Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 05:57 AM - Re: carburetor rebuilt schedule (Thom Riddle)
2. 07:49 AM - Re: Re: RPM Drop (knowvne@aol.com)
3. 07:53 AM - Re: carburetor rebuilt schedule (Roger Lee)
4. 10:19 AM - Re: Re: carburetor rebuilt schedule/Justified Maintenance (John Hauck)
5. 12:13 PM - jswan/Carburetor rebuilt schedule (Arksey@aol.com)
6. 01:33 PM - Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? (funderp47)
7. 02:26 PM - Re: carburetor rebuilt schedule/Justified Maintenance (Roger Lee)
8. 04:06 PM - Re: prop hub extentions (Paul Petty)
9. 04:13 PM - Uncle Craig (Paul Petty)
10. 04:59 PM - Re: Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? (WhiskeyVictor36@aol.com)
11. 05:18 PM - Re: Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? (Richard Pike)
12. 07:05 PM - Parts Replacement (Bob Noyer)
13. 08:43 PM - Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? (R. Hankins)
14. 08:45 PM - Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? (R. Hankins)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: carburetor rebuilt schedule |
...The manual says every 200 hrs. for the 912uls and the rebuild kit
cost $214 for
the pair from CPS....
A couple months ago, I removed, cleaned and inspected the carbs on a
Diamond Katana with certified 912F engine at the request of the owner.
(I'm an FAA Powerplant Mechanic so it was legal.) The reason for doing
it was that he had hard starting when hot and rough idle. Upon
inspection I found that both starter jets were wrong number, one too
rich, and one two lean, the mixture adjust o-ring was brittle and
cracked on both carbs. I ordered the minimum of rebuild kits from
Lockwood since they are cheaper than Bing distributor prices and new
starter jets. The whole thing for both carbs was about $60. I replaced
only the parts that needed replacing, cleaned everything, reassembled
it, balanced the carbs and gave the owner the left over gaskets and
o-rings that came in the minimum gasket/seal kit for him to use if/when
they are needed. It runs like a sewing machine now. The condition of
the o-rings as well as inspection of the log books told me that the
carbs had never been removed, cleaned and inspected in a few thousand
hours.
The moral of this story is that manufacturers and parts suppliers make
money by selling parts. IF they can sell you a $214 kit every 200 hours
of use, it accomplishes two things. 1) covers their arse. 2) generates
a lot of un-earned income for them. I did not replace the gaskets and
o-rings that were still in good shape, nor the float mechanism parts
because they were still good and new ones are expensive. If they don't
need it, your replacing them makes the manufacturers and parts
suppliers very happy and your wallet thinner, but does nothing to
enhance the function or operation of your engine. If they are needed,
then by all means replace them, otherwise, why waste your money?
Get to know your engine and listen to it and monitor it very carefully.
It will tell you when it needs attention. It costs nothing but a little
labor to remove, inspect and clean the carbs, so doing it every 200
hours is not a bad idea, but replacing parts that are still good is a
waste of money IMO. If you take apart a Bing Carb please do yourself a
favor and spend the $10 Bing charges for their manual, before doing so,
it is the cheapest and best investment one can make regarding Bing
carbs.
My opinion is cheap, as is my labor or my airplane, but Bing parts
(except for their manual) are outrageously priced.
Thom in Buffalo
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Jim
Thanks for the Read 8-)
Some abit over my Grey Matter but interesting material just the same...
Thanks
Ignorant 2 2 Strokes...
Mark Vaughn
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| Subject: | Re: carburetor rebuilt schedule |
Hi John,
I think Thom makes a good point.
I'm with you on not always rebuilding carbs every 200 hrs. It was only what the
manual stated and a price out of CPS. I believe in inspecting and sync to check
performance. That being said, I would only not follow the book if I did not
have any warranty or insurance.
I think flying is taking care of your aircraft before something becomes an issue.
Sometimes stretching something out to the last penny cost you more later in
money and heartache.
We all believe this to some point, more or less, or we wouldn't change oil, filters
or plugs by the tach, we would wait until we squeezed the last penny out
of our oil, filter and plugs. We all have our own limits on replacement programs
from the manual.
My new plane is warrantied and insured so I pretty much go by the book. The first
incident and they will check your logbook for proper maint. If poor maint.
schedule or a mod. is noted which contributed to an incident then you might as
well not even have a warranty and and not bother with insurance at all.
We all have seen too many people fly and their lives hang on the all mightly dollar
and no matter what you say you couldn't convence them of this. You have a
bigger responsibility to yourself to come home every night. We have had too many
crashes this year for different reasons, but to save a dollar!
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98853#98853
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| Subject: | Re: carburetor rebuilt schedule/Justified Maintenance |
all mightly dollar and no matter what you say you couldn't convence
them of this. You have a bigger responsibility to yourself to come
home every night. We have had too many crashes this year for different
reasons, but to save a dollar!
|
| --------
| Roger Lee
Roger:
Whoa............Amigo.
Maybe you misunderstood what I was saying.
I would not be here today if I scrimped on maintenance, inspections,
and was not a responsible aviator. I wouldn't fly around the patch if
I thought there might be some problem looming ahead if I had not done
my home work.
However, I do not believe in trashing good parts because CPS or anyone
else says to. Carbs are easy because we can see the wear.
I don't stretch oil changes, plugs, or any other maintenance on my
airplane to save a penny, but I don't throw my money away either.
If something needs replacing on the engine I do that, but not replace
the entire engine. Well, maybe this last time I did. Just
kidding......................
john h
mkIII
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| Subject: | jswan/Carburetor rebuilt schedule |
Hello everyone,
been reading your posts on carburetor rebuild...Here is my 2 cents
worth...
when i brought the firestar with the 503 on it to Florida this winter it
became very hard to start. We bought this plane last fall and this was our 1st
experence with the rotax, so we had a lot to learn. Staying near Sebring in
Florida I took off the Bing carbs and took them to Lockwood aviation to have
them rebuilt. They only replaced the parts needed. The engine had about 325
hours and the carbs may have had the same. They found that the jetting was not
correct and replaced those that needed to be. I decided to replace two of the
floats. The engine now starts excellent with pull start, temps run about 1000
deg on exhaust temp and about 200 on cly head temp. correct carburation is
very important. I have not had to adjust the carbs from the way Lockwood set
them....Flying is good here in Florida.....Jim Swan
firestar ll rotax 503 MI in summer and FL in winter
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| Subject: | Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? |
First post from a long time lurker in NC who has read the Kolb list for years and
may someday own a Kolb. Name's Phil and I presently fly a Hawk from my pasture
at the edge of Wilkes county down 421 from Boone, Mr. Pike. I have learned
a lot from this list and only today felt the need to post.
I have only owned 503's since 1999. I noticed (or didn't notice) the spark on
a CDI is virtually invisible in daylight. The points model I owned was readily
visible and when I bought my first dual CDI 503 I was surprised to learn it
has a weaker spark than the points ignition. I learned to shade the plug to check
for spark.
I've since heard the same thing from others, and have found out Ducati CDIs make
for more difficult pull starting because of insufficient rpms to produce a hot
enough spark.
I'll take the weaker spark for dual ignition.
Basic electronics. When current flows in a circuit, voltage is dropped (lost)
across any resistance. When the plug fires, current flows. Any resistance in
series with the spark plug gap has a voltage drop that robs voltage from the gap.
Each voltage drop across any resistances in this series circuit subtracts from
or reduces the gap voltage. The built in resistance in the spark plug and the
resistance of the spark plug cap are two of them.
So if you use a resistor plug and a resistor cap, you are reducing the voltage
of the spark at the gap. The reduced voltage at the gap makes for less radio interference.
My only experience is with 503's, and although I of 503's with both resistor plugs
and caps that seem to do just fine, I run the non-resistor plug.
Back to lurk mode.
Do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98918#98918
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| Subject: | Re: carburetor rebuilt schedule/Justified Maintenance |
Hi John,
:D
This is why I hate email. No face to face emotion or immediate dialog.
I did not mean to infer that you did not do what is necessary. It was just a general
statement about what other pilots do at times. I really did not mean to
make you think it was directed at you. You have my apology if I offended you.
I do believe that some parts are replaced prematurely and an inspection will suffice.
I think companies will replace an item because they don't always trust
the individual to be able to test or verify the part's condition.
--------
Roger Lee
Tucson, Az.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98925#98925
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| Subject: | Re: prop hub extentions |
Dennis,
I thought the extention was needed to have proper clearance. Without one on my
kolbra the prop would be vert close to the flaps. The reason for this thread was
to find out what everyone is useing. I bought/made 3 before I found the one
closest to what TNK sends out. The problem with the "black" one was it uses the
smaller diamater bolt circle and no lugs (rotax). Daryel at warp was not happy
with this combo. The one Travis sent me for comparison did not have the holes
on the prop side properly sized for the lugs to be "pressed" or "pulled" into
the hub. This has been a real adventure finding out what is used out there.
I have seen it all however I think what we landed on is the closest to right.
If there is such of thing.
p.s. send me a off list e-mail at paupetty@myway.com if you need more photos
p.s.s. call me anytime @ 601-480-9979
--------
Paul Petty
Kolbra #12
Ms Dixie
painting and reassembly
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98942#98942
Attachments:
http://forums.matronics.com//files/p3030041_637.jpg
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Craig,
Love the photos! That is a beautifuf airplane. Can you send me a link to your website
and you e-mail address?
Do not archive
--------
Paul Petty
Kolbra #12
Ms Dixie
painting and reassembly
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98947#98947
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| Subject: | Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? |
In a message dated 3/4/2007 8:41:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jhm9812@yahoo.com writes:
I think I'm going to order some non resistor plugs just in case
John Murphy,
You can get NGK B8ES plugs at an automotive store (Pep Boys), but they won't
have the solid caps. They'll have the screw on type caps. But you could
use them as a test to see if it causes radio interference.
Bill Varnes
Original Kolb FireStar
Audubon NJ
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| Subject: | Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? |
Put the resistor plugs on the two leads for one coil, and the
non-resistor plugs on the leads for the other coil. Do a mag check and
listen to your radio and see if the hash level changes.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
----- Original Message -----
From: WhiskeyVictor36@aol.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 7:59 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not?
In a message dated 3/4/2007 8:41:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jhm9812@yahoo.com writes:
I think I'm going to order some non resistor plugs just in case
John Murphy,
You can get NGK B8ES plugs at an automotive store (Pep Boys), but they
won't have the solid caps. They'll have the screw on type caps. But
you could use them as a test to see if it causes radio interference.
Bill Varnes
Original Kolb FireStar
Audubon NJ
Do Not Archive
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| Subject: | Parts Replacement |
This is not Kolb-related except that it pertains to parts replacements.
In '65 I started a new job at old Collins Radio Co. as director of
Factory Repair & Modification Div. Arthur Collins was still there,
running the whole dang factory out of his roll top desk. He promptly
summoned me for what became The Reading of the Tablets (Moses style).
His main, and stern, directive was: Every repair and/or modification
was to end with the "radio" (all boxes were called radios, regardless
of their use...autopilots, OBS heads, etc) looking and operation like
new i.e., like it had just come from the production line! That was
all, no questions, just git 'er done.
Of course this was patently impossible, especially with the
constraints of charges and turn around time. Since Mr. Collins was
busy trying to get into the computer field, which cost him the
control of the company, he let me alone. After several attempts to
walk on water, go head-to-head with various airline bean counters and
maint. chiefs, I was able to slightly water-down The Edict whereby we
turned out the "radios" adhering to their advertised specs
("brochure" numbers) and with minor exterior blemishes (normal wear
and tear usage). This satisfied the airline customers, with the
possible exception of the ham radio guys who always complained about
the price.
This departure from the wholesale replacement of components, in many
cases that had many hours of good service left, did not lower the
quality of repair/modification, and lowered the cost dramatically.
However, used components which could have from hangar-queen boxes,
were never used in repair, regardless of the age of the radio. This
led to the establishment of another department, Department Zero,
whose job was to build out-of-production components. That's another
story, a very difficult problem, time and money-wise. Another time,
another story.
regards,
Bob N. FireFly 070 Old Kolb
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg/ronoy/
do not archive
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? |
After a careful search of the Rotax Parts manual I replaced my resistor caps and
installed resistor plugs as well. My radio noise decreased; my climb rate did
not. The idle seems to be just a touch rougher, but temps were in the low
60's this weekend and I didn't lower my needles 'til after I got back home. I
did lots of slow flight, stalls and sink rate testing at an idle and the engine
was a little less smooth, but never even hinted at wanting to die. Throttle
response was positive and instant. Interestingly, the non-resistor plugs are
not listed for the 503 in the current on-line parts manual.
Many of the newer 2 stroke dirt bikes use resistor plug because the R/F generated
by standard plugs can mess with the electronic ignition at high RPMs (or so
a local dealer tells me).
By the way, if you need new caps and plugs, go to sparkplugs.com. They have the
NGK LB50EZ plug caps (same NGK part number as on my 503) for $2.24 ea. Rotax
price is over $16ea. You will have to live with black instead of red; Otherwise
they are identical. They have plugs as well. Just type in "solid" after
the plug number to get the solid tops. Be careful, Aircraft Spruce will send
you screw tops. You would think an aircraft supply outfit would know better (or
at least tell you they are screw tops).
Here is the address to a .pdf of NGK's resistor cap number scheme for anyone interested.
http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/docs/Resistor_Covers.pdf
Fly when the sun shines, fish for steelhead when it rains!
--------
Roger in Oregon
1992 KXP 503
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98998#98998
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: NGK Spark Plugs - resistor or not? |
After a careful search of the Rotax Parts manual I replaced my resistor caps and
installed resistor plugs as well. My radio noise decreased; my climb rate did
not. The idle seems to be just a touch rougher, but temps were in the low
60's this weekend and I didn't lower my needles 'til after I got back home. I
did lots of slow flight, stalls and sink rate testing at an idle and the engine
was a little less smooth, but never even hinted at wanting to die. Throttle
response was positive and instant. Interestingly, the non-resistor plugs are
not listed for the 503 in the current on-line parts manual.
Many of the newer 2 stroke dirt bikes use resistor plug because the R/F generated
by standard plugs can mess with the electronic ignition at high RPMs (or so
a local dealer tells me).
By the way, if you need new caps and plugs, go to sparkplugs.com. They have the
NGK LB50EZ plug caps (same NGK part number as on my 503) for $2.24 ea. Rotax
price is over $16ea. You will have to live with black instead of red; Otherwise
they are identical. They have plugs as well. Just type in "solid" after
the plug number to get the solid tops. Be careful, Aircraft Spruce will send
you screw tops. You would think an aircraft supply outfit would know better (or
at least tell you they are screw tops).
Here is the address to a .pdf of NGK's resistor cap number scheme for anyone interested.
http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/docs/Resistor_Covers.pdf
Fly when the sun shines, fish for steelhead when it rains!
--------
Roger in Oregon
1992 KXP 503
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=98999#98999
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