---------------------------------------------------------- Kolb-List Digest Archive --- Total Messages Posted Sat 03/21/09: 24 ---------------------------------------------------------- Today's Message Index: ---------------------- 1. 07:04 AM - Re: Re: AirVenture 2009 (John Hauck) 2. 07:35 AM - Re: AirVenture 2009 (N111KX (Kip)) 3. 07:44 AM - Re: AirVenture 2009 (ces308) 4. 08:17 AM - Re: Engine monitoring (boyd) 5. 08:17 AM - Re: Headsets & intercom selection for Mark III Xtra! (boyd) 6. 08:17 AM - Re: Warp Drive bolt torque (boyd) 7. 09:24 AM - 100LL fuel additive (Mike Welch) 8. 11:41 AM - Re: 100LL fuel additive () 9. 01:25 PM - Re: Headsets & intercom selection for Mark III Xtra! (Jim Kmet) 10. 01:27 PM - Re: Warp Drive bolt torque (Jim Kmet) 11. 01:51 PM - Re: 100LL fuel additive (herb) 12. 02:05 PM - And now for something completely different (Richard Girard) 13. 02:05 PM - Re: Engine monitoring (boyd) 14. 02:10 PM - Re: Engine monitoring (Richard Girard) 15. 02:47 PM - Re: 100LL fuel additive (Larry Cottrell) 16. 03:24 PM - Re: Anyone have experence with Hirth F-30? (Brad Stump) 17. 03:43 PM - Re: 100LL fuel additive (Dana Hague) 18. 04:03 PM - Future Kolb pilot (Richard Girard) 19. 04:47 PM - Re: 100LL fuel additive (Beauford T) 20. 05:52 PM - Re: 100LL fuel additive (John Hauck) 21. 08:22 PM - Broken exhaust bracket (cristalclear13) 22. 08:59 PM - Re: Broken exhaust bracket (Ralph B) 23. 09:55 PM - Re: 100LL fuel additive (Dwight) 24. 10:11 PM - Re: Re: 100LL fuel additive (Larry Cottrell) ________________________________ Message 1 _____________________________________ Time: 07:04:42 AM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: AirVenture 2009 > Thanks John,I hope so...that would work great for me...anyone interested in coming up to northern Michigan ?? 5Y2 Houghton Lake State airport to be exact.... > > chris ambrose I'm pretty sure I have been into 5Y2 on one of my flight up north, just south of Grayling. john h mkIII ________________________________ Message 2 _____________________________________ Time: 07:35:09 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: AirVenture 2009 From: "N111KX (Kip)" Wow. It's too bad that OSH has sunk to this level regarding ultralights. In the mid-eighties and nineties there was such a buzz over in the UL area. To me, it was about the only reason to go to make the 8 hour drive... Kip -------- Kip Firestar II, N111KX Waiex, N111YX Quickie 1, N111QX Atlanta Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=235507#235507 ________________________________ Message 3 _____________________________________ Time: 07:44:59 AM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: AirVenture 2009 From: "ces308" John Hauck wrote: > > Thanks John,I hope so...that would work great for me...anyone interested > in coming up to northern Michigan ?? 5Y2 Houghton Lake State airport to > be exact.... > > > > > chris ambrose > > That's the one John....best little airport in the north! > > > > chris ambrose > > > > > > I'm pretty sure I have been into 5Y2 on one of my flight up north, just > south of Grayling. > > john h > mkIII Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=235508#235508 ________________________________ Message 4 _____________________________________ Time: 08:17:06 AM PST US From: "boyd" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Engine monitoring Mike. I wonder if any of the O2 sensors are "less" succeptible to leaded gas? 100 octane is the minuimum analysis...I recall accepting the delivery of a truck of av gas at a local airport that had an analysis of 119 octane... . High Octane gas is regular gas with additives...to slow the burn mainly...everyone knows this I guess? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >From what I know.. Which I will admit is not enough... may not be totally accurate. My friend drives a gas delivery truck and has done so for over 40 years. he has been in the refineries, as well as the pipeline terminals... and he has told me that there is what is called " house gas" which comes in regular "house gas" and premium "house gas" . Example, Texaco refineries do not refine Texaco gas. They refine "house gas" when the gas hauler pulls up to the loading dock and inserts his load card and enters the amount to load.. The computers will mix in the additives into the house gas specified by Texaco then it becomes Texaco gas. Auto fuel does not sit in tanks for months and months... it is designed to run through the system and be consumed within a couple weeks. Av gas on the other hand because it sits in the tanks for much longer times has to be refined in such a manner that more of the impurities are removed. This extra refining is in large part responsible for the additional cost. That added to the supply and demand at the local airport,,,, the fbo has it and you need it,,, and generally there is not an av gas station on each and every corner,, so the competition or large volumes discounts is not there. Boyd ________________________________ Message 5 _____________________________________ Time: 08:17:06 AM PST US From: "boyd" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Headsets & intercom selection for Mark III Xtra! Please can everyone give their feedback with their Headsets, >>>>>>>>> I use the sigtronics spo22 "N" intercom the "N" is for high noise environment My headsets are Telex Echelon anr 150 the mikes on these headsets are real sensitive, and picked up too much background noise so I called telex and they gave me instructions to turn down the mike gain now they work quite well. Boyd ________________________________ Message 6 _____________________________________ Time: 08:17:06 AM PST US From: "boyd" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Warp Drive bolt torque Does anybody know the torque on the bolts that hold a Warp Drive prop to the hub flange on a 447? I called Warp Drive, and they are closed this week. Thanks. Bill Sullivan Windsor Locks, Ct. FS 447 >>>>>>>>>>. I am not sure if there is different torque values for different engines,,,,, My instructions say to torque the =BC inch bolts to 120 inch pounds or 10 foot pounds,,, in increments of 20 inch pounds up to the full recommended torque. Torque the 8 mm or 5/16 mounting bolts to 175 inch pounds or 15 ft pounds Torque the 3/8 mounting bolts to 35 ft pounds Re torque after 1 hour of operation then every 5 to 10 hours as a part of regular maintenance. I am just guessing here,,, I think the difference between the 5/16 / 8mm and the 3/8 mounting bolts will depend on what hub you have. Boyd ________________________________ Message 7 _____________________________________ Time: 09:24:29 AM PST US From: Mike Welch Subject: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive Kolb people=2C Is anyone familiar with this product that reduces lead deposit buildup=2C when using low-lead fuel. http://www.skygeek.com/73122.html My engine is designed to run on auto gas (it oughta=2C since it came from an auto!). It is NOT designed to run on low-lead. Yet=2C I can imagine i t is possible that the only fuel available on a long distance cross country flight might be airport fuel....100LL. Has anyone ever used this stuff=2C and can give a report on it's effectiv eness? Mike Welch MkIII _________________________________________________________________ Internet Explorer 8 ' Now Available. Faster=2C safer=2C easier. ________________________________ Message 8 _____________________________________ Time: 11:41:53 AM PST US From: Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive I have heard that Marvel Mystery oil used in the gas and the oil prevents lead build up. Have not been able to confirm if it will make the use of 100LL practical in engines designed to use auto fuel. ________________________________ Message 9 _____________________________________ Time: 01:25:15 PM PST US From: "Jim Kmet" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Headsets & intercom selection for Mark III Xtra! Afetr using several different intercoms, I`ve had the best luck with this same model, the SPO-22N, with any kind of headset, works well. Jim Kmet Cookeville, TN MK-3C now 912 powered & condition inspection done as of today! ----- Original Message ----- From: "boyd" Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 10:16 AM Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Headsets & intercom selection for Mark III Xtra! > > Please can everyone give their feedback with their Headsets, >>>>>>>>>> > > I use the sigtronics spo22 "N" intercom the "N" is for high noise > environment > My headsets are Telex Echelon anr 150 the mikes on these headsets are > real sensitive, and picked up too much background noise so I called telex > and they gave me instructions to turn down the mike gain now they work > quite > well. > > Boyd > > > ________________________________ Message 10 ____________________________________ Time: 01:27:09 PM PST US From: "Jim Kmet" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Warp Drive bolt torque Warps website has a page that has this info. Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: boyd To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 10:16 AM Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Warp Drive bolt torque Does anybody know the torque on the bolts that hold a Warp Drive prop to the hub flange on a 447? I called Warp Drive, and they are closed this week. Thanks. Bill Sullivan Windsor Locks, Ct. FS 447 >>>>>>>>>>. I am not sure if there is different torque values for different engines,,,,, My instructions say to torque the =BC inch bolts to 120 inch pounds or 10 foot pounds,,, in increments of 20 inch pounds up to the full recommended torque. Torque the 8 mm or 5/16 mounting bolts to 175 inch pounds or 15 ft pounds Torque the 3/8 mounting bolts to 35 ft pounds Re torque after 1 hour of operation then every 5 to 10 hours as a part of regular maintenance. I am just guessing here,,, I think the difference between the 5/16 / 8mm and the 3/8 mounting bolts will depend on what hub you have. Boyd ________________________________ Message 11 ____________________________________ Time: 01:51:24 PM PST US From: herb Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive Reading on the net...appears that MMO has phosphorous as its active ingredient... Dump a few ozs in the tank and carbon and sticky rings are a thing of the past...I also toss one oz over my left shoulder... :-) Herb WHAT IS IT? My own understanding from earlier articles on the subject is that Marvel Mystery Oil is a light viscosity oil, roughly equivalent to an SAE 3W, containing (among other things) about 20 percent solvent (probably mineral spirits), dye, wintergreen for smell, and 790 PPM of a phosphorous additive. At 01:40 PM 3/21/2009, you wrote: > >I have heard that Marvel Mystery oil used in the gas and the oil >prevents lead build up. Have not been able to confirm if it will >make the use of 100LL practical in engines designed to use auto fuel. > ________________________________ Message 12 ____________________________________ Time: 02:05:25 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: And now for something completely different From: Richard Girard http://www.fanwing.com/ Rick ________________________________ Message 13 ____________________________________ Time: 02:05:37 PM PST US From: "boyd" Subject: RE: Kolb-List: Engine monitoring Can a 2 cycle or 4 cycle motor, tuned at sea level, become way too lean, if a person were to fly it at 10,000+ feet? If it is possible for this to happen (climb into a lean condition), at least there are gauges that may help them take a different tuning approach. Mike Welch >>>>>>>>>>>>>> If tuned for sea level.. And you go to 10,000 ft. it will be running rich,,,, however if you are at 5,000 ft and tuned up nice and go to sea level. then you will be lean. Boyd ________________________________ Message 14 ____________________________________ Time: 02:10:51 PM PST US Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Engine monitoring From: Richard Girard Boyd, The primary reason that avgas costs more than mogas is due to shippin g costs. Mogas can go through the pipeline system, avgas has to be transporte d by truck because of the lead. Rick On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 10:16 AM, boyd wrote: > Mike. I wonder if any of the O2 sensors are "less" succeptible to > leaded gas? 100 octane is the minuimum analysis...I recall accepting > the delivery of a truck of av gas at a local airport that had an analysis of > 119 octane... . High Octane gas is regular gas with additives...to slow > the burn mainly...everyone knows this I guess? > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > From what I know=85. Which I will admit is not enough=85.. may not be > totally accurate. My friend drives a gas delivery truck and has done so > for over 40 years=85 he has been in the refineries, as well as the > pipeline terminals=85.. and he has told me that there is what is ca lled > =93 house gas=94 which comes in regular =93house gas=94 and premium =93house gas=94 > . Example, Texaco refineries do not refine Texaco gas. They refine > =93house gas=94 when the gas hauler pulls up to the loading dock and in serts > his load card and enters the amount to load=85. The computers will mix i n the > additives into the house gas specified by Texaco then it becomes Texaco > gas. Auto fuel does not sit in tanks for months and months=85.. it i s > designed to run through the system and be consumed within a couple weeks. > Av gas on the other hand because it sits in the tanks for much longer tim es > has to be refined in such a manner that more of the impurities are > removed. This extra refining is in large part responsible for the > additional cost. That added to the supply and demand at the local > airport,,,, the fbo has it and you need it,,, and generally there is not > an av gas station on each and every corner,, so the competition or large > volumes discounts is not there. > > > Boyd > > =========== =========== =========== =========== > * > > ________________________________ Message 15 ____________________________________ Time: 02:47:14 PM PST US From: "Larry Cottrell" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive Not a scientific test you understand, but when Arty and I took our Texas trip a couple of years ago. I had a 503 and used MMO in my fuel. We flew for 40 some hours, using 100 LL when it was available which was most of the time. Just a WAG on my part but I believe we used in excess of 120 gallons of the stuff. We flew for 2600 miles total. I changed the spark plugs when we returned and there was enough lead on the plugs that my mag checks showed a noticeable change. Not enough to be concerned about, but there was a small build up. Of course the recommended change time frame is 25 hours I believe, so it was no real surprise that they were showing wear. Now having said that, that same engine when I sold it at 185 hours showed no carbon at all on the pistons and no wear on the cylinder walls. It had never been decarboned. I had always used MMO in my fuel, and will continue to do so. It damn sure doesn't hurt and I believe that it helps a lot. Larry C ----- Original Message ----- From: apilot@surewest.net To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 12:40 PM Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive I have heard that Marvel Mystery oil used in the gas and the oil prevents lead build up. Have not been able to confirm if it will make the use of 100LL practical in engines designed to use auto fuel. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 03/20/09 19:01:00 ________________________________ Message 16 ____________________________________ Time: 03:24:52 PM PST US From: Brad Stump Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Anyone have experence with Hirth F-30? I fly a mk3 with a Hirth 3503 EFI,so far,35hrs.The engine performes well.The only issue Ive had is oil leaking out air filter.The reed valve was not sealing correctly,replaced with a new one,still have a small leak.I don't like having to wipe oil off the prop every time i land.Can't afford to replace engine,I hope that time and use will solve this neusance. > -----Original Message----- > From: jhauck@elmore.rr.com > Sent: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 22:55:59 -0500 > To: kolb-list@matronics.com > Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Anyone have experence with Hirth F-30? > > > > > We got a 70 HP - with problems - at the farm. >> But I wouldn't want to comment on that particular engine on this list. >> Oil leaks, gear box problems - engine out (frame damage - lot of work). >> But, they say they have fixed them........ >> I don't like Hirth's, (the old ones or the new ones) so I shouldn't >> comment anyway. > > > Possum: > > Thanks for not commenting on the Hirth reputation. > > Like a some of the Rotax and Cuyuna engines I owned and flew in front of, > they quit making noise at the most inopportune times. Uncommanded > silence. > > I don't know anything about them except what I hear or happen to see at a > flyin somewhere. We do not have any in my neck of the woods. > > Someone mentioned a mkIIIx at last year's Kolb Homecoming flying with a > Hirth. I did see that one fly. However, I believe it was trailered to > Labhart Field, and trailered home. Good looking Kolb. > > john h > mkIII > > ____________________________________________________________ FREE 3D MARINE AQUARIUM SCREENSAVER - Watch dolphins, sharks & orcas on your desktop! Check it out at http://www.inbox.com/marineaquarium ________________________________ Message 17 ____________________________________ Time: 03:43:51 PM PST US From: Dana Hague Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive At 12:23 PM 3/21/2009, Mike Welch wrote: >Kolb people, > > Is anyone familiar with this product that reduces lead deposit buildup, > when using low-lead fuel. > >http://www.skygeek.com/73122.html > > My engine is designed to run on auto gas (it oughta, since it came from > an auto!). It is NOT designed to run on low-lead. Yet, I can imagine it > is possible that the only fuel available on a long distance cross country > flight might be airport fuel....100LL. > > Has anyone ever used this stuff, and can give a report on it's > effectiveness? I've never used it, but it was quite popular and a lot of guys used it religiously in older airplanes when 100LL first came out and 80 was hard to find... a lot of aircraft engines had trouble with lead fouling the valves. Me, I just ran mogas instead (leaded regular and no ethanol then). -Dana -- Ever notice how fast Windows runs? Neither did I. ________________________________ Message 18 ____________________________________ Time: 04:03:49 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Future Kolb pilot From: Richard Girard We had the grandson over for the afternoon and he just had to see grandpa's airplane. Almost took tools to pry him out when it was time to go home. There are PIC issues in my future, I'm sure. Rick ________________________________ Message 19 ____________________________________ Time: 04:47:11 PM PST US From: "Beauford T" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive Mike: TCP was developed during WWII to control lead fouling in high performance Av-engines using 115-145 octane heavily leaded high-test gasoline.... I believe Shell Oil marketed it first after the war. I ran a 165 hp. Franklin on 100 LL for 9 years...This engine was low compression and was designed in the 1930's for 80/87 octane gas. The Alcor TCP was the only way I could keep from having to pull and scrape the bottom plugs every 20 hours (the Franklin used 14mm automotive type plugs and the electrodes were prone to fouling.) With the TCP, they would go 100 hours plus on the 100 LL. TCP makes the lead ball up into globules and blow out the exhaust, vice depositing on the plugs, valves, piston crown, or whatever. Not sure what it would do in a 2-stroke or Rotax 4 stroke engine... Worth what ye paid fer it.. beauford FF-076 Brandon, FL ----- Original Message ----- From: Mike Welch To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 12:23 PM Subject: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive Kolb people, Is anyone familiar with this product that reduces lead deposit buildup, when using low-lead fuel. http://www.skygeek.com/73122.html My engine is designed to run on auto gas (it oughta, since it came from an auto!). It is NOT designed to run on low-lead. Yet, I can imagine it is possible that the only fuel available on a long distance cross country flight might be airport fuel....100LL. Has anyone ever used this stuff, and can give a report on it's effectiveness? Mike Welch MkIII ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Internet Explorer 8 ' Now Available. Faster, saferrget='_new'>Download FREE now! ________________________________ Message 20 ____________________________________ Time: 05:52:01 PM PST US From: "John Hauck" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: 100LL fuel additive Me too! In fact I use it in everything I own, except the weed eater and chain saw two strokes. Got sponsored by Alcor TCP on my 2001 flight to Alaska. It worked well, but was hard to handle. Warnings on the can was enough to scare me. It is very expensive. No sponsorship in 2004 when I flew back to Alaska. This flight I used MMO. It worked well, smelled good, and had not scarly warnings on the can. Was relatively cheap, available at Walmart, so resupply was not a problem. Did not have to haul enough for the entire flight. Does it work. I think so. It has been used by aviators and a lot of other folks since 1933. I have seen miracles happen with some of my old tractors that are a few years older than me. Back in the old days, I have watched crop dusters dump it in the fuel tank by the gallons. john h mkIII Now having said that, that same engine when I sold it at 185 hours showed no carbon at all on the pistons and no wear on the cylinder walls. It had never been decarboned. I had always used MMO in my fuel, and will continue to do so. It damn sure doesn't hurt and I believe that it helps a lot. Larry C ________________________________ Message 21 ____________________________________ Time: 08:22:41 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Broken exhaust bracket From: "cristalclear13" I don't know how many of you read the Rotax forum also, but if you do you'll remember that I have an exhaust leak. Here's the thread: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?t=55938 I first tried to simply replace the outside exhaust gaskets. That didn't stop the leak. So today I replaced the inside exhaust gaskets. Since Lucien also mentioned checking the support and since I had been noticing lately that the rubber bushings on my exhaust mount were looking pretty worn AND since I had it all apart anyways to replace the inner exhaust gaskets (those were a challenge to scrape off the cowl), I decided to go ahead and take the mount apart and inspect it. Should have done that sooner! I attached a picture of what I found. The rubber bushings were useless and the bracket (or plate? whatever it's called) on the exhaust has cracked all the way through. I've also attached a picture of my exhaust with the mount with some letters pointing to various places. The male rubber bushing was currently where letter A is pointing (actually inside the exhaust bracket or plate). The female rubber bushing was currently where letter C is pointing. The people helping me say that the male bushing should be where letter B is pointing (between the exhaust bracket and the exhaust mount). If it is currently set up wrong that might have further aggravated and caused the crack (besides the bushings being rotten). I know there aren't many of you out there that have a 503 anymore and probably don't even have the same set up for the exhaust if you do have a 503, but if you have something similar could you please post a picture and/or diagram? The CPS catalogue shows a mounting kit that uses a bolt-driven mounting clamp...does anyone use that? -------- Cristal Waters Kolb Mark II Twinstar Rotax 503 DCSI Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=235582#235582 Attachments: http://forums.matronics.com//files/exhaust_mount_rubber_bushings_188.jpg http://forums.matronics.com//files/crack_in_exhaust_bracket_195.jpg ________________________________ Message 22 ____________________________________ Time: 08:59:37 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: Broken exhaust bracket From: "Ralph B" Cristal, a couple of things I see in the pictures: 1) the reason it cracked is that you have the old style single-jointed muffler with one set of 3 springs. These older mufflers are prone to cracking. 2) it looks like the previous owner may have welded a washer to the muffler where it cracked. Maybe the weld job had the opposite effect and weakening it instead of making it stronger. Ralph B -------- Ralph B Original Firestar 447 N91493 E-AB 22 years flying it Kolbra 912UL N20386 almost 1 year flying it Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=235584#235584 ________________________________ Message 23 ____________________________________ Time: 09:55:09 PM PST US Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 100LL fuel additive From: "Dwight" So, for those who use it, what is the mix ratio? When using the MMO . 1 oz per gal, 1oz per 5gal?? And do you add it over and above your regular oil mix or substitute the oz or so of MMO for part of the oil?? I've used it as a fogger for winterizing boats etc for years and had great results with it in that application. Thanks Dwight Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=235585#235585 ________________________________ Message 24 ____________________________________ Time: 10:11:39 PM PST US From: "Larry Cottrell" Subject: Re: Kolb-List: Re: 100LL fuel additive John Hauck told me to use 2 oz per five gallons in addition to the regular oil. I also use two oz of Sta-bil as well. If you don't fly that often mixed gas goes bad quicker than regular gasoline. Keep in mind that if you are using Ethanol there is a Marine grade of Sta-bil for Ethanol, and that is one oz per 5 gallons. Larry C ----- Original Message ----- From: Dwight To: kolb-list@matronics.com Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2009 10:54 PM Subject: Kolb-List: Re: 100LL fuel additive So, for those who use it, what is the mix ratio? When using the MMO . 1 oz per gal, 1oz per 5gal?? And do you add it over and above your regular oil mix or substitute the oz or so of MMO for part of the oil?? I've used it as a fogger for winterizing boats etc for years and had great results with it in that application. Thanks Dwight Read this topic online here: http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=235585#235585 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Checked by AVG - www.avg.com 03/21/09 17:58:00 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Other Matronics Email List Services ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Post A New Message kolb-list@matronics.com UN/SUBSCRIBE http://www.matronics.com/subscription List FAQ http://www.matronics.com/FAQ/Kolb-List.htm Web Forum Interface To Lists http://forums.matronics.com Matronics List Wiki http://wiki.matronics.com Full Archive Search Engine http://www.matronics.com/search 7-Day List Browse http://www.matronics.com/browse/kolb-list Browse Digests http://www.matronics.com/digest/kolb-list Browse Other Lists http://www.matronics.com/browse Live Online Chat! http://www.matronics.com/chat Archive Downloading http://www.matronics.com/archives Photo Share http://www.matronics.com/photoshare Other Email Lists http://www.matronics.com/emaillists Contributions http://www.matronics.com/contribution ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- These Email List Services are sponsored solely by Matronics and through the generous Contributions of its members.