, but flew everyday since I left home last
Thursday. Flew in all kinds of winds. Glad I had an ASI to keep me
out of trouble on most of the landings. Made it from west of Houston,
TX, to Gantt International Airport, Alabama, in a day, from 0830 until
1645 today. Got home 7 minutes after sundown. Phew!!! Couldn't have
done it, or would not have done it without the GPS. Cutting it too
close to dark. After dark I have to land 25 road miles away at
Wetumpka Airport, then hitch a ride home.
Take care,
john h
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 33
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Hi Dave C/Gang:
Jim H's trailer is HQs for Monument Valley, and was Base Ops for the
gang that flew up to Moab, Utah, after MV. We spent three days on the
tarmac at Moab. Jim's trailer and transportation were invaluable
during that stay.
Thanks again, Jim H!!!
john h
MKIII/912ULS
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: You know that you live in 2005 when... |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
|
| 1. You accidentally enter your password on the
| microwave.
Hi Gang:
Come on now. This one went into the archives.
Do you all want this type info on the Kolb Aircraft Builders List?
Thanks,
john h
MKIII/912ULS
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants/No Flight Instruments??? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Port
|
| john h
Hi All:
I'm wore out and should not be responding to the Kolb List, but felt I
needed to support my beliefs and experiences for some recent posts
while I was away.
I also forgot to mention my good friends that allowed me to join them
in their flight around a lot of the State of Texas:
John W, Kolbra
Gary H, MKIII (an old one like mine, ;-)
And...........Ken K, Titan Tornado, 912ULS
I might add all four aircraft were powered by the 912ULS.
We low leveled the entire beach and Rio Grand, except for a few short
moments when we needed to give way to people and vehicles on the
beach. What a fantastic trip. Good to be home, but good memories to
keep forever.
john h
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 36
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Flying without instruments??? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Hi John/All,
I agree. I agree with the other statements about not 'absolutely'
needing an ASI. The airplane doesn't know it's there, and will fly. But
the pilot needs it on several occasions, even day VFR, so it's a must-have
IMO.
It also occurred to me how much different ops (and 'feel') are in
higher elevations and higher density altitude. I was amazed the first time
I took a Cessna 421 twin into Albuquerque one July day many years ago. I'd
slowed down to normal pattern speed of 120 kts, 100 over the fence, yet the
visible groundspeed and sight picture told me we were near cruise. Had to
really trust the ASI on that one. The simple 'pitch + power' protocol
would've had us in the weeds before the threshold.
I know it's not a Kolb, but the correlation still works for C-150s,
ULs, etc. We routinely crash RC aircraft at my club, usually base-to-final,
because we rely only on visual cues. By the time I see a wing drop, it's
too late. 'Nother one bites the dust...
Ed in JXN
MkII/503
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: RE: Flying without instruments???
Very, very difficult to determine accurate airspeed by the
> seat of the pants, especially when turning down wind at very low
> altitudes.
>
> john h
> MKIII/912S
> hauck's holler, alabama
Message 37
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| Subject: | Re: Seat of the pants |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Michael Bigelow" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
You should at minimun have an airspeed indicator to fly safely. We should
all have the skill to fly without the ASI it should it fail, but it is NOT
something you should make a habbit of doing. Even though many of have the
skill to fly without an airspeed indicator, if you do it on a regular basis,
sooner or later it will probably catch up with you. We all get distracted,
have bad days, etc. etc. and having the ASI can prevent a disastorous
situation. We train for lots of difficult situations in flying, and we are
expected to be able to be able to handle them, but that does not mean we
should be exposing ourselves to unnecessary risk on a regular basis.
An ASI is an important instrument, that gives you information critical for
safe flight. Like any insturment it can fail, or mislead you, so you dont
want to be overly reliant on it.... But that does not change the fact that
it is just plain foolish to routinely fly an ultralight without a working
ASI.
Michael Bigelow
Message 38
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| Subject: | Re: You know that you live in 2005 when... |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Hi Mitty,
That's a great list, just as funny now as when Al Gore published it
at the dawn of the interwebnet. (Not Kolby, though.)
Ed in JXN
Do NOT archive.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mitty" <benny_bee_01@yahoo.com>
contains.an.underline.and.numbers/letters@roxy.matronics.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: You know that you live in 2005 when...
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: Mitty <benny_bee_01@yahoo.com>
>
> YOU KNOW YOU ARE LIVING IN 2005 when...
>
> 1. You accidentally enter your password on the
> microwave.
>
> 2. You haven't played solitaire with real cards in
> years.
>
> 3. You have a list of 15 phone numbers to reach your
> family of 3.
Message 39
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| Subject: | Re: Prop Clearance |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Michael Bigelow" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
The feedback on prop clearance has been very helpful. I dont want the extra
noise and am still not confortable with just one inch, but given your
reports I will most definately not go more than 2 or 3 inches. You guys
helped me avoid a mistake before it was built into my plane, thanks guys !!!
Michael Bigelow
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Seat-of-the-Pants/No Instruments??? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: N27SB@aol.com
In a message dated 12/5/2005 8:52:06 PM Eastern Standard Time,
jhauck@elmore.rr.com writes:
> I agree with Ed 100% on the airspeed indicator being the most
> important instrument in my Kolb.
>
> john h
>
OK, I can;t stand it no more. Most of my flying career is saddled up to a
Long-EZ. Keep in mind this is an arcraft that will not stall, but if you want
to
get it on the ground or maximize it's performance airspeed is eveything. An
airspeed indicator is really a feedback device that reminds you of what you
think is happening. I think that it is the most important gauge.
Steve b
do not archive
Message 41
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| Subject: | Re: You know that you live in 2005 when... |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Mitty <benny_bee_01@yahoo.com>
Sorry ,forgot :)
do not archive
--- John Hauck <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> wrote:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck"
> <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
>
> | YOU KNOW YOU ARE LIVING IN 2005 when...
>
> Hi Gang:
>
> Come on now. This one went into the archives.
>
> Do you all want this type info on the Kolb Aircraft
> Builders List?
>
> Thanks,
>
> john h
> MKIII/912ULS
>
> DO NOT ARCHIVE
>
>
>
> Click on
> about
> provided
> www.buildersbooks.com,
> Admin.
> _->
> browse
> Subscriptions page,
> FAQ,
>
>
>
>
>
>
http://home.earthlink.net/~mr_d/index.html
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