Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 02:15 AM - Kolb SnowStar (Scott Perkins)
2. 04:01 AM - Re: sports pilot (tc1917)
3. 04:07 AM - Re: Kolb SnowStar (ron wehba)
4. 04:27 AM - Re: Sport Pilot (DANIEL WALTER)
5. 04:43 AM - Re: Kolb glider (Jack B. Hart)
6. 06:09 AM - Re: Kolb glider (N27SB@aol.com)
7. 06:22 AM - Re: Re: sports pilot (Richard Girard)
8. 06:32 AM - The debate over Kolb glide ()
9. 07:52 AM - Re: Kolb glider (Jack B. Hart)
10. 08:15 AM - Slips (Richard Girard)
11. 08:17 AM - Kolb SnowStar (Scott Perkins)
12. 08:18 AM - Re: Kolb glider (knowvne@aol.com)
13. 08:26 AM - Re: Re: sports pilot (Larry Cottrell)
14. 08:35 AM - Re: Slips (knowvne@aol.com)
15. 08:53 AM - Flame outs (pat ladd)
16. 09:05 AM - Re: Flame outs (knowvne@aol.com)
17. 09:06 AM - Re: La Jolla/glider port (Gherkins Tim-rp3420)
18. 09:15 AM - that old video (pat ladd)
19. 09:18 AM - Re: Pilot's name in Utah accident (pat ladd)
20. 09:30 AM - Re: that old video (John Hauck)
21. 09:54 AM - Re: Kolb glider (Dana Hague)
22. 10:39 AM - Re: Kolb glider (JetPilot)
23. 10:42 AM - Re: Kolb glider (JetPilot)
24. 12:07 PM - Re: that old video (pat ladd)
25. 12:30 PM - Re: that old video (John Hauck)
26. 12:35 PM - Re: Pat's CA trip (Bob Noyer)
27. 01:35 PM - Re: Re: Kolb glider (flykolb)
28. 02:24 PM - Engine outs (Jim Dunn)
29. 03:14 PM - panel (Paul Petty)
30. 03:24 PM - Re: Kolb glider (Larry Bourne)
31. 03:25 PM - Re: Engine outs (Mike Welch)
32. 03:44 PM - Re: Glider time (ElleryWeld@aol.com)
33. 04:07 PM - Re: Kolb glider (planecrazzzy)
34. 04:26 PM - Re: Engine outs (flykolb)
35. 05:14 PM - Kolb History (John Hauck)
36. 05:31 PM - Re: FLAME OUTS (Russ Kinne)
37. 06:24 PM - Re: Kolb glider (JetPilot)
38. 07:07 PM - Re: Re: Kolb glider (Larry Cottrell)
39. 07:36 PM - Re: Kolb History (Malcolmbru@aol.com)
40. 07:47 PM - Re: Kolb History (John Hauck)
41. 07:48 PM - Dave Kulp (Larry Bourne)
42. 08:09 PM - Re: Re: Kolb glider (Denny Rowe)
43. 08:45 PM - Re: Re: Kolb glider (HShack@aol.com)
Message 1
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Jim sent some photos of his plane in the snow that are simply incredible
(which I have uploaded to the Ultrastar Photo archives)
use the below link to Kolb Ultrastar photos and scroll down to Jim's
"SnowStar" photos. You wont be sorry ! Just amazing !
Thanks for sharing Jim
PS. if someone wants to take all these pics and turn into a thumbnail
photo
gallery, be my guest...
/////////////////////////////////////////////
Subject: [KolbUltrastar] COLD
From: "JIm" <belvidereill@yahoo.com>
Hi guys.
Jim here
I did my first ski landings today It was 18 deg but it was worth it not
much snow 3 inches but a great experence and awesome flying i guess im
im a flying nut lol
-----------------------
KOLB ULTRASTAR Photos Link
http://vula2.org/images/land_planes/Kolb-Ultrastar/
.
KOLB FLYER photos Link
http://vula2.org/images/land_planes/Kolb-Flyer/
Message 2
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| Subject: | Re: sports pilot |
To Larry Cottrell. You aint done yet. you dont have a tail wheel
endorsement!! now you gotta go back to an instructor, take lessons on how
to drag your butt around on a tail wheel and then have him endorse your logs
and then go find another one who is qualified to test you and get HIS
endorsement and then it is done. thats all there is to it. gads. they
sure have made it easy for us, right. I took my check ride in a tail
dragger and it is in my log so I am covered automatically. it doesn really
say that in the rules (at least I cant find it) but it says you must furnish
a ride that is what you want your license for. something like that. not
the same words. my log says kolb slingshot and that should cover me.
anybody have a different reading of this? ted cowan, alabama
Message 3
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| Subject: | Re: Kolb SnowStar |
ok jim. now you done went and done it, you went and took my old plain plane
and turned it into a career distroying machine, cause I don't know how you
can stay out of it and go make a living."" GRINS" ronnie w in tx. the old
owner of jims machine
p.s. super great job jim,,, wish they would build these again.,cause I sure
miss it.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Scott Perkins" <2scott@bellsouth.net>
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 4:21 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb SnowStar
>
> Jim sent some photos of his plane in the snow that are simply incredible
> (which I have uploaded to the Ultrastar Photo archives)
>
> use the below link to Kolb Ultrastar photos and scroll down to Jim's
> "SnowStar" photos. You wont be sorry ! Just amazing !
> Thanks for sharing Jim
>
> PS. if someone wants to take all these pics and turn into a thumbnail
> photo
> gallery, be my guest...
>
> /////////////////////////////////////////////
> Subject: [KolbUltrastar] COLD
> From: "JIm" <belvidereill@yahoo.com>
>
> Hi guys.
> Jim here
>
> I did my first ski landings today It was 18 deg but it was worth it not
> much snow 3 inches but a great experence and awesome flying i guess im
> im a flying nut lol
> -----------------------
> KOLB ULTRASTAR Photos Link
> http://vula2.org/images/land_planes/Kolb-Ultrastar/
> .
> KOLB FLYER photos Link
> http://vula2.org/images/land_planes/Kolb-Flyer/
>
>
>
Message 4
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Congratulations Larry, I know what you mean when you say, now you shall
collapse, I worried way too much about the practical test and also took
it on a bad weather day.
Do Not Archive
Dan Walter
Ultrastar
Palmyra Pa.
----- Original Message -----
From: Larry Cottrell
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 9:09 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Sport Pilot
Well friends, a journey begun 9 years, 10 months and 17 days ago has
finally come to an end. Or in the immortal words of our departed
(hopefully) aerial scholar. "Seeks mons ago I culdent evn spel Spor Pile
it and now I are one!" A promise that I made to the missus when I
started talking about flying was that I would get a Pilots Certificate,
is now fulfilled. Now, much sweat, stress and of course $money$ later I
can relax and enjoy flying. I think that I have more than 270 hours as a
UL Pilot, 20 hours dual instruction in a GA plane, so I shouldn't have
had much concern. However I had to fly a Quad City Challenger whose only
saving grace is that it lands like a kitten. The wind when we started
was almost a full sock, but it was only about 6 degrees off my right
wing. The plane to me has a real tendency to want to stick its tail in
the front rather than following along behind as it should. If you didn't
stay on top of it, the only way that you could get it back in line was
full left rudder and aileron full right. Which still doesn't seem right,
but it was what you had to do. With the wind like it was the poor stick
was being moved around like it was part of a butter churn, but none of
that showed on the outside and I am very pleased to report that both of
us were very happy with the outcome of the flight. I normally do wheel
landings in my Kolb at whatever altitude suits me, but very little of it
more than 200 feet off the ground. I of course had to learn to do it
properly from 1000 feet agl. I am used to landing in a restricted
distance, but really in a totally non professional manner. So it was a
bit of a shock to me that I actually had to pick a spot rather than a
runway. :-) However today all my landings were no further than 50 feet
from the spot.
Now I shall collapse!
Larry, Oregon , SPORT PILOT!
do not archive
Message 5
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At 10:45 AM 1/23/07 -0800, you wrote:
>
>I sold my Quicksilver MX in Aug 2006 to buy a Kolb Firefly (which I got in
>October). I expected the Firefly to glide better, but it's actually
>worse.
Jim
The MX should glide better as it has more wing area. 156 to 117 square feet.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
Message 6
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In a message dated 1/23/2007 10:18:59 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
possums@bellsouth.net writes:
I think 8 to 1 glide is about right for mine at 50 mph.
20 mph over stall. Not so good with floats through.
At least "lotus floats" I'm sure Steve's are better.
But you can still gettum out of the trees with out too much damage.
"The last Possum" ..........except for John H. of course.
Greg finally sold his plane last weekend.
Possum, just guessed at 8 to 1. It is probably less but it does not really
matter cause in my area around Winter Haven it is mostly water down below. I
just hold enough altitude between lakes. I see the ability to do a steep
approach as an asset.
steve
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: sports pilot |
Ted, WIth my private ticket, it was a log book endorsement only, just like
high performance aircraft, complex aircraft, or operating in Class Bravo
airspace. There was no check ride.
Rick
On 1/24/07, tc1917 <tc1917@hughes.net> wrote:
>
>
> To Larry Cottrell. You aint done yet. you dont have a tail wheel
> endorsement!! now you gotta go back to an instructor, take lessons on how
> to drag your butt around on a tail wheel and then have him endorse your
> logs
> and then go find another one who is qualified to test you and get HIS
> endorsement and then it is done. thats all there is to it. gads. they
> sure have made it easy for us, right. I took my check ride in a tail
> dragger and it is in my log so I am covered automatically. it doesn
> really
> say that in the rules (at least I cant find it) but it says you must
> furnish
> a ride that is what you want your license for. something like that. not
> the same words. my log says kolb slingshot and that should cover me.
> anybody have a different reading of this? ted cowan, alabama
>
>
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
Message 8
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| Subject: | The debate over Kolb glide |
I watch these occasional blips on the List with some amusement, I must
admit. How much does all the whoopin' and hollerin' really change
anyone's mind or actions, I wonder?
Still, this one seems unusually strange. I'm a simple guy, so it seems
like the whole thing is simple:
If you don't like the glide of a Kolb, fly something else.
See ya in the air! (When it gets warmer anyway. brrrrr)
-Ken Fackler
Kolb Mark II / N722KM (pending inspection)
Rochester MI
do not archive
Message 9
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Kolbers,
My retired airforce brother-in-law sent this one to me.
http://jet-man.com/playervideo.swf?video=jetman2007.flv
Jack B. Hart FF004
Wichester, IN
Message 10
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Got out the 172 manuals just out of curiosity. For the N and P models in
chapter 2, "Limitations", under Placards, Cessna tells you that a placard
must be near the flap switch that says "Avoid slips with flaps extended".
Same models, in chapter 4, "Normal Procedures", under cross wind landings,
"If flap settings greater than 20 degrees are used in sideslips with full
rudder deflection, some elevator oscillation may be felt at normal approach
speeds. However, this does not effect the control of the airplane."
I can't find my manual for the K model, narrower main gear, ten less HP, and
flaps go to 40 degrees, and 100 lb. less MTOW than the N and P, so I can't
quote it right now. I can tell you it comes out of the sky at about the same
glide angle as the Space Shuttle when doing a forward slip with flaps 40.
The rudder buffets a bit, and you can feel a pulsation in the yoke, but it
slips to either side just fine.
If you've ever read "The Lucky Bastard Club", sorry it's in a box somewhere
and I can't remember the author's name right off, the author mentions that
he asked his instructors why the Army didn't teach slips. The aircraft are
too big and too heavy was the usual reply. At several places in the book he
makes a point of describing the slip characteristics of the Stearman and the
Cessna AT-50. Toward the end of the book he slyly lets you know that the
Boeing B-17G slipped just fine, too.
As for the Mk 3, it slips just fine, too. I sometimes wish for a bit more
rudder area, but I suspect that may be more pilot than aircraft.
Rick
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
Message 11
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Jim sent some photos of his plane in the snow that are simply incredible
(which I have uploaded to the Ultrastar Photo archives)
use the below link to Kolb Ultrastar photos and scroll down to Jim's
"SnowStar" photos. You wont be sorry ! Just amazing !
Thanks for sharing Jim
PS. if someone wants to take all these pics and turn into a thumbnail
photo gallery, be my guest...
/////////////////////////////////////////////
Subject: [KolbUltrastar] COLD From: "JIm" <belvidereill@yahoo.com>
Hi guys.
Jim here
I did my first ski landings today It was 18 deg but it was worth it not
much snow (3 inches) but a great experence and awesome flying I guess im
im a flying nut lol
-----------------------
KOLB ULTRASTAR Photos Link
http://vula2.org/images/land_planes/Kolb-Ultrastar/
.
KOLB FLYER photos Link
http://vula2.org/images/land_planes/Kolb-Flyer/
Message 12
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Now strap a skateboard to his Gut and he may have something....
hahahahaha
YOU FIRST... 8-)
Mark Vaughn
-----Original Message-----
From: jbhart@onlyinternet.net
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 11:01 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Kolb glider
<jbhart@onlyinternet.net>
Kolbers,
My retired airforce brother-in-law sent this one to me.
http://jet-man.com/playervideo.swf?video=jetman2007.flv
Jack B. Hart FF004
Wichester, IN
________________________________________________________________________
across the web, free AOL Mail and more.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: sports pilot |
----- Original Message -----
From: "tc1917" <tc1917@hughes.net>
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 4:59 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: sports pilot
>
> To Larry Cottrell. You aint done yet. you dont have a tail wheel
> endorsement!!
You are right, I do still have one thing to do, but it is only to get a
Class D endorsement. Some time ago I bought a Experimental Mark III (N
numbered) and coerced my CFI into taking a ride with me and giving me a
tail wheel endorsement, so that I could fly it legally. He didn't want to do
it, (He is a bit of a butt, and would not give me instruction in the Mark
III. One of the reasons that I did not go ahead with the Private ticket) but
he did. I was lucky in that the guy that I bought the Mark III from was a
CFI as well. We flew it a bit and he reluctantly signed me off to fly it
back home, a three hour flight, so my regular CFI really couldn't refuse.
Even though I complained about flying the Challenger, by doing so I ended up
with an endorsement for both less and more than the 87 knot LSA. I am hoping
that I can pick up the Class D endorsement without having to fly a 172
again, since 17 hours of my dual instruction was in fact at a Class D
airport that shares runways with one of the busiest Airforce operation areas
around the Pacific Northwest.
The next thing however will be to get the Firestar an airworthiness
certificate. So the bull isn't totally done, just a bit shallower.
Larry, Oregon
do not archive
Message 14
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Thanks Rick
It must have been a Flap issue my instructor was concerned with....
This was 20 years ago that this happen..
As with most flying related things they get a little fresh paint over
time 8-)
Mark Vaughn
-----Original Message-----
From: jindoguy@gmail.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 11:15 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Slips
Got out the 172 manuals just out of curiosity. For the N and P models
in chapter 2, "Limitations", under Placards, Cessna tells you that a
placard must be near the flap switch that says "Avoid slips with flaps
extended". Same models, in chapter 4, "Normal Procedures", under cross
wind landings, "If flap settings greater than 20 degrees are used in
sideslips with full rudder deflection, some elevator oscillation may be
felt at normal approach speeds. However, this does not effect the
control of the airplane."
I can't find my manual for the K model, narrower main gear, ten less
HP, and flaps go to 40 degrees, and 100 lb. less MTOW than the N and P,
so I can't quote it right now. I can tell you it comes out of the sky
at about the same glide angle as the Space Shuttle when doing a forward
slip with flaps 40. The rudder buffets a bit, and you can feel a
pulsation in the yoke, but it slips to either side just fine.
If you've ever read "The Lucky Bastard Club", sorry it's in a box
somewhere and I can't remember the author's name right off, the author
mentions that he asked his instructors why the Army didn't teach slips.
The aircraft are too big and too heavy was the usual reply. At several
places in the book he makes a point of describing the slip
characteristics of the Stearman and the Cessna AT-50. Toward the end of
the book he slyly lets you know that the Boeing B-17G slipped just
fine, too.
As for the Mk 3, it slips just fine, too. I sometimes wish for a bit
more rudder area, but I suspect that may be more pilot than aircraft.
Rick
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
________________________________________________________________________
across the web, free AOL Mail and more.
Message 15
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Hi,
what are these `flame outs` that seem to have crept into the list
recently. I thought a `flame out` was when a jet engine quit.
Have some of you guys been taking the freedom the Experimental category
gives you a bit far? Lets stick to `engine out` and leave the `flame
outs` to the big boys.
Cheers
Pat
Message 16
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PAT
Don't all KOLBS fly with their engines out? 8-)
Personally I prefer the term FLAME OUT when referring to a dead
engine...
But then given my Background, I'm use to flying with no FLAME at
all... 8-)
Sorry if I've confused the terms..
Mark Vaughn
-----Original Message-----
From: pj.ladd@btinternet.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 11:53 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Flame outs
Hi,
what are these `flame outs` that seem to have crept into the list
recently. I thought a `flame out` was when a jet engine quit.
Have some of you guys been taking the freedom the Experimental
category gives you a bit far? Lets stick to `engine out` and leave the
`flame outs` to the big boys.
Cheers
Pat
________________________________________________________________________
across the web, free AOL Mail and more.
Message 17
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| Subject: | La Jolla/glider port |
George/Gang,
I grew up in North San Diego county in a little town called Rancho
Bernardo/Poway area during the 70's and 80's. Back then "Blacks Beach"
was the nude bathing beach for the San Diego area. As a surfing youth,
inexplicably the rip tides would suddenly and forcefully push us over to
the Black Beach surf. I think I spent more time on the beach and surf
then I did up on the cliffs flying RC gliders.
George, one could appreciate the challenge mother nature there........I
know I did......and I'm not talking about the surf, or soaring either.
;O)
Tim
FSII
do not archive
________________________________
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of
GeoR38@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 4:03 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Pilot's name in Utah accident
hey pat if you have the time, as I know you will have the urge,as a
glider pilot, to go to La Jolla, just north of San Diego and go to the
top of the cliff overlooking the Pacific ocean just over "Black beach".
You will be amazed.... if it hasn't fallen into the ocean yet. To anyone
who appreciates challenging mother nature ... successfully, that is, the
soaring done there is phenomenal.... if it is still going on, does
anyone know?
George Randolph
Firestar driver from the Villages in Fl
Message 18
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Get to post my tired old video again!>>
Hi,
enjoyed it again too. The clip is just over a minute, how high were you
when the clip started?
Switching off the engine is a little different from having it suddenly stop.
Reaction time is different and of course you tend to switch off only when
you are confident of reaching your strip. No searching round looking for a
landing spot while your flying accuracy goes to hell. Thats what throws your
height away.
Great video
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Pilot's name in Utah accident |
go to La Jolla, >>
Hi George,
I shall be driving down from LA so I may well do that. Thanks for the
tip.
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: that old video |
No searching round looking for a
| landing spot while your flying accuracy goes to hell. Thats what
throws your
| height away.
Patrick:
A good pilot always has the next best forced landing area in sight.
If I may add, once a suitable forced landing area is selected, it is
usually best not to change one's mind. We have some folks on this
List that have experienced that mistake, me included.
john h
mkIII
Message 21
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At 07:53 AM 1/24/2007, Jack B. Hart wrote:
>
>The MX should glide better as it has more wing area. 156 to 117 square feet.
It's not really about wing area, but L/D (lift to drag ratio). The MX is
very "draggy", with all the exposed tubes and cables. You need to dive it
steeper to keep the speed up than you do with a cleaner airplane.
-Dana
--
--
But if we LEGALIZE it, we can't take your HOUSE!
Message 22
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Possum,
Those are amazing pictures.. I never heard about that. Im assuming you posted
the story behond that, can you post a link to it ???
I dont think the MK III is anywhere near 10 to 1 glide. The Cessna 172 manual
gives a glide ratio of 10.5 to one, and my MK III Xtra does not glide anywhere
near as good as a 172 will. One day soon I will do a test to find the exact
glide ratio, I am very curious about this. Compared to most spam can type airplanes,
the Kolb has a very bad glide, offset by a very low touchdown speed and
shot landing roll :)
JetPilot
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90148#90148
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[quote="kolbmark3"]"The Kolbs drop like a rock" - not really! Granted, it is not
like a glider, but having experienced at least ten "engine outs" from as low
as 300 feet to as high as 2000 feet, the Mark III does give you some time to
land. But in any plane, even a GA, it is always a good idea (read life saver)
to have a potential landing site picked out.
Jim
Mark III
> [b]
Jim,
I am also interested in what would cause 10 engine outs ? Can you post some of
the information on what caused them, and the kinds of places you land ? And
most of all, what engine are you flying ! Im not trying to flame you here,
I just think it would be really good information for the rest of us and very interesting
stories about the landings !
JettPilot
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90149#90149
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| Subject: | Re: that old video |
good pilot always has the next best forced landing area in sight.>>
Hi John,
I agree absolutely, but it is a counsel of perfection, and its that few
minutes when your attention wanders that bite you in the bum. Can any of us
say with all honesty that we know where you will land if it goes quiet NOW
100% of the time.. Some of the stuff you fly over and some of the
extensive woodland that some listers have produced pics. of are pretty short
of choices.
I agree also about not changing your mind although in my couple of `outs` I
haven`t had time to channge my mind before I was on the ground.
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
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| Subject: | Re: that old video |
| extensive woodland that some listers have produced pics. of are
pretty short
| of choices.
Patrick:
In those cases you mention above, I still take the best choice of what
is available.
Never give up until you finish crashing.
john h
mkIII
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| Subject: | Re: Pat's CA trip |
When you get that far down the coast, watch for signs to San Jose
Institute of Technology.
regards,
Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/
do not archive
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They were kind of in "clusters" - and not all were complete surprises.
First one was with a 503 and I landed in a hay field, dodging bales of hay.
The next tow were in the same field. After landing, I could not find the
problem, tied the tail down, did an extended runup with no problem. Took
off, was still climbing, when it quit again. Landed, inspected everything,
replaced the fuel pump, did another extended runup, took off, engine quit.
Trailered it home, replaced all fuel lines, cleaned the fuel tanks, new fuel
pump. No more problems. What caused it? I am still not sure.
Next time was after a A&P had replaced the points. Took off and on downwind
it got real quiet. The key in the crankshaft sheared. Landed at my airport.
Replaced key, no more problem.
The other times were with a Rotax 532. I had taken off from a friend's
field, climbed to 2000', leveled out, reduced power, engine quit. Landed at
his field, did extended runup, climbed to 4000', everything ok. Flew back to
my airport with a landing spot always in sight. No problem getting back.
Then in trying to figure out what was wrong there followed a series of
takeoffs and engine outs (just after clearing the end of the field but with
enough altitude to do 180's).
No real sign of seizure but A&P tore down engine, cleaned cylinders and
pistons.Replaced the points with CDI, new radiator, rebuilt gearbox. No more
problems.
Now someone will flame me for taking off again after having a problem. Every
time I had a long enough runway to land if the engine quit on takeoff and/or
enough altitude to do a 180 and get back. In fact one time I had excess
altitude to loose in order to make the runway.
I may be slow but I'm not completely stupid nor do I have a death wish. I
now know I won't panic when the engine goes quiet - but I do have a lot more
experience with engine out landings than I really want!
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 1:42 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb glider
>
> [quote="kolbmark3"]"The Kolbs drop like a rock" - not really! Granted, it
is not like a glider, but having experienced at least ten "engine outs"
from as low as 300 feet to as high as 2000 feet, the Mark III does give you
some time to land. But in any plane, even a GA, it is always a good idea
(read life saver) to have a potential landing site picked out.
>
> Jim
> Mark III
>
> > [b]
>
>
> Jim,
>
> I am also interested in what would cause 10 engine outs ? Can you post
some of the information on what caused them, and the kinds of places you
land ? And most of all, what engine are you flying ! Im not trying to
flame you here, I just think it would be really good information for the
rest of us and very interesting stories about the landings !
>
> JettPilot
>
> --------
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
could have !!!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90149#90149
>
>
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Being your own mechanic makes you a better pilot. The worse mechanic you
are, the better the pilot you must be. Not much over a year ago I thought
2-strokes had valves (my son corrected me). It was quite a learning
experience when I bought a disassembled 1982 Quicksilver MX with Cuyuna
engine. I went through two major issues involving the points ignition and
carburetor. The carb was the most problematic. Everything worked fine on
the ground and during takeoff and climbout, then I would loose power 1 or
2 miles from the field. Every time I was able to nurse it back to my
airport for a landing.
The problem was the carb was rotated just slightly too far forward. During
climbout it was near vertical and operating fine, but when I leveled off
(1-2 miles from the field) it would rotate forward slightly (with the
engine) and flood. This problem appeared intermittent and bothered me for
a while until I committed to keep flying short hops around the airport
until I figured it out.
The point is, I could not duplicate this problem on the ground. I had to
fly it multiple times over the airport to troubleshoot the problem. During
testing, the engine could have quit at any time and I would not have had a
problem landing safely. After I figured it out, it was really a joy to
fly.
Jim
> Now someone will flame me for taking off again after having a problem.
> Jim
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Going in with the wireing and panel!
http://groups.msn.com/AerialWorld/kolbra012.msnw?Page=7
--------
Paul Petty
Kolbra #12
Ms Dixie
painting and reassembly
Read this topic online here:
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When I took some lessons in an MX II in '95, the instructor told me to hold
pattern altitude of 500 ft till I could see the numbers between my feet, (no
floor in that thing) then pull back the throttle to about (I think) 1/4 or
1/3 power, watch the airspeed indicator (ball in tube type - can't remember
the name) out of the corner of my eye and hold it at 40 mph, then flare just
before hitting. He clamped his hand over mine on the stick to make sure I
obeyed. It was spooky. We came down almost on the numbers, and
the.........flare........almost wasn't. About (it seemed) 5 ft from the
ground he pulled my hand back on the stick, we flared and hit. Not too
hard, either, it were a perty good landing. I can't imagine anything with a
worse glide ratio. Lar. Do not
Archive.
Larry Bourne
Santa Fe, NM
www.gogittum.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dana Hague" <d-m-hague@comcast.net>
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 9:54 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Kolb glider
>
> At 07:53 AM 1/24/2007, Jack B. Hart wrote:
>>
>>The MX should glide better as it has more wing area. 156 to 117 square
>>feet.
>
> It's not really about wing area, but L/D (lift to drag ratio). The MX is
> very "draggy", with all the exposed tubes and cables. You need to dive it
> steeper to keep the speed up than you do with a cleaner airplane.
>
> -Dana
> --
> --
> But if we LEGALIZE it, we can't take your HOUSE!
>
>
>
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Jim,
A few of us (5 total, we took turns) were flying two Quicksiver MX2's to
Arlington Airshow and experienced an identical engine problem on one of the
engines, like you mentioned in paragraph one of your previous email.
Let me know if you're interested in what we found..... Mike
in Utah
_________________________________________________________________
Valentines Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping
http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline
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I would suggest installing a runway in the first field You seem to be landing
there a lot hate to see anyone get hurt
Ellery
J/K
do not archive
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Hey Big Lar,
The "key" your talking about.... is 40
Mine will drop in fast at 40..... but if I shoot for 50 , she glides VERY good
Gotta Fly...
Mike in MN
--------
.
.
.
.
.
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90234#90234
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Mike,
I'm interested! What did you find?
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Welch" <mdnanwelch7@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 6:25 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Engine outs
>
>
> Jim,
> A few of us (5 total, we took turns) were flying two Quicksiver MX2's
to
> Arlington Airshow and experienced an identical engine problem on one of
the
> engines, like you mentioned in paragraph one of your previous email.
> Let me know if you're interested in what we found.....
Mike
> in Utah
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Valentine's Day -- Shop for gifts that spell L-O-V-E at MSN Shopping
>
http://shopping.msn.com/content/shp/?ctId=8323,ptnrid=37,ptnrdata=24095&tcode=wlmtagline
>
>
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Hi Gang:
Boy! The weather has been rotten at hauck's holler. Talk about cabin
fever...........
Maybe this will brighten things up a bit. Was going through the
November 1999 copy of EAA Experimenter Magazine tonight and found a
couple historical photos.
One is the Kolb Company's Fire Fly at Sun and Fun 1999. This
particular Sun and Fun was the transition flyin for old and new Kolb
Aircraft. Here is where I met my new bosses at TNK, although I was
flying for Old Kolb.
The other photo is Old Kolb's Sling Shot. Can not remember what year
that was. May have been Oshkosh 1998, or earlier. Anyhow, this was
my first flight in the Sling Shot. Quite a bit of difference between
it and all the other Kolb models I had flown up to that time. Took a
little time to adjust to those little bitty lift struts and wings.
Once I found out I would not fall out of the sky and the SS would fly
much like all the others, I had a ball.
Spring is coming,
john h
mkIII
Message 36
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About slips -- in my 170 I slipped a LOT. Placarded against it w/full
flaps but I never could get the tail to stall; slips in any
configuration were no problems, in some 2700 hrs. Interestingly, even
with the big rudder of a 170 you ran out of rudder control first
Russ K
do not archive
On Jan 23, 2007, at 9:59 PM, Larry Bourne wrote:
>
> I had most of my training and have done most of my flying in a
> C-172, and, as I recall, they're fine in slips - but not with
> flaps. I believe the flaps change the airflow characteristics to
> where you can stall the tail while slipping at low speeds. On
> short final, that's not a thing you need real
> bad. Lar.
>
> Larry Bourne
> Santa Fe, NM
> www.gogittum.com
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: <knowvne@aol.com>
> To: <kolb-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 5:31 PM
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: FLAME OUTS
>
>
>>
>> Hi Ellery
>> Do you know if it's an approved manuver for the firestar ?
>>
>> I use to slip in a flight schools 172 till I learned it wasn't
>> rated for it...... 8-/
>>
>> Mark Vaughn
>
>
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planecrazzzy wrote:
> Hey Big Lar,
> The "key" your talking about.... is 40
>
> Mine will drop in fast at 40..... but if I shoot for 50 , she glides VERY good
>
> Gotta Fly...
> Mike in MN
Thats 2 reports of firestars that glide well...
Im beginning to suspect that the Firestar has a much better glide ratio than the
MK-III Xtra.
Michael A. Bigelow
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90269#90269
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If we are taking a poll, mine glided a measured 6 miles with 4000 feet of
elevation. I figured 8 to 1. This was without a motor turning.
Larry
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 7:23 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb glider
>
>
> planecrazzzy wrote:
>> Hey Big Lar,
>> The "key" your talking about.... is 40
>>
>> Mine will drop in fast at 40..... but if I shoot for 50 , she glides
>> VERY good
>>
>> Gotta Fly...
>> Mike in MN
>
>
> Thats 2 reports of firestars that glide well...
> Im beginning to suspect that the Firestar has a much better glide ratio
> than the MK-III Xtra.
>
> Michael A. Bigelow
>
> --------
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
> could have !!!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90269#90269
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Kolb History |
John do you remember the year the older guy that drove the pelican in the
ditch on the East end of the runway? Have you ever met anyone that new him? I
often wonder how his widow and son are dooing, I understand the volinteer
that was with him is having a hard time geting over it malcolm
Message 40
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| Subject: | Re: Kolb History |
> John do you remember the year the older guy that drove the pelican in the ditch
Hi Malcomb: No I don't know about them.
Made an ID mistake on the red Sling Shot. That was Oshkosh 1999 and the Sling
Shot belongs to Bruce Chesnut. Was just now looking at that photo and saw the
912 sitting on it. The old Kolb Sling Shot was powered with a 582.
Xin loi!
john h
mkIII
--------
John Hauck
MKIII/912ULS
hauck's holler, alabama
Read this topic online here:
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Did you receive my email yesterday ?? Having intermittent problems with
this thing. Lar. Do not Archive.
Larry Bourne
Santa Fe, NM
www.gogittum.com
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Same wing, less weight, narrower fuselage.
Could have somthing to do with it. :-)
Denny Rowe, Mk-3
PS: I have flown Quicksilver MXs and their glide performance is nowhere near
any Kolb. Single surface wing, cables and tubes everywhere, no real
enclosure, Come on Guys.
----- Original Message -----
From: "JetPilot" <orcabonita@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 9:23 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb glider
>
>
> planecrazzzy wrote:
>> Hey Big Lar,
>> The "key" your talking about.... is 40
>>
>> Mine will drop in fast at 40..... but if I shoot for 50 , she glides
>> VERY good
>>
>> Gotta Fly...
>> Mike in MN
>
>
> Thats 2 reports of firestars that glide well...
> Im beginning to suspect that the Firestar has a much better glide ratio
> than the MK-III Xtra.
>
> Michael A. Bigelow
>
> --------
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
> could have !!!
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=90269#90269
>
>
> --
> 8:40 PM
>
>
Message 43
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In a message dated 1/24/2007 9:24:50 PM Eastern Standard Time,
orcabonita@hotmail.com writes:
Thats 2 reports of firestars that glide well...
Im beginning to suspect that the Firestar has a much better glide ratio than
the MK-III Xtra.
My FS II, which is about 725 gross, gave me a 6:1 glide ratio.
Howard Shackleford
FS II
SC
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