Today's Message Index:
----------------------
1. 06:57 AM - Re: Kolb Firestat II and Sport Pilot (grantr)
2. 08:33 AM - Re: Re: Cross Country Dreams (pj.ladd)
3. 09:41 AM - Re: Re: HKS Fuel system (Richard Girard)
4. 10:04 AM - Re: Re: Cross Country Dreams (Dana Hague)
5. 11:19 AM - Re: HKS Fuel system (JetPilot)
6. 01:01 PM - Re: Re: HKS Fuel system (boyd)
7. 02:08 PM - Kolb Falconer - Not Kolb Related (Michael Sharp)
8. 02:37 PM - Re: HKS Fuel system (Mnflyer)
9. 03:05 PM - Re: Re: Cross Country Dreams (robert bean)
10. 05:21 PM - Re: Re: HKS Fuel system (Richard Girard)
11. 09:38 PM - Re: HKS Fuel system (JetPilot)
Message 1
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Kolb Firestat II and Sport Pilot |
If he has a tail-wheel endorsement in say a J3,That he could fly the Kolb? Does
this also mean that he could also fly a Preceptor Pup for example, with out further
endorsement's? Sorry for my ignorance, I'm just happily building my airplane
myself ( CH 701), I still have not crossed any of these bridges myself yet.
The fly off hours are not an issue as his buddy flys for North West.
If you did the training in a tail wheel airplane with a speed less than 87kts you
will be rated to fly a tail wheel set AP-2 which is less than 87 kts. So that
means you can fly any light sport tail wheel airplane that flys less than
87 kts.
Too fly a plane faster than 87 kts you will have to get an endorsement. If you
are rated for AP-2, You will also have to get an endorsment to fly a tri gear
plane AP-1. This should be changed. If you can fly a tail wheel airplane you should
be able to fly a tri gear.
The firestar will fall under the 87kt speed. My MKIII does.
These rules apply to sport pilots.
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 2734#202734
Message 2
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Cross Country Dreams |
Well, you require some sort of pilot certificate for anything that's not
foot launched now, don't you? >>
Hi Dana
Yes. Quite right. Its not really too onerous. Not quite up to the standard
of the normal PPL but it gives you the basics of Nav, Met, Air law and
normal flyskills. Nothing fancy. Your plane too will be up to standard,
still pretty minimal but the design must be approved and any major
departures from the approved design have to be OK`d. There has recently been
the introduction of a `sub 115 Kg` category which is pretty mush like your
ultralight cat. The Firefly qualifies and there are a number of new designs
in the wings. (No pun intended)
Most pilots are responsible, but there are always a
few jerks who think they don't to know anything about procedures, airspace,
and the like. All it takes is one of them to give an airport manager a bad
taste for ultralights.>>
Yeah! Every country has them. Part of the problem with airport managers I
think was that the low speeds of the Ul`s messed up the circuits with other
GA aircraft. Now pilots with low speed approaches tend to keep their circuit
speeds well up and only slow up on finals.
Apart from that so many of the planes which are in the microlight bracket
are now indistinguishable from normal GA in both appearance and performance
that things have ironed themselves out.
Your wide open spaces enable you to ignore officialdom to a greater extent
than we can.Once upon a time I was part owner of 1000acre Ranch about 60
miles outside Denver. If I had lived there permanently I think that I would
have flown a UL with no licence without too many worries >
Cheers
Pat
Message 3
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: HKS Fuel system |
All, the HKS engine's ignition system is nearly identical to that of the
Rotax 912 with the exception that the HKS has a CDI box between each
ignition pickup on the stator and the coil. I'd guess this is because it
needs the extra power to fire the plug given the higher compression of the
HKS (11.3 to 1). The book says the CDI's will work down to 10 volts. If I
were to lose the alternator I'd shut down everything but the mags and the
boost pump, hit "nearest" on the GPS (now operating off its own internal
batteries), relax and fly to my new destination. The 17AH battery will give
at least a half hour endurance at that rate of drain.
Rick
do not archive
On Thu, Sep 4, 2008 at 10:10 PM, boyd <by0ung@brigham.net> wrote:
>
>
> > This is good until the lighting coil in the engine quits, or a fuse
> blows.
> > This still puts all the eggs in one basket... After 545 hours I will
> > still
> > use the facet pump as a backup to the pump on the 912.
> >
> > Boyd
>
>
> >Hi Boyd:
>
> >Correct me if I am wrong. The 912 series engine use an alternator for
> >aircraft power, and two seperate generators for the two seperate ignition
> systems. I think that is the way I remember being taught in Rotax 912
> >engine school.
>
> >Am I to understand the HKS uses one system to power accessories and dual
> >ign?
>
> >john h
> >mkIII
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>
> John... I think you are right... but for clarity I believe the lighting
> and 2 cdi and also the tach coils are all on the same stator, they have
> separate output wires that feed their intended destinations. And you could
> have one coil go bad, say the left cdi... and the engine would still run on
> the right cdi... but if the lighting coil goes out, you are finished with
> charging the battery, and would be left with what power is in the battery.
> I do not believe there is a redundant backup to the lighting coil.
>
> My point was not that he would loose the spark if the lighting coil went
> out,,, only that if his only source of getting fuel to the engine was the
> 2
> facet pumps.... and no engine driven pump. An electrical failure would
> quickly become an engine failure due to fuel exhaustion. If the charging
> circuit fails the battery should keep things going for a while,,
>
> but if a main buss fuse blows,,,
> even with the lighting coil working,,,
> no electricity to the pumps,,,
> no gas to the engine,,,
> no turning of the prop,
> look for a place to set it down.
>
> If my only source of fuel pumping was 2 electric pumps,,, I would want 2
> batteries,, 2 fuses,, 2 switches,,, in order to have it redundant.. and
> maybe Dave has that under control. If not I would rethink something.
>
> Or maybe I missed something in the translation and my thoughts are all wet.
> I am a plumber you know. It could happen. I kind of got mostly wet this
> afternoon,, but that is another story.
>
> Boyd Young
> MkIII
>
>
Message 4
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Cross Country Dreams |
At 11:30 AM 9/5/2008, pj.ladd wrote:
>...the low speeds of the Ul`s messed up the circuits with other GA
>aircraft. Now pilots with low speed approaches tend to keep their circuit
>speeds well up and only slow up on finals.
>Apart from that so many of the planes which are in the microlight bracket
>are now indistinguishable from normal GA in both appearance and
>performance that things have ironed themselves out.
That's different, too, since here the ultralight category doesn't include
those newer, faster aircraft. The new LSA category was supposed to absorb
all the fat ultralights and to an extent it has, but it's more a downward
extension of the GA category... with ultralights still a noticeably
different class, all the aluminum tube and sailcloth planes (with a few
exceptions like the lighter Kolbs).
>Your wide open spaces enable you to ignore officialdom...
That's a sacred tradition! :)
-Dana
do not archive
--
And they shall beat their swords into plowshares, for if you hit a man
with a plowshare, he'll know he's been hit!
Message 5
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: HKS Fuel system |
aslsa.rng(at)gmail.com wrote:
>
>
> The 17AH battery will give at least a half hour endurance at that rate of drain.
>
>
A battery that big should give you several hours running time if the charging system
fails... An ignition system and a facett fuel pump do not draw more than
a few amps. You would probably run out of gas before your engine died due to
the battery running down.
For the ignition system on an HKS, you are best off to NEVER use a fuse on it,
or relay, or anything of the sort. Why would you want a fuse or any device that
could suddenly cut power to your ignition system in order to protect it ?
It should be hard wired to its power source. You want power to get to the ignition
system no matter what happens.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 2785#202785
Message 6
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: HKS Fuel system |
All, the HKS engine's ignition system is nearly identical to that of the
Rotax 912 with the exception that the HKS has a CDI box between each
ignition pickup on the stator and the coil. I'd guess this is because it
needs the extra power to fire the plug given the higher compression of the
HKS (11.3 to 1). The book says the CDI's will work down to 10 volts. If I
were to lose the alternator I'd shut down everything but the mags and the
boost pump, hit "nearest" on the GPS (now operating off its own internal
batteries), relax and fly to my new destination. The 17AH battery will give
at least a half hour endurance at that rate of drain.
Rick
do not archive
What would happen if there were an electrical short and the main fuse to the
charging system blows, or it is not present and because of the short the
battery is pulled to below 10 volts. Would the engine quit???? Do the
cdi"s need power from the lighting circuit or are they independent???
This is totally unrelated to the original question I posed... which was if
there were a loss of electrical power and the only fuel pumps were
electric, if you don't fuse the pumps and one of them shorts out...
the result would be a possible fire in the wiring, or it would continue to
pull the battery level down at an accelerated rate.
The question was posed on the premise that the only fuel pumps were 2
electrical facet pumps and no engine driven pumps. an electrical melt down
would stop fuel flow. I had not considered cdi or the loss of sparks.
Apparently that is now being discussed as well.
I was riding with a friend in his family car when an unfused circuit shorted
out ( the installation of an aftermarket stereo) .. Suddenly we were
trying to dodge traffic, pull off the road, and try to put out the fire
before we were involved in a crash or the entire car went up in flames.
Fuses are installed for a couple reasons.. First it protects the device and
secondly it protects the wiring. And if either catches on fire,, it will
bring an end to the fun in a hurry. And in the event of an electric fuel
pump. the fan quits in short order even if every other thing is ok.
I like my eggs in 2 baskets,,, 1: an engine driven pump, and 2: an
electric driven pump.
Boyd Young
MkIII
Message 7
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Kolb Falconer - Not Kolb Related |
ATTENTION!!!! ATTENTION!!!!
NOT KOLB RELATED!!!
Would the Falconer in our group please email me off list???
I believe Larry C????
Thanks
And,
Do Not Archive
Mike
Message 8
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: HKS Fuel system |
The reason for having fuses or a circuit breaker in the HKS CDI wiring system is
thats the way the HKS installation manual says to do it. A 3 amp fuse or circuit
breaker of each unit. As posted a fuse is a safety device and needed in
any circuit. While anything can happen a total light coil / alternator failure
is not common, I'm in my 60's and have ridden snowmobiles for 40+ years and have
flown Rotax and HKS powered aircraft for 15+ yrs and have yet to experience
a lighting coil or alternator failure, I have has snowmobile CDI failure (never
has happened while running but on shut down would not fire when tring to start
again) and I've had point ignition failure for that reason I do not like
single ignition aircraft engines.
--------
GB
MNFlyer
Flying a HKS Kitfox III
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 2825#202825
Message 9
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: Cross Country Dreams |
That is the goofy loophole built into the system. Some of the old
type certificated manufacturers, given the marketing demands of the time
were want to stick as high a gross on the thing as possible to
attract buyers. -come many years later it has worked negatively on the
prospects for these good old birds, putting too many of them just out
of reach of LSA. One of the better eliminated (IMO) was the C-140.
Now, preinformed, all a manufacturer has to do is stick a1320 label
on it. The most extreme example to date is the Jabiru.
That thing is actually a 4 passenger airplane with the back seat
removed. -good plane too if you can afford one.
BB
On 5, Sep 2008, at 1:01 PM, Dana Hague wrote:
>
> At 11:30 AM 9/5/2008, pj.ladd wrote:
>> ...the low speeds of the Ul`s messed up the circuits with other GA
>> aircraft. Now pilots with low speed approaches tend to keep their
>> circuit speeds well up and only slow up on finals.
>> Apart from that so many of the planes which are in the microlight
>> bracket are now indistinguishable from normal GA in both
>> appearance and performance that things have ironed themselves out.
>
> That's different, too, since here the ultralight category doesn't
> include those newer, faster aircraft. The new LSA category was
> supposed to absorb all the fat ultralights and to an extent it has,
> but it's more a downward extension of the GA category... with
> ultralights still a noticeably different class, all the aluminum
> tube and sailcloth planes (with a few exceptions like the lighter
> Kolbs).
>
>> Your wide open spaces enable you to ignore officialdom...
>
> That's a sacred tradition! :)
>
> -Dana
>
> do not archive
>
> --
> And they shall beat their swords into plowshares, for if you hit a
> man with a plowshare, he'll know he's been hit!
>
>
Message 10
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: HKS Fuel system |
Boyd, Well, it started out as an answer to the question posed by John.
To answer yours, I'd suggest you join the Aeroelectric forum which is also
here on the Matronic list. Get yourself a copy of Bob Nuckolls' book, learn
about building a fault tolerant electrical system for your aircraft, and
then use one of Bob's sample schematics as the basis for your system.
Just the way I do it, you ideas may differ.
Rick
do not archive
On Fri, Sep 5, 2008 at 2:59 PM, boyd <by0ung@brigham.net> wrote:
> All, the HKS engine's ignition system is nearly identical to that of the
> Rotax 912 with the exception that the HKS has a CDI box between each
> ignition pickup on the stator and the coil. I'd guess this is because it
> needs the extra power to fire the plug given the higher compression of th
e
> HKS (11.3 to 1). The book says the CDI's will work down to 10 volts. If I
> were to lose the alternator I'd shut down everything but the mags and the
> boost pump, hit "nearest" on the GPS (now operating off its own internal
> batteries), relax and fly to my new destination. The 17AH battery will gi
ve
> at least a half hour endurance at that rate of drain.
>
> Rick
> do not archive
>
>
> What would happen if there were an electrical short and the main fuse to
> the charging system blows, or it is not present and because of the short
> the battery is pulled to below 10 volts=85 Would the engine quit????
Do
> the cdi"s need power from the lighting circuit or are they independent???
>
>
> This is totally unrelated to the original question I posed=85.. which wa
s if
> there were a loss of electrical power and the only fuel pumps were
> electric, if you don't fuse the pumps and one of them shorts out=85.
.
> the result would be a possible fire in the wiring, or it would continue t
o
> pull the battery level down at an accelerated rate=85
>
>
> The question was posed on the premise that the only fuel pumps were 2
> electrical facet pumps and no engine driven pumps=85 an electrical melt d
own
> would stop fuel flow. I had not considered cdi or the loss of sparks.
> Apparently that is now being discussed as well.
>
>
> I was riding with a friend in his family car when an unfused circuit
> shorted out ( the installation of an aftermarket stereo) =85. Suddenl
y we
> were trying to dodge traffic, pull off the road, and try to put out the
> fire before we were involved in a crash or the entire car went up in
> flames. Fuses are installed for a couple reasons=85. First it protects
the
> device and secondly it protects the wiring. And if either catches on
> fire,, it will bring an end to the fun in a hurry. And in the event of
an
> electric fuel pump=85 the fan quits in short order even if every other
thing
> is ok.
>
>
> I like my eggs in 2 baskets,,, 1: an engine driven pump, and 2: an
> electric driven pump.
>
>
> Boyd Young
>
> MkIII
>
>
> *
>
===========
===========
===========
===========
> *
>
>
Message 11
INDEX | Back to Main INDEX |
PREVIOUS | Skip to PREVIOUS Message |
NEXT | Skip to NEXT Message |
LIST | Reply to LIST Regarding this Message |
SENDER | Reply to SENDER Regarding this Message |
|
Subject: | Re: HKS Fuel system |
If you have two Facet fuel pumps, you should fuse and power each one separately.
That way the failure of one fuel pump will be a non issue, you probably wont
even know about it until you test them. No one is telling you not to fuse the
fuel pumps.
I am not familiar with HKS ignition, but If both ignitions use the same electrical
supply, you most definitely do not want to fuse it. Adding fuses also adds
a bunch more electrical connections, and sometimes fuses just blow when they
should not, it happens. I would much rather burn a module, or a wire on the
engine than adding all the failure points of running the ignition power down
to a fuse than back up to the engine.
If your fuse blows, or a connections vibrates loose, and your engine quits suddenly
at a very bad time, will you still be saying , at least had a fuse ? Power
directly from the power output of the engine to the ignition. That way it
is a very short and simple connection, and chances of a failure are about zero.
Even if you do short the wire on the engine, its not going to burn anything
or cause a fire with such a short run in a non critical area. Your experience
from a car does not apply in any way in this case. The power from the battery
should have a fuse, because the wire is running into the airframe and most
definitely would be a hazard in a short. Bottom line, you have to educate yourself,
and be knowledgeable enough to know what is a real risk and what is not.
Just taking some experience from an automobile and trying to apply it to all
aspects of wiring an airplane is not the right thing to do.
Mike
--------
"NO FEAR" - If you have no fear you did not go as fast as you could
have !!!
Kolb MK-III Xtra, 912-S
Read this topic online here:
http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p 2855#202855
Other Matronics Email List Services
These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.
-- Please support this service by making your Contribution today! --
|