Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:53 AM - Re: Gap Seals (Bob and Jenn B)
2. 06:57 AM - MarkIIIvs Kolbra (David Key)
3. 08:44 AM - gap seals (b young)
4. 12:50 PM - Re: new to the List/Gap Seals (Jack B. Hart)
5. 02:12 PM - Re: Memories and Merry Xmas!!! (roger lee)
6. 03:00 PM - Batteries and 912ULS (John Hauck)
7. 05:37 PM - Re: NORMS MK3 CRASH (Ron)
8. 05:37 PM - Suki motor with a turbo (Ron)
9. 05:40 PM - Gap seals redux (lucien stavenhagen)
10. 06:07 PM - Re: Gap seals redux (John Hauck)
11. 08:16 PM - Re: Re: Gap Seals (Ed Chmielewski)
Message 1
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bob and Jenn B" <tabberdd@hotmail.com>
My two cents, I tried gap seals on my ailerons on my Mk II and it did
absolutely nothing. I know others who have tried them as well on Mk II's
and no joy. I suspect it's the full length wide ailerons and 60mph speed
that makes the change not as noticeable.
Bob B
Do Not Archive
Message 2
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| Subject: | MarkIIIvs Kolbra |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "David Key" <dhkey@msn.com>
I am longing for another Kolb but I've only had a Mark III. I am seriously
looking at a Kolbra. I wanted to hear from someone that has flown in both.
Besides the side by side seating what are the diffrences on how they feel?
Thanks,
David
Message 3
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "b young" <by0ung@brigham.net>
i put gap seals on my mkIII elevators and could not tell much
difference...... but i took my old aileron seals off when i washed my
plane last summert and flew around the pattern once to dry things off before
installing new ones........ BELIEVE ME they make a lot of
difference!!!!!! i have not ever put them on the rudder.
boyd
---------------
Should the rudder and elevators be sealed too...
|
| DVD
DVD/Gang:
Plans did not call for them on any of my three different Kolbs. Gave
it some thought, but never got around to experimenting with elevator
and rudder gap seals, and sealing the area between vertical
stabilizers, upper and lower, where they mate with the tail boom.
Can't remember if anyone else I know has done that experimentation or
not.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: new to the List/Gap Seals |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Jack B. Hart" <jbhart@onlyinternet.net>
>At 05:39 PM 12/16/05 -0500, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org>
>
>Norm flew my MKIII which has vortex generators, and due to the lower
>stall speeds, he suggested that I not add gap seals between the
>elevators and the horizontal tail. He said it was possible I might get
>into some really unexplored territory where no one could predict what
>might happen, perhaps have the elevators hang in a bit longer than
>before and the tail stall sharply instead of the elevators gradually
>losing control authority like it does now. He did not think adding
>vortex generators to both the wings and the underside of the horizontal
>tail, or gap sealing the tail if you had VG's on the wing was a good
>idea. However he liked the VG's on the wing a lot. I sure wish the
>factory Xtra would have had them...
>
>Richard Pike
>MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
Richard & FireFlyer's,
To help civilize the FireFly, I mounted VG's on the wings at 28.5 hours.
The FireFly became much more solid and docile. VG's reduced stall speed,
with no wing drop off and no clean break, just a mush. This would indicate
the center of lift has moved more toward the rear.
I found that at slow speeds and flying in ground effect there was little
pitch control authority. As result one had to maintain higher speeds to
keep pitch control crisp. To increase back stick reaction, I installed book
binding tape back seals between the horizontal stabilizers and elevators at
43 hours. I could not feel much if any improvement. At 69 hours I added
temp VG's to the underside of the horizontal stabilizer. These VG's
increased back pressure feed back at low speeds. I can three point the
FireFly with three degrees of flaperon and at lower speeds with out it
becoming mushy in pitch.
The current total flight time is 194 hours. The library tape needs to be
replaced. This Spring, I will take it off and fly with out it to see if
there is a change in performance. I doubt that I will replace the tape.
Checking my records, I could not find that I have done any stall testing
since adding the VG's to the bottom of the horizontal stabilizer. I added
stall testing to my short list.
Snow is a couple feet deep next to the hangar doors.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: Memories and Merry Xmas!!! |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: roger lee <ssadiver1@yahoo.com>
Hi Charlie,
The 18ah battery was the original battery. When I talked to Lockwood, Rotax distributor
and service facility, about the starting issue they said all the 912s
were supposed to have a 28 ah battery. I will say it made a big difference.
I am also installing this week the heavy duty starter. The heavy duty starter
is supposed to have more torque and turning speed.
We will see shortly.
Take Care,
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az
Charlie England <ceengland@bellsouth.net> wrote: --> Kolb-List message posted
by: Charlie England
roger lee wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: roger lee
>
>Hi John,
>
> Was having some trouble on cold mornings starting my 912s. I read your post about
reducing the plug gap to .025 from .028. I also took out the old battery
that was only 18 ah and put in a new Odessy gel cell 27ah battery. Fires right
up now.
>
> Thanks for the tip,
> Roger Lee
> Tucson, Az.
>
snipped
FWIW, an 18ah sealed lead-acid battery (not really a gel cell; different
technology) like the Odyssey will easily crank a hotrodded 10-1
compression IO-360 Lycoming if wiring is done right & the battery is in
good condition. With 27ah, you shouldn't even need gas for short flights.
Charlie
(obligatory ;-) here)
Message 6
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| Subject: | Batteries and 912ULS |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
the 912s were supposed to have a 28 ah battery. I will say it made a
big difference. I am also installing this week the heavy duty starter.
| |
| Roger Lee
Roger L/Gang:
Did the 1994 flight to Alaska with a 912 and a 14 ah Wal*Mart wet
motorcycle battery. Had to get a jump start in Dead Horse, AK, when
the temps below freezing.
2000 and 2001 flight to Alaska was with a 12 ah sealed battery. It
got the job done with out any starting assistance.
2004 flight was with 16 ah Odesey sealed lead acid battery. It also
got the job done, turning the 912ULS with a new high torque starter
and slip clutch. The new starter and slip clutch were excellent
improvements to the older 912ULS. Newer 912ULS's come with equipped
with the starter and slip clutch.
The 16 ah bat weighs 15 lbs.
Don't have any documentation to back me up, only experience, but that
big battery is probably an overkill. However, you may have a
requirement for it.
BTW the 12 ah battery would start the Cummins Diesel in my truck,
without a whimper.
Take care,
john h
Message 7
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ron" <captainron1@cox.net>
Glad to see you recovering. You are certainly handling all of this as best
as anyone possibly can. See you in the sky sometime.
Ron
Arizona
===================
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of chris davis
Subject: Kolb-List: NORMS MK3 CRASH
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "chris davis" <scrounge69@comcast.net>
HI LIsters its been a year and a month since I was the passenger with Norm
at
the Kolb factory. Rest his soul, I was in the hospital til July 15 2005. I
had
a tour of the factory in the morn then donnys ears perked up and hr said"
here
comes our demo pilot" I had just bought a beautiful MK3From Bob Broucis,
the
day before and sold my firestar KXP two weeks before after 10 years of
flying
and dreams of the FAA light sport aircraft filling my mind and my heart. I
had
an excellent year commercial fishing and had been searching for a flyin
community for 10 years. I found one and bought a 4 acre site and a new
singlewide big enough for my my 85 year old ex pilot Dad and my step mom my
wife
and myself in O'Brien Florida thats on the Suwannee river in NW Florida ,
So
taking a demo flight in the factories two place seem like a good idea , my
last
flight in a MK3 was in the late 80s at Sun and Fun with JOHN HAUCK well this
decision was the last thing I remember until Jan 5, 2005. I dont remember
Norm
or the walkaround he did or the check ride and another walkaround that he
and I
did but my wife does !she was on the ground taking pictures and hoping for a
great uneventful flight .I don't remember the fact that we did a touch and
go
and on the next flight my wife says " she heard and saw us take off and then
we
went behind the hanger and she thought " we left the area because she
couldn't
hear the Rotax" but is smart enough to know it was a quiet 4stroke Rotax
not
like my 503 but the she saw us come around the hanger with the engine out
and
crash into the end of the runway she was there right after Donny and he said
"there both alive " as he ran to the phone , My wife Becky is an R.N.and
ran to
the planeopen the door and I sat up saying " my back" Norm wasn't moving
she gave him mouth to mouth and he turned from blue to pink as the EMTs
arrived
got me out and said" he is gone" about Norm. What a great bunch of rescue
people they have in London Kentucky, They put me in a helicopter and had me
at
University of Kentucky Hospital in a matter of minutes I was busted up
pretty
bad . Six broken ribs broken sternum a crushed ,80% spine my pelvis was
broken
into 9 pieces .which are now bolted together with 2 seven inch stainless
lag
bolts I've got two 3\8 stainless rods going down my spine and there is a
spot
above my tailbone that the two ss rods are boxed together to freeze the
place
where my spinal cord was crushed I say was because I am learning to walk, I
can
lift my body which weighed 148 lbs when I got out of the Hosp after 9months
,but
now weighs alittle over 190ibs most of it is muscle University of Kentucky
Hosp. is a wondrous place , They did a great job on me and they let my wife
live
in there waiting room for two weeks ,because she didn't want to be away
from me
,I was in such bad shape .She is quite a woman 91\2 months in the hosp. she
was
by my side every day accept one there was 8ft of snow in the driveway caused
her
to miss a day!The reason am writing is That I had some really excellent
lawyers
that my wife Hired when they thought I was going to be a quadriplegic or
worse
they considered suing everyone ,ROTA,KOLB , THE PILOT I said no to them
all
Rota? we all know the 4 strokes run and the NTSB took the engine to Florida
hooked it up to pure fuel and ran it for hours ran like a dream ,KOLB we all
know that Kolb's are so well designed that if I had been in another
ultrslight
type aircraft we would both probly be dead ,crome moly cockpit and all , the
PILOT I didn't want to hurt his family , then the insurance company that
held
the Liability policy that Norm had paid for for years told my lawyers there
would be no argument .he paid for it and they would pay me ! no harm to his
wife
or kids and I am going to make a deposit in the Labhart children's fund
after
all in htis KOLB family we are all -- brothers& sisters are we not ? one
more
thing I would like to say the reason I think you all know why I didn't sue
KOLB
is I still want to build a MKIII and I believe I will . first I need to
build
a shop and hanger in O'Brien the get a kit and work my way through it . in
3or4or5 years maybe I will fly , MY wife says she won't stop me , WHAT A
WIFE
she is the reason I live . Thanks for all the good will you all wished us
back
in November Norm was lucky to have you all for friends . Sorry about the
long
story vie haven't had a computer fo a while . it would be great to hear
from
any of you any time . a KOLBER forever Chris davis cape cod ma.& O'Brien Fl.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Suki motor with a turbo |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ron" <captainron1@cox.net>
Bob B. sorta suggested that I repost this message here. Which makes sense as
Richard S. is doing or may have already finished doing the same thing.
-------------
Folks
I am about to make a call and send off 600 smackers
for a 1.0 ltr Suzuki with a turbo. This is what I know is
to be delivered. One motor low mileage (according to
the seller) and one turbo charger.
I also know that I will need the following; a starter,
a radiator, an ignition system, and adopter plate and plumbing for the
turbo, and of course an RDU. The Rdu I can leave
for later as we have two qualified gentlemen here (yahoo Geo list) that can
help me with that. What I would like to get in
terms of input is just what all I will need to do the
day the crate arrives at my door step.
It would be great if you would tell me in as much
detail what you would do, from the minute the create
is on the garage floor. No detail will go un
Appreciated. Plus it will be guidance to all of us.
(Main problem is that I cannot find any 1.3 liter
motor in Southern Arizona at all, and as some of you
have commented that the 1.0 liter with a turbo is as
Sufficient as a 1.3
Merry Christmas and Happy Hanukah as the case may be.
Ron
Arizona
(Needing to get that Big Kolb finished, all the other
little things have been done and I have nothing to
stall the project with any longer)
Message 9
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--> Kolb-List message posted by: "lucien stavenhagen" <lstavenhagen@hotmail.com>
Hey All,
Just an FYI, I made some temporary aileron gap seals for my FS II out of
packing tape with a strip of light cloth down the middle (to keep the tape
from sticking and crumpling up as the ailerons were moved) and flew around
with them a bit today.
Yep, just like my r/c airplanes, the tape made a significant difference. The
roll rate was higher and there was just overall more aileron (seemed like
slightly less adverse yaw too, perhaps the seals reduce drag as well).
I'm going to do some more test flying tomorrow if the weather holds. But it
sure seemed to help with the aileron authority.
I guess now I have to plan some permanant ones, a-la the drawing on the kolb
list photos.... Never done dope and fabric, but I guess this will be a good
way to start.... I'll have to ask a bunch of ignorant fabric work questions
on here I guess ;)....
LS
N646F
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: Gap seals redux |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
| I'll have to ask a bunch of ignorant fabric work questions
| on here I guess ;)....
|
| LS
LS/Gang:
Not necessary if you read and study the Poly Fiber Manual before you
get in over your head.
Best place to start is with Jim and Dondi Miller. You can go to their
web page, get their toll free number, call and ask all the dumb
questions you can come up with. They have a lot of good answers.
Have been invaluable to most of us on the Kolb List when it came to
covering and painting our Kolbs.
http://www.aircrafttechsupport.com/
Glad the gap seals helped. That is why they are included in the plans
and instructions for Kolb airplanes.
john h
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler, al
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: RE: Gap Seals |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Hi Bob,
My MkII has them, built in 1988. It's awaiting restoration, I can't
comment on flying qualities since I haven't flown it. I've got the plans
around somewhere, will see what they have for info. I doubt the original
builder did the seals on his own but will try to find out.
Ed in JXN (MI)
MkII/503
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob and Jenn B" <tabberdd@hotmail.com>
Subject: Kolb-List: RE: Gap Seals
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bob and Jenn B" <tabberdd@hotmail.com>
>
> My two cents, I tried gap seals on my ailerons on my Mk II and it did
> absolutely nothing. I know others who have tried them as well on Mk II's
> and no joy. I suspect it's the full length wide ailerons and 60mph speed
> that makes the change not as noticeable.
>
> Bob B
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
>
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