Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:13 AM - Re: Kolb-List Digest: 40 Msgs - 02/28/06 (Ralph Hoover)
2. 06:01 AM - Fw: T-6's on the water (pat ladd)
3. 06:17 AM - Re: Re: Flying Naked (pat ladd)
4. 06:31 AM - Re: Re: Flying Naked (Robert Laird)
5. 10:01 AM - Re: Flying Naked (JetPilot)
6. 10:06 AM - Re: Kolb-List Digest: 40 Msgs - 02/28/06 (JetPilot)
7. 10:20 AM - Re: Re: Flying Naked (Chris Mallory)
8. 10:35 AM - Re: Re: Flying Naked (Ed Chmielewski)
9. 11:05 AM - Re: Flying Naked (JetPilot)
10. 12:54 PM - Re: Re: Flying Naked (duncanmcbride@comcast.net)
11. 02:01 PM - Re: Re: Flying Naked (David Key)
12. 02:54 PM - To cut or not to cut? (John Murr)
13. 03:03 PM - Aileron and flap hinges (Icrashrc@aol.com)
14. 03:13 PM - Re: Aileron and flap hinges (John Hauck)
15. 03:24 PM - Re: Flying Naked (JetPilot)
16. 03:39 PM - Re: To cut or not to cut? (JetPilot)
17. 03:39 PM - Re: Aileron and flap hinges (Richard Pike)
18. 04:03 PM - Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? (Mike Pierzina)
19. 04:06 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (Frcole@aol.com)
20. 04:10 PM - Re: To cut or not to cut? (ray anderson)
21. 04:49 PM - Re: Aileron and flap hinges (duncan mcbride)
22. 04:52 PM - Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? (duncan mcbride)
23. 05:04 PM - Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? (David Lehman)
24. 05:09 PM - Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? (planecrazzzy)
25. 05:17 PM - Re: To cut or not to cut? (flht99reh)
26. 05:17 PM - Re: Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? (duncan mcbride)
27. 05:25 PM - Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? (planecrazzzy)
28. 05:32 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (Ed Chmielewski)
29. 06:15 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (David Lehman)
30. 06:15 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (Frcole@aol.com)
31. 06:47 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (John Murr)
32. 07:41 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (John Hauck)
33. 08:47 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (possums)
34. 08:56 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (David Lehman)
35. 09:23 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (Denny Rowe)
36. 10:13 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (Ed Chmielewski)
37. 10:15 PM - Re: Re: To cut or not to cut? (Ed Chmielewski)
38. 10:47 PM - Original Firestar Gross Weight limit (John Murr)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 40 Msgs - 02/28/06 |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph Hoover" <flht99reh@netzero.com>
Here comes a can of worms!!!
Vic, please don't take this as disrespect for your stand (if we didnt have opposing
views, we wouldnt have balance). However, yesterday as I was walking down
the street a guy on the other side of the street waved and said hello. I wondered
what he really meant by that.
We get so sue crazy; paranoia, law book (do you know the eight most popular shows
on TV now are based on cops, killing and coroner role playing) and we have
this new found interest about ratting on our neighbors and cameras on stop lights.
I personally believe in the end times there will be only cops, lawyers and
insurance agents alive. They will be so busy shooting, suing and insuring against
life limb and property to know that its the end times! That would be as
close to hell as I could picture. And I have some very good friends in the SWAT
departments around Ohio. Also used to like my insurance agent, never found
a lawyer (have one across the street) I could really relate too (but we all have
a calling and need to make a living). Actually I was seriously considering
starting a TV series That some how combines: Trading Spaces with Trading Faces,
What's my line, C.O.P.S., Law and Order and WWW Stomp with This old house, Who's
your momma and Queer eyes for streight guys. It's bound to appeal to everyone.
I jsut don't have a way to tie them all together that would hold the audiance.
If the system had its way: we would we would all wear ankle bracelets monitoring
our whereabouts 24/7 and you would really wonder in the future; what did that
guy really mean when he said hello. I have a considerable amount of Auto insurance,
Home insurance and when I had the bikes more that the cagers (car people)
had just for that concern. Now because of all this outpouring of money I dont
have the monies to enjoy the other things in life like I should. There comes
a time in life where a man has to say enough is enough! (guess thats the John
Wayne, Sylvester Salon ((pun intended) in me)). I know that regardless of the
response to this post, most know exactly what Im saying. Its frustration with
the greedy system, and the likes of individuals that would take advantage of
it. My wifes and my health insurance is over eight grand a year, plus co-pays
etc.! Enough!
Insurance in its own right was and is good. Its the continued need to cover more
and more against more and more problems. I would rather fly out in the areas
noted to be farm land, not (even as FAR 103 states) over crowded areas of populist.
And I know that even over farm land, I could run into a prize bull (not
to worry, my plane isnt red), and as such pay the consequences. I guess I am
prepared to do that if necessary. Has anyone looked into a Bond? Not James! We
are a dying breed of freedoms and rights and the wolrd see us as a giant lolipop,
there for the sucking! I don't see my 5 gallion gas tank mounted on my 75
mile per hour Klob as a threat to a neighborhood, refinery or school bus, And
If affordable, I probably would carry insurance, but not for the sake of the
hoops that one has to jump through.
Now I feel better!
Underinsured, ill equipped, over governed and watching my back Ralph of Ohio!
I just looked down at the button to send...It says 'SUBMIT" makes me shake with
fear even to send this.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19078#19078
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Fw: T-6's on the water |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
----- Original Message -----
From: Sent: Wednesday, March 01, 2006 10:10 AM
Subject: Fw: T-6's on the water
Seaplane ratings not needed...(apparently) CMJ
Hi there,
I thought the list might be interested in this.
Do not try this at home.
Cheers
Pat
.................................................
Pilots Hone Their Skills For Upcoming Airshow Season.
Photography by Frans Dely/Aviationdimension.com
Early morning anglers are treated to the spectacle of four T6 Harvard Aircraft
from The Flying Lions Aerobatic Team waterskiing across the Klipdrift Dam
near Johannesburg South Africa.
Lead by Scully Levin, with wingman Arnie Meneghelli, Stewart Lithgow and
Ellis Levin, this renown airshow display team rehearse a sequence for the newly
launched "Aviation Action" television program on Supersport. Arnie Meneghelli
from Academy Brushware, owner of the aircraft had this to say, "What we did
today I believe is a world first. It illustrates that South African airshow pilots
are amongst the best in the world".
This unusual act, approved by the South African Civil Aviation Authority
(CAA), and supported by Castrol Aviation, was meticulously planned and took
place under the watchful eye of divers and paramedics that were on site.
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
ou become a much, much tinier target, >>
Hi Robert,
you may be a tiny target for them but if they hit you for your bank account,
house,car you will feel like a big target. Not forgetting my main point. In
what sort of a state are you going to leave the family of the guy you
killed?. Although lawyers do very nicely thank you, remember that it is the
victim who is sueing you not the lawyer.
I agree with John Hauk. If it is a choice between hull insurance and
liability protection, ditch the hull insurance. Your top monetary loss is
the cost of the plane. Damage to third parties has no limit.
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
--
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Robert Laird" <rlaird@cavediver.com>
I'm not saying I agreed with that philosophy, but I do think it has _some_
merit. If you don't have insurance, and you don't have a lot of assets,
then they will have a lot of trouble finding a lawyer to sue you. The cost
of the lawyers fees could easily stretch beyond the total sum of the assets
you do have. That would mean the person suing would get nothing, and the
lawyer is also likely to come up short... so, what lawyer would touch it?
Again, I'm not saying I agree with it, but in a outside-the-box thinking
kind of way, it makes sense.
-- Robert
do not archive
On 3/2/06, pat ladd <pj.ladd@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
>
> ou become a much, much tinier target, >>
>
> Hi Robert,
> you may be a tiny target for them but if they hit you for your bank
> account,
> house,car you will feel like a big target. Not forgetting my main point.
> In
> what sort of a state are you going to leave the family of the guy you
> killed?. Although lawyers do very nicely thank you, remember that it is
> the
> victim who is sueing you not the lawyer.
>
> I agree with John Hauk. If it is a choice between hull insurance and
> liability protection, ditch the hull insurance. Your top monetary loss is
> the cost of the plane. Damage to third parties has no limit.
>
> Cheers
>
> Pat
>
> do not archive
>
>
> --
>
>
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com wrote:
>
>
> In what sort of a state are you going to leave the family of the guy you
> killed?. Although lawyers do very nicely thank you, remember that it is the
> victim who is sueing you not the lawyer.
>
>
If a guy gets into an ultralight or experimental airplane, then he is accepting
the risk... That is between him and his family, not my responsibility.
What usually happens is not justice, something fails or some mechanical failure,
and the family sues you for something that was not your fault. People are greedy
, lawyers are also in it up to thier eyeballs also, they get 33 % and dont
care about right and wrong,they just go after who they can extort money from.
Its not a matter of justice, its usually a matter of who you can demand money
from.
What was a system set up with good intentions has been misused and corrupted into
something that takes our freedoms and hurts us all more than people realize.
Do you realize how much of the price of everything you buy is covering liability
insurance. Lawyers and a few people are getting rich at the expense of
everyone eles. That is not justice, and its not right.
Michael A. Bigelow
--------
NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19132#19132
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb-List Digest: 40 Msgs - 02/28/06 |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
vicw(at)vcn.com wrote:
>
>
> When and individual takes up a avocation such as ultralight flying which
> could possibly cause harm to another individual then I believe that person
> has a responsibility to have insurance. Of course if you have unlimited
> assets and can just write a check for any injury or property damage you
> cause, then insurance is optional for you.
>
>
Did you think before you wrote this ? You are far more likely to hurt someone
playing football, baseball, soccor, etc. then ever hurting a bystander with an
ultralight. So using your logic, dont participate in any sports without insurance...
Dont ride a bicycle either without liability insurance, because you
could run into someone on the sidewalk. Riding a bike in a city is far more likely
to hurt someone else than flying your ultralight.
Your post is just typical of someone that gets all worked up about anything differnet
and exciting, while ignoring risks that are far bigger, but not "attention
getters". Typical of emotional but not to bright people....
--------
NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19137#19137
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Chris Mallory" <wcm@tampabay.rr.com>
He is referring to the innocent guy on the ground that you kill with your
plane not the pilot of the plane.
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 12:57 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Naked
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
>
>
> pj.ladd(at)btinternet.com wrote:
>>
>>
>> In what sort of a state are you going to leave the family of the guy you
>> killed?. Although lawyers do very nicely thank you, remember that it is
>> the
>> victim who is sueing you not the lawyer.
>>
>>
>
>
> If a guy gets into an ultralight or experimental airplane, then he is
> accepting the risk... That is between him and his family, not my
> responsibility.
>
> What usually happens is not justice, something fails or some mechanical
> failure, and the family sues you for something that was not your fault.
> People are greedy , lawyers are also in it up to thier eyeballs also, they
> get 33 % and dont care about right and wrong,they just go after who they
> can extort money from. Its not a matter of justice, its usually a matter
> of who you can demand money from.
>
> What was a system set up with good intentions has been misused and
> corrupted into something that takes our freedoms and hurts us all more
> than people realize. Do you realize how much of the price of everything
> you buy is covering liability insurance. Lawyers and a few people are
> getting rich at the expense of everyone eles. That is not justice, and
> its not right.
>
> Michael A. Bigelow
>
> --------
> NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have
> !!!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19132#19132
>
>
>
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Hi Mike,
If one does some research, one may find that the high cost of
insurance is due more to the poor investments of the insurance companies
(read 'greed') over the last 10-15 years as opposed to the trial judgements.
The insurance industry in the States is headed for meltdown, much as the S&L
scandal in the '80's. As in that case, the consumer - or taxpayer - will
foot the bill because Washington can pass it on to the taxpayer with no
repercussions. What about corporate responsibility? They pass the costs of
their mistakes onto you and me because the laws are changed to allow it.
Have you written your Federal and State representatives of your
concerns? Might be more productive than repeated posts on an ultralight
chat board. Just MHO.
Ed in JXN
MkII/503
Do not archive.
Oh, while we're at it,it's "their".
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 12:57 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Flying Naked
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
>
(Snip) People are greedy , lawyers are also in it up to thier eyeballs
also, they get 33 % and dont care about right and wrong,they just go after
who they can extort money from. Its not a matter of justice, its usually a
matter of who you can demand money from.
> What was a system set up with good intentions has been misused and
> corrupted into something that takes our freedoms and hurts us all more
> than people realize. Do you realize how much of the price of everything
> you buy is covering liability insurance. Lawyers and a few people are
> getting rich at the expense of everyone eles.
> Michael A. Bigelow
>
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com wrote:
> He is referring to the innocent guy on the ground that you kill with your
> plane not the pilot of the plane.
>
You are more likely to kill someone else playing a game of football, baseball,
or even by riding your bike down a city sidewalk than hitting someone with your
ultralight....
Would you insist on having insurance before you even get on a bicycle or play a
sport ? That is just not the way I like to live....
Michael A. Bigelow
--------
NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19148#19148
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: duncanmcbride@comcast.net
First, when you play football or baseball, all the other players have made the
decision to come out on the field and take their chances. The folks on the ground
below you don't have that choice. Second, you insure against the possible
damage you may inflict, on persons or property. You want to be able to take
responsibility for your actions, right? So if you lose the engine and have to
put the plane down in a parking lot, it would be nice to have the money to get
everybody's car repaired. I think I have enough in the bank to pay for any
damage I may do with my bicycle, and I'm careful not to run into people. I think
I'm being responsible to my wife and kids by not risking our financial future
on an accident I may have in the plane, by having liability insurance. And
a good neighbor to those whose property I fly over.
Reckless and irresponsible behaviour in the name of freedom and liberty? That
sounds more emotional than bright, to me. But that's just my opinion, worth what
you paid for it.
McBride
319DM, Mark III, Rotax 912, flying once again(!)
Do not archive, for pete's sake
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot"
>
>
> wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com wrote:
> > He is referring to the innocent guy on the ground that you kill with your
> > plane not the pilot of the plane.
> >
>
>
> You are more likely to kill someone else playing a game of football, baseball,
> or even by riding your bike down a city sidewalk than hitting someone with your
> ultralight....
>
> Would you insist on having insurance before you even get on a bicycle or play
a
> sport ? That is just not the way I like to live....
>
>
> Michael A. Bigelow
>
> --------
> NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
>
>
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19148#19148
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
First, when you play football or baseball, all the other players have made the
decision to come out on the field and take their chances. The folks on the ground
below you don't have that choice. Second, you insure against the possible
damage you may inflict, on persons or property. You want to be able to take responsibility
for your actions, right? So if you lose the engine and have to put
the plane down in a parking lot, it would be nice to have the money to get everybody's
car repaired. I think I have enough in the bank to pay for any damage
I may do with my bicycle, and I'm careful not to run into people. I think I'm
being responsible to my wife and kids by not risking our financial future on
an accident I may have in the plane, by having liability insurance. And a good
neighbor to those whose property I fly over.
Reckless and irresponsible behaviour in the name of freedom and liberty? That sounds
more emotional than bright, to me. But that's just my opinion, worth what
you paid for it.
McBride
319DM, Mark III, Rotax 912, flying once again(!)
Do not archive, for pete's sake
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "JetPilot" orcabonita@hotmail.com
-- Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <ORCABONITA@HOTMAIL.COM>
wcm(at)tampabay.rr.com wrote:
He is referring to the innocent guy on the ground that you kill with your
plane not the pilot of the plane.
You are more likely to kill someone else playing a game of football, baseball,
or even by riding your bike down a city sidewalk than hitting someone with your
ultralight....
Would you insist on having insurance before you even get on a bicycle or play
a
sport ? That is just not the way I like to live....
Michael A. Bigelow
--------
NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast
as you could have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19148#19148
======================================
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "David Key" <dhkey@msn.com>
just a story...
My uncle is a doctor, he doesn't carry malpratice insurance and he doesn't
show many assets, he never gets sued. Soon as the attorneys find out he
doesn't have insurance they find another doctor.
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Murr" <jdm@wideworld.net>
I have an original Firestar TTAF 905 hrs. It's fat 388 lbs. as am I 215 lbs. It
is the 5 rib wing sporting a 503 on top. I've had the plane for 40 hours of
it's flight time. I don't know about how it was flown in the past except an entry
in the logbook that states "did first loop today".
I fly conservatively but as someone mentioned, you never know when you are going
to hit turbulence. Last summer I banged my head on the canopy a few times and
other times it felt like the bottom had fallen out followed by an abrupt stop.
Other times I had been doing something else GPS, radio, etc and when I looked
up I was going 80 and once I know I saw 90. So, no matter how gentle we try
to fly there are going to be times when the plane gets stressed.
My question is should I strip the covering off the wing and brace the leading edge
and perform a full inspection or should I continue to fly and not worry about
it?
The condition of the covering and plane is very good. Looks like this plane has
been taken care of at least as far as appearances go. But is this an accident
waiting to happen? What would you do? Thanks!
John Murr
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Aileron and flap hinges |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Icrashrc@aol.com
I'm building a Mark III Xtra, but with the separate flaps and ailerons like
the Classic. On the plans it clearly shows the hinges interfering with the ribs
on the flaps and ailerons. Funny thing is that's exactly how the wing builds
too! The only options I see are:
1. Notch the hinges around the ribs, leaving enough room for the fabric to
pull back down to the LE from the 'Homer bump.' This would seem to be a large
chunk of hinge missing.
2. Make the individual hinges 7 inches long instead of 14" and lay them
between the ribs like the Firefly is. This would leave just as much hinge as the
plans call for but in 6 pieces instead of 3.
3. Drop the barrel of the hinge down inside the gap far enough to keep the
ribs and hinges from interfering. Doing it like this would not allow the pivot
point on the root rib to line up with the pivot point of the piano hinge. Also
I don't know if it would limit surface travel enough to interfere with folding
the wings.
I'm leaning toward option 2 because of the obvious problems with the other
two options. If anyone wants to share how they worked around this problem please
feel free to do so! Thanks,
Scott
do not archive
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron and flap hinges |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
fabric to
| pull back down to the LE from the 'Homer bump.' This would seem to
be a large
| chunk of hinge missing.
|
| Scott
Scott:
I took option #1 back in 1991 when I built my MKIII. Back then it was
a MKIII. Now it is a MKIIIc. Ain't that classy! Don't know why Kolb
did not name the Xtra the MKIV. Would have simplified the process of
ID. ;-)
john h
Message 15
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Flying Naked |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Duncan McBride wrote:
>
>
> I think I have enough in the bank to pay for any damage I may do with my bicycle,
and I'm careful not to run into people. I think I'm being responsible to
my wife and kids by not risking our financial future on an accident I may have
in the plane, by having liability insurance. And a good neighbor to those whose
property I fly over.
>
> Reckless and irresponsible behaviour in the name of freedom and liberty? That
sounds more emotional than bright, to me. But that's just my opinion, worth
what you paid for it.
>
> McBride
> 319DM, Mark III, Rotax 912, flying once again(!)
>
>
Here are the FACTS from New York City ALONE:
Pedestrians Killed by Bicyclists: 1 annually
Pedestrians Struck by Bicyclists: 500 annually
Given these stats from ONE city, that would make a number of pedistrians killed
and a huge number of pedestrians injured by bicycles each year.
Now how many bystanders are hurt and killed by ultralights each year ???
The FACTS do not do much to support your "beleifs" do they ???
--------
NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19199#19199
Message 16
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
That is a LOT of hours on that plane JDM... I have no idea what to say about that
one. If you are good at covering and building, and you could easily do the
job, I personally would take the time to get in the wing and do it, especially
given the history of someone doing loops in that plane.
If you do not have the ability and shop to do that type of work that makes the
choice much harder. I just dont know Maybe someone here with more experience
than I will help you out there.
One thing I definately would recommend is getting a BRS (ballistic chute). That
gives you a really good backup and can save your life if the worst does happen.
Best of luck with that one, I really hope someone can give you some better advice
than I can on this.
Michael A. Bigelow
--------
NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19206#19206
Message 17
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron and flap hinges |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org>
I would go with option one. That is how I did my MKIII Classic.
If you want a bit of extra beef for the hinges, you can easily add a
bunch of strength by adding an extra (non-piano) hinge out at the tip,
as I did on mine.
http://www.bcchapel.org/pages/0003/pg8.htm
And that hinge must be absorbing some load, after ten years, it is time
to replace the AN-3 bolt in that hinge, it is getting worn!
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
Icrashrc@aol.com wrote:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: Icrashrc@aol.com
>
> I'm building a Mark III Xtra, but with the separate flaps and ailerons like
> the Classic. On the plans it clearly shows the hinges interfering with the ribs
> on the flaps and ailerons. Funny thing is that's exactly how the wing builds
> too! The only options I see are:
>
> 1. Notch the hinges around the ribs, leaving enough room for the fabric to
> pull back down to the LE from the 'Homer bump.' This would seem to be a large
> chunk of hinge missing.
>
Message 18
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Mike Pierzina <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
Hey Guys,
I'm trying to "re"find some info that I had,..... It gave some
guide line on what to write in my log book ,stating that the "annual Inspection"
has been done...
The checklist for doing the inspection is in "AC NO: 90-89A"
Maybe I need to call my Airworthiness Inspector.....He explained it....But
that was awhile ago...
Gotta Fly...
Mike in MN N381PM
w/Repairmans Cert.
Do not archive
Firestar I&II Forum
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Kolb_Firestar/
My Web Site:
http://www.geocities.com/planecrazzzy/Planecrazzzy.html
Sometimes you just have to take the leap and build your wings on the way down...
---------------------------------
Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze.
Message 19
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Frcole@aol.com
5 Ribs vs 7 !. The weight of that Firestar is just about what my Firestar 11
is. The 7 rib vs 5 uses the same primary structure in that the spar will take
the bending moment. The problem is distributing the air load thru the fabric
into the ribs and then into the spar. I think the probable failure would be
pulling the fabric from the rib caps and not folding the wing. Its still a
terminal failure though, best solution would be to rebuild the wing with more ribs.
Dick C
Message 20
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: ray anderson <rsanoa@yahoo.com>
I guess I'm just an old fuddy duddy but my first line of defence, and insurance,
would be the installation of a BRS. A damaged plane in our catagorys can't do
much damage to anything on the ground descending under a chute.
Ray ... UltraStar
Tenn.
do not archive
John Murr <jdm@wideworld.net> wrote:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Murr"
I have an original Firestar TTAF 905 hrs. It's fat 388 lbs. as am I 215 lbs. It
is the 5 rib wing sporting a 503 on top. I've had the plane for 40 hours of it's
flight time. I don't know about how it was flown in the past except an entry
in the logbook that states "did first loop today".
I fly conservatively but as someone mentioned, you never know when you are going
to hit turbulence. Last summer I banged my head on the canopy a few times and
other times it felt like the bottom had fallen out followed by an abrupt stop.
Other times I had been doing something else GPS, radio, etc and when I looked
up I was going 80 and once I know I saw 90. So, no matter how gentle we try
to fly there are going to be times when the plane gets stressed.
My question is should I strip the covering off the wing and brace the leading edge
and perform a full inspection or should I continue to fly and not worry about
it?
The condition of the covering and plane is very good. Looks like this plane has
been taken care of at least as far as appearances go. But is this an accident
waiting to happen? What would you do? Thanks!
John Murr
---------------------------------
Bring photos to life! New PhotoMail makes sharing a breeze.
Message 21
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Aileron and flap hinges |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "duncan mcbride" <duncanmcbride@comcast.net>
I used option one, and I followed Richard's suggestion when I built my first
set of Mark IIIc wings. After the hangar doors fell on the wings and
smashed the leading edges and spares, Hurricane Charlie (
http://home.comcast.net/~duncanmcbride/Charley.htm , scroll down to
'after' ) proceeded to slam the plane back into the T-hangar, mashing on
the ailerons to where the linkages were bent and the control surfaces
ruined. The L-hinges were still securely fixed in place, even though the
trailing edge of the wing and the leading edge of the aileron were warped
like pretzels. Wish I had a picture. Whatever, put them on a few inches
from the tip, especially with the counterweights - it really makes a
difference
Duncan McBride
MKIII N319DM, deltamike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Pike" <richard@bcchapel.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 6:41 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Aileron and flap hinges
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org>
>
> I would go with option one. That is how I did my MKIII Classic.
> If you want a bit of extra beef for the hinges, you can easily add a
> bunch of strength by adding an extra (non-piano) hinge out at the tip,
> as I did on mine.
> http://www.bcchapel.org/pages/0003/pg8.htm
> And that hinge must be absorbing some load, after ten years, it is time
> to replace the AN-3 bolt in that hinge, it is getting worn!
>
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
>
Message 22
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "duncan mcbride" <duncanmcbride@comcast.net>
I certify that this aircraft has been inspected on January 16, 2006 in
accordance with the scope and detail of Appendix D of Part 43, and was found
to be in a condition for safe operation.
That's how mine reads. I signed it with my repairman cert number.
Duncan
319DM
Do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 7:01 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ?
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: Mike Pierzina <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
>
> Hey Guys,
> I'm trying to "re"find some info that I had,..... It gave
> some guide line on what to write in my log book ,stating that the "annual
> Inspection" has been done...
>
> The checklist for doing the inspection is in "AC NO: 90-89A"
>
> Maybe I need to call my Airworthiness Inspector.....He explained
> it....But that was awhile ago...
>
> Gotta Fly...
Message 23
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "David Lehman" <david@davidlehman.net>
The information is in the Operating Limitations attached to the
Airworthiness Certificate...
DVD
On 3/2/06, duncan mcbride <duncanmcbride@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "duncan mcbride" <
> duncanmcbride@comcast.net>
>
> I certify that this aircraft has been inspected on January 16, 2006 in
> accordance with the scope and detail of Appendix D of Part 43, and was
> found
> to be in a condition for safe operation.
>
> That's how mine reads. I signed it with my repairman cert number.
>
> Duncan
> 319DM
>
> Do not archive
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Pierzina" <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
> To: "List Kolb" <kolb-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 7:01 PM
> Subject: Kolb-List: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ?
>
>
> > --> Kolb-List message posted by: Mike Pierzina <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
> >
> > Hey Guys,
> > I'm trying to "re"find some info that I had,..... It
> gave
> > some guide line on what to write in my log book ,stating that the
> "annual
> > Inspection" has been done...
> >
> > The checklist for doing the inspection is in "AC NO: 90-89A"
> >
> > Maybe I need to call my Airworthiness Inspector.....He explained
> > it....But that was awhile ago...
> >
> > Gotta Fly...
>
>
--
=F4=BF=F4 "I started with nothing... And I still have most of it left!"...
Message 24
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "planecrazzzy" <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
Thanks for the reply Duncan,
In the Amateur-built aircraft Flight testing
handbook ( AC NO: 90-89A )
I was looking at the Annual Inspection list....it sez "appendix 1"
Where did you get Appendix D of Part 43....? ( I need to read it )
Thanks in advance...
Gotta Fly...
Mike in MN N381PM
Duncan McBride wrote:
> with the scope and detail of Appendix D of Part 43
>
> Duncan
> 319DM
>
--------
The more people I know....
The more I like MY DOG
.
.
.
.
.Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19245#19245
Message 25
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "flht99reh" <flht99reh@netzero.net>
John, I love your candidness. My Firstar is in the same weight category and
I weigh about 15 pounds more than you, as did my predecessor. But hitting
your head on the canopy, may I suggest tightening your seatbelt! Ha, HA! As
far as the feeling of the bottom falling out, I might suggest apiece of 3/8"
thick mild steel plate along the base of the frame. Of course the plane may
have difficulty getting off in less than 500 feet but when you hit the
ground you will make a dent in the earth that they will know you were there!
Ha! "Logbook entry of "first loop today". Now that one really scares me!
John Houck, have you ever done intentional loops? To answer your question, I
really don't know. I do know that it is a considerable amount of work. My
life in it? Yours hours flying it? You would be the best judge of your
values. How old is the plane? It might be time anyway. And I know I would be
a bit more comfortable knowing for sure what's under the rapping paper.
Ohio Ralph
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Murr
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 5:53 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: To cut or not to cut?
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Murr" <jdm@wideworld.net>
I have an original Firestar TTAF 905 hrs. It's fat 388 lbs. as am I 215
lbs. It is the 5 rib wing sporting a 503 on top. I've had the plane for 40
hours of it's flight time. I don't know about how it was flown in the past
except an entry in the logbook that states "did first loop today".
Message 26
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "duncan mcbride" <duncanmcbride@comcast.net>
http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgFAR.nsf/0/802c5e7fd617a350852566ab006bcc54!OpenDocument&ExpandSection=2
have to admit, I haven't read it in a while, but as David stated it's in
the operating limitations the DAR gave me after I passed the inspection.
Duncan, 319DM
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "planecrazzzy" <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 8:08 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ?
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "planecrazzzy" <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
>
> Thanks for the reply Duncan,
>
> In the Amateur-built aircraft
> Flight testing handbook ( AC NO: 90-89A )
> I was looking at the Annual Inspection list....it sez "appendix 1"
>
> Where did you get Appendix D of Part 43....? ( I need to read it )
>
> Thanks in advance...
>
> Gotta Fly...
> Mike in MN N381PM
>
>
> Duncan McBride wrote:
>> with the scope and detail of Appendix D of Part 43
>>
>> Duncan
>> 319DM
>>
>
>
> --------
> The more people I know....
> The more I like MY DOG
> .
> .
> .
> .
> .Do not archive
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19245#19245
>
>
>
Message 27
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Annual Inspection/ Log book entry ? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "planecrazzzy" <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
Thanks Dave,
I pulled out my" Operating limitations" stuff, and I found
it...
and as Duncan said....it sez appendix D to part 43...
Thanks Guys !
Gotta Fly...
Mike in MN
--------
The more people I know....
The more I like MY DOG
.
.
.
.
.Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19248#19248
Message 28
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Guys,
Seems to be too much 'TLAR' (that looks about right) engineering and
conjecture going on here. Homer built a very sturdy bird to start with!
All the chicken littles (with no design experience!) should perhaps refrain
from expounding on alterations. As pointed out in an earlier post, going
from a 5-rib to a 7-rib involves more than just sliding on a couple ribs - a
new spar would be in order. Where's the failure data that was mentioned
earlier, which started all this?
Ed in JXN
MkII/503
Do not archive.
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 6:38 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: To cut or not to cut?
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Maybe someone here with more experience than I will help you out there.
> Michael A. Bigelow
>
> --------
> NO FEAR - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have
> !!!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19206#19206
Message 29
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "David Lehman" <david@davidlehman.net>
Ed, I'm with you, where's the data?... This thread has actually got me a
little scared to go fly my new (to me) airplane...
I bought a Kolb for several reasons and one of the most important is the
reputed strength... I'm starting to get a little disenchanted with it and I
haven't even flown it yet...
If there are documented Firestar airframe failures, please, please guide me
to the reports... The life I save may be my own... If it's just hearsay,
please say so and I'll take it as such...
Thanx...
David
On 3/2/06, Ed Chmielewski <edchmiel@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com
> >
>
> Guys,
>
> Seems to be too much 'TLAR' (that looks about right) engineering
> and
> conjecture going on here. Homer built a very sturdy bird to start with!
> All the chicken littles (with no design experience!) should perhaps
> refrain
> from expounding on alterations. As pointed out in an earlier post, going
> from a 5-rib to a 7-rib involves more than just sliding on a couple ribs -
> a
> new spar would be in order. Where's the failure data that was mentioned
> earlier, which started all this?
>
> Ed in JXN
> MkII/503
> Do not archive.
>
>
--
=F4=BF=F4 "I started with nothing... And I still have most of it left!"...
Message 30
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Frcole@aol.com
Just a quick question, why a new spar ? A few extra holes, so long as they
are plugged at the old rib locations would make no difference. Did Homer change
the tube spar thickness?
DickC
Message 31
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Murr" <jdm@wideworld.net>
John Hauck knows of two. His and a friend of his. Perhaps her could expand
exactly what failed in each case and should we be worried?
>
> Ed, I'm with you, where's the data?... This thread has actually got me a
> little scared to go fly my new (to me) airplane...
>
> I bought a Kolb for several reasons and one of the most important is the
> reputed strength... I'm starting to get a little disenchanted with it and
> I
> haven't even flown it yet...
>
> If there are documented Firestar airframe failures, please, please guide
> me
> to the reports... The life I save may be my own... If it's just hearsay,
> please say so and I'll take it as such...
>
> Thanx...
>
>
Message 32
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
| --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Murr" <jdm@wideworld.net>
|
| John Hauck knows of two. His and a friend of his. Perhaps her
could expand
| exactly what failed in each case and should we be worried?
My accident is well documented in the Kolb List Archives. Do a search
in the Kolb Archives on "leading edge failure". Then scroll down to
around 4 March 2004. There are several posts reference wings there.
john h
Message 33
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: possums <possums@mindspring.com>
At 10:41 PM 3/2/2006, you wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
>| John Hauck knows of two. His and a friend of his. Perhaps her
>could expand
>| exactly what failed in each case and should we be worried?
>
>My accident is well documented in the Kolb List Archives. Do a search
>in the Kolb Archives on "leading edge failure". Then scroll down to
>around 4 March 2004. There are several posts reference wings there.
>
>john h
-----------------
>Yes, a gentleman by the name of Aubrey Radford, old Air America pilot
>from VN days installed spades on his original Firestar. Aubrey flew
>hard, very similar to John Hauck, back in those days. Two months
>after I pulled the wings off my original Firestar, Aubrey did the same
>thing with his Firestar. He got a full canopy, but the kevlar bridal
>seperated when it came into contact with the sharp edge of the engine
>mount. Unfortunately, it was his last flight. Those two events
>happened 15 years ago. Mine in March and Aubrey's in May. BTW My
>parachute worked.
He did have the spades on his plane, but later we cut down the ailerons and
archived the same or better results.
That's right about the crash - except Aubrey had a "Second Chance" chute
with a "nylon"
bridal that separated at about 100+ mph on an over loaded KXP going
straight down after doing several aerobic maneuvers - loops and
hammerheads - at an air show.
The front leading edge folded back as far as we could tell - the out of
column sort of thing.
I'm almost sure it was a 500lb max chute system. Aubrey was about 1/2 max
himself.
He hit so hard that the engine block was flattened. Not to be too graphic
..........................you know the rest. We've had two of these
so far - so
be careful out there you guys. Aubrey flew very hard.
Message 34
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "David Lehman" <david@davidlehman.net>
Damn!...
On 3/2/06, possums <possums@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: possums <possums@mindspring.com>
>
> At 10:41 PM 3/2/2006, you wrote:
> >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
> >| John Hauck knows of two. His and a friend of his. Perhaps her
> >could expand
> >| exactly what failed in each case and should we be worried?
> >
> >My accident is well documented in the Kolb List Archives. Do a search
> >in the Kolb Archives on "leading edge failure". Then scroll down to
> >around 4 March 2004. There are several posts reference wings there.
> >
> >john h
> -----------------
>
> >Yes, a gentleman by the name of Aubrey Radford, old Air America pilot
> >from VN days installed spades on his original Firestar. Aubrey flew
> >hard, very similar to John Hauck, back in those days. Two months
> >after I pulled the wings off my original Firestar, Aubrey did the same
> >thing with his Firestar. He got a full canopy, but the kevlar bridal
> >seperated when it came into contact with the sharp edge of the engine
> >mount. Unfortunately, it was his last flight. Those two events
> >happened 15 years ago. Mine in March and Aubrey's in May. BTW My
> >parachute worked.
> He did have the spades on his plane, but later we cut down the ailerons
> and
> archived the same or better results.
> That's right about the crash - except Aubrey had a "Second Chance" chute
> with a "nylon"
> bridal that separated at about 100+ mph on an over loaded KXP going
> straight down after doing several aerobic maneuvers - loops and
> hammerheads - at an air show.
> The front leading edge folded back as far as we could tell - the out of
> column sort of thing.
> I'm almost sure it was a 500lb max chute system. Aubrey was about 1/2 max
> himself.
> He hit so hard that the engine block was flattened. Not to be too graphic
> ..........................you know the rest. We've had two of these
> so far - so
> be careful out there you guys. Aubrey flew very hard.
do not archive
Message 35
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl@highstream.net>
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Lehman" <david@davidlehman.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 11:56 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: To cut or not to cut?
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "David Lehman" <david@davidlehman.net>
>
> Damn!...
>
Dave,
Remember, In both these cases the Firestars were flown way beyond there
stated limits for many many hours before the wings failed.
A five rib Firestar flown inside its limits will not fail in this way.
Additionally, any aircraft abused beyond its design limits time after time
will eventually break.
Relax about the number of ribs in your wing, operate your bird within its
gross weight envelope like you would operate a Cessna 152 (not the aerobat
one) and it will last several lifetimes.
Denny Rowe, Mk-3
Message 36
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Well said, Denny!
----- Original Message -----
From: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl@highstream.net>
Sent: Friday, March 03, 2006 12:21 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: To cut or not to cut?
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Denny Rowe" <rowedl@highstream.net>
>
> Dave,
> Remember, In both these cases the Firestars were flown way beyond there
> stated limits for many many hours before the wings failed.
> A five rib Firestar flown inside its limits will not fail in this way.
> Additionally, any aircraft abused beyond its design limits time after time
> will eventually break.
> Relax about the number of ribs in your wing, operate your bird within its
> gross weight envelope like you would operate a Cessna 152 (not the aerobat
> one) and it will last several lifetimes.
>
> Denny Rowe, Mk-3
Message 37
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: To cut or not to cut? |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
Hi Dick,
I suppose it's not required, but I'd always wonder about any holes
in the spar. If my bird had the fabric off and I felt the need to add the
ribs, the spar change would make me sleep better. But I'm no aerodynamic
engineer, either!
Ed in JXN
MkII/503
Do not archive.
----- Original Message -----
From: <Frcole@aol.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 9:14 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: To cut or not to cut?
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: Frcole@aol.com
>
> Just a quick question, why a new spar ? A few extra holes, so long as they
> are plugged at the old rib locations would make no difference. Did Homer
> change
> the tube spar thickness?
> DickC
>
Message 38
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Original Firestar Gross Weight limit |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Murr" <jdm@wideworld.net>
And what is the gross weight limit of the original Firestar?
>> Relax about the number of ribs in your wing, operate your bird within its
>> gross weight envelope like you would operate a Cessna 152 (not the
>> aerobat
>> one) and it will last several lifetimes.
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|