---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 02/17/07: 27 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 03:10 AM - Re: Gas Tank Study (icrashrc) 2. 05:31 AM - Re: Ultralight Callsign (Thom Riddle) 3. 05:36 AM - Re: Poly fiber (planecrazzzy) 4. 06:59 AM - Re: Ultralight Callsign (John Hauck) 5. 07:31 AM - HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC (Chuck Stonex) 6. 08:15 AM - Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC (David Key) 7. 09:46 AM - Re: Re: Poly fiber (Arizona Man) 8. 10:26 AM - Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC (Chuck Stonex) 9. 10:53 AM - Re: Poly fiber (planecrazzzy) 10. 11:00 AM - Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC (planecrazzzy) 11. 11:09 AM - Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC (knowvne@aol.com) 12. 11:24 AM - Re: Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC (Chuck Stonex) 13. 11:33 AM - Re: Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC (snuffy@usol.com) 14. 12:14 PM - Re: Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC (knowvne@aol.com) 15. 01:09 PM - Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane (Herb Gayheart) 16. 01:34 PM - Alot of "V" speed info (planecrazzzy) 17. 03:49 PM - Re: Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane (Richard Girard) 18. 03:54 PM - Re: Alot of "V" speed info (Thom Riddle) 19. 04:28 PM - Re: Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane (Herb Gayheart) 20. 05:05 PM - Re: Re: Gas Tank Study (Larry Bourne) 21. 05:34 PM - Re: Alot of "V" speed info (planecrazzzy) 22. 06:25 PM - Re: Re: Alot of "V" speed info (Bob Noyer) 23. 06:30 PM - Pictures (Steven Green) 24. 06:57 PM - 23 gal tank (Craig Nelson) 25. 07:47 PM - October in Alabama (John Hauck) 26. 08:57 PM - Re: Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane (Richard Pike) 27. 09:49 PM - Pictures of winter flying Dec. 2000 (Jack Carillon) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 03:10:59 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Gas Tank Study From: "icrashrc" I would be interested in pictures, dimensions, plans, drawings, ect. of the 16 gallon tank from Kolb. Feel free to send what you have back channel if you don't think it all belongs on the list. icrashrc@aol.com -------- Scott do not archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-635#95635 ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 05:31:04 AM PST US From: Thom Riddle Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ultralight Callsign ... if you see/have any Far Ants, pls send.... Bob, As I said, no FAR ANTS around here, but if they were good for clearing snow and ice, they would be worth their weight in gold this time of year. So far this month we've not had a single day in which the high temperature was anywhere near thawing. Y'all down south refer to 32 degrees F as the freezing temperature, up here we call it the thawing temperature. Thom in Buffalo do not archive ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 05:36:12 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Poly fiber From: "planecrazzzy" Hey Ron, You know the next plane I'm building will cruise around 200 mph....it has fabric on the fuselage and tail....They use 2.7 oz On my Firestar I have 1.7 oz....but I'm 3 times slower Seems to me that 1.7 oz is plenty strong after the poly soaks into it... although , in this picture you can see how it stretches and bows between the ribs... Gotta Fly... Mike in MN -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-645#95645 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/2nd_flight_cambridge_airport_3000agl_216.jpg ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 06:59:06 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ultralight Callsign Y'all down south refer to 32 | degrees F as the freezing temperature, up here we call it the thawing | temperature. | | Thom in Buffalo Thom: Buffalo is in another country, north of the Arctic Circle, is it not? We bumped 19F last night. Coldest temp this year. Hopefully, it will be the last. I got stuff to do outside and freezing temps and me do not get along. ;-) john h mkIII DO NOT ARCHIVE ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 07:31:56 AM PST US From: "Chuck Stonex" Subject: Kolb-List: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC This is off topic but I know it will get to a lot of readers. Yesterday my daughter had to put her dog to sleep because he was turning aggressive towards her and other animals in the house. It was very difficult for her to do. He was an eight year old catahula male that she raised from a pup. She is looking for a good quality 13 inch beagle male under 12 weeks old. We live in Des Moines and have not had much luck finding one here from a breeder who knows what he is talking about or that sounds trustworthy. If any one knows of anybody who has a litter available, please let me know off list. My email is cstonex@msn.com. Thanks guys. Chuck S _________________________________________________________________ Mortgage rates as low as 4.625% - Refinance $150,000 loan for $579 a month. Intro*Terms http://www.NexTag.com ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:15:55 AM PST US From: "David Key" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC This would be considered SPAM >From: "Chuck Stonex" >To: FlyChallenger@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Kolb-List: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC >Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:31:07 -0600 > > >This is off topic but I know it will get to a lot of readers. Yesterday my >daughter had to put her dog to sleep because he was turning aggressive >towards her and other animals in the house. It was very difficult for her >to do. He was an eight year old catahula male that she raised from a pup. >She is looking for a good quality 13 inch beagle male under 12 weeks old. >We live in Des Moines and have not had much luck finding one here from a >breeder who knows what he is talking about or that sounds trustworthy. If >any one knows of anybody who has a litter available, please let me know off >list. My email is cstonex@msn.com. >Thanks guys. >Chuck S > >_________________________________________________________________ >Mortgage rates as low as 4.625% - Refinance $150,000 loan for $579 a month. >Intro*Terms http://www.NexTag.com > > ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:46:41 AM PST US From: Arizona Man Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Poly fiber ---- planecrazzzy wrote: ============ Hey Ron, You know the next plane I'm building will cruise around 200 mph....it has fabric on the fuselage and tail....They use 2.7 oz On my Firestar I have 1.7 oz....but I'm 3 times slower Seems to me that 1.7 oz is plenty strong after the poly soaks into it... although , in this picture you can see how it stretches and bows between the ribs... Gotta Fly... Mike in MN -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-645#95645 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/2nd_flight_cambridge_airport_3000agl_216.jpg I started wondering about it after I checked the Aircraft Spruce site for coverings. I know the convention is with lighter grade, but you know how it is, you get to thinking hey how much more weight can it be total for the aircraft? Not that I care all that much, I figure I got enough HP for the extra weight. Maybe a combo of heavy stuff on high wear areas and light stuff on the wings. I just ordered 1/4 inch alum angle to fabricate the engine mounts. I ain't cutting that fuselage till I have the mounts on the engine and I know exactly where I need to weld the new parallel bars on the cage. also need to finish up the muffler, and then the engine is done. I completely rebuilt that Suzuki 1.3 liter even with stainless steel valves and such. So far all I have invested in that motor is about $1K, the drive is going to be almost 2K and some other accessories I figure total price will be about 4K. Still lots of money but the alternatives some of which are clearly inferior are more. What are building next (sounds like a Stagger Wing)? ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 10:26:24 AM PST US From: "Chuck Stonex" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC David Key this is not spam ...this is a genuine request for assistance .... If you don't know the answer then ignore it. That is what a caring person would do. This would be considered SPAM >From: "Chuck Stonex" >To: FlyChallenger@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Kolb-List: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC >Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:31:07 -0600 > > >This is off topic but I know it will get to a lot of readers. Yesterday my >daughter had to put her dog to sleep because he was turning aggressive >towards her and other animals in the house. It was very difficult for her >to do. He was an eight year old catahula male that she raised from a pup. >She is looking for a good quality 13 inch beagle male under 12 weeks old. >We live in Des Moines and have not had much luck finding one here from a >breeder who knows what he is talking about or that sounds trustworthy. If >any one knows of anybody who has a litter available, please let me know off >list. My email is cstonex@msn.com. >Thanks guys. >Chuck S > >_________________________________________________________________ >Mortgage rates as low as 4.625% - Refinance $150,000 loan for $579 a month. >Intro*Terms http://www.NexTag.com > > _________________________________________________________________ Mortgage rates as low as 4.625% - Refinance $150,000 loan for $579 a month. Intro*Terms http://www.NexTag.com ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 10:53:43 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Poly fiber From: "planecrazzzy" Huh ??? . .. .. .. -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-702#95702 ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 11:00:39 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC From: "planecrazzzy" Looks like donkey is the one who Spammed the list , not you chuck... I don't get it...? He's always ready with a flame.... Gotta Fly... Mike in MN ( could use a good flame ...Brrr) PS look online fer your dog...I'm sure you'll find one.( google ? ) (Amashound.com....He he he ) -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-703#95703 ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 11:09:23 AM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC From: knowvne@aol.com In deed... Chuck Just ignore the man behind the curtain... 8-/ Mark Vaughn -----Original Message----- From: cstonex@msn.com Sent: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 1:25 PM Subject: RE: Kolb-List: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC David Key this is not spam ...this is a genuine request for assistance .... If you don't know the answer then ignore it. That is what a caring person would do. This would be considered SPAM >From: "Chuck Stonex" >To: FlyChallenger@yahoogroups.com >Subject: Kolb-List: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC >Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:31:07 -0600 > > >This is off topic but I know it will get to a lot of readers. Yesterday my >daughter had to put her dog to sleep because he was turning aggressive >towards her and other animals in the house. It was very difficult for her >to do. He was an eight year old catahula male that she raised from a pup. >She is looking for a good quality 13 inch beagle male under 12 weeks old. >We live in Des Moines and have not had much luck finding one here from a >breeder who knows what he is talking about or that sounds trustworthy. If >any one knows of anybody who has a litter available, please let me know off >list. My email is cstonex@msn.com. >Thanks guys. >Chuck S > >_________________________________________________________________ >Mortgage rates as low as 4.625% - Refinance $150,000 loan for $579 a month. >Intro*Terms http://www.NexTag.com > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ Mortgage rates as low as 4.625% - Refinance $150,000 loan for $579 a month. Intro*Terms http://www.NexTag.com ________________________________________________________________________ across the web, free AOL Mail and more. =0 ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 11:24:11 AM PST US From: "Chuck Stonex" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC Thanks Mike .... were doing what ever we can to try to find one. Too cold to fly here ..... 22.8deg now at 1.22pm. It was 4 degrees yesterday. Warmer days are coming Chuck Looks like donkey is the one who Spammed the list , not you chuck... I don't get it...? He's always ready with a flame.... Gotta Fly... Mike in MN ( could use a good flame ...Brrr) PS look online fer your dog...I'm sure you'll find one.( google ? ) (Amashound.com....He he he ) -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-703#95703 _________________________________________________________________ Dont miss your chance to WIN 10 hours of private jet travel from Microsoft ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 11:33:50 AM PST US From: snuffy@usol.com Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC My favorite beagle was a pilot in WWI he shot down the Bloody Red Baron numerous times........I think from a Kolbra....... ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 12:14:52 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC From: knowvne@aol.com RUFF way to go 8-) hahaha Mark Vaughn -----Original Message----- From: snuffy@usol.com Sent: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 3:36 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: HELP NEEDED IN IOWA/ Off TOPIC My favorite beagle was a pilot in WWI he shot down the Bloody Red Baron numerous times........I think from a Kolbra....... ________________________________________________________________________ across the web, free AOL Mail and more. ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 01:09:34 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane From: Herb Gayheart Guys One of the things that seems not to be known by anyone that I have talked to over the years, is the composition and technology behind the covering and finishing systems that we use on fabric planes.. Surely someone on the net can tell us how to make our own paints? I think we have seen most products go up 10 to 20 percent this year.. Seems like a good time to try to circumvent the Aircraft coating companies.. 200 dollars a gal seems absurd to me.. Here is a little blurb.. Herb ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 01:34:06 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Alot of "V" speed info From: "planecrazzzy" Hey guys, Here's some good reading on V-speeds.... http://whitts.alioth.net/Pageb11About%20Aircraft%20Speeds.htm#V_S_ Gotta Fly... Mike in MN -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-728#95728 ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:49:50 PM PST US From: "Richard Girard" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane Herb, One of the biggest problems with the alternative coating systems, whether urethane, latex, or whatever is how to make a repair should you get a tear or a bad case of hangar rash. Another is UV protection of the fabric. Yet another is selling your creation to a repairman or an A & P when your next annual is due. If you look down the road a piece, the price of knowing that the covering job on which you lavished your time and attention is going to give you the service you deserve is pretty cheap, really. Remember, all that stuff about lift and drag is a sham. Airplanes fly on money, usually in large quantities. :-) Rick On 2/17/07, Herb Gayheart wrote: > > Guys > > One of the things that seems not to be known by anyone that I have > talked to over the years, is the composition and technology behind the > covering and finishing systems that we use on fabric planes.. > > Surely someone on the net can tell us how to make our own paints? > > I think we have seen most products go up 10 to 20 percent this year.. > Seems like a good time to try to circumvent the Aircraft coating > companies.. 200 dollars a gal seems absurd to me.. > > Here is a little blurb.. > > > Herb > > -- Rick Girard "Ya'll drop on in" takes on a whole new meaning when you live at the airport. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 03:54:53 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Alot of "V" speed info From: "Thom Riddle" ....alioth.net/Pageb11About%20Aircraft%20Speeds.htm#V_S_ That sure was a lot of words about V speeds etc. Unfortunately some of it is self-contradictory, much of it hard to follow and contains a lot of absolutes, some of which are just not correct. That is not to say that it does not contain some good info, but I believe there are other sources for this sort of information that are easier to understand. Two such sources are listed below. http://www.auf.asn.au/groundschool/contents.html http://www.av8n.com/how/ Thom in Buffalo Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-741#95741 ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 04:28:30 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane From: Herb Gayheart Hi Ed Just trying to know more about paints and coatings.. I have used Poly Tone three times.. my mini Max came to me with an auto base coat/clear coat finish and it looked super.. Sherwin Williams Ultra 2000. It was expensive also.. I do not want to get into the aircraft paint business.. too old for that... Just want to have the knowledge to make informed decisions.. When I am asked to grab my ankles... just want to know that the benefits out weight the disadvantages.. :-) Herb do not archive.. On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 17:49:21 -0600 "Richard Girard" writes: Herb, One of the biggest problems with the alternative coating systems, whether urethane, latex, or whatever is how to make a repair should you get a tear or a bad case of hangar rash. Another is UV protection of the fabric. Yet another is selling your creation to a repairman or an A & P when your next annual is due. If you look down the road a piece, the price of knowing that the covering job on which you lavished your time and attention is going to give you the service you deserve is pretty cheap, really. Remember, all that stuff about lift and drag is a sham. Airplanes fly on money, usually in large quantities. :-) ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 05:05:48 PM PST US From: "Larry Bourne" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Gas Tank Study Here's dimensions of the stock Kolb (TOK) 16 gal tank. Lar. Larry Bourne Santa Fe, NM www.gogittum.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "icrashrc" Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2007 3:10 AM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Gas Tank Study > > I would be interested in pictures, dimensions, plans, drawings, ect. of > the 16 gallon tank from Kolb. Feel free to send what you have back channel > if you don't think it all belongs on the list. > > icrashrc@aol.com > ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 05:34:58 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Alot of "V" speed info From: "planecrazzzy" Hey , Thanks Thom....I bookmarked those...alot of interesting stuff there. Gotta Fly... Mike & "Jaz" in MN -------- .. .. .. .. .. Do Not Archive Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p-758#95758 ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 06:25:55 PM PST US From: Bob Noyer Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Alot of "V" speed info Both of these URLs contain the old "suction on top of the wing makes lift" canard...to make a nice pun. Maybe 16%. Let's get Newton back! regards, Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/ do not archive ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 06:30:25 PM PST US From: "Steven Green" Subject: Kolb-List: Pictures Pictures: Fuel tank holds 20 gal. which gives 3 hrs. with 1 hr reserve. Hiwassee river between Benton and Starr Mountains in October 2005. Steven Green MKIII 912S Do not archive ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 06:57:30 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: 23 gal tank From: "Craig Nelson" 23 gal do not archive _________________________________________________________________________ _____________ The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination, or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. Ifyou receive this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. ________________________________ Message 25 ____________________________________ Time: 07:47:57 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Kolb-List: October in Alabama Hi Gang: James Tripp cruising his FSII at 6,000 feet over Alabama. Shot from Miss P'fer. john h mkIII DO NOT ARHCIVE ________________________________ Message 26 ____________________________________ Time: 08:57:26 PM PST US From: "Richard Pike" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane Years ago I decide my Hummer's factory sails were no longer airworthy, and recovered it with generic dacron, purchased from Aircraft Spruce for about a third the cost of Stits fabric. Painted it with Sears Latex Gloss Black for U/V protection, based on the premise that it would be staying in a hangar, and the original sail had lasted for ten years, and (according to Mike Fischer - Fischer Flying Products, the black makes a good U/V barrier) and then I trimmed it out in high gloss yellow, from Sherwin-Williams. Had about $300 in the whole affair. The best Latex you can buy is only about $25 a gallon. Latex is super easy to do, works well, not too glossy, just don't lay two Latex painted surfaces together, they will adhere to each other, and when you separate them, something bad will happen. Attached the fabric to the structure with Rand-O-Bond. Stits Poly-Tak would probably be as good. If price is the main consideration, go with Latex. If you want it airplaney - go with something else. (spend money) I don't plan to ever do another airplane, but if I did, I think I would try using Classic Coatings dope (Aircraft Spruce). Dope is like lacquer, gives a pretty finish, is cheaper than Stits, and I have always found dope easy to work with. Swimming upstream here - Richard Pike MKIII N420P (420ldPoops) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Herb Gayheart" Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2007 4:07 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Ole Paint! Not the horse! Polyurethane > Guys > > One of the things that seems not to be known by anyone that I have > talked to over the years, is the composition and technology behind the > covering and finishing systems that we use on fabric planes.. > > Surely someone on the net can tell us how to make our own paints? > > I think we have seen most products go up 10 to 20 percent this year.. > Seems like a good time to try to circumvent the Aircraft coating > companies.. 200 dollars a gal seems absurd to me.. > > Here is a little blurb.. > > > Herb > > ________________________________ Message 27 ____________________________________ Time: 09:49:28 PM PST US From: Jack Carillon Subject: Kolb-List: Pictures of winter flying Dec. 2000 I've been reading the list everyday for many years and really enjoy the info and seeing the pictures you guys send. Here are some pixs I shot from the back seat of my 1994 Firestar II In Nov. of 2000 with my son Bob flying a straight in approach to my friend Leonard's 600 foot strip where i kept my Kolb at the time. Temp that day was about 25 degrees. His strip starts at the edge of the snow. In the last pix you can just see the nose of a Kolb in the hanger to the right, this is the one Ralph Hoover(Ohio Ralph) ended up with after it was sold 2 or 3 times. Jack Carillon Akron , Oh. 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