Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:30 AM - Re: Fw: gummint (planecrazzzy)
2. 05:16 AM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (N27SB@AOL.COM)
3. 05:33 AM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Dana Hague)
4. 05:37 AM - Re: Ground Idea (joe)
5. 06:01 AM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (DANIEL WALTER)
6. 06:28 AM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Dana Hague)
7. 06:36 AM - Re: Re: Monument Valley 2007 (pat ladd)
8. 06:40 AM - Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (pat ladd)
9. 06:41 AM - Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (pat ladd)
10. 07:49 AM - Re: Re: Monument Valley 2007 (Craig Nelson)
11. 08:22 AM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Richard & Martha Neilsen)
12. 08:52 AM - Re: Re: Monument Valley 2007 (Gherkins Tim-rp3420)
13. 09:52 AM - Re: Monument Valley 2007 (Doug Wetzel)
14. 11:19 AM - Re: VW Redrive Update (David Lucas)
15. 11:22 AM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (N27SB@aol.com)
16. 11:24 AM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Dana Hague)
17. 11:36 AM - Fiberglass Fuel Tank (N27SB@aol.com)
18. 01:07 PM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (WillUribe@aol.com)
19. 01:14 PM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Larry Cottrell)
20. 01:15 PM - Re: Re: Monument Valley 2007 (russ kinne)
21. 01:22 PM - Assembly manual on CD (Tom Deiulio)
22. 01:27 PM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Dana Hague)
23. 01:28 PM - Re: Fiberglass Fuel Tank (Paul Petty)
24. 01:41 PM - Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Paul Petty)
25. 01:50 PM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (GeoR38@aol.com)
26. 02:11 PM - Re: Re: Cuyuna (GeoR38@aol.com)
27. 02:29 PM - Fw: Re: Monument Valley 2007 (John Hauck)
28. 02:38 PM - Re: Re: Monument Valley 2007 (John Hauck)
29. 02:52 PM - Re: Re: Cuyuna (Richard Pike)
30. 03:29 PM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Dennis Souder)
31. 03:32 PM - Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. (possums)
32. 03:36 PM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Dennis Souder)
33. 03:45 PM - Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. (knowvne@aol.com)
34. 03:53 PM - Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. (Richard Pike)
35. 04:27 PM - Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. (Earl & Mim Zimmerman)
36. 05:47 PM - Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. (snuffy@usol.com)
37. 05:49 PM - Re: Re: Monument Valley 2007 (John Hauck)
38. 05:53 PM - Re: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Dana Hague)
39. 05:57 PM - Re: Re: Cuyuna (Dana Hague)
40. 06:15 PM - Re: Re: Cuyuna (John Hauck)
41. 07:19 PM - Twinstar (joe)
42. 07:45 PM - Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. (knowvne@aol.com)
43. 08:11 PM - Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points (Jack B. Hart)
44. 08:28 PM - F F Fore sale ()
45. 08:31 PM - ooops F F fore sale ()
46. 10:40 PM - Kolb Wing Attach Points (possums)
Message 1
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Fwd: gummint |
Hey Bob,
I got one of those....it said it was only Voluntary....
I did fill it out....But if they send it again , and it's still voluntary ,
I'm not gonna fill it out again.....it said it wasn't for the FAA
it was some "study" thing....?
I hope they don't make it manditory.......uh....no....I didn't fly last year...
Oh, fuel receipts , that was for my motorcycle, yeah my motorcycle....
Gotta Fly...
Mike in MN / N381PM
--------
.
.
.
.
.
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=105424#105424
Message 2
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
In a message dated 4/6/2007 11:36:33 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
orcabonita@hotmail.com writes:
To put the next size bigger pin in, I will have to be careful to drill the
holes larger only inwards, taking care not to make the holes any closer to the
edges, but there is plenty of material to do this. See the attached
picture.
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you
could have !!!
Mike,
What you propose to do is not that easy. You may end up with loose out of
round holes in your pursuit to improve a tested design. As an alternative you
might consider using spacers or washers to fill the gaps. If you carefully trim
a spacer to a snug fit you will be able to tighten your bolt without
deflecting the main tabs. Deflecting the tabs would also worsen your situation.
Steve B
do not archive
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 3
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
At 11:35 PM 4/6/2007, JetPilot wrote:
>
>That is a very good analisys of the loads on the pins, where did you get
>the figures for bending the pins across 1 inch ? According to your
>figures, the pin is only 1/10 th as strong when the load is bending
>instead of sheer, which seems about right.
I just treated the pin as a small beam in bending, supported at the ends,
and calculated the stresses.
>There is very little force on the trailing edge attachment of a Kolb, I
>would not worry at all about that. My MK III weighs almost 3 times what
>the Ultrastar and the Firefly do, but uses the same size pins... What is
>not an issue on some planes could be on others.
At low AOA (i.e. cruise) the loads are very low. At high AOA the drag
loads can become significant... I guess a good reason not to do high speed
accelerated stalls or snap rolls in these planes.. . :)
>The one thing I think you got wrong is the stress on that center pin that
>I am talking about. It is more than the weight of the airplane.
No, remember that each wing holds only half of the plane's weight.
>NAS 6600 hardware is used as aircraft structrual bolts, and is used in
>many airplanes for very high stress wing spar attachment ( Low wing planes
>with no struts ). This type of bolt was recommended to me by an airline
>structrual inspector. I searched the applications and confirmed this to
>be true before switching bolts.
It may very well be fine, probably is, I haven't seen the actual specs for
those fasteners.
Hopefully I can get some work done on my plane this weekend (including
replacing all the fasteners we've been discussing with new ones) so I can
have it done in time for Homer's fly-in...
-Dana
--
--
The citizens of the United States are getting the government they deserve.
The problem is that I'm also getting the government they deserve.
Message 4
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
That is very clean looking, and should be a solid ground.
Joe
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=105430#105430
Message 5
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dana Hague" <d-m-hague@comcast.net>
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 8:29 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points
I believe it was the Ultrastar wing that was tested to failure, I think the
pins in question all surived. Dennis would know for sure.
Dan Walter
Palmyra PA
Ultrastar
do not archive
Message 6
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
At 09:01 AM 4/7/2007, DANIEL WALTER wrote:
>I believe it was the Ultrastar wing that was tested to failure, I think the
>pins in question all surived. Dennis would know for sure.
Yes, he beat on it until the drag strut (which the pin is on the end of)
failed in compression. The design was changed to reinforce the drag strut
and they called it good enough.
Took balls with only a hand thrown parachute...
-Dana
--
--
The citizens of the United States are getting the government they deserve.
The problem is that I'm also getting the government they deserve.
Message 7
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Monument Valley 2007 |
I can't believe you left out the most important "C" word - it's chocolate,
of course!>>
Being mere male it never occurred to me.
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
Message 8
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
RSJ= Real Stout Joist>>
Hi Bob,
well.. it was certainly stout enough that the roof didn`t fall on me
when I hit it.
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
Message 9
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
Whats an RSJ?>>
Hi ,
sorry, different language. Rolled Steel Joist. You call them `I` beams,
I think.
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
Message 10
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Monument Valley 2007 |
COFFEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't know how to make the stuff. Pat if you
drink tea for breakfast you might consider BYOT
Looking forward to meting you
Uncle craig
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pat ladd
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 6:25 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Monument Valley 2007
All you need is a hefty appetite an Iron stomach and a steady hand. BYOC
>>
Hi Craig,
sounds too good to miss. BYOC ????
Bring your own ...
Coffee?
Coca Cola?
Cheese?
Chips?
Chairs?
Chameleon?
Coronet?
Cornet?
Cordwainer?
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which
it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review,
retransmission, dissemination, or other use of, or taking of any action
in reliance upon this information by persons or entities other than the intended
recipient is prohibited. Ifyou receive this in error, please contact the sender
and delete the material from any computer.
Message 11
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
Oh come off it.
There are hundreds of Kolbs out there and there are even a few Kolbs that
have thousands of hours on them with in-flight loads over gross and the has
never been even a bent pin (from flight loads). That's not to say there
isn't maybe a good idea to put spacers in but....
Also that plane that Dennis folded the wing on was one of the newer kolbs
(maybe a MKII). He had to really really work at it to get it to fail. Also
they didn't just fix the drag strut and call it good enough!!! They fully
inspected the wing. If the attach point pins were bent in any way they would
have fixed that also. This wasn't just some required test that they went
thru (it isn't required and no one else cared enough to do this). The point
was they cared enough make sure it was safe. Just don't go fixing something
not broken and make it fail
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIC
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dana Hague" <d-m-hague@comcast.net>
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 9:24 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points
>
> At 09:01 AM 4/7/2007, DANIEL WALTER wrote:
>
>>I believe it was the Ultrastar wing that was tested to failure, I think
>>the
>>pins in question all surived. Dennis would know for sure.
>
> Yes, he beat on it until the drag strut (which the pin is on the end of)
> failed in compression. The design was changed to reinforce the drag strut
> and they called it good enough.
>
> Took balls with only a hand thrown parachute...
>
> -Dana
> --
> --
> The citizens of the United States are getting the government they deserve.
> The problem is that I'm also getting the government they deserve.
>
>
>
Message 12
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Monument Valley 2007 |
Pat/Gang,
I was going to say YES to all the below! Bring it! A Chameleon would
certainly be entertaining, and what is a Cordwaiter, Coronet????
Bring your own ...
Coffee?
Coca Cola?
Cheese?
Chips?
Chairs?
Chameleon?
Coronet?
Cornet?
Cordwainer?
Chocolate?
Tim Gherkins- smaller one of the Milows.
FSII
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Craig Nelson
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 7:49 AM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Monument Valley 2007
--> <Craig.Nelson@heraeus.com>
COFFEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't know how to make the stuff. Pat if you
drink tea for breakfast you might consider BYOT Looking forward to
meting you Uncle craig -----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pat ladd
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 6:25 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Monument Valley 2007
All you need is a hefty appetite an Iron stomach and a steady hand. BYOC
>>
Hi Craig,
sounds too good to miss. BYOC ????
Bring your own ...
Coffee?
Coca Cola?
Cheese?
Chips?
Chairs?
Chameleon?
Coronet?
Cornet?
Cordwainer?
Cheers
Pat
do not archive
The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to
which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged
material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination, or other use of, or
taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or
entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. Ifyou receive
this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from
any computer.
Message 13
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Monument Valley 2007 |
After watching the list for years and wishing my schedule would allow me to
get to MV, plans finally came together this week, and this year looks like
the one. It's been frustrating, since I actually live in Utah - but put me
on the list of whatever activities there might be. We will be staying in
Mexican Hat rather than at Goulding's so reservations are all handled.
Doug Wetzel
Lurking since 2001
Message 14
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: VW Redrive Update |
> Belts are a problem, always breaking, or stripping thier teeth. The are good
for driving alternators etc.., but for spinning a prop I would much rather have
gears.
Was comparing two ribbed drive belts the other day (about 3" wide x 24" circumference).
Could hardly tell the difference between them.
One was brand new, the other had 1,000 hrs on it !
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=105485#105485
Message 15
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
In a message dated 4/7/2007 11:23:33 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
NeilsenRM@comcast.net writes:
That's not to say there
isn't maybe a good idea to put spacers in but....
Hi Rick,
I agree with you that no change is required but the idea of the spacers was
to give some peace of mind to those that do not believe in the tried and
tested method. I also think that if done improperly the spaces could cause harm.
For the record, I use the factory method.
Steve B
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 16
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
At 11:22 AM 4/7/2007, Richard & Martha Neilsen wrote:
>There are hundreds of Kolbs out there and there are even a few Kolbs that
>have thousands of hours on them with in-flight loads over gross and the
>has never been even a bent pin (from flight loads). That's not to say
>there isn't maybe a good idea to put spacers in but....
>
>Also that plane that Dennis folded the wing on was one of the newer kolbs
>(maybe a MKII). He had to really really work at it to get it to fail.
No, it was an Ultrastar:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=19920
I'm not worried about it, myself... as an aeronautical engineer, I was
curious about it from an academic standpoint. I'm leaving my plane stock,
as designed.
-Dana
--
--
The citizens of the United States are getting the government they deserve.
The problem is that I'm also getting the government they deserve.
Message 17
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Fiberglass Fuel Tank |
To All,
Just got done building my fuel tank for my Firefly that I pulled from a mold
I built last week.
I have not drilled and tapped the holes for the fittings yet but the hard
points are in place for a pickup in the small sump in the bottom, a vent in the
bump on top and an upper and lower fitting for a sight gauge. Total weight is
a mere 2.5 lbs including the Usher Aviation filler cap. It is sized for a
direct drop in for the Firefly. I will let you know how it works in a few weeks.
Steve Boetto
Firefly 007 on Floats
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 18
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
Greetings,
In the 11 years I have been a list member, every once in a while, I read
with great amusement how people want to change Homer's design because they feel
they can do a better job. IMHO nothing is going to just break if you build it
to plans so stop worrying so much.
Regards,
Guillermo Uribe
FireStar II N4GU
El Paso, TX
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 19
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
> I'm not worried about it, myself... as an aeronautical engineer, I was
> curious about it from an academic standpoint. I'm leaving my plane stock,
> as designed.
>
> -Dana
>
Then one could safely surmise that you just enjoy being a "Devils Advocate",
or something painful like that! :-/
The most likely failure of any part in a Kolb is always going to be the
brain.
Larry, Oregon
do not archive
Message 20
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Monument Valley 2007 |
The one Pat may have left out is "cutie"!
Cordwainer is a sort-of soft leather shoemaker I think. Not a common
term on this side of The Pond. Not as common as 'cutie'
On Apr 7, 2007, at 11:52 AM, Gherkins Tim-rp3420 wrote:
> <rp3420@freescale.com>
>
> Pat/Gang,
> I was going to say YES to all the below! Bring it! A Chameleon would
> certainly be entertaining, and what is a Cordwaiter, Coronet????
>
> Bring your own ...
> Coffee?
> Coca Cola?
> Cheese?
> Chips?
> Chairs?
> Chameleon?
> Coronet?
> Cornet?
> Cordwainer?
> Chocolate?
>
> Tim Gherkins- smaller one of the Milows.
> FSII
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of Craig
> Nelson
> Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 7:49 AM
> To: kolb-list@matronics.com
> Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Monument Valley 2007
>
> --> <Craig.Nelson@heraeus.com>
>
>
> COFFEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I don't know how to make the stuff. Pat if you
> drink tea for breakfast you might consider BYOT Looking forward to
> meting you Uncle craig -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of pat ladd
> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 6:25 AM
> To: kolb-list@matronics.com
> Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Monument Valley 2007
>
>
> All you need is a hefty appetite an Iron stomach and a steady hand.
> BYOC
>
>>>
>
> Hi Craig,
>
> sounds too good to miss. BYOC ????
>
> Bring your own ...
> Coffee?
> Coca Cola?
> Cheese?
> Chips?
> Chairs?
> Chameleon?
> Coronet?
> Cornet?
> Cordwainer?
>
> Cheers
>
> Pat
>
> do not archive
>
>
> The information transmitted is intended only for the person or
> entity to
> which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged
> material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination, or other use
> of, or
> taking of any action in reliance upon this information by persons or
> entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. Ifyou
> receive
> this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from
> any computer.
>
>
Message 21
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Assembly manual on CD |
Does anyone know when Kolb will release the MkIII Xtra assembly manual
on CD? I have original "classic" paper plans from the mid 90's. In the
mean time if anyone has any details (photos of your own project or
perhaps a snippet of the official plans) of the wing tip bow and
supporting members from the end of the spar tube outward that would be
great. The paper plans are vague at best in this area. I appreciate any
help. Thanks.
Message 22
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
At 04:11 AM 4/8/2007, Larry Cottrell wrote:
>Then one could safely surmise that you just enjoy being a "Devils
>Advocate", or something painful like that! :-/
>
>The most likely failure of any part in a Kolb is always going to be the brain.
The design had me a little nervous, after looking at my own plane. This
discussion (which I didn't start) got me thinking about it... after
analyzing it I came to the conclusion (surprise, surprise) that Homer knew
what he was doing. :)
-Dana
--
--
The citizens of the United States are getting the government they deserve.
The problem is that I'm also getting the government they deserve.
Message 23
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Fiberglass Fuel Tank |
Wow Steve thats pretty! You da man with that fiberglass no doubt!
do not archive
--------
Paul Petty
Kolbra #12
Ms Dixie
Final assembly!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=105508#105508
Message 24
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
Dana,
I guess one does have to trust the design and look at the track record. Myself
dont see how in the world those tiny pins hold up. But im not about to change
such a critical component. You and Mike seam to be pretty brainy about this stuff
so maybe you can enlightn me on something. With the pins being so small but
apparently strong, why are the lift struts so beefy? You should have seen the
barbells for lift struts TNK sent me with my kit [Shocked] they did not fit
the lift strut "ends" and I opted to use the ones that kolb has used for ages.
If the tiny pin is so strong why are the struts so masive? And have 6 AN bolts
in each one?
do not archive
--------
Paul Petty
Kolbra #12
Ms Dixie
Final assembly!
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=105511#105511
Message 25
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
In a message dated 4/7/2007 4:08:38 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
WillUribe@aol.com writes:
Greetings,
In the 11 years I have been a list member, every once in a while, I read
with great amusement how people want to change Homer's design because they feel
they can do a better job. IMHO nothing is going to just break if you build it
to plans so stop worrying so much.
Regards,
Guillermo Uribe
FireStar II N4GU
El Paso, TX
Um witcha !00% buddy!!
George Randolph
firestar driver from theVillages, Fl
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 26
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
In a message dated 4/4/2007 8:36:35 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
worrybear@verizon.net writes:
Dana, In my opinion, the Cayuna with the single Mikuni carb is very
sensitive to jetting, Once you get the jetting matched to the seasons and
airplane you should be able to get away with three main jet changes a year.
You need to pay close attention to the EGT's, too low and you will foul the
plugs and too high and you will sieze. If you don't have a manual for the
cayuna and mikuni you should get one.
Dan Walter
Palmyra, PA
Ultrastar, UL202
Dana I had a Cuyuna on my pterodactyl and it failed several times and
usually I did not know why, but now I think I do. I had no EGT on the plane and
if
I had I would have learned not to let the temps exceed a certain amount based
on the positioning of the EGT probe at the exhaust stack. It almost always
"froze" before bombing me with silence, but as a glider pilot I just flew it
in. Caused me to think of the engine as merely an assist.... a way to bore a
hole in the sky without an extra plane attached.Of course that is the reason
why I never did develop cross country skills though.
As Dan says, I think they would have been reliable if the EGT were a part of
the engine. In those '80s almost no one had EGTS.
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
Message 27
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Monument Valley 2007 |
John Williamson
Jim Hefner
Boyd Young
John Hauck
Steven Green
Larry Cottrell and Karen
Arty Trost
George Thompson
Jim and John Clayton
Will Uribe
Dave Raines?
Larry Bourne
Rick Neilsen
Dennis Kirby
Mike Welch
Pat and Wendy Ladd
Bob Dalton
Tim Gerkin
Craig Nelson
Jeff Warner
BJ Moore
James and Sandy Beard
Doug Wetzel
Tim D (need your last name, please)
The MV 2007 List is up to date once again, I theeeeenk!
If you aren't on the list and should be, add your name and send it
back to the List. Thanks,
john h
mkIII
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 28
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Monument Valley 2007 |
John Williamson
Jim Hefner
Boyd Young
John Hauck
Steven Green
Larry Cottrell and Karen
Arty Trost
George Thompson
Jim and John Clayton
Will Uribe
Dave Raines
Larry Bourne
Rick Neilsen
Dennis Kirby
Mike Welch
Pat and Wendy Ladd
Bob Dalton
Tim Gerkin
Craig Nelson
Jeff Warner
BJ Moore
James and Sandy Beard
Doug Wetzel
Tim D (need your last name, please)
The MV 2007 List is up to date once again, I theeeeenk!
If you aren't on the list and should be, add your name and send it
back to the List. Thanks,
john h
mkIII
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 29
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
My buddy with the FSII/582 in the hangar next door used to have a Hummer
with a Zenoah 250 on it, and a Mikuni pumper carb. The "main jet" was a
needle you turned in and out, ala weed eater carb. We took some 1/4"
vinyl tubing and slipped it over the high speed needle, stuck the tubing
into a 1/4" dowel, more tubing, another dowel, supported the whole rig
with some little brackets, and ran the dowels forward to just behind the
seat, put a knob on the end, where he could reach back and turn it one
way or the other. By watching his egt, he could adjust the carb so that
little Zenoah was always around 1050. It ran like a top. He never had
any trouble out of it at all.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: GeoR38@aol.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 5:10 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: Cuyuna
Dana I had a Cuyuna on my pterodactyl and it failed several times and
usually I did not know why, but now I think I do. I had no EGT on the
plane and if I had I would have learned not to let the temps exceed a
certain amount based on the positioning of the EGT probe at the exhaust
stack. It almost always "froze" before bombing me with silence, but as a
glider pilot I just flew it in. Caused me to think of the engine as
merely an assist.... a way to bore a hole in the sky without an extra
plane attached.Of course that is the reason why I never did develop
cross country skills though.
As Dan says, I think they would have been reliable if the EGT were a
part of the engine. In those '80s almost no one had EGTS.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
See what's free at AOL.com.
Message 30
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
Re: Pins & some anecdotal evidence:
I recall a number of collisions, crashes and other instances where Kolbs
have come to unusually abrupt stops. I recall seeing the square tubing to
which the wing tabs are attached ripped in half - but I have never seen a
failed pin. So, for crash loading (and probably inflight loading as well)
you will probably have more productive time worrying about the strength of
the tube to which the pin is attached because it appears to be the weaker
link. Personally I have spent more time thinking about the safety pin
falling out or ... thinking if I actually installed the pin or not. When
you land and are putting the airplane away and find an unused safety pin ...
then you'll spend more time thinking / worrying about more worthwhile
things.
Dennis
>There are hundreds of Kolbs out there and there are even a few Kolbs that
>have thousands of hours on them with in-flight loads over gross and the
>has never been even a bent pin (from flight loads).
Message 31
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. |
Message 32
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
Oops, I should quickly add that I have never heard of a safety pin falling
out, so no basis for that irrational concern either :-)
Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Dennis Souder [mailto:flykolb@pa.net]
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 6:29 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points
Re: Pins & some anecdotal evidence:
I recall a number of collisions, crashes and other instances where Kolbs
have come to unusually abrupt stops. I recall seeing the square tubing to
which the wing tabs are attached ripped in half - but I have never seen a
failed pin. So, for crash loading (and probably inflight loading as well)
you will probably have more productive time worrying about the strength of
the tube to which the pin is attached because it appears to be the weaker
link. Personally I have spent more time thinking about the safety pin
falling out or ... thinking if I actually installed the pin or not. When
you land and are putting the airplane away and find an unused safety pin ...
then you'll spend more time thinking / worrying about more worthwhile
things.
Dennis
>There are hundreds of Kolbs out there and there are even a few Kolbs that
>have thousands of hours on them with in-flight loads over gross and the
>has never been even a bent pin (from flight loads).
Message 33
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. |
BUDDY
YOU BEST FUEL UP AND BOOOOOGY..
THE KIDS ARE LOADING THEIR GUNS...
HAHAHAHAHHAHA
THATS GREAT! IS/ WAS THAT A SNOWSHOE ?
Mark Vaughn
-----Original Message-----
From: possums@bellsouth.net
Sent: Sat, 7 Apr 2007 6:31 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit.
________________________________________________________________________
from AOL at AOL.com.
Message 34
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. |
Wow, I sure am glad that Christianity has nothing to do with rabbits or
Ishtar eggs...
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
do not archive
----- Original Message -----
From: "possums" <possums@bellsouth.net>
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 6:31 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit.
>
Message 35
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. |
Richard Pike wrote:
>
> Wow, I sure am glad that Christianity has nothing to do with rabbits or
> Ishtar eggs...
>
> Richard Pike
> MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
> do not archive
Amen Reverend!! He is RISEN!! ~ Earl
Message 36
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. |
> Wow, I sure am glad that Christianity has nothing to do with
rabbits or Ishtar eggs...
They're both fairy
tales.
Message 37
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Monument Valley 2007 |
John Williamson
Jim Hefner
Boyd Young
John Hauck
Steven Green
Larry Cottrell and Karen
Arty Trost
George Thompson
Jim and John Clayton
Will Uribe
Dave Raines
Larry Bourne
Rick Neilsen
Dennis Kirby
Mike Welch
Pat and Wendy Ladd
Bob Dalton
Tim Gerkin
Craig Nelson
Jeff Warner
BJ Moore
James and Sandy Beard
Doug Wetzel
Tim Duffney
The MV 2007 List is up to date once again, I theeeeenk!
If you aren't on the list and should be, add your name and send it
back to the List. Thanks,
john h
mkIII
DO NOT ARCHIVE
Message 38
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
At 04:41 PM 4/7/2007, Paul Petty wrote:
>...If the tiny pin is so strong why are the struts so masive? And have 6
>AN bolts in each one?
I couldn't really say, not being familiar with the newer Kolbs... but I'd
guess that they're way stronger than they need to be in tension (normal
flight), but need to be that strong to handle compression (negative g's and
landing loads) without buckling.
Dunno 'bout the 6 AN bolts, perhaps to spread the load out on the thinwall
tubing?
-Dana
--
--
The citizens of the United States are getting the government they deserve.
The problem is that I'm also getting the government they deserve.
Message 39
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
At 05:10 PM 4/7/2007, GeoR38@aol.com wrote:
>Dana I had a Cuyuna on my pterodactyl and it failed several times and
>usually I did not know why, but now I think I do. I had no EGT...
Friend of mine had a 'dac with a Cuyuna, never had a failure. My US has
both EGT and CHT (on the rear cylinder) and you can be sure I will keep an
eye on them.
-Dana
--
--
The citizens of the United States are getting the government they deserve.
The problem is that I'm also getting the government they deserve.
Message 40
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
US has
| both EGT and CHT (on the rear cylinder) and you can be sure I will
keep an
| eye on them.
|
| -Dana
Dana:
Hope you have a very quick eye.
Don't recall an EGT or CHT preventing a two stroke failure. Usually,
when it happens, it happens so quick the last thing you will think of
looking at will be the instruments.
john h
mkIII
Message 41
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Would you say a Twinstar is close to a Mark III? Is it close, just not as wide?
Does it perform about the same?
Just curious,
Joe
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=105569#105569
Message 42
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit. |
This is from a guy who believes Fairies have Tails and who screen names
now snuffy hahahahahahaha
Given the lack of a signature to his obvious expression of disbelief
in our Savior I'm betting he doesn't mind
if we all believe he's covered in FEATHERS and his worse night mare is
a white haired Gentleman better
known to us all as the Colonel.................. Buck Buck Buck Buck
hahahahahahahahaha
Hey snuffy your half right....
Oh and BTW maybe next time you should consider being
FoghornLeghorn@usol.com hahahahahaha 8-)
Be proud of your Faith...... Happy Easter to you all... He has Risen
Hey Suffy FYI he didn't use a Rotax to get there 8-) hahahahahaha
Mark Vaughn
-----Original Message-----
From: snuffy@usol.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Sat, 7 Apr 2007 8:46 PM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Happy Easter - Sorry about the rabbit.
> Wow, I sure am glad that Christianity has nothing to do with
rabbits or Ishtar eggs...
They're both fairy
tales.
________________________________________________________________________
from AOL at AOL.com.
Message 43
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Re: Kolb Wing Attach Points |
At 05:06 PM 4/5/07 -0700, you wrote:
Michael,
I got to wondering what would be the load and stress condition on the strut
and main wing attachment pins for the FireFly. I took some measurements
from the FireFly. I found:
Distance from upper fuselage pin to end of wing - 10.5 feet
Distance from upper fuselage pin to upper strut pin - 3.83 feet
Angle of strut to wing - 45 degrees.
Assuming a gross weight of 500 pounds, one can simulate the loading by
placing a point load of 250 pounds at the center of the wing. Below is a
crude representation of the wing. "A" represents the upper fuselage pin.
"B" represents the upper strut pin(s). "L" is the lift concentrated at the
center of the wing over the main spar. We can get away with this because we
are interested in pin loads and not the stress distribution of the main
spar. "y-up" indicates the load pin is up, etc.
y-up y-up
A<----3.83'---->B<-1.42'->L<-------------5.25'------------|
y-down 250#
Summing the moments about Pin A gives:
5.25' x 250# - By x 3.83' = 0
By = 5.25x250/3.83 = 343#
Summing forces in Y gives Ay = 343 - 250 = 93# up
Looking at the strut attachment, we know it lies at a 45 degree angle.
Therefore we know that Bx has to have a value of 343 pounds. Multiplying by
the square root of two tells that the upper strut attachment pins must share
485 pounds and this total load must be carried by the single lower pin. The
upper wing support pin must with stand the square root of 93 squared plus
343 squared, which equals 355 pounds.
Therefore for a one g the loads are:
Wing fuselage attachment pin -> 355#
Upper wing strut pins -> 243# each
Lower wing strut pin -> 485#
The FireFly info states it was designed for 4 g yield and 6 g ultimate. For
the single lower strut 5/16 inch OD pin the corresponding loads would be
1,832# and 2,910#. Looking at the lower end structure the pin is supported
in a 9/16 inch wide clevis. Calculating the bending stress for the pin with
the load placed at the pin center calculates out to be 58,000 psi for 4 g
and 92,000 psi for 6 g. The minimum tensile stress values for 4130 is
75,000 psi yield and 95,000 psi ultimate. This indicates for the FireFly
there is a safe margin for the pin at 4 g with no deformation. If you want
to put it through 6 g the pin may deform but it is not likely to separate.
Never thought I would do this. But since the question came up and it is
cold and snowing, here it is. It all goes to show that if you are gentle in
the way you treat your FireFly, it will be kind to you too.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
Message 44
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
OK all, my loss is someone's gain. I'm selling my Firefly. It's brand new some
still in the box. This plane is all built except for the ailerons. I have
everything but motor and gauges. I even have the covering kit still in the box.
I have had this plane/kit since new( from factory) for about 8 month's now
and money has become an issue for me and my wife. I live in Phoenix, Arizona.
I have spent around $9,000.00 for everything knowing I will never get it all
back. $5,000.00 takes it all!
--
Rob.
Message 45
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | ooops F F fore sale |
Firefly for sale ,..........I forgot to put my phone # 623 580 9381
--
Rob.
Message 46
| INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
| PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
| NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
| LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
| SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
| Subject: | Kolb Wing Attach Points |
At 12:23 AM 4/8/2007, you wrote:
>
>At 05:06 PM 4/5/07 -0700, you wrote:
>
>Michael,
>
>I got to wondering what would be the load and stress condition on the
..(snip)...
>main wing attachment pins for the FireFly. I took some measurements
Give it a break guys, you are not going to break that pin in flight -
period...no way!
We have crashed Kolbs into the trees, ground, mashed them so flat (doing stupid
things) that the engine was crushed. Killed more than two guys doing
it - I shouldn't say that,
should I ? BUT "those" pins never failed - I don't think you could
make them fail "in flight".
It's way easier to find something else to look for. Control linkages
or something
like that. If nothing else look at your elevator linkage. I could
land without ailerons,
without a rudder, etc. Maybe without the elevator - been practicing
with the trottle.
Sorry about the "Easter Bunny" thing if it offended anybody .just a
funny picture.
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|