Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 01:05 AM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (icrashrc)
2. 04:34 AM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (N27SB@aol.com)
3. 04:34 AM - M3X info (tc1917)
4. 05:08 AM - Re: Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (Jack B. Hart)
5. 05:42 AM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (Richard Girard)
6. 06:03 AM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (John Hauck)
7. 06:26 AM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (Eugene Zimmerman)
8. 06:56 AM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (Richard & Martha Neilsen)
9. 06:56 AM - Re: Help to fix careless mistake (olendorf)
10. 07:12 AM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (Richard Girard)
11. 07:24 AM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (N27SB@aol.com)
12. 07:29 AM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (J.D. Stewart)
13. 07:43 AM - Re: Help to fix careless mistake (jb92563)
14. 07:53 AM - Re: Decisions decisions (jb92563)
15. 07:58 AM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (Thom Riddle)
16. 08:00 AM - Re: Re: Help to fix careless mistake (Richard Girard)
17. 08:07 AM - Re: Re: Help to fix careless mistake (Richard Pike)
18. 08:36 AM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (APilot@webtv.net)
19. 08:45 AM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (promod69camaro)
20. 09:05 AM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (JetPilot)
21. 09:44 AM - Kolb training - Anywhere in the US? (clearprop)
22. 10:00 AM - Re: Kolb training - Anywhere in the US? (John H Murphy)
23. 10:49 AM - Re: Kolb training - Anywhere in the US? (John H Murphy)
24. 11:20 AM - Re: Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (APilot@webtv.net)
25. 11:22 AM - Re: Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (Richard Girard)
26. 11:26 AM - Re: Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (David Key)
27. 11:54 AM - Re: Help to fix careless mistake (jb92563)
28. 12:09 PM - Re: Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (N27SB@aol.com)
29. 12:45 PM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (promod69camaro)
30. 12:54 PM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (promod69camaro)
31. 12:58 PM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (Robert Laird)
32. 01:24 PM - Re: Kolb training - Anywhere in the US? (Jim Kmet)
33. 01:43 PM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (N27SB@aol.com)
34. 02:19 PM - Esp. for Steve Re: 447 fuel line, again (TheWanderingWench)
35. 02:39 PM - Re: Re: 447 fuel line, again (Dana Hague)
36. 02:43 PM - Re: Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (Dana Hague)
37. 04:02 PM - Re: Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (Richard Girard)
38. 07:27 PM - Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. (lucien)
Message 1
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
JetPilot wrote:
> My MK 3 Xtra is very happy crusing around 75 MPH. It will easily do 80 or more,
but it seems to like the mid 70's, which is a nice low power setting on the
Rotax 912-S, around 4600 RPM.
>
>
> Mike
What is your fuel burn at this power setting?
--------
Scott
www.ill-EagleAviation.com
do not archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130415#130415
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
In a message dated 8/23/2007 1:10:19 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
orcabonita@hotmail.com writes:
Mike
What are they using?
steve
do not archive
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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Would like to add something to the string about the Titan v. M3X Kolbs. If
you want the zoom and fun flying, but still want the benefits of a larger (a
little larger inside than a titan) plane, check out the slingshot. Cruise
more around 85. Not a bad stall. Very easy in bumps. Fold up wings. Put
a 912 on it and you got a rocket. Probably wont cruise as fast as a Titan
could or would but still a better plane. Tail wheels have a lot of
advantages. I have flown a titan also but my money is still on the Kolb
Slingshot. Not for the faint hearted. Ted Cowan, Alabama
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
At 09:58 PM 8/22/07 -0700, you wrote:
>
............................
The Titan will also kill you if you dont fly it correctly, ...............
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
MIke,
How is this different from any other aircraft?
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
Message 5
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
Mike, Even the best plastic deteriorate over time. On all my machines,
whether they fly or not, I inspect the fuel and pulse lines regularly and
just replace them when I think they need it. I get my line from the Bing
Agency, primarily because it's just up the road, right here in Kansas.
Different philosophy, I guess.
To make replacement easier, I coat the barbed fittings with lithium grease
before I slide the line on. Keeps me from having to cut the line off the
fitting when the time comes.
Rick
On 8/23/07, N27SB@aol.com <N27SB@aol.com> wrote:
>
> In a message dated 8/23/2007 1:10:19 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> orcabonita@hotmail.com writes:
>
> Mike
>
> What are they using?
>
> steve
> do not archive
>
>
> ------------------------------
> .
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
Hi Rick:
Personally, I would not put grease on my barbed fuel fittings. I do not
want them to be easily removed. If I have to cut them off, when the
time comes, so be it.
Undoubtedly, the "grease'em up" system works for you or you would not
use it.
I use neoprene rubber fuel line on my MKIII and 912ULS. Have not used
plastic in years. I have heard there is some problem using premixed
fuel/oil with some black neoprene line, but also heard marine grade fuel
line will work with that combo. I have used marine fuel line before.
It is much heavier, thicker wall, than regular Gates auto fuel line.
Capable of making tight bends without collapsing.
UV, heat, and fuel will eventually get any flexible fuel line, but the
black neoprene rubber line will far outlast plastic.
Does anyone know why the UL community decided to use plastic fuel line
instead of black neoprene rubber?
john h
mkIII
To make replacement easier, I coat the barbed fittings with lithium
grease before I slide the line on. Keeps me from having to cut the line
off the fitting when the time comes.
Rick
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
On Aug 23, 2007, at 9:03 AM, John Hauck wrote:
> Does anyone know why the UL community decided to use plastic fuel
> line instead of black neoprene rubber?
Well ya gotta keep the air-vehicles separate from the air-craft some
how and since air-vehicles are not
automobiles ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Oh, I just lost my ,,,
train,,, of thought,
What were we talking about?
positively do not archive
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
I fly a MKIIIC but it is the same airplane just 10 MPH slower but my cruise
is 75 MPH. The major difference between a Kolb and a Titan is that the Kolb
is a STOL air plane it can easily get in and out of strips all day long that
a Titan can only dream about. I would also like to say that Kolbs have VERY
strong airframes and find it very difficult to believe the Titan is
stronger. Anyone that has built a Kolb can attest to the lengths that Kolb
went through to design a rugged air frame. Our flight history supports this
claim.
Also Kolb now makes a very well designed optional spring steel landing gear
that is superior to any fiberglass landing gear.
Rick Neilsen
Redrive VW powered MKIIIC
----- Original Message -----
From: <APilot@webtv.net>
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 12:13 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Need Kolb M3X information please.
>
> No comparison. Titan is more of a go-somewhere airplane with good speed
> and strength. Kolb is more fun. Some have been able to get them to go
> around 90 mph. I am lucky to get 70 with a 58 hp engine. But, it is
> the best of all airplanes at a slow cruise around 55-60. If it had a
> well designed fiberglass gear, it would be perfect.
>
>
>
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: Help to fix careless mistake |
Hey Tom D,
I just noticed you are in Scotia. I'm right near you. I would love to come over
and see your Kolb. We have a pretty good EAA chapter also and you may want
to come to the meeting Monday. Send me an email if you want to get together.
olendorf at gmail.com
--------
Scott Olendorf
Original Firestar, Rotax 447, Powerfin prop
Schenectady, NY
http://KolbFirestar.googlepages.com
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130471#130471
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
John, Don't confuse easier with easily. They're still a pain to pull off,
much harder than the fittings on Mikuni fuel pumps and the Rotax pulse port
fitting, and I never rely on anything less than a good safety wire wrap as a
hose clamp.
Rick
On 8/23/07, Eugene Zimmerman <ez@embarqmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Aug 23, 2007, at 9:03 AM, John Hauck wrote:
>
> > Does anyone know why the UL community decided to use plastic fuel
> > line instead of black neoprene rubber?
>
>
> Well ya gotta keep the air-vehicles separate from the air-craft some
> how and since air-vehicles are not
> automobiles ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Oh, I just lost my ,,,
> train,,, of thought,
> What were we talking about?
>
>
> positively do not archive
>
>
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
In a message dated 8/23/2007 9:04:32 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
jhauck@elmore.rr.com writes:
I use neoprene rubber fuel line on my MKIII and 912ULS. Have not used
plastic in years. I have heard there is some problem using premixed fuel/oil
with
some black neoprene line, but also heard marine grade fuel line will work
with that combo. I have used marine fuel line before. It is much heavier,
thicker wall, than regular Gates auto fuel line. Capable of making tight bends
without collapsing.
Hi John, You and I have discussed this before, I even tried using auto line
but as you know it did not work for us lowly mixgas types. The fuel line I
am talking about appears to be superior to auto line. It is not the big
clunky stuff for under the hull install, it is very flexible and non collapsing.
I do not need to test this hose because I have already used it for years
exposed to UV and mixed fuel on skiffs. The added bonus is that for those using
a pump bulb, The bulb on the Yamaha assy seems to be the same material and
is far superior to any I have seen.
I think that standard auto hose is great for unmixed fuel but this is the
best thing that I have seen for fuel/oil mix.
steve
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Message 12
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| Subject: | Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Lucien will probably contribute more since he owns both (including
my former Titan SS). I've flown a MK III a few times also.
For the first 2 years I operated my Titans off of an 845' runway,
with power lines on one end. Rarely needed over half of it unless I had to
come in hot because of gusty x-winds. Lucien's SS will stall at 40 clean
and 34 with flaps. Only slightly higher than a 912S-powered MKIII. I love
the climb of the Kolbs, though. Awesome.
The Titan SS comes with titanium gear. A huge improvement over
fiberglass, but for lighter planes, the fiberglass is more than enough. As
for the fuselage being weaker, I don't know. You can see them in the build
pictures of http://www.ultrafunairsports.com/titanss.htm and make your own
decision.
More fun is subjective to interpretation. I'd have just as much fun
with a 103-legal FireFly as a MKIII or a Tornado SS. If only I could have
one of everything. :>)
Shawn, you've been on many lists over the last year with the same
questions, but the best thing to do is to go fly everything you can, once
you've defined your flying mission (what type of flying you want to do).
Hope that helps,
J.D. Stewart
UltraFun AirSports, LLC
http://www.ultrafunairsports.com
Titan e-mail list
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Titanaircraft/
Do not archive
> I fly a MKIIIC but it is the same airplane just 10 MPH slower
> but my cruise is 75 MPH. The major difference between a Kolb
> and a Titan is that the Kolb is a STOL air plane it can
> easily get in and out of strips all day long that a Titan can
> only dream about. I would also like to say that Kolbs have
> VERY strong airframes and find it very difficult to believe
> the Titan is stronger. Anyone that has built a Kolb can
> attest to the lengths that Kolb went through to design a
> rugged air frame. Our flight history supports this claim.
>
> Also Kolb now makes a very well designed optional spring
> steel landing gear that is superior to any fiberglass landing gear.
>
> Rick Neilsen
> Redrive VW powered MKIIIC
> >
> > No comparison. Titan is more of a go-somewhere airplane
> with good speed
> > and strength. Kolb is more fun. Some have been able to
> get them to go
> > around 90 mph. I am lucky to get 70 with a 58 hp engine.
> But, it is
> > the best of all airplanes at a slow cruise around 55-60.
> If it had a
> > well designed fiberglass gear, it would be perfect.
Message 13
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| Subject: | Re: Help to fix careless mistake |
I read that coating a surface the rivet is in contact with before riveting is NOT
an approved method for aircraft construction.
You can however paint over the rivet.
I forgot what the exact reason was, but it had something to due with the compression
of the coating and the rivet becomming loose eventually and loosing the
integrity of the joint.
Just an FYI so others dont think its a proven approved method....just the opposite
actually.
--------
Ray
Riverside County, CA
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130487#130487
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: Decisions decisions |
Just to help you out Dave, you could mention that your area of operation is 40%
lakes, 50% pine forrests and 10% roads, pastures or small open fields here and
there.
A BRS might be a good idea also
You should post that pic you sent me of your area....beautifull!
--------
Ray
Riverside County, CA
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130489#130489
Message 15
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Jet Pilot,
Have you ever owned a Titan? The "Titan will kill you" comment was an irresponsible
and unwarranted slam. All aircraft can kill you if not flown safely.
I have owned two Kolbs and one Titan. Both are great aircraft. Kolbs are better
at short field but there are not many fields, including grass ones, that I would
not fly a Tornado in and out of. The Tornado is faster in both cruise and
roll response. If aerobatics are an important capability, the the Tornado wins
easily. The two things I didn't like about the Titan was that the back seat in
the Tornado II was too small, not the case in the larger Tornados. The other
thing was I hated the tail being on the ground when parked.
The prospective owner should answer three questions before deciding.
1) Must you operate out of a field that is shorter than 1000' at low density altitudes
at gross weight? If the answer is yes, then a Kolb is the better choice.
At higher DA the length limit goes up. The runway length limit also depends
upon which wing is on the Tornado. With runway lengths longer than this, then
the question is moot.
2) Must you cruise at over 90 mph on a regular basis? If so, then the Tornado is
the better choice. If this is not important then this question is moot.
3) Must you be able to fly at 50 mph comfortably for extended periods of time?
If so, then the Kolb is better suited for this.
If all of these are answered in the negative, then you must decide on personal
preference or other criteria, because both aircraft (assuming 2 seats with 80
hp or more) will cruise comfortably at 80+ mph and both will operate comfortably
from a 1,000' field at low DA at gross, unless the Titan has the very short
20' wing, like mine had. I operated comfortably from 1,000' field solo, but not
at gross with the short wing.
--------
Thom in Buffalo
N197BG FS1/447
--------------------
"Blind respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth."
Albert Einstein
Read this topic online here:
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| Subject: | Re: Help to fix careless mistake |
Ray, I'm not sure why riveting with a dab of zinc chromate or other primer
under the rivet head would be any different than riveting together two parts
that have been painted prior to riveting. Seems like it would squeeze out
the liquid and maybe not do as good a job at corrosion protection, but how
it would effect the clench strength of the riveted joint isn't clear.
I'll see if I can find any reference in AC 43-13 later.
Rick
On 8/23/07, jb92563 <jb92563@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
> I read that coating a surface the rivet is in contact with before riveting
> is NOT an approved method for aircraft construction.
>
> You can however paint over the rivet.
>
> I forgot what the exact reason was, but it had something to due with the
> compression of the coating and the rivet becomming loose eventually and
> loosing the integrity of the joint.
>
> Just an FYI so others dont think its a proven approved method....just the
> opposite actually.
>
> --------
> Ray
> Riverside County, CA
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130487#130487
>
>
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
Message 17
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| Subject: | Re: Help to fix careless mistake |
On my MKIII, I applied the zinc chromate and then put the rivit in while the
paint was still wet. Solves the Problem.
Richard Pike
MKIII N420P (420ldPoops)
----- Original Message -----
From: "jb92563" <jb92563@yahoo.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 10:42 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Help to fix careless mistake
>
> I read that coating a surface the rivet is in contact with before riveting
> is NOT an approved method for aircraft construction.
>
> You can however paint over the rivet.
>
> I forgot what the exact reason was, but it had something to due with the
> compression of the coating and the rivet becomming loose eventually and
> loosing the integrity of the joint.
>
> Just an FYI so others dont think its a proven approved method....just the
> opposite actually.
>
> --------
> Ray
> Riverside County, CA
>
> Do Not Archive
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130487#130487
>
>
>
Message 18
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Happy to hear that Kolb makes a new spring steel langing gear. I
definitely will contact them. Their previous gear leg was made of 4130
steel and would transfer hard landing loads to the fuselage frame
sockets, which are very hard to fix if bent. The original 7075 aluminum
was weak, but it did save the fuselage socket area. And, they will
rebend a couple of time before they fail. I suggest tension lines
between the wheel axles if one intends to do full stall landings. Wheel
landings are definitely easier on the gear legs. Big soft tires also
benefit the gear legs such as the golf cart tires called Surf Glide sold
at Les Schwab.
Message 19
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Thanks for the information. The reason I have joined several groups is because
that is the best way to get information. The Titan group members love their
Titans. The Sonex group has Monnett warshipers. They love those little planes
eventhough they look strange and are very small.
The reality is that the Kolb better fits my situation except for the trips to my
fathers farm. Its located right outside of Altus Oklahoma in the middle of
nowhere. He is getting old and it would be nice to fly out to help when weather
permitts. The drive across Dallas on a Friday afternoon can take 3 to 4 hours
or more depending on how many wrecks I get behind. Then I still have a 3
to 4 hour drive ahead of me. Its only a 200 mile drive. With an airplane, it
would be more like a 150 mile fly. But there asways seems to be a wind at one
of our places, so I will have to contend with windy landings, some of which
would be cross winds. And with the Kolb, I may be able to land on a road going
through the wheat field. That would be nice, and probably not advisable in
a Titan because of the trike gear.
I want to be able to fly the plane like a fighter plane. Dive into a river and
follow it. Maybe a loop from time to time.
So you can see that I have two missions. One is fun, the other is transportation
around 200 miles (150 in the air).
The other thing I like about the Kolb is that you guys are very interested in alternative
engines. I just can't see paying for a Rotax 912S at the current prices.
You guys have found many ways to get around that without durability issues.
Its nice to meet such a group of resourceful individuals. Not many Titans
are equipped with alternative engines, so if you try, you are the one blazing
the trail. As you know, that is a lot of work and can be very dangerous.
Thanks,
Shawn
--------
Sport Pilot (almost) - Waiting for good weather to take flight exam.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130512#130512
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Shawn,
The Titan would be better in crosswinds, because of the tricycle gear. Landing
a Kolb in a crosswind is tricky, as with any taildragger. With taildraggers,
ground loops happen, its just a matter of time. I would never never loop, spin,
or roll a Kolb, they are not made for that. With a flat bottom wing, and
a huge amount of lift, air loads build up very quick and you can get a huge amount
of G loading at even moderate airpseeds and a small change in pitch. Bottom
line, forget about any kind of aerbatics with a Kolb.
Also the Titan airframe is just much stronger. Contrary to what some might say,
the Kolb can not compare to the all metal Titan wing in streingth. If I was
going to go to my fathers farm reliably on a regular basis, I would drive.
By the time you get to the airport, preflight, etc. etc. you would almost be there
in your car. When you factor waiting for weather which will happen sooner
or later, the car is faster. People really get themselves into trouble thinking
of light aircraft as "transportation", they get somewhere, and then make
bad choices trying to get back in bad conditions. If I wanted an airplane I
could fly in worse weather though, the Titan would handle the margional weather
and summertime turbulance better than a Kolb would.
Engines, the 912 is worth the 16,000 period. People spend so much time and hassle
with alternative engines, they would have been better off just to pay what
a 912 or a Jabiru costs. If you can not afford that, should probably wait
until you can.
Mike Bigelow
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130516#130516
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| Subject: | Kolb training - Anywhere in the US? |
Is there anyone in the lower 48 States that is providing Kolb training? I'm looking
for someone with a Kolb MK III that can provide the experience of flying
in a Kolb.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130523#130523
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| Subject: | Re: Kolb training - Anywhere in the US? |
I think Kolb Aircraft has an aircraft they provide training with. Not sure if this
is still the case.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130531#130531
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| Subject: | Re: Kolb training - Anywhere in the US? |
Just got off the phone with Travis @ Kolb. He tells me that Kolb no longer has
any aircraft for training.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130543#130543
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
I took a chance and tried the Geo Metro G10 engine a few years ago. For
some reason, I decided to go with the Raven conversion. Thanks to
Jeron's continuing help at Raven Re-drive, I was able to get it
installed on the Kolb Mark III Classic and tuned to perfection. It has
turned out to have 4 cycle reliability, easy to maintain, quite a lot of
power (approx. the same as a 582 Rotax at about a 20 lb. penalty),
excellent thrust with an Ivo 3 blade 70" dia prop, fuel economy and at a
cost of somewhere around $5000. I am glad that I listened to those who
are equally satisfied with their Geo conversion and regularly express
their views on the Fly Geo site.
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Mike, I guess I was lucky. When I was learning to fly GA aircraft, I was
never allowed to do a crabbed landing. Spence always made my keep lined up
with the runway centerline by cross controlling. Darn good thing, too,
because I don't think I've ever landed my Kolb in anything but a cross wind.
When I first flew my Mk IIIC the only trouble I encountered, as I've
documented here, was trying to land in a three point stance. Once Travis, at
TNK, told me to stop doing that and wheel it on, my problems went away. A
Kolb has it's idiosyncrasies but all taken together, it's about the
gentlest, most forgiving plane you can buy or build.
I'm going to go knock on wood, now. :-)
Another thing Shawn might consider is how easy it is to get in and out of a
Mk III. Should your Dad ever want to take a ride around the patch you'll
really appreciate that. I just spent a week clamoring in and out of a
Challenger II. Once I was in, it was a pretty comfy fit, but getting in and
out was like the proverbial monkey and the football. Evaluate your choice on
that criteria, too.
Rick
On 8/23/07, JetPilot <orcabonita@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Shawn,
>
> The Titan would be better in crosswinds, because of the tricycle gear.
> Landing a Kolb in a crosswind is tricky, as with any taildragger. With
> taildraggers, ground loops happen, its just a matter of time. I would never
> never loop, spin, or roll a Kolb, they are not made for that. With a flat
> bottom wing, and a huge amount of lift, air loads build up very quick and
> you can get a huge amount of G loading at even moderate airpseeds and a
> small change in pitch. Bottom line, forget about any kind of aerbatics with
> a Kolb.
>
> Also the Titan airframe is just much stronger. Contrary to what some
> might say, the Kolb can not compare to the all metal Titan wing in
> streingth. If I was going to go to my fathers farm reliably on a regular
> basis, I would drive. By the time you get to the airport, preflight, etc.
> etc. you would almost be there in your car. When you factor waiting for
> weather which will happen sooner or later, the car is faster. People really
> get themselves into trouble thinking of light aircraft as "transportation",
> they get somewhere, and then make bad choices trying to get back in bad
> conditions. If I wanted an airplane I could fly in worse weather though,
> the Titan would handle the margional weather and summertime turbulance
> better than a Kolb would.
>
> Engines, the 912 is worth the 16,000 period. People spend so much time
> and hassle with alternative engines, they would have been better off just to
> pay what a 912 or a Jabiru costs. If you can not afford that, should
> probably wait until you can.
>
> Mike Bigelow
>
> --------
> "NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have
> !!!
>
> Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130516#130516
>
>
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Shawn,
I'm in Plano if you want to ride in a Xtra. What is your weight?
David
>From: "promod69camaro" <shawn-bishop@verizon.net>
>To: kolb-list@matronics.com
>Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Need Kolb M3X information please.
>Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 08:44:36 -0700
>
><shawn-bishop@verizon.net>
>
>Thanks for the information. The reason I have joined several groups is
>because that is the best way to get information. The Titan group members
>love their Titans. The Sonex group has Monnett warshipers. They love
>those little planes eventhough they look strange and are very small.
>The reality is that the Kolb better fits my situation except for the trips
>to my fathers farm. Its located right outside of Altus Oklahoma in the
>middle of nowhere. He is getting old and it would be nice to fly out to
>help when weather permitts. The drive across Dallas on a Friday afternoon
>can take 3 to 4 hours or more depending on how many wrecks I get behind.
>Then I still have a 3 to 4 hour drive ahead of me. Its only a 200 mile
>drive. With an airplane, it would be more like a 150 mile fly. But there
>asways seems to be a wind at one of our places, so I will have to contend
>with windy landings, some of which would be cross winds. And with the
>Kolb, I may be able to land on a road going through the wheat field. That
>would be nice, and probably not advisable in a Titan because of the trike
>gear.
>I want to be able to fly the plane like a fighter plane. Dive into a river
>and follow it. Maybe a loop from time to time.
>So you can see that I have two missions. One is fun, the other is
>transportation around 200 miles (150 in the air).
>The other thing I like about the Kolb is that you guys are very interested
>in alternative engines. I just can't see paying for a Rotax 912S at the
>current prices. You guys have found many ways to get around that without
>durability issues. Its nice to meet such a group of resourceful
>individuals. Not many Titans are equipped with alternative engines, so if
>you try, you are the one blazing the trail. As you know, that is a lot of
>work and can be very dangerous.
>Thanks,
>Shawn
>
>--------
>Sport Pilot (almost) - Waiting for good weather to take flight exam.
>
>
>Read this topic online here:
>
>http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130512#130512
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: Help to fix careless mistake |
I believe the AC 43- is where I saw it from the EAA website.
Riveting it "wet'" with zinc chromate probably eliminates the "compression" issue.
I doubt anyone will have to worry if they riveted painted surfaces, as the loose
rivets will eventually reveal themselves and merely cause some extra work.
I would think on Kolbs, that by the time that happens then aluminum fatigue would
be just as much an issue and warrant rebuilds by the time the rivets show signs
of being loose.
But I'm not an airframe engineer so I just go by the AC 43 guidlines.
I dont have time to discover all the problems on my own that the AC 43 has info
on....I prefer to learn from others mistakes when it comes to airframe integrity
[Wink]
--------
Ray
Riverside County, CA
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130557#130557
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
In a message dated 8/23/2007 12:59:31 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
orcabonita@hotmail.com writes:
I have been teaching my wife stalls, and she has made every mistake you can
think of
can jerk the Kolb around like a drunk fool at very slow airspeeds
Mike,
Are these two lines related? Sorry, couldn't resist (-:
steve
do not archive
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Hi David,
I way 195 out of the shower, so probably 210 full dressed. I would very much appreciate
a take up if possible. The weather has been difficult for flying this
spring and summer with all the thunderstorm, so I am eger to get back up.
Thanks,
Shawn
You can call me at 972-740-3240 if you would like.
--------
Sport Pilot (almost) - Waiting for good weather to take flight exam.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130572#130572
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
The other thing I like about the Kolb is that you can take down the wings and use
a trailer for the hanger. I have an enclosed race car trailer that can become
home. I can store it at the airport in the trailer and save a lot of money.
Hanger rent here is very expensive
Seeing the video of the Kolb being taken down was what peaked my interest in this
aircraft to start with. And its nice to be a side by side where my kids can
look me in the face while we fly. It just does not sound as if its a good fit
at all to take a short trip with.
I need two planes. One fast and the other fun!!
I don't really consider driving to be a good option. The traffic not only makes
the drive twice as long as it has to be, but it makes it dangerous. I have
been rear ended 4 times in my life. 3 were here in Dallas, and 2 were drivers
moving very fast. I was put into the hospital twice and got serious back, neck,
and head injuries with the last hit. So I am not sure its safer to drive.
My doctors have told me that head injuries are cumulative and that the next
one will be worse than the previous one. I just can't imagine that. But I want
to protect myself from those drunks out there that seem intent on hurting me.
I guess its just bad luck.
Thanks for all the input everyone. I am going to keep investigating alternate
ways to power a light plane. I would like that decision made before I get one.
--------
Sport Pilot (almost) - Waiting for good weather to take flight exam.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130574#130574
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
I use fuel-injection line that is compatible with all fuels with any
mixes: SAE 30R9 (one popular mfg is Gates). Most NAPA stores will
have an SAE 30R9 equivalent. Also, I haven't used it, but check out
Areoquip FC332...
http://www.hosexpress.com/hose/socketless/FC332.htm
-- Robert
On 8/23/07, N27SB@aol.com <N27SB@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
> In a message dated 8/23/2007 9:04:32 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> jhauck@elmore.rr.com writes:
>
>
> I use neoprene rubber fuel line on my MKIII and 912ULS. Have not used
> plastic in years. I have heard there is some problem using premixed
> fuel/oil with some black neoprene line, but also heard marine grade fuel
> line will work with that combo. I have used marine fuel line before. It is
> much heavier, thicker wall, than regular Gates auto fuel line. Capable of
> making tight bends without collapsing.
>
>
> Hi John, You and I have discussed this before, I even tried using auto line
> but as you know it did not work for us lowly mixgas types. The fuel line I
> am talking about appears to be superior to auto line. It is not the big
> clunky stuff for under the hull install, it is very flexible and non
> collapsing.
>
> I do not need to test this hose because I have already used it for years
> exposed to UV and mixed fuel on skiffs. The added bonus is that for those
> using a pump bulb, The bulb on the Yamaha assy seems to be the same material
> and is far superior to any I have seen.
> I think that standard auto hose is great for unmixed fuel but this is the
> best thing that I have seen for fuel/oil mix.
>
> steve
>
>
> ________________________________
>
>
Message 32
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| Subject: | Re: Kolb training - Anywhere in the US? |
I have a MK-3 C in Cookeville, TN, (based KSRB) , with dual controls , and
I`m a CFII. I do not have insurance on this plane for instructing. I am
available though for familiarization flights to anyone that can confirm
(Prove) they Own a Kolb aircraft. I am not available for familiarization
flights to persons needing dual training, or persons "thinking about buying
a Kolb aircraft."
When I converted this plane to LSA this year, I had to make a statement
about whether this plane will be used for dual instruction, & I claimed that
it would not, but I`m fine taking "passengers". "If you need time in type"
for insurance purposes, this may be helpful.
Jim Kmet
--- Original Message -----
From: "clearprop" <john@lv702.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2007 11:43 AM
Subject: Kolb-List: Kolb training - Anywhere in the US?
>
> Is there anyone in the lower 48 States that is providing Kolb training?
> I'm looking for someone with a Kolb MK III that can provide the experience
> of flying in a Kolb.
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130523#130523
>
>
>
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
Thanks Robert, I will check it out
steve
do not archive
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
Message 34
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| Subject: | Re: Esp. for Steve Re: 447 fuel line, again |
Steve -
I may have missed an e-mail from you in this thread -
can't find the name/mfg. of the fuel line you mention
below. Would you specify?
Arty Trost
> Hi John, You and I have discussed this before, I
> even tried using auto line
> but as you know it did not work for us lowly mixgas
> types. The fuel line I
> am talking about appears to be superior to auto
> line. It is not the big
> clunky stuff for under the hull install, it is very
> flexible and non collapsing.
>
> I do not need to test this hose because I have
> already used it for years
> exposed to UV and mixed fuel on skiffs. The added
> bonus is that for those using
> a pump bulb, The bulb on the Yamaha assy seems to be
> the same material and
> is far superior to any I have seen.
> I think that standard auto hose is great for unmixed
> fuel but this is the
> best thing that I have seen for fuel/oil mix.
>
> steve
>
>
>
> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour
>
www.LessonsFromTheEdge.com
"Life's a daring adventure or nothing"
Helen Keller
"I refuse to tip toe through life just to arrive safely at death."
Message 35
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| Subject: | Re: 447 fuel line, again |
At 09:03 AM 8/23/2007, John Hauck wrote:
>
>Does anyone know why the UL community decided to use plastic fuel line
>instead of black neoprene rubber?
I'm guessing it's because the clear line makes it possible to see air
bubbles if any are present, which can be pretty important in keeping a
2-stroke healthy.
Funny... Aircraft Spruce sells the blue Bing urethane fuel line, which one
presumes is good if the carburetor manufacturer sells it... it's what I
bought for my US. OTOH, over on the Quicksilver list where I used to hang
out for awhile, they hate the blue line, preferring (I think) the yellow
Tygon fuel line, which I've used with no problems on my PPG (you still have
to replace it every few years). McMaster sells the yellow Tygon, and they
also sell a cheaper generic yellow fuel line, which hardens up much faster
than the genuine Tygon.
When I bought a primer bulb (Suzuki, I think) from a boat dealer a few
years ago it came with some very nice looking gray tubing (which I never
used as it was too short).
-Dana
--
--
Children seldom misquote you. In fact, they usually repeat word for word
what you shouldn't have said.
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
At 02:21 PM 8/23/2007, Richard Girard wrote:
>Mike, I guess I was lucky. When I was learning to fly GA aircraft, I was
>never allowed to do a crabbed landing. Spence always made my keep lined up
>with the runway centerline by cross controlling...
Funny, when I learned to fly (in C-150's) it was just the opposite; all
they taught was the "crab and kick it straight" method, I guess because the
school was mainly interested in training commercial pilots. It wasn't
until after I got my licence and got checked out in C-172's from an FBO in
another state that their instructor taught me the wing low method... a must
on their short narrow runway, and critical once I started flying taildraggers.
I'm guessing the Ultrastar will be happier with 3-point landings than the
low boom Kolbs?
-Dana
do not archive
--
--
Children seldom misquote you. In fact, they usually repeat word for word
what you shouldn't have said.
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
Dana, Ask Travis at TNK. Although he doesn't fly, even Denny admits he
really knows the aircraft. I still think he's a genius, if for no other
reason than I no longer have to straighten main gear on Mr. Press anymore.
Rick
do not archive
On 8/23/07, Dana Hague <d-m-hague@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> At 02:21 PM 8/23/2007, Richard Girard wrote:
>
> Mike, I guess I was lucky. When I was learning to fly GA aircraft, I was
> never allowed to do a crabbed landing. Spence always made my keep lined up
> with the runway centerline by cross controlling.
>
> ..
>
>
> Funny, when I learned to fly (in C-150's) it was just the opposite; all
> they taught was the "crab and kick it straight" method, I guess because the
> school was mainly interested in training commercial pilots. It wasn't until
> after I got my licence and got checked out in C-172's from an FBO in another
> state that their instructor taught me the wing low method... a must on their
> short narrow runway, and critical once I started flying taildraggers.
>
> I'm guessing the Ultrastar will be happier with 3-point landings than the
> low boom Kolbs?
>
> -Dana
>
> do not archive
>
> --
> --
> Children seldom misquote you. In fact, they usually repeat word for word
> what you shouldn't have said.
>
> *
>
>
> *
>
>
--
Rick Girard
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
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| Subject: | Re: Need Kolb M3X information please. |
My .02,
As JD said, I own his titan II SS and I still have my Firestar II which I still
try to fly as much as I can.
Here are what I think are good points of comparison, though admittedly my Kolb
experience is with the FS II and not the MK III:
- landing gear config. The Kolb is the clear winner if the mission requires lots
of soft field ops due to the tailwheel configuration. So this is something to
consider when deciding on which plane to get. The titan will still do ok on
grass fields too; I've landed on grass in mine and it does fine with normal soft
field technique. But the Kolb will do somewhat better, IMO, as is true of any
tailwheel plane.
- STOL capability. The Kolb is going to have an advantage here, mostly due to the
high lift flat bottom airfoil. The titan can still do surprisingly well in
STOL with generous flap usage, but the Kolb is what you want for short field ops.
If you do go with the titan and need good STOL ability, though, be sure and
build it with the 26' wing option. also, the tornado II SS fixes the prop clearance
proplem of the other models in a major way, allowing a prop up to 72"
in length. But you get pretty large prop clearance for free on the Kolb, which
is an advantage for STOL.
- Low and slow vs fast. Well, low and slow is kind of a wash here, IMO. The titan,
especially with the 26' wing flies along perfectly comfortably trimmed at
70mph with the power backed off. The AOA is a little higher than you'll have with
the Kolb, though, I'd say. Both planes can do this though the kolb might be
more comfortable. The titan, though, is a fast plane, cruising at 100mph plus
pretty easily. The Kolb won't fly quite that fast I don't believe (my FS II
will do about 70 fairly comfortably, though I have to push the motor a little
to go that fast).
- xwind capability. Well both planes have no-dihedral wings so both will do easy
wing-low xwind landings. My FS II in fact requires practically no aileron input
to do a decent wing-low xwing approach. The titan requires a little opposite
aileron but not much.
That's about all the major highlights I can think of apart from the metal vs rag-and-tube
and other issues.
Also I agree on wheel landings vs. 3-point. 3-pointing my FS II takes very calm
conditions and super spot-on timing in the flare. I've only 3 pointed my FS II
perfectly a handful of times. Wheel landings are so much easier and the Kolb
is pretty docile in its handling so its not so hazardous even when a little hot
(but I still try to get close to a 3-point whenever possible to insure I'm
slowed down as much as possible).
LS
[quote="jindoguy(at)gmail.com"]Mike, I guess I was lucky. When I was learning to
fly GA aircraft, I was never allowed to do a crabbed landing. Spence always
made my keep lined up with the runway centerline by cross controlling. Darn good
thing, too, because I don't think I've ever landed my Kolb in anything but
a cross wind. When I first flew my Mk IIIC the only trouble I encountered, as
I've documented here, was trying to land in a three point stance. Once Travis,
at TNK, told me to stop doing that and wheel it on, my problems went away. A
Kolb has it's idiosyncrasies but all taken together, it's about the gentlest,
most forgiving plane you can buy or build.
I'm going to go knock on wood, now. :-)
Another thing Shawn might consider is how easy it is to get in and out of a Mk
III. Should your Dad ever want to take a ride around the patch you'll really appreciate
that. I just spent a week clamoring in and out of a Challenger II. Once
I was in, it was a pretty comfy fit, but getting in and out was like the proverbial
monkey and the football. Evaluate your choice on that criteria, too.
Rick
Shawn,
The Titan would be better in crosswinds, because of the tricycle gear. Landing
a Kolb in a crosswind is tricky, as with any taildragger. With taildraggers,
ground loops happen, its just a matter of time. I would never never loop, spin,
or roll a Kolb, they are not made for that. With a flat bottom wing, and
a huge amount of lift, air loads build up very quick and you can get a huge amount
of G loading at even moderate airpseeds and a small change in pitch. Bottom
line, forget about any kind of aerbatics with a Kolb.
Also the Titan airframe is just much stronger. Contrary to what some might say,
the Kolb can not compare to the all metal Titan wing in streingth. If I was
going to go to my fathers farm reliably on a regular basis, I would drive.
By the time you get to the airport, preflight, etc. etc. you would almost be there
in your car. When you factor waiting for weather which will happen sooner
or later, the car is faster. People really get themselves into trouble thinking
of light aircraft as "transportation", they get somewhere, and then make
bad choices trying to get back in bad conditions. If I wanted an airplane I
could fly in worse weather though, the Titan would handle the margional weather
and summertime turbulance better than a Kolb would.
Engines, the 912 is worth the 16,000 period. People spend so much time and hassle
with alternative engines, they would have been better off just to pay what
a 912 or a Jabiru costs. If you can not afford that, should probably wait
until you can.
Mike Bigelow
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
"Ya'll drop on in"
takes on a whole new meaning
when you live at the airport.
> [b]
--------
LS
FS II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=130645#130645
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