---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Mon 01/23/06: 68 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 12:12 AM - Re: Re: take off with flaps (Ed Chmielewski) 2. 02:32 AM - Re: Shoulder straps too loose (pat ladd) 3. 02:36 AM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (pat ladd) 4. 04:19 AM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (firebug) 5. 04:22 AM - Re: Shoulder straps too loose (pat ladd) 6. 04:27 AM - Corrected my email (firebug) 7. 04:58 AM - Re: What's Wrong With This Picture? (pat ladd) 8. 05:40 AM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (robert bean) 9. 07:10 AM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (JetPilot) 10. 07:16 AM - Re: What's Wrong With This Picture? (Earl & Mim Zimmerman) 11. 08:07 AM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (JetPilot) 12. 08:13 AM - Re: take off with flaps (JetPilot) 13. 09:01 AM - Re: take off with flaps (John Hauck) 14. 09:13 AM - Re: take off with flaps (John Hauck) 15. 09:21 AM - Re: Chafing Tape (Dave & Eve Pelletier) 16. 10:02 AM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (Richard & Martha Neilsen) 17. 10:05 AM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (Ed Chmielewski) 18. 10:09 AM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (Richard & Martha Neilsen) 19. 10:31 AM - Re: Chafing Tape (firebug) 20. 10:41 AM - Senior Moment (Richard & Martha Neilsen) 21. 10:46 AM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (pat ladd) 22. 10:56 AM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (firebug) 23. 10:58 AM - Re: What's Wrong With This Picture? (pat ladd) 24. 10:59 AM - John H's position (Todd Fredricks) 25. 11:11 AM - Re: Shoulder straps too loose (flht99reh) 26. 11:16 AM - Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (firebug) 27. 11:21 AM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (ray anderson) 28. 11:28 AM - Re: John H's position (John Hauck) 29. 12:13 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (JetPilot) 30. 12:44 PM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (Chris Mallory) 31. 01:12 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (firebug) 32. 01:19 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (JetPilot) 33. 01:21 PM - Re: John H's position (Todd Fredricks) 34. 01:25 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (firebug) 35. 01:31 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (JetPilot) 36. 01:46 PM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (Chris Mallory) 37. 01:55 PM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar (Chris Mallory) 38. 02:21 PM - Re: take off with flaps (Mark) 39. 02:58 PM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (russ kinne) 40. 03:06 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (JetPilot) 41. 03:28 PM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (JW Hauck) 42. 03:29 PM - Re: Shoulder straps too loose (Mike Pierzina) 43. 03:30 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar (JetPilot) 44. 03:34 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (firebug) 45. 03:47 PM - Re: Shoulder straps too loose (Mike Pierzina) 46. 03:49 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (JetPilot) 47. 03:59 PM - Re: Shoulder straps too loose (Mike Pierzina) 48. 04:11 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (firebug) 49. 04:21 PM - Re: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (Chris Mallory) 50. 04:30 PM - firebug, jetpilot (flykolb) 51. 04:38 PM - Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) (JetPilot) 52. 04:51 PM - Starting new improved thread: Looking for a FireStar (firebug) 53. 04:55 PM - Re: firebug, jetpilot (firebug) 54. 05:15 PM - Re: Re: Shoulder straps too loose (flht99reh) 55. 05:56 PM - Re: firebug, jetpilot (JetPilot) 56. 06:10 PM - Flying Pictures (R. Hankins) 57. 06:14 PM - Re: Re: firebug, jetpilot (Dallas Shepherd) 58. 06:50 PM - Great aviation movie (kfackler) 59. 06:58 PM - Re: Shoulder straps too loose (Mike Pierzina) 60. 07:17 PM - Re: Flying Pictures (firebug) 61. 07:23 PM - Try Hang gliding it will help your flying skills (firebug) 62. 07:28 PM - Re: Great aviation movie (R. Hankins) 63. 07:29 PM - Re: Flying Pictures (R. Hankins) 64. 07:58 PM - Re: Re: Flying Pictures (Larry Bourne) 65. 08:58 PM - Re: Flying Pictures (rlaird) 66. 09:55 PM - Re: Re: Flying Pictures (Larry Bourne) 67. 10:03 PM - Yearlings....oh well (possums) 68. 10:25 PM - Re: Re: firebug, jetpilot (Ed Chmielewski) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 12:12:47 AM PST US From: "Ed Chmielewski" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: take off with flaps --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" Hi John, Great technique. One of my early instructors taught me the same thing, saved me once on a snowy, short runway (PA-28 with Hershey-bar wing). Ed in JXN (MI) MkII/503 Do not archive. ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Hauck" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 12:10 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: take off with flaps > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" > > In no case should you ever use full flaps for takeoff, at that > setting the drag penalty is so high that you only hurt your > performance to the point of being hazardous ! > > Mike B: > > There is one exception, or variation, that I use occassionally. It is > useful getting out of a soft, wet, or heavily vegetated strip. Start > the takeoff roll clean. Just prior to reaching stall speed, snatch > the flaps all the way down. Soon as the MKIII pops off the ground, > start easing the flaps out and continue to climb. > > Normally, never use flaps for take off, but use them for most all > landings. > > john h > MKIII ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 02:32:02 AM PST US From: "pat ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Shoulder straps too loose --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" Red to match my plane...and I macreme'd the shoulder strap..>> Hi, oh ducky, how sweet. I bet you look sooo cute...( purl one, stitch one, drop one....) Cheers Pat :-) -- ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 02:36:42 AM PST US From: "pat ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" the chafing tape on the airframe, THE FRAME, not on the exterior over the high points where its supposed to be. >> Hi, this intrigues me. If the tape is not between the frame and the covering what does it do?. What chafes on the OUTSIDE of the covering? Pat -- ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 04:19:08 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" Chafing tape is put on the high spots of the airframe because those parts are more likely to rub against objects. Look at a Cub or other fabric covered aircraft, you will see chafing tape on the airframe. When the airframes high points rub on something the chafing tape rubs instead of the fabric. This makes the fabric twice as thick which makes it twice as had to rub through. You will typically see it on the longerons and any other area that protrudes. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6079#6079 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 04:22:15 AM PST US From: "pat ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Shoulder straps too loose --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" surely cause John Wayne to roll over in his grave. >> Hi Ralph, what would certainly cause him to roll over in his grave is Brokeback Mountain, a film about gay cowboys. Good grief. On the other hand with a name like Marion..... Cheers Pat :-) -- ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 04:27:53 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Corrected my email From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" I had to correct my email. Sorry for any trouble it caused. Just for the record it is gcc1964@mon-cre.net I also discovered that the forum inserts (at) for the symble @ which you have to change when you email someone. If I am wrong please correct me. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6082#6082 ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 04:58:32 AM PST US From: "pat ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: What's Wrong With This Picture? --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" I was on the down wind side of a small mountain a couple hundred feet about the peak>> Hi, you were very lucky. A bit lower and the downgoing side of the airflow would have put you firmly on the ground. A friend of mine when we were doing 5 hours on a ridge for a gliding badge took a short cut from one end of the ridge to the other which took him back behind the lift into the curlover. He went down in a cornfield absolutely vertically. The pattern he left in the corn was a complete outline of the glider, no run in or approach. He must have gone in absolutely flat . It broke the glider fuselage in half just behind the wing and gave the guy back trouble for a long time. The sensation of flying backwards is really strange though. I have done it twice. Once in a glider where I launched up the wire, levelled out, dumped the wire and drifted backwards far enough to make a straight in approach to land without turning. Once when I was having a demonstration flight in gyrocopter. We climbed to about a thousand feet and then flew more and more slowly until we began to drift backwards. At that point the pilot said `I expect you are wondering what would happen if the engine stopped now` Then he switched it off. In the sudden silence we fluttered down to a smooth landing right on the numbers. Impressive but odd. Cheers Pat -- ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 05:40:21 AM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean What we have here is more a confusion in nomenclature than fact. A chafing tape would be occasionally necessary on a rough surface directly over the frame before covering. The tape on the outside of the fabric is (no kidding) surface tape. It provides both additional strength at protruding points and is a sacrificial bump absorber. Not much more to that subject, unless you get down to diddly stuff like pinked vs straight edge, bias tape, whether to use grade A, etc. -BB On 23, Jan 2006, at 5:36 AM, pat ladd wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" > > the chafing tape on the airframe, THE FRAME, not on the exterior over > the > high points where its supposed to be. >> > > Hi, > > this intrigues me. If the tape is not between the frame and the > covering > what does it do?. What chafes on the OUTSIDE of the covering? > > Pat > > > -- > > ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 07:10:20 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" So it turns out that the airplane was properly built, and that the covering was ripped off for nothing [Shocked] -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6119#6119 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:16:25 AM PST US From: Earl & Mim Zimmerman Subject: Re: Kolb-List: What's Wrong With This Picture? --> Kolb-List message posted by: Earl & Mim Zimmerman pat ladd wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" > > I was on the down wind side of a small mountain a couple hundred feet about > the peak>> > > Hi, > you were very lucky. A bit lower and the downgoing side of the airflow would > have put you firmly on the ground. I meant to type "a couple hundred feet (above) the peak". I was about 3-4 miles down wind of the mountain at about 1500-1700 ft AGL. At the point where I was backing up the air was very smooth. It reminded me of when you see a hawk (not Hauck) hovering motionless in the air. Farther down wind of the mountain it was pretty rough. I tighten me seatbelt a couple tugs, would have banged my bald spot if it were any looser. I do understand what you are saying though, but I didn't think that I was that close to the mountain. Maybe I was in the next wave off the mountain. Sure glad I wasn't in a glider, but a 1000 fpm 582 powered MKII! ~ Earl -- ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:07:29 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" JetPilot wrote: > Firebug, > > So it turns out that the airplane was properly built, and that the covering was ripped off for nothing [Shocked] Chafing tape on the inside of the covering would certainly not hurt anything. Sounds like you tore up a perfectly good airplane to me [Crying or Very sad] . > > The guys were correct about something eles, the firestar is much better than the skyraider. Being in front of everything with almost unlimited visibility is what this type of flying is all about. If you want to be closed in an airplane with no visibility like the Skyraider, you might as well be flying around a Cessna 150 [Evil or Very Mad] -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6140#6140 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:13:07 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: take off with flaps From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" Very Correct John, I did not consider that situation, but that would work great :D I immagine you used that technique on the the soft beach in alaska, I remember seeing a picture of your tailwheel sunk way down in the sand. JettPilot -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6143#6143 ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 09:01:41 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: take off with flaps From: "John Hauck" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" > I immagine you used that technique on the the soft beach in alaska Morning Mike B/Gang: That is correct. That was the old Maule 6" solid rubber tailwheel in that picture. In sand, as dry and soft as it was on the beach, 12 miles south of Barrow Airport, the tailwheel acted like an anchor. Poor planning got me on the beach with full fuel and gear, aprx'ly 1,200 lbs takeoff weight. I should have gone down the Will Rogers/Wiley Post Memorial before I refueled after my flight from Helmericks. Would have been easier to get in and out of the beach. However, the old fat MKIII did her job quite well, as usual. I now have an 8" pnuematic Maule Tundra Tailwheel which would have done a much better job. I have attached two photos of Miss P'fer (P fer plane) on the beach on the Arctic Ocean at the Will Rogers/Wiley Post crash site and memorial. Very solem feeling standing alone on that beach where these two adventurers died in 1935. Little MKIII never ceases to amaze me. -------- John Hauck MKIII/912ULS hauck's holler, alabama Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6156#6156 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/ak040537_resize_531.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/ak040543_resize_433.jpg ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 09:13:45 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: take off with flaps From: "John Hauck" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" Hi Gang: Here was another occassion to use the "flap pop up" technique of takeoff. Was between LA, CA, and Laughlin, NV. In dire need of a pit stop. Nearest airport 30 miles off course. Picked out a dry creek bed, drug it twice, then went for it. Sand was dry and deeper than I had expected. Thank goodness for the displaced main gear on my MKIII. Standard MKIII gear location would have put me on my nose and I would have been looking for another way back to Alabama. In a situation like this, there is no way to know exactly what you are getting into until you have committed to land. I was a little bit, well..........a lot leary, of getting back out of there. Walked my take off track to make sure there wasn't anything that was going to jump out and bite me. Big problem is getting the aircraft to start rolling. I also had dug out in front of the mains to help every little bit I could to get moving. Once I got her rolling, she climbed right up on top of the sand, popped the flaps, and we were flying. That is always a super good feeling when we get back in the air once again. -------- John Hauck MKIII/912ULS hauck's holler, alabama Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6160#6160 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscf2933_880.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/dscf2932_446.jpg ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 09:21:00 AM PST US From: "Dave & Eve Pelletier" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Chafing Tape --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Dave & Eve Pelletier" ----- Original Message ----- From: "firebug" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 5:18 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" > > Chafing tape is put on the high spots of the airframe because those parts are more likely to rub against objects. Look at a Cub or other fabric covered aircraft, you will see chafing tape on the airframe. When the airframes high points rub on something the chafing tape rubs instead of the fabric. This makes the fabric twice as thick which makes it twice as had to rub through. You will typically see it on the longerons and any other area that protrudes. According to the Poly-Fiber manual, chafing tape is put under the fabric. "Any sharp edge or structural feature that might cut or poke through the fabric should be covered with cloth sticky-back anti-chafe tape." ..."Obviously it should go over rivet heads, metal seams, and sharp edges that could cut the fabric." (page 12) I took the liberty of changing the subject line to better reflect the subject under discussion. AzDave Do Not Archive > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6079#6079 > > > ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 10:02:30 AM PST US From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 10:09 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > So it turns out that the airplane was properly built, and that the > covering was ripped off for nothing [Shocked] > > -------- > NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have > !!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6119#6119 > > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 10:05:27 AM PST US From: "Ed Chmielewski" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" Not having been there, how can you determine whether the aircraft was built properly and covering did not need replacement? Hours aren't the determining factor for fabric, age and the elements are. Or maybe the owner just wanted to recover for peace of mind, experience, different fabric, who knows? Not having been there, I sure don't. Ed in JXN MkII/503 Do not archive. ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 10:09 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > So it turns out that the airplane was properly built, and that the > covering was ripped off for nothing [Shocked] > > -------- > NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have > !!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6119#6119 ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 10:09:57 AM PST US From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Mike You made you point, why do you feel the need to rub his nose in it? How would you feel if you had done that to a perfectly good airplane and someone kept making posts to the world about how you screwed up. It was necessary to keep others from not making the same mistake but please let it go. Thanks Rick Neilsen Redrive VW powered MKIIIc ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 10:09 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > So it turns out that the airplane was properly built, and that the > covering was ripped off for nothing [Shocked] > > -------- > NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have > !!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6119#6119 > > > ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 10:31:07 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Chafing Tape From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" I understand that chafing tape goes on the rough areas under the fabric but you also put it on the exterior too, it can also be refered to as surface tape. The function is two fold, one it strengthens the area but I think most importantly it guards against chafing the fabric when the high spot hits an object. It is simply 2 - 3 inches wide usually with pinked edges. It is glued to the surface like it is over the ribs of the wings. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6176#6176 ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 10:41:29 AM PST US From: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" Subject: Kolb-List: Senior Moment --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" I really sorry for the last two posts they were meant to be sent off list. Do not archive Rick Neilsen Redrive VW powered MKIIIc ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 10:46:42 AM PST US From: "pat ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" confusion in nomenclature>> Hi Robert, looks as though you are right. I certainly put `chafing tape` around all the sharp corners of the airframe before covering and `pinked cut` tape on the outside before spraying. Cheers Pat -- ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 10:56:59 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" TO JETPILOT: There are always a few like you on every board talking when you should shut up. You do not know what you are talking about. I would hate to fly anything you have built. Yes there are areas under the fabric where you put chafing tape. There are also areas on the surface you put it, sometimes it is refered to as surface tape. Its function on the surface is to keep the fabric from being rubbed through, chafed when it is struck at a high point on the airframe. He had NONE of this, that is a sign of a poorly built plane in my opinion. The high spots are going to be hit period. You put surface or chafing tape on the high spots to double the thickness of the fabric. LOOK at a factory built Cub if you don't believe me. You DO NOT rap chafing tape all the way around the frame of the rudder, horizontal stabilizer, elevator etc and THEN glue the fabric to the chafing tape. The fabric is glued to the structure of the rudder, elevator, horizintal stabilizer etc. He had chafing tape glued all the way around the perimeter of the tail feathers. Can you understand that do I need to draw you a picture? He also did the same thing to the rest of the airframe. What do you fly? I find it hard to believe it is a jet. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6181#6181 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 10:58:39 AM PST US From: "pat ladd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: What's Wrong With This Picture? --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" Maybe I was in the next wave off the mountain. Sure glad I wasn't in a glider, but a 1000 fpm 582 powered>> Hi Earl, you might have been in the second wave. It is uncannily smooth. Super flying in the `up` section. If you had been in the downflow of a good wave your 582 would`nt have saved you, and the rotor may well have banged your bald spot right through the canopy. Pat -- ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 10:59:08 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: John H's position From: Todd Fredricks --> Kolb-List message posted by: Todd Fredricks So John; Am I to take it after all the flaperon, flap debate that you fall into the camp of separate flaps and ailerons? I am heading down to London first of next month to size up the Mark IIIX for myself (since the 172 finally sold) and at some point I need to start planning for the separate flap option. I ask specifically because as an Army flight surgeon I always looked at the principal function of Army W O s as keeping the FS from killing himself when he take the flight controls. Todd PS: Thanks for attaching the separate photos of Miss P'Fer to some of your posts. They make great screensavers to muse over.... -- Todd Fredricks, DO Flying Fox Services Visit my Blog at www.flyingfoxhangar.blogspot.com POWERED BY MAC ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 11:11:05 AM PST US From: "flht99reh" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Shoulder straps too loose --> Kolb-List message posted by: "flht99reh" Hey Pat! Don't you pick on my flyin brother Plainecrazzy. He said he'd make me a set if I flew out there and whopped your old hide ! HA. HA! Anyway, since we need to keep the subject matter about Kolbs to please the site master and purpose of our gathering place. If he makes me a set, I'll fly my 1990 Kolb Firestar KXP with 503 DIDC out to whoop your old hide, after I complete my lessons. How old are you now Pat, It might be a while. Ralph, "the good one from Ohio" P.S. Pat, for your information; "pearl one, stitch one, drop one" is not macram! Thats knitting. And unless you want to meet me in a dark ally, all 230# and 6'1" of me, you do not want to pick on the knitters in America! Cause we can find you in a heartbeat! HA, HA! -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pat ladd Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 5:31 AM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Shoulder straps too loose --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" Red to match my plane...and I macreme'd the shoulder strap..>> Hi, oh ducky, how sweet. I bet you look sooo cute...( purl one, stitch one, drop one....) Cheers Pat :-) -- ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 11:16:07 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" Thanks for your comment. Believe me the plane was not perfectly good. He had rapped the chafing tape around the perimeter of the tail feathers as well as other parts and glued it to the surfaces. He then glued the fabric to the chafing tape. That is not good. He then neglected to put surface tape on the exterior along the high spots. I also refered to this as chafing tape as it is there to keep the fabric from being chafed through. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6186#6186 ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 11:21:42 AM PST US From: ray anderson Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: ray anderson Let's don't get ugly. Play nice. Ray UltraStar TN do not archive. firebug wrote: --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" TO JETPILOT: There are always a few like you on every board talking when you should shut up. You do not know what you are talking about. I would hate to fly anything you have built. Yes there are areas under the fabric where you put chafing tape. There are also areas on the surface you put it, sometimes it is refered to as surface tape. Its function on the surface is to keep the fabric from being rubbed through, chafed when it is struck at a high point on the airframe. He had NONE of this, that is a sign of a poorly built plane in my opinion. The high spots are going to be hit period. You put surface or chafing tape on the high spots to double the thickness of the fabric. LOOK at a factory built Cub if you don't believe me. You DO NOT rap chafing tape all the way around the frame of the rudder, horizontal stabilizer, elevator etc and THEN glue the fabric to the chafing tape. The fabric is glued to the structure of the rudder, elevator, horizintal stabilizer etc. He had chafi! ng tape glued all the way around the perimeter of the tail feathers. Can you understand that do I need to draw you a picture? He also did the same thing to the rest of the airframe. What do you fly? I find it hard to believe it is a jet. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6181#6181 --------------------------------- Ring in the New Year with Photo Calendars. Add photos, events, holidays, whatever. ________________________________ Message 28 ____________________________________ Time: 11:28:39 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: John H's position --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" into the | camp of separate flaps and ailerons? | | I ask specifically because as an Army flight surgeon I always looked at the | principal function of Army W O s as keeping the FS from killing himself when | he take the flight controls. | | Todd Hi Todd/Gang: Well..........I don't fall into any camp. I am pretty much an individualist. Have been extremely lucky, with a 22 year close association with both old and new Kolb. I got to fly and compare most of the Kolb models. Not just a quick flight, but extensively. This was a great way of gathering info and making decisions on what I build, what I modify, and what I fly. Made it very easy for me to determine what works best for me. It does not lend much credence, to me, for someone to tell me how much better one system works than the other, when they do so without actual experience of flying both systems. In some cases, without any experience flying a Kolb. I don't sell airplanes, so I can be very honest in my opinions of what works for me, and what does not. I think I have the best that Kolb offers in a 16 year old design, with a few of my own mods thrown in to make my type of flying more comfortable and more likely to accomplish successfully. To me, flaps work much better than flaperons. Some aileron authority is lost with the flaperon system. They are not nearly as effective in steep approaches and landings as the flaps. I wasn't a WO, but I know what you mean. I always relied on them to keep me out of trouble, even to this day. I am very fortunate to have a good friend and a retired Army CWO to fly with each year. I always learn something when I am flying with him. You are more than welcome for the photo posts. john h MKIII ________________________________ Message 29 ____________________________________ Time: 12:13:25 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" firebug wrote: > I also have a skyraider kit for sale just needs to be covered has 100 hrs on the airframe and 503 DCDI with b box. I don't have the time to finish it. GREAT kit plane. Firebug, Your response was very nasty and uncalled for. You advertised an uncovered kit in good shape for sale here. Im sure everyones natural question was "why was the covering ripped off ".... Telling someone to shut up for commenting and asking about it is way out of line and unacceptable conduct here. -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6201#6201 ________________________________ Message 30 ____________________________________ Time: 12:44:46 PM PST US From: "Chris Mallory" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Chris Mallory" What he do here is talk about KOLBS and KOLB related areas of interest. Firebug bought an airplane and for whatever reason took the covering off of it, I'll bet that he didn't do that because he wanted to destroy an aircraft that he just bought and paid for. Jetpilot beat him like a rented mule for his post on the KOLB list. I think the guy has suffered enough because of this Skyraider business. Now let's all do what we can to put this ugly affair behind us and help firebug get the airplane that he should have bought in the first place. Chris Mallory do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 3:12 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > > firebug wrote: >> I also have a skyraider kit for sale just needs to be covered has 100 hrs >> on the airframe and 503 DCDI with b box. I don't have the time to finish >> it. GREAT kit plane. > > > Firebug, > > Your response was very nasty and uncalled for. You advertised an > uncovered kit in good shape for sale here. Im sure everyones natural > question was "why was the covering ripped off ".... Telling someone to > shut up for commenting and asking about it is way out of line and > unacceptable conduct here. > > -------- > NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have > !!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6201#6201 > > > ________________________________ Message 31 ____________________________________ Time: 01:12:05 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" Tampabay: I'll bet you are in Tampa Fl. right? i have relatives down there, nice place. Where do you fly out of? And you are right I didn't take the fabric off to destroy the plane for fun. I hated to do that but I like thing to be right especially when my rear end is in it at 5000ft agl. If I can get rid of the Skyraider I will buy a Kolb. I started to buy one in the first place. Whether the Kolb is better than the Raider is a matter of opinon. Most likely you will side with the plane you own. I am sure once I have gotten a Kolb I will be singing it's praises. Any help in getting rid of the Raider and finding a Firestar would be greatly appreciated. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6222#6222 ________________________________ Message 32 ____________________________________ Time: 01:19:12 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com wrote: > > Jetpilot beat him like a rented mule for his post on the KOLB list. I think > the guy has suffered enough because of this Skyraider business. > > Chris Mallory > What difference does it make if Firebug was advertising a Kolb or not ??? I could care less, he adviertised it here, so im more than happy to talk about it in this forum. You are the only one that has vioced a problem with it not being a Kolb on a Kolb list....... I did ask Firebug the same question any competent buyer would ask... Why rip relitively new covering off an airframe that is in good condition ??? Is Firebug going to verbally assault his potiental buyers if they ask him the same question ?? Given Firebugs response, he is not the kind of person I would ever want to do busienss with. Michael A. Bigelow -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6226#6226 ________________________________ Message 33 ____________________________________ Time: 01:21:10 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: John H's position From: Todd Fredricks --> Kolb-List message posted by: Todd Fredricks Well this is all good because when I spoke to Izek at OSH he told me that I could order the IIIX with flaps as an option so I think that is the way to go. I am going to be doing a lot of what you are doing and my 64 172E with 40 degrees of available flaps and my now-departed Maule M5-235C spoiled me rotten for their ability to maintain a vertical line without excessive airspeed. My 900 feet of upsloping ridgeline will like the Kolb immensely I think. So I take it that you were an RLO? Really excited to work with a fine airplane and be able to envision trips to far away places... Todd -- Todd Fredricks, DO Flying Fox Services Visit my Blog at www.flyingfoxhangar.blogspot.com POWERED BY MAC ________________________________ Message 34 ____________________________________ Time: 01:25:38 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" Jetpilot: It not that you asked me why I took the fabric off that was wrong. It was the way you seem to enjoy saying that I needlessly ripped the covering off of a perfectly good airplane[it wasn't]. You repeated that "It turns out that the plane was properly built and the cover was torn off for nothing" Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6234#6234 ________________________________ Message 35 ____________________________________ Time: 01:31:03 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" neilsenrmf(at)comcast.net wrote: > Mike > > You made you point, why do you feel the need to rub his nose in it? How > would you feel if you had done that to a perfectly good airplane and someone > kept making posts to the world about how you screwed up. It was necessary to > keep others from not making the same mistake but please let it go. > > I asked the question as ANY potiental buyer of that airplane is going to ask... I talked about it again because some others pointed out that firebug was in error in what he described, Firebug still defended what he had done as being correct... I posted again not to rub his nose in it, but to generate more discussion on the matter and maybe we could all learn more from this. If I made a mistake, I would admint it and try to learn enough from people on the list so that I would make the same mistake again. So it was brought up a couple times, big deal. The way Firebug verbally assaulted me in a very nasty way for questioning why he did that tells a lot about the kind of man he is. Given Firebugs response to a legitimate question about an airplane he is selling, I would never buy an airplane, or do any type of business with him. -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6238#6238 ________________________________ Message 36 ____________________________________ Time: 01:46:52 PM PST US From: "Chris Mallory" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Chris Mallory" Myself, George and Beauford all fly out of Airport Manatee, it's on the south shore of Tampa Bay. Yeah, there's nothing wrong with a Skyraider. It's all in what your happy with. I love my Kolb and I researched every single plane out there (for years) nothing surpasses the Kolb for safety, design, Bang for your buck and just the pure fun of flying. Jetpilot was right about "the Kolb view", in a Kolb almost the entire aircraft is behind you and you don't have a feeling of being "in" an airplane .... just stuck out there in the wind ....... Did I mention that I love my Kolb. Anyway ..... good luck to you and don't shy away from posting questions to the list. The amount of experience and expertise here is unbelievable. Chris Mallory do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "firebug" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 4:11 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" > > Tampabay: I'll bet you are in Tampa Fl. right? i have relatives down > there, nice place. Where do you fly out of? And you are right I didn't > take the fabric off to destroy the plane for fun. I hated to do that but I > like thing to be right especially when my rear end is in it at 5000ft agl. > If I can get rid of the Skyraider I will buy a Kolb. I started to buy one > in the first place. Whether the Kolb is better than the Raider is a matter > of opinon. Most likely you will side with the plane you own. I am sure > once I have gotten a Kolb I will be singing it's praises. Any help in > getting rid of the Raider and finding a Firestar would be greatly > appreciated. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6222#6222 > > > ________________________________ Message 37 ____________________________________ Time: 01:55:05 PM PST US From: "Chris Mallory" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Chris Mallory" Mike, My reference to Kolb was meant to say that we are here to support others that are interested in Kolbs not belittle them for some mistake they may have made. And ... are you or were you truly an interested prospective buyer? If so and you didn't like what he had to say then just look elsewhere. You know a little compassion wouldn't hurt. do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 4:18 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > > wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com wrote: >> >> Jetpilot beat him like a rented mule for his post on the KOLB list. I >> think >> the guy has suffered enough because of this Skyraider business. >> >> Chris Mallory >> > > > What difference does it make if Firebug was advertising a Kolb or not ??? > I could care less, he adviertised it here, so im more than happy to talk > about it in this forum. You are the only one that has vioced a problem > with it not being a Kolb on a Kolb list....... > > I did ask Firebug the same question any competent buyer would ask... Why > rip relitively new covering off an airframe that is in good condition ??? > Is Firebug going to verbally assault his potiental buyers if they ask him > the same question ?? Given Firebugs response, he is not the kind of > person I would ever want to do busienss with. > > Michael A. Bigelow > > -------- > NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have > !!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6226#6226 > > > ________________________________ Message 38 ____________________________________ Time: 02:21:47 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: take off with flaps From: "Mark" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mark" WOW!!! Thats how I used to get my PA28-140 off the ground on shorter strips. Thought no one else did it... -------- Mark Shimei Twinstar, 503 Phantom, Kawasaki 440 Weight shift Quick, Chrysler Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6252#6252 ________________________________ Message 39 ____________________________________ Time: 02:58:03 PM PST US From: russ kinne Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) --> Kolb-List message posted by: russ kinne I agree. He had reasons for removing the fabric, and it's his aircraft -- you don't need to jump all over him for it. Let's keep the List friendly and cooperative -- not abrasive or scolding. On Jan 23, 2006, at 3:30 PM, JetPilot wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > > neilsenrmf(at)comcast.net wrote: >> Mike >> >> You made you point, why do you feel the need to rub his nose in >> it? How >> would you feel if you had done that to a perfectly good airplane >> and someone >> kept making posts to the world about how you screwed up. It was >> necessary to >> keep others from not making the same mistake but please let it go. >> >> > > > I asked the question as ANY potiental buyer of that airplane is > going to ask... I talked about it again because some others pointed > out that firebug was in error in what he described, Firebug still > defended what he had done as being correct... I posted again not > to rub his nose in it, but to generate more discussion on the > matter and maybe we could all learn more from this. > > If I made a mistake, I would admint it and try to learn enough from > people on the list so that I would make the same mistake again. So > it was brought up a couple times, big deal. The way Firebug > verbally assaulted me in a very nasty way for questioning why he > did that tells a lot about the kind of man he is. Given Firebugs > response to a legitimate question about an airplane he is selling, > I would never buy an airplane, or do any type of business with him. > > -------- > NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could > have !!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6238#6238 > > ________________________________ Message 40 ____________________________________ Time: 03:06:39 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" kinnepix(at)earthlink.net wrote: > I agree. He had reasons for removing the fabric, and it's his > aircraft -- you don't need to jump all over him for it. > I did not jump all over him for it, although a number of people did question it and rightfully so. You are telling ME to keep it friendly, I kept it very freindly. The only nasty, unfriendly post here was wirtten by Firebug.... You need to check your facts and rethink who you are telling to "keep it friendly", and " dont jump all over him". You are obviously an not to bright telling me this after what firebug posted. -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6266#6266 ________________________________ Message 41 ____________________________________ Time: 03:28:53 PM PST US From: "JW Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JW Hauck" Y'all; Don't y'all think it would be a good idea to drop this thread as it will lead to a no good end. I feel this ole horse has been whipped enough. Jim Hauck On 1/23/2006 5:56:15 PM, kolb-list@matronics.com wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: russ kinne > > I agree. He had reasons for removing the fabric, and > it's his > aircraft -- you don't need to jump all over him for it. > Let's keep the List friendly and cooperative -- not abrasive or > scolding. > > On Jan 23, 2006, at 3:30 PM, JetPilot wrote: > > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > > > > > neilsenrmf(at)comcast.net wrote: > >> Mike > >> > >> You made you point, why do you feel the need to rub his nose in > >> it? How > >> would you feel if you had done that to a perfectly good airplane > >> and someone > >> kept making posts to the world about how you screwed up. It was > >> necessary to > >> keep others from not making the same mistake but please let it go. > >> > >> > > > > > > I asked the question as ANY potiental buyer of that airplane is > > going to ask... I talked about it again because some others pointed > > out that firebug was in error in what he described, Firebug still > > defended what he had done as being correct... I posted again not > > to rub his nose in it, ________________________________ Message 42 ____________________________________ Time: 03:29:53 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Shoulder straps too loose From: "Mike Pierzina" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" Hi, The "lettering" on the dash is done with my computer, then "taped" in place..... One is my "N" number.... on the other side are my "V speeds" And I put "Stall" and "VNE" in RED I also labeled all the other stuff that way for my airworthiness inspection. I used the WIDE clear tape, so it seals it , and looks better... The Gauge that sez " miZer " is my Fuel gauge/fuel flow gauge, and it has an alarm ( at whatever gals "left" I program ) It was a litte SPENDY at $300 bucks from A.S.&S. Gotta Fly... > The professional lettering on the panel is a nice touch, how did you do that ? > > What is that guage called the miZer ??? > > > > > Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6271#6271 ________________________________ Message 43 ____________________________________ Time: 03:30:14 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" rsanoa wrote: > > > TO JETPILOT: There are always a few like you on every board talking when you should shut up. You do not know what you are talking about. I would hate to fly anything you have built. Yes there are areas under the fabric where you put chafing tape. There are also areas on the surface you put it, sometimes it is refered to as surface tape. Its function on the surface is to keep the fabric from being rubbed through, chafed when it is struck at a high point on the airframe. He had NONE of this, that is a sign of a poorly built plane in my opinion. The high spots are going to be hit period. You put surface or chafing tape on the high spots to double the thickness of the fabric. LOOK at a factory built Cub if you don't believe me. You DO NOT rap chafing tape all the way around the frame of the rudder, horizontal stabilizer, elevator etc and THEN glue the fabric to the chafing tape. The fabric is glued to the structure of the rudder, elevator, horizintal stabilizer etc. He had chafi! > ng tape glued all the way around the perimeter of the tail feathers. Can you understand that do I need to draw you a picture? He also did the same thing to the rest of the airframe. What do you fly? I find it hard to believe it is a jet. > > > The only one that posted a nasty, rude, and uncalled for statement was Firebug. You are out of line telling me to have compassion while ignoring Firebugs post... -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6272#6272 ________________________________ Message 44 ____________________________________ Time: 03:34:34 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" I am over it. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6275#6275 ________________________________ Message 45 ____________________________________ Time: 03:47:39 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Shoulder straps too loose From: "Mike Pierzina" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" Hi Guys, Now leme Splain sometin........ Macreme.......Is " Knot " tying , Which I pride myself in knowing alot of different HANDY knots.....Truckers Knot, Turkey Foot, half hitch, Square, and a bunch more that I don't know there name... Sailors know knots.....Is it for knitting ??? That was funny tho... These had to be tied "in place" because the way I did it was....I threaded the wire thru the belt on "TOP" , (I made a hole with a fat pin)....That way the "Loom" Can't slip down..... And if you want a good job....do it yerself, don't ask the "little woman" Well, you can ask her "how the hell do ya do that"... Gotta Fly... Mike in MN N381PM flht99reh(at)netzero.net wrote: > "Macreme'd them.." > > Damned it man, youre a man. What are you doing with macram. Now if you > were to say "the little woman" did that for you, we could all save face. But > a man macreme'ing! Well that would surely cause John Wayne to roll over in > his grave. Well I can tell you this much; you wouldn't find John H. (Col > Retired) talking about no Macram'. Now there's a real man for ya! HA, HA! > > But I have to agree, something need to be done about them dangling shoulder > harness straps. > > P.S. Mike, could you make me a set on the Q.T. for my Firstar? > > Please, please 'do not archive" !! > > > Ralph "the good one from Ohio" Hoover > Kolb Firestar KXP > > > > > -- Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6280#6280 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/seat_belt_macrame_002_122.jpg ________________________________ Message 46 ____________________________________ Time: 03:49:32 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" firebug wrote: > I am over it. Firebug, you come into the list and on your third day here post the meanest, nastiest post I have ever seen here.... And all you can say is I am over it.. That just shows what kind of a small man you are. Nothing short of a very public, and sincere apology would even begin to correct this. firebug wrote: > > TO JETPILOT: There are always a few like you on every board talking when you should shut up. You do not know what you are talking about. I would hate to fly anything you have built. Yes there are areas under the fabric where you put chafing tape. There are also areas on the surface you put it, sometimes it is refered to as surface tape. Its function on the surface is to keep the fabric from being rubbed through, chafed when it is struck at a high point on the airframe. He had NONE of this, that is a sign of a poorly built plane in my opinion. The high spots are going to be hit period. You put surface or chafing tape on the high spots to double the thickness of the fabric. LOOK at a factory built Cub if you don't believe me. You DO NOT rap chafing tape all the way around the frame of the rudder, horizontal stabilizer, elevator etc and THEN glue the fabric to the chafing tape. The fabric is glued to the structure of the rudder, elevator, horizintal stabilizer etc. He had chafi! > ng tape glued all the way around the perimeter of the tail feathers. Can you understand that do I need to draw you a picture? He also did the same thing to the rest of the airframe. What do you fly? I find it hard to believe it is a jet. > -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6281#6281 ________________________________ Message 47 ____________________________________ Time: 03:59:40 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Shoulder straps too loose From: "Mike Pierzina" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" Hi Guys, One other thing.....Each of the shoulder straps took about 15 min to tie the loom..... it used 14 ft of elec wire( each loom ), and it made aprox a 12" long loom... It is VERY SIMPLE to do.....It's a simple knot that is repeated over and over.... Gotta Fly... Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6282#6282 ________________________________ Message 48 ____________________________________ Time: 04:11:32 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" JetPilot: I suggest you go back and read your posts and maybe you will see why I was offended and deffended myself. When provoked I will strike back quickly. I make my living saving lives and have done so many times. Believe me I do have compassion but not when I am on the receiveing end of remarks such as yours. You meant nothing more but to degrade me with what you said. I am easy to get along with until someone makes remarks like yours. I am not the only one that thinks you meant to cut me by what you said on this forum. From what I have read most agree with me about that. I suggest you look at Jerb's post, the one dirrectly after your first one, he asked the same questions you did without trying to make me look like an idiot. If you have a habit of making degrading posts like the ones to me I am surprised mine is the worst one you have read. I promise everyone on this forum, if ya'll could have seen the cover job you would not have flown the plane. The rest of the build was fine, better than fine. As I stated earlier, I bought the plane over the internet without personally inspecting it. I will never do that again. It was 1200 miles from me and looked fine in the photos. Bad mistake. I WILL NOT POST AGAIN CONCERNING JETPILOT. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6283#6283 ________________________________ Message 49 ____________________________________ Time: 04:21:17 PM PST US From: "Chris Mallory" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Chris Mallory" JetPilot Stop it already, you are such a whiner. Please , you started all this. Be a man and let it go. do not archive .. ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 6:49 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > > firebug wrote: >> I am over it. > > Firebug, you come into the list and on your third day here post the > meanest, nastiest post I have ever seen here.... And all you can say is I > am over it.. That just shows what kind of a small man you are. > > Nothing short of a very public, and sincere apology would even begin to > correct this. > > > firebug wrote: >> >> TO JETPILOT: There are always a few like you on every board talking when >> you should shut up. You do not know what you are talking about. I would >> hate to fly anything you have built. Yes there are areas under the fabric >> where you put chafing tape. There are also areas on the surface you put >> it, sometimes it is refered to as surface tape. Its function on the >> surface is to keep the fabric from being rubbed through, chafed when it >> is struck at a high point on the airframe. He had NONE of this, that is a >> sign of a poorly built plane in my opinion. The high spots are going to >> be hit period. You put surface or chafing tape on the high spots to >> double the thickness of the fabric. LOOK at a factory built Cub if you >> don't believe me. You DO NOT rap chafing tape all the way around the >> frame of the rudder, horizontal stabilizer, elevator etc and THEN glue >> the fabric to the chafing tape. The fabric is glued to the structure of >> the rudder, elevator, horizintal stabilizer etc. He had cha! > fi! >> ng tape glued all the way around the perimeter of the tail feathers. Can >> you understand that do I need to draw you a picture? He also did the same >> thing to the rest of the airframe. What do you fly? I find it hard to >> believe it is a jet. >> > > > -------- > NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have > !!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6281#6281 > > > ________________________________ Message 50 ____________________________________ Time: 04:30:13 PM PST US From: "flykolb" Subject: Kolb-List: firebug, jetpilot --> Kolb-List message posted by: "flykolb" Jim said it best: Y'all; Don't y'all think it would be a good idea to drop this thread as it will lead to a no good end. I feel this ole horse has been whipped enough. Jim Hauck Enough already!! ________________________________ Message 51 ____________________________________ Time: 04:38:22 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Looking for a Firestar(off list) From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com wrote: > > Stop it already, you are such a whiner. > > When someone comes into the list and on their second day posts a nasty persontal attack as firebug did, that is totally wrong and uncalled for. The fact that you support this, and tell me to quietly take firebugs abuse, shows me that something seriously wrong with your judgement and thinking. The fact that you are now posting a personal attack tells me that you are in the same class as firebug. Totally uncalled for on both of your parts. -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6292#6292 ________________________________ Message 52 ____________________________________ Time: 04:51:37 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Starting new improved thread: Looking for a FireStar From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" This is an effort to get away from the last attempt to find a Firestar which went bad. I have had a response for a realy nice one in Maine but it is more than I can afford now unless I can sale my Raider kit. It is also rather far away. Let me know what you have or where one is at. Thanks in advance. Also, I do know that Kolbs are great aircraft after all I know John H. He lives not far from me. I have watched him fly many times. I also have attended Oshkosh and Sun N Fun about 5 or 6 times each. I have watched the factory pilot buzz around for countless hours. There were several in Wetumpka when I had my Challenger based there. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6295#6295 ________________________________ Message 53 ____________________________________ Time: 04:55:30 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: firebug, jetpilot From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" I am with you so I started a new and Improved thread trying to locate a FireStar. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6296#6296 ________________________________ Message 54 ____________________________________ Time: 05:15:50 PM PST US From: "flht99reh" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Shoulder straps too loose --> Kolb-List message posted by: "flht99reh" Mike, you take it (the raging) like a soldier. I really appreciate reading your stuff. But, I gotta tell ya: You do remind me a little bit like that "Monk" character on TV. I'll bet you could eat off your garage floor. Course I'd been know to eat off of anyone's floor, and way past the 5 second rule! HA, HA! So does this mean were friends and you marcema me a shoulder harness sleeve? The good Ralph from Ohio 1990 KXP -----Original Message----- From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Mike Pierzina Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 6:59 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Shoulder straps too loose --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" Hi Guys, One other thing.....Each of the shoulder straps took about 15 min to tie the loom..... it used 14 ft of elec wire( each loom ), and it made aprox a 12" long loom... It is VERY SIMPLE to do.....It's a simple knot that is repeated over and over.... Gotta Fly... Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6282#6282 ________________________________ Message 55 ____________________________________ Time: 05:56:41 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: firebug, jetpilot From: "JetPilot" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" firebug wrote: > I am with you so I started a new and Improved thread trying to locate a FireStar. On your second day here on this forum you have posted the worst and nastyest personal attacks I have ever seen on this forum... Yet you are to small a man to apologize for your actions. Your actions speak much louder than your words.... -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6316#6316 ________________________________ Message 56 ____________________________________ Time: 06:10:18 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Flying Pictures From: "R. Hankins" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "R. Hankins" I would like to see everyones favorite flying pictures from 2005. Taken from kolbs or of kolbs. We have some great photographers on the list. How about posting a few of your best from last year? If this works, here are a few of mine...... Roger in Oregon Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6318#6318 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/cloudshadow_362.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/rogueleaves_539.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/beachflightsl_187.jpg ________________________________ Message 57 ____________________________________ Time: 06:14:55 PM PST US From: "Dallas Shepherd" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: firebug, jetpilot --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Dallas Shepherd" You kids go to your rooms!! -------Original Message------- From: kolb-list@matronics.com Subject: Kolb-List: Re: firebug, jetpilot --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" firebug wrote: > I am with you so I started a new and Improved thread trying to locate a FireStar. On your second day here on this forum you have posted the worst and nastyest personal attacks I have ever seen on this forum... Yet you are to small a man to apologize for your actions. Your actions speak much louder than your words.... -------- NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=3D6316#6316 ________________________________ Message 58 ____________________________________ Time: 06:50:51 PM PST US From: "kfackler" Subject: Kolb-List: Great aviation movie --> Kolb-List message posted by: "kfackler" This is not strictly Kolb, but it's definitely about flying. The movie file is a bit over 5mb so depending on your connection speed it may take a minute. Crank up the sound and enjoy. http://www.staliteaviation.com/gtuf/bin/sky_diamond.wmv -Ken Fackler Kolb Mark II / A722KWF Rochester MI do not archive ________________________________ Message 59 ____________________________________ Time: 06:58:58 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Shoulder straps too loose From: "Mike Pierzina" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Mike Pierzina" Hi, The knots are so tight....When I started the first one....I broke the wire. So if it was made and you tried to "slip it on yours"....I don't think it could be done.....and if it was made "Bigger" it would look sloppy.... It's too late today, but I can take a few pictures, and show you the knot it's an extremely simple knot.......ya know how you cross your shoe laces before you make the bow........THAT'S THE KNOT....It's just reversed each time and it incorperates what your tying it to.... Then "YOU" can knitt.....I mean Macreme too ! Gotta Fly... Mike in MN PS The floors clean....but NOT that clean [quote! HA, HA! So does this mean were friends and you marcema me a shoulder harness sleeve? The good Ralph from Ohio 1990 KXP --[/quote] Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6334#6334 ________________________________ Message 60 ____________________________________ Time: 07:17:48 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Pictures From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" That looks great, maybe I'll be joining you in the sky soon! Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6338#6338 ________________________________ Message 61 ____________________________________ Time: 07:23:45 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Try Hang gliding it will help your flying skills From: "firebug" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" I went to Wallaby Ranch just outside Orlando Fl and got my hang gliding certification. It is great plus after you are towed up you are powerless. This has seemed to ease my concerns about engine outs. I have already had 2. I think that flying under the wing with no power makes you realize just what can be done without power. I do know that an ultralight will not perform as well as a hang glider but it still helps when it gets real quiet after the engine stops. If nothing else go up for a tandem flight with an instructor. I have also flown at Lookout Mountain Georgia. Great scenery. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6342#6342 ________________________________ Message 62 ____________________________________ Time: 07:28:26 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Great aviation movie From: "R. Hankins" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "R. Hankins" Wow! That is one big kite. I lost count at about 80 chutes. Very impressive show of precision teamwork. Too bad those guys only get to fly for 15 mins at a time. :) Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6343#6343 ________________________________ Message 63 ____________________________________ Time: 07:29:38 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Pictures From: "R. Hankins" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "R. Hankins" Come on up, the air is fine! Can't beat the view from a kolb. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6344#6344 ________________________________ Message 64 ____________________________________ Time: 07:58:49 PM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Pictures --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" I dunno, Roger - I tried to post a reply with pic attached, but nothing happened when I clicked on "submit." Or "preview" either, for alla that. Lar. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "R. Hankins" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 7:28 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Pictures > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "R. Hankins" > > Come on up, the air is fine! Can't beat the view from a kolb. > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6344#6344 > > > ________________________________ Message 65 ____________________________________ Time: 08:58:07 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Pictures From: "rlaird" --> Kolb-List message posted by: "rlaird" C'mon Larry... you can put a non-standard engine on a Kolb, you can figure this out! [Wink] -------- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Robert Laird MkIIIc/912ULS Houston, TX http://www.Texas-Flyer.com Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6366#6366 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/dad37_small_175.jpg ________________________________ Message 66 ____________________________________ Time: 09:55:22 PM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Pictures --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Yah, but that non-standard engine hasn't flown yet, and so far neither has this. Interesting..........at least 2 people have received my post about difficulties with the new format, but it didn't come thru to me. Hmmmm............discrimination ! ! ! I'll try it again in a minute, then phooey with it - bedtime. Manana is another day. Lar. Do not Archive. Larry Bourne Palm Springs, CA Building Kolb Mk III N78LB Vamoose www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "rlaird" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 8:57 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Pictures > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "rlaird" > > C'mon Larry... you can put a non-standard engine on a Kolb, you can figure > this out! [Wink] > > --------> Houston, TX ________________________________ Message 67 ____________________________________ Time: 10:03:23 PM PST US From: possums Subject: Kolb-List: Yearlings....oh well --> Kolb-List message posted by: possums Don't y'all think it would be a good idea to drop this thread Jim Hauck TO JETPILOT: There are always a few like you on every board talking when you should shut up. You do not know what you are talking about. I would hate to fly anything you have built. ----------------------------- --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" Thanks for your comment. Believe me the plane was not perfectly good. Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" firebug wrote: ----------------------------- I also have a skyraider kit for sale just needs to be covered has 100 hrs on the airframe and 503 DCDI with b box. I don't have the time to finish it. GREAT kit plane. Firebug, ----------------------------- Your response was very nasty and uncalled for. You advertised an uncovered kit in good shape for sale here. Im sure everyones natural question was "why was the covering ripped off ".... Telling someone to shut up for commenting and asking about it is way out of line and unacceptable conduct here. ----------------------------- What difference does it make if Firebug was advertising a Kolb or not ??? I could care less, he adviertised it here, so im more than happy to talk about it in this forum. ----------------------------- --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug Jetpilot: It not that you asked me why I took the fabric off that was wrong. It was the way you seem to enjoy saying that I needlessly ripped the covering off of a perfectly good airplane[it wasn't]. You repeated that "It turns out that the plane was properly built and the cover was torn off for nothing ----------------------------- The way Firebug verbally assaulted me in a very nasty way for questioning why he did that tells a lot about the kind of man he is. Given Firebugs response to a legitimate question about an airplane he is selling, I would never buy an airplane, or do any type of business with him ------------------------------ --> Kolb-List message posted by: "firebug" I am over it. firebug wrote: > I am over it. ------------------------------ Firebug, you come into the list and on your third day here post the meanest, nastiest post I have ever seen here.... And all you can say is I am over it.. That just shows what kind of a small man you are. Nothing short of a very public, and sincere apology would even begin to correct this ----------------------------- JetPilot: I suggest you go back and read your posts and maybe you will see why I was offended and deffended myself. When provoked I will strike back quickly. I make my living saving lives and have done so many times. Believe me I do have compassion but not when I am on the receiveing end of remarks such as yours. You meant nothing more but to degrade me with what you said. I am easy to get along with until someone makes remarks like yours. wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com wrote: ---------------------------- > Stop it already, you are such a whiner. When someone comes into the list and on their second day posts a nasty persontal attack as firebug did, that is totally wrong and uncalled for. The fact that you support this, and tell me to quietly take firebugs abuse, shows me that something seriously wrong with your judgement and thinking. The fact that you are now posting a personal attack tells me that you are in the same class as firebug. Totally uncalled for on both of your parts. ________________________________ Message 68 ____________________________________ Time: 10:25:02 PM PST US From: "Ed Chmielewski" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: firebug, jetpilot --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" "jetpilot', Please give it a rest, no one cares! I agree with others on the list that you repeatedly pointed out how the covering was taken off a 'perfectly good' airplane in a taunting manner, not 'asking a question' as you so lamely assert. You jumped to a wrong conclusion, now go get a beer and relax. Ed in JXN MkII/503 Please- Do not archive. ----- Original Message ----- From: "JetPilot" Sent: Monday, January 23, 2006 8:55 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: firebug, jetpilot > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" > > On your second day here on this forum you have posted the worst and > nastyest personal attacks I have ever seen on this forum... Yet you are > to small a man to apologize for your actions. Your actions speak much > louder than your words.... > > -------- > NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have > !!! > > > Read this topic online here: > > http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=6316#6316 > > >