Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 04:34 AM - prop clearance (william sullivan)
2. 04:35 AM - Re: The weather's lousy again (George Myers)
3. 04:47 AM - clearance (william sullivan)
4. 05:46 AM - Re: prop clearance (ElleryWeld@aol.com)
5. 06:06 AM - prop (william sullivan)
6. 06:42 AM - Re: prop clearance (Jim Kmet)
7. 07:49 AM - Re:Clutch for clearance (knowvne@aol.com)
8. 08:48 AM - Re: Clutch for clearance (lucien)
9. 09:36 AM - Re: prop clearance (Dana Hague)
10. 12:22 PM - prop spacer (william sullivan)
11. 12:23 PM - Re: toe out on the main gear (jb92563)
12. 02:45 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (ElleryWeld@aol.com)
13. 03:15 PM - Re: prop spacer (Jim Kmet)
14. 03:20 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (John Hauck)
15. 03:37 PM - prop ext. (william sullivan)
16. 03:38 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (boyd)
17. 03:38 PM - Re: prop spacer (boyd)
18. 03:54 PM - New Videos (John Williamson)
19. 04:14 PM - Re: New Videos (John Hauck)
20. 04:21 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (Mike Welch)
21. 04:21 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (ElleryWeld@aol.com)
22. 04:34 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (John Hauck)
23. 04:44 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (John Hauck)
24. 04:55 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (Dana Hague)
25. 05:15 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (Jack B. Hart)
26. 05:18 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (Mike Welch)
27. 05:37 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (Mike Welch)
28. 08:11 PM - Re: New Videos (lucien)
29. 10:34 PM - Re: Re: toe out on the main gear (Tony Oldman)
Message 1
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Ellery- I have a 2 blade Warp Drive prop bolted directly to the "B" box shaft.
Engine off clearance to the torque tube is about 1 3/4". By pushing hard on the
prop, I can get the blade to about 1/4" from the aileron. I will do a full power
run-up later today. Remember- my wings are mounted 2 1/2" to the rear of
where the original wings were. Where can I get a spacer, if necessary?
I will check with a local airport to see if their mogas has alcohol. I suspect
the former owner just ran pump high test, probably with alcohol. He was very
casual about maintenance. He was very specific about using Pennzoil, and an
MR funnel.
do not archive
Bill Sullivan
FS/KX
Windsor Locks, Ct.
Message 2
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| Subject: | The weather's lousy again |
Beautiful
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com
[mailto:owner-kolb-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of possums
Sent: Sunday, March 30, 2008 2:01 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: The weather's lousy again
But it was nice yesterday - went to the race track.
You might want to turn the volume down.
http://video.yahoo.com/watch/2287232/7182318
Message 3
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Ellery- I forgot. When I said I had about 1/4" clearance to the aileron, I meant
the tapered edge of the aileron itself. I was pushing HARD! I have not run the
engine past 4500 rpm yet. Jack Hart gave me a method of measuring- paper and
tape. I'll see what happens.
do not archive
Bill Sullivan
FS/KX
Windsor Locks, Ct.
Message 4
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| Subject: | Re: prop clearance |
Bill you can probably get a local machine shop to make you a spacer just
give them something to go by for the bolt pattern and tell them how thick you
need it , I could make you one if you was a bit closer a warp is a lot
stiffer than an IVO Prop but I would move the prop back anyway to help reduce
noise
Ellery in Maine
do not archive
In a message dated 3/31/2008 6:35:17 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
williamtsullivan@att.net writes:
Ellery- I have a 2 blade Warp Drive prop bolted directly to the "B" box
shaft. Engine off clearance to the torque tube is about 1 3/4". By pushing hard
on the prop, I can get the blade to about 1/4" from the aileron. I will do a
full power run-up later today. Remember- my wings are mounted 2 1/2" to the
rear of where the original wings were. Where can I get a spacer, if necessary?
I will check with a local airport to see if their mogas has alcohol. I
suspect the former owner just ran pump high test, probably with alcohol. He was
very casual about maintenance. He was very specific about using Pennzoil, and
an MR funnel.
do not archive
Bill Sullivan
FS/KX
Windsor Locks, Ct.
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List)
(http://www.matronics.com/contribution)
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 5
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Thanks, Ellery. I was just looking at Jack Hart's notes on prop cutting, if necessary.
Testing will have to wait- rain today.
do not archive
Bill
FS/KX
W.L., Ct.
Message 6
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| Subject: | Re: prop clearance |
I just Bought a 2 & 1/2 inch prop Extension from Lockwood for my Warp
Drive on a B-box, About $100 bucks, included bolts, & made things much
quieter.
Jim Kmet, TN, MK-3C
----- Original Message -----
From: ElleryWeld@aol.com
To: kolb-list@matronics.com
Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 7:41 AM
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: prop clearance
Bill you can probably get a local machine shop to make you a spacer
just give them something to go by for the bolt pattern and tell them
how thick you need it , I could make you one if you was a bit closer a
warp is a lot stiffer than an IVO Prop but I would move the prop back
anyway to help reduce noise
Ellery in Maine
do not archive
In a message dated 3/31/2008 6:35:17 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
williamtsullivan@att.net writes:
Ellery- I have a 2 blade Warp Drive prop bolted directly to the "B"
box shaft. Engine off clearance to the torque tube is about 1 3/4". By
pushing hard on the prop, I can get the blade to about 1/4" from the
aileron. I will do a full power run-up later today. Remember- my wings
are mounted 2 1/2" to the rear of where the original wings were. Where
can I get a spacer, if necessary?
I will check with a local airport to see if their mogas has
alcohol. I suspect the former owner just ran pump high test, probably
with alcohol. He was very casual about maintenance. He was very specific
about using Pennzoil, and an MR funnel.
do not archive
Bill Sullivan
FS/KX
Windsor
Locks, Ct.
="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.co
m/Navigator?Kolb-List
.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home.
Message 7
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| Subject: | Re:Clutch for clearance |
Guys
Wouldn a clutch do the same thing but with an added benefit?
Just a thought..
Mark
-----Original Message-----
From: ElleryWeld@aol.com
Sent: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 8:41 am
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: prop clearance
Bill you can probably get a local machine shop to make
you a spacer just give them something=C2- to go by for the bolt
pattern=C2-and tell them how thick you need it ,=C2-I could make you one
if
you was a bit closer=C2- a warp is a lot stiffer than an IVO Prop=C2- bu
t I
would move the prop back anyway to help reduce noise
=C2-
Ellery in Maine
do not archive
=C2-
In a message dated 3/31/2008 6:35:17 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
williamtsullivan@att.net writes:
Ellery- I have a 2 blade Warp=C2-Drive prop=C2-bolted directly to the
"B" box shaft. Engine off clearance to the torque tube is about 1 3/4". By
pushing hard on the prop, I can get the blade to about 1/4" from the ailer
on.
I will do a full power run-up later today. Remember- my wings are mounted
2
1/2" to the rear of where the original wings were. Where can I get a space
r,
if necessary?
=C2- I will check with a local airport to see if their mogas has
alcohol. I suspect the former owner just ran pump high test, probably with
alcohol. He was very casual about maintenance. He was very specific about
using Pennzoil, and an MR funnel.
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-do not archive
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
Bill Sullivan
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
FS/KX
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2
-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
=C2-=C2-=C2-=C2-
Windsor Locks, Ct.
="http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List">http://www.matronics.com/N
avigator?Kolb-List
.matronics.com/">http://forums.matronics.com
://www.matronics.com/contribution">http://www.matronics.com/contribution
Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home.
Message 8
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| Subject: | Re: Clutch for clearance |
knowvne(at)aol.com wrote:
> Guys Wouldn a clutch do the same thing but with an added benefit?
> Just a thought..
>
>
> Mark
>
>
> --
If you're thinking of the rk-400 that goes in the (2-stroke) C box, no, it doesn't
change any dimensions - it replaces the rubber coupler between the drive pinion
and crankshaft PTO inside the box.
It does solve about 10 other problems at once while adding only 2 or 3 more, so
it's a really good investment (I had on my, now Bob's, FSII)....
LS
--------
LS
FS II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=173897#173897
Message 9
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| Subject: | Re: prop clearance |
At 07:30 AM 3/31/2008, william sullivan wrote:
>Ellery- I have a 2 blade Warp Drive prop bolted directly to the "B" box
>shaft. Engine off clearance to the torque tube is about 1 3/4". By pushing
>hard on the prop, I can get the blade to about 1/4" from the aileron. I
>will do a full power run-up later today.
If you can push it to within 1/4", I'd wait on the full power
runup. Things can move around an awful lot under dynamic loading, and 1/4"
is REAL close!
> I will check with a local airport to see if their mogas has alcohol. I
> suspect the former owner just ran pump high test, probably with alcohol.
> He was very casual about maintenance. He was very specific about using
> Pennzoil, and an MR funnel.
If an airport sells mogas, it's probably alcohol free, since alcohol isn't
allowed for the aircraft that have an STC for mogas.
-Dana
--
Hit any key. With what?
Message 10
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Jim- I just talked to Lockwood, and they were not sure what item it was. Warp doesn't
make one. Do you have the item code, or the part numbers for the prop spacer?
do not archive
Bill Sullivan
FS/KX 447
Windsor Locks, Ct.
Message 11
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
Here is another Opinion on toe-out (Like you need an extra hole in your head) but
what the heck...information is power right?!!!
I Thought that Toe-in (pidgeon toed) was used because it tends to push the wheel
against the bearings, hub and helps hold the tire on if cotters or nuts come
off.
Also, it pushes the wheel legs closer together helping support the weight of the
aircraft on the landing gear on bounces.
Toe-out would cause the legs to be pulled out potentially increasing the leg bending
loads.
Too much of either one is bad.
My common sense tells me that with the plane in the flight level attitude you want
only very slight Toe-in which would probably be about neutral toe-in when
the tail is on the ground.
Let us know how it goes.
--------
Ray
Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Riverside County, CA
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=173941#173941
Message 12
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
Try a toe in configuration, I have flown a champ that had it, it really
likes to make things hard handling on the ground both wheels fighting with
each other to see who can get the most traction tossing the plane back and
forth, if your cotter pin and your bearing nuts are not in place you didn't do
a
good installation or inspection of your equipment the correct procedure is
a toe out sorry but I have been there done that
Ellery in Maine
do not archive
In a message dated 3/31/2008 2:24:35 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jb92563@yahoo.com writes:
--> Kolb-List message posted by: "jb92563" <jb92563@yahoo.com>
Here is another Opinion on toe-out (Like you need an extra hole in your
head) but what the heck...information is power right?!!!
I Thought that Toe-in (pidgeon toed) was used because it tends to push the
wheel against the bearings, hub and helps hold the tire on if cotters or nuts
come off.
Also, it pushes the wheel legs closer together helping support the weight of
the aircraft on the landing gear on bounces.
Toe-out would cause the legs to be pulled out potentially increasing the leg
bending loads.
Too much of either one is bad.
My common sense tells me that with the plane in the flight level attitude
you want only very slight Toe-in which would probably be about neutral toe-in
when the tail is on the ground.
Let us know how it goes.
--------
Ray
Kolb UltraStar (Cuyuna UL-202)
Moni MotorGlider
Schreder HP-11 Glider
Riverside County, CA
Do Not Archive
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=173941#173941
**************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL
Home.
(http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15&ncid=aolhom00030000000001)
Message 13
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Bill, the Item Code right off my invoice sez:
EAIVOEXT Description: Ivo prop extension W/mounting hardeware,
not for medium prop Price was $100. plus 14.00 S&H
Fit perfect. Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: william sullivan
To: kolb list
Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 2:18 PM
Subject: Kolb-List: prop spacer
Jim- I just talked to Lockwood, and they were not sure what item it
was. Warp doesn't make one. Do you have the item code, or the part
numbers for the prop spacer?
do not archive
Bill Sullivan
FS/KX 447
Windsor Locks, Ct.
Message 14
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
Ellery/Steve B/Gang:
I do not know about other airplanes, but Kolbs like a tad of toe in.
How much is a tad? Not much.
Toe out on a Kolb, minus the US, tends to spread the gear sequentially.
The farther it rolls on pavement, the more the main gear will spread
apart, increasing toe out and negative camber. It is the nature of
aluminum rod landing gear legs. Unlike truss/ladder type gear legs that
by nature hole the main wheels in what ever alignment they were in
before the aircraft started rolling.
When the brakes are applied on a Kolb, the main wheels tend to toe out
because the gear legs twist.
I use about 5 deg of positive camber and about 1/8" toe in. It works
for me and has for many many hours in the FS and the mkIII.
john h
mkIII
hauck's holler, alabama
the correct procedure is a toe out sorry but I have been there done
that
Ellery in Maine
Message 15
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Thanks, Jim. I'll call them tomorrow.
do not archive
Bill Sullivan
FS/KX
Windsor Locks, Ct.
Message 16
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
I Thought that Toe-in (pidgeon toed) was used because it tends to push the
wheel against the bearings, hub and helps hold the tire on if cotters or
nuts come off.
Also, it pushes the wheel legs closer together helping support the weight of
the aircraft on the landing gear on bounces.
Toe-out would cause the legs to be pulled out potentially increasing the leg
bending loads.
Too much of either one is bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The plans that came with my mkIIIc state:
The wheels should be aligned as shown: Parallel with the centerline axis of
the airplane. If you must err, err on the side of having the wheels toe
out a bit. Do not have any "toe-in".
Not being an engineer,,, I built as close as I could to plans.
Boyd
Message 17
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Jim- I just talked to Lockwood, and they were not sure what item it was.
Warp doesn't make one. Do you have the item code, or the part numbers for
the prop spacer?
do not archive
Bill Sullivan
FS/KX 447
Windsor Locks, Ct.
>>>>>>>>..
Check the aircraft spruce catalog or online store.
Boyd
Message 18
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Hi All,
It's been too windy to fly so I have had to resort to looking at past flights.
I posted 6 more videos to Youtube. They can be found here:
http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=kolbrapilot&p=r
do not archive
--------
John Williamson
Arlington, TX
Kolbra, 912ULS, 1580 hours
http://home.tx.rr.com/kolbrapilot
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=173987#173987
Message 19
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> http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=kolbrapilot&p=r
> > --------
> John Williamson
John W:
Well.................I'd have to say there is one set of videos that are far
more breath taking than all the others:
Kolb Kolbra Sunrise Flight
Or...............could be a toss up with this one:
Kolb Mark III Classic of John H.
Wadda ya think gang?
john h
mkIII
hauck's holler, alabama
Message 20
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
John H., Ray, and the rest of you'ze guys,
Since the Wright Bros. began the HomeBuilt craze, it has always been my understanding
that (all) taildraggers
require toe out, for the primary reason I already stated, namely, because the wheel
that is touching the ground has a tendency to "drive out" from the centerline
of the plane, thereby causing the other wheel to touch, also.
Like Ellery said, "No, toe in or out doesn't have anything to do with your wheels
coming off if you lose the cotter
pin and wheel nuts." That is nonsense to think you angle the wheel a particular
direction to help keep the wheel on!!
Toe in or out has nothing to do with keeping your wheels on, it has to do with
proper ground control manners.
We are talking TINY amounts of angle, gentlemen! So little, that if you have
a string stretched taut next to the wheel, inline with the centerline of the
plane, that you couldn't tell there was any angle....either in or out. You need
to place a long straightedge against the wheel, to actually see where the wheel
is really pointing.
On page 9, of my KOLB TWINSTAR MARK III " Plans Contents (yellow) book, it says;
The wheels should be aligned as shown (straight, neither toe in or out, according
to the drawing): Parallel with the centerline axis of the airplane. If you
must err, err on the side of having the wheels toe out a bit. Do not have any
"toe-in".
I double checked my actual toe out today. It is more like 1.25" toe out in 8
feet.
Here's another "mental picture" of what I have; I described my present settings
to be "1.25" in 8 feet. In other words, if the right tire was rolled, it would
travel 1.25" to the right, after a distance of eight feet. While this setting
would be a little excessive on a car, an airplane spends most of it's time in the
air.
John H. If I understood your toe in description, you said you have 1/8" toe
in. If you have the same MkIII OEM
wheels and tires I have, then that would equate to 1/8" in 7" (the tire's radius).
Converting this to my measurement
equates to: 8 feet = 96 ", 96" / 7" radius = 13.7, 13.7 X 1/8" = approx. 1.75".
In other words, your wheels are angled almost exactly the same as mine, except
your's are angle slightly in, and mine are angled slightly out.
Thanks for the discourse. You know, it may be that as long as your wheels are
kept within reasonable limits, either in or out, it may not make too much difference.
Could it be that Kolbs are easy ground handlers?
Mike Welch
________________________________
From: jhauck@elmore.rr.com
Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: toe out on the main gear
Ellery/Steve B/Gang:
I do not know about other airplanes, but Kolbs like a tad of toe in. How much
is a tad? Not much.
Toe out on a Kolb, minus the US, tends to spread the gear sequentially. The farther
it rolls on pavement, the more the main gear will spread apart, increasing
toe out and negative camber. It is the nature of aluminum rod landing gear
legs. Unlike truss/ladder type gear legs that by nature hole the main wheels
in what ever alignment they were in before the aircraft started rolling.
When the brakes are applied on a Kolb, the main wheels tend to toe out because
the gear legs twist.
I use about 5 deg of positive camber and about 1/8" toe in. It works for me and
has for many many hours in the FS and the mkIII.
john h
mkIII
hauck's holler, alabama
the correct procedure is a toe out sorry but I have been there done that
Ellery in Maine
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
I still like my wheels as straight as possible , just for even tire wear
Ellery in Maine
do not archive
In a message dated 3/31/2008 5:39:19 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
by0ung@brigham.net writes:
I Thought that Toe-in (pidgeon toed) was used because it tends to push the
wheel against the bearings, hub and helps hold the tire on if cotters or nu
ts
come off.
Also, it pushes the wheel legs closer together helping support the weight o
f
the aircraft on the landing gear on bounces.
Toe-out would cause the legs to be pulled out potentially increasing the le
g
bending loads.
Too much of either one is bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The plans that came with my mkIIIc state:
The wheels should be aligned as shown: Parallel with the centerline axis of
the airplane. If you must err, err on the side of having the wheels toe
out a bit. Do not have any =9Ctoe-in=9D.
Not being an engineer,,, I built as close as I could to plans.
Boyd
(http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Kolb-List)
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
> John H. If I understood your toe in description, you said you have 1/8"
toe in. If you have the same MkIII OEM
> wheels and tires I have, then that would equate to 1/8" in 7" (the tire's
> radius). Converting this to my measurement
> equates to: 8 feet = 96 ", 96" / 7" radius = 13.7, 13.7 X 1/8" =
> approx. 1.75".
>
> In other words, your wheels are angled almost exactly the same as mine,
> except your's are angle slightly in, and mine are angled slightly out.
>
> Thanks for the discourse. You know, it may be that as long as your
> wheels are kept within reasonable limits, either in or out, it may not
> make too much difference. Could it be that Kolbs are easy ground
> handlers?
>
> Mike Welch
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
> John H. If I understood your toe in description, you said you have 1/8"
toe in. If you have the same MkIII OEM
> wheels and tires I have, then that would equate to 1/8" in 7" (the tire's
> radius). Converting this to my measurement
> equates to: 8 feet = 96 ", 96" / 7" radius = 13.7, 13.7 X 1/8" =
> approx. 1.75".
>
> In other words, your wheels are angled almost exactly the same as mine,
> except your's are angle slightly in, and mine are angled slightly out.
>
> Thanks for the discourse. You know, it may be that as long as your
> wheels are kept within reasonable limits, either in or out, it may not
> make too much difference. Could it be that Kolbs are easy ground
> handlers?
>
> Mike Welch
Mike W:
Maybe reread my previous msg on how and why I set up my main gear the way I
do.
Sometimes I think we need to forget all the knowledge we have of why other
aircraft do what they do and focus on what we are building and flying.
Kolbs don't always agree with all those other tail draggers out there.
I'll repeat myself. A tad of toe in and 5 deg of positive camber work great
for me and my mkIII. I have never worn/scrubbed the tread off a tire on my
FS or mkIII.
Negative camber is progressive and most likely will scrub your tires.
Aluminum gear legs on Kolbs are quite flexible, not only in bending, but
also in twist. Your main gear almost have a mind of their own.
I have used heat treated 4130 for gear legs on my FS and mkIII since 1986.
I use them because they work much better for me than aluminum rod.
john h
mkIII
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
Hmmm. From my experience with R/C taildraggers, I've found that any
toe-out made the plane quite squirrelly on the ground and prone to ground
looping.
Picture this: Wheels toe out. Plane is slightly yawed to the right, by an
amount (for sake of discussion) equal to the toe-out. This results in the
left wheel tracking exactly straight, and the right wheel scrubbing. The
scrubbing results in greater drag on that side, so the plane yaws even more
to the right, etc.
Toe-in, OTOH, would be self correcting. Additionally, any braking flexes
the gear back, which would make any toe-out even worse, but would correct
toe-in.
I would shoot for perfectly straight, but err on the side of toe-in.
-Dana
--
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
Think about what you want your aircraft react during gusty cross wind
landing.
Assume you are side slipping with the up wind wing down and some rudder to
keep aligned with the center line during final approach and you are going to
stick the upwind wheel.
If you have toe out, the wheel touch will cause yaw up wind.
If you have toe in, the wheel touch will cause yaw down wind.
If you have zero toe in, the wheel touch will not influence yaw.
With a CG that is behind the main gear, which situation are you the most
comfortable?
It is important to have a little positive camber. Also, check and set your
camber and toe in at or close to gross weight for best results.
Jack B. Hart FF004
Winchester, IN
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
John,
Regarding my present gear legs, they are steel. Remember all the questions I
had about a month ago. Well, since then I built my new ones. They are 1 3/8"
chromoly 4130. I built them to have 3.5 degrees positive camber. I did not
like the looks of 5 degrees positve camber, so I chose to aim for a little less.
I planned on 4 degrees, but after it was all said and done, I ended up with
3.5. I am happy with that. Clearly they tilt out a little at the tops, but
not a whole lot, and this 1 3/8" x .0120 tubing is some tough stuff!
While your experience may prefer slight toe in, I was going by the Kolb Construction
book that says straight, or, if anything, slight toe out.
I also agree that with the tiny amount of toe we have, either in or out, neither
will will scrub your tires. It just not that much off from straight!
Mike Welch
MkIII steel gear
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
>
> Toe-in, OTOH, would be self correcting. Additionally, any braking flexes
> the gear back, which would make any toe-out even worse, but would correct
> toe-in.
>
> I would shoot for perfectly straight, but err on the side of toe-in.
>
> -Dana
Dana,
While doing a little research, about the time I posed this question to the group,
it appears that on RC models
you do indeed set for toe in. For the reasons you stated, you are correct. RC
models should be set for slight toe in.
What is becoming apparent to me is that slight toe in, to slight toe out, is
not going to make a huge difference.
I think I will just call it good, and leave them with 3.5 degrees positive camber,
and 1 degrees toe out. Looks good, and should work just fine!
One thing I am fairly curious about, though, is why there are so few Kolbs with
wheel pants. I am in the middle of
fabricating the mounts for my fiberglass wheel pants. I've just about completed
installing one, and it should be 1/3 the time to do the second one. Most of
the time spent on the first one was trying to see what would work. The second
one is just a matter of making a mirror image of some parts.
So, can you answer this one for me? Why don't more guys install wheel pants.
Mine will be so solidly mounted, that I don't think landing on grass has anyhing
to do with it. I'm curious......??
Mike W
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John Hauck wrote:
> > http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=kolbrapilot&p=r
>
> > > --------
> > John Williamson
> >
> >
>
>
>
> John W:
>
> Well.................I'd have to say there is one set of videos that are far
> more breath taking than all the others:
>
> Kolb Kolbra Sunrise Flight
>
> Or...............could be a toss up with this one:
>
> Kolb Mark III Classic of John H.
>
> Wadda ya think gang?
>
> john h
> mkIII
> hauck's holler, alabama
Those are good, but I'd have to say my favorite is The Kolbra Goes To Breakfast....
Not just because the view is from the back seat of a titan ;), but also it's
the best view of the kolbra from the outside as it flies through the air....
LS
--------
LS
FS II
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=174058#174058
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| Subject: | Re: toe out on the main gear |
My MK111 has wheel pants and looks great. They have never been a problem on
grass strips. I have used it in some pretty long grass and apart from
picking up a few stalks they just part the grass on thay through.
Tony
From Down under
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Welch" <mdnanwelch7@hotmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 01, 2008 1:33 PM
Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Re: toe out on the main gear
>
>
>>
>> Toe-in, OTOH, would be self correcting. Additionally, any braking flexes
>> the gear back, which would make any toe-out even worse, but would correct
>> toe-in.
>>
>> I would shoot for perfectly straight, but err on the side of toe-in.
>>
>> -Dana
>
>
> Dana,
>
> While doing a little research, about the time I posed this question to
> the group, it appears that on RC models
> you do indeed set for toe in. For the reasons you stated, you are
> correct. RC models should be set for slight toe in.
>
> What is becoming apparent to me is that slight toe in, to slight toe
> out, is not going to make a huge difference.
> I think I will just call it good, and leave them with 3.5 degrees positive
> camber, and 1 degrees toe out. Looks good, and should work just fine!
>
> One thing I am fairly curious about, though, is why there are so few
> Kolbs with wheel pants. I am in the middle of
> fabricating the mounts for my fiberglass wheel pants. I've just about
> completed installing one, and it should be 1/3 the time to do the second
> one. Most of the time spent on the first one was trying to see what would
> work. The second one is just a matter of making a mirror image of some
> parts.
>
> So, can you answer this one for me? Why don't more guys install wheel
> pants. Mine will be so solidly mounted, that I don't think landing on
> grass has anyhing to do with it. I'm curious......??
>
> Mike W
> _________________________________________________________________
> Windows Live Hotmail is giving away Zunes.
> http://www.windowslive-hotmail.com/ZuneADay/?locale=en-US&ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Mobile_Zune_V3
>
>
>
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