---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Tue 06/20/06: 18 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 05:22 AM - Re: Alcohol (Vic Peters) 2. 06:54 AM - First Flight (pat ladd) 3. 07:21 AM - Re: First Flight (John Hauck) 4. 07:24 AM - Re: First Flight (Terry) 5. 07:44 AM - Re: First Flight (robert bean) 6. 08:31 AM - Re: Alcohol (possums) 7. 12:35 PM - Re: Alcohol (Ron) 8. 04:53 PM - Re: First Flight (Larry Bourne) 9. 05:55 PM - Re: First Flight (Bob Dalton) 10. 07:36 PM - Re: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair (Gene Ledbetter) 11. 08:05 PM - Large Stab xtra (David Key) 12. 08:44 PM - Re: First Flight (Kirk Smith) 13. 08:46 PM - Re: Alcohol (Charlie England) 14. 08:47 PM - Re: Alcohol (FS2Kolb@aol.com) 15. 08:47 PM - Re: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair (John Hauck) 16. 09:24 PM - Re: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair (Eugene Zimmerman) 17. 09:39 PM - Re: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair (John Hauck) 18. 10:18 PM - Re: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair (R. Hankins) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 05:22:23 AM PST US From: "Vic Peters" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Alcohol --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Vic Peters" Bill Gates can afford to lose money, Brazil has sugarcane and plenty of forest to kill off ( kinda like our Buffalo) to grow more. It does cost nearly as much energy to make ethanol as you get out, unless ofcourse your susidiesed. (spell check not working) Why not put the research into a way to produce an unlimited polution free supply of Hydrogen more economicaly. And that Blimp your thinking of right now would have blown up with gasoline too. If it's good enough for the rest of the Universe it's good enough for us. Fuel for Kolbs related, ya think. do not archive Vic in Maine -- ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 06:54:19 AM PST US From: "pat ladd" Subject: Kolb-List: First Flight Hi All, I finally made it. Last week the final paperwork from the CAA arrived and on Wednesday Wendy d rove me to Doncaster where we spent the night. Thursday morning she dropped me at the airfield the dealer, Mike Moulai, op erates from and headed home. Mike gave me a half a dozen check flights and we played with the plane all day. Mainly trying to get the oil pressure up. In the evening I did a coupl e of circuits solo with no trouble. I haven`t flown a tail dragger for year s neither have I flown from concrete but experiencd no problem although my landings were a bit untidy. Friday morning around ten o clock having waited for the haze to clear I flew with Mike in the second seat navigating, near ly 200 miles to my home strip. Visibility improved as we headed south and t he the thermals began to kick in. I have a glider variometer fitted and we were getting steady 8/9 knot bumps. The Xtra rode it all very well and felt extremely steady. We refuelled at an airfield around halfway home and apart from trying to ta ke off with the brakes on I managed OK. The Jabiru performed faultlessly apart from the oil pressure, Nearing home we flew through the local MATZ, with permission, something I h ad never done being strictly non radio, which meant that we approached my s trip from the north, an entirley new perspective for me and I had trouble finding my own strip. The fact the the field had been cut for hay since I l ast saw it didn`t help either. It was a bit lumpy on the approach with a slight cross wind but around 55 m ph on the ASI and a full flap landing put us safely home around 12.50. Unfortunately my hangar is still full of Challenger so I had the experience of de rigging the Kolb for the first time, on my own. I shall do it bette r next time I thoroughly enjoyed my first extended flight in the Kolb. She was easy to fly, Although that flap lever is a pain. She has much more arrow stability than the Challenger and held her course, feet off the pedals, easily. Unfortunately we have had guests over the weekend and I have been unable to fly again and it looks as though it will be next weken now before the weat her clears up again. Thanks to everyone on the list for the knowledge they have contributed. Cheers Pat do not archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:21:14 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: First Flight --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" I thoroughly enjoyed my first extended flight in the Kolb. She was easy to fly, Although that flap lever is a pain. She has much more arrow stability than the Challenger and held her course, feet off the pedals, easily. Pat -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Patrick: Good for you. I know you are happy to finally get some air time in your new bird and have it home to its roost. Bet your oil pressure problem is the sender. We have problems on the 912's with oil pressure senders. Seems the vibration tends to shorten their lives and scrambles their brains. Take care, john h mkIII ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 07:24:09 AM PST US From: Terry Subject: Re: Kolb-List: First Flight --> Kolb-List message posted by: Terry pat ladd wrote: >Hi All, > >I finally made it. > >Last week the final paperwork from the CAA arrived and on Wednesday Wendy drove me to Doncaster where we spent the night. >Thursday morning she dropped me at the airfield the dealer, Mike Moulai, operates from and headed home. > >Mike gave me a half a dozen check flights and we played with the plane all day. Mainly trying to get the oil pressure up. In the evening I did a couple of circuits solo with no trouble. I haven`t flown a tail dragger for years neither have I flown from concrete but experiencd no problem although my landings were a bit untidy. Friday morning around ten o clock having waited for the haze to clear I flew with Mike in the second seat navigating, nearly 200 miles to my home strip. Visibility improved as we headed south and the the thermals began to kick in. I have a glider variometer fitted and we were getting steady 8/9 knot bumps. The Xtra rode it all very well and felt extremely steady. > >We refuelled at an airfield around halfway home and apart from trying to take off with the brakes on I managed OK. > >The Jabiru performed faultlessly apart from the oil pressure, > >Nearing home we flew through the local MATZ, with permission, something I had never done being strictly non radio, which meant that we approached my strip from the north, an entirley new perspective for me and I had trouble finding my own strip. The fact the the field had been cut for hay since I last saw it didn`t help either. > >It was a bit lumpy on the approach with a slight cross wind but around 55 mph on the ASI and a full flap landing put us safely home around 12.50. > >Unfortunately my hangar is still full of Challenger so I had the experience of de rigging the Kolb for the first time, on my own. I shall do it better next time > >I thoroughly enjoyed my first extended flight in the Kolb. She was easy to fly, Although that flap lever is a pain. She has much more arrow stability than the Challenger and held her course, feet off the pedals, easily. > >Unfortunately we have had guests over the weekend and I have been unable to fly again and it looks as though it will be next weken now before the weather clears up again. >Thanks to everyone on the list for the knowledge they have contributed. > >Cheers > >Pat > >do not archive > > Pat, Way to go!!!!! All the hard work has paid off for you. Enjoy!!!! Terry - FireFly #95 ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:44:21 AM PST US From: robert bean Subject: Re: Kolb-List: First Flight --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean > > I finally made it. > Cheers > > Pat > Pat, here's an attaboy from western New York state. fly safe. BB do not archive ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:31:16 AM PST US From: possums Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Alcohol --> Kolb-List message posted by: possums At 11:35 PM 6/19/2006, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ron" > >I heard it too. I somehow don't believe those boys are investing so heavily >into ethanol to loose money. From what I've heard Ethanol plants are >sprouting in Iowa overnight. The US imposes a 54-cent-per-gallon tariff on ethanol to discourage imports and protect domestic farmers. Simply put: Is this 54 cents justified at a time when prices are skyrocketing? http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/04/petrobras_and_m.html ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 12:35:14 PM PST US From: "Ron" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Alcohol --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ron" No I don't think it's the right thing to do. I think Ethanol production should be encouraged anywhere in the world. For one thing its bio friendly, for another if we really get bummed out we can always drink a bit of it. There is an inbuilt advantage in north America for Ethanol. You can't grow much in those far flung deserts. Ron Arizona ============================= -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of possums Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 8:29 AM --> Kolb-List message posted by: possums At 11:35 PM 6/19/2006, you wrote: >--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ron" > >I heard it too. I somehow don't believe those boys are investing so heavily >into ethanol to loose money. From what I've heard Ethanol plants are >sprouting in Iowa overnight. The US imposes a 54-cent-per-gallon tariff on ethanol to discourage imports and protect domestic farmers. Simply put: Is this 54 cents justified at a time when prices are skyrocketing? http://www.greencarcongress.com/2006/04/petrobras_and_m.html ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 04:53:42 PM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: First Flight --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Congratulations, Pat. That's the best news I've heard in a long time. Lar. Do not Archive. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 6:42 AM Hi All, I finally made it. Last week the final paperwork from the CAA arrived and on Wednesday Wendy drove me to Doncaster where we spent the night. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 05:55:22 PM PST US From: "Bob Dalton" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: First Flight Congrat's Pat! Bob D. Do not archive -----Original Message----- [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Larry Bourne Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 4:51 PM --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" Congratulations, Pat. That's the best news I've heard in a long time. Lar. Do not Archive. ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 6:42 AM Hi All, I finally made it. Last week the final paperwork from the CAA arrived and on Wednesday Wendy drove me to Doncaster where we spent the night. Attachment: http://www.matronics.com/enclosures/a0959c980566ddc22af4e1c771a0a246c4502fb3.gif ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 07:36:45 PM PST US From: "Gene Ledbetter" Subject: Kolb-List: Re: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Gene Ledbetter" Jack, I checked my Firefly Wing Swivel Joints today and after 328 hours can report that there is minimum wing movement. I have always used bolts for the swivel joint connections and although that may not be significant, it has allowed the joints to be tightened to the point that the bolts have never been loose to move or shake. Gene -------- Gene D. 2000 Firefly 330 Hours New 447 Brakes, Ivo Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=41905#41905 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 08:05:05 PM PST US From: "David Key" Subject: Kolb-List: Large Stab xtra --> Kolb-List message posted by: "David Key" I have a large stab xtra and wanted to know where to attach the guide wires on the tail. The directions I have say 18 inches from the outside edge of the h-stab. I'd like to know the measurment from another large stab xtra builder, I'm not sure my directions are for my stab. Also a measurement going down from the top of the trailing edge of the vertical stab would be helpfull. Thanks, David ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 08:44:04 PM PST US From: "Kirk Smith" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: First Flight --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Kirk Smith" Jolly good show old chap!!!! Hi All, I finally made it. Pat ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 08:46:02 PM PST US From: Charlie England Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Alcohol --> Kolb-List message posted by: Charlie England russ kinne wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: russ kinne > > Ron, all > I'v e been told it takes more energy to produce Ethanol than you get > out of it! -- > does anyone know?or have a comment? > > do nboit archgi9ve It *always* takes more energy to create a fuel than you get out of it. It's just that some forms had the energy put in there with no effort on our part. You're probably thinking of the debate over cost of ethanol from corn, & it might (or might not) be true. There are other sources that are much more efficient in energy production. Brazil uses sugar cane & they have declared themselves energy independent. Another source is called (I think) switch grass. If you really want to talk about cost, what do 2500 (& climbing) dead, 18,000 (& climbing) as-good-as-dead & before it's over, around $2trillion left for our kids & grand kids to pay, add to the cost of gas? Comment mode off :-) Charlie (He who spends the money, raises the taxes) ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 08:47:33 PM PST US From: FS2Kolb@aol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Alcohol --> Kolb-List message posted by: FS2Kolb@aol.com Once the big players get setup they will just give bribes (AKA political contributions) to our politicians so in turn they will make the use of ethanol mandatory and make the big players even richer. Do not archive In a message dated 6/19/2006 9:37:06 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, captainron1@cox.net writes: I heard it too. I somehow don't believe those boys are investing so heavily into ethanol to loose money. From what I've heard Ethanol plants are sprouting in Iowa overnight. I think even Bill Gates is investing in an Ethanol plant in California. There are some big players getting into that market. ADM and some others, those are serious folks who don't Kidd around when it comes to money. Brazil runs on Ethanol. Ron Arizona ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 08:47:39 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" mating hole ID's. | | I purchased some inexpensive Oilite flanged sleeve bushings from McMaster | Carr, drilled out the holes, inserted the bearings, and new slightly longer | pins and removed all the play from the swivel joints. Also, I bushed the | stud that passes through the cage clevis. I used a washer and two nested | "O" rings so that I could put the joint into compression but still let it | pivot. | | Jack B. Hart FF004 Jack: Looks like you have drastically deviated from Kolb plans and instructions on how to attach the wing fold universal joint and attachment to the cage. After more than 2,500 hours flight time, I have not had a requirement to change out the bolts in the wing fold universal joint, nor adjust the tension on the attachment hardware to the cage. These parts of my mkIII remain snug, safe, and secure. Don't believe bronze bushings are the remedy to your problem. Quite possibly, had you used bolts washer and nyloc nuts as prescribed by the plans and instructions, you would not have wear on your "clevis pins" and holes in the universal joints. Reference the attachment at the cage, two "O" rings are not going to keep that piece of hardware from moving on the ground and in flight, when the wings are loading and unloading. A combination of thick and thin AN washers will give you the appropriate snugness required at this point with castellated nut and cotter pin. If the bolts are snugged up tight after the wings are repositioned from storage to flight position, wear on these bolts and holes will certainly be discouraged. If I had to fold my airplane after each flying session, I would insure the bolts in the universal joints were loose during the flight prep process, snugging them up tight prior to flight. When time came to fold the airplane, a second or two to loosen these bolts prior to folding the wings. NOTE: Jack can configure his FF any way he wants to, as anyone else can do likewise. However, let it be noted that his procedure for taking slack out of the wing fold universal joint and wing attachment to the fuselage is certainly not a "normal, safe, recommended" method of maintenance. "Nuther NOTE: This is in no way a personal attack on Jack Hart. john h mkIII ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 09:24:16 PM PST US From: Eugene Zimmerman Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair --> Kolb-List message posted by: Eugene Zimmerman Huh ? What? Is the list funky, or are you shooting blanks? On Jun 19, 2006, at 2:03 PM, John Hauck wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" > > | After 200+ hours the FireFly rear wing spar swivel joints started > to sound > shim > result, > the pin > McMaster > longer > bushed the > nested > let it > eight of > about this > the > > ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 09:39:12 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" Eugene Zimmerman | | Huh ? What? Is the list funky, or are you shooting blanks? Shoot'n blanks............. john h PS: A msg I posted yesterday afternoon came strolling across my monitor late tonight. Always better the second time around. Maybe it was a shadow. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 10:18:06 PM PST US From: "R. Hankins" Subject: Kolb-List: Re: FireFly Wing Swivel Joint Repair --> Kolb-List message posted by: "R. Hankins" Jack: You are scaring me, Jack. In theory the pins are in pure shear loading. The shear load is not what will bite you. If the ears of the piece closest to the cage try to spread the clip on the pin will be sheared off and we may be reading unwelcome stories of your early demise. Another failure mode: the vibration that forced the repair in the first place may weaken the clip or safety ring as it rattles in the pin hole. Safety pins and rings are made in China more often then not these days, even when purchased from a reputable source. In my mind, a weight savings of less than an ounce doesn't justify the added risk. The bushings look nice, but those pins scare the puddin' out of me. Those are "Oh Sh-t" bolts you are playing with. -------- Roger in Oregon 1992 KXP 503 Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=41989#41989