Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:28 AM - Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra (flyingfox)
2. 05:51 AM - MkIIIc vs MkIIIx (robert bean)
3. 10:26 AM - Re: Re: First solo yesterday (Eugene Zimmerman)
4. 11:23 AM - Re: Prop Effency (pat ladd)
5. 11:42 AM - Henry Voss 1st solo (Arksey@aol.com)
6. 12:00 PM - good service from Ivoprop company (Arksey@aol.com)
7. 12:03 PM - Re: Looking For A Plane To Trailer (Chris Wolf)
8. 12:32 PM - Re: Re: Looking For A Plane To Trailer (Chris Wolf)
9. 12:56 PM - Re: Re: First solo yesterday (John Hauck)
10. 01:00 PM - Re: good service from Ivoprop company (John Hauck)
11. 01:13 PM - Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra (Chris Wolf)
12. 02:15 PM - Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra (Todd Fredricks)
13. 03:27 PM - Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra (Bob Noyer)
14. 03:42 PM - Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra (Todd Fredricks)
15. 04:04 PM - Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra (John Hauck)
16. 04:46 PM - Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra (planecrazzzy)
17. 05:47 PM - Re:florida location.. (Arksey@aol.com)
18. 07:29 PM - Videos (possums)
19. 08:40 PM - Time for the cowling (Craig Nelson)
20. 09:03 PM - Re: First solo yesterday (jimhefner)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "flyingfox" <flyingfox@copper.net>
John H sent me a suggestion that I modify the airframe to suit my
purposes. I replied that I am not an aircraft structural engineer...
...however, it is widely known that John H did exactly that to his
own Classic, which was then just the Mark III. Frankly, I have always
thought that John's version looks better than the stock one.
The point to all that is this, for us genetic deviants, the Mark IIIX
is really the only way to go, unless you chop the front end off the
Classic ala Adriel Hasey.
I would recommend sling seats, as much for available backside width
over the molded products as weight savings. I sat in the slings in
London and the molded job at OSH. Slings are much better. I would
also consider talking to the London KY folks about the door
arrangement, the structural side. I have no idea how 'structural'
that door frame is, but if it could be modified to increase the
height of the upper cross member, it would be a great way to allow
big guys to get in.
The lower door sill is probably where it needs to be. Frankly it
serves to protect the throttle and other fragile bits and works well
ergonomically.
If the Mark IIIX is the airplane that I end up with, the panel layout
will change but even so, there is plenty of leg and foot room for my
size 13R gunboats. The center stick is probably also the best bet
over the dual control sticks. I had good control throw on the center
arrangement and it is a lot like Zenith's set up, which I find very
comfortable to use. Dual control sticks are not so good, because I
like to feel the stops when I move the stick... ...not my thigh.
Uncle Craig 'Milow' has done some really beautiful work with the
panel arrangement and there is plenty of space in the machine for
avionics and other instruments. The purists here will start choking
on that, especially when I tell them that I will have two comms and a
WAAS/LNAV IFR GPS in whatever I build, but that is only because I am
a passionate IFR pilot who likes to shoot approaches for fun, I am
gadget obscessed and I live in a hollar in Southeast Ohio where one
draw looks like the next. One airstrip sits on a ridge, the
other...the long one...down in a valley. On hazy VFR Ohio days it is
nice to know exactly where you are always.
The only other consideration from my perspective is storeability. I
ditched my 172 because I realized that I was spending the equivalent
of a Garmin 495 every year on hangars and my annual was enough to buy
a new navcom every two years and I was 45 minutes away and flew my
airplane no more than 20 hours a year. So off it went. I have a large
shop with 18 foot high garage doors but they are only 12 feet wide.
Whatever it is it needs to fold so I can use my shop for a hangar.
I cannot speak for Glastars, but I doubt that anyone has purposely
gone out and destroyed them in flight. Homer Kolb did that with his
design. An actual in-flight test to failure, so we know the absolute
structural limits of the design. That says it for me.
The AirCam wings can come off and be put back on in about 30 minutes.
Not nearly as convenient as the Kolb, but for low altitude with no
forced landing area flying, two engines will always trump one.
The bottom line is that you need to sit in some Kolbs, talk with the
London folks, they are all as nice as can be, and frankly consider
where you live. If you live in the flatlands, you don't need but one
engine because you always have lots of options. If you live in the
mountains or near the water, two engines becomes a consideration,
especially if you plan on doing a lot of low altitude flying.
It is a tough thing in the end because these machines tend to become
an extension of the pilot. You cannot look at John Williams Kolbra,
or Hauck's Mark III or Jeremy Lezin's Chiquita AirCam or Uncle
Craig's Xtra and not say, that is a unique machine and a reflection
of its owner. There is nothing 172-generic about experimentals.
So whatever you build/buy will become your baby and in the forums
everyone will say, Oh, Miss P'Fer, that's Hauck's airplane. It is
pretty cool actually. And much like your kids, it becomes a
crapshoot. You put your heart into the thing and in the end, it is
never perfect, but you love it and it is yours and it works for you.
Todd
DO NOT ARCHIVE
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| Subject: | MkIIIc vs MkIIIx |
Todd, with a very minor amount of welding to a slightly used MkIIIc
you can have a lot more foot room. I don't have huge feet but
don't like a claustrophobic footwell either. -and the frontal
area stays the same.
DSCN0736.JPG
DSCN0741.JPG
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: First solo yesterday |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Eugene Zimmerman <etzim62@earthlink.net>
Hey Jim,
You just gotta get Henry on this list.
Winter is coming and a there are still a coupla old geezers who can't
hanger fly as good as Henry can write.
Gene
On Oct 17, 2006, at 12:51 AM, jimhefner wrote:
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "jimhefner" <hefner_jim@msn.com>
>
> Henry Voris sent this in an email and asked me to post to the
> list... enjoy!
>
> --------
> Jim Hefner
> Kolbless in Tucson :(
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=68398#68398
>
>
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Prop Effency |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "pat ladd" <pj.ladd@btinternet.com>
<<
Hi Richard,
<< where it is a good climb prop or a good cruise prop. >>
I guess if that were not so there would be no market for variable pitch
props??
By the way `Nieuport` not Newport please.
Incidentally, while speaking French, I found out on holiday that `denim`
which America has made more or less its own through jeans and other working
and fashion clothes etc was in fact invented in France. Theres a bummer.
It is actually `de Nimes` after the town of Nimes.
Can`t actually tell you anything about Nimes, even if you wanted to know as
the nearest I got was the `Pont du Gard` just outside the town. This is a
tremendous Roman Aquaduct across a valley. It is awe inspiring. Three rows
of arches on top of each other engineered to be just enough out of level
for the water to flow. Built 2000 years ago and looks good for another 2000.
If you haven`t come across it before look it up on google. Amazing. I have
been trying to visit it for 20 years. The wait was well worthwhile.
Incidentally in a town just beyond Nimes I found an advert in my hotel for a
`bapteme de l`air` in an ultralight on floats.Phone call to try and organise
this only to find that the guy had finished his season the day before. Great
shame as it was a super evening, no wind and a calm sea flat as a table
top. I couldn`t talk him into it though. French!!!!
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
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| Subject: | Henry Voss 1st solo |
sure a good story about Henry's 1st solo....thanks for posting it Jim and
try and get more from him.
Jim Swan Firestar ll Michigan
do not archive
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| Subject: | good service from Ivoprop company |
Hello gang,
My firestar ll has a 3 blade ivo prop, I purchased a used enclosed
trailer that a fellow built for his firestar ll so that i could haul mine to
florida this winter, but when i tried to put my plane it it the 3 blade prop stuck
up to high. I intend to remove the prop and then reinstall it when I arrive
in Florida, but not knowing anything about the installation or pitch
adjustment I decided to contact Ivo before I screwed something up...I emailed
them
this morning and I received a phone call from Ron at the factory within a hour.
He explained to me what i needed to know and we had a nice visit, then as
soon as we got off the phone he emailed me and attached the info so I could
print it off and he is also going to mail me complete info...Now I was so
impressed with their quick and friendly service i just thought it was worth passing
on. Their is still some nice companies to do business with in this country.
Have enjoyed flying the firestar but weather a bit cold and rainy now.
Sure is a fun airplane.
jim swan firestar ll michigan
do not archive
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: Looking For A Plane To Trailer |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Chris Wolf <cwolf41@comcast.net>
On Mon, 16 Oct 2006 20:16:14 -0400, Richard Neilsen wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Richard & Martha Neilsen" <NeilsenRM@comcast.net>
>
>I have seen photos of a Kolb trailer where it is designed to kneel.
Such things really exist? Cool!
>There
>are also a few of us that have carts like you are talking about for holding
>the wings. I have a custom trailer with a cart that I'm building that I'm
>planning to pull with my Toyota mini van that I will share with you when it
>is finished.
I'd very much like to see the pictures when you're finished. Thanks!
Chris Wolf
cwolf41@comcast..net
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Looking For A Plane To Trailer |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Chris Wolf <cwolf41@comcast.net>
On Mon, 16 Oct 2006 16:33:49 -0700, Gene Ledbetter wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "Gene Ledbetter" <gdledbetter@aol.com>
>
>I've been fllying my firefly out of a trailer for 5 years and it is very
>easy to scrape the leading edge of the wings if the front of the trailer
>is not raised high enough. Ask me how I know.
I'll bet I can guess.
>I put 4 X 4s under the tongue jack to maximize the tongue lift and this has
>worked for me. You just need to be very careful the first time you load
>and unload to make sure you have clearance.
Good advice. Thanks!
Chris Wolf
cwolf41@comcast.net
Do Not Archive
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: First solo yesterday |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Gene Z:
You got that right.
Glad I did not have to be an observer for that solo flight. Don't
think my nerves would have stood it. ;-)
Take care,
john h
mkIII
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 10
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| Subject: | Re: good service from Ivoprop company |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
Jim S:
Where will you be located in Florida?
Started to send this bc, then decided there may be others on the List
that would like to know where Jim spends his winters.
john h
mkIII
DO NOT ARCHIVE
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| Subject: | Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Chris Wolf <cwolf41@comcast.net>
On Tue, 17 Oct 2006 11:27:43 -0000, Todd wrote:
>--> Kolb-List message posted by: "flyingfox" <flyingfox@copper.net>
>
>John H sent me a suggestion that I modify the airframe to suit my
>purposes. I replied that I am not an aircraft structural engineer...
>...however, it is widely known that John H did exactly that to his
>own Classic, which was then just the Mark III. Frankly, I have always
>thought that John's version looks better than the stock one.
>
>The point to all that is this, for us genetic deviants, the Mark IIIX
>is really the only way to go, unless you chop the front end off the
>Classic ala Adriel Hasey.
>
>I would recommend sling seats, as much for available backside width
>over the molded products as weight savings. I sat in the slings in
>London and the molded job at OSH. Slings are much better. I would
>also consider talking to the London KY folks about the door
>arrangement, the structural side. I have no idea how 'structural'
>that door frame is, but if it could be modified to increase the
>height of the upper cross member, it would be a great way to allow
>big guys to get in.
>
>The lower door sill is probably where it needs to be. Frankly it
>serves to protect the throttle and other fragile bits and works well
>ergonomically.
>
>If the Mark IIIX is the airplane that I end up with, the panel layout
>will change but even so, there is plenty of leg and foot room for my
>size 13R gunboats. The center stick is probably also the best bet
>over the dual control sticks. I had good control throw on the center
>arrangement and it is a lot like Zenith's set up, which I find very
>comfortable to use. Dual control sticks are not so good, because I
>like to feel the stops when I move the stick... ...not my thigh.
>
>Uncle Craig 'Milow' has done some really beautiful work with the
>panel arrangement and there is plenty of space in the machine for
>avionics and other instruments. The purists here will start choking
>on that, especially when I tell them that I will have two comms and a
>WAAS/LNAV IFR GPS in whatever I build, but that is only because I am
>a passionate IFR pilot who likes to shoot approaches for fun, I am
>gadget obscessed and I live in a hollar in Southeast Ohio where one
>draw looks like the next. One airstrip sits on a ridge, the
>other...the long one...down in a valley. On hazy VFR Ohio days it is
>nice to know exactly where you are always.
>
>The only other consideration from my perspective is storeability. I
>ditched my 172 because I realized that I was spending the equivalent
>of a Garmin 495 every year on hangars and my annual was enough to buy
>a new navcom every two years and I was 45 minutes away and flew my
>airplane no more than 20 hours a year. So off it went. I have a large
>shop with 18 foot high garage doors but they are only 12 feet wide.
>Whatever it is it needs to fold so I can use my shop for a hangar.
>
>I cannot speak for Glastars, but I doubt that anyone has purposely
>gone out and destroyed them in flight. Homer Kolb did that with his
>design. An actual in-flight test to failure, so we know the absolute
>structural limits of the design. That says it for me.
>
>The AirCam wings can come off and be put back on in about 30 minutes.
>Not nearly as convenient as the Kolb, but for low altitude with no
>forced landing area flying, two engines will always trump one.
>
>The bottom line is that you need to sit in some Kolbs, talk with the
>London folks, they are all as nice as can be, and frankly consider
>where you live. If you live in the flatlands, you don't need but one
>engine because you always have lots of options. If you live in the
>mountains or near the water, two engines becomes a consideration,
>especially if you plan on doing a lot of low altitude flying.
That's a great deal of very useful information, Todd. Thanks!
>It is a tough thing in the end because these machines tend to become
>an extension of the pilot. You cannot look at John Williams Kolbra,
>or Hauck's Mark III or Jeremy Lezin's Chiquita AirCam or Uncle
>Craig's Xtra and not say, that is a unique machine and a reflection
>of its owner. There is nothing 172-generic about experimentals.
>
>So whatever you build/buy will become your baby and in the forums
>everyone will say, Oh, Miss P'Fer, that's Hauck's airplane. It is
>pretty cool actually. And much like your kids, it becomes a
>crapshoot. You put your heart into the thing and in the end, it is
>never perfect, but you love it and it is yours and it works for you.
>
>Todd
>
>DO NOT ARCHIVE
An inspiring concluding thought. It ought to be archived!
Chris Wolf
cwolf41@comcast.net
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: Todd Fredricks <flyingfox@copper.net>
This might be the way to go, Lar since I was planning on putting a wire
cutter up the windshield anyway. I might see if structurally I can alter the
Mark IIIX canopy to allow for those doors.
Todd
DO NOT ARCHIVE
On 10/15/06 10:32 PM, "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com> wrote:
>
> --> Kolb-List message posted by: "Larry Bourne" <biglar@gogittum.com>
>
> As long as you are building a plane, build gull wing doors for it. It's
> somewhat of a job, but can be done. See the page in my website by clicking
> on the link in my signature, below. Access is Very easy.
>
> Maybe you'd like to buy an almost completed Mk III Classic - cheap - with
> gull wing doors already built, but with no engine ?????? :-)
> Lar. Do not Archive.
>
> Larry Bourne
> Palm Springs, CA
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra |
Todd,
Now I see why you want two fans...to drive that wire cutter right
through those pesky EHT lines, even the paired ones?
regards,
Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/
do not archive
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra |
Well, the issue is wire-strikes. I have already known three helicopter crew
s
that have hit wires and never saw the towers or the wires. The wire cutters
saved their lives. So as a low altitude flier I intend to put them on my
airplane. I know it sounds crazy but fly around south east Ohio a while and
you realize that even with the best recon, you can miss the small ones
pretty easily. They are not that big and I can probably salvage a set off a
n
old OH-58.
Todd
On 10/17/06 6:18 PM, "Bob Noyer" <a58r@verizon.net> wrote:
> Todd,
> Now I see why you want two fans...to drive that wire cutter right through
> those pesky EHT lines, even the paired ones?
>
> regards,
> Bob N. - -FireFly 070 Old Kolb
> http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/
>
> do not archive
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
--
Todd Fredricks, DO
Flying Fox Services
http://web.mac.com/flyingfoxservices
flyingfoxservices@mac.com
Visit my Blog at www.flyingfoxhangar.blogspot.com
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "John Hauck" <jhauck@elmore.rr.com>
wire
| cutter up the windshield anyway. I might see if structurally I can
alter the
| Mark IIIX canopy to allow for those doors.
|
| Todd
Todd:
Like I said the other day, you can modify the entrance system to fit
you and still maintain structural integrity of the aircraft.
My mkIII was designed for one pilot and one mission. This aircraft
fits me, and if it fits anyone else, it is lucky.
Contact Donnie Sizemore reference modifications to existing aircraft
kits, or to modify a fuselage before it is complete to prevent undoing
a lot of work that has already been done. Bryan Melborn will also
work with you.
Take care,
john h
mkIII
PS: Wire cutter? Like the Grey Baron said, "Gonna need two engines
to drive the wire cutter." ;-)
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: Mark III Classic vs. Mark III Xtra |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "planecrazzzy" <planecrazzzy@yahoo.com>
Big Lar....
Say it AIN'T so.....
.
.
Gotta Fly...
Mike & "Jaz" in MN
.
.
.
.
biglar wrote:
>
>
> Maybe you'd like to buy an almost completed Mk III Classic - cheap - with
> gull wing doors already built, but with no engine ?????? :-)
> Lar.
> ---
--------
.
.
.
.
.
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=68608#68608
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re:florida location.. |
In a message dated 10/17/2006 4:01:44 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
jhauck@elmore.rr.com writes:
Jim S:
Where will you be located in Florida?
Started to send this bc, then decided there may be others on the List
that would like to know where Jim spends his winters.
john h
mkIII
Hi John,
I and my wife June spend our winters near Sebring Florida...we are only
about 4 miles from Sebring airport. I usually help the fellows with the sport
category expo at Sebring. I think I will keep the firestar there as I have a
friend who has a hangar there that we will share. There are several other
small grass strips in the area also..We intend to head down that way about the
20th of Nov. Looks like I might be able to get in the air tomorrow here in
michigan....If so should see some nice color of the trees. Think I will take
the digital camera and take some pics from the air. If everything works out
ok this winter in florida i intend to also fly to sun and fun and camp out
there with the ultra light group...I think that would be a fun time.....
Jim Swan firestar ll Michigan
Message 18
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|
Possums,
I've watched all your videos and this last one was awesome great job
keep'em coming!
Bob Dalton
---------------------------------------
See .... I have a fan .... "Bob Dalton".
This video has a very small section (in the middle that has some
redeeming value) of us flying over Wilmington N.C. after Fran struck
the North Carolina coast very close to Cape Fear around 8:30 p.m.
EDT, September 5, 1996, with sustained winds of 115 mph (185 km/h).
The highest wind gust was unofficially measured at 137 mph (220 km/h)
about 30 feet off the ground between Wilmington and Wrightsville
Beach. I know that we were the first allowed to "officially" fly over
the beech - you might notice the "Hummers" and the guys with the guns
and all the houses knocked down.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HwkoeGz9oQ
Message 19
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| Subject: | Time for the cowling |
<<DSC_0075.JPG>> Fi <<DSC_0077.JPG>> rs <<DSC_0078.JPG>> t
<<DSC_0079.JPG>> le <<DSC_0081.JPG>> t <<DSC_0082.JPG>> me congratulate
Henry. I felt as though I was there with him.
I have decided to go ahead and install the cowling and see how it fly's.
Air does not like to go through radiators so I made a throw away mold of
paper laminated foam last Saturday. I will do a lost mold technique. The
baffle will be made this Saturday. Here are a few pictures of the paper
mold.
Uncls Craig
Do not archive
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: First solo yesterday |
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "jimhefner" <hefner_jim@msn.com>
Henry will be on the list soon. I demo'ed BBS for him tonight so I'm sure he will
post on here soon, but right now he is having problems with internet access
out in the boondocks of San Manuel where he is staying close to the airport.
He is looking for places to hangout and get wireless access so once he figures
that out he'll be in business.
--------
Jim Hefner
Kolbless in Tucson :(
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http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=68662#68662
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