Kolb-List Digest Archive

Fri 07/21/06


Total Messages Posted: 20



Today's Message Index:
----------------------
 
     1. 01:33 AM - Re: Re: First Airplane (Mike Schnabel)
     2. 01:40 AM - Re: Re: Hot morning in Arizona (pat ladd)
     3. 05:48 AM - Re: Re: Hot morning in Arizona (russ kinne)
     4. 06:11 AM - Re: Hot summer flight (Todd Fredricks)
     5. 09:46 AM - fuel tank piping (robert bean)
     6. 10:11 AM - Re: fuel tank piping (John Hauck)
     7. 11:51 AM - Re: Firefly W/ bigger tank (N27SB@AOL.COM)
     8. 12:01 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (robert bean)
     9. 12:22 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (APilot@webtv.net)
    10. 12:47 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (John Hauck)
    11. 12:48 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (Ed Chmielewski)
    12. 01:10 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (robert bean)
    13. 01:26 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (Cat36Fly@aol.com)
    14. 03:39 PM - Re: Hot summer flight (Ralph Hoover)
    15. 05:07 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (Roger Lee)
    16. 06:20 PM - Re: Re: fuel tank piping (Richard Pike)
    17. 07:22 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (Bill Vincent)
    18. 07:33 PM - Re: Sting Sport/Flite Des.CTSW (Bob Noyer)
    19. 07:40 PM - Re: fuel tank piping (John Hauck)
    20. 10:17 PM - Re: Sting Sport/Flite Des.CTSW (Roger Lee)
 
 
 


Message 1


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 01:33:26 AM PST US
    From: Mike Schnabel <tnfirestar2@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: First Airplane
    One of my more memorable flights was also in an AT-6 for an hour of aerobatics. What surprised me was how much of the actual aerobatic flight I was allowed to do, with the instructor walking me through each maneuver. My pilot/instructor Gina Moore is best known as the only female barnstorming pilot in America. She owns the business Warbirds SkyVenture based in Gallatin TN. HIGHLY recommended if you ever get the chance! http://www.warbirdskyventures.com To maintain Kolb connective, I plan on second round of taxiing practice this weekend, and since I will not be able to make OSH this year hope to arrange so flight time with a CFI here who trains for Sport Pilot. To everyone traveling to OSH this coming week, please have a great, SAFE time! Mike S Manchester TN Firestar 2 503 do not archive icrashrc <icrashrc@aol.com> wrote: --> Kolb-List message posted by: "icrashrc" Ken has already added this info but i thought i would post it here as well. The first time I left the ground was for 1 hour of aerobatic instruction in a T-6 Texan. The date was 8/18/1996. Attached is a pic of my final preflight briefing. -------- Scott do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=48938#48938 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/scott_t_6_web01_921.jpg ---------------------------------


    Message 2


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 01:40:36 AM PST US
    From: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
    Subject: Re: Hot morning in Arizona
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com> doesn'tmatter what time it is the Iditarod is ready to fly!!!!!!!!! >> Hi Craig, you know of course that a woman has won the Iditarod evry year since....... Cheers Pat do not archive --


    Message 3


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:48:07 AM PST US
    From: russ kinne <kinnepix@earthlink.net>
    Subject: Re: Hot morning in Arizona
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: russ kinne <kinnepix@earthlink.net> Haven't I read that VNE is below 110???? Please be careful! -- an in-flite breakup could spoil your whole day -- On Jul 20, 2006, at 8:55 PM, Craig Nelson wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Craig Nelson" > <Craig.Nelson@heraeus.com> > > WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!! John made the adjustments today and the without the X > it now flies 110mph @ 2800rpm!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks and it doesn't > matter what time it is the Iditarod is ready to fly!!!!!!!!! > Uncle craig > > -----Original Message----- > [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of John Hauck > Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 6:23 PM > > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> > > Can any one give suggestions > to > > Unk Craig/Gang: > > Maybe you are flying too early in the morning. Airplane hasn't had a > chance to wake up completely. > > Shoulda got a mkIII without the X. ;-) > > john h > mkIII > > DO NOT ARCHIVE > >


    Message 4


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:11:01 AM PST US
    From: Todd Fredricks <flyingfox@copper.net>
    Subject: Re: Hot summer flight
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: Todd Fredricks <flyingfox@copper.net> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Man, I wonder what the engine nacelle will do for speed and power settings. Todd On 7/21/06 12:28 AM, "Craig Nelson" <Craig.Nelson@heraeus.com> wrote: > <<DSC_0295.JPG>> Mr <<DSC_0289.JPG>> . <<DSC_0290.JPG>> fl > <<DSC_0291.JPG>> yi <<DSC_0293.JPG>> ng Fox(Todd) > No the cowling was not on. just took Johns suggestion and this morning > it was amazing the performance we saw. here are some pictures of Lt.Dan > removing the X and you can see Slick with the windex doing his job > making sure there is no X left on the mark 3 > uncle craig > do not archive---- but this information might be useful to any one with > a MK3 with an x on it ha ha > -- Todd Fredricks, DO Flying Fox Services Visit my Blog at www.flyingfoxhangar.blogspot.com Photos Located at http://www.flickr.com/photos/flyingfoxservices/


    Message 5


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 09:46:02 AM PST US
    From: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
    Subject: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net> MkIII (c&x) owners: I was looking at the TNK pdf drawings for fuel piping. I have a similar setup, with the plastic tanks, dip tubes, etc. Question, if anyone is using the parallel suction shown, how evenly are your tanks drawing down? Also, instead of creating the vent in the handle, I made use of the female threads already in most chemical tank caps and put in a small stainless barb fitting. Stick the vent tube on that with no clamp. When you unscrew the cap the tubing swivels on the fitting with no problem. -in addition the cap will stay attached to the tube and won't fall into an "unreachable zone". -BB BTW, I blow through the vent to check if mud daubers (dobbers to you southerners) have blocked it.


    Message 6


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 10:11:26 AM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> you | southerners) have blocked it. Wrong, Leroy: DABBERS................ We invented them. Do you need any more up there in the land of ice and snow? john h hauck's holler, alabama mkIII (2537.3) 912ULS (1191.4) PS: mkIII is ready to go to OSH with the exception of a few gals fuel and loading my gear. Looks like thunderstorms until I get north of Kentucky tomorrow. Normal weather for flight to OSH.


    Message 7


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 11:51:34 AM PST US
    From: N27SB@AOL.COM
    Subject: Re: Firefly W/ bigger tank
    Ed, FF#oo7 on floats comes in at the full max weight allowed for part 103. With the BRS it weighs over 320lbs. Bryan M is about 200lbs and says that the Firefly handles almost as good as a land plane version. I have never flown any other Firefly so I cant give a comparison. The Firefly really handles the extra weight. also keep in mind that the floats add a lot more drag. Steve


    Message 8


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:01:24 PM PST US
    From: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net> I stand corrected. Dobbers must be midwestern. First year I parked the Kolb up in the open front shed they filled every unused screw hole on the suzuki engine, plus the distributor vent. I covered the holes with silicone seal. Yesterday I squirted the beams overhead to cut down on the sawdust sprinkling on the wings. -BB do not archive BTW, a nice hard freeze sure cuts back on the bug population. Winters have been too warm recently :) On 21, Jul 2006, at 1:10 PM, John Hauck wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> > > | BTW, I blow through the vent to check if mud daubers (dobbers to > you > > > Wrong, Leroy: > > DABBERS................ > > We invented them. > > Do you need any more up there in the land of ice and snow? > > john h > hauck's holler, alabama > mkIII (2537.3) > 912ULS (1191.4) > > PS: mkIII is ready to go to OSH with the exception of a few gals fuel > and loading my gear. Looks like thunderstorms until I get north of > Kentucky tomorrow. Normal weather for flight to OSH. > >


    Message 9


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:22:25 PM PST US
    From: APilot@webtv.net
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: APilot@webtv.net Bob, I am using standard Kolb tanks on my Mk III and use two fuel valves located where the flap handle pivots. I have a fuel return valve selector and a fuel supply valve selector to feed my throttle body fuel injection system. This allows me to direct the return fuel to either tank. That way, when fuel amount becomes an issue, I can empty the port tank by directing it's fuel. via the return line, to the starboard tank. Now, I can easily see how much fuel I have left and fly the rest of the flight on the starboard tank.


    Message 10


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:47:23 PM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> Bob B/Gang: No sweat. Spring is a dangerous time in my old hanger. Those big carpenter bees can cut a 2X8 rafter in the blink of an eye. They keep my airplane covered with saw dust and bee crap. The crap is of the consistency of epoxy glue. I spend a lot of time with a squirt gun and bug spray knocking them out of the air in mid flight. They are so dumb they come right back to the same place so I can get'em again. However, they usually win the war, and I win a battle every once in a while. john h mkIII DO NOT ARCHIVE


    Message 11


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 12:48:12 PM PST US
    From: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" <edchmiel@mindspring.com> Bob, I almost hate to ask *what* you squirted on the beams. Ed in JXN (MI) MkII/503 ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, July 21, 2006 3:00 PM > --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net> > > Yesterday I squirted the beams overhead to cut down on the > sawdust sprinkling on the wings. > -BB do not archive


    Message 12


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 01:10:21 PM PST US
    From: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net> Since the list is mixed company we shall keep things polite: -besides, at 65+ my hydraulic pressure isn't what it yooster be. It was some kind of cheap water soluble poison in a squirt bottle from dollar general. Seems to work, at least temporary. No dust the next day. The bee crap John refers to is a tough, yellowish deposit. I clean it all off with generic windex and those nice soft blue paper shop towels. Too lazy to spread tarps on the wings every time and I pay the penalty. I did sight down the tail tube recently and no body was living or depositing in there. do not archive On 21, Jul 2006, at 3:47 PM, Ed Chmielewski wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ed Chmielewski" > <edchmiel@mindspring.com> > > Bob, > > I almost hate to ask *what* you squirted on the beams. > > Ed in JXN (MI) > MkII/503 > > > ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, July 21, 2006 3:00 PM > > >> --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net> > >> Yesterday I squirted the beams overhead to cut down on the >> sawdust sprinkling on the wings. > > >> -BB do not archive > > > http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List > http://wiki.matronics.com > >


    Message 13


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 01:26:46 PM PST US
    From: Cat36Fly@aol.com
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    I am using the parallel connection and the tanks even themselves out with use and/or with atmospheric changes. Fill one tank today and tomorrow you have two half tanks. I also have a fuel gauge sensing one tank but always go by flying time. I can push it to 2.5 hrs at 500-5500 RPM but look to put down at 2 hrs. (old habit). Have not experienced any problems with this arrangement in 45 hrs. Larry Tasker MKlllx/582


    Message 14


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 03:39:31 PM PST US
    From: "Ralph Hoover" <flht99reh@columbus.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: Hot summer flight
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Ralph Hoover" <flht99reh@Columbus.rr.com> Craig.Nelson, This is Doctor feelbetter. Your room is ready und, your co-heart Lt. Dan wvill be promoted in your room to Captain Dan. His room will be ready very soon. Please ignore the men in the white coats! "Mine fhur, I can valk...und sing, und play with my imiganiary friends vifth the green uniforms on. Hurry, Craig, Nelson, we have people that want to attend to your ever need! White coat wearing Ralph of Ohio, yah! Und brink your own brewmiester. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=49166#49166


    Message 15


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 05:07:50 PM PST US
    From: "Roger Lee" <ssadiver1@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Roger Lee" <ssadiver1@yahoo.com> Hi All, I have 780 hrs. on my Kolb Mark III. It has always had the standard parallel fuel tanks with a probe in the pilot side tank. It works very well. Drains equally. I also have a 6 gal. bladder tank for a total of 16 gals. It has its own fuel pump and pumps into the fuel line that comes out of the tanks going to the engine. It fills up the tanks in flight. When I get down to 4 gals. of fuel I flip the switch and in a couple of minutes I have a full tank that I can read the level on my fuel gauge. Roger Lee Tucson, Az p.s. I might be breaking ranks and buying a Flight Design CTSW. -------- Roger Lee Tucson, Az. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=49183#49183


    Message 16


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 06:20:45 PM PST US
    From: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: Richard Pike <richard@bcchapel.org> For that much money you could have a Sting Sport. Nicest airplane I ever flew. Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) do not archive Roger Lee wrote: > --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Roger Lee" <ssadiver1@yahoo.com> > <snip> > p.s. > I might be breaking ranks and buying a Flight Design CTSW. > > -------- > Roger Lee > Tucson, Az. > > >


    Message 17


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:22:13 PM PST US
    From: "Bill Vincent" <emailbill@chartermi.net>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Bill Vincent" <emailbill@chartermi.net> Hi Gang Putting tarps on the wings is well worth it to me; because the bats in my hangar seem to think that my plane is a bat'room :-) Bill Vincent FS II Upper Peninsula of Michigan Do Not Archive ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Friday, July 21, 2006 3:08 PM > --> Kolb-List message posted by: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net> > > Since the list is mixed company we shall keep things polite: > -besides, at 65+ my hydraulic pressure isn't what it yooster be. > > It was some kind of cheap water soluble poison in a squirt bottle > from dollar general. Seems to work, at least temporary. No dust > the next day. The bee crap John refers to is a tough, yellowish > deposit. I clean it all off with generic windex and those nice soft > blue paper shop towels. Too lazy to spread tarps on the wings > every time and I pay the penalty. > I did sight down the tail tube recently and no body was living or > depositing in there. > do not archive > Bob,


    Message 18


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:33:53 PM PST US
    From: Bob Noyer <a58r@verizon.net>
    Subject: Re: Sting Sport/Flite Des.CTSW
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: Bob Noyer <a58r@verizon.net> Sting Sport--$84k min FlightDesignCTSW--$90K +EFIS+Garmin+Xtra Radios Yas, thems the flyin ma-chines fer hoi polloi. {note lack of the definite article} regards, Bob N. http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/ do not archive


    Message 19


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 07:40:56 PM PST US
    From: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
    Subject: Re: fuel tank piping
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com> because the bats in my | hangar seem to think that my plane is a bat'room :-) | Bill Vincent Reckon that makes Bill V "batman". john h mkIII DO NOT ARCHIVE


    Message 20


  • INDEX
  • Back to Main INDEX
  • PREVIOUS
  • Skip to PREVIOUS Message
  • NEXT
  • Skip to NEXT Message
  • LIST
  • Reply to LIST Regarding this Message
  • SENDER
  • Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message
    Time: 10:17:30 PM PST US
    From: "Roger Lee" <ssadiver1@yahoo.com>
    Subject: Re: Sting Sport/Flite Des.CTSW
    --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Roger Lee" <ssadiver1@yahoo.com> Hi Bob, CTSW is a high wing which I like better. Plus very roomy cabin, easy access doors, much higher cruise, lower stall, more fuel (34 gal) and range (1000 + miles), 110 lbs. luggage, better visability, more storage, better glide ratio (14:1). Pitch and roll trim system. BRS chute and great instrument panel (Dynon D-100 and D-120). Approach at 50 mph and stall at 37 mph. It weighs less than the sting by 100 lbs. and has a higher useful load of 688 lbs. (Side note* my figures may be off a pound or two, but very close. I don't have their specs. side by side.) I'm already drooling. LOL KitPlane list it as the best selling lsa plane in the U.S. Delivery date is first of Dec. -------- Roger Lee Tucson, Az. Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=49237#49237




    Other Matronics Email List Services

  • Post A New Message
  •   kolb-list@matronics.com
  • UN/SUBSCRIBE
  •   http://www.matronics.com/subscription
  • List FAQ
  •   http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm
  • Full Archive Search Engine
  •   http://www.matronics.com/search
  • 7-Day List Browse
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list
  • Browse Kolb-List Digests
  •   http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list
  • Browse Other Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/browse
  • Live Online Chat!
  •   http://www.matronics.com/chat
  • Archive Downloading
  •   http://www.matronics.com/archives
  • Photo Share
  •   http://www.matronics.com/photoshare
  • Other Email Lists
  •   http://www.matronics.com/emaillists
  • Contributions
  •   http://www.matronics.com/contributions

    These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.

    -- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --