Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:37 AM - Re: Re:The pro &con of D.T. D, was dool L E vador K bull (Eugene Zimmerman)
2. 06:30 AM - Re: Aileron Hinges (planecrazzzy)
3. 06:38 AM - cooling (robert bean)
4. 07:15 AM - Re: Aileron Hinges (Jack B. Hart)
5. 08:35 AM - Re: cooling (Jack B. Hart)
6. 10:48 AM - Re: Re: cooling (Jim Baker)
7. 11:01 AM - Re: carburetor ice question (hillstw)
8. 11:58 AM - MV (pat ladd)
9. 12:13 PM - Re: Dual Elevator Cables (pat ladd)
10. 01:54 PM - Re: MV (Larry Bourne)
11. 01:56 PM - Re: Dual Elevator Cables (Larry Bourne)
12. 02:54 PM - Re: MV mothers' day (Bob Noyer)
13. 03:10 PM - Re: Aileron Hinges (Richard Girard)
14. 03:22 PM - Re: Dual Elevator Cables (pat ladd)
15. 03:29 PM - Re: MV (pat ladd)
16. 03:33 PM - Re: MV (George Thompson)
17. 03:48 PM - Re: Dual Elevator Cables (pat ladd)
18. 05:13 PM - Re: Dual Elevator Cables (Dana Hague)
19. 06:30 PM - Re: MV (Larry Cottrell)
20. 06:59 PM - Re: Aileron Hinges (grabo172)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re:The pro &con of D.T. D, was dool L E vador K bull |
Very Good Bob!
That aughta put a nice clevis on the K-bull hawser.
Gene
On Dec 2, 2006, at 10:36 PM, Bob Noyer wrote:
>
> Well, E-gene, this thread, DWT, previously that turned into a
> towing hawser, has had several lives on at least two UL listservs.
> A short while ago I thought surely we were almost about to dig up
> The Dreaded Downwind Turn, but perhaps fortunately, many of the Old
> Hands either didn't take up the cudgel, or were too disenchanted by
> the wounds visited upon then in The Old Days.
>
> Basically, there are two camps, both seemingly correct, and both
> with equal vociferosity. In a nut shell, one faction believes that
> in a Down Wind Turn you will most certainly Fall Outa The Sky if
> your airspeed is at or very near to stalling. The other POH-
> thumpers merely say Hog Wash, often declaiming The Moving Airmass
> Dogma, aka "boat in moving water" doctrine.
>
> Personally, I "learned" to fly before I'd ever heard of this
> Dreaded Phantasmagoria, and consequently flew with the What You
> Don't Know Won't Hurt You philosophy. But here's a way out of doing
> the Downwind Turn, patterned after J.Edgar Hoover's dictum of No
> Left Turns after his driver made a left turn and had an
> accident...just make a straight in, or at worst, enter from base leg.
>
> regards,
> Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb
> http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/
>
> do not archive
>
>
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: Aileron Hinges |
I built my Firestar II aileron hinge area stock.....
But when I folded it up like the plans say , it was just too tight and if you
trailer it like that , your gonna get some BAD hanger rash....
So instead , I made a simple bracket to slip into the aileron counter balance
tubes , and it holds the ailerons straight up , no rubbing...
Also, I put a bungie cord between it and the tailwheel to keep it secure.
Here's a picture or two...
Gotta Fly...
Mike in MN
--------
.
.
.
.
.
Do Not Archive
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Message 3
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Although aimed at rotary engines, this is a very comprehensive
(and lengthy) report on cooling:
http://www.rotaryeng.net/how-to-cool12.html
I have a couple of hose connections that will get beading this winter.
BB
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Aileron Hinges |
At 05:39 PM 12/2/06 -0800, you wrote:
>
......................................>
>Secondly, do you think that may be why I've had to replace a bunch of
rivets already (I've had the plane for 4 months and have replaced about 15
or so of the hinge rivets)
>
Erik,
If aileron hinge rivets are coming loose, it would seem that it could be
caused by poor hinge alignment. This can be verified by removing the pin
from the push rod clevis and rotating the aileron by hand. If it is badly
misaligned the hinges will squawk. If only one hinge rivet set is becoming
loose that is a hint that, that hinge is out of alignment. This can be
verified by pulling the hinge pin and check to see how the two halves line
up to each other as the aileron is rotated.
For what it is worth.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
Message 5
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From: robert bean <slyck@frontiernet.net>
Although aimed at rotary engines, this is a very comprehensive
(and lengthy) report on cooling:
http://www.rotaryeng.net/how-to-cool12.html
.......................................................
Bob,
It looks like I am using the wrong approach. Thanks.
As I am running the Victor 1+ with a small radiator, I have looked into different
coolants. I tried out water, water with WaterWetter, and 50/50 water/glycol
and a product called "Engine Ice". WaterWetter was purchased from AutoZone
and the Engine Ice I found on the web.
The results from initial testing this summer gave the following:
WaterWetter and H20 <-BEST
H2O
Engine Ice and WaterWetter
Engine Ice
Half H2O and Glycol <-WORST
WaterWetter when added to water lowers water surface tension. If you have
ever watched water start to boil in a pan on the stove you may have noticed
that little bubbles filled with steam begin to form and remain attached to
the pan bottom. As the water continues to heat the bubbles break loose and
float to the surface. These bubbles attached to the heated surface actually
reduce heat flow to the water. By reducing the water surface tension, the
bubbles break away from the metal surface earlier in their formation
allowing liquid water to re-attach to the surface and improves heat flow.
WaterWetter is not an anti-freeze solution, but Engine Ice is. Engine Ice
is expensive, and it is claimed that it will lower coolant temperatures by
50 degrees. I did not find this to be true. Now that cooler air
temperatures are here, I do not see that much improvement over glycol/water
solution.
Next Spring after the date for last frost, I will go back to WaterWetter and
distilled water.
I left the Engine Ice in for this winter and I expected it to be much better
in the cooler air, but this does not seem to be the case.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
Message 6
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X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (4.41)
> By reducing the water surface tension, the
> bubbles break away from the metal surface earlier in their formation
> allowing liquid water to re-attach to the surface and improves heat flow.
If you're running a pressure coolant system that gets hot enough
to form bubbles in operation........
Jim Baker
580.788.2779
Elmore City, OK
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: carburetor ice question |
Jim:
What is the sport category expo? When is it? I am not familar with it.
No doubt your weather is nicer than our just now. We have had a real
big winter storm; snow is melting off now, but will take a while, as we
had about a foot.
Regards.
Jimmy
----- Original Message -----
From: Arksey@aol.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, December 02, 2006 5:26 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: carburetor ice question
Hi Jimmy,
Yes we got to Florida Wed. evening before Thanksgiving, hauled the
Firestar down here in a enclosed trailer. hauled it with my olds van,
worked ok. The trailer was built for a firestar but with a 2 blade prop
so i had to remove the 3 blade prop to get it in the trailer....trailer
worked fine and pulled good, but when i hit uneven pavement it would
rock back and forth like a baby buggy....I intend to put shocks on it to
stop that action...It was a bit of work to haul but if the flying down
here this winter is enjoyable I will do it again...
Regard the carburetor ice, I am sure that is what the problem was
and I intend to look into carb heat, it was ideal conditions for it and
as I fly whenever i can I guess i better have carb heat to take care of
it....I would not like to be over hostile country and have that happen.
I sure have had fun flying the plane this last summer and am very happy
with it. I am near Sebring Florida and you should think about coming
down for the sport category exp at the sebring airport the 1st part of
Jan. and I will show you around the area and for sure try and make Sun
and Fun...I hope to be there with the plane and camp in the ultra light
section...
I will be back to flying down here in a week or so...been fishing
some already.
Jim Swan Firestar ll Michigan
do not archive
Message 8
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Hi All,
can anyone comfirm the dates for Monument Valley next May please. Its no
good saying Labor Day or whatever we don`t celebrate that.
Also, what is the hotel which is close by. Can find nothing specific
among the reams of stuff on the net.
Cheers
Pat
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Dual Elevator Cables |
Hi Lar,
I had a mate, now dead, unfortunately, who was a gunner in a Halifax. He
told me that his skipper always rounded out on the trim. Not quuite
pattern and approach I agree but pretty neat.
Thanks for the pics. we may use your hotel if we make it to MV next year
Cheers
Pat
Message 10
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Hi Pat: The hotel is Goulding's, and the date is the weekend after
Mother's Day.......tho' I can't help on the date. It won't be the same
without Dave and Eve there. I hope the ol' Bald Eagle joins us tho'.
Lar. Do not Archive.
Larry Bourne
Santa Fe, NM
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: pat ladd
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2006 11:57 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: MV
Hi All,
can anyone comfirm the dates for Monument Valley next May please. Its
no good saying Labor Day or whatever we don`t celebrate that.
Also, what is the hotel which is close by. Can find nothing specific
among the reams of stuff on the net.
Cheers
Pat
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: Dual Elevator Cables |
It's a fair hike from La Posada de Santa Fe to MV, (about 400 miles) but
if you stop here en route, I'll scramble to play tour guide for
you......and for any other Kolb'ers who may stop by at any time.
I've got a few picture stories put together on my activities to and
around Santa Fe, so anyone who's interested, let me know and I'll send
'em on to you. Lar. Do not
Archive.
Larry Bourne
Santa Fe, NM
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: pat ladd
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2006 12:13 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Dual Elevator Cables
Hi Lar,
I had a mate, now dead, unfortunately, who was a gunner in a Halifax.
He told me that his skipper always rounded out on the trim. Not quuite
pattern and approach I agree but pretty neat.
Thanks for the pics. we may use your hotel if we make it to MV next
year
Cheers
Pat
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: MV mothers' day |
In US, at least my part, Mothers' Day is celebrated 5/13, a Sunday.
regards,
Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Aileron Hinges |
Erik, You didn't say how you determined the rivets needed to be replaced,
and whether you replaced them with the same size rivet or went oversize.
There's a condition called "smoking rivets" in which the rivets begin to
move in the holes creating an aluminum oxide dust ring around the head of
the rivet. If you see evidence the rivets are smoking, going oversize to
5/32 is probably your only option to get a true fix to the problem.
Rick
On 12/3/06, Jack B. Hart <jbhart@onlyinternet.net> wrote:
>
>
> At 05:39 PM 12/2/06 -0800, you wrote:
> >
> ......................................>
> >Secondly, do you think that may be why I've had to replace a bunch of
> rivets already (I've had the plane for 4 months and have replaced about 15
> or so of the hinge rivets)
> >
>
> Erik,
>
> If aileron hinge rivets are coming loose, it would seem that it could be
> caused by poor hinge alignment. This can be verified by removing the pin
> from the push rod clevis and rotating the aileron by hand. If it is badly
> misaligned the hinges will squawk. If only one hinge rivet set is
> becoming
> loose that is a hint that, that hinge is out of alignment. This can be
> verified by pulling the hinge pin and check to see how the two halves line
> up to each other as the aileron is rotated.
>
> For what it is worth.
>
> Jack B. Hart FF004
> Winchester, IN
>
>
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Dual Elevator Cables |
Hi Ed,
sorry if I have inadverdently trodden on your toes..
I think maybe you came into this thread partway through as you seem to
have missed the previous posts to which I was replying.
I was certainly not denigrating Kolbs. I have one, and I agree with you
that it is well designed, except for the flap handle, and very strong.
I shall NOT be fitting dual cables. I was merely continuing a discussion
about the differing approaches to legislation in the US and the UK.
The comment about the length of time that was apparently going to be
taken in investigating Daves sad accident did not suggest for a moment
that we don`t have accidents in greater or lesser numbers than you but
merely making the point that if an accident(any accident) occurs then
the cause needs to be determined as quickly as possible. If the tail
falls off a Rans at 1000 hours and I have 950 hours on mine I would like
to know NOW if it is a generic flaw or if the pilot sawed through half
the longerons to install an extra fuel tank. Not in six months time when
someone has finally got round to it.
Another lister was applauding the fact that in the US you could `do
pretty much as you liked`. In fact I think that his words were "you
could carve a plane out of cheese and provided the C of G was in the
right place it would pass". Apologies if I have misquoted but those were
the general sentiments. I was merely commenting. If it is not true dont
blame me.
I agree, (we seem to agree about everything Ed, whats the argument?)
that regs don`t make an aircraft safe. Design does. But what except regs
ensures that a builder follows the design? Also, would you be happy that
any designer could market a plane without it being checked by an outside
source.? You couldn`t do that here.
In the States you seem to be in the position that you can change much
more in the design without permission than we are in the UK. Is that
good or bad? I don`t know. I would like to be able to change a prop. or
an engine or fiddle with the dihedral or extend the undercarriage legs
without getting approval but I have no expertise and the fact that I am
willig to take a chance on killing myself should not entitle me to
hazard some innocent bystander. We are working slowly towards your
approach and I suspect that in time we shall arrive at some middle
point.
Incidentally I have had carb icing , twice. Each time it was cleared by
opening the throttle. I didn`t just make up the idea. I read it in a
book.
I am sorry if you find any of this an attack un the US or on Kolb. Put
it down to cabin fever.
Cheers
Pat
Message 15
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the date is the weekend after Mother's Day...>>
Crikey Lar,
cant you put some numbers on that? We do have Mothers day, I
think,probably not the same as you, and I am almost sure we have Fathers
Day. When the Card Manufacturers and the flower growers get around to it
we shall no doubt have Nephew and Nieces day and Cousins Day, Pumpkin
Pie day.......
Cheers
Pat
Message 16
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I am still thinking about it. For sure it wouldn't be the same without
Dave and Eve. At the present I am thinking now that I should come up to
explain to everyone what we think must have happened.
Az Bald Eagle
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Bourne
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2006 3:53 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: MV
Hi Pat: The hotel is Goulding's, and the date is the weekend after
Mother's Day.......tho' I can't help on the date. It won't be the same
without Dave and Eve there. I hope the ol' Bald Eagle joins us tho'.
Lar. Do not Archive.
Larry Bourne
Santa Fe, NM
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: pat ladd
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2006 11:57 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: MV
Hi All,
can anyone comfirm the dates for Monument Valley next May please.
Its no good saying Labor Day or whatever we don`t celebrate that.
Also, what is the hotel which is close by. Can find nothing specific
among the reams of stuff on the net.
Cheers
Pat
href="http://www.aeroelectric.com">www.aeroelectric.com
href="http://www.buildersbooks.com">www.buildersbooks.com
href="http://www.kitlog.com">www.kitlog.com
href="http://www.homebuilthelp.com">www.homebuilthelp.com
href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/c
href="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronic
s.com/Navigator?Kolb-List
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
12/2/2006
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Dual Elevator Cables |
Did over regulation, on your side of the pond, prevent further "bad
accidents"?>>
Good question John. I don`t know. On balance I think it probably did. It may
well have stultified some exciting new developments too. Thats the trade
off.
The main thing that happened was that the series of accidents put the whole
sport in jeopardy. Committees were formed etc., and we were lucky enough
that Anne Welch who had cut her teeth on the Gliding movement and was Sec of
the BGA for years took an interest and was able to lay down enough
guidelines that the government handed over regulation to the new committee
instead of running it directly themselves.
Therefore we enjoy pretty much the status of the Gliding Assoc, and
regulate, inspect, instruct etc., ourselves without too much outside
interference.
Cheers
Pat
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Dual Elevator Cables |
At 06:21 PM 12/3/2006, pat ladd wrote:
>In the States you seem to be in the position that you can change much more
>in the design without permission than we are in the UK. Is that good or
>bad? I don`t know. I would like to be able to change a prop. or an engine
>or fiddle with the dihedral or extend the undercarriage legs without
>getting approval but I have no expertise and the fact that I am willig to
>take a chance on killing myself should not entitle me to hazard some
>innocent bystander. We are working slowly towards your approach and I
>suspect that in time we shall arrive at some middle point.
Pat, there are two sets of regs here. If it's two seats, or over 254 lbs,
factory built you can't change much; homebuilt, you have to register it as
experimental and go through inspections, test flying in a restricted area,
etc. You can change pretty much anything when you build it but you still
have to get it approved for flight.
If it's under 254 lbs and single seat (i.e. ultralight), you can do
virtually anything... but the ultralight regs prohibit you from flying, at
ANY altitude, over any congested area or open air assembly of persons. So
our regs DO protect the innocent bystander either way, but you're free to
kill yourself flying solo.
-Dana
--
--
For every new foolproof invention there is a new and improved fool.
Message 19
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The weekend after is the 19th and 20th. I think this is the normal
"regular" weekend.
Larry,Oregon
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Aileron Hinges |
jindoguy(at)gmail.com wrote:
> Erik, You didn't say how you determined the rivets needed to be replaced, and
whether you replaced them with the same size rivet or went oversize.
The heads were just a bit pulled out from the hinge, not flush...
Not smoking at all thank goodness. I just drilled them out and replaced them with
1/8x 1/4 steel rivets. The ones I took out were 1/8 x 1/8. But the manual
said that the larger grip is ok if needed.
But of course I'm going to drill them all out anyway and replace the hinges. Better
safe than sorry.
On another note.. I passed my Light Sport Repairman - Inspector class today so
I can legally sign off my own annual condition inspection...
So I have to replace those hinges anyway... as a maintenance man I have to say
my "Inspector" (me) is a real tough cookie [Laughing]
--------
-Erik Grabowski
Kolb Firestar N197BG
CFI/CFII/LS-I
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